The Spurs barely have an offensive system. What happened to the beautiful game?

[apalisoc_9]

Even With Demar and Aldridge, it shouldn't be impossible to run a free flowing offense with emphasis in ball movement.

The Clippers have Kawhi and George that are natural iso players but they now have the best ball moving team in the league.

They barely run pinch post action, their sideline action is abysmal. The dribble handoff action is limited.

the offball movement is even mediocre.

I hate to say this, but they might be able to accomplish some semblance of ball movement by showcasing Aldridge more in the 5 position and as a primary decision maker. He can be really good at this..We've all seen it. He's so trash in this current spurs system.

They might have assist numbers but it's actually deceiving because a good amount of these are "rescue" passess.

[ragas]

Ball movement and Aldridge shouldn't be used in the same sentence unless it's a negation or meant ironically.

[EasyMoney]

Everyone has to buy in. Rudy gay, demar derozan, lamarcus aldridge aren't guys that could buy in since they love iso ball.

[r0drig0lac]

this team collectively has less basketball iq than Duncan/Manu/Diaw, and that's it.

[The Truth #6]

Not sure about Aldridge, but I agree the flow of the offense is limited. It seems like everyone calling their own number. I’m guessing Pop is committing to the style of play he saw in the Bubble.

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

Not sure about Aldridge, but I agree the flow of the offense is limited. It seems like everyone calling their own number. I’m guessing Pop is committing to the style of play he saw in the Bubble.

That style of play is summer league offense where everyone takes turns attacking while the others wait and do nothing. Spurs are 3rd in drives and 27th in passes per game. The beautiful game was being elite at both.

[Larry O]

The current style of ball movement the Spurs are using, from my observation, seems to be ridged, guardable & energy consuming, usually with no results! That paint probing & penetrating then pass it out then penetrate again, to eventually have some one to finally take a final shot, seems to take a lot of time off the clock, with only one or two chances to score with the shot clock winding down, & in the end, if there's not an offensive rebound after a missed shot, in some cases, which usually is the outcome, is a waisted possession. Unlike the Beautiful Game, it's not fluid nor is it effective. It's only used from time to time with the isoball to be elected to be the primary style of play. I recall Pop saying this of LMA, that he was trying to change him; trying to conform him into the Spurs' system, instead of him trying to adapt to LMA & playing to his strengths & styles (to appease LMA of coarse). I'm sure he has also done that with DDR as well. Pop seems to have given in the vets & stars' isoball, & just run a few plays that's created for them & simply just do whatever they want on the court, it seems. But hopefully with time, as the youngins take over, perhaps we will see the Beautiful Game return as it would be easier to coach that system to them & for them to buy into it as well. GSG!!!

[Leetonidas]

Old guys are constantly iso-ing and all LMA does is chuck jumpers now. Rudy and Mills are complete black holes on offense

[MoSpur02]

The vets hold onto the ball too long. Especially DeRozan and Aldridge.

[John B]

Not sure about Aldridge, but I agree the flow of the offense is limited. It seems like everyone calling their own number. I’m guessing Pop is committing to the style of play he saw in the Bubble.
The Bubble experiments need Aldridge to hit outside shots (if he's in the game) to pull his big out, and allow open lanes for Keldon/Demar/DJ/Lonnie to attack the rim. Aldridge needs to be fed outside early and knock those, and get him going.
Last night that didn't happen. I don't know what's with Keldon shooting the 1st 3 shots. It took him out of the game completely. If anybody, that should've been Aldridge.

[RC_Drunkford]

This is one of my main critique points that Gregg Popovich's coaching has fallen off a cliff. There is no coaching. No out of bounds plays being run, just isos. The man ain't running anything. It's all penetrate, pass out, dribble hand off, drive, pass out and so on until the shotclock runs out and somebody has to shoot. No loop, no zipper cuts, no motion strong.

I don't even know what the old man is doing. When he said in training camp that he let's the players play more freely and calls less plays, that literally sounds to me like he ain't coaching. He couldn't even call a screen to get Tucker off of DeRozan when he missed the shot to tie it up against Houston.

He has to run a more balanced offense. Like if you struggle to score, post up Aldridge occassionaly. Run the loop or zipper action for fast players like Lonnie and Dejounte. Parker used to tire opposing PGs out by running that set. Call more plays for Walker anyway so he can be more aggressive on offense. Some hammer plays would help too, if we struggle from 3 like yesterday.

[exstatic]

Beautiful game? Hell, I’d like to know what happened to the bubble offense.

[JuneJive]

Beautiful game? Hell, I’d like to know what happened to the bubble offense.

Remind me how did it look like.

LMA was out, did that influence the style?

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

Beautiful game? Hell, I’d like to know what happened to the bubble offense.

It's exactly the same offense right now. Only difference is fewer shots are going in. Check out the stats - literally the same type of offense - first in drives, bottom 3 in passing, etc. etc.

[TimDunkem]

After the organizational, coaching, and HOF player brain drain over the years I'm beginning to think that Pop isn't that important, tbqfh.

[exstatic]

It's exactly the same offense right now. Only difference is fewer shots are going in. Check out the stats - literally the same type of offense - first in drives, bottom 3 in passing, etc. etc.

Demar is back to his old self, nothing like he was in the bubble. What does it matter if LMA can provide spacing to open the lane, if DeMar just clogs it again? He’s in the way, and needs to step back into a strictly point forward role, or he needs to go. Lonnie just fucking disappears when DeMar is on the floor, and I’m fucking done with that.

[Chinook]

It's exactly the same offense right now. Only difference is fewer shots are going in. Check out the stats - literally the same type of offense - first in drives, bottom 3 in passing, etc. etc.

Guys like White and Johnson aren't shooting crazy percentages from three and SA is actually playing real NBA teams. I'm basically at the point of believing the bubble was one of the worst things that could've happened to the Spurs in the short term.

[Chinook]

Demar is back to his old self, nothing like he was in the bubble. What does it matter if LMA can provide spacing to open the lane, if DeMar just clogs it again? He’s in the way, and needs to step back into a strictly point forward role, or he needs to go. Lonnie just fucking disappears when DeMar is on the floor, and I’m fucking done with that.

Walker's best on-offs are with the bench players (which is normal since they are the best four on the team in that regard). He has a better on-off with DeRozan than he does with Murray. There's zero evidence that DeRozan is what hurts Walker. DeMar was in the bubble too. There is evidence that falling far down on the option hierarchy hurts him, but that comes from DeRozan, LMA, Murray and even Johnson taking unideal shots instead of moving it to Walker or someone else. That happened in the bubble too.

[GreekSpursfan]

The beautiful game required very high bball IQ, they are trying to teach them stuff but you need to have the god given talent to play like that team. All our bigs back then had super high IQ and they were willing passers, there's nothing like that now and i dont want to talk about our PGs back then, there is zero comparison. Bad thread.

[Seventyniner]

Guys like White and Johnson aren't shooting crazy percentages from three and SA is actually playing real NBA teams. I'm basically at the point of believing the bubble was one of the worst things that could've happened to the Spurs in the short term.

Johnson's 64.7% from three in the bubble certainly was crazy, but White only shot 39.3%. Maybe his volume was unsustainable, but not the percentage.

[Chinook]

Johnson's 64.7% from three in the bubble certainly was crazy, but White only shot 39.3%. Maybe his volume was unsustainable, but not the percentage.

White had a 2/6 and whopping 1/8 game to end his time in the bubble. Before that, he was shooting 45 percent on eight attempts a game. That was the unsustainable part I was talking about, when he was looking like a DPOY candidate.

[exstatic]

Walker's best on-offs are with the bench players (which is normal since they are the best four on the team in that regard). He has a better on-off with DeRozan than he does with Murray. There's zero evidence that DeRozan is what hurts Walker. DeMar was in the bubble too. There is evidence that falling far down on the option hierarchy hurts him, but that comes from DeRozan, LMA, Murray and even Johnson taking unideal shots instead of moving it to Walker or someone else. That happened in the bubble too.

It’s not a coincidence that Lonnie scored 49 points in two games that DeMar was absent, and has been invisible since he returned.

[exstatic]

White had a 2/6 and whopping 1/8 game to end his time in the bubble. Before that, he was shooting 45 percent on eight attempts a game. That was the unsustainable part I was talking about, when he was looking like a DPOY candidate.

So, instead of taking the whole sample, you cut the worst two games off the end, and shout “unsustainable!”. Got it.

[Sugus]

It’s not a coincidence that Lonnie scored 49 points in two games that DeMar was absent, and has been invisible since he returned.

I'm amazed that there's still folks that think otherwise. What clearer situation could there have been than DD missing exactly two games out of nowhere, and also seemingly out of nowhere, Lonnie proceeds to have by far the best two games of this season, and probably second/third best games of his young career, only to go back to being invisible once DeRozan returns?

There's definitely fault to be had for Lonnie - he's far too passive and deferring, passes up wide open shots, has a tendency to disappear, etc. But to say there's "zero evidence" that Lonnie plays better without DeMar? Flat out false, tbh.

[SPURt]

As stated, DD and LMA have turned it fugly. At this point, I’d be happy to see the horrible face, good body game

[Chinook]

It’s not a coincidence that Lonnie scored 49 points in two games that DeMar was absent, and has been invisible since he returned.

Where are the games Walker played without Murray to compare? You're definitely assuming a causation when there are better explanations. As I've said before, Walker and DeRozan are a better pairing this year than Walker and Murray have been, and that's including two very good Walker games in Murray's minutes.

[Chinook]

So, instead of taking the whole sample, you cut the worst two games off the end, and shout “unsustainable!”. Got it.

I think in a quest to sound edgy, you completely botched your understanding of what I said. The parts I cut out where the good games, not the bad. The bubble offense looked great when White and Johnson were shooting unsustatinably well, meaning those first five games when White was shooting 45 percent and Johnson in the 60s. That insane efficiency covered up the lack of good-shot generation the offense had going.

[Dejounte]

Where are the games Walker played without Murray to compare? You're definitely assuming a causation when there are better explanations. As I've said before, Walker and DeRozan are a better pairing this year than Walker and Murray have been, and that's including two very good Walker games in Murray's minutes.

You saw it last night.

The ppm DeRozan had last night when he was on the court was 2.46, while when he was off of it the team had a ppm of 2.46. DeRozan is a net zero at his best on offense if you call last night's offensive performance one of the team's season best (Sixth highest point total of the season). You can't brush off DeMar not passing enough by claiming touches are high between him, Dejounte, and Mills. That stat is affected by FTA, assists, number of field goal attempts-- all of which are favorable towards DeMar because he attempts more field goals per game, gets star calls from officials, and gets assists by holding onto the ball until the last second.