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Dos
11-15-2005, 01:52 PM
funny how things like this get over looked... bah

What the Democrats can learn from Kaine's Virginia victory

By Howard Fineman
Newsweek
Nov. 21, 2005 issue - The morning after Democrat Tim Kaine won the governorship of Virginia, his first order of business was to attend mass in Richmond, where he said prayers for his father-in-law, who is ill with bladder cancer. It was an apt conclusion to a notable campaign, in which Kaine ran as a mass-attending disciple of Jesuit missionaries and the Roman Catholic Church's social gospel. Kaine accomplished three things. He became the first Catholic to win the top job in Virginia, home of Protestant evangelicals Pat Robertson and Jerry Falwell. He provided a road map into the cultural mainstream for national Democrats. And he highlighted the ever more pivotal role of Catholic politicians, jurists and voters at a time when "values" debates are front and center. "We can't completely separate politics and faith," Kaine told NEWSWEEK. "They rise from the same wellspring: the concern about the distance between what is and what ought to be."

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Formerly a reliable part of the Democratic base, Catholic America (now approaching 75 million) is increasingly inclined to vote for Republicans. Bush won 52 percent of that vote in 2004; his majority among white Catholics was 56 percent. Not coincidentally, GOP presidents have placed four Catholics on the current U.S. Supreme Court and a majority-making fifth, Judge Samuel Alito Jr., is up for confirmation. Democratic polltaker Stan Greenberg frets that, while Catholics remain sympathetic to his party's economic policies, they distrust it on social issues such as marriage, abortion and the practice of faith. Reassuring these "dislodged Democrats," he writes, is essential if the party ever expects to win back the White House.

One way to prosper, Democrats evidently have decided, is to discuss their own faith in public. For next year's U.S. Senate race in Pennsylvania, for example, Democratic powers are backing state Treasurer Robert P. Casey Jr., hoping that Catholicism (including a pro-life position on abortion) will neutralize the doctrinally stricter incumbent, Rick Santorum.

Strategists in both parties have concluded that any expression of Judeo-Christian devotion, if seen as genuine, can reassure culturally traditional voters. In Connecticut, where nearly half of the electorate is Catholic, Sen. Joe Lieberman's enduring appeal is based in part on his allegiance to Orthodox Judaism. In Virginia, where only 15 percent of the electorate is Catholic, the Democrats' goal is to win over—or at least calm down—rural Bible Belt voters. The incumbent Democratic governor, Mark Warner, did it in 2001 with a campaign of cultural semiotics. "Warner won them over by being the guy who knew hunting, NASCAR and country music," said Democratic consultant Jim Jordan. "Kaine reached them with his faith."

Still, there are land mines for Democrats on that country road—especially on the issue of abortion. In the NEWSWEEK poll, 67 percent of Democrats express sympathy with the pro-choice view, and even 51 percent of Catholics do so. In Pennsylvania, pro-choice Democrats remain influential, especially in the Philadelphia suburbs, and they haven't yet warmed to pro-life Casey. In Virginia, Kaine nearly was caught—as John Kerry was in 2004—between his pledge to support Roe v. Wade as governor and his faith-based opposition to it. Kaine supports legal limitations on abortion—including parental notification and a ban on so-called partial-birth procedures—that pro-choice activists view as anathema. "I'm not convinced they have found a way out," said Ken Mehlman, chairman of the Republican National Committee. "They've got Kaine going one way and the national Democrats going in the opposite direction."

But Kaine says there is a middle way. "A lot of Democrats, if you try to get them to say, 'I want there to be fewer abortions,' their mouths just won't move," said Kaine. "The fact is, that is what most Americans want." Polls show that he is right, but the next time he goes to mass, he might want to pray that his fellow Democrats get the message.

© 2005 Newsweek, Inc.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10017797/site/newsweek/

gtownspur
11-15-2005, 03:37 PM
Wow! I didnt know Democrats have said in the past that they wanted "more" abortions.:lol Seriously, this is just like Bush saying "I want there to be less terrorist attacks on US soil." and passes no measure to rid of terrorism.

To win as a democrat, you have to act conservative.

xrayzebra
11-15-2005, 03:42 PM
To win as a democrat, you have to act conservative.

That my friend is a fact. Ask Hillary, she is now more conservative than
dimm-o-crap. Of course I don't know who some on this board will vote for
since she will more than likely be their candidate and they hate repugs.
:lol

Ocotillo
11-15-2005, 06:03 PM
Democrats don't have to act conservative to win. Kaine didn't act conservative.

Kaine is not unlike quite a few Democrats in that he attends church and has a relationship with God. Being active within your religion is not being conservative. I know most on the right want people to think that way because it makes it easier to villify the Democrats.

The Democratic party is an inclusive party that has a range of opinions on the issue of abortion that Fineman writes about in the above piece. Casey the candidate running for Senator in Pennsylvania is pro-life. The Minority leader of the senate Harry Reid is pro-life.

The people Kaine refers to in his quote that have a hard time saying they want less abortions in this country are the special interest groups such as NARAL. I think most Democrats as well as Republicans would like to see less abortions in this country.

What Americans want is women to have the right to choose what they want to do in regards to a pregnancy. I think most Americans don't want to see abortion be a birth control method when there are so many options for birth control already. There is a lot of room for varying opinion even within the pro-choice opinion such as parental notification, waiting periods etc...

NARAL is not unlike the NRA. They do not want to give an inch on anything because they fear that it will lead to further "erosion" of rights in that area.

But back to the point about Kaine, he was not "acting" anything. He was honest is what he was. His faith could easily have been a double edged sword because not only does he personally oppose abortion but he against the death penalty and his opponent tried to exploit that.

What he did is what Kennedy had to do back in 1960 when there was concern that is Catholicism would interfere with this adminstration of the country. He stated his personal view, his relgious conviction would not interfere with his role as president (or in Kaine's case, Govenor).

To say he is acting conservative by speaking of his faith in public is wrong. That is a Republican myth and it frightens them to think they may lose some of the support that they have from religious people.

Jesus spoke of many things during His time with us on earth and they weren't Republican talking points.

Ocotillo
11-15-2005, 07:02 PM
And what have the Republicans learned? Run as a liberal?

GOP likes Chafee Best (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20051115/ap_on_el_se/rhode_island_republican;_ylt=Apg8ZzP0fOHusEDBJxFXn jeyFz4D;_ylu=X3oDMTA5aHJvMDdwBHNlYwN5bmNhdA--)

WARWICK, R.I. - Liberal Republican Sen. Lincoln Chafee (news, bio, voting record) refused to support President Bush in the last election, opposed the GOP tax cuts and was the only Republican to vote against the use of military force in Iraq, a war he has likened to Vietnam.

So why, a year before the election, is the GOP embracing Chafee and spending close to $200,000 on television ads aimed at undercutting his conservative rival in the Republican primary, Cranston Mayor Stephen Laffey?

Like him or not, Republicans consider Chafee their best chance to win in heavily Democratic Rhode Island.

Brian Nick, spokesman for the National Republican Senatorial Committee, said it is "ridiculous" that Laffey is running against "the only Republican that can keep the seat in the Senate." The committee is financing the ads and urging Laffey to abandon the race.

In recent years, Laffey endeared himself to the GOP by challenging the state's unions and other public officials; Republicans once courted him for lieutenant governor. Now, he is ignoring their entreaties to step aside.

"This is the story of my life," said Laffey, a 43-year-old former investment banker. "People tell me I shouldn't do things, and I end up doing them. Seems like I do them for spite sometimes."

The son of a toolmaker, Laffey frequently boasts about attending Harvard Business School despite being told he would not get in straight out of college. He scoffs at the Republican argument about the Senate race.

"The national Republican Party has sort of lost its way," he said. "Think about it: The first $200,000 they're spending is against a fellow Republican."

Chafee — a first-term senator who inherited the seat upon the death of his father, John Chafee, and later won it outright in 2000 — is soft-spoken and painstakingly polite. Laffey is outgoing, outspoken and often confrontational.

Chafee is a reluctant campaigner. Laffey enlists his wife and five children to stand on street corners to reach people as they drive to work and says he would "rather campaign than do anything else."

Rhode Island has more than three times as many registered Democrats as Republicans, and the state overwhelmingly went for Democrat John Kerry in the last presidential election, 59 percent to 39 percent.

Republicans fear Laffey will mobilize enough conservatives to edge out Chafee in the GOP primary next September, and then lose to a Democrat in November, said Maureen Moakley, a political science professor at the University of Rhode Island.

On the big issues — the environment, the war in Iraq, abortion — Chafee looks a lot like a Democrat, Moakley said. (The senator even drives a Toyota Prius hybrid.) :lol

As for his relationship with the Bush administration and Republican Party leaders, Chafee said: "We have a respectful distance, if you will, a mutual non-aggression pact."

The contenders on the Democratic side are former Rhode Island Attorney General Sheldon Whitehouse, Secretary of State Matt Brown and businessman Carl Sheeler.

___

gtownspur
11-15-2005, 10:38 PM
You are just in denial. Tim Kaine was trying to run on a low tax, moral conservative platform. I think Dick morris said it better. HE ran as a conservative but will play big liberal.

And as far as Chaffee, its Goddamn Rhode Island.

Look at the national elections. Look at hilary. No one ever runs like a Howard Dean, Kucinich. The last one to run like a liberal was Walter Mondale.

Ocotillo
11-15-2005, 11:29 PM
The Democrats are not fielding Marx, Lenin and Engels as their national candidates.

Face it. The Democrats are closer to the center than the Republicans are these days. Kaine is not the exception, he is the rule.

Take Harriet Miers. Even Yonivore was behind her. The Democrats were playing it close to the vest. It was the "base" that went nuts over her. Their frothing and venting forced Bush to back down. It's the Republicans that are controlled by the extremists these days, not the Democrats.

gtownspur
11-16-2005, 12:01 AM
^Yeah right. Need i say Howard Dean, George Soros,.. Moveon.org. Your gonna have a tough time convincing anyone that the democrat party is mainstream.

Kaine is an exception. The Democrat Party plays two fronts. One is pseuo conservatives in the redstates, the other is Sheehan in the blue.

Nbadan
11-16-2005, 04:24 AM
http://www.cagle.com/working/051110/jones.gif

JoeChalupa
11-16-2005, 09:03 AM
We're back baby!!!!!

Vashner
11-16-2005, 10:46 AM
We're back baby!!!!!

Premature celebration. Your out of power for 3 more years at least.

The map looks that same. What happned was DNC didn't loose ground.
So if that makes you happy then. But your not "bacK".

You are going to loose again in 08 because Hillary and Al Gore have
too many bones in the closet.

gtownspur
11-16-2005, 01:46 PM
Its funny! when Not ganing any seats but retaining your own means Victory. Can you say "Damage Control" sounds more like it.

Dos
11-16-2005, 06:08 PM
We're back baby!!!!!

you mean republican lite's are back...

Mr. Peabody
11-16-2005, 06:19 PM
We're back baby!!!!!

Dems in control once again!

Ocotillo
11-16-2005, 07:28 PM
Premature celebration. Your out of power for 3 more years at least.



Not so fast Grasshopper, there are elections in '06 whereby the Dems are poised to make significant gains if not regain control of one or both houses of congress. A Speaker Pelosi or Majority Leader Reid will certainly add a new dynamic to Washington politics.

Marcus Bryant
11-16-2005, 09:47 PM
So basically Democrats have to assume that the voting public are a bunch of inbred rednecks and they are on this Earth to save them. How does this differ from the prior approach?

Phil E.Buster
11-16-2005, 10:06 PM
I must admit that the Democratic party is looking better and I hate both parties.

gtownspur
11-17-2005, 12:47 AM
^i guess all they needed to do was to wear a religous dress clap their hands and thank Gawddah!! No need to change their platform for that matter.

Nbadan
11-19-2005, 03:57 AM
So basically Democrats have to assume that the voting public are a bunch of inbred rednecks and they are on this Earth to save them. How does this differ from the prior approach?


How does this differ from the southern-conservative approach? Only one party is talking about the issues that most moderate Americans worry about, and some people are liking what they are hearing.