Stein: Chatter Circulating About The Spurs' Attempts To "Barge" Their Way Into Simmons Sweepstakes

[KingKev]

https://bleacherreport.com/post/nba/322b968e-48cb-4c8a-838c-226b71232ec2

LOL not even Brian Wright is this stupid.

[baseline bum]

These idiots are really going to piss away what could have been a contending season with Embiid aren't they? :lmao

[Leetonidas]

It's crazy that they're refusing to trade Simmons for the best package available to fill their roster out and compete in a year with no clear cut title favorite. This is the year to go all in. There is no super GS team, BKN is gimped, LAL will be lucky to make the 2nd round...this is the time to capitalize and make a move. Lol at Morey content to do nothing because he thinks somehow Simmons value will get better over time:lmao

Their fans are just as retarded and delusional too. Go on any 6ers forum and look at the deals they're discussing for Simmons :lmao they still think they're getting Dame or Beal

[KingKev]

These idiots are really going to piss away what could have been a contending season with Embiid aren't they? :lmao

haha at this rate they may piss away his entire career. We’ve added Tobias Harris to the mix so the bidding starts at 10 first round picks, and two future hall of famers but we will settle for Klay, Curry, 5 future FRPs, Moody, Kuminga, Wiseman and a coach swap because we are motivated to get a deal done - Morey

[CGD]

Wow, that's wild.

Would have to be a 3-way deal to make may sense, and probably a reflection that Philly isnt getting assets they want and pivoting to shedding long term money.

Off the top of head something like would work $$ wise:

ATL: Ben Simmons
CLE: Tobias Harris
PHI: Love, Galo, Hunter, FRP from ATL

[KingKev]

Wow, that's wild.

Would have to be a 3-way deal to make may sense, and probably a reflection that Philly isnt getting assets they want and pivoting to shedding long term money.

Off the top of head something like would work $$ wise:

ATL: Ben Simmons
CLE: Tobias Harris
PHI: Love, Galo, Hunter, FRP from ATL

I don’t mind Harris but that contract was always an over pay. I think one thing is for certain we should all put to rest the Spurs even being remotely interested at this point.

[CGD]

I don’t mind Harris but that contract was always an over pay. I think one thing is for certain we should all put to rest the Spurs even being remotely interested at this point.

Agree.

On Thobias, for CLE it’s a position of need and just 1 additional year over Love’s contract term I believe. But yeah, that contract sucks ass.

[tbdog]

I don’t mind Harris but that contract was always an over pay. I think one thing is for certain we should all put to rest the Spurs even being remotely interested at this point.

Harris is straight up on one of the worse contracts. He just isn't good. I've said this for years, and any team giving that contract would regret it instantly. How is this guy not getting the negative attention that all underwhelming max players get, is beyond me.

[KingKev]

Harris is straight up on one of the worse contracts. He just isn't good. I've said this for years, and any team giving that contract would regret it instantly. How is this guy not getting the negative attention that all underwhelming max players get, is beyond me.

Agreed but these are the type of contracts we should consider renting our salary cap for if appropriately compensated (young asset, draft capital etc) eapecially given the upcoming free agency landscape.

[exstatic]

Agreed but these are the type of contracts we should consider renting our salary cap for if appropriately compensated (young asset, draft capital etc) eapecially given the upcoming free agency landscape.

Philly already had to unload Horford, and it cost them multiple #1s. Doubt they be up for a repeat, especially since TH will make almost $80M over the next two seasons. Harris will be 32 when the deal expires, and his shooting has fallen off a cliff this season. Not a huge surprise with Simmons not playing.

[Dejounte]

https://twitter.com/jobes44/status/1619163457865281536?s=46

What trade proposals today are being made by the folks who were all in on Ben Simmons? Gotta watch out for those folks… the Spurs would be in much worse shape than they are now.

[KingKev]

^ not me but while we are pulling receipts you had some pretty lofty expectations for the 22-23 Spurs. My favourite being how improved our defense would be :lmao

[Dejounte]

^ not me but while we are pulling receipts you had some pretty lofty expectations for the 22-23 Spurs. My favourite being how improved our defense would be :lmao

What I’ll give to these guys who give these takes (good or bad) is that they aren’t afraid to make them… which is a notch above validation-craving black-wannabe pussies like yourself who give no real basketball contribution insights to this forum except for the empty “I watch other NBA teams” posts you give from time to time or the slobbering you give to people you agree with. You are as predictable as the sun going up in the morning.

[exstatic]

Ben Simmons dad ruined his career by switching him from shooting right handed to left handed, thinking his shot would get blocked less. He was right, since Ben no longer shoots his shot almost never gets blocked.

[Chinook]

I did want Simmons. I was wrong, both because Murray had another gear and because Simmons' transmission broke. Honestly I'd still take Ben, especially if they're moving Poeltl, and I am still glad Murray's gone. But the Spurs would've been multiple firsts in the whole had they listened to me.

I also wanted to trade Murray and Aldridge in 2020 to move up and draft Obi Toppin. I also wanted to trade Bonner and a first for Derrick Williams back in the day and loved Bagley in the 2018 draft. I really wanted a high-pedigree PF for many years, and it led me astray many times.

[KingKev]

I did want Simmons. I was wrong, both because Murray and another gear and because Simmons' transmission broke. Honestly I'd still take Ben, especially if they're moving Poeltl, and I am still glad Murray's gone. But the Spurs would've been multiple firsts in the whole had they listened to me.

I also wanted to trade Murray and Aldridge in 2020 to move up and draft Obi Toppin. I also wanted to trade Bonner and a first for Derrick Williams back in the day and loved Bagley in the 2018 draft. I really wanted a high-pedigree PF for many years, and it led me astray many multiple times.

haha bro you sound like you are at an AA meeting. I didn’t care for him when the asking price was so high but now?

Given our cap situation and my preference for drafting multiple years in the lottery I’d take a flier on Simmons but I’m not giving up much to get him. McD, JRich and our 2023 SRP would be fair to take that contract on.

He isn’t built for the flashing lights right now but being under the radar in San Antonio could revive his career. In the meantime if he is still a 7/7/7 guy he just becomes an over paid Derrick White

[ambchang]

^ not me but while we are pulling receipts you had some pretty lofty expectations for the 22-23 Spurs. My favourite being how improved our defense would be :lmao

Or how you continuously talk an about tre being the worst PG in the league.

People make wrong predictions all the time. That’s why they are predictions. If they are right all the time theyd be prophets.

[KingKev]

Or how you continuously talk an about tre being the worst PG in the league.

People make wrong predictions all the time. That’s why they are predictions. If they are right all the time theyd be prophets.

What are you talking about? I’ve been a proponent of Tre since early last year

[KobesAchilles]

To be fair, I just wanted to trade Murray. I didn’t know the Hawks package was available. I wanted a Ben for Murray swap bc Murray isn’t a winning player and not worth 40 million a year. I’m glad we didn’t do it but I’m also glad we traded Murray. But paying Ben $36 million wouldn’t have hurt this team in any way shape or form. He would’ve added to the tanking and we have a lot of money to spend anyways. Once we get Victor, I would like for us to go big and over pay for a secondary star player (like the Pels did with CJ).

[John B]

I also like to trade Murray for Simmons, especially because I saw that Murray’s thug side, started with him barking back at Pop like a juvvy that he is. I always thought Ben can thrive with a great coaching staff like Pop’s, who could slowly fix his game to winning games. Very much what we see Pop is doing with Sochan. Simmons has great vision, big athletic who can rim run and finish, while finding who’s open, great defender. Yes, I’d still take Simmons for the right pieces. It would be a challenge to play him with Sochan not shooting, yet. That would have to get fixed. Simmons for Poeltl plus fillers, I’d take him. It’d be a roster challenge, but I’d leave Pop to figure it out.

[DPG21920]

There’s a path to talk oneself into anything and gambles that become +EV at certain values, but Spurs fans sometimes are too keen to overlook issues and take on risks for no good reason IMO

[DPG21920]

And I wouldn’t be so sure SA could flip Simmons if things went south. If he didn’t work out here (meaning we didn’t see an improvement in a year or two in his shooting and attitude) then the ceiling and hope is gone with how he’s viewed and his last 2 years of his deal is an albatross you can maybe do a Westbrook/Wall type of deal for.

I’m not so certain Sa could recoup firsts in that situation is all I’m saying (in a situation where we don’t see any improvement)


Simmons doesn't have to improve to be worth his deal. He's a DPOY candidate who's also a great facilitator and finisher. That's why SA should look at trading for him, not because of potential. The Spurs should look at him as basically anchoring their defense and get him a primary scoring guard and two-way big-wing to run with him. The improvement they'd be looking for is in guys like Primo, Keldon and Vassell/Walker. If they can get another star out of that group, then they'd be in position to make an all-in trade to move toward being a contender. Otherwise, they have to look at two more big trades, which means continuing to accumulate assets and contracts to match

We will be having this argument until the end of time lol….players being worth their deals just for playing our their contract vs having a bigger picture asset mentality in mind

Similar to my Jak, Doug and other mindsets and the risks of “bad deals” even if you can afford them.

[KingKev]

There’s a path to talk oneself into anything and gambles that become +EV at certain values, but Spurs fans sometimes are too keen to overlook issues and take on risks for no good reason IMO

Have you not done the same thing with your praise in the dynamic duo of Keldon Johnson and Devin Vassell?

[exstatic]

Spurs have drastically improved the FT shooting of both Jak and Sochan. If you could just do THAT for Simmons, he’d be a vastly improved player. All a moot point, though. We’re not likely to give up an asset or assets for him, and his personality profile suggests he wouldn’t do the one hand thing, anyway.

[Sugus]

:lmao Benjamin fucking Simmons :lmao

Ah, the good ole days where a good chunk of ST was dying over trading the sink for this guy. It's too low a blow to look up the receipts on this thread, but y'all know who you are. :lol

[Sugus]

I did want Simmons. I was wrong, both because Murray and another gear and because Simmons' transmission broke. Honestly I'd still take Ben, especially if they're moving Poeltl, and I am still glad Murray's gone. But the Spurs would've been multiple firsts in the whole had they listened to me.

I also wanted to trade Murray and Aldridge in 2020 to move up and draft Obi Toppin. I also wanted to trade Bonner and a first for Derrick Williams back in the day and loved Bagley in the 2018 draft. I really wanted a high-pedigree PF for many years, and it led me astray many multiple times.

Big ups for owning up to your mistakes, Chino. The forum would be much better if everyone had your self-reflection. The desperate need for a PF has indeed led many of us to the worst of shores (I was a Samanic truther once upon a time, myself, yuck).

No way I'm taking Ben though, even now, unless he's coming with at least an unprotected FRP a few years into the future. He's bad on offense, maybe worse than Poeltl himself in terms of spacing and offensive contributions, and worse of all he's mentally shot and broken. I wouldn't gamble the smallest chip on the chance that he "works it out" and turns into rookie-Simmons ever again, or a level even close to that.

[KingKev]

Murray + Thad + Jakob + CHI 1st + top 14 protected SA 1st

wowzers

[KingKev]

Still think this is about as far as the Spurs would go . . .

76ers: Murray, Dragic, Spurs top 1-3 protected '22 1st, Suns lottery protected '23 1st, Bulls '25 1st and 2nd

Suns: Young

Spurs: Simmons, Milton, Saric

Raptors: Walker IV, Aminu, Hutchison, Smith

Johnson/Samanic/Bates-Diop?/Saric
McDermott/Vassell/Wieskamp
Poeltl/Eubanks/Landale/Collins
White/Forbes/Primo
Simmons/Milton/Jones


:lmao

[Ariel]

Right now Simmons is the best paid NBA player impersonator on the planet. Who'd have thought that a few years ago?

[Bill_Brasky]

God damn this guy sucks.

[Chinook]

We will be having this argument until the end of time lol….players being worth their deals just for playing our their contract vs having a bigger picture asset mentality in mind

That's not our conflict. Our conflict is whether to have players who can help develop other guys and make the product watchable versus thinking the only thing of value is what they could get on the resale market. In the other thread you criticized me for accusing you for thinking the Spurs needed to "get something" for Poeltl while telling another poster that Spurs should be focused on getting something from Poeltl, Richardson and McDermott. I think you believe you have a more nuanced position than it is.

Like in the case of the things you quoted, I'm very clearly talking about a direct plan to competing/contending. It's not any more nebulous than "drafting a superstar". Trading for a star, drafting one or signing one in free agency are all paths teams can take. None is more sound than the other on it's face. Trading is the only one where you're both guaranteed to get a star (since they've already developed) and that isn't dependent on being in a good location.

If Simmons were still in his prime and not fallen off completely, the Spurs would be fine after the proposed trade. We know they missed out on a lot now, but they'd have an All-Star with some good players like Keldon and Vassell, significant cap space and all of their future picks. We would've looked at Murray likely being a good player for the Sixers and wondered if it were the right deal, but the position the team would be in would still be fine. Just as Simmons ended up busting, Wemby could bust, as well as the next guy the Spurs draft. They can't constantly liquidate their roster forever at the expense of the on-court product.

In reality, I was wrong about Simmons. He regressed. But being able to be aggressive in trading for stars is why you keep the contracts in the first place. Having really good ballast is worth not getting a random second-round pick.

[Mr. Body]

Simmons, as a supposed top-1 pick in a draft, failed to get his college team even into the NCAAT. That's a really terrible sign about work ethic and game impact. At this point, it's even worse. The guy is a complete mess psychologically.

[JPB]

It's crazy that they're refusing to trade Simmons for the best package available to fill their roster out and compete in a year with no clear cut title favorite. This is the year to go all in. There is no super GS team, BKN is gimped, LAL will be lucky to make the 2nd round...this is the time to capitalize and make a move. Lol at Morey content to do nothing because he thinks somehow Simmons value will get better over time:lmao

Their fans are just as retarded and delusional too. Go on any 6ers forum and look at the deals they're discussing for Simmons :lmao they still think they're getting Dame or Beal

Almost as hilarious as 2 FRPs for Poodle tbh.

[JPB]

To be fair, I just wanted to trade Murray. I didn’t know the Hawks package was available. I wanted a Ben for Murray swap bc Murray isn’t a winning player and not worth 40 million a year. I’m glad we didn’t do it but I’m also glad we traded Murray. But paying Ben $36 million wouldn’t have hurt this team in any way shape or form. He would’ve added to the tanking and we have a lot of money to spend anyways. Once we get Victor, I would like for us to go big and over pay for a secondary star player (like the Pels did with CJ).

Same for me. I we luck into the alien, immediately give the big bag to a star guard or swingman willing to come in what should become one of most attractive teams in the NBA with a lot of media and world wide attention... Don't mess with that and give Wemby an already competitive team from Day 1, not a contender yet but not a team who'll get dismantled evey night. Put a real show out there.

[spurraider21]

I was wrong. Didn’t realize how broken simmons was. If we were getting sixers simmons it would have still been good. But Murray also improved more than anybody really thought.

[FutureMan]

I didn’t want Simmons then. But I’ll take him now….. for Brooklyn’s unprotected 2028 pick, Philly’s lightly protected pick in 2027, and a pick swap with Brooklyn in 2029 :lol

[scott]

Shout out to those who saw that Simmons sucks and DJM was better. And by those, I mean me. Bow down, bitches.

[DPG21920]

Have you not done the same thing with your praise in the dynamic duo of Keldon Johnson and Devin Vassell?

Elaborate how thinking our draft picks have done very well and leaped beyond their value of where they were drafted comparatively is the same/comparable to spending picks to trade for players or signing them to large deals in free agency?

I’m saying there will pretty much always be a legit price low enough to where a gamble is worth it. What some were talking about with Simmons was so far off of that or what would realistically get a deal done.

[DPG21920]

That's not our conflict. Our conflict is whether to have players who can help develop other guys and make the product watchable versus thinking the only thing of value is what they could get on the resale market. In the other thread you criticized me for accusing you for thinking the Spurs needed to "get something" for Poeltl while telling another poster that Spurs should be focused on getting something from Poeltl, Richardson and McDermott. I think you believe you have a more nuanced position than it is.

Like in the case of the things you quoted, I'm very clearly talking about a direct plan to competing/contending. It's not any more nebulous than "drafting a superstar". Trading for a star, drafting one or signing one in free agency are all paths teams can take. None is more sound than the other on it's face. Trading is the only one where you're both guaranteed to get a star (since they've already developed) and that isn't dependent on being in a good location.

If Simmons were still in his prime and not fallen off completely, the Spurs would be fine after the proposed trade. We know they missed out on a lot now, but they'd have an All-Star with some good players like Keldon and Vassell, significant cap space and all of their future picks. We would've looked at Murray likely being a good player for the Sixers and wondered if it were the right deal, but the position the team would be in would still be fine. Just as Simmons ended up busting, Wemby could bust, as well as the next guy the Spurs draft. They can't constantly liquidate their roster forever at the expense of the on-court product.

In reality, I was wrong about Simmons. He regressed. But being able to be aggressive in trading for stars is why you keep the contracts in the first place. Having really good ballast is worth not getting a random second-round pick.

That again is incorrect. I value mentoring. Product isn’t watchable anyways so I don’t get your point there. I just don’t value mentoring so much that you overpay because you can with no regard as using them as trade assets.

I said, many times, Josh and Doug were the priorities in a trade. Not Jak. But that absolutely Jak should be on the table because 1) if they get a great offer he should be and 2) he’s the oldest of the core and a non-scoring Center and paying those types 20M when you may suck like this for 2 more years may not be optimal path (even after acknowledging like 100 times that its still an “ok” path)

In the post I quoted, it was you again arguing the same things I said; me worried about future value/resale and you arguing that it does not matter and all that matters is him playing his deal out and nothing else. If you didn’t know that was the crux of my debate with you, it should be very clear now.

EDIT: I even have agreed with what you said with regards to trying to trade for an all star etc…I said it in this thread even about the logic of using Murray/White but keeping all the other youth. I can compartmentalize two things: discussing what if’s like that & balancing my personal wants/fears with regards to HOW I THINK SA should be operating/my player evaluation (which is why I said in the post I quoted that I don’t think the risk/reward was good trading for Simmons because he sucks and with what SA would give up (Murray who netted us 3 picks from ATL) might not be recouped and we could be stuck with Ben and I saw that risk clearly and you didn’t and don’t with guys like Doug etc..

[DPG21920]

wowzers

Bruh - you read my posts on the matter lol? The context is me NOT being keen on trading for Ben unless he was basically free. That stuff was discussion on what it would take IF SA (not me) was interested at the time.

[DPG21920]

I am fine with this more than the other one since we don’t eat Saric, keep Lonnie and only give up one actual Spurs pick vs 2. My only beef is Vassell. I am pretty high on him. I am not so high on Simmons personally.

But this type of package seems like the right type.

I personally would be fighting to keep all the youth except Murray out although ultimately you are correct; if SA likes Simmons and truly believes in him keeping one more young player won’t be franchise altering. Especially if they only give up one of their own picks (and can protect it).

But I would love to swap Jakob for Vassell here…to me that would be the perfect trade: Murray/Jakob/Thad/Chi 1st/SA 22’nd

Ultimately I personally prefer they do no trade for Simmons though. I would understand it if they do and it’s in this type of deal, but I would prefer they do not.

The question for me is if they did the trade and if Simmons didn’t work out - do we think SA would be able to recoup one or two of the firsts they gave up by flipping Simmons to another team?

This is pretty clear summary of my view at the time doing exactly what I said we argue about: compartmentalization of what you are saying and seeing that angle, but disagreeing with your player evaluation, where I rank our youth in comparison and always having an eye on future trade value/concerns

[DPG21920]

Maybe - but I am talking about how Simmons is viewed. In theory hes’ all of those things now and PHI doesn’t want him and he’s not getting big offers (that we know of). A big part of how fans and more importantly teams view him is still discussed in the lenses of “untapped potential” and “can fix his shot”.

