Per The Athletic, "A source with knowledge of DeRozan’s outlook said he’ll be taking a “wide open” approach to free agency in terms of possible landing spots."

[Dejounte]

DeMar DeRozan, Spurs (unrestricted)

Outlook: If you do a quick search of players who are averaging at least 21 points, seven assists and four rebounds per game this season, you see a list of eight players who have one thing in common: They don’t come cheap. Six of the players are on max deals (Damian Lillard, Nikola Jokic, LeBron James, James Harden, Russell Westbrook, Jimmy Butler), one is on a near-max (DeRozan left some money on the table when he-resigned in Toronto in 2016) and one is headed toward a max extension after his rookie deal (Luka Doncic). And if we’re assuming that Paul will cite the Holiday deal as evidence of his own worth – and we are – then you’d better believe the 31-year-old DeRozan is doing the same.

A source with knowledge of DeRozan’s outlook said he’ll be taking a “wide open” approach to free agency in terms of possible landing spots. But after these past three seasons in San Antonio, where he was asked to sacrifice on the scoring front and evolve as a playmaker in the process, the master of the midrange has put himself in prime position to take advantage of this well-earned reputation as a more versatile offensive threat.

Post-trade deadline prism: The Spurs, whose choice to waive LaMarcus Aldridge in exchange for $5.8 million in buyout money was the headline of their deadline period, are on the dawn of a new financial era. Between Aldridge, DeRozan Rudy Gay, Patty Mills and Trey Lyles, they have a combined $78 million coming off the books.

As for DeRozan’s ultimate landing spot, it will be fascinating to see what teams emerge as suitors and what the market bears. In this point guard-heavy free agency class, he’s the best wing player available outside of Leonard, who – as we noted – doesn’t appear to actually be available.

https://theathletic.com/2504113/2021/04/07/nba-free-agency-kawhi-leonard-certain-to-stay-with-clippers-demar-derozan-pursuit-wide-open-a-look-at-the-best-available-options?source=user-shared-article

https://i.imgur.com/nlw1AbB.gif?noredirect

[lefty]

Kewl

[baseline bum]

So whoever offers the most money. I'd do the same in his shoes.

[Dejounte]

Potential DeRozan suitors (or teams who will have the max) according to the article:

Five teams are assured of having significant cap room.:


Three of those teams — the Knicks, Spurs, and Thunder — will have enough cap room for a max contract even if they win the lottery.
A fourth, the Mavericks, project to have about $35 million in room if Josh Richardson opts out of his $11.6 million player option, which would put them in play for the max contract for a player with nine or fewer years of service (currently projected at $33.7 million).
One other team, the Hornets, will have significant cap room, but probably not quite enough for a max. We project them to have about $26 million below the cap line.

Three others teams seem likely to have room if they want it:


The Raptors will be about $25 million below the cap if they don’t re-sign Kyle Lowry (https://theathletic.com/player/nba/raptors/kyle-lowry/) and waive the non-guaranteed deals of Aron Baynes (https://theathletic.com/player/nba/raptors/aron-baynes/), Rodney Hood (https://theathletic.com/player/nba/raptors/rodney-hood/), Paul Watson (https://theathletic.com/player/nba/raptors/paul-watson/) and DeAndre’ Bembry (https://theathletic.com/player/nba/raptors/deandre-bembry/). This includes Gary Trent, Jr. (https://theathletic.com/player/nba/raptors/gary-trent-jr/)’s cap hold. They could generate another $7 million in room by waiving or trading Chris Boucher (https://theathletic.com/player/nba/raptors/chris-boucher/).
The Heat will be in the same position if they don’t re-sign Victor Oladipo (https://theathletic.com/player/nba/heat/victor-oladipo/) or Kendrick Nunn (https://theathletic.com/player/nba/heat/kendrick-nunn/), and decline team options on Andre Iguodala (https://theathletic.com/player/nba/heat/andre-iguodala/) ($15 million) and Goran Dragic (https://theathletic.com/player/nba/heat/goran-dragic/) ($18.4 million).
The Grizzlies will also be in that dollar range if they decline a team option Justise Winslow (https://theathletic.com/player/nba/grizzlies/justise-winslow/) ($13 million) and waive the non-guaranteed Jontay Porter (https://theathletic.com/player/nba/grizzlies/jontay-porter/).

Finally, a small handful of teams could, in theory, have significant cap space, but it’s unlikely to work out that way in practice.


The Suns will have close to $30 million in room if Chris Paul (https://theathletic.com/player/nba/suns/chris-paul/) opts out and leaves as a free agent.
The Pelicans, Hawks, and Cavs could get close to $20 million in room, but only if significant restricted free agents (Lonzo Ball (https://theathletic.com/player/nba/pelicans/lonzo-ball/), John Collins (https://theathletic.com/player/nba/hawks/john-collins/), Jarrett Allen (https://theathletic.com/player/nba/cavaliers/jarrett-allen/)) walk out the door.
The Bulls could do the same, but would have to waive or trade Thaddeus Young (https://theathletic.com/player/nba/bulls/thaddeus-young/) and Tomas Satoransky (https://theathletic.com/player/nba/bulls/tomas-satoransky/), and let Lauri Markkanen (https://theathletic.com/player/nba/bulls/lauri-markkanen/) walk.
The Pistons could theoretically generate $25 million in cap room, but most of it will likely be siphoned out by the cap hold for a high lottery pick.

[SpurSpike]

I saw DDR made a point to go talk to Lou Williams after the last Hawks game when Lou played us on his 1st game after being traded. Lou took the trade pretty hard I think, DDR is a good dude to check in on him.

I like DeRozan and hope he ends up somewhere he is happy weather that be with the Spurs or elsewhere.

[Dejounte]

My guesses:

1) Back with the Spurs
2) The Hornets
3) Dark horse pick are the Mavericks

[exstatic]

My guess: the Knicks. They’ll pay him as much as he can make, and as many years as he’s allowed. They’ve been so Star starved, they’ll squint, and see him as a franchise guy.

[KobesAchilles]

Would be the biggest mistake the franchise has made since trading Kawhi if we let him go. He deserves the max PERIOD

[baseline bum]

Would be the biggest mistake the franchise has made since trading Kawhi if we let him go. He deserves the max PERIOD

Why? The team sucks with him, they can get their teeth kicked it at home fine without him too.

[KobesAchilles]

Why? The team sucks with him, they can get their teeth kicked it at home fine without him too.
I mean he was destined to fail here since the team was never built around him If we properly built around him then we would be a top 4 team in the west this year. Like imagine if the 27 million a year to LMA actually went to a good player. Imagine if his center could make a lay up. Or KJ a wide ass open 3. This team is built in a way for him to fail and he still is dragging the Spurs to the playoffs (play-in).

[LeBowen]

S&T is the most realistic option, imo.

If not, rather let him walk than have him re-sign here.

[cd98]

I think the Knicks or the Heat would be preferred. I think the Spurs try and do a two year deal, and he will reject that for either more years (last big contract) or a better winning situation (Heat). I don't see him staying in San Antonio, but only because San Antonio wouldn't max him. If San Antonio offered him the max or near max, I think he would definitely re-sign with the Spurs because he has to like that the entire offense flows through him.

[exstatic]

I mean he was destined to fail here since the team was never built around him If we properly built around him then we would be a top 4 team in the west this year. Like imagine if the 27 million a year to LMA actually went to a good player. Imagine if his center could make a lay up. Or KJ a wide ass open 3. This team is built in a way for him to fail and he still is dragging the Spurs to the playoffs (play-in).

At this rate, we won’t make the play in, and Poeltl makes layups just fine. What player is going to sign here, with the team drowning, weighed down by DD’s antiquated game? We didn’t sign players coming off championships.

[Dejounte]

IMO, the Heat don't trade for Oladipo without any intention of keeping him. Their cap space will go to him, leaving no room for DeRozan.

[itzsoweezee]

Cool, enjoy your new team, demar

[John B]

It would be a long dry season without a franchise player. Be careful what you wish for.

I still believe this team is a PF/C 20/10 away from being a contender, as long as Murray, White, Keldon, Vassell, Luka and Poeltl continue to improve. Sign Demar his max, sign Patty but in limited role, and let Rudy/Lyles walk. Sign Dieng back.

I think Demar has demonstrated his loyalty, and being a good soldier. He likes playing with the young core. I think he will sign with the Spurs, granted they have a good plan of becoming competitive. But if it's another year of mediocrity, I think Demar should find a contender that he can help get a ring.

[GAustex]

Well bye gif

[exstatic]

It would be a long dry season without a franchise player. Be careful what you wish for.

I still believe this team is a PF/C 20/10 away from being a contender, as long as Murray, White, Keldon, Vassell, Luka and Poeltl continue to improve. Sign Demar his max, sign Patty but in limited role, and let Rudy/Lyles walk. Sign Dieng back.

I think Demar has demonstrated his loyalty, and being a good soldier. He likes playing with the young core. I think he will sign with the Spurs, granted they have a good plan of becoming competitive. But if it's another year of mediocrity, I think Demar should find a contender that he can help get a ring.

And how are we going to get that 20/10 PF/C? They don’t grown on trees, and if we tie up $30M in DD, we won’t be able to afford one, regardless.

[BatManu20]

My gut feeling is he returns to the East. My guess is:

1. Knicks
2. Heat
3. Spurs

[PhantomDashCam]

If he took that same approach to 3 pointers and less so on the defensive end...

Teams been playing like a clogged drain as of late.

In all seriousness, DDR deserves to be happy - hope he finds a situation that accommodates his unique, although at times archaic, offensive gifts.
Spurs have three players who should compete for starters minutes at SF next season too.

[TD 21]

I suspect the candidates are Hawks, Grizzlies, Knicks, Raptors . . .

- Hawks: Would have to go the sign and trade route, with Collins and/or Bogdanovic being candidates. Would upgrade the latter in terms of shot creation, but only makes sense if Young is willing to cede primary ball handling responsibilities.

- Grizzlies: Desperately need another source of shot creation alongside Morant and he'd be a significant offensive upgrade on Winslow.

- Knicks: Even if they regress some, with Randle's and Barrett's improvement from 3 and if they plan to start Quickley next season, he could make sense if they want to fast track their re-build, but he'd stunt the growth of Barrett.

- Raptors: Ideal current fit with core as Lowry replacement, but they need a starting center and may not want to deal with possible backlash again if/when he doesn't finish his career with them.

The Grizzlies make the most sense from both a team and player perspective. Small market, intriguing young nucleus, no go-to guy at the moment and can't attract real stars.

[r0drig0lac]

reality: 12:01

Adrian Wojnarowski
@wojespn
free agent Demar Derozan has agreed to 3-year, $105M deal with Spurs

[itzsoweezee]

It would be a long dry season without a franchise player. Be careful what you wish for.

I still believe this team is a PF/C 20/10 away from being a contender, as long as Murray, White, Keldon, Vassell, Luka and Poeltl continue to improve. Sign Demar his max, sign Patty but in limited role, and let Rudy/Lyles walk. Sign Dieng back.

I think Demar has demonstrated his loyalty, and being a good soldier. He likes playing with the young core. I think he will sign with the Spurs, granted they have a good plan of becoming competitive. But if it's another year of mediocrity, I think Demar should find a contender that he can help get a ring.

Lolololol

[SpursDynasty85]

reality: 12:01

Adrian Wojnarowski
@wojespn
free agent Demar Derozan has agreed to 3-year, $105M deal with Spurs

I think it is becoming clear unless we catch fire and make the playoffs, Spurs will not invest heavy in DeMar anymore.

[Prime BEEF]

​
My guess: the Knicks. They’ll pay him as much as he can make, and as many years as he’s allowed. They’ve been so Star starved, they’ll squint, and see him as a franchise guy.
Agreed. I think he’s going to the Knicks. Although I’d love a ST with hawks for Collins

[tbdog]

And how are we going to get that 20/10 PF/C? They don’t grown on trees, and if we tie up $30M in DD, we won’t be able to afford one, regardless.

I've been saying this for a while. I think Spurs will go hard for sabonis or towns this offseason.

[KingKev]

We should realize unless we pay DDR 30+ a year we are not even on his radar. 39mm cap hold makes a S&T challenging to offer anyone else a decent deal unless all things are lined up well in advance. There is no winning for us.

[mo7888]

I think its going to be the Knicks... if not, then the S&T is in play and that could work to our benefit if we have anyone in the FO who knows how to navigate that..

[mo7888]

We should realize unless we pay DDR 30+ a year we are not even on his radar. 39mm cap hold makes a S&T challenging to offer anyone else a decent deal unless all things are lined up well in advance. There is no winning for us.

The hold won't be an issue because there's nobody on the market that's worth throwing that kind of money at. We can afford to wait.. it'll be a short wait anyway. He'll agree in the 1st week.

[spurs1990]

In this last 2-7 home stand, DeRozan bears no fault in its occurrence? Is that the message of our resident DeRozan diehards.

Just to recap, a loss to the undermanned Hornets, Hawks, Pacers, and a house-cleaning by the tanking Cavaliers.

So if we're to fear what the Spurs will be like next year without DeRozan, how does that equate to the losses above with him prime and ready in each game.
Maybe we lose to Cleveland by 35 instead of 25. I just don't understand those calling to hitch another three years with DeRozan as player 1 or 1A.

[gambit1990]

hometown discount one year deal with the lakers?

[Dejounte]

IF DeMar is indeed taking a "wide open" approach, then the chucking and freezing out of teammates will continue. Expect more "clutch" DeMar at the end of games.

[EasyMoney]

I wonder if the heat will put their name in the hat. Them and the Knicks

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Will be one more failure by old man Pop if he walks for nothing.

In classic Spurs/R.C. groveling fashion, they'll probably offer the supermax at 12:01.

Best move would be a sign and trade out east. Time for Wright to earn his keep.

[itzsoweezee]

In this last 2-7 home stand, DeRozan bears no fault in its occurrence? Is that the message of our resident DeRozan diehards.

Just to recap, a loss to the undermanned Hornets, Hawks, Pacers, and a house-cleaning by the tanking Cavaliers.

So if we're to fear what the Spurs will be like next year without DeRozan, how does that equate to the losses above with him prime and ready in each game.
Maybe we lose to Cleveland by 35 instead of 25. I just don't understand those calling to hitch another three years with DeRozan as player 1 or 1A.

The derozan diehards are by far the most delusional people on the site. Just absolute mush for brains

[MultiTroll]

The most important factor is what does Pop want.

[timtonymanu]

He won’t be back. Hopefully he lands on a championship team tbh.

[BackHome]

I suspect the candidates are Hawks, Grizzlies, Knicks, Raptors . . .

- Hawks: Would have to go the sign and trade route, with Collins and/or Bogdanovic being candidates. Would upgrade the latter in terms of shot creation, but only makes sense if Young is willing to cede primary ball handling responsibilities.

- Grizzlies: Desperately need another source of shot creation alongside Morant and he'd be a significant offensive upgrade on Winslow.

- Knicks: Even if they regress some, with Randle's and Barrett's improvement from 3 and if they plan to start Quickley next season, he could make sense if they want to fast track their re-build, but he'd stunt the growth of Barrett.

- Raptors: Ideal current fit with core as Lowry replacement, but they need a starting center and may not want to deal with possible backlash again if/when he doesn't finish his career with them.

The Grizzlies make the most sense from both a team and player perspective. Small market, intriguing young nucleus, no go-to guy at the moment and can't attract real stars.

+1

[cd021]

hometown discount one year deal with the lakers?
S&T would be needed for that to happen.

[Dex]

I could see NY putting in a bid on him. Not sure if they have the cap-space to pay him what he wants though

[timvp]

A source with knowledge of DeRozan’s outlook said he’ll be taking a “wide open” approach to free agency in terms of possible landing spots.

I mean, yeah, obviously. Why would he narrow his search on what is sure to be his last big contract?



Spurs fans: DeRozan sucks, I can't wait until he's off the team. He's been a net-negative player his whole career. The Spurs will be better the second he leaves.

Also Spurs fans: How could this incompetent front office let him walk for nothing? Look at his averages! They should be able to get at least two first round draft picks for him!

[DAF86]

I mean he was destined to fail here since the team was never built around him If we properly built around him then we would be a top 4 team in the west this year. Like imagine if the 27 million a year to LMA actually went to a good player. Imagine if his center could make a lay up. Or KJ a wide ass open 3. This team is built in a way for him to fail and he still is dragging the Spurs to the playoffs (play-in).

Dude, just no. Stop. It's time to move on.

[DAF86]

I mean, yeah, obviously. Why would he narrow his search on what is sure to be his last big contract?



Spurs fans: DeRozan sucks, I can't wait until he's off the team. He's been a net-negative player his whole career. The Spurs will be better the second he leaves.

Also Spurs fans: How could this incompetent front office let him walk for nothing? Look at his averages! They should be able to get at least two first round draft picks for him!

I don't see how those comments contradict each other, tbh. DeRozan's experiment with the Spurs is pretty much done. It didn't work out. That doesn't mean DD's guady numbers can't atract a decent haul from another team. Anything would have been better than letting him go for nothing.

[cd021]

We should realize unless we pay DDR 30+ a year we are not even on his radar. 39mm cap hold makes a S&T challenging to offer anyone else a decent deal unless all things are lined up well in advance. There is no winning for us.
The Spurs may know before FA that he is unlikely to re-sign and shift focus on signing other players. They could keep his cap hold on the books until it comes time to actually sign players, making it possible for an S&T. Otherwise, they'd just renounce him.

[duncan2150]

With not a lot of cap teams, what happens if we do a sign and trade ? if we keep his rights, his cap hold will not handicap us for signing other free agents ?

[TD 21]

I mean, yeah, obviously. Why would he narrow his search on what is sure to be his last big contract?



Spurs fans: DeRozan sucks, I can't wait until he's off the team. He's been a net-negative player his whole career. The Spurs will be better the second he leaves.

Also Spurs fans: How could this incompetent front office let him walk for nothing? Look at his averages! They should be able to get at least two first round draft picks for him!

Nice try.

Multiple things can be true at once: He's not a legit star, but they won't be better without him necessarily (pending other moves) because they currently don't have anyone else who can play his all important role.

It's also more than reasonable to think a team going nowhere fast, with by all indications no interest in re-signing him, would trade him and take what they can get while they still have leverage.

But, you know, 5 rings, so . . .

[cd021]

Chicago may be an option; Bulls reportedly had interest in DeMar, and are probably looking for a third "star" to go with LaVine and Vucevic. They can't sign DeMar outright but they do have Markkanen who, if he's interested, could be shipped back in a double S&T (I think that's technically possible) . Bulls get DeMar and Spurs get Lauri.

[itzsoweezee]

I mean, yeah, obviously. Why would he narrow his search on what is sure to be his last big contract?



Spurs fans: DeRozan sucks, I can't wait until he's off the team. He's been a net-negative player his whole career. The Spurs will be better the second he leaves.

Also Spurs fans: How could this incompetent front office let him walk for nothing? Look at his averages! They should be able to get at least two first round draft picks for him!

No one sensible is expecting two first round picks for derozan. The Spurs fucked up when they didn’t trade him after that first playoff embarrassment, then doubled down by not moving him in the two years since. Now their only hope is some sucker team will be as delusional about derozan as Spurs fans are.

[gambit1990]

I suspect the candidates are Hawks, Grizzlies, Knicks, Raptors . . .

- Hawks: Would have to go the sign and trade route, with Collins and/or Bogdanovic being candidates. Would upgrade the latter in terms of shot creation, but only makes sense if Young is willing to cede primary ball handling responsibilities.

- Grizzlies: Desperately need another source of shot creation alongside Morant and he'd be a significant offensive upgrade on Winslow.

- Knicks: Even if they regress some, with Randle's and Barrett's improvement from 3 and if they plan to start Quickley next season, he could make sense if they want to fast track their re-build, but he'd stunt the growth of Barrett.

- Raptors: Ideal current fit with core as Lowry replacement, but they need a starting center and may not want to deal with possible backlash again if/when he doesn't finish his career with them.

The Grizzlies make the most sense from both a team and player perspective. Small market, intriguing young nucleus, no go-to guy at the moment and can't attract real stars.
hmm... i'd say:
knicks #1
hawks #2
spurs #3 ?

i think the raps and grizz are too smart to want demar. both teams need help but demar is not the answer for anyone TBH.

[Dejounte]

Chicago may be an option; Bulls reportedly had interest in DeMar, and are probably looking for a third "star" to go with LaVine and Vucevic. They can't sign DeMar outright but they do have Markkanen who, if he's interested, could be shipped back in a double S&T (I think that's technically possible) . Bulls get DeMar and Spurs get Lauri.

Probably depends on how the Bulls perform the rest of the season. If they do bad, yes. If they do good, probably not.

[gambit1990]

Chicago may be an option; Bulls reportedly had interest in DeMar, and are probably looking for a third "star" to go with LaVine and Vucevic. They can't sign DeMar outright but they do have Markkanen who, if he's interested, could be shipped back in a double S&T (I think that's technically possible) . Bulls get DeMar and Spurs get Lauri.
the bulls are 100% dumb enough to want demar.

[tbdog]

Bulls and Markkanen is obviously a reasonable trade scenario. I would try and get Satoranský, who's contract should close the gap in the DDR contract. Satoranský is the type of Spurs they need. Just is a very smart player, combo guard with good size and a decent shooter.

I am unsure how double sign and trades work though.

[TD 21]

Chicago may be an option; Bulls reportedly had interest in DeMar, and are probably looking for a third "star" to go with LaVine and Vucevic. They can't sign DeMar outright but they do have Markkanen who, if he's interested, could be shipped back in a double S&T (I think that's technically possible) . Bulls get DeMar and Spurs get Lauri.

From the Bulls perspective, I suspect the Vucevic trade was two fold: Belief that Williams can become a significant piece and if so, with him, LaVine, Vucevic and a big market, if they can become decent for a while, they can get in the game for significant free agents.

That being the case, they're not blowing that opportunity on late - post prime DeRozan, especially when their two best players are already sub par defenders.



hmm... i'd say:
knicks #1
hawks #2
spurs #3 ?

i think the raps and grizz are too smart to want demar. both teams need help but demar is not the answer for anyone TBH.

There's no such thing as "too smart". Most of the job is luck based and situational. The Spurs were supposedly geniuses for nearly two decades, until they weren't. Then it was the Warriors turn, then they weren't.

[RC_Drunkford]

I hope he walks, but if he walks for nothing Popovich is the biggest idiot in NBA history

[SpurPadre]

Too bad he can't take a "wide open" three when he's given the chance...

[gambit1990]

There's no such thing as "too smart". Most of the job is luck based and situational. The Spurs were supposedly geniuses for nearly two decades, until they weren't. Then it was the Warriors turn, then they weren't.
i disagree. there's good GMs, etc. and bad ones. i think masai knew who demar really was. and was smart enough to "risk" moving him for kawhi.

also, the warriors had solid rosters / would still be favorites if durant never left. they didn't want to move him for DLo.

most (all?) teams were smart enough to not offer much for la and / or demar.

spurs were smart for drafting outside america but the rest of the league caught up with that.

[duncan2k5]

I mean he was destined to fail here since the team was never built around him If we properly built around him then we would be a top 4 team in the west this year. Like imagine if the 27 million a year to LMA actually went to a good player. Imagine if his center could make a lay up. Or KJ a wide ass open 3. This team is built in a way for him to fail and he still is dragging the Spurs to the playoffs (play-in).
This is bullshit...a real difference maker can go to ANY team and make it successful...the team doesn't literally have to be built around them...DeMar just isn't that guy...kawhi never had a team that was built around him...he played with whatever he had...durant can go to ANY team... Tatum can go to any team...AD can go to any team...DeMar needs a team to be built around him because he is so limited, but even if one were to be built around him, he simply isn't that dude...that team wouldn't be taken seriously

[duncan2150]

Can someone explain the situation with his bird rights- cap hold if we do a S&T ? Thanks

[GAustex]

Regarding DDR- “I can see the Emperor's has no Clothes/why can you not see the emperor has no clothes”

[timvp]

DeRozan's experiment with the Spurs is pretty much done. It didn't work out. That doesn't mean DD's guady numbers can't atract a decent haul from another team.


It's also more than reasonable to think a team going nowhere fast, with by all indications no interest in re-signing him, would trade him and take what they can get while they still have leverage.


The Spurs fucked up when they didn’t trade him after that first playoff embarrassment, then doubled down by not moving him in the two years since. Now their only hope is some sucker team will be as delusional about derozan as Spurs fans are.


I hope he walks, but if he walks for nothing Popovich is the biggest idiot in NBA history

Yeah, this is exactly what I was getting at, tbh. I know Spurs fans know that DeRozan's value is pretty limited in today's NBA. If someone like Evan Fournier was worth two second round draft picks, DeRozan's value to other teams is somewhere in that neighborhood, too. In fact, it's not a stretch to say Fournier has more universal appeal than DeRozan at this point in time, if only because he's a shooter.

We can pretend DeRozan is a major asset that the Spurs would be foolish to let walk. But if we're going to be realistic about it, we can admit that DeRozan is most likely worth a couple of second round draft picks, at most.

[Allan Rowe vs Wade]

i love ddr, hope he gets paid, hope he rings, looks like that aint gonna happen with the mermaids so ... be well playa

[DAF86]

Yeah, this is exactly what I was getting at, tbh. I know Spurs fans know that DeRozan's value is pretty limited in today's NBA. If someone like Evan Fournier was worth two second round draft picks, DeRozan's value to other teams is somewhere in that neighborhood, too. In fact, it's not a stretch to say Fournier has more universal appeal than DeRozan at this point in time, if only because he's a shooter.

We can pretend DeRozan is a major asset that the Spurs would be foolish to let walk. But if we're going to be realistic about it, we can admit that DeRozan is most likely worth a couple of second round draft picks, at most.

Nah, Derozan would have pretty clearly comanded a much better haul than Fournier. A first round pick is the least we would have got.

[3&D_TBH]

Nah, Derozan would have pretty clearly comanded a much better haul than Fournier. A first round pick is the least we would have got.
Disagree. If I’m a GM I value wings that can shoot the three and play defense. Demar can do neither. He might not even bring in a single first round pick, but there’s no way he brings two IMO

[DAF86]

Disagree. If I’m a GM I value wings that can shoot the three and play defense. Demar can do neither. He might not even bring in a single first round pick, but there’s no way he brings two IMO

Many teams desperate to make the playoffs would have easily given up a protected first round pick for DeRozan.

[itzsoweezee]

Yeah, this is exactly what I was getting at, tbh. I know Spurs fans know that DeRozan's value is pretty limited in today's NBA. If someone like Evan Fournier was worth two second round draft picks, DeRozan's value to other teams is somewhere in that neighborhood, too. In fact, it's not a stretch to say Fournier has more universal appeal than DeRozan at this point in time, if only because he's a shooter.

We can pretend DeRozan is a major asset that the Spurs would be foolish to let walk. But if we're going to be realistic about it, we can admit that DeRozan is most likely worth a couple of second round draft picks, at most.

Yes, because the Spurs completely mismanaged this “asset”. You people will forever live in denial about the incompetence of this front office. I wouldn’t be surprised if they re-sign this dude because that is exactly the type of move a shitty front office would do.

[exstatic]

I've been saying this for a while. I think Spurs will go hard for sabonis or towns this offseason.

Towns isn’t a FA, and Minny won’t trade him, since his contract isn’t up until 2024. He’s expressed an interest in staying,

[mo7888]

Towns isn’t a FA, and Minny won’t trade him, since his contract isn’t up until 2024. He’s expressed an interest in staying,

There have been reports since the deadline that Minny is looking to move Towns send Russell this offseason.

[paperboy77]

Why? The team sucks with him, they can get their teeth kicked it at home fine without him too.

Starting to think that way too.

[KaiRMD1]

Starting to think that way too.

I haven't seen a lot of upside with DeRozan lately so I'm on the same boat

[slick'81]

:rollinAnybody wanting this guy back after missing out on the playoffs 2/3 seasons

[PhantomDashCam]

Disagree. If I’m a GM I value wings that can shoot the three and play defense. Demar can do neither. He might not even bring in a single first round pick, but there’s no way he brings two IMO


Spot on. And his attitude when the team experiences any form of adversity? A missed call, contentious foul... Just can't keep his cool. Not many teams would be willing to sign up for that.

[GAustex]

Yes, because the Spurs completely mismanaged this “asset”. You people will forever live in denial about the incompetence of this front office. I wouldn’t be surprised if they re-sign this dude because that is exactly the type of move a shitty front office would do.

[Slippy]

Spot on. And his attitude when the team experiences any form of adversity? A missed call, contentious foul... Just can't keep his cool. Not many teams would be willing to sign up for that.

He did it again tonight.. this young team seeing that attitude

[Allan Rowe vs Wade]

rudy and patty -22 and -29 tonight and spurstalk is talking about demar .....

[TD 21]

Yeah, this is exactly what I was getting at, tbh. I know Spurs fans know that DeRozan's value is pretty limited in today's NBA. If someone like Evan Fournier was worth two second round draft picks, DeRozan's value to other teams is somewhere in that neighborhood, too. In fact, it's not a stretch to say Fournier has more universal appeal than DeRozan at this point in time, if only because he's a shooter.

We can pretend DeRozan is a major asset that the Spurs would be foolish to let walk. But if we're going to be realistic about it, we can admit that DeRozan is most likely worth a couple of second round draft picks, at most.

Even if that were true, I'd take that over nothing. The guy who should win MVP this season was the 41st pick in the '14 draft. Needle in a haystack obviously, but it beats the alternative.

[TD 21]

i disagree. there's good GMs, etc. and bad ones. i think masai knew who demar really was. and was smart enough to "risk" moving him for kawhi.

also, the warriors had solid rosters / would still be favorites if durant never left. they didn't want to move him for DLo.

most (all?) teams were smart enough to not offer much for la and / or demar.

spurs were smart for drafting outside america but the rest of the league caught up with that.

That wasn't a risk, it was the equivalent of finding a wallet with a lot of money in it.

Because of a mostly lucky run of drafting that netted them Curry, Thompson, Green.

By that logic, certain teams would never fall and others would never rise.

[J_Paco]

My guess: the Knicks. They’ll pay him as much as he can make, and as many years as he’s allowed. They’ve been so Star starved, they’ll squint, and see him as a franchise guy.

Praying to the stars above you're right.

We need to end this "era" of Spurs basketball as quickly as possible and start collecting lottery picks (and hopefully that translating to wins).

[baseline bum]

At this point DeRozan is nothing but downside. He won them some early season games but now that the games are starting to mean something he's not taking the team anywhere. So if he's in his 30s and not winning us games now, what exactly is the point of having him here? To stunt the growth of Walker, Vassell, and Keldon? He is negative value to the team, might as well buy him out too.

[FutureMan]

Like a few people here, I see this as a sign and trade. Possibly for a team looking to upgrade their roster. Something like:

ATL: DeRozan
SAS: Gallinari & ATL 2021 1st

This way they can still resign Collins. Certainly solidifies ATL as a top 4-5 team in the East.

For the Spurs it gives them a vet off the bench to replace Gay and of course a pick.

[tbdog]

Towns isn’t a FA, and Minny won’t trade him, since his contract isn’t up until 2024. He’s expressed an interest in staying,

Towns is available. But they want an AX/Harden haul.

[gambit1990]

That wasn't a risk, it was the equivalent of finding a wallet with a lot of money in it.
then why didn't the spurs get a better deal for kawhi?


Because of a mostly lucky run of drafting that netted them Curry, Thompson, Green.
draft is skill and luck.


By that logic, certain teams would never fall and others would never rise.
wtf :lol

how on earth are you arguing that some FOs aren't smarter than others?

[ElNono]

Yeah, this is exactly what I was getting at, tbh. I know Spurs fans know that DeRozan's value is pretty limited in today's NBA. If someone like Evan Fournier was worth two second round draft picks, DeRozan's value to other teams is somewhere in that neighborhood, too. In fact, it's not a stretch to say Fournier has more universal appeal than DeRozan at this point in time, if only because he's a shooter.

We can pretend DeRozan is a major asset that the Spurs would be foolish to let walk. But if we're going to be realistic about it, we can admit that DeRozan is most likely worth a couple of second round draft picks, at most.

DDR has now been under the tutelage of world's renowned coach Popovich, his trade value should be magnitudes higher than when the Spurs acquired him, tbh...

[exstatic]

Like a few people here, I see this as a sign and trade. Possibly for a team looking to upgrade their roster. Something like:

ATL: DeRozan
SAS: Gallinari & ATL 2021 1st

This way they can still resign Collins. Certainly solidifies ATL as a top 4-5 team in the East.

For the Spurs it gives them a vet off the bench to replace Gay and of course a pick.

Gallinari is 32, plays no defense, and is barely a replacement level player. This isn’t Gallo from 5 years ago.

[CGD]

Good for him. Let him shop around for a deal, and if the price is right Spurs still have the cap space to effectively outbid almost everyone if they choose.

[Ice009]

Towns is available. But they want an AX/Harden haul.

Do you think the Spurs could put together a package to get him, or do you think they don't have the assets to even get their hats in the ring? He's starting to be my number one preferred target right now, and I'd probably be OK with trading anyone on the team. Lonnie, I want to keep at give one more year to see what he can do, but if he's required in a package, I'd probably let him go too.

[exstatic]

Do you think the Spurs could put together a package to get him, or do you think they don't have the assets to even get their hats in the ring? He's starting to be my number one preferred target right now, and I'd probably be OK with trading anyone on the team. Lonnie, I want to keep at give one more year to see what he can do, but if he's required in a package, I'd probably let him go too.

The problem is, if you put that package together, your cupboard is bare, you get Towns, and you’re the Timberwolves. You’d have three years, maybe only two, to get more assets, and win, or he could walk for nothing, and we’d be worse off than now. Think DJ and Derrick for salaries, plus Walker and Vassell.

[Dverde]

At this point, I would think something is wrong with him if he wants to stay here.

[pad300]

Like a few people here, I see this as a sign and trade. Possibly for a team looking to upgrade their roster. Something like:

ATL: DeRozan
SAS: Gallinari & ATL 2021 1st

This way they can still resign Collins. Certainly solidifies ATL as a top 4-5 team in the East.

For the Spurs it gives them a vet off the bench to replace Gay and of course a pick.

Nobody is doing a first (even a far future first) as part of an S&T. You might be able to get something out of a franchise that has already mortgaged it's future, eg Chicago:

SAS : Sato + Markannen (S&T)
CHI : Derozan (S&T)

[Ice009]

The problem is, if you put that package together, your cupboard is bare, you get Towns, and you’re the Timberwolves. You’d have three years, maybe only two, to get more assets, and win, or he could walk for nothing, and we’d be worse off than now. Think DJ and Derrick for salaries, plus Walker and Vassell.

Yeah, I see your point, I'm still interested in taking a chance on him becoming a better player here that he ever was with the Timberwolves, but yeah, like you said, we'd probably have to give up too much to get him, so we'd be back to square one.

[Sugus]

Nobody is doing a first (even a far future first) as part of an S&T. You might be able to get something out of a franchise that has already mortgaged it's future, eg Chicago:

SAS : Sato + Markannen (S&T)
CHI : Derozan (S&T)

How is the logic both that the Spurs wouldn't be able to get even a late, late 1st back for DD in a S&T, and also that a team like the Bulls would gladly ship out a lottery pick prospect in Lauri back for getting DeRozan? Don't get me wrong, I'd take DeRozan to the airport myself if that offer was on the table, but seems wholly unrealistic tbh

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

I have a feeling DDR is just going to walk at the end of this season. With the lack of winning success he's brought the Spurs, I can't see them being willing to invest a lot to keep him. I'd be shocked at a sign and trade. It doesn't look like the Spurs have many willing trade partners out there that would provide us with any real value in return. We'll be a team of middle to late first and second round draft picks next season. Probably will be a long year.

[GAustex]

Need young athletic dudes willing to go for it. Use your young guards you have. Need depth at SF PF and C (lol). Maybe catch lightening in a bottle with the young ones putting it together.
Right now the young one look to the vets and get nothing.
Pitch the young ones into the deep end of the pool. Sink or swim

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

Need young athletic dudes willing to go for it. Use your young guards you have. Need depth at SF PF and C (lol). Maybe catch lightening in a bottle with the young ones putting it together.
Right now the young one look to the vets and get nothing.
Pitch the young ones into the deep end of the pool. Sink or swim

It's definitely the way it's going. Maybe there's a vet minimum player or two to provide some mentoring. Pop used to know how to properly use those type of guys to support the growth of the younger players. I guess the team's limited talent dictates that guys like Mills and Rudy play about twice as much as they should.

[Extra Stout]

Do you think the Spurs could put together a package to get him, or do you think they don't have the assets to even get their hats in the ring? He's starting to be my number one preferred target right now, and I'd probably be OK with trading anyone on the team. Lonnie, I want to keep at give one more year to see what he can do, but if he's required in a package, I'd probably let him go too.
I totally think the Spurs should target a guy who is the centerpiece of a perennially dysfunctional 13-39 team infamous for low effort.

KAT’s nickname should be “Absentee Voter,” because he just mails it in.

[pad300]

How is the logic both that the Spurs wouldn't be able to get even a late, late 1st back for DD in a S&T, and also that a team like the Bulls would gladly ship out a lottery pick prospect in Lauri back for getting DeRozan? Don't get me wrong, I'd take DeRozan to the airport myself if that offer was on the table, but seems wholly unrealistic tbh

Lauri hasn't exactly been pulling up trees for CHI, and is going to want to get paid. You could say he's been a bust; he definitely hasn't lived up to expectations. Does he fit with Vuc (and Lavine)? Not convinced myself (I think they need a stronger defender in the 4 spot with Vuc on the floor). So there are plenty of reasons to move him for value. Also, he's a RFA, he may also want out of CHI.

CHI on the other hand, post Vuc trade (which I think was a mistake for them, but not my problem), is committed to being a good team. Right now, they are 6 games into the Vuc era and are 2-4... If that doesn't improve significantly... Well, they will need to improve and they can't move more picks. They don't have the cap space to get Deroz directly; he might be the individual best FA left on the market. It gives them a big 3 who can all get their own shot. You can probably make a starting lineup that fits with Lavine and Vuc, because they can shoot the 3...

This doesn't cost CHI much by way of sunk costs. If they get Deroz, he's going to eat Sato's minutes anyway (and I've discussed Markannen's issues already).

[exstatic]

How is the logic both that the Spurs wouldn't be able to get even a late, late 1st back for DD in a S&T, and also that a team like the Bulls would gladly ship out a lottery pick prospect in Lauri back for getting DeRozan? Don't get me wrong, I'd take DeRozan to the airport myself if that offer was on the table, but seems wholly unrealistic tbh

They have seen Markkanen, and don’t want to pay him, allegedly. A pick is an unknown, with infinite promise right up until he steps onto the floor. In other words, basketball beer goggles.

[Extra Stout]

I have a feeling DDR is just going to walk at the end of this season. With the lack of winning success he's brought the Spurs, I can't see them being willing to invest a lot to keep him. I'd be shocked at a sign and trade. It doesn't look like the Spurs have many willing trade partners out there that would provide us with any real value in return. We'll be a team of middle to late first and second round draft picks next season. Probably will be a long year.
This is correct. The DDR-LMA-Gay Spurs have run their course. We all will remember fondly that one time they pushed the Denver Nuggets to seven games in the first round. Let’s tip our hats to the Medium 3.

Next year starts the string of 60-loss seasons for however many years it takes until the lottery balls bounce the right way. We can pass the time over those years (1) convincing ourselves that Johnson/Vassell/Murray/whoever is about to make that big leap, or (2) enjoying San Antonio’s surprisingly competitive park system and entertainment districts in the warm South Texas late spring while other cities’ teams are in the playoffs.

[FutureMan]

Gallinari is 32, plays no defense, and is barely a replacement level player. This isn’t Gallo from 5 years ago.

Gallinari would be good for this team off the bench hitting threes. Plus like I said it is also a salary dump for ATL. We’ll have the salary to give if DeRozan isn’t here. The prize for the Spurs is the pick. They’ll have to give up a pick to get rid of Gallinari anyway so they might as well get better with DeRozan. Anyway, that’s just one option. There are other teams in the east who can do similar trades.

[james evans]

Popovich will give him Supermax and buy him out in 3 years.

[rjv]

They have seen Markkanen, and don’t want to pay him, allegedly. A pick is an unknown, with infinite promise right up until he steps onto the floor. In other words, basketball beer goggles.

ST has more members with basketball beer goggles than a bar at closing time.

[mo7888]

So what do you think it would take to get KAT?

Would Poeltl, White, and 2 1st's get the conversation started?

[TD 21]

then why didn't the spurs get a better deal for kawhi?


draft is skill and luck.


wtf :lol

how on earth are you arguing that some FOs aren't smarter than others?

:lmao Seriously? Because Scumbag intentionally destroyed his value in an attempt to strong arm them into trading him to L.A.

More so luck, which is why the Warriors have mostly struggled with it since that run.

You're only arguing otherwise based on results that are mostly derived from luck. Again, if it were about being "smarter", there would be no rise and fall.

[tbdog]

Do you think the Spurs could put together a package to get him, or do you think they don't have the assets to even get their hats in the ring? He's starting to be my number one preferred target right now, and I'd probably be OK with trading anyone on the team. Lonnie, I want to keep at give one more year to see what he can do, but if he's required in a package, I'd probably let him go too.

If Spurs don't resign DDR, who I think is the best free agent available, along with possibly Oladipo. Then I think the Spurs have a good haul to offer for Towns. I think the starting bid will be Poeltl, White/Murray, and Johnson, 2x First round picks.

If the Spurs let DDR go and don't get a star in return, then there is no point.

[ducks]

The most important factor is what does Pop want.

Why it should be what is best for spurs not pop

[MultiTroll]

Why it should be what is best for spurs not pop
I should have typed it in blue so you would know it's sarcasm.

Altho it's also true of what has become of the Spurs.
It's all about what Pop wants 1st and foremost.
Winning is far down the line.

[Spursfanfromafar]

If Derozan leaves...the Spurs should target these three FAs: Evan Fournier, Nic Batum and Montrezl Harrell for short two year contracts.

[Sugus]

Lauri hasn't exactly been pulling up trees for CHI, and is going to want to get paid. You could say he's been a bust; he definitely hasn't lived up to expectations. Does he fit with Vuc (and Lavine)? Not convinced myself (I think they need a stronger defender in the 4 spot with Vuc on the floor). So there are plenty of reasons to move him for value. Also, he's a RFA, he may also want out of CHI.

CHI on the other hand, post Vuc trade (which I think was a mistake for them, but not my problem), is committed to being a good team. Right now, they are 6 games into the Vuc era and are 2-4... If that doesn't improve significantly... Well, they will need to improve and they can't move more picks. They don't have the cap space to get Deroz directly; he might be the individual best FA left on the market. It gives them a big 3 who can all get their own shot. You can probably make a starting lineup that fits with Lavine and Vuc, because they can shoot the 3...

This doesn't cost CHI much by way of sunk costs. If they get Deroz, he's going to eat Sato's minutes anyway (and I've discussed Markannen's issues already).

I don't disagree with either of your assessments re: Lauri and Chicago's position; however, I do disagree with the inference that Lauri's misfit with the Bulls directly means the Spurs would be able to get him via trading DDR to them. I hardly think the Bulls would like a heavy ball-handling guard taking shots away from Lavine (not to mention being unable to space the floor or C&S when Lavine penetrates to dish it out), not to mention DeRoz's no-D, which would be exacerbated on the Bulls, considering both Vuc and Lavine are not exactly lockdown defenders or close to it. Your "Big 3" all being able to get their own shot is great in theory, but teams don't want the kinds of shots DeMar gets, and the time/effort/ball-hogging it takes for him to get them, in the modern game.

I can't say for sure what other packages will be on the table, since many times random teams decide to blow it up or make certain players available after weak/disappointing playoff runs; but I'm sure the Bulls won't be looking our way. Not for that package at least. Maaaaybe Lauri + filler for DeRozan, either Murray/White, and a first would get it done, but I'd pass on that deal personally.

[MultiTroll]

What are the rules on trading for draft picks $$$ on an S&T.

If DD is signed and traded, does their have to be matching salary or can straight player for picks be done?

[Sugus]

If Spurs don't resign DDR, who I think is the best free agent available, along with possibly Oladipo. Then I think the Spurs have a good haul to offer for Towns. I think the starting bid will be Poeltl, White/Murray, and Johnson, 2x First round picks.

If the Spurs let DDR go and don't get a star in return, then there is no point.

That's the problem with trying to trade for an established star that's in an impoverished franchise. Asking cost is too high. No way KAT is worth that package - not because of the cost in a vacuum, but because it leaves the Spurs with too little assets/talent to surround KAT with. Actively contending teams can afford to ship out multiple 1sts for that kind of player who can "get them over the hump" (most recent example with Jrue and the Bucks, think it was even 3 picks), but the Spurs are nowhere near that status, and have to take real good care of their picks. I doubt they'd be able to crack 30 wins with that package being sent out.


If Derozan leaves...the Spurs should target these three FAs: Evan Fournier, Nic Batum and Montrezl Harrell for short two year contracts.

Why would the Spurs trade for middling roleplayers who do nothing to raise the teams' ceiling if DeRozan walks? Any scenario where DD leaves means the Spurs start an active tank job. There'd be no use for any of those players raising the teams' floor and worsening their pick, and likewise, none of those players would like to spend their prime years (well, maybe Batum would since he's over the hill already) in a tanking, small-market team. Hard pass.

[Dejounte]

That's the problem with trying to trade for an established star that's in an impoverished franchise. Asking cost is too high. No way KAT is worth that package - not because of the cost in a vacuum, but because it leaves the Spurs with too little assets/talent to surround KAT with. Actively contending teams can afford to ship out multiple 1sts for that kind of player who can "get them over the hump" (most recent example with Jrue and the Bucks, think it was even 3 picks), but the Spurs are nowhere near that status, and have to take real good care of their picks. I doubt they'd be able to crack 30 wins with that package being sent out.



Why would the Spurs trade for middling roleplayers who do nothing to raise the teams' ceiling if DeRozan walks? Any scenario where DD leaves means the Spurs start an active tank job. There'd be no use for any of those players raising the teams' floor and worsening their pick, and likewise, none of those players would like to spend their prime years (well, maybe Batum would since he's over the hill already) in a tanking, small-market team. Hard pass.

My theory is there is a psychological effect that comes from losing; combine that with having no veteran presence to re-direct the youth from bad habits and it might lead to a high turnover environment. While there is a need for a top player on the team, you don't disregard the rest of the team and waste all their years of development. You'd probably want that top tier player to join a healthy environment, not one that's been desensitized to losing. Give the team at least the illusion of competing and everything will follow.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

https://th.bing.com/th/id/Rbcf2bc5a8dd1186d88c9546643329289?rik=xDSgIXH3fvlc Wg&riu=http%3a%2f%2fwww.speakgif.com%2fwp-content%2fuploads%2f2015%2f10%2fwell-bye-animated-gif.gif&ehk=iUho2Gj3Vn%2fyzhK%2fmLw3iGWcgAA5HAjnLH16iTb%2f 87A%3d&risl=&pid=ImgRaw

[MannyIsGod]

If Derozan leaves...the Spurs should target these three FAs: Evan Fournier, Nic Batum and Montrezl Harrell for short two year contracts.

The spurs should not target any of those if Derozan leaves.

[poopbox]

It would be a long dry season without a franchise player. Be careful what you wish for.

I still believe this team is a PF/C 20/10 away from being a contender, as long as Murray, White, Keldon, Vassell, Luka and Poeltl continue to improve. Sign Demar his max, sign Patty but in limited role, and let Rudy/Lyles walk. Sign Dieng back.

I think Demar has demonstrated his loyalty, and being a good soldier. He likes playing with the young core. I think he will sign with the Spurs, granted they have a good plan of becoming competitive. But if it's another year of mediocrity, I think Demar should find a contender that he can help get a ring.

You can't get that power forward center while also keeping demar because he effectively plays power forward AND you need the money you would pay him to go get that power forward center.

[pad300]

I don't disagree with either of your assessments re: Lauri and Chicago's position; however, I do disagree with the inference that Lauri's misfit with the Bulls directly means the Spurs would be able to get him via trading DDR to them. I hardly think the Bulls would like a heavy ball-handling guard taking shots away from Lavine (not to mention being unable to space the floor or C&S when Lavine penetrates to dish it out), not to mention DeRoz's no-D, which would be exacerbated on the Bulls, considering both Vuc and Lavine are not exactly lockdown defenders or close to it. Your "Big 3" all being able to get their own shot is great in theory, but teams don't want the kinds of shots DeMar gets, and the time/effort/ball-hogging it takes for him to get them, in the modern game.

I can't say for sure what other packages will be on the table, since many times random teams decide to blow it up or make certain players available after weak/disappointing playoff runs; but I'm sure the Bulls won't be looking our way. Not for that package at least. Maaaaybe Lauri + filler for DeRozan, either Murray/White, and a first would get it done, but I'd pass on that deal personally.

I wouldn't do what you're proposing would be the price either; I just think you're wrong about what the price will be. The Bull's FO isn't smart (see the Vuc trade in the first place), and are going to be looking desperately for anything that might work because of it. Nobody's going to offer them something like that (pick, young player and good player, are you crazy?!?) for Lauri - he's generally seen as a bust...

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

The spurs should not target any of those if Derozan leaves.

My thought as well. Batum??? Every time I watch the Cloppers I see him getting burned on D. He's another slow footed vet. Why we would want that?

[tbdog]

That's the problem with trying to trade for an established star that's in an impoverished franchise. Asking cost is too high. No way KAT is worth that package - not because of the cost in a vacuum, but because it leaves the Spurs with too little assets/talent to surround KAT with. Actively contending teams can afford to ship out multiple 1sts for that kind of player who can "get them over the hump" (most recent example with Jrue and the Bucks, think it was even 3 picks), but the Spurs are nowhere near that status, and have to take real good care of their picks. I doubt they'd be able to crack 30 wins with that package being sent out.



Why would the Spurs trade for middling roleplayers who do nothing to raise the teams' ceiling if DeRozan walks? Any scenario where DD leaves means the Spurs start an active tank job. There'd be no use for any of those players raising the teams' floor and worsening their pick, and likewise, none of those players would like to spend their prime years (well, maybe Batum would since he's over the hill already) in a tanking, small-market team. Hard pass.

Spurs would still have cap space, even if DDR signs a full max.

You're starting lineup would be
Murray
Walker
DDR
Samanic
Towns

Then Spurs would have 15 to 25 mil (depending on DDR contract). Spurs would probably bring back Mills and Dieng, hopefully have room to sign one more player then the mle exception.

[exstatic]

Spurs would still have cap space, even if DDR signs a full max.

You're starting lineup would be
Murray
Walker
DDR
Samanic
Towns

Then Spurs would have 15 to 25 mil (depending on DDR contract). Spurs would probably bring back Mills and Dieng, hopefully have room to sign one more player then the mle exception.

Not enough to sign your required 20/10 PF/C.

Oh, and if you drop as far below the cap as we will, you don’t get the MLE.

[tbdog]

Not enough to sign your required 20/10 PF/C.

Oh, and if you drop as far below the cap as we will, you don’t get the MLE.

You don't need a 20/10 PF if you got Towns. I'm unsure what the mle rules are. As far I know, you only get it if you used it the year before.

[exstatic]

You don't need a 20/10 PF if you got Towns. I'm unsure what the mle rules are. As far I know, you only get it if you used it the year before.

How are you getting Towns?

[tbdog]

How are you getting Towns?

I proposed a trade idea at what would it take. I think Spurs will target towns this off season.

[exstatic]

I proposed a trade idea at what would it take. I think Spurs will target towns this off season.
In this thread?

[mo7888]

In this thread?

This was his trade proposal-"Then I think the Spurs have a good haul to offer for Towns. I think the starting bid will be Poeltl, White/Murray, and Johnson, 2x First round picks."

[Teamduncan21]

I don't disagree with either of your assessments re: Lauri and Chicago's position; however, I do disagree with the inference that Lauri's misfit with the Bulls directly means the Spurs would be able to get him via trading DDR to them. I hardly think the Bulls would like a heavy ball-handling guard taking shots away from Lavine (not to mention being unable to space the floor or C&S when Lavine penetrates to dish it out), not to mention DeRoz's no-D, which would be exacerbated on the Bulls, considering both Vuc and Lavine are not exactly lockdown defenders or close to it. Your "Big 3" all being able to get their own shot is great in theory, but teams don't want the kinds of shots DeMar gets, and the time/effort/ball-hogging it takes for him to get them, in the modern game.

I can't say for sure what other packages will be on the table, since many times random teams decide to blow it up or make certain players available after weak/disappointing playoff runs; but I'm sure the Bulls won't be looking our way. Not for that package at least. Maaaaybe Lauri + filler for DeRozan, either Murray/White, and a first would get it done, but I'd pass on that deal personally.

But in the end we can just bid on lauri. So to a certain degree they will consider taking something. (or outbid)

[illusioNtEk]

we should pay him as an nba star and not a superstar

[R. DeMurre]

Pairing Towns and DDR would be a complete disaster, giving opposing offenses both a poor wing and a poor post defender to attack. Compare that to teams that have had success in the last few years with a pairing of good stars who can defend: LeBron/AD, Bam/Butler, Embiid/Simmons, Giannis/Middleton, Gobert/Conley. No way that pairing has a chance at success.

[KobesAchilles]

Pairing Towns and DDR would be a complete disaster, giving opposing offenses both a poor wing and a poor post defender to attack. Compare that to teams that have had success in the last few years with a pairing of good stars who can defend: LeBron/AD, Bam/Butler, Embiid/Simmons, Giannis/Middleton, Gobert/Conley. No way that pairing has a chance at success.
Yeah I agree. DDR and Towns should not be paired together. You keep them as far apart as possible, so whatever the furthest fast food restaurant away from Jack in the Box is, that is where you keep Towns.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

KAT hasn't proven he can help a team win. Great stats though.

[John B]

KAT hasn't proven he can help a team win. Great stats though.
He's a KG in TWolves. You get him in a winning team, I bet he rings

[exstatic]

He's a KG in TWolves. You get him in a winning team, I bet he rings

Why? It’s not like he hasn’t had talent. He’s a young LMA, posting great stats, and winning nothing. It won’t matter who you put around him. He’ll find a way to lose in the end.

[TD 21]

He's a KG in TWolves. You get him in a winning team, I bet he rings

Not sure about that because of his defense at the most important defensive position, but I get the gist and agree with the sentiment.

Granted Davis is a significantly better defender, but look at him. Supposedly wasn't a "winner" . . . until he was given his first real chance to win at a high level and did so immediately, despite having a flawed team.

It's mostly context related, especially in the contrived/tainted era.

[8sy21vd]

I don't want Derozan back even though he's a tremendous offensive talent. He's not a good fit here and it baffles me why anybody within the organization or Demar for that matter would want to come back. At this stage of his career, he should be part of contending team as a 2nd or 3rd option particularly in the East.

The Spurs do need to go after legit bigs in FA, via trade or in the draft. They need at least one starting stretch big and one off the bench. When your bigs rotation is Poetl, Gay, Eubanks...you're in trouble. We have good young pieces like Murray, White, Walker, Vassell you can also package in a trade. I mean you're not going to keep all of those guys long-term in your back court.

[Dex]

He's a KG in TWolves. You get him in a winning team, I bet he rings

Counting the 50-game lockout season, KG averaged 44.3 wins in his 11 seasons in Minny and made the playoffs 8 times with arguably worse talent. The only truly talented team he played on in Minnesota was the Sprewell/Cassell/KG Wolves which lost in the WCF.

KAT has averaged 32.4 wins in his 5 full seasons (a number which is going to dip even lower this year) and has only made the playoffs once.

Comparing KAT to KG is an insult to Garnett.

[baseline bum]

Comparing Towns to KG would be like comparing Julius Randle to Tim Duncan, or Dale Ellis to Steph Curry.

[TD 21]

I'm not saying Towns is as good as Garnett (though the gap isn't as wide as some are making it seem), but he's had one season (his 3rd/age 22) where he was on a goodish team and they pretty much maxed out.

There's very few players who can take virtually any roster and at least make them a playoff team (in this era, it might just be James and Harden). I'm not going to hold that against him any more than I'm going to pretend these contrived/tainted "winners" are real champions.

[RD2191]

He's a KG in TWolves. You get him in a winning team, I bet he rings
:rollin

[Seventyniner]

He's a KG in TWolves. You get him in a winning team, I bet he rings

Anthony Davis is a better comparison imo. Even then AD is better but the AD/KAT gap is much smaller than KG/KAT.

fwiw I would definitely trade for him if the price isn't exorbitant. I think KAT can definitely be close to an AD-level #2 option, which would make luring a big-name FA much easier. Then again, I don't know a lot about his reputation around the league; I don't remember hearing anything really good or bad but I don't pay much attention on that front.

[LCM]

Would Pascal Siakam be on anyones wish list? His contract is 33+, 35+, 37+ over the next three years, and I don't think Toronto can sustain that contract. Don't think in the end the Spurs would want to fork that kind of money to one player either.

[Fusternino]

Would Pascal Siakam be on anyones wish list? His contract is 33+, 35+, 37+ over the next three years, and I don't think Toronto can sustain that contract. Don't think in the end the Spurs would want to fork that kind of money to one player either.

Still can't shoot and I don't trust us in trades . . .

[lmbebo]

If KAT available, would have to take a hard look at it. But he's someone I think you think about trading some of our young guards for. depends on the cost.

[exstatic]

Anthony Davis is a better comparison imo. Even then AD is better but the AD/KAT gap is much smaller than KG/KAT.

fwiw I would definitely trade for him if the price isn't exorbitant. I think KAT can definitely be close to an AD-level #2 option, which would make luring a big-name FA much easier. Then again, I don't know a lot about his reputation around the league; I don't remember hearing anything really good or bad but I don't pay much attention on that front.

The price would be exorbitant, and you’d have to have him as a number 1 option, not a number 2.

[poopbox]

Would Pascal Siakam be on anyones wish list? His contract is 33+, 35+, 37+ over the next three years, and I don't think Toronto can sustain that contract. Don't think in the end the Spurs would want to fork that kind of money to one player either.

Our butthole should still be raw from Masai long stroking us in the Kawhi trade TBH :cry

[poopbox]

Also while Kat is talented, let's not forget the one time he played on a legit good team with Jimmy, and Jimmy demanded they play winning basketball, Kat got mad and was threatening not to resign unless they traded Jimmy :cry

Dude very much seems like a "ma touches" type of player

[tbdog]

If you want KAT then you want to keep DDR. No point trading young players and picks but then just sideways step and get a star bigman and let DDR walk. It would make sense to lock DDR first and go after Towns or Sabonis. Then use the available cap space to replace those young players with better fits.

[FutureMan]

If you want KAT then you want to keep DDR. No point trading young players and picks but then just sideways step and get a star bigman and let DDR walk. It would make sense to lock DDR first and go after Towns or Sabonis. Then use the available cap space to replace those young players with better fits.

I completely disagree with that. In fact, the best situation for the Spurs is a sign and trade that sends DeRozan to MIN and KAT to the Spurs.

It’s interesting that KAT is coming up in conversations now. I’ve been thinking for a while about how he is one of only 2 or three top 25 players on terrible teams. I can’t help but think even the league itself would want KAT in San Antonio. Another “big” for Pop to coach and for Duncan to work with behind the scenes.

[look_at_g_shred]

only benefit of bringing in towns would be seeing Jordyn Woods on the sideline tbh

[tbdog]

I completely disagree with that. In fact, the best situation for the Spurs is a sign and trade that sends DeRozan to MIN and KAT to the Spurs.

It’s interesting that KAT is coming up in conversations now. I’ve been thinking for a while about how he is one of only 2 or three top 25 players on terrible teams. I can’t help but think even the league itself would want KAT in San Antonio. Another “big” for Pop to coach and for Duncan to work with behind the scenes.

There is no way DDR would agree to go to Twolves. It just won't happen and is highly unlikely Twolves would want DDR if they are trading Towns. It makes no sense. If the Spurs were to sign and trade DDR to another team, then the Spurs are only getting 25c for the dollar. Which would be fine. But then to also trade youth and picks to get Towns, then that would be a mistake. Because you would be stepping sideways. You would lose DDR for capsace, then trade 2 to 3 young pieces and picks for Towns. The team just got worse.

[FutureMan]

There is no way DDR would agree to go to Twolves. It just won't happen and is highly unlikely Twolves would want DDR if they are trading Towns. It makes no sense. If the Spurs were to sign and trade DDR to another team, then the Spurs are only getting 25c for the dollar. Which would be fine. But then to also trade youth and picks to get Towns, then that would be a mistake. Because you would be stepping sideways. You would lose DDR for capsace, then trade 2 to 3 young pieces and picks for Towns. The team just got worse.

A trade is unlikely but not impossible. DeRozan might be willing to go if MIN was willing to pay the most. But neither of us are DeRozan so who knows.

It also depends on what trades MIN is getting from other teams. Would they be better than DeRozan and 3 1st? Maybe. But maybe not. (And that’s DeRozan on a contract for several years)

My point was that you don’t have to keep DeRozan.

I’d also disagree with the 25 cents on the dollar comment as well. It just depends on the team. Clippers did a sign and trade with Houston and the Clippers got the better deal in the end.

Hopefully this team does something this summer. Would be nice for the San Antonio area to have a reason to go to Spurs games again. As it stands for me, I don’t go unless the team is playing someone else that I like. This way when they lose, and look terrible, I don’t feel like I wasted my money.

[CGD]

I think Lowry and DDR link back up in NYC. Knicks have the cap space to donor straight up.

[mo7888]

I think Lowry and DDR link back up in NYC. Knicks have the cap space to donor straight up.

I agree that is the most likely scenario..

[KobesAchilles]

I agree that is the most likely scenario..
prayingdog.gif

[exstatic]

I agree that is the most likely scenario..

They likely have almost enough to do that, but they’d have to renounce everyone, including Derrick Rose, and that would make Thibs blow a gasket. They have only six players under contract, so you’d have to add seven minimum salary cap holds. Both DD and Lowry would have to take less than their MAX, probably below $30 M each.

[John B]

I completely disagree with that. In fact, the best situation for the Spurs is a sign and trade that sends DeRozan to MIN and KAT to the Spurs.



Would Demar agree to a sign and trade only to be traded to Siberia?

[exstatic]

Would Demar agree to a sign and trade only to be traded to Siberia?

Nope. It would have to be a three way trade, maybe with the Knicks. No one would sign with the TWolves , which is essentially what a sign and trade is.

[mo7888]

They likely have almost enough to do that, but they’d have to renounce everyone, including Derrick Rose, and that would make Thibs blow a gasket. They have only six players under contract, so you’d have to add seven minimum salary cap holds. Both DD and Lowry would have to take less than their MAX, probably below $30 M each.

I expect ddr to be in that range... Lowry I expect to be between 20 and 25

[exstatic]

I expect ddr to be in that range... Lowry I expect to be between 20 and 25

You can expect all you want. Players want what they want. I’m not even sure that the remaining 6 players, plus DD and Lowry, plus 5 minimum contract guys is even a playoff team in the East.

[mo7888]

You can expect all you want. Players want what they want. I’m not even sure that the remaining 6 players, plus DD and Lowry, plus 5 minimum contract guys is even a playoff team in the East.

Yes, he can want all he wants for any amount but, based in the lack of interest at the deadline based on teams that didn't want to pay him $30M next year I expect him to have to take less than that... so my expectations are based on the indicators I see in the market..

[cd98]

It's weird because this guy has a game similar to Kobe Bryant. He's not Kobe, but he's not that far off in his ability to create his own shot off the dribble and his ability to hit the midrange and get to the rim almost at will and finish. Yet in today's game, that is not a valuable skill, at least not if you can't also hit 3 pointers or play great defense. I do think he has showcased great playmaking skills and there is no question the Spurs are a bubble playoff team because of what he has done. If he were not on the team, they would be solidly in the lottery. I'm curious to see what teams think of him this offseason and what is value is. Since some teams can sign him outright, it makes sense that they wouldn't trade away the future for a guy playing on the last year of his contract. But the Spurs have likely been willing to trade him any of the last 3 years and still have not gotten a decent enough offer to move him.

Also, how long would you sign him for? He's 31 years old. I would not sign him to longer than 3 years if I were any NBA team. But there is no way you can consider a lowball to him. It's not like he wouldn't be one of the best players on any team in the NBA.

[PrimeMinister]

you don't sign demar to any contract

you let a team in a big market struggling to be relevant overpay and overcommit to the aging player that plays negative defense and overlaps positions with your 2 best young players and laugh as you play them twice a year and roast demar on defense

[SAGirl]

I could be wrong but I don’t see him back. The team is not a good fit for him. He’s a win now player and this team needs an infusion of talent from the draft or for some of their players to grow and develop. I have only marginally followed the team this season as I am a casual nba fan atm but I don’t see him back. I also think him and the team have tried to get him traded b4 and are ready to part ways, it’s always the Spurs not getting a package they like or something, but they have looked around.

[exstatic]

Yes, he can want all he wants for any amount but, based in the lack of interest at the deadline based on teams that didn't want to pay him $30M next year I expect him to have to take less than that... so my expectations are based on the indicators I see in the market..

Teams aren’t interested in GIVING UP ASSETS FOR HIM. That doesn’t mean he won’t get paid. Hell, NY supposedly won’t deal with us at all, something about supposed tampering with KP back in the day. They won’t have to if they simply sign him.

[mo7888]

Teams aren’t interested in GIVING UP ASSETS FOR HIM. That doesn’t mean he won’t get paid. Hell, NY supposedly won’t deal with us at all, something about supposed tampering with KP back in the day. They won’t have to if they simply sign him.

Of course he'll get paid...the amount is in question....as far assets giving uo...the reports were they didn't give assets becausethey didn'twant to pay what he was asking for his next contract.....if you think Lowry is getting $30M then bookmark this and come back when he does ...I seriously doubt I'll see you quoting this in FA...

[exstatic]

Of course he'll get paid...the amount is in question....as far assets giving uo...the reports were they didn't give assets becausethey didn'twant to pay what he was asking for his next contract.....if you think Lowry is getting $30M then bookmark this and come back when he does ...I seriously doubt I'll see you quoting this in FA...

I don’t think Lowry will get $30M, but then again, he’s older than DD by a couple of years. I absolutely think DD could get $30M. In today’s hyper inflated Market, where salaries are creeping up on $50 M, that is probably a deal, even with his flawed game.

[JuneJive]

Whatever else PATFO does, not signing DDR would be a major win. In a myriad of ways.

[mo7888]

I don’t think Lowry will get $30M, but then again, he’s older than DD by a couple of years. I absolutely think DD could get $30M. In today’s hyper inflated Market, where salaries are creeping up on $50 M, that is probably a deal, even with his flawed game.

I agree that DDR will get at least $30M/yr... I think Lowry gets between $20 and $25 per year depending on the length of the contract.

[OldMan88]

Here’s hoping SATX is socked in with zero visibility when DDR is looking for a place to land.