Do we need Derozan more than he needs us?

[kht]

As much of a dinosaur he is (a non three pointer shooter), he's still an elite level midrange player and slasher (a Kobe-lite type). He's the only one on our team that can get his own shot via isolation in the half court. The rest of our team is littered with three pointer shooters and hustle guys. You can't center offenses after role players and hustle guys.

Where would the Spurs be without Derozan? Who's available this offseason if we let Derozan walk? He has a good track record of being healthy and not toxic.

[Mugen]

Nope

[John B]

It will be difficult to score enough without Demar. And he has gobto moves that none of our young guys have yet, maybe White and DJ but still not as consistent.

[Blackhaus]

Team is a lottery team without him for sure, bottom 6-8 seed with him

[Mr. Body]

This team is near bottom of the league without him this year.

[C-Dub]

Spurs do not need DDR if they're planning on ever challenging for a deep run in the playoffs, especially in the Western Conference. If the Spurs are only looking to compete for a chance just to make the bottom half of playoffs every year and never really truly compete for a Championship, then yes, the Spurs need DDR.

[kht]

This team is near bottom of the league without him this year.

Okay so why all the hoards of nephews on Spurstalk saying we need to get rid of him lol?

[paperboy77]

Not sure why that dude catches so much heat around here. He’ll be gone next year.

[Dejounte]

DeRozan's problem is his playstyle is erratic. For a few games, he wants to be a ballhog. Then the next few games, he wants to be a distributor and only try to score his points when its crunch time. When he's the latter, it makes the team THAT much better.

[MoSpur02]

Of course Spurs need him more than he needs the Spurs. Where would the points come from if he isn’t on the team?

[Dejounte]

Of course Spurs need him more than he needs the Spurs. Where would the points come from if he isn’t on the team?

Young guys start becoming aggressive without him... see White, Lonnie.

With that said I'm torn on DeMar. I'm fine with him coming back but only at a reasonable price. If he is gone, I won't cry about it.

[kht]

Hayward got the bag... you can only assume it's starting at 120/4 years minimum.

[Teamduncan21]

Its a balance between short term and long term. Short term he keeps us floating near some bottom playoff seeding. Long term it stunts some growth and reps from young guys (keldon playing pf, lonnie less chances, vassel less minutes. Etc)

the key is to transition from where we are now. To a contender. Best way is if can get derozan for lower price. Sign new talented guy (lauri, collins) and slowly transition the load to younger guys.

but if a diff team gives him max. Then we will just be forced to transition faster (and allows us to sign 2 guys)

[spurraider21]

Its a balance between short term and long term. Short term he keeps us floating near some bottom playoff seeding. Long term it stunts some growth and reps from young guys (keldon playing pf, lonnie less chances, vassel less minutes. Etc)

the key is to transition from where we are now. To a contender. Best way is if can get derozan for lower price. Sign new talented guy (lauri, collins) and slowly transition the load to younger guys.

but if a diff team gives him max. Then we will just be forced to transition faster (and allows us to sign 2 guys)
3rd option is to get what we can at the deadline

[Uriel]

DeRozan is an invaluable player and sometimes plays at an all-star level. That said, if we could flip him at the deadline for draft picks and / or young building blocks to a contender looking to make a playoff push, I’d do it in a heartbeat. He’ll be gone by next year anyway.

[Rummpd]

DeRozan is an invaluable player and sometimes plays at an all-star level. That said, if we could flip him at the deadline for draft picks and / or young building blocks to a contender looking to make a playoff push, I’d do it in a heartbeat. He’ll be gone by next year anyway.

Aggressively trade him while you can is the way to go.

[tbdog]

Spurs would be lottery bound if he was gone for nothing. There is this weird theory that losing him would be an addition by subtraction. It's based on zero evidence. In saying that, Spurs could be a better team if DDR was traded for a better fit. But I could say the same for trading away Murray, Gay, or LMA.

[MoSpur02]

Young guys start becoming aggressive without him... see White, Lonnie.

With that said I'm torn on DeMar. I'm fine with him coming back but only at a reasonable price. If he is gone, I won't cry about it.

If you’re not gonna resign him, which is fine, then you better trade him before the deadline and get a young talent and a pick for him. If that happens then the Spurs won’t have a go to scorer who can create or get to the line.

[tbdog]

If you’re not gonna resign him, which is fine, then you better trade him before the deadline and get a young talent and a pick for him. If that happens then the Spurs won’t have a go to scorer who can create or get to the line.

If the Spurs want to offer Collins a max, then DDR would have to take a very steep discount, like low 20mil per year. If the Spurs are targeting someone else, then DDR will command but settle less than Hayward money.

[Fusternino]

If the Spurs want to offer Collins a max, then DDR would have to take a very steep discount, like low 20mil per year. If the Spurs are targeting someone else, then DDR will command but settle less than Hayward money.

Collins doesn't have me convinced at all. I would rather the Spurs go for Holmes + JA.

[RC_Drunkford]

If the Spurs want to offer Collins a max, then DDR would have to take a very steep discount, like low 20mil per year. If the Spurs are targeting someone else, then DDR will command but settle less than Hayward money.

if we get Collins we shouldn't keep DeRozan. The defense would be catastrophic with that forward combo

[Mugen]

Of course Spurs need him more than he needs the Spurs. Where would the points come from if he isn’t on the team?

I don't think his offense would be too difficult to replace in the long-term tbh.

[duncan2k5]

Spurs do not need DDR if they're planning on ever challenging for a deep run in the playoffs, especially in the Western Conference. If the Spurs are only looking to compete for a chance just to make the bottom half of playoffs every year and never really truly compete for a Championship, then yes, the Spurs need DDR.

This guy gets it...and there's an article floating around somewhere showing that advanced metrics indicate Spurs play better with him off the floor...but I guess everyone is enamored with stats instead of impact...it sickens me to see how we celebrate and want to build around him because he helped us win a tight game vs some 9f the worst teams in the league...we have a decade of history on who this guy is, yet Spurs fans still get fooled...I don't wanna become the magic of the west...just happy to make the playoffs

[duncan2k5]

Spurs would be lottery bound if he was gone for nothing. There is this weird theory that losing him would be an addition by subtraction. It's based on zero evidence. In saying that, Spurs could be a better team if DDR was traded for a better fit. But I could say the same for trading away Murray, Gay, or LMA.

Ppl said that about the thunder if they got rid of westbrook

[spurraider21]

Murray has taken a step up offensively. White can absorb a more primary role. Keldon is still just a second year player. Bring in a FA like Collins and you’ll have enough offense

[Dex]

Young guys start becoming aggressive without him... see White, Lonnie.

With that said I'm torn on DeMar. I'm fine with him coming back but only at a reasonable price. If he is gone, I won't cry about it.

I'm not a huge DeRozan fan, but I also haven't seen enough from the young guys to believe that they would be able to put up points on a consistent basis yet.

Especially guys like Lonnie who seems like he could go off for 30 one night, then goes completely soft the next. You can't simply blame that all on DeMar.

[exstatic]

Of course Spurs need him more than he needs the Spurs. Where would the points come from if he isn’t on the team?

Lonnie scored 49 in the two games he missed. Dejounte, White, Keldon have all had multiple 20+ point games. NONE of our youngsters are scoring to their potential, because DeMar dominates the ball. I’m ok with keeping DD on a reasonable contract, but don’t start thinking we’d be worse without him. We’d just have to spread the scoring around, and put the ball in Whites hands to close games.

[cjw]

Demar is a bridge player, and is providing invaluable output right now. You don’t develop young players without bets on the roster. The young guys are more likely to reach potential playing with vets and on competitive teams.

I’d consider moving some vets at the deadline but this isn’t a video game where you can go full on youth movement. Also, any contracts that come in the door at the deadline will impact flexibility in free agency. Don’t underestimate S&T possibilities too in the off-season where bird rights can bring back picks from teams that have no space. Unfortunately a lot of teams are limited in ability to deal picks, and those picks come with cap holds if they’re 2021 ones.

[exstatic]

I'm not a huge DeRozan fan, but I also haven't seen enough from the young guys to believe that they would be able to put up points on a consistent basis yet.

Especially guys like Lonnie who seems like he could go off for 30 one night, then goes completely soft the next. You can't simply blame that all on DeMar.
Lonnie completely defers to DD. He scored 25 and 24 in back to back games when DD missed time. I think Lonnie would be better served coming off the bench so that DD isn’t on the floor with him.

[John B]

Young guys start becoming aggressive without him... see White, Lonnie.

With that said I'm torn on DeMar. I'm fine with him coming back but only at a reasonable price. If he is gone, I won't cry about it.
None of the young guys have developed a goto signature move, magnified especially in the playoffs when every possession counts. Sure DJ can do the crossover and midrange, White may have a few tricks off his sleeves, but nothing like Derozan wilfully can score on any player. Until the Spurs have a player like that, a sure shot, Spurs need Demar as the goto guy more than Demar needs Spur. I’m sure will see suitors cone free agency, especially he has shown that he can and willing to shoot the 3’s.

[Dex]

Lonnie completely defers to DD. He scored 25 and 24 in back to back games when DD missed time. I think Lonnie would be better served coming off the bench so that DD isn’t on the floor with him.

That may be the case, but Lonnie needs to get out of this "pecking order" mentality. He's an NBA player in his third year and getting nearly 28 minutes a game.

If he wants to take charge, he needs to put that on himself. Deferring to DD is just another sign of him being passive.

DeMar actually seems to enjoy it when the young guys take charge. I don't think he has a "touches" complex like LMA. And guys like KJ and White and even Eubanks seem to understand that while Walker just keeps trying to fit in unless forced to do otherwise.

[John B]

In a team missing just another key player to get to the championship, Heat, Bucks, Sixers, Demar could be that missing player. He can score 30 pts, 7 assist guy to back Giannis, or Embiid. Again he has shown he can hit and willing to take the 3’s. I think Spurs will not be able to match and will lose Demar come off season, unless Demar sees promise with our young guns to take him to another level. But next FA will be his last to get a big contract or a chance of getting a ring.

[Mr. Body]

Lonnie scored 49 in the two games he missed. Dejounte, White, Keldon have all had multiple 20+ point games. NONE of our youngsters are scoring to their potential, because DeMar dominates the ball. I’m ok with keeping DD on a reasonable contract, but don’t start thinking we’d be worse without him. We’d just have to spread the scoring around, and put the ball in Whites hands to close games.

This is incredibly naive.

[The Truth #6]

This is incredibly naive.

But is moving forward with DMDR a great option? The team does defer to him and, though a super cool dude, he is not consistent or a great leader, so what are the other players learning? White and Dejounte are entering their prime. Our “youth” is already getting older. It’s time to see what we have. And if we’re worse, then we continue to move forward.

[R. DeMurre]

None of the young guys have developed a goto signature move, magnified especially in the playoffs when every possession counts.

DeMar's regular season advanced stats are extremely subpar for a star, but his playoff advanced stats are far worse. I just don't think he's a guy that will lead a team in the playoffs, where opposing coaching staffs & players have more time to focus & target him. I literally can't find another star (or even average player) with worse +/- on court or worse +/- on/off numbers, and I've spent much too much time looking....

https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/d/derozde01.html

[cd021]

Team is a lottery team without him for sure, bottom 6-8 seed with him
They could very well be a lottery team, with him again, too...

[tbdog]

Collins doesn't have me convinced at all. I would rather the Spurs go for Holmes + JA.

I like Holmes. Who's JA?

[TD 21]

Not him specifically, but obviously in general the lack of a go-to player is a glaring need going forward.

They've made their bed on that front though by going the route they have. Basically, either Johnson emerges as it or they'll need to luck into a big wing or big to shoulder that burden.

Collins is primarily a finisher, either via rim running or spotting up.

[MultiTroll]

Similar core being the Young Suns who after the great bubble screwed the pooch by signing CP0.
Sure they're slightly above .500 but the control freak has to have the ball constantly. Stunting Young Uns growth big time.
Now there's talk of him joining fellow phaggots in Brooklyn.

If DD could get and stay in fascilitate mode I'd be down. He's not. Grandpa started the year out right by staying young and having DD facilitate. Now it looks like DD is the focus of the O again and who knows what will happen when pet LA returns.

[tmtcsc]

Derozan? No. Excellent mid-range shooter (the best I've ever seen) with well-below average defense. Why has he decided to shoot 3's and be more of a facilitator this season? This is his 3rd year here. Do you think Pop wanted anything different from him? I still contend he's doing this for his own market value and still isn't a winner. Not a dawg. The Spurs would be fine without him or at least not that much worse.

[tmtcsc]

This is incredibly naive.

Exactly. Anyone expecting big things from Lonnie will be waiting a LONG time. He's as inconsistent as Aldridge. You never know what he's going to give you on a nightly basis. He doesn't look confident and is sorely lacking in overall basketball skills. Footwork, how to rotate on defense, when to push the ball on offense, when to shoot. Just lost. That's when having a young roster really hurts.

[Mr. Body]

But is moving forward with DMDR a great option? The team does defer to him and, though a super cool dude, he is not consistent or a great leader, so what are the other players learning? White and Dejounte are entering their prime. Our “youth” is already getting older. It’s time to see what we have. And if we’re worse, then we continue to move forward.

They're learning quite a bit from him. None of the young players are nearly consistent enough to carry the team as needed game over game and may never be. Throwing them to the wolves isn't the answer, either. Without DDR this team's record is closer to Minnesota's.

[TD 21]

Derozan? No. Excellent mid-range shooter (the best I've ever seen) with well-below average defense. Why has he decided to shoot 3's and be more of a facilitator this season? This is his 3rd year here. Do you think Pop wanted anything different from him? I still contend he's doing this for his own market value and still isn't a winner. Not a dawg. The Spurs would be fine without him or at least not that much worse.

Not even the best on this team (Aldridge). In recent memory, Jordan, Nowitzki, Paul come to mind.

[K...]

the best option would be to sign with SA to a deal that could be traded. Next year the longer contract could bring a better return. But dDR probably doesn't want that if he can get a good deal this off season. This team will probably need to replace LMA more than DDR. SO letting DDR walk may be a fair option. I dont think we'll get a great big for DDR rental at the deadline.

[Down Under]

We need him at the moment with only 1 other player (White) able to consistently able to create their own shot.

[Fusternino]

I like Holmes. Who's JA?

Jarrett Allen.

[r0drig0lac]

Not even the best on this team (Aldridge). In recent memory, Jordan, Nowitzki, Paul come to mind.

Kawhi, Kris, Booker, Curry, Durant, etc etc

[The Truth #6]

They're learning quite a bit from him. None of the young players are nearly consistent enough to carry the team as needed game over game and may never be. Throwing them to the wolves isn't the answer, either. Without DDR this team's record is closer to Minnesota's.

I suppose this disagreement depends on one’s expectations. I would rather roll the dice without Demar and see what we have, and if our record is worse, then we get a higher draft pick. As for players learning from him, I can’t think of anything to point to that indicates that. He dominates the ball. Implodes too often. Loses his cool quite easily. Very mercurial. As for teaching skills, I would love if he could teach his amazing footwork, but I haven’t noticed that, either.

[rankingtear]

White needs to evolve as a primary this season. Relying on a restricted free agent signing with us is a bad plan. If derozan leaves we might have to rely in signing a scoring wing like Evan Fournier to be competitive offensively. A volume 3 point scorer at the wing is the priority this offseason.

[rjv]

derozan get a lot of flack on this site but then again manu used to get hammered on this site also. that being said, it's clear he's easily the best offensive threat this team has and by that, i mean he is the only player that can get to the line consistently and can score in multiple ways. he'd be a solid addition to another contender. put derozan on the clippers and they jump up a notch. put him on the mavs or the nuggets and the same is true. he wouldn't be the star on any of these teams but he'd be a solid piece of the puzzle. whether or not he is worth what he will likely ask for next season is an entirely different matter. complicating things is that there really aren't too many FA options this summer that stand out. yes, john collins sounds nice but he's not exactly an offensive juggernaut. also, one has to consider that derozan has been willing to play here, something that many top tier FAs don't share in common. clearly, derozan could get paid somewhere else and will have suitors.

[John B]

derozan get a lot of flack on this site but then again manu used to get hammered on this site also. that being said, it's clear he's easily the best offensive threat this team has and by that, i mean he is the only player that can get to the line consistently and can score in multiple ways. he'd be a solid addition to another contender. put derozan on the clippers and they jump up a notch. put him on the mavs or the nuggets and the same is true. he wouldn't be the star on any of these teams but he'd be a solid piece of the puzzle. whether or not he is worth what he will likely ask for next season is an entirely different matter. complicating things is that there really aren't too many FA options this summer that stand out. yes, john collins sounds nice but he's not exactly an offensive juggernaut. also, one has to consider that derozan has been willing to play here, something that many top tier FAs don't share in common. clearly, derozan could get paid somewhere else and will have suitors.

I think Spurs will not be able to afford Demar's market this off season. This could be his last chance of getting big money or playing for the ring. Can Spurs offer either of that next off season? Highly doubt it.

The snubs of this group will have rude awakening when Spurs can't even score enough to get us 20 wins next season without Demar. Yes definitely Spurs need Demar more than Demar needs the Spurs.