Gas prices in Gordon California

[ducks]

https://scontent-lax3-2.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/fr/cp0/e15/q65/247313260_10104247935770011_5370221586309913204_n. jpg?_nc_cat=1&ccb=1-5&_nc_sid=110474&efg=eyJpIjoidCJ9&_nc_ohc=-JVRbPzjrG0AX9vG3kq&_nc_ht=scontent-lax3-2.xx&oh=4e9ae3c97a82aa26949188e05167019c&oe=61761A06

[ElNono]

More reason the get the State credit and buy electric :tu

[SnakeBoy]

That pump needs a sticker

https://empowerwisconsin.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/10/Biden-I-did-that-.jpeg

[ElNono]

That pump needs a sticker

https://empowerwisconsin.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/10/Biden-I-did-that-.jpeg

"Promises made, promises kept"

[Millennial_Messiah]

More reason the get the State credit and buy electric :tu

Electric cars are still too expensive, and too inefficient. How am I supposed to drive from Texas to Michigan and back in a Tesla? Where are all the EV station ports I can go to along the interstates in order to charge my EV in less than 10 minutes?

[boutons_deux]

Fuck oil.

prediction are that in 2030 more oil will be pumped then than now

Himalayas melting, nobody does shit. BigCoal whore Manchin, alone, kills CEPP


Climate Change Viewed From the Attic of the World

https://www.counterpunch.org/2021/10/21/climate-change-viewed-from-the-attic-of-the-world/


========================

Intelligence community: 'No country will be spared' from climate-related challenges

https://thehill.com/policy/energy-environment/577757-intelligence-community-no-country-will-be-spared-from-climate

... nobody does shit.

[DarrinS]

Filled my tanks before this happened. Saw it coming.

[DarrinS]

More reason the get the State credit and buy electric :tu

Gotta charge those batteries with something.

[ElNono]

Electric cars are still too expensive, and too inefficient. How am I supposed to drive from Texas to Michigan and back in a Tesla? Where are all the EV station ports I can go to along the interstates in order to charge my EV in less than 10 minutes?

uh? Looks like you've never driven a Tesla... you program point A to point B and it will route you including any stops to charge your car. It does take ~20 mins to charge for 200 miles (varies by vehicle). It's actually pretty well thought out.

But we're talking California anyways, there's charging stations everywhere in this state.

[DarrinS]

uh? Looks like you've never driven a Tesla... you program point A to point B and it will route you including any stops to charge your car. It does take ~20 mins to charge for 200 miles (varies by vehicle). It's actually pretty well thought out.

But we're talking California anyways, there's charging stations everywhere in this state.

Not here

[ElNono]

Gotta charge those batteries with something.

Not sure what you're referring to... electric motors are about twice as efficient as combustion engines.

[ElNono]

Not here

Not sure where 'here' is, but you'll join the rest of the advanced world sooner or later, tbh :tu

[Millennial_Messiah]

uh? Looks like you've never driven a Tesla... you program point A to point B and it will route you including any stops to charge your car. It does take ~20 mins to charge for 200 miles (varies by vehicle). It's actually pretty well thought out.

But we're talking California anyways, there's charging stations everywhere in this state.
that's not the point. if you're trying to traverse the entire lower-48 in one vehicle. 20 minutes to charge for 200 miles is a bit inefficient... but how much does it cost?

[DarrinS]

Not sure what you're referring to... electric motors are about twice as efficient as combustion engines.

They get charged by the grid, which is FUELED by something.

[DarrinS]

Keep mining that lithium

[ElNono]

They get charged by the grid, which is FUELED by something.

The grid is fueled by a lot of sources, including renewables. 1/3 of the grid here in California is fed by renewables, and the biggest contribution is from natural gas.

But even in the event of being supplied by dirty sources, the fact that you only need half the amount of energy to power the same engine with near zero emissions means substantial pollution reduction and better cost per energy unit.

[SnakeBoy]

More reason the get the State credit and buy electric :tu

Hey poors, just buy a Tesla

Todays libs smh

[ElNono]

that's not the point. if you're trying to traverse the entire lower-48 in one vehicle. 20 minutes to charge for 200 miles is a bit inefficient... but how much does it cost?

Of course it's the point, the OP was talking specifically about gas prices in one town in California.

And what you mean in how long it takes to charge is time consuming, not inefficient. Tier 3 charging stations are the so far the best and do 3 to 20 miles per minute, depending on the station and car. It'll get better over time.

As far as cost:

A 2018 study from the University of Michigan's Transportation Research Institute found that electric vehicles cost less than half as much to operate as gas-powered cars. The average cost to operate an EV in the United States is $485 per year, while the average for a gasoline-powered vehicle is $1,117

https://www.energysage.com/electric-vehicles/costs-and-benefits-evs/evs-vs-fossil-fuel-vehicles/

Which is in-line with electric engines being roughly twice as efficient as combustion engines (~80% vs ~40%).

[ElNono]

Hey poors, just buy a Tesla

Todays libs smh

Or Ford, or Chevy... plenty of options these days....

[DarrinS]

The grid is fueled by a lot of sources, including renewables. 1/3 of the grid here in California is fed by renewables, and the biggest contribution is from natural gas.

But even in the event of being supplied by dirty sources, the fact that you only need half the amount of energy to power the same engine with near zero emissions means substantial pollution reduction and better cost per energy unit.


Now, imagine everyone in California owning a Tesla.

[Millennial_Messiah]

Of course it's the point, the OP was talking specifically about gas prices in one town in California.

And what you mean in how long it takes to charge is time consuming, not inefficient. Tier 3 charging stations are the so far the best and do 3 to 20 miles per minute, depending on the station and car. It'll get better over time.