If that narrative dies, I dont think hes worth his deal at all especially if you dont have the team success that PHI had to bolster any arguments. You may not agree with that and part of this is speculative, but my gut says many teams view him in the framework I presented and that represents risk to me that needs to be considered to the downside (meaning can you recoup picks if you dont like what you see when you’re up close and personal and giving away multiple firsts)

Seems obvious now tbh..

[Chinook]

That again is incorrect. I value mentoring.

No you don't. If you value something, you don't throw it away and replace it with "whatever". If guys who can't play are just as good, then they could save on salary space by hiring coaches.


Product isn’t watchable

YOU don't want to watch it. That's fine. But to me, this team is far from unwatchable. Are they my sole go-to for entertainment? No. But I have enjoyed a lot of the games this year (helps because I don't meltdown when they managed to win a game), and Richardson and McDermott have been big parts to many of those games. I don't think I could watch Houston.


I just don’t value mentoring so much that you overpay because you can with no regard as using them as trade assets.

We've gone over why not "overpaying" means that the better players just go elsewhere. The Spurs don't have much to lure free agents right now except money, and they have money they literally can't use any other way. I also don't think there's a good argument for McDermott being overpaid besides "I think Doug sucks and didn't want the Spurs to pay for him." He got a contract in line with the market. Some of the better teams were limited in what they could give him, but if the Spurs had only offered the MLE, he'd be somewhere else. Other teams paid as much or more for their shooters.


I said, many times, Josh and Doug were the priorities in a trade. Not Jak.

This isn't the defense you think it is. "I wanted to trade these two more" isn't what the hinge point of our discussion is. That's fake nuance. Our disagreement is if the Spurs have to only care about trade value -- if they're failing at their job if they let guys expire or sign guys without their immediate trade market in mind. The reason why I jumped in was because you suggested the Spurs should have "learned" their lesson from the McDermott signing, when that signing has been exactly what anyone could've expected. And because people were "meh Doug's on the team" or "his shooting is nice, and his D helps the tank" rather than just being mad at the FO for still having him on the roster is why you thought you were in the minority of folks who didn't like the signing. Most people didn't like the signing, but most people just didn't have the same reasoning for not liking it that you did. No biggie. We all have our own wishes for the team. But it's not like your reasoning has born out to the exclusion of the others, which I think is why so many of us were confused by you connecting it to Poeltl being re-signed for market value.

I think we all agree Poeltl should be on the table, but the Spurs should have a high price for him and an actual price for the other guys, because they're all adding value to the team by being around. It's not the highest for someone like Doug, but it's there.

[KingKev]

I’m fine if Sa does this but not at the costs reported. If it’s Thad + Murray + 2 picks. Ok I can see it.

[DPG21920]

No you don't. If you value something, you don't throw it away and replace it with "whatever". If guys who can't play are just as good, then they could save on salary space by hiring coaches.

I do value it. You can keep screaming I don’t when I say I do. Makes you look close minded vs having an honest debate because you don’t like my view on things. If you cant grasp what and how I value mentoring that’s on you and I cant force you to see it.




YOU don't want to watch it. That's fine. But to me, this team is far from unwatchable. Are they my sole go-to for entertainment? No. But I have enjoyed a lot of the games this year (helps because I don't meltdown when they managed to win a game), and Richardson and McDermott have been big parts to many of those games. I don't think I could watch Houston.

LMAO I have season tickets and go to damn near every game that is an absurd thing to say because again you are making it personal about me vs understanding I am talking globally here. I love the team and it’s not because of DOUG and JOSH lol. You could replace them with plenty of other guys on one or two year deals max and get same result and same mentoring IMO. I’m saying it’s not like attendance is top of league and we are all over national tv. By and large, even many of our fans who ARENT ME, think it’s unwatchable so that’s just a throw away portion of your argument there for me personally. Does not really add any sort of relevance to the discussion - but I do agree you need vets and mentors so you don’t turn into HOU from a developmental perspective.




We've gone over why not "overpaying" means that the better players just go elsewhere. The Spurs don't have much to lure free agents right now except money, and they have money they literally can't use any other way. I also don't think there's a good argument for McDermott being overpaid besides "I think Doug sucks and didn't want the Spurs to pay for him." He got a contract in line with the market. Some of the better teams were limited in what they could give him, but if the Spurs had only offered the MLE, he'd be somewhere else. Other teams paid as much or more for their shooters.

I don’t agree he got a deal in line with market or else with how you are saying “Spurs can overpay” and how he’s lived up to everything he was supposed to be because if that were true he would be a CLEAR + in trade value? Do you think that’s the case? Also you said earlier everyone agreed with me about hating that deal. So everyone hated it but he was paid fairly and now is an irreplaceable mentor somehow? How do you reconcile that? Why did everyone hate the deal like me then?




This isn't the defense you think it is. "I wanted to trade these two more" isn't what the hinge point of our discussion is. That's fake nuance. Our disagreement is if the Spurs have to only care about trade value -- if they're failing at their job if they let guys expire or sign guys without their immediate trade market in mind. The reason why I jumped in was because you suggested the Spurs should have "learned" their lesson from the McDermott signing, when that signing has been exactly what anyone could've expected. And because people were "meh Doug's on the team" or "his shooting is nice, and his D helps the tank" rather than just being mad at the FO for still having him on the roster is why you thought you were in the minority of folks who didn't like the signing. Most people didn't like the signing, but most people just didn't have the same reasoning for not liking it that you did. No biggie. We all have our own wishes for the team. But it's not like your reasoning has born out to the exclusion of the others, which I think is why so many of us were confused by you connecting it to Poeltl being re-signed for market value.

I think we all agree Poeltl should be on the table, but the Spurs should have a high price for him and an actual price for the other guys, because they're all adding value to the team by being around. It's not the highest for someone like Doug, but it's there.

I agree Jak should be higher valued and keeping him poses less risk than signing Doug. I’ve said all that too! We agree on plenty and you just gloss over it so many times for some reason. I never said Spurs ONLY need to care about trade value. I said they can’t be lazy and just overpay mediocre to bad players with NO regard for trade value. That is a world of difference that IMO if you understood what I was saying changes a ton of what you are arguing with towards me

[DPG21920]

My man - read in context. Look at the posts I quoted. It’s not that hard. That’s again me saying “I can see it if that is what the Spurs want to do”. That is not me going “Spurs should do this here is my idea!!!” I literally have posts quoted saying “I do not want them to trade for Simmons” lmao.

Quit with the clown behavior for a minute

[DPG21920]

Shout out to those who saw that Simmons sucks and DJM was better. And by those, I mean me. Bow down, bitches.

I was posting blind stats tests and trying to pump the breaks lol…

[TD 21]

:lmao At taking hypotheticals out of context from the time they were discussed.

As if anyone could have foreseen Simmons having mental health issues, developing a mental block and having a back injury that led to surgery.

[baseline bum]

I did want Simmons. I was wrong, both because Murray had another gear and because Simmons' transmission broke. Honestly I'd still take Ben, especially if they're moving Poeltl, and I am still glad Murray's gone. But the Spurs would've been multiple firsts in the whole had they listened to me.

I also wanted to trade Murray and Aldridge in 2020 to move up and draft Obi Toppin. I also wanted to trade Bonner and a first for Derrick Williams back in the day and loved Bagley in the 2018 draft. I really wanted a high-pedigree PF for many years, and it led me astray many times.

Derrick Williams had me fooled like hell too, thought for sure he was going to be at least a high level allstar

[scott]

So Dejounte Murray is better than Ben Simmons?


Maybe a three team trade?

IND: Murray & Samanic
PHI: Brogdon, Young, SAS 1st, & SAS 2nd
SAS: Simmons


If the Spurs helped facilitate trade of Ben Simmons: 4 Teams

Suns - Thad Young

Kings - Ben Simmons, Luka Samanic, 2nd rd pick 2023 Spurs (via Pacers)

76ers - Dejounte Murray, Lonnie Walker, Dario Saric, Jalen Smith (1st rd picks - 2022 Sac, 2024 Sac - Lottery protected, 2025 Spurs (via Bulls)) (2nd rd picks 2022 Sac, 2025 Sac, 2025 Spurs (via Bulls))

Spurs - Tyrese Haliburton, Marvin Bagley III, Harrison Barnes

Spurs SL: T. Haliburton, D. White, K. Johnson, H. Barnes, J. Poeltl
Bench: T. Jones, D. Vassell, D. McDermott, M. Bagley, J. Landale
B. Forbes, AF Aminu, D. Eubanks, Z. Collins, J. Primo (Stretch waive Hutchinson)
Two way - Wieskamp, KBD?

If you rehabilitate Bagley, you can flip him for assets at trade deadline, and Barnes can be flipped in the offseason due to only being 29 and on an expiring contract of 18 million, very affordable. This also gives Collins time to get completely healthy, you get Haliburton on his rookie deal to be the head of the snake on offense, and you get Primo ready to eventually take over for White in the future instead of Murray. Your core becomes Haliburton, Primo, Johnson, Vassell, and Collins - you'll have glue guys like Wieskamp and Landale - and you'll still have your 1st rd picks to go hunting for that front court piece to put the team over the top. This trade also doesn't compromise any flexibility for 2023 FA class. Plus White can be used as a trade piece at that time as well.

The 76ers get a player in Murray who can run the team, needed front court depth with Smith. Drummond is backing up Embid, so Saric can rehab and fill that position next year, and Walker gets to play in his home state on a one year prove it deal or be flipped at trade deadline. They also get 6 picks in total, a blessing since Simmons value is dog shit right now (it's probably too many picks, I agree!).

76ers SL: DJM, LW4, Danny Green, Tobias Harris, Joel Embid
Bench: Maxey, Seth Curry, M. Thybelle, Jalen Smith, Drummond
Springer, Milton, Kurkmaz, Saric, Paul Reed (Stretch waive Tolliver)

Now, since I've put my contribution to bullshit nonsense up, I'm going to bed


So many posters seem to be overlooking the fact that Simmons fucking sucks.

If he was a FA, he would be a $14m/yr player that teams would hesitate on due to his attitude and work ethic.

There are some fun quotes in this thread to look back on. LCM's idea was good.

[DPG21920]

Derrick Williams had me fooled like hell too, thought for sure he was going to be at least a high level allstar

I’m apparently wrong about Sengun - I didn’t care that SA really passed on him for Primo because I thought he was just meh but he’s doing pretty damn good. I really liked Brandon Clarke too but even though he’s a very good role player he would not have changed much for SA

[Atl Spur]

I also like to trade Murray for Simmons, especially because I saw that Murray’s thug side, started with him barking back at Pop like a juvvy that he is. I always thought Ben can thrive with a great coaching staff like Pop’s, who could slowly fix his game to winning games. Very much what we see Pop is doing with Sochan. Simmons has great vision, big athletic who can rim run and finish, while finding who’s open, great defender. Yes, I’d still take Simmons for the right pieces. It would be a challenge to play him with Sochan not shooting, yet. That would have to get fixed. Simmons for Poeltl plus fillers, I’d take him. It’d be a roster challenge, but I’d leave Pop to figure it out.

I agree……..Simmons has a place in the league:)

[Ariel]

Yeah, Simmons has a place in the NBA... the all nut job first team, alongside Primo.

[ambchang]

What are you talking about? I’ve been a proponent of Tre since early last year

Must have mixed it up with someone else then. I thought you were saying tre is the worst starting PG in the league as part of the evidence that the spurs have the least talent.

[Mr. Body]

Can we just mention Marc Stein is just a bullshit merchant?

[Sugus]

:lmao At taking hypotheticals out of context from the time they were discussed.

As if anyone could have foreseen Simmons having mental health issues, developing a mental block and having a back injury that led to surgery.

Yeah, just who could've foreseen him sucking ass...?!


:lmao At homers and casuals alike who think a combination of the Spurs' second and third rate youth and lesser/protected picks are getting them a young, signed long term, (flawed) complimentary star.

When Stein says "barge", he's more than likely alluding to pulling in a third or maybe even fourth team to be able to contribute to supplying the 76ers with the type of package that would appeal to them.


Fuuuuck this noise.

This is a Kangz-level move, for real now. Y'all have been bitching about the "inept FO" moves all off-season long - this is precisely the move an inept FO would do. I too don't buy all this noise and "sources", it's clear the clock is ticking out on Simmons and the Klutch media machine is hoping now more than ever for a bidding war, lest Simmons be on the roster still come training camp.

:lmao at naive posters thinking Simmons is a "first domino" and would attract "ring chasers" to SanAn. Insane that after so many years this fantasy is still going strong, for BEN SIMMONS nonetheless... Who's he gonna drag down here? Be fucking real... Guy is hardly adequate as a #2 option, probably a #3, with the ego of a diva #1 to boot. Further :lmao at posters thinking his "issues are fixable", no they aren't - he literally shoots off the wrong fucking hand still, at twenty-fucking-five, be real. Chip could more easily get Poeltl shooting 3's than he would Simmons shooting them (matter-of-factly, Poeltl literally has a better jumper and touch than Simmons does, and I see nobody barking up that hopeless tree for some reason...).

Disgusting that it's even a consideration, can only hope it's media BS smoke and mirrors. Definitely would be my breaking point. Fuck Simmons and being locked into at least 4 years of mediocrity (the REAL mediocrity) paying his bum, beta ass $140 million dollars. I'd much, much rather bottom out and go get a player off the top lottery who isn't so fatally and fundamentally flawed in the most important aspect of the modern NBA as Simmons. Why do people even want him? You can't even play him for his defense in the 4th, he's been Hack-A-Shaq'd literally every single playoff series last season :lol

Once again... Fuck this.

Back-to-back. :reading :music

[TD 21]

Yeah, just who could've foreseen him sucking ass...?!





Back-to-back. :reading :music

Not for those reasons though.

For the record, I was never a Simmons guy. I've always been a re-build guy, but short of that I was a proponent of, if they're going to continue to be a treadmill team, might as well look to be a better version of it so long as it didn't require gutting their future.

[K...]

Simmons was always a case of ....Did he want to be here and could he recover his game. because he could have come here and been different and better than murray. Murray a guy who didn't want to be here but did not quit on the team vs a guy who quit on his team but might be better. .

[KingKev]

Not for those reasons though.

For the record, I was never a Simmons guy. I've always been a re-build guy, but short of that I was a proponent of, if they're going to continue to be a treadmill team, might as well look to be a better version of it so long as it didn't require gutting their future.

Which is EXACTLY what you proposed :lmao :lmao :lmao

For the record

:lmao

[talkspurs]

If Simmons were still in his prime and not fallen off completely, the Spurs would be fine after the proposed trade. We know they missed out on a lot now, but they'd have an All-Star with some good players like Keldon and Vassell, significant cap space and all of their future picks. We would've looked at Murray likely being a good player for the Sixers and wondered if it were the right deal, but the position the team would be in would still be fine. Just as Simmons ended up busting, Wemby could bust, as well as the next guy the Spurs draft. They can't constantly liquidate their roster forever at the expense of the on-court product.

In reality, I was wrong about Simmons. He regressed. But being able to be aggressive in trading for stars is why you keep the contracts in the first place. Having really good ballast is worth not getting a random second-round pick.

If Simmons was still in his prime? He never even got to his prime. He was able to post ok numbers but should not have received the accolades that he did.


To be fair, I just wanted to trade Murray. I didn’t know the Hawks package was available. I wanted a Ben for Murray swap bc Murray isn’t a winning player and not worth 40 million a year. I’m glad we didn’t do it but I’m also glad we traded Murray. But paying Ben $36 million wouldn’t have hurt this team in any way shape or form. He would’ve added to the tanking and we have a lot of money to spend anyways. Once we get Victor, I would like for us to go big and over pay for a secondary star player (like the Pels did with CJ).

How would paying murry 40 mill hurt but paying Ben 36 not hurt? I understand your tanking argument but Ben is a bad teamate. There is a reason why his team is frustrated with him again. He is probably the worst contract in the NBA. yes even worse then westbrock because he deal is so much longer.

I was probably the biggest one against a murray for Ben trade. and was the first to say I would not trade murray for simmons straight up.

As far as wouldI take Simmons now. I guess if the proce is right but what I would want the nets would not be willing to give up. I would be looking something like a mcdermont for Ben and picks. and I doubt they would be willing to send picks back right now.

[TD 21]

Which is EXACTLY what you proposed :lmao :lmao :lmao

For the record

:lmao

Not at all.

:lmao At being obsessed with me because I expose your arrogant, Craptors fan boy ass for being not nearly as knowledgeable as you think you are.

[scott]

Simmons is in Westbrook territory. Nets would have to send us 2 FRPs to eat his deal.

Just if it hasn't been made clear in this long ass thread... Simmons fucking sucks.

[XDT76]

Simmons is in Westbrook territory. Nets would have to send us 2 FRPs to eat his deal.

Just if it hasn't been made clear in this long ass thread... Simmons fucking sucks.

U are kidding Westbrook contract ends this season, Simmons got another 2 years to run no way anyone would agree same return for their contract.

[talkspurs]

U are kidding Westbrook contract ends this season, Simmons got another 2 years to run no way anyone would agree same return for their contract.

are you saying westbrooks contract is worse or Bens contract is worse?

[scott]

U are kidding Westbrook contract ends this season, Simmons got another 2 years to run no way anyone would agree same return for their contract.

You are correct, we would need ABOVE a Westbrook deal to take Simmons. My point was more that they both suck ass and are huge negative assets that require compensation to take.

[XDT76]

are you saying westbrooks contract is worse or Bens contract is worse?

Simmons is worse, Westbrook contract finish this season, with cap space the organisation can absorb it. For Simmons you lose cap for two additional season and have prolong negative locker room issue.

[KobesAchilles]

If Simmons was still in his prime? He never even got to his prime. He was able to post ok numbers but should not have received the accolades that he did.



How would paying murry 40 mill hurt but paying Ben 36 not hurt? I understand your tanking argument but Ben is a bad teamate. There is a reason why his team is frustrated with him again. He is probably the worst contract in the NBA. yes even worse then westbrock because he deal is so much longer.

I was probably the biggest one against a murray for Ben trade. and was the first to say I would not trade murray for simmons straight up.

As far as wouldI take Simmons now. I guess if the proce is right but what I would want the nets would not be willing to give up. I would be looking something like a mcdermont for Ben and picks. and I doubt they would be willing to send picks back right now.
Bc with Murray we were in the 10-11 range in the west. W/o Murray we are at the botttom of the west. Ben would’ve kept us on the bottom. Murray is just good enough to where we win too much to suck but lose way too much to be any good. So as far as team tank goes, Simmons is the man for it. Now I of course loved the Hawks deal and am glad the Spurs went that way, but trading DJ in general is what I really wanted.

What’s hilarious though is that Atlanta is gonna pay him his $40 million a year just for them to have a losing record bc they traded so many assets for him.

[Dejounte]

What’s hilarious though is that San Antonio is gonna pay Simmons his $40 million a year just for them to have a losing record bc they traded so many assets for him.

Do you not follow your own logic here?

[KobesAchilles]

Do you not follow your own logic here?
One gets me tanking though. While Atlanta has no picks for themselves. I don’t think we were ever gonna offer up one of our picks for Simmons. Atlanta gave away like 4 picks. I don’t mind paying people. I do mind giving away our first round draft pick AND paying people.

There’s a lot to consider though other than does Simmons just suck. He would get zero tv time here and have zero expectations. He could just be a role player here and not have to have the burden of being a weak link on a star team with finals aspirations. Now maybe that makes him play free.

But once we get Victor though we need to look for an overpaid “star” to pair him with. In a perfect world it would be Harden. We need a PG badly. It’s a huge hole and weakness for our team going forward

[exstatic]

One gets me tanking though. While Atlanta has no picks for themselves. I don’t think we were ever gonna offer up one of our picks for Simmons. Atlanta gave away like 4 picks. I don’t mind paying people. I do mind giving away our first round draft pick AND paying people.

There’s a lot to consider though other than does Simmons just suck. He would get zero tv time here and have zero expectations. He could just be a role player here and not have to have the burden of being a weak link on a star team with finals aspirations. Now maybe that makes him play free.

But once we get Victor though we need to look for an overpaid “star” to pair him with. In a perfect world it would be Harden. We need a PG badly. It’s a huge hole and weakness for our team going forward

If we ever got Harden, I’d check out. He’s everything NOT Spurs. I don’t care how much he scores with his 35 USG, he would destroy the development track of all of our young players.

[james evans]

One gets me tanking though. While Atlanta has no picks for themselves. I don’t think we were ever gonna offer up one of our picks for Simmons. Atlanta gave away like 4 picks. I don’t mind paying people. I do mind giving away our first round draft pick AND paying people.

There’s a lot to consider though other than does Simmons just suck. He would get zero tv time here and have zero expectations. He could just be a role player here and not have to have the burden of being a weak link on a star team with finals aspirations. Now maybe that makes him play free.

But once we get Victor though we need to look for an overpaid “star” to pair him with. In a perfect world it would be Harden. We need a PG badly. It’s a huge hole and weakness for our team going forward
Any team in the NBA that doesn't have a durable pg that can at least hit the open 3 and get teammates involved need to fire their GM immediately. There are more pgs in basketball now than I ever remember in my entire life. Every pg doesn't have to be as flashy as Irving and Morant, but they are out here in large numbers.

[John B]

One gets me tanking though. While Atlanta has no picks for themselves. I don’t think we were ever gonna offer up one of our picks for Simmons. Atlanta gave away like 4 picks. I don’t mind paying people. I do mind giving away our first round draft pick AND paying people.

There’s a lot to consider though other than does Simmons just suck. He would get zero tv time here and have zero expectations. He could just be a role player here and not have to have the burden of being a weak link on a star team with finals aspirations. Now maybe that makes him play free.

But once we get Victor though we need to look for an overpaid “star” to pair him with. In a perfect world it would be Harden. We need a PG badly. It’s a huge hole and weakness for our team going forward

You lost me at Harden. I’d rather have the Coyote playing PG than Harden destroying this team. I think Malaki is a good candidate for me as a starting PG down the line. He is already showing good ballhandling, better than DJ in his 1st 3 years, composure and the ability to pick and pop. Blake while more explosive is very raw. Malaki has the demeanor and can score when he needs to, at least if he continues his trajectory and become NBA strong. I think Malaki will continue backing up Tre until late next season.

[KobesAchilles]

I know all about Harden and his ways. I wouldn't say he has matured as a person, I'm sure he still hits the clubs/hookers. He plays zero defense and can be a diva. But I like his game now. James has a lot he could pass onto our younger guys. He gets to the foul line with ease, he is a great dribbler, he really reads the floor well on offense and can make all the passes. These are all things I want our youth to learn. Plus he has no problem now getting others involved and letting others get their baskets. This isn't the Houston Harden who dribbles the ball 25 seconds of the 24 second shot clock, he plays differently.

Another guy I wouldn't mind is FFV. That guy would fit our system well. I just haven't seen enough Raptor games to know how well he runs the show. Can he create consistently for others? Maybe a more knowledgeable poster knows.

[talkspurs]

Bc with Murray we were in the 10-11 range in the west. W/o Murray we are at the botttom of the west. Ben would’ve kept us on the bottom. Murray is just good enough to where we win too much to suck but lose way too much to be any good. So as far as team tank goes, Simmons is the man for it. Now I of course loved the Hawks deal and am glad the Spurs went that way, but trading DJ in general is what I really wanted.

What’s hilarious though is that Atlanta is gonna pay him his $40 million a year just for them to have a losing record bc they traded so many assets for him.

As I said I understand your tanking point but his contract is for more then this year. He also spoils locker rooms. I might be willing to take him on if we got the right compensation but his contract is worse then westbrooks.

[poopbox]

The takes in this thread :lmao

The only thing Simmons has done worth talking about in his career is not dunk on Trae Young :lmao

Could you imagine us tanking AND trying to give Simmons away :lmao

You think we could have gotten for Simmons what we got for Murray :lmao

[CGD]

The ringer podcast folks had a fake trade of Ben Simmons for Jakob and Richardson.

Theory is he comes to a low stakes environment and rehabs his career etc. Didn’t appreciate he only had 2 years after this one (not 3)

[scott]

The ringer podcast folks had a fake trade of Ben Simmons for Jakob and Richardson.

Theory is he comes to a low stakes environment and rehabs his career etc. Didn’t appreciate he only had 2 years after this one (not 3)

The only way I do that deal now is if it also comes with 2 lightly protected FRPs into the future.

[KingKev]

The Nets quietly have a well balanced roster. Simmons role probably continues to deteriorate to that of a deep bench player lol

[mo7888]

The Nets quietly have a well balanced roster. Simmons role probably continues to deteriorate to that of a deep bench player lol

I think I enjoyed watching Brooklyn play last night more than I did with KD on the team... they played hard on both ends... obviously not coming out of the east, but they are gonna make somebody work to knock them out in the playoffs.

[Spursfanfromafar]

I think I enjoyed watching Brooklyn play last night more than I did with KD on the team... they played hard on both ends... obviously not coming out of the east, but they are gonna make somebody work to knock them out in the playoffs.

Bridges was brilliant. Johnson missed a lot of shots that he generally makes and he will get into a groove soon. Finney-Smith and Dinwiddie are good additions. And Cam Thomas is a baller on offense. But they have to trade Ben Simmons - he is genuinely terrified of the rim. He wont even take open layups and is a net negative on offense. Completely unplayable in fourth quarters and what a drag on their salary. Just one more shot creator and the Nets could be cooking soon.

[mo7888]

Bridges was brilliant. Johnson missed a lot of shots that he generally makes and he will get into a groove soon. Finney-Smith and Dinwiddie are good additions. And Cam Thomas is a baller on offense. But they have to trade Ben Simmons - he is genuinely terrified of the rim. He wont even take open layups and is a net negative on offense. Completely unplayable in fourth quarters and what a drag on their salary. Just one more shot creator and the Nets could be cooking soon.

He's the key.... for him to be playable you need 4 other shooters around him so you can maximize what he brings...basically you have to build a team around him ... and I don't see anyone out there willing to do that.... maybe Houston, but I doubt it..

[The Truth #6]

Haven given up so much draft capital, they are probably stuck with him. These pariah superstars are hilarious to me. I know the spurs definitely need high end talent, but I’m also glad we don’t have a dumb ass superstar dragging the team down, that might be actually more depressing than our current state.

[exstatic]

Haven given up so much draft capital, they are probably stuck with him. These pariah superstars are hilarious to me. I know the spurs definitely need high end talent, but I’m also glad we don’t have a dumb ass superstar dragging the team down, that might be actually more depressing than our current state.

Brooklyn RECEIVED draft capital in the Simmons trade, 2 FRPs. They sent out Harden.

[The Truth #6]

Brooklyn RECEIVED draft capital in the Simmons trade, 2 FRPs. They sent out Harden.

I recall them being heavily indebted to Houston and in general being without a lot of future picks.

[John B]

Bridges was brilliant. Johnson missed a lot of shots that he generally makes and he will get into a groove soon. Finney-Smith and Dinwiddie are good additions. And Cam Thomas is a baller on offense. But they have to trade Ben Simmons - he is genuinely terrified of the rim. He wont even take open layups and is a net negative on offense. Completely unplayable in fourth quarters and what a drag on their salary. Just one more shot creator and the Nets could be cooking soon.

I’m rooting for the Nets to stay competitive and not give Rockets high lottery picks :lol. It’s bad that Rockets did not even reach Finals with any of those future Hofers CP3, Harden, Westbrook, putting in the right pieces around. But I have to give it to them, they cashed out getting high picks, what they do with them is another story :lmao

[talkspurs]

I was totally against getting Ben in the DJm trade. but if we could get the 27 and 29 picks from the Suns I would take those to take on his contract. I heard they were willing to give away a 1st rd pick to get rid of him. Nets actually have a good amount of picks coming up over the next few years so I would rather have the Suns picks over theirs.

[exstatic]

I was totally against getting Ben in the DJm trade. but if we could get the 27 and 29 picks from the Suns I would take those to take on his contract. I heard they were willing to give away a 1st rd pick to get rid of him. Nets actually have a good amount of picks coming up over the next few years so I would rather have the Suns picks over theirs.

Their owner apparently doesn’t care about the tax, or doesn’t want to appear cheap. They did nothing at the deadline to lower a pretty hefty tax bill, and they could have done things not involving Simmons. They’re not sending out the two Phoenix picks.

[talkspurs]

Their owner apparently doesn’t care about the tax, or doesn’t want to appear cheap. They did nothing at the deadline to lower a pretty hefty tax bill, and they could have done things not involving Simmons. They’re not sending out the two Phoenix picks.

They also wern't going to trade durant and according to you Ben is so much better then DJM so your information that you try to present as facts is pretty useless. Also it is not always about tax but being able to sign FA or getting other players via trade.

[K...]

they will trade Ben Simmons when it's time. They can trade him for another bad contract they prefer. trading two big salary is enough for one season. There are always dumb trades that fail to make sense if you are patient

[exstatic]

They also wern't going to trade durant and according to you Ben is so much better then DJM so your information that you try to present as facts is pretty useless. Also it is not always about tax but being able to sign FA or getting other players via trade.

This thread was made 18 months ago when Simmons was on a completely different team, and DJ hadn’t yet been selected as an All Star yet. Keep living in the past, though, and ignore the fact that literally DAYS ago, teams weren’t willing to pay one FRP to rent cap space, let alone two unprotected ones.

[talkspurs]

This thread was made 18 months ago when Simmons was on a completely different team, and DJ hadn’t yet been selected as an All Star yet. Keep living in the past, though, and ignore the fact that literally DAYS ago, teams weren’t willing to pay one FRP to rent cap space, let alone two unprotected ones.

Right because we should only trade on what they currently are not what they are going to become. Heck even at what they were I would not have tradded for simmons as he was living off of his name and not what he could do. I also believe you continued to push for it after he made the all star team but there are to many pages to look through to find it.

I do find it interesting that you say keep living in the past and then talk about the past. Same sentence since trades cant happen till the summer things will change by then. I also saw a tweet that they were willing to give a first to get rid of him. Was it true? who knows besides the GMs. But if it was true then no one was willing to take his contract. As he plays more seasons then teams may require less but for most of next year I could see it being 2 first.

[exstatic]

Right because we should only trade on what they currently are not what they are going to become. Heck even at what they were I would not have tradded for simmons as he was living off of his name and not what he could do. I also believe you continued to push for it after he made the all star team but there are to many pages to look through to find it.

I do find it interesting that you say keep living in the past and then talk about the past. Same sentence since trades cant happen till the summer things will change by then. I also saw a tweet that they were willing to give a first to get rid of him. Was it true? who knows besides the GMs. But if it was true then no one was willing to take his contract. As he plays more seasons then teams may require less but for most of next year I could see it being 2 first.

So, a tweet is a valid source? Because I saw tweets that they weren’t going to trade Durant.

I also haven’t been interested in a positive asset trade for Ben since he didn’t play the rest of the season after being traded to BKN. Believe what you want.

[talkspurs]

So, a tweet is a valid source? Because I saw tweets that they weren’t going to trade Durant.

I also haven’t been interested in a positive asset trade for Ben since he didn’t play the rest of the season after being traded to BKN. Believe what you want.

I never said a tweet was valid but I believe it was either shams or woj that tweeted it. If it came from them then I would say it was pretty valid. I had one other that I was following that was throwing out some speculation but mostly news after shams and woj. As far as the Durant thing that was what I was talking about things can change and things that might have been true a few days ago may no longer be.

You do realize that he stopped playing long before this thread even started. He did not play at the 2021-2022 season and you were wanting him with giving up assets in this thread. I cant say what you were willing to give up once he went to Brooklyn as I am not going to dig if you even said it.

I like how you never respond to things that call you out as you ae so wrong most of the time you just ignore it.

[exstatic]

I never said a tweet was valid but I believe it was either shams or woj that tweeted it. If it came from them then I would say it was pretty valid. I had one other that I was following that was throwing out some speculation but mostly news after shams and woj. As far as the Durant thing that was what I was talking about things can change and things that might have been true a few days ago may no longer be.

You do realize that he stopped playing long before this thread even started. He did not play at the 2021-2022 season and you were wanting him with giving up assets in this thread. I cant say what you were willing to give up once he went to Brooklyn as I am not going to dig if you even said it.

I like how you never respond to things that call you out as you ae so wrong most of the time you just ignore it.

I know the whole history of the Simmons soap opera. He was holding out, or he wasn’t holding out. He was injured or he wasn’t injured. Once he was traded, and didn’t resume playing, he became a negative asset in my opinion, whether it was the more likely injury scenario or mental issues or both.

When you mentioned the Durant thing in the same post that you said you got your informational from an indeterminate tweet, I said that the Durant information I got was from a tweet JUST like your information was. Responded. You then made some vague accusation of me still wanting to send positive assets for him, but admitted that you couldn’t bother to track the post. No response needed.

This little exchange all started when you got butthurt about being called out about thinking we could pry two unprotected FRPs for cap rental, when literally days ago, no one got even one unprotected FRP for cap rental. Once cornered, you resorted to vague accusations that you refused to research or back up. I’ll take my W, and move on.

[talkspurs]

I know the whole history of the Simmons soap opera. He was holding out, or he wasn’t holding out. He was injured or he wasn’t injured. Once he was traded, and didn’t resume playing, he became a negative asset in my opinion, whether it was the more likely injury scenario or mental issues or both.

When you mentioned the Durant thing in the same post that you said you got your informational from an indeterminate tweet, I said that the Durant information I got was from a tweet JUST like your information was. Responded. You then made some vague accusation of me still wanting to send positive assets for him, but admitted that you couldn’t bother to track the post. No response needed.

This little exchange all started when you got butthurt about being called out about thinking we could pry two unprotected FRPs for cap rental, when literally days ago, no one got even one unprotected FRP for cap rental. Once cornered, you resorted to vague accusations that you refused to research or back up. I’ll take my W, and move on.

You know the whole story of the Simmons soap opera?? Then why dont you know if it was injury or holding out, mental or physical. btw knowing the whole story would mean you would know that.

I dont understand what the durant information has to deal to much with this. I was saying it was reported as fact and then came to be untrue. This was not meant to say you were wrong on it just that things reported to be true turn out not to be. I did not say you still wanted to I was saying when it was going down and He was not playing you were still wanting to send out positive asst to get him. You can find this through the first several pages of this thread. I said once he went to Brooklyn I could not say what you wanted. (learn to read) This is what I was not going to did for because I did not know if you even stated it once he went to Brooklyn if you were willing to give up assets.

The response that you did not reply to was how you say dont live in the past and then go to the past in the same sentence. Its more recent but is still the past as the next trades cant happen until the summer. And also how you like to present things as fact although you are wrong.

Once again you are presenting this as fact that we cannot got 2 first round picks for his contract. You do not know this. You may think this will not happen but you do not know this. I would have never thought that Gobert or KD would be able to get the # of picks/players they got for them. I also would not have thought LA would have got off of Wetbrooks contract and get back what they got. So you cannot say what will or will not happen in the future.
As far as what I sad was what it would take for me to consider it a trade the spurs should make not what we could get. If it was much less then that I would walk. I never said we could get that. I said "if we could get the 27 and 29 picks from the Suns I would take those to take on his contract. " This does not say we will but if we could get that then I would take on his contract.
This started because you came in here trying to sound like it was a crazy Idea of it happening because you know everything. There is no way to know what he would be traded for or if he would be traded. You cannot say with certainty if that could or could not happen though currently. Just like when you you were trying to give away DJM and acting like Ben was so much better you were wrong on it.

[exstatic]

You know the whole story of the Simmons soap opera?? Then why dont you know if it was injury or holding out, mental or physical. btw knowing the whole story would mean you would know that.

I dont understand what the durant information has to deal to much with this. I was saying it was reported as fact and then came to be untrue. This was not meant to say you were wrong on it just that things reported to be true turn out not to be. I did not say you still wanted to I was saying when it was going down and He was not playing you were still wanting to send out positive asst to get him. You can find this through the first several pages of this thread. I said once he went to Brooklyn I could not say what you wanted. (learn to read) This is what I was not going to did for because I did not know if you even stated it once he went to Brooklyn if you were willing to give up assets.

The response that you did not reply to was how you say dont live in the past and then go to the past in the same sentence. Its more recent but is still the past as the next trades cant happen until the summer. And also how you like to present things as fact although you are wrong.

Once again you are presenting this as fact that we cannot got 2 first round picks for his contract. You do not know this. You may think this will not happen but you do not know this. I would have never thought that Gobert or KD would be able to get the # of picks/players they got for them. I also would not have thought LA would have got off of Wetbrooks contract and get back what they got. So you cannot say what will or will not happen in the future.
As far as what I sad was what it would take for me to consider it a trade the spurs should make not what we could get. If it was much less then that I would walk. I never said we could get that. I said "if we could get the 27 and 29 picks from the Suns I would take those to take on his contract. " This does not say we will but if we could get that then I would take on his contract.
This started because you came in here trying to sound like it was a crazy Idea of it happening because you know everything. There is no way to know what he would be traded for or if he would be traded. You cannot say with certainty if that could or could not happen though currently. Just like when you you were trying to give away DJM and acting like Ben was so much better you were wrong on it.

Take your L with some grace. You were operating on old information, both with what I thought of Simmons, and what current compensation models for cap rental are.

[talkspurs]

Take your L with some grace. You were operating on old information, both with what I thought of Simmons, and what current compensation models for cap rental are.

Why would I take the L I am correct. You are not really trying to say you were correct on Simmons are you? As I said previously When you know you are wrong do dont respond you deflect.

[exstatic]

Take your L with some grace. You were operating on old information, both with what I thought of Simmons, and what current compensation models for cap rental are.

[PhantomDashCam]

https://youtu.be/z3OajfvzSt8

Wow, things must be bad when I find myself agreeing with Perk...

[talkspurs]

Glad your took your L by quoting yourself.

[DPG21920]

Would love if SA could land Simmons this off season for Khem + Graham and one of those Suns unprotected picks….Spurs don’t seem to have a cap space plan for next year anyways with taking on Khem+Graham so what’s one more year if you can get a rather tasty pick from BKY/Suns? It’s a risk because while next year FA class sucks and is a throw away for SA, year after where Ben has 40M owed it may not be. But you can kick that can down the road and maybe give up a first to move him then (that’s not as good as the one they got).

Let’s say they trade Khem/Graham for Simmons + PHX 1st and then one year later trade the CHA 1st+Simmons to a team if Sa needs to dump Simmons as a true expiring deal for a team?

[KingKev]

Would love if SA could land Simmons this off season for Khem + Graham and one of those Suns unprotected picks….Spurs don’t seem to have a cap space plan for next year anyways with taking on Khem+Graham so what’s one more year if you can get a rather tasty pick from BKY/Suns? It’s a risk because while next year FA class sucks and is a throw away for SA, year after where Ben has 40M owed it may not be. But you can kick that can down the road and maybe give up a first to move him then (that’s not as good as the one they got).

Let’s say they trade Khem/Graham for Simmons + PHX 1st and then one year later trade the CHA 1st+Simmons to a team if Sa needs to dump Simmons as a true expiring deal for a team?

For BK Simmons is just going to be dead cap. Zero reason to pay assets to get him off.

[DPG21920]

For BK Simmons is just going to be dead cap. Zero reason to pay assets to get him off.

I mean, not really. If BKY does that deal I said, they could open up a large salary slot vs being an MLE only team…they have no incentive to tank since they don’t own their own picks and I’m guessing they wont be cool with 37M dead money player when they can simply give up a pick and legit pursue who they want with that money

* to get close to a max slot SA would have to take back most of Ben’s salary without sending much back

[DPG21920]

Basically, I look at it like this: if you have no incentive to tank, have a solid core, would you trade Ben Simmons + a Suns first for Khris Middleton or DLO or Jerami Grant?

Maybe that’s no, but if you don’t improve you don’t get any pick anyways….

[KingKev]

I mean, not really. If BKY does that deal I said, they could open up a large salary slot vs being an MLE only team…they have no incentive to tank since they don’t own their own picks and I’m guessing they wont be cool with 37M dead money player when they can simply give up a pick and legit pursue who they want with that money

* to get close to a max slot SA would have to take back most of Ben’s salary without sending much back

Why would they do that? Cam Johnson’s cap hold alone is probably 15m meaning that cap space has been eaten and they clearly aren’t concerned with lux tax as evidenced by these deadline deals. They are going to consolidate the pieces they have into an all-star or sell for more draft capital. Not the other way around.

[exstatic]

Why would they do that? Cam Johnson’s cap hold alone is probably 15m meaning that cap space has been eaten and they clearly aren’t concerned with lux tax as evidenced by these deadline deals. They are going to consolidate the pieces they have into an all-star or sell for more draft capital. Not the other way around.

Their owner is in the five years ago Joe Lacob IDGAF about luxury tax mode. Simmons will be long gone before Tsai has regrets.

[DPG21920]

Why would they do that? Cam Johnson’s cap hold alone is probably 15m meaning that cap space has been eaten and they clearly aren’t concerned with lux tax as evidenced by these deadline deals. They are going to consolidate the pieces they have into an all-star or sell for more draft capital. Not the other way around.

Bruh I’m confused why you are so dismissive of this scenario lol. I just said why: BKY does not own their own picks. If they don’t improve, it benefits them absolutely none. Beyond that, as you said, they are currently at 145M in money before Cams money and with needing to re-sign Seth too.

So they are right there at the luxury tax if you think Cam gets say 15M+ a year. Why would you pay the luxury tax and be a worse team when you can simply trade Simmons, have no danger of being in luxury tax, spend the money on a player to improve your team instead and all you give up is a pick when you just landed a ton of them?

I mean, sure, I guess if they don’t care about improving despite having no incentive to tank, don’t care about luxury tax again despite not being able to improve due to Simmons money and are ok with 2 years of dead money with an unproductive player sure. But you would at least think they would consider being rid of all those problems completely while simultaneously improving on the court

If you say Cam gets 20M a year, but you shed Ben’s 37M, that’s a 25M net savings of their current situation (Cams QO if 8M, so 20M would be +12 to their current projection of 145M - 37M from Ben) so they go from 145M in salaries to 120M in salaries but that includes having Cam locked up and now you have 14M to get a productive player in place of Ben and be out of tax zone.

[Russ]

Ben Simmons is 26 years old. How could he possibly fit into the Spurs timeline?

(Assuming the many other problems could be set aside.)

[DPG21920]

If anything I think it’s Sa that would need to be convinced here more than BKY. Not sure they absorb all of Simmons for just one pick (I’d prob be ok with it since it’s functionally one year since SA doesn’t have a plan for cap space this next season anyways)

[DPG21920]

Ben Simmons is 26 years old. How could he possibly fit into the Spurs timeline?

(Assuming the many other problems could be set aside.)

He doesn’t. He’s traded for and benched or bought out or plays very limited minutes to see if value can improve to where SA can dump him when he’s truly an expiring contract.

[KingKev]

Bruh I’m confused why you are so dismissive of this scenario lol. I just said why: BKY does not own their own picks. If they don’t improve, it benefits them absolutely none. Beyond that, as you said, they are currently at 145M in money before Cams money and with needing to re-sign Seth too.

So they are right there at the luxury tax if you think Cam gets say 15M+ a year. Why would you pay the luxury tax and be a worse team when you can simply trade Simmons, have no danger of being in luxury tax, spend the money on a player to improve your team instead and all you give up is a pick when you just landed a ton of them?

I mean, sure, I guess if they don’t care about improving despite having no incentive to tank, don’t care about luxury tax again despite not being able to improve due to Simmons money and are ok with 2 years of dead money with an unproductive player sure. But you would at least think they would consider being rid of all those problems completely while simultaneously improving on the court

If you say Cam gets 20M a year, but you shed Ben’s 37M, that’s a 25M net savings of their current situation (Cams QO if 8M, so 20M would be +12 to their current projection of 145M - 37M from Ben) so they go from 145M in salaries to 120M in salaries but that includes having Cam locked up and now you have 14M to get a productive player in place of Ben and be out of tax zone.

I didn’t read this novel. You wrote a similar chapter book when I suggested the Nets trade KD after Kyrie was moved.

[DPG21920]

I didn’t read this novel. You wrote a similar chapter book when I suggested the Nets trade KD after Kyrie was moved.

I never said BKY wouldn’t or shouldn’t trade KD…I simply said it seemed disjointed as evidenced by the report Suns offered CP3 for Kyrie. If BKY knew they were going to trade KD, why would Suns have made that offer?

It at least points to BKY making the deal for Kyrie independent of the thought of moving KD as a hedge to keeping KD.

So….don’t get your point and don’t GAF if you can read or not

[scott]

Two things I can never understand about this message board:

1. Why people are so snarky/rude to each other over different basketball opinions. It's one thing to pick on ducks for being a troglodyte, but the dickery and condescension from some folks is unnecessary. Especially when it comes from people who are comically wrong all the time. You know who I'm talkin' about :lol
2. Why a thread about a player as shitty as Ben Simmons is 75 pages long.

[KingKev]

I never said BKY wouldn’t or shouldn’t trade KD…I simply said it seemed disjointed as evidenced by the report Suns offered CP3 for Kyrie. If BKY knew they were going to trade KD, why would Suns have made that offer?

It at least points to BKY making the deal for Kyrie independent of the thought of moving KD as a hedge to keeping KD.


So….don’t get your point and don’t GAF if you can read or not

After Kyrie was traded you held the opinion KD would not be moved as the Nets needed to double down on him and whatever assets they received given their lack of draft capital. That was a specific rebuttal to
my view. Two days later KD was moved.

[DPG21920]

After Kyrie was traded you held the opinion KD would not be moved as the Nets needed to double down on him and whatever assets they received given their lack of draft capital. That was a specific rebuttal to
my view. Two days later KD was moved.

Yes. I held the opinion because it was logical. Does not mean I have a crystal ball. Had they known for sure KD was going to want out, I’m not sure they make that same deal with Mavs.

Cool - you guessed right that KD was going to be traded - want a cookie?

[KingKev]

Yes. I held the opinion because it was logical. Does not mean I have a crystal ball. Had they known for sure KD was going to want out, I’m not sure they make that same deal with Mavs.

Cool - you guessed right that KD was going to be traded - want a cookie?

The lesson to learn is to not be so pompous. Especially when you have had recent and quite simply bad takes.

[DPG21920]

The lesson to learn is to not be so pompous. Especially when you have had recent and quite simply bad takes.

You’re an idiot

[K...]

DPG is right that we could trade for simmons but again the counter argument is try to trade to graham for a separate pick, keep salary open, simmons is cancer, and brooklyn probably trades Simmons for an equal bad player if it can. As much as we like to white knight the spurs as the savior for bad frnachises there are other teams with dumb ideas too.

[DPG21920]

DPG is right that we could trade for simmons but again the counter argument is try to trade to graham for a separate pick, keep salary open, simmons is cancer, and brooklyn probably trades Simmons for an equal bad player if it can. As much as we like to white knight the spurs as the savior for bad frnachises there are other teams with dumb ideas too.

For sure - it’s not just SA that can do it. Will be interesting to see what they do with Simmons. They probably have something they are looking for and a price just have to see how it shakes out.

Haven’t looked at cap space next year for all the teams yet either; not sure how many will have space to take on Simmons (or mostly take him on)

[exstatic]

You’re an idiot

Take a number. I had a poster following me around the Simmons thread trying to hold up me to an opinion from a year and a half, plus one trade to a different team, ago.

[KingKev]

Take a number. I had a poster following me around the Simmons thread trying to hold up me to an opinion from a year and a half, plus one trade to a different team, ago.

You literally turtle EVERY-TIME you are proven wrong. Like not even debate; you just coward when blatantly proven wrong. When you deflect it means there maybe is an argument.

[exstatic]

You literally turtle EVERY-TIME you are proven wrong. Like not even debate; you just coward when blatantly proven wrong. When you deflect it means there maybe is an argument.

You ask me if I’m finished eating, I say no. You ask me 15 minutes later and I say yes. Opposite answers, but both true when said.

At one point, in 2021, I thought Simmons was worth positive assets. I no longer do. Is that really so hard to understand?

[JPB]

Two things I can never understand about this message board:

1. Why people are so snarky/rude to each other over different basketball opinions. It's one thing to pick on ducks for being a troglodyte, but the dickery and condescension from some folks is unnecessary. Especially when it comes from people who are comically wrong all the time. You know who I'm talkin' about :lol
2. Why a thread about a player as shitty as Ben Simmons is 75 pages long.

1. Insecure, stubborn people.
2. It's a long season.

[JeffDuncan]

Would love if SA could land Simmons this off season…


Have you had a physical recently? Sometimes physical ailments can produce strange thoughts and behaviors.

[rankingtear]

Would love if SA could land Simmons this off season for Khem + Graham and one of those Suns unprotected picks….Spurs don’t seem to have a cap space plan for next year anyways with taking on Khem+Graham so what’s one more year if you can get a rather tasty pick from BKY/Suns? It’s a risk because while next year FA class sucks and is a throw away for SA, year after where Ben has 40M owed it may not be. But you can kick that can down the road and maybe give up a first to move him then (that’s not as good as the one they got).

Let’s say they trade Khem/Graham for Simmons + PHX 1st and then one year later trade the CHA 1st+Simmons to a team if Sa needs to dump Simmons as a true expiring deal for a team?

Dumping 40 million for a lottery protected pick without involving a hostage situation is not happening.

[John B]

Man I was rooting for this guy to get better. But if you can’t play good playing with future hofers KD, Embiid, there's just something wrong. As somebody mentioned, you might need to build around him, but right now it’s too much risk. He’d probably fit in a running game, transition offense type, yet plays slow down in playoffs then his sub-par shooting becomes a liability. Sochan was willing to change his shot at the risk of getting ridiculed, but has unlocked his game. Idk if Simmons would be willing to do the same at 26. His time is fast running out and could belong to the bust club.

[The Truth #6]

To receive Simmons we would need more compensation then they want to give. They got some picks back their way with the recent trade but still lost a bunch of picks to Houston from a previous trade iirc. Brooklyn is in a weird situation right now, but finally they are somewhat back to where they started when Sean Marks took over and started making changes: a scrappy team in a big market. But a nightmare they went through chasing superstars to only go full circle with NOTHING to show for it but more debt. Shows how the league is in such disrepair, especially when the league promotes players over teams, much less the actual game experience. (*steps off soap box)

[DPG21920]

Ya - I agree it’s more of a question would SA do it. I see reasons for BKY. Not sure one pick, even if unprotected, is enough though. Only reason I lean yes is because SA seemingly doesn’t have cap space plans anyways next season so it would (not from a money perspective but cap plans perspective) functionally only be one year of Simmons

Still, not sure SA ownership would pay 35M for a pick lol

[DPG21920]

1. Insecure, stubborn people.
2. It's a long season.

I’m rarely rude - I’m usually pretty patient and willing to engage in conversation and enjoy it. Been extra annoyed lately, but I am rarely every rude and I don’t troll. Doubt Scott was talking about me, but I know you have taken a few shots at me lately so wanted to address.

But I will leave it at that.

[DPG21920]

Have you had a physical recently? Sometimes physical ailments can produce strange thoughts and behaviors.

Lmao - look, I’m not a Simmons fan and hold no hope he turns his career around. I’m talking strictly for renting cap space. SA taking on Khem + Graham already so if you aren’t going to use rest of space or instead of doing several smaller deals for 2nds, I would rather go ahead and at least try to get best pick(s) possible IF that is the path SA is going…

But I’m not high on Simmons and not sure SA would even do that for 1 first - even a potentially great one. But I think its something to ponder..

[JeffDuncan]

Lmao - look, I’m not a Simmons fan and hold no hope he turns his career around. I’m talking strictly for renting cap space. …



Fair enough, but that Simmons contract runs through 2024-25, with no options. A cap space evaluation would have to look ahead two seasons. That’s too far.

The Spurs have more cap space now than they know what to do with, and may be on track for plenty next season, but in two years? Unknown. Two years can be an eternity in the NBA.

Might be a subject to revisit in the summer of ‘24 if Simmons is still a topic. Mark your calendar. Lol

[JPB]

I’m rarely rude - I’m usually pretty patient and willing to engage in conversation and enjoy it. Been extra annoyed lately, but I am rarely every rude and I don’t troll. Doubt Scott was talking about me, but I know you have taken a few shots at me lately so wanted to address.

But I will leave it at that.

Wasn't talking about you, it's all good. Just the couple "I'm a genius, you all stupid", bullying guys...

Sorry if you felt I was taking shots at you, it's always genuine and maybe to tease or make a stupid joke, but never with bad intentions even if I know intentions or second degree can sometimes be wrongly perceived on the Internet, and I sometimes facepalm when I read my own posts... We may not always agree but I like reading you.

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

We all know who scott and JPB were talking about. There are a few posters who are consistently rude and being assholes to everyone but DPG is certainly not one of them. Most grown up people can handle a basketball disagreement in a civil manner and some arguing can genuinely be a good way to begin perceiving a different point of view as no one here is right all the time, which is completely normal of course.

[DPG21920]

Fair enough, but that Simmons contract runs through 2024-25, with no options. A cap space evaluation would have to look ahead two seasons. That’s too far.

The Spurs have more cap space now than they know what to do with, and may be on track for plenty next season, but in two years? Unknown. Two years can be an eternity in the NBA.

Might be a subject to revisit in the summer of ‘24 if Simmons is still a topic. Mark your calendar. Lol

Definitely fair. But the value imo lies in taking him now since it doesn’t appear Sa cares about this years cap space anyways. Agree it’s far out but it’s functionally one year due to that context. Question in my mind is can you dump Simmons as a true expiring if you need to in 25 for less than you got by taking him here? If so mitigates risk and you come out ahead. But I agree it’s a lot to consider

[DPG21920]

Wasn't talking about you, it's all good. Just the couple "I'm a genius, you all stupid", bullying guys...

Sorry if you felt I was taking shots at you, it's always genuine and maybe to tease or make a stupid joke, but never with bad intentions even if I know intentions or second degree can sometimes be wrongly perceived on the Internet, and I sometimes facepalm when I read my own posts... We may not always agree but I like reading you.


We all know who scott and JPB were talking about. There are a few posters who are consistently rude and being assholes to everyone but DPG is certainly not one of them. Most grown up people can handle a basketball disagreement in a civil manner and some arguing can genuinely be a good way to begin perceiving a different point of view as no one here is right all the time, which is completely normal of course.

Cheers

[scott]

I'd actually be slightly intrigued by Simmons as an expensive reclamation project, but it would have to be for more than just 1 FRP, for the reasons JeffDuncan points out. I probably need 3 FRPs to take on that beast of a contract, and I don't think BKY is game. They need the draft capital they just got from Kyrie and Durant, it is in their interest to make Simmons their own reclamation project.

[scott]

Wasn't talking about you, it's all good. Just the couple "I'm a genius, you all stupid", bullying guys...

Sorry if you felt I was taking shots at you, it's always genuine and maybe to tease or make a stupid joke, but never with bad intentions even if I know intentions or second degree can sometimes be wrongly perceived on the Internet, and I sometimes facepalm when I read my own posts... We may not always agree but I like reading you.

Seconded. It ain't you, DPG, you're cool. Have enjoy interacting with you on the tweet machine as well.

[baseline bum]

Ya - I agree it’s more of a question would SA do it. I see reasons for BKY. Not sure one pick, even if unprotected, is enough though. Only reason I lean yes is because SA seemingly doesn’t have cap space plans anyways next season so it would (not from a money perspective but cap plans perspective) functionally only be one year of Simmons

Still, not sure SA ownership would pay 35M for a pick lol

Hard to imagine the guy has gone from looking like a legit franchise player his first year in Philly to being Alfrederik Hughes 2023, but with $78 million due the next two years one unprotected pick just isn't enough.

[CGD]

80M dollars would be a really expensive way to get 2 protected FRPs. Hard pass.

On the other hand, if Philly flops this playoffs and are looking to reset some, i'd be prepared to take Thobias Harris at 37M/1 year.

[baseline bum]

80M dollars would be a really expensive way to get 2 protected FRPs. Hard pass.

On the other hand, if Philly flops this playoffs and are looking to reset some, i'd be prepared to take Thobias Harris at 37M/1 year.

That'd be a negative for me. Unless Embiid blows his knee out they're going to be a playoff team every year and $37 million is way too much to pay for a pick in the twenties.

[poopbox]

Definitely fair. But the value imo lies in taking him now since it doesn’t appear Sa cares about this years cap space anyways. Agree it’s far out but it’s functionally one year due to that context. Question in my mind is can you dump Simmons as a true expiring if you need to in 25 for less than you got by taking him here? If so mitigates risk and you come out ahead. But I agree it’s a lot to consider

If you demand a pick when trading for Simmons then I don't see how you get off of him without giving up a pick. Only teams I can see trying to salary dump that much money are teams that are around the salary cap and they probably don't have anything we want.

Dude is a complete headcase. I don't think their is anything to redeem. I think its a greater than 0% chance he is out of the league when his current contract is up.

[DPG21920]

If you demand a pick when trading for Simmons then I don't see how you get off of him without giving up a pick. Only teams I can see trying to salary dump that much money are teams that are around the salary cap and they probably don't have anything we want.

Dude is a complete headcase. I don't think their is anything to redeem. I think its a greater than 0% chance he is out of the league when his current contract is up.

Exactly. You get an unprotected 1st for taking him with 2 years on his deal. If you need to dump him the next season with 1 year left on his deal, then you trade like CHA pick (which is protected) or another protected pick.

You trade one protected pick (if you need to dump him) for a non-protected pick. So you don’t end up net extra first but you end up with a better one.

[scott]

Exactly. You get an unprotected 1st for taking him with 2 years on his deal. If you need to dump him the next season with 1 year left on his deal, then you trade like CHA pick (which is protected) or another protected pick.

You trade one protected pick (if you need to dump him) for a non-protected pick. So you don’t end up net extra first but you end up with a better one.

Assuming you can pull this off, the $40MM you’ll pay him in one season is waaaaaaaay too steep a price just to upgrade a protected FRP to an unprotected. It ain’t my money, but that would be my line of thinking if I’m the Spurs FO.

[DPG21920]

Assuming you can pull this off, the $40MM you’ll pay him in one season is waaaaaaaay too steep a price just to upgrade a protected FRP to an unprotected. It ain’t my money, but that would be my line of thinking if I’m the Spurs FO.

For sure. Not sure Sa views 35m as an acceptable price for a pick lol

[The Truth #6]

It feels like Simmons is now part of the John Wall, Westbrook type of revolving door of bad contracts where they get traded around for each other out of desperation. Outside of money, the other downside is him possibly rubbing off on our young players. Sort of the worst type of veteran presence you could have. Though I suppose he could be a cautionary tale, lol.

[CGD]

That'd be a negative for me. Unless Embiid blows his knee out they're going to be a playoff team every year and $37 million is way too much to pay for a pick in the twenties.

Its never too early for a 2030 FRP!

[exstatic]

Its never too early for a 2030 FRP!

Actually, right now it is. Those aren’t available to trade until the new league year opens in early July.

[Excessive Egotist]

For sure. Not sure Sa views 35m as an acceptable price for a pick lol

At this point, Simmons must be viewed as a 100% negative salary. Assume we dump back and send at least Birch and Graham back to them to offset Simmons' money.

Still, ever after the bad salary for bad salary offset, we'd likely require two future FRPs to take back the remaining 40M in Simmons salary.

I'd do it if the picks were unprotected. I'd be hesitant if any protections were applied. Plus, the year of those unprotected picks matters a lot. Nothing immediate from Nets, Suns, or Philly.