Blow it up

[FkLA]

Tried to give this team a chance but its painfully obvious their ceiling is sneaking into the playoffs and winning 1 game in the first round.

Get DeMar, Rudy, and Patty the fuck out. It's time for a full blown rebuild.

[TheGreatYacht]

Holts need that playoff money to pay Gorgui and Cam Reynolds bro, it ain’t happening :lol

Luke does need to be freed though, at least..

[NASpurs]

Tried to give this team a chance but its painfully obvious their ceiling is sneaking into the playoffs and winning 1 game in the first round.

Get DeMar, Rudy, and Patty the fuck out. It's time for a full blown rebuild.

But :cry DeStar DeRozan, top four seed, we back boys

[Robz4000]

:lol they'll be lucky to make it in to the play in game

[BatManu20]

Lol

[FkLA]

But :cry DeStar DeRozan, top four seed, we back boys

:(

[tonight...you]

Tried to give this team a chance but its painfully obvious their ceiling is sneaking into the playoffs and winning 1 game in the first round.

Get DeMar, Rudy, and Patty the fuck out. It's time for a full blown rebuild.
https://media1.tenor.com/images/335526e1421d2cc708b3cc0dca9d70d0/tenor.gif?itemid=7276964

[ohmwrecker]

Too late.

[Rito3d30]

Don't think they will make the playoffs

[spurraider21]

next year would be even uglier than this year with Derozan gone (unless a John Collins thing actually happens)... but imo would be the best thing long term to rip the bandaid.

[BatManu20]

I will say the Spurs are in a tough position. They’re clearly closer to rebuilding than they are to contending, but RC Buford and Brian Wright and Co. obviously want to do right by Pop in his last couple years so they’re trying their best to field a contender, but unfortunately we just don’t have the horses. Some nice young players, sure, but nothing that gives us hope for future contention and certainly not at the current time. And our vets in Patty and Rudy simply aren’t giving us much on a constant basis.

A huge decision is what they’re gonna do with DeMar. Spurs don’t attract Free Agents so in theory they should be doing whatever they can to retain him, but we all know that even though he does make us better AT TIMES right now, this team ain’t winning shit with him on board long-term. So it’ll be interesting to see what they’re gonna do with that. Could see Pop retiring this offseason if DeMar walks and we don’t sign anybody else.

[Ice009]

Man, I am leaning towards being all for blowing it up. This team seems to have hit their ceiling and now they're on their way down. I wonder what could have happened if not for that bullshit quarantine when the team was playing great and their confidence was sky high.

[ohmwrecker]

What do y’all mean by “blow it up”? It’s pretty much blown up now. Also, it never works. The only teams that win championships never stop trying to contend. Blow it up franchises stay blown up.

[Dverde]

Our apex is winning the play-in game.

[Spur4ever]

I’ve always been against tanking but that’s this teams only hope. We need that could be super star. We loaded with a bunch of role players.

[NASpurs]

Should've just soft tanked it. Just roll with the young guys, trade DeRozan, Mills and Gay for picks/assets or whatever and see where that shit lands you in the lottery.

[LurkingSpursFan]

I would advocate for Devin starting over Keldon. Devin is shooting 47% from 3 as compared to Keldon's 30% over last 10 games. Also Devin provide more length, better defense, shot blocking and spacing.

[cd98]

We don’t need to blow it up. We need to keep building it up with some lottery picks. We have talented young players, but we need to draft our next star to lead them.

[ace3g]

It's hard to get a read on this team when Pop doesn't play the players that are playing well "each game."

[slick'81]

trust the process

[offset formation]

I finally agree with the blow it up crowd. Took me 4 years but I'm there now.

[GreekSpursfan]

I’ve always been against tanking but that’s this teams only hope. We need that could be super star. We loaded with a bunch of role players.

This

[EasyMoney]

Everything went to shit after that outbreak. Wow. Thanks quindary

[DeRozan m8]

The league execs don't care about us and we are run by a washed up front office, that were carried by Tim....and Tony and Manu to a smaller degree.

The league sucks now anyway

3 jacking and weak players sucking each other off to play with each other...easy path...run away when it's too hard...even if you have a contract.

Weak as fuck

[duncan2150]

That's too late and i don't think that's the solution. Better to try to win than losing like Rockets or others.

But one thing is you need to give more PT to Vassell, a little bit more to Samanic ( still think he's not ready but he's improving well) and tanking with this team even without derozan or patty- rudy is shit, they would not be as bad as Twolves or other teams maybe you could have some luck in the lottery but if not having a pick 8-9 will not bring you a FP imo.

[Rummpd]

OP good post but two years behind on this. Spurs made some hay this season with an over-hyped early season run, but now regression to the mean is occurring and ESPN predicts will have to win play in games to even make post season. Until this FO goes and the coach moves on expect Groundhog day on this for years. You cannot get blown out by the Kings at home period.

[DeRozan m8]

trust the process

What process?

There is none...they're running in circles

[Robz4000]

The league execs don't care about us and we are run by a washed up front office, that were carried by Tim....and Tony and Manu to a smaller degree.

The league sucks now anyway

3 jacking and weak players sucking each other off to play with each other...easy path...run away when it's too hard...even if you have a contract.

Weak as fuck

Honestly this tbh. Wonder if this is what the league will be going forward? If so might be time to pack it in.

[LeBowen]

The biggest problem is that this roster has way too many players who don't fit together.

You can't say that any of the rotation guys are bad players, all of them would certainly be in rotation of any contender. Even Rudy.
The problem is that in current league, one great player is worth more than 3 good players. And we have just good players.

Some of the young guys have the potential to be great players, but that's where Pop comes into play. He's literally ruining their development.
Luka finally gets minutes, does great whenever he's playing, 2 days later and we still have to watch Rudy embarrass himself whenever he tries doing anything other than catch and shoot.
Luka comes in and does an outstanding job on Randle, but no, rather have traffic cone Rudy play 20 minutes the next game. Even when he scores 15ish points, he gives them right back on defense.

Patty? Still a shooter every team would love to have, but watching him dribble the ball while the guys who should be doing it stand in the corner is infuriating. Nothing good has ever come out of it.

Lonnie is the only player with legit star potential. He probably won't get there, but he has all the tools. He simply must be given a chance to develop. It's not a coincidence he had a career night when Patty was out.

I won't even mention Demar because we all know he has to go in summer. Hopefully we get a decent S&T deal.

We simply can't have more than 1 non-shooter if Jakob is starting. Nowdays we have 2 non-shooters and 2 bad ones in the starting lineup.
Until Demar is gone, Lonnie or Devin have to start for spacing purposes. Even if Demar/DJ/Derrick are better players. But who do you even bench?
Keldon has to start because he's the only guy with size who's not a pussy and can rebound.

That leaves DJ and Demar. Can't bench either one because of their egos, would ruin them.
DJ-Lonnie-Devin-Keldon-Jakob lineup makes the most sense. Or Luka in place of Lonnie/Devin. They're not good enough now, but with current roster those are the only starting lineups that make sense.
Won't happen because the old man who always says he doesn't care about basketball is still desparate to get those all-time records. And everyone is suffering because of it.

I understand why PATFO doesn't want to tank, but what's the plan then? Why didn't they make any moves? Current roster has no chance of being competitive against any legit playoff team.

Idk, this is as frustrating as it gets. Grasping for straws and hoping washed up vets play well, chasing 8th seed to get swept in the first round. All that while stalling the development of young players.
Not making any trades is just a cherry on top. They want to compete, but they don't actually want to compete.

Hopefully, next season they finally stop being delusional and blow it up. Everyone should be expendable if the price is right. Except Devin, Luka and Keldon.
I'd love to see Lonnie as the first or second option for a year, still think he has potential.

DJ and Derrick are good, but as I said, we need great players. If the price is right, they shouldn't be untouchable.

[NASpurs]

^^^

We’re on the treadmill, destination to nowhere.

[mo7888]

Start Luka and bring Keldon off the bench. The spacing would be better and until Keldon learns to shoot his best attributes are strength and energy which should be effective off the bench playing alongside shooters.

[Poolboy5623]

For todays NBA standards its already blown up..

[SpursDynasty85]

Trying to make the playoffs is a big part of development. If they miss the playoffs again you can for sure expect DD not to be back. Slow and steady is what we’re watching. Hopefully this works out.

[KobesAchilles]

Trying to make the playoffs is a big part of development. If they miss the playoffs again you can for sure expect DD not to be back. Slow and steady is what we’re watching. Hopefully this works out.
It does workout. For the 11th pick in the draft and another rookie who won't play more than 10 minutes a game and get up 2 shots a game

[The Truth #6]

The biggest problem is that this roster has way too many players who don't fit together.

You can't say that any of the rotation guys are bad players, all of them would certainly be in rotation of any contender. Even Rudy.
The problem is that in current league, one great player is worth more than 3 good players. And we have just good players.

Some of the young guys have the potential to be great players, but that's where Pop comes into play. He's literally ruining their development.
Luka finally gets minutes, does great whenever he's playing, 2 days later and we still have to watch Rudy embarrass himself whenever he tries doing anything other than catch and shoot.
Luka comes in and does an outstanding job on Randle, but no, rather have traffic cone Rudy play 20 minutes the next game. Even when he scores 15ish points, he gives them right back on defense.

Patty? Still a shooter every team would love to have, but watching him dribble the ball while the guys who should be doing it stand in the corner is infuriating. Nothing good has ever come out of it.

Lonnie is the only player with legit star potential. He probably won't get there, but he has all the tools. He simply must be given a chance to develop. It's not a coincidence he had a career night when Patty was out.

I won't even mention Demar because we all know he has to go in summer. Hopefully we get a decent S&T deal.

We simply can't have more than 1 non-shooter if Jakob is starting. Nowdays we have 2 non-shooters and 2 bad ones in the starting lineup.
Until Demar is gone, Lonnie or Devin have to start for spacing purposes. Even if Demar/DJ/Derrick are better players. But who do you even bench?
Keldon has to start because he's the only guy with size who's not a pussy and can rebound.

That leaves DJ and Demar. Can't bench either one because of their egos, would ruin them.
DJ-Lonnie-Devin-Keldon-Jakob lineup makes the most sense. Or Luka in place of Lonnie/Devin. They're not good enough now, but with current roster those are the only starting lineups that make sense.
Won't happen because the old man who always says he doesn't care about basketball is still desparate to get those all-time records. And everyone is suffering because of it.

I understand why PATFO doesn't want to tank, but what's the plan then? Why didn't they make any moves? Current roster has no chance of being competitive against any legit playoff team.

Idk, this is as frustrating as it gets. Grasping for straws and hoping washed up vets play well, chasing 8th seed to get swept in the first round. All that while stalling the development of young players.
Not making any trades is just a cherry on top. They want to compete, but they don't actually want to compete.

Hopefully, next season they finally stop being delusional and blow it up. Everyone should be expendable if the price is right. Except Devin, Luka and Keldon.
I'd love to see Lonnie as the first or second option for a year, still think he has potential.

DJ and Derrick are good, but as I said, we need great players. If the price is right, they shouldn't be untouchable.

Solid points. I would add that part of the problem with our "process" is that Pop likes to go super slow and is afraid of change, which you obviously get. He overdevelops young players—he holds them off in the beginning which I agree is good, but then keeps holding them off even after they have break out games. Sigh. But part of the problem of not making changes is that we are stuck with a ill-fitted roster like you suggest. By only making a few changes each year, we continue to exist with a problematic roster, overloaded with shooting guards (five of them) all taking stabs at being a point guard. The problems with the roster are here in plain sight. Letting DDR go for free, if needed, is the first next major step that needs to happen. I'd say one of DJ, White, or IV needs to go as well, ideally packed in a trade to move up in the draft. I don't see another way at the moment.

[PrimeMinister]

An object in motion stays in motion unless acted upon by an unbalanced force

CC: Pop

Luka should have been playing no less than 20 minutes from the point it became apparent against the Knicks that he is the most versatile defender on the team at this moment. He was once in motion and is now at rest.

You can’t tell me a young player doesn’t develop with more urgency under the environment and competition of a real game situation. Let Luka read up more on world history and do 100 more wind sprints at practice before you play one of your more capable players. He might foul a jump shooter because he was too excited to contest the shot unlike everyone else on this fucking team.

For the “blow it up” crowd- I have great news. Demar is your tank commander, trading him- or “blowing it up” in your mind would actually make this team better. He is in the bottom 10% of the league in +/- per 100 possessions. He is out scored by more points while on the floor than almost anyone else in the game.

Trading Demar and starting vassell would make this team a near 50 win caliber team over the course of a full season but with Demar we will be in the lottery. Enjoy.

[stephen jackson]

Maybe we just miss Lonnie

[GAustex]

At this rate poop gonna need two years to break the record

[8FOR!3]

Do ya'll really think it behooves the young guys to have zero veterans on the team around them??

[Extra Stout]

What do y’all mean by “blow it up”? It’s pretty much blown up now. Also, it never works. The only teams that win championships never stop trying to contend. Blow it up franchises stay blown up.
Lakers: sucked for years until 2 generational superstars showed up
Raptors: fake contender for years until generational superstar showed up on 1-year rental. Immediately reverted back to fake contender once he left.
Warriors: sucked for years until multiple generational superstars showed up
Cavaliers: sucked for years until generational superstar showed up. Immediately started sucking again when he left. Immediately resumed contending for titles when he returned. Immediately started sucking again when he left a second time.
Spurs: seemed to be in long, slow decline after a dynastic run with multiple generational superstars until yet another generational superstar showed up. Immediately became first-round playoff fodder once he left.
Heat: First-round playoff fodder until another generational superstar showed up.
Mavericks: contended for a long time with a generational superstar until they finally got over the top. Before that generational superstar arrived, they had sucked for years.

I dunno, seems like “trying to contend” has little to do with winning championships. The whole “generational superstar(s) showing up” seems to matter more. How could the Spurs go about getting another one of those?

[JuneJive]

Maybe they have their sights on Bates or someone else. I'm sure they have that in mind.

[Floyd Pacquiao]

Do ya'll really think it behooves the young guys to have zero veterans on the team around them??
Sure when those veterans are old can’t play D and make as many mistakes if not more than the young guys

[Mugen]

Do ya'll really think it behooves the young guys to have zero veterans on the team around them??

Have a token veteran around like Haslem or Collison. The problem is when you have washed guys like Rudy taking up big rotation minutes and has Pop's unwavering trust tbh :lol

Also, White/Murray have been in the league long enough to be leaders in their own right. They shouldn't need any hand holding especially by next season.

[DMC]

Lakers: sucked for years until 2 generational superstars showed up
Raptors: fake contender for years until generational superstar showed up on 1-year rental. Immediately reverted back to fake contender once he left.
Warriors: sucked for years until multiple generational superstars showed up
Cavaliers: sucked for years until generational superstar showed up. Immediately started sucking again when he left. Immediately resumed contending for titles when he returned. Immediately started sucking again when he left a second time.
Spurs: seemed to be in long, slow decline after a dynastic run with multiple generational superstars until yet another generational superstar showed up. Immediately became first-round playoff fodder once he left.
Heat: First-round playoff fodder until another generational superstar showed up.
Mavericks: contended for a long time with a generational superstar until they finally got over the top. Before that generational superstar arrived, they had sucked for years.

I dunno, seems like “trying to contend” has little to do with winning championships. The whole “generational superstar(s) showing up” seems to matter more. How could the Spurs go about getting another one of those?

While I agree with what you posted above, there are other factors involved, especially with the Raptors (like the real generational superstar leaving the East for a weak team in the West that same year) and I am not really sure Kawhi is a generational superstar. He's close. The Toronto win, is imo, one of the biggest Cinderella stories in the history of the NBA.

The success that has followed James is undeniable by all but the most staunch of haters. Even if he didn't win the majority of his Finals appearances, he was there every year and often with a different team. The fact that no one like him ever signed in San Antonio, and no one even close actually, really indicates that the Spurs can only hope to contend. If they win, it would have to come from acquisitions in the draft or a draft day trade OR some really lucky fall of the dice with other competitive teams (like the Lebron and Curry injuries). So the Spurs are almost forced to work through organic development of players - no one wants to play/live in SA who can play/live in LA/NY or Miami. Their successes in the past 20 years have been from draft choices with Kawhi being the lone flier. However I don't see the Spurs blowing it up before Pop retires.

[Extra Stout]

I think the Spurs are in the same boat as most other franchises. Nobody really wants to live in most of these other cities either. Non-glamorous locations have a better shot keeping international players for whom 0 of the 28 markets can compare to home. Most front offices scramble and fight and claw over a period of several years to put together a team that can win a playoff series or two if the cards fall right. Several franchises go close to a generation without fielding a team that makes the second round.

The mighty Celtics won all but one of their championships so long ago that nobody under 40 can remember them.

It is what it is. Wait and hope for the right lottery ball in the right year, or the next Steph Curry to fall far enough. It’s already happened multiple times for this franchise.

[TheChillFactor]

It cracks me up to see people watching the games and then say "there is no plan" or "blow it up". The fucking plan is right in front of your face if you PAY ATTENTION, rather than expecting this team to win the way the Big Three Spurs did and throwing your crayons when they don't.

There are no superstar trades to be made right now. Even if we write off all of the development of ALL of these kids, which we have spent 3-4 years on, there's no guarantee we get a superstar in the lottery. You're more likely to wind up with a Greg Oden or Andrew Bogut than Tim Duncan. Get this through your fucking head.

THAT'S WHAT MADE OUR GOLDEN ERA SO FUCKING AWESOME.

Develop the kids, hopefully one of them can make a leap and develop into a lead player. Keep building and developing assets. Maybe in the next few years we can swing a trade for a headline player. That's it - that's the fucking plan.

It sucks to lose Duncan, Parker, Manu and Kawhi all in a row. There is no franchise in the history of sports that has lost that many core players in a short period of time and was back to winning championships in three years.

Quit bitching, and act like a man for chrissakes.

[Dejounte]

It cracks me up to see people watching the games and then say "there is no plan" or "blow it up". The fucking plan is right in front of your face if you PAY ATTENTION, rather than expecting this team to win the way the Big Three Spurs did and throwing your crayons when they don't.

There are no superstar trades to be made right now. Even if we write off all of the development of ALL of these kids, which we have spent 3-4 years on, there's no guarantee we get a superstar in the lottery. You're more likely to wind up with a Greg Oden or Andrew Bogut than Tim Duncan. Get this through your fucking head.

THAT'S WHAT MADE OUR GOLDEN ERA SO FUCKING AWESOME.

Develop the kids, hopefully one of them can make a leap and develop into a lead player. Keep building and developing assets. Maybe in the next few years we can swing a trade for a headline player. That's it - that's the fucking plan.

It sucks to lose Duncan, Parker, Manu and Kawhi all in a row. There is no franchise in the history of sports that has lost that many core players in a short period of time and was back to winning championships in three years.

Quit bitching, and act like a man for chrissakes.

Accept it. You will find none of that here. A bunch of folks enjoy wallowing in their misery here. Sooner you realize that, the better.

[Chucho]

What is there to blow up?

DeRozan taking a hike is about as far is "blowing" this up can go. Mills and Gay don't matter.

[TD 21]

The biggest problem is that this roster has way too many players who don't fit together.

We simply can't have more than 1 non-shooter if Jakob is starting. Nowdays we have 2 non-shooters and 2 bad ones in the starting lineup.
Until Demar is gone, Lonnie or Devin have to start for spacing purposes. Even if Demar/DJ/Derrick are better players. But who do you even bench?
Keldon has to start because he's the only guy with size who's not a pussy and can rebound.

That leaves DJ and Demar. Can't bench either one because of their egos, would ruin them.
DJ-Lonnie-Devin-Keldon-Jakob lineup makes the most sense. Or Luka in place of Lonnie/Devin. They're not good enough now, but with current roster those are the only starting lineups that make sense.
Won't happen because the old man who always says he doesn't care about basketball is still desparate to get those all-time records. And everyone is suffering because of it.

That and a lack of high end talent. Individually they've done well considering where the youth were drafted and most of them probably will have long careers as solid starters - decent backups, but collectively they're lacking.

The lack of spacing among the starters is embarrassing, but it's not like replacing DeRozan with a stretch four would solve their issues because then they'd lack primary shot creation/play making.

This is why I was never in favor of committing to a Murray-White back court because they're not nearly dynamic/potent enough offensively.

Johnson shouldn't be starting right now, but almost has to by default. Start Walkver IV or Vassell and they become too small. Start Gay and they further weaken the second unit, one of their few strengths. Start Samanic and they don't gain (markedly, at least) more stretch.

But yeah, looking ahead conventional wisdom has been to replace DeRozan with a stretch four, but until/unless Johnson shows marked progress from 3, the other move is going to have to be to start Vassell at the three.

[RC_Drunkford]

You know it’s bad when reddit posters bash this team and Pop. I never thought I would see this

[MultiTroll]

At this rate poop gonna need two years to break the record
But that is what is most important.

[Ice009]

I've been thinking about White recently, and I wonder, what do you guys think his best stretches were/longest stretches of his best play? I think it was back when LA was still playing at an all-star level a couple of years ago. I wonder if LA make White look better than he really is. I'm not too impressed with the way White has played most of this season and most of last season (excluding the bubble, but that too small a sample size). Do you guys think Aldridge (when he was a bigger threat) helped him to look better than he is?

[timtonymanu]

I've been thinking about White recently, and I wonder, what do you guys think his best stretches were/longest stretches of his best play? I think it was back when LA was still playing at an all-star level a couple of years ago. I wonder if LA make White look better than he really is. I'm not too impressed with the way White has played most of this season and most of last season (excluding the bubble, but that too small a sample size). Do you guys think Aldridge (when he was a bigger threat) helped him to look better than he is?

Definitely back in 2019. There's a reason why we hyped him up so much. The Spurs don't make the playoffs that year without him. I think he has too many injury issues and he's reached his ceiling (2019 White might be the best he will ever look). When people said he was George Hill, honestly it wasn't that far off.

[DJR210]

The Spurs being in draft purgatory doesn't help.. We can sure draft solid role players, but how are we going to nab the next true franchise player? Sure ain't going to be a FA

[DAF86]

I've been thinking about White recently, and I wonder, what do you guys think his best stretches were/longest stretches of his best play? I think it was back when LA was still playing at an all-star level a couple of years ago. I wonder if LA make White look better than he really is. I'm not too impressed with the way White has played most of this season and most of last season (excluding the bubble, but that too small a sample size). Do you guys think Aldridge (when he was a bigger threat) helped him to look better than he is?

Last season's bubble White was pretty damn good, tbh.

[duncan2k5]

Last season's bubble White was pretty damn good, tbh.
But that's like when any role player from other teams have a good stretch...white will never be anything greater than a solid starter ..he DEFINITELY isn't untradeable and damn sure isn't ever gonna be a star

[Thomas82]

The Spurs being in draft purgatory doesn't help.. We can sure draft solid role players, but how are we going to nab the next true franchise player? Sure ain't going to be a FA

And you can only have so many of these types on your team. The lottery would fix a lot of things for us.

[ragas]

But that's like when any role player from other teams have a good stretch...white will never be anything greater than a solid starter ..he DEFINITELY isn't untradeable and damn sure isn't ever gonna be a star

The Spurs should definitely think about an upgrade for White. He's not that young and his injuries are a concern. If there's a chance you can trade up in the draft to get a guy like Jalen Suggs, don't think twice.

[Rummpd]

Only this inept front office could have two former all stars on team with soon to be expired contracts and get nothing for them and in fact pay one to buy out contract. Horrible execution so why have any faith in them?

Now we have a team with too many of same players, a center who can’t shoot, not enough three point threats in a league feasting on the analytical stats that support shooting a lot, and a stubborn HOF coach who at this point should help blow it up rather than toil in NBA mediocrity.