As far as cost:

A 2018 study from the University of Michigan's Transportation Research Institute found that electric vehicles cost less than half as much to operate as gas-powered cars. The average cost to operate an EV in the United States is $485 per year, while the average for a gasoline-powered vehicle is $1,117

https://www.energysage.com/electric-vehicles/costs-and-benefits-evs/evs-vs-fossil-fuel-vehicles/

Which is in-line with electric engines being roughly twice as efficient as combustion engines (~80% vs ~40%).

2018.... tee-hee. Gas was half as expensive in 2018 as it is now.

Also, stopping every 200 miles for 20 minutes is inefficient compared to stopping for 5-7 minutes every 500 miles in my Hybrid Camry (which includes filling the tank, taking a piss and putting ice in my drink).

[ElNono]

2018.... tee-hee. Gas was half as expensive in 2018 as it is now.

Also, stopping every 200 miles for 20 minutes is inefficient compared to stopping for 5-7 minutes every 500 miles in my Hybrid Camry (which includes filling the tank, taking a piss and putting ice in my drink).

Which would make the savings twice as big... every time gas goes up it makes electric more appealing.

Hybrid is great too, great savings there as well, which also mitigate gas prices.

[ElNono]

Now, imagine everyone in California owning a Tesla.

What's with the fixation on Tesla? Lots of companies doing EVs and Hybrid these days. Hybrids now also have EV only mode as well.

I think Ford is debuting their F-150 EV soon too... Lots of options out there.

[DarrinS]

What's with the fixation on Tesla? Lots of companies doing EVs and Hybrid these days. Hybrids now also have EV only mode as well.

I think Ford is debuting their F-150 EV soon too... Lots of options out there.

Now, imagine everyone in California has EVs.

[ElNono]

Now, imagine everyone in California has EVs.

ok? is this like what you said about incandescent lightbulbs :lol

It won't happen overnight, but the tech is good enough right now and only getting better. Automakers are onboard as well, they get to sell you new cars.

And California already put a date on it, we'll see if it sticks:
https://www.gov.ca.gov/2020/09/23/governor-newsom-announces-california-will-phase-out-gasoline-powered-cars-drastically-reduce-demand-for-fossil-fuel-in-californias-fight-against-climate-change/

[leemajors]

Now imagine there aren't conflict minerals in regular automobiles

[boutons_deux]

Gas prices are, like bank fees, profit-making decisions

People driving gas guzzlers like SUVs and pickups.



https://mail.google.com/mail/u/0?ui=2&ik=c5ffe9fe07&attid=0.1&permmsgid=msg-a:r4739336000307421495&th=17ca818c4d5fdcc1&view=fimg&fur=ip&sz=s0-l75-ft&attbid=ANGjdJ9MBB9chKDYzJwbTeWXdjClZtqsFamp2JhWMRu onKzxtS9G8dccA5wyqRqfSyx60Qv2LDSwzuD73hEVbXBjYAF1-521iu9UrTXeJdPXpc-0IH-qxccRBjsuNUg&disp=emb&realattid=ii_kv2dvb8v0

https://mail.google.com/mail/u/0?ui=2&ik=c5ffe9fe07&attid=0.2&permmsgid=msg-a:r-2662692968001207993&th=17ca8208b5c73f76&view=fimg&fur=ip&sz=s0-l75-ft&attbid=ANGjdJ-OTI1BjjIQtqN4xupmZ6609-9InArJogAlxylo4d_H2UBIQqFefIuEODLlV6weSlQNu5yuwqJ8 qS78rx2u2EYwI7vlkfKvKTS2SR7YphZ9sMj7x9UPIoO_aaQ&disp=emb&realattid=ii_kv2e6a7l1

[Blake]

Filled my tanks before this happened. Saw it coming.

Hey you saved about $15? Nice work!

[Millennial_Messiah]

Which would make the savings twice as big... every time gas goes up it makes electric more appealing.

Hybrid is great too, great savings there as well, which also mitigate gas prices.
I still pay way too much @ 46-48 summer MPG / 39-42 winter MPG.

The Hybrid Camry (2020) advertises up to 54 MPG, but that's bullshit, that's only in perfect climate conditions and only going downhill and 50-65 MPH... anything 70 MPH and up is going to cost gas mileage. Cooler weather? Less gas mileage. Going uphill? That tank is gonna plummet. Get anything less than 87 at the pump (the standard is usually 85 for most western states)? That MPG is gonna plummet.


Gas prices are, like bank fees, profit-making decisions

People driving gas guzzlers like SUVs and pickups.

I drive a Hybrid Camry and have paid over $8700 this year in gas alone...


Hybrids now also have EV only mode as well.

:lol yeah, you can go up to 22 MPH on EV only mode... works great for traversing parking lots, parking garages etc. but that's about it... if you hit the accelerator too hard, go over ~23 MPH, or the hybrid battery gets low, your EV only mode will die and you'll be back on full gas...

[MultiTroll]

Electric cars are still too expensive, and too inefficient. How am I supposed to drive from Texas to Michigan and back in a Tesla? Where are all the EV station ports I can go to along the interstates in order to charge my EV in less than 10 minutes?
Maybe you could rub one out and make up another fantasy chick for ST while your car charged?

https://images.fastcompany.com/upload/charging-station-map.jpg

[Blake]

The Hybrid Camry (2020) advertises up to 54 MPG, but that's bullshit, that's only in perfect climate conditions and only going downhill and 50-65 MPH... anything 70 MPH and up is going to cost gas mileage. Cooler weather? Less gas mileage. Going uphill? That tank is gonna plummet. Get anything less than 87 at the pump (the standard is usually 85 for most western states)? That MPG is gonna plummet.


I drive a Hybrid Camry and have paid over $8700 this year in gas alone...

:lol sure dude

[Millennial_Messiah]

Maybe you could rub one out and make up another fantasy chick for ST while your car charged?

https://images.fastcompany.com/upload/charging-station-map.jpg
I don't travel just to "rub one out", tbh. I could do that any dumb old place. If I'm going out of state, I'm getting laid.

[spurraider21]

They get charged by the grid, which is FUELED by something.
a) more efficiently than combustion engines
b) grids can also be more or less efficient depending on how much of a given grid's energy comes from sources less shitty than coal

[spurraider21]

The grid is fueled by a lot of sources, including renewables. 1/3 of the grid here in California is fed by renewables, and the biggest contribution is from natural gas.

But even in the event of being supplied by dirty sources, the fact that you only need half the amount of energy to power the same engine with near zero emissions means substantial pollution reduction and better cost per energy unit.
they will never acknowledge or address this

[spurraider21]

Now, imagine everyone in California has EVs.
would be a fantastic upgrade, environmentally

charge it at home using solar panels, power wall, etc

[RandomGuy]

:lol sure dude

8700 bucks, divided by say... 3 bucks a gallon, is 2900 gallons. Times 43 miles per gallon and that is 124,700 miles.

Fiddle with some of the assumptions and that is still at least 90k miles.

Do a bit of calculating... 10 months with 22 workdays each... roughly 411 miles per workday, minimum

Not too far outside the realm of plausibility, but likely something of an exaggeration, IMO.

[RandomGuy]

would be a fantastic upgrade, environmentally

charge it at home using solar panels, power wall, etc

Ran the numbers for how many panels it would take to provide the energy for a car, and it was quite a bit. Panels have gotten better, and the power wall could compensate a bit of that, charging during days where the car isn't driven.

Cool thing about solar panels: They don't wear out.

I think this is going to be my next vehicle scheme, i.e. powerwall/pv/EV

No more oil changes, or replacing transmissions, etc. A vastly simpler vehicle.

[ElNono]

I still pay way too much @ 46-48 summer MPG / 39-42 winter MPG.

The Hybrid Camry (2020) advertises up to 54 MPG, but that's bullshit, that's only in perfect climate conditions and only going downhill and 50-65 MPH... anything 70 MPH and up is going to cost gas mileage. Cooler weather? Less gas mileage. Going uphill? That tank is gonna plummet. Get anything less than 87 at the pump (the standard is usually 85 for most western states)? That MPG is gonna plummet.

I drive a Hybrid Camry and have paid over $8700 this year in gas alone...

Because hybrid is not optimal. You're still using a combustion engine to turn gas into electricity. You do get some substantial savings though.

IIRC, the very absolute best combustion engine cars top out at 36-39 MPG (the latter being super small cars you likely wouldn't want to drive anyways) and you're also getting the quick refill convenience, so it's a middle ground.


:lol yeah, you can go up to 22 MPH on EV only mode... works great for traversing parking lots, parking garages etc. but that's about it... if you hit the accelerator too hard, go over ~23 MPH, or the hybrid battery gets low, your EV only mode will die and you'll be back on full gas...

The Prius can do up to 60-84 MPH (depending on the model), so this is really all about the particular car and battery configuration.

[spurraider21]

Ran the numbers for how many panels it would take to provide the energy for a car, and it was quite a bit. Panels have gotten better, and the power wall could compensate a bit of that, charging during days where the car isn't driven.

Cool thing about solar panels: They don't wear out.

I think this is going to be my next vehicle scheme, i.e. powerwall/pv/EV

No more oil changes, or replacing transmissions, etc. A vastly simpler vehicle.
i mean if you wanted to go 100% solar yeah its not feasible everywhere. but even if its just contributing... thats good enough. and yeah powerwalls are ideal because you charge up during the day when your car isn't home

[spurraider21]

8700 bucks, divided by say... 3 bucks a gallon, is 2900 gallons. Times 43 miles per gallon and that is 124,700 miles.

Fiddle with some of the assumptions and that is still at least 90k miles.

Do a bit of calculating... 10 months with 22 workdays each... roughly 411 miles per workday, minimum

Not too far outside the realm of plausibility, but likely something of an exaggeration, IMO.
411 miles per workday "not too far outside the realm of possibility"

:lol what?

not to mention if he's actually tacking on 100k miles per year, even a few less MPG would add substantial cost

[RandomGuy]

i mean if you wanted to go 100% solar yeah its not feasible everywhere. but even if its just contributing... thats good enough. and yeah powerwalls are ideal because you charge up during the day when your car isn't home

Not feasible everywhere, but it would practically eliminate one of the largest sources of CO2 emissions. :tu

I would also make the value of the oil still in the ground plummet like a fucking rock. Oil majors would take a huge asset write off at levels that would probably threaten their solvency, IMPO. Might be interesting to dig up a 10-k and test hypothesis.

[RandomGuy]

411 miles per workday "not too far outside the realm of possibility"

:lol what?

My commute is 60 miles each way. 120 miles.

Some types of work drive for a living. 400 is not that far from the kinds of miles generated by those kinds of work. One or two long-haul trips for vacations would make that 400 per workday into 350. very feasible.

[spurraider21]

My commute is 60 miles each way. 120 miles.

Some types of work drive for a living. 400 is not that far from the kinds of miles generated by those kinds of work. One or two long-haul trips for vacations would make that 400 per workday into 350. very feasible.
a 60 mile commute is not that typical, and 400 miles per day is more than tripling that. and i think andy claimed to work in tech of sorts? not a job that would require distance driving

[RandomGuy]

i mean if you wanted to go 100% solar yeah its not feasible everywhere. but even if its just contributing... thats good enough. and yeah powerwalls are ideal because you charge up during the day when your car isn't home

Add in plans for next-gen Electric turbo prop planes:
https://www.ainonline.com/aviation-news/air-transport/2021-10-13/embraer-ceo-touts-green-credentials-e-jets-future-propjet

Most intriguing twin engine turbo prop
https://electrek.co/2021/07/01/eviation-tesla-of-aircraft-production-version-unveiled-range/

Cool thing about this tech is the super-low operating costs, if it pans out. Could revolutionize short range commuter routes.

Even if they fall short, but just get close to their cost projections it will be a game changer. Small, very quiet short hop planes that need only tiny runways.

Unlike self-driving vehicles... self-flying planes are already flying.

Take out labor costs for pilots, and have a fraction of the maint. and fuel costs? holy fuckballs.

[RandomGuy]

a 60 mile commute is not that typical, and 400 miles per day is more than tripling that. and i think andy claimed to work in tech of sorts? not a job that would require distance driving

If it is driving from call to call over a wide area. 400 miles is too much on that basis.

Bookkeepers guess: his figure includes maintenance charges like oil changes. Shave out a some of the starting money from that calc, and miles per work day drop off the other end. if he is going by his CC statement and he forgot to take out drinks bought at the gas station or snacks...even more. He isn't lying, just not very careful with what he included. Sloppy, like most people when categorizing expenses.

[spurraider21]

If it is driving from call to call over a wide area. 400 miles is too much on that basis.

Bookkeepers guess: his figure includes maintenance charges like oil changes. Shave out a some of the starting money from that calc, and miles per work day drop off the other end. if he is going by his CC statement and he forgot to take out drinks bought at the gas station or snacks...even more. He isn't lying, just not very careful with what he included. Sloppy, like most people when categorizing expenses.
the best guess is he's talking out of his ass like he always does, and its pathological. just put him on ignore

[Adam Lambert]

That pump needs a sticker

https://empowerwisconsin.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/10/Biden-I-did-that-.jpeg

$3.29/gallon gas, wow, better go invade another Middle Eastern country I guess.

[RandomGuy]

the right-wing propaganda machine made money convincing me that gas prices were somehow too high, and I am not smart enough to realize I am getting played for
fool

um... ok.

[RandomGuy]

$3.29/gallon gas, wow, better go invade another Middle Eastern country I guess.

It's the latest outrage de jour. Right wing media makes a shit-ton of money ginning up outrage, because facts and reasoned takes are boring.

I follow a few conservative groups on facebook, and thumb through fox "news" every few days. Always easy to see what ducks or Dupeboi will be posting about before they post it. Gas-prices popped up a week or so ago. :lol

[ElNono]

$3.29/gallon gas, wow, better go invade another Middle Eastern country I guess.

Don't get it either, tbh, the first to benefit from these prices are the shale areas like in Texas. Gives work to Americans as well.

I remember when these guys were all about energy independence...

[Blake]

411 miles per workday "not too far outside the realm of possibility"

:lol what?

not to mention if he's actually tacking on 100k miles per year, even a few less MPG would add substantial cost

Lol 400+ miles a day is at 7 days a week. 5 days would be about 600

[Ef-man]

Lol 400+ miles a day is at 7 days a week. 5 days would be about 600

Works if he is a trucker moving servers or computers around Texas but gives him no time as a tech.

Would have to include overtime as transport regulations would dictate how many hours he could drive per day.

[SnakeBoy]

It's the latest outrage de jour. Right wing media makes a shit-ton of money ginning up outrage, because facts and reasoned takes are boring.

I follow a few conservative groups on facebook, and thumb through fox "news" every few days. Always easy to see what ducks or Dupeboi will be posting about before they post it. Gas-prices popped up a week or so ago. :lol

It's quicker to just look on texags politics forum

[SnakeBoy]

Don't get it either, tbh, the first to benefit from these prices are the shale areas like in Texas. Gives work to Americans as well.

I remember when these guys were all about energy independence...

What don't you get? Historically Presidents get worried when oil gets over $80 and Biden is getting worried. A lot of people are forecasting $100 bbl and some even $150 - $200 bbl, either would be a disaster for Dems. Whether it happens or not, there is no downside to the GOP starting det narrative now.

[Blake]

Works if he is a trucker moving servers or computers around Texas but gives him no time as a tech.

Would have to include overtime as transport regulations would dictate how many hours he could drive per day.

He could be hauling stuff in a trailer hitched to the hybrid Camry

[Ef-man]

He could be hauling stuff in a trailer hitched to the hybrid Camry

:lmao

[ElNono]

What don't you get? Historically Presidents get worried when oil gets over $80 and Biden is getting worried. A lot of people are forecasting $100 bbl and some even $150 - $200 bbl, either would be a disaster for Dems. Whether it happens or not, there is no downside to the GOP starting det narrative now.

Historically we didn't have the means/tech to replace our foreign dependency on oil or alternatives to it. That has changed, and will continue to change.

I do understand this is about the political gotchas, not an actual real drama.

[Millennial_Messiah]

8700 bucks, divided by say... 3 bucks a gallon, is 2900 gallons. Times 43 miles per gallon and that is 124,700 miles.

Fiddle with some of the assumptions and that is still at least 90k miles.

Do a bit of calculating... 10 months with 22 workdays each... roughly 411 miles per workday, minimum

Not too far outside the realm of plausibility, but likely something of an exaggeration, IMO.

try $4.29/gallon and a rough average of 41 mpg even with hybrid car, factoring in summer and winter.

[Blake]

try $4.29/gallon and a rough average of 41 mpg even with hybrid car, factoring in summer and winter.

How do you find time to post here

[Millennial_Messiah]

Works if he is a trucker moving servers or computers around Texas but gives him no time as a tech.

Would have to include overtime as transport regulations would dictate how many hours he could drive per day.

:lol I hardly ever drive for work anymore because of covid. Before covid though I would drive a roughly 80 mile commute per day sometimes... DFW is very spread out and rough.

But y'all are missing the main point... completely overlooking driving for pleasure and only factoring in driving for work... :lol

[Millennial_Messiah]

How do you find time to post here

My driving is in spurts. There's a lot of days I haven't posted on here... figure it out. Likely either driving, sleeping, or getting laid. Or out doing something with my best friend in Fort Worth (golfing, shooting, etc)

[koriwhat]

I remember when these guys were all about energy independence...

Yeah before Robinette shut everything down with his red tape... Red like China!

[Ef-man]

Red China’s economy is doing pretty good at the moment.

So joey is a Biden fan after all!

:tu

[koriwhat]

Red China’s economy is doing pretty good at the moment.

So joey is a Biden fan after all!

:tu

Actually it isn't especially their real estate market. If you just took 2 seconds to google it you'd know how wrong you are you fucking retard! Whose dumb fucking alt are you?

[Ef-man]

Actually it isn't especially their real estate market. If you just took 2 seconds to google it you'd know how wrong you are you fucking retard! Whose dumb fucking alt are you?

In 2008, our real estate market went sour too.

China is going through real estate speculation trouble now but over all production is great.

If Chinese government intervened, this would not be in discussion.

Oh, and I am the alt between your ears, continue living with it. :lol

[koriwhat]

In 2008, our real estate market went sour too.

China is going through real estate speculation trouble now but over all production is great.

If Chinese government intervened, this would not be in discussion.

Oh, and I am the alt between your ears, continue living with it. :lol

So you lied in your last post then? Look over here and not over there... Goal posts constantly moving with you rejects.

[ChumpDumper]

Yeah before Robinette shut everything down with his red tape... Red like China!

How did he shut it down in March 2020?

[Ef-man]

So you lied in your last post then? Look over here and not over there... Goal posts constantly moving with you rejects.

Did you lie when you said Joe “shut everything down with his red tape?”

[koriwhat]

Did you lie when you said Joe “shut everything down with his red tape?”

NOPE you silly puto.

[Millennial_Messiah]

How did he shut it down in March 2020?

Astral projection

[monosylab1k]

Actually it isn't especially their real estate market. If you just took 2 seconds to google it you'd know how wrong you are you fucking retard! Whose dumb fucking alt are you?

He’s an alt of Joseph Kony, better go hide!

[SnakeBoy]

Historically we didn't have the means/tech to replace our foreign dependency on oil or alternatives to it. That has changed, and will continue to change.

I do understand this is about the political gotchas, not an actual real drama.

It's about both in this case. I mean we don't have the "tech" to replace our dependency on oil in the near term at least. We can replace foreign oil with domestic production but that requires a lot of capital. Overall shale has been a capital destruction machine and since 2019 wall street hasn't been willing to throw more capital at it and at least for this year shale producers have been showing restraint on production as well. We'll have to see what happens in 2022 but oil at $100+ would be real actual drama for the economy. I don't claim to know what's going to happen because the oil market is complicated and hard to predict but at least in the near term it looks like there will be more pain at the pump

U.S. Oil Hub Emptying to Levels Last Seen When Crude Cost $100
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-10-21/u-s-oil-stockpiles-are-plunging-while-energy-crisis-drives-up-demand

[pgardn]

It has to be fueled by something.


They get charged by the grid, which is FUELED by something.

Have you heard of wind turning a turbine?
Lithium is NOT fuel.
Have you heard of water running downhill turning a turbine?

I know you have heard of natural gas heating water to turn a turbine?
do you know what a turbine is?

Have you heard of the photoelectric cells charging batteries?

[monosylab1k]

:lmao DarrinS is already stupid when he’s sober, but then goes full blown retard when he drunk-posts here.

[ElNono]

It's about both in this case. I mean we don't have the "tech" to replace our dependency on oil in the near term at least. We can replace foreign oil with domestic production but that requires a lot of capital. Overall shale has been a capital destruction machine and since 2019 wall street hasn't been willing to throw more capital at it and at least for this year shale producers have been showing restraint on production as well. We'll have to see what happens in 2022 but oil at $100+ would be real actual drama for the economy. I don't claim to know what's going to happen because the oil market is complicated and hard to predict but at least in the near term it looks like there will be more pain at the pump

U.S. Oil Hub Emptying to Levels Last Seen When Crude Cost $100
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-10-21/u-s-oil-stockpiles-are-plunging-while-energy-crisis-drives-up-demand

Shale was in full swing back in the Barry days, and that's because barrels were this expensive and it was profitable... I recall some posters cheering about being energy independent (without giving that administration any credit for it). The government back then was also heavily investing in renewables.

What happened is we ended up with an administration that catered to terrorists like the Saudis and in exchange we got cheap gas. But it's a long term mistake. High oil prices benefit those terror states, Russia, Venezuela, etc.

I expect high oil prices to continue as the worldwide economy ramps up again post-pandemic. It's not just oil, but a lot of things.

But high oil prices also make alternatives much more attractive, so let's see how long OPEC wants to play that game.

[pgardn]

:lmao DarrinS (https://www.spurstalk.com/forums/member.php?u=2042) is already stupid when he’s sober, but then goes full blown retard when he drunk-posts here.


:lol

This is something else that should be taught in school somewhere. People, especially in cities, don’t understand the basics of how we get and use energy to “run” all the things around them. It should not take a hurricane or deep freeze for people to start to think about this stuff. And the RV guy in the middle of nowhere, who becomes landlocked stuck in place should not think propane is some mysterious substance.

It seems all the gas price stuff that continually pops up on this forum to determine the rating of every president lacks very basic understanding. The market stuff, is more difficult. But some basic energy understanding to begin with maybe? Would help.

Electricity seems to be a mystery to many. Plug something in or get a battery then, end of story.... It worked.

Aside:

(This then leads to nurses claiming they are magnetic while trying to stick any small metal object to their head. And the Ohio legislature listens to the amazing discovery... we don’t need more derpage)

[DarrinS]

https://www.nhm.ac.uk/press-office/press-releases/leading-scientists-set-out-resource-challenge-of-meeting-net-zer.html

[DarrinS]

This is something else that should be taught in school somewhere. People, especially in cities, don’t understand the basics of how we get and use energy to “run” all the things around them.

Yeah, most dems are stupid. :lmao

[monosylab1k]

:lmao hungover Darrin back trying to save face.

[pgardn]

Yeah, most dems are stupid. :lmao

So as an outsider, what is your perspective on intelligence?

[pgardn]

a touché' will be in order Darrin.

[ElNono]

https://www.nhm.ac.uk/press-office/press-releases/leading-scientists-set-out-resource-challenge-of-meeting-net-zer.html

Some goals as aspirational, tbh... That said, there's no doubt that's where the UK (and the rest of the world) is going, and honestly, very difficult to know nowadays what battery tech will look like 30 years from now.

That's an area in heavy research right now that goes beyond cars.

[Trill Clinton]

Nono put in work in here. Salute.

[koriwhat]

He’s an alt of Joseph Kony, better go hide!

You sit here and continue to cheerlead on your boyfriend as if your fat ass can't come visit me yourself. What's stopping you FATTY? For real though? You going to man up already or continue to fluff JK endlessly like the little bitch that you are? :tu

[Joseph Kony]

koriwhat is my bitch

[Blake]

You sit here and continue to cheerlead on your boyfriend as if your fat ass can't come visit me yourself. What's stopping you FATTY? For real though? You going to man up already or continue to fluff JK endlessly like the little bitch that you are? :tu

Why do you talk so much shit and then whine when someone returns it?

[monosylab1k]

You sit here and continue to cheerlead on your boyfriend as if your fat ass can't come visit me yourself. What's stopping you FATTY? For real though? You going to man up already or continue to fluff JK endlessly like the little bitch that you are? :tu


koriwhat is my bitch
:lmao

[koriwhat]

:lmao

It's always weak males like yall that pat each other on the back over doing nothing whatsoever. IRL it's a different story with bitch males like yourself Mono. You and others doxxed me yet none of yall have shown yalls face here at my place. JK claimed he'd show up until my actual shop address was doxxed and then he made excuses as to why he won't show up but continues to act like he's not the bitch that he truly is. BD24 claimed to have come to my shop but none of that ever happened and he sits back still patting himself on the back because that's what bitch males like yall do.

Yall talk mad shit online in the comfort of yalls house/apt/whatever knowing damn well yall are all too pussy to do anything irl. Yall are boring af, lame af, and I hope one day you all run into the wrong dude who will smash your face into the concrete. :tu

[monosylab1k]

It's always weak males like yall that pat each other on the back over doing nothing whatsoever. IRL it's a different story with bitch males like yourself Mono. You and others doxxed me yet none of yall have shown yalls face here at my place. JK claimed he'd show up until my actual shop address was doxxed and then he made excuses as to why he won't show up but continues to act like he's not the bitch that he truly is. BD24 claimed to have come to my shop but none of that ever happened and he sits back still patting himself on the back because that's what bitch males like yall do.

Yall talk mad shit online in the comfort of yalls house/apt/whatever knowing damn well yall are all too pussy to do anything irl. Yall are boring af, lame af, and I hope one day you all run into the wrong dude who will smash your face into the concrete. :tu

I never doxxed you. Try again, beta.

[Leetonidas]

Another diary entry of emo angst lol

[Blake]

It's always weak males like yall that pat each other on the back over doing nothing whatsoever. IRL it's a different story with bitch males like yourself Mono. You and others doxxed me yet none of yall have shown yalls face here at my place. JK claimed he'd show up until my actual shop address was doxxed and then he made excuses as to why he won't show up but continues to act like he's not the bitch that he truly is. BD24 claimed to have come to my shop but none of that ever happened and he sits back still patting himself on the back because that's what bitch males like yall do.

Yall talk mad shit online in the comfort of yalls house/apt/whatever knowing damn well yall are all too pussy to do anything irl. Yall are boring af, lame af, and I hope one day you all run into the wrong dude who will smash your face into the concrete. :tu











https://pics.me.me/i-act-like-i-dont-care-but-deep-inside-it-22750088.png

[ElNono]

Nono put in work in here. Salute.

Frankly, I was doubtful about this for a number of years as well until pretty much all automakers went onboard, especially American ones.

You can thank California and it's regulations for this as well, tbh...

https://www.statista.com/statistics/196010/total-number-of-registered-automobiles-in-the-us-by-state/

[BackHome]

As gas prices get higher by the day you will see companies pass that shipping increase to there customers so basically everything will end up costing more impacting the poor and the middle class the most. You know shit is getting out of hand when you go to Taco Bell and it’s costing you over $20 to feed two people.

[ChumpDumper]

:lol WTF are you eating at Taco Bell?

[ElNono]

As gas prices get higher by the day you will see companies pass that shipping increase to there customers so basically everything will end up costing more impacting the poor and the middle class the most. You know shit is getting out of hand when you go to Taco Bell and it’s costing you over $20 to feed two people.

I mean, it's shit food and I haven't had Taco Bell in ages, but that's cheap! Plus I thought they had $5 deals...

[ChumpDumper]

I mean if you're hard up you can a free fancy chicken sandwich every day this month at McDonalds if you spend a dollar on something else like a drink.

[Ef-man]

:lol WTF are you eating at Taco Bell?

Obviously, nothing but the best that taco bell has to offer for two people, especially when you want to break up with them.

Relationship kiss of death.

:tu

[Blake]

Lol every now and then I get that craving for Taco Hell. Then I eat it and remember why it's been a year since I've eaten it

[Spurminator]

Fast food has been getting more expensive for the past two years. It's not a recent thing.

[Millennial_Messiah]

Obviously, nothing but the best that taco bell has to offer for two people, especially when you want to break up with them.

Relationship kiss of death.

:tu

I got laid after a late night Taco Bell dinner in La Porte, Indiana this summer. 3 Doritos Locos tacos was apparently enough for my body to produce enough semen to have the most mind blowing sex of my life... twice in 10 hours.

[spurraider21]

Fast food has been getting more expensive for the past two years. It's not a recent thing.
Yeah. Carls Jr had to abandon the Six Dollar Burger when they started charging more than $6 for them :lol

[Ef-man]

I got laid after a late night Taco Bell dinner in La Porte, Indiana this summer. 3 Doritos Locos tacos was apparently enough for my body to produce enough semen to have the most mind blowing sex of my life... twice in 10 hours.

Expect a Poster B, with fat hands, to ask if your date was a tranny and if not, why not?

[ElNono]

Fast food has been getting more expensive for the past two years. It's not a recent thing.

All that said, if you can't even afford Taco Bell, you probably need to be looking for another job...

[baseline bum]

I never doxxed you. Try again, beta.

LOL calftats hopes you run into his boss that beat his ass

[baseline bum]

Yeah. Carls Jr had to abandon the Six Dollar Burger when they started charging more than $6 for them :lol

Man I got to like Carl's Jr in Cali, but in San Antonio every time one opens it's awesome for the first 3 months and then degrades to Jack in the Box level.

[spurraider21]

Man I got to like Carl's Jr in Cali, but in San Antonio every time one opens it's awesome for the first 3 months and then degrades to Jack in the Box level.
there was one on campus at UCLA... good stuff.

out here in VA they're called Hardees. havent been in one though.

[baseline bum]

Fast food has been getting more expensive for the past two years. It's not a recent thing.

Fucking anything with beef has gone way up ever since the 2012 drought here.

[baseline bum]

there was one on campus at UCLA... good stuff.

out here in VA they're called Hardees. havent been in one though.

Wonder if it's the same menu at Hardees. Shit my goto if I ate on campus was Panda in Ackerman. Though mostly I'd prefer waiting until after I was done with classes going to Westwood for In N Out, Fatburger, Lamonica's, or Enzo's... or Diddy Riese lol. Glad to see they're all still in business.

[spurraider21]

Is it the same menu at Hardees? Shit my goto if I ate on campus was Panda in Ackerman. Though mostly I'd prefer waiting until after I was done with classes going to Westwood for In N Out, Fatburger, Lamonica's, or Enzo's... or Diddy Riese lol. Glad to see they're all still in business.
from my understanding its the same menu, but i havent stepped foot in one.

there is still the panda at top floor of ackerman, along with sbarro, rubios, and some other stuff. the floor directly below that had a carls jr and taco bell when i was there

if i was walking off campus into westwood yeah In N Out was the go-to. but there was also Fat Sals for drunk nights. fatburger another option, but dno why id go there over in n out

[baseline bum]

from my understanding its the same menu, but i havent stepped foot in one.

there is still the panda at top floor of ackerman, along with sbarro, rubios, and some other stuff. the floor directly below that had a carls jr and taco bell when i was there

Man I just looked up Diddy Riese to see if I could get some chocolate white chocolate shipped and I see in big letters they suspended their shipping for now :pctoss

[baseline bum]

if i was walking off campus into westwood yeah In N Out was the go-to. but there was also Fat Sals for drunk nights. fatburger another option, but dno why id go there over in n out

In N Out has way better shakes but Fatburger fries are way better. For the burgers they were about equal in my eyes, just whichever I was more in the mood for. Though when I lived out there the Fatburger in Westwood was awesome, perfectly cooked every single time, while the one on the other side of the 405 on Wilshire sucked.

[Millennial_Messiah]

Expect a Poster B, with fat hands, to ask if your date was a tranny and if not, why not?

Definitely a woman with a legitimate vagina and she had 3 daughters.

[ElNono]

In N Out has way better shakes but Fatburger fries are way better. For the burgers they were about equal in my eyes, just whichever I was more in the mood for. Though when I lived out there the Fatburger in Westwood was awesome, perfectly cooked every single time, while the one on the other side of the 405 on Wilshire sucked.

I’m favoring Shake Shack burgers these days…

[ducks]

So when will semi trucks get to be electric ?
People need things semi trucks bring to stores ?

[ElNono]

So when will semi trucks get to be electric ?
People need things semi trucks bring to stores ?

https://www.ford.com/trucks/f150/f150-lightning/2022/

[ElNono]

https://www.motortrend.com/news/toyota-ev-pickup-truck-tacoma-tundra-preview/amp/

[ducks]

https://www.ford.com/trucks/f150/f150-lightning/2022/

Damm you are a fool
Semi truck not f150!

[ducks]

https://www.motortrend.com/news/toyota-ev-pickup-truck-tacoma-tundra-preview/amp/
Damm you are a fool
I said semi trucks not a small truck !

[ElNono]

I thought you meant truck… never mind

Big trucks will probably stick with ultra clean diesel for now. Haven’t heard plans of electric/hybrid trucks yet

[baseline bum]

I’m favoring Shake Shack burgers these days…

They're pretty good too but In N Out is the same quality IMO at half the price

[ElNono]

They're pretty good too but In N Out is the same quality IMO at half the price

My biggest beef with In n Out are the long lines, tbh

[spurraider21]

In N Out has way better shakes but Fatburger fries are way better. For the burgers they were about equal in my eyes, just whichever I was more in the mood for. Though when I lived out there the Fatburger in Westwood was awesome, perfectly cooked every single time, while the one on the other side of the 405 on Wilshire sucked.
Fatburger is a solid fucking burger. But in n out is special. Agreed on fries, but just get animal fries tbh

I still think Habit is king when it comes to bang for buck. But they aren’t open late night like in n out

Also have a real soft spot for tommys and they’re open 24 hours

[baseline bum]

Fatburger is a solid fucking burger. But in n out is special. Agreed on fries, but just get animal fries tbh

I still think Habit is king when it comes to bang for buck. But they aren’t open late night like in n out

Also have a real soft spot for tommys and they’re open 24 hours

Sometimes the Kingburger would just hit the fucking spot, though I'd always tell them hold the relish. Hate anything sweet on a burger. No relish, no ketchup, no Big Mac copycat sauce, no Animal Style, no mayo, only sauce I want on a burger is mustard. Well, or chili if you consider that a sauce lol.

[ducks]

https://scontent-lax3-2.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.6435-9/fr/cp0/e15/q65/242893810_10216460880714111_2163579061188813282_n. jpg?_nc_cat=106&ccb=1-5&_nc_sid=8024bb&efg=eyJpIjoidCJ9&_nc_ohc=xcRlr-hfknEAX_9ePt8&_nc_ht=scontent-lax3-2.xx&oh=6d5aeeb1c8f0d5276ab019c388e184c9&oe=6198CB90

[spurraider21]

https://scontent-lax3-2.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.6435-9/fr/cp0/e15/q65/242893810_10216460880714111_2163579061188813282_n. jpg?_nc_cat=106&ccb=1-5&_nc_sid=8024bb&efg=eyJpIjoidCJ9&_nc_ohc=xcRlr-hfknEAX_9ePt8&_nc_ht=scontent-lax3-2.xx&oh=6d5aeeb1c8f0d5276ab019c388e184c9&oe=6198CB90
https://i.redd.it/upwethoirfx51.png

[ElNono]

https://i.redd.it/upwethoirfx51.png

:lol

[spurraider21]

They get charged by the grid, which is FUELED by something.
Wonder what other scenarios Darrin uses the “but they still need fuel” argument

hey, my Camry gets better gas mileage than a Sequoia.

yAh BuT iT sTiLl uSeS fUeL

[DMC]

Eventually it will be more feasible to own EV as the ability to refuel will increase. Right now trying to use them for travel for more than daily driving with night charging or workplace charging is challenging. With dino fuels you can top off in a few minutes compared to hours for EV, even if you have super charging which isn't widely available. Still worthwhile to own one if you're doing daily stuff an have another vehicle for longer trips.

[DMC]

Wonder what other scenarios Darrin uses the “but they still need fuel” argument

hey, my Camry gets better gas mileage than a Sequoia.

yAh BuT iT sTiLl uSeS fUeL

Who are you talking to? You quoted Darrin but then you seem to be talking to an audience.

Using silly tactics in your response doesn't illustrate you're mature enough to have a conversation about things.

Darrin was saying the fuel needed to power vehicles comes from power plants, and the more vehicles that need to be powered with electricity the more these plants need to run, and they were at capacity just doing normal home shit last year. You'd need to build more power plants to have fast charging if everyone decided to start using 100Amp charging. It's not going to happen but you cannot just compare fuel at the pump between cars and say one is that much better. It has to get energy from somewhere, just not at the gas pump.

[ChumpDumper]

It worked.

[spurraider21]

Who are you talking to? You quoted Darrin but then you seem to be talking to an audience.

Using silly tactics in your response doesn't illustrate you're mature enough to have a conversation about things.

Darrin was saying the fuel needed to power vehicles comes from power plants, and the more vehicles that need to be powered with electricity the more these plants need to run, and they were at capacity just doing normal home shit last year. You'd need to build more power plants to have fast charging if everyone decided to start using 100Amp charging. It's not going to happen but you cannot just compare fuel at the pump between cars and say one is that much better. It has to get energy from somewhere, just not at the gas pump.
he tried to make a snarky point implying that EVs are no greener than traditional combustion vehicles because they also require some form of fuel/energy

it was a very stupid point and deserved mockery

you think you're nobly defending the "little guys" like derp, calf tats, and darrin when really you're just one of them

[ElNono]

Eventually it will be more feasible to own EV as the ability to refuel will increase. Right now trying to use them for travel for more than daily driving with night charging or workplace charging is challenging. With dino fuels you can top off in a few minutes compared to hours for EV, even if you have super charging which isn't widely available. Still worthwhile to own one if you're doing daily stuff an have another vehicle for longer trips.

Agreed, I wouldn't have considered EV in another state, tbh... here I have EV chargers in the parking lot at the office, and there are EV chargers everywhere in the city.

Then again, after seeing the infrastructure here, it dawns on you that this works, and probably will be what the future looks like. Combustion engines have been around for a long time, and you really can't make them substantially more efficient.

On EVs the challenge is battery capacity, which is a difficult problem, but one where we've made consistent advances for years.

[pgardn]

Who are you talking to? You quoted Darrin but then you seem to be talking to an audience.

Using silly tactics in your response doesn't illustrate you're mature enough to have a conversation about things.

Darrin was saying the fuel needed to power vehicles comes from power plants, and the more vehicles that need to be powered with electricity the more these plants need to run, and they were at capacity just doing normal home shit last year. You'd need to build more power plants to have fast charging if everyone decided to start using 100Amp charging. It's not going to happen but you cannot just compare fuel at the pump between cars and say one is that much better. It has to get energy from somewhere, just not at the gas pump.

No he was not saying this. He was assuming energy must come from fuel. Do you consider wind fuel? Do you consider sunlight fuel?

This is not the way most people refer to fuel.
Dont tell us what he was saying.

[pgardn]

Agreed, I wouldn't have considered EV in another state, tbh... here I have EV chargers in the parking lot at the office, and there are EV chargers everywhere in the city.

Then again, after seeing the infrastructure here, it dawns on you that this works, and probably will be what the future looks like. Combustion engines have been around for a long time, and you really can't make them substantially more efficient.

On EVs the challenge is battery capacity, which is a difficult problem, but one where we've made consistent advances for years.

If you use the same route to work and know where you charge it you could use an EV if you have a plan.
But right now, it will most likely cost you more if you charge it commercially.

Internal combustion engines are drastically more efficient in big hauling machines and its going to take a big leap for batteries to change this. The capacity for batteries to hold enough energy and get smaller is tough. We cant end up with little bombs or something really dangerous it seems. That much energy in a small volume and mass gone wrong and turned into heat energy is worrisome. But I agree the research lies in this area to make it happen. 95% of new power capacity in Texas being readied for use is going to be wind, sun and batteries. And the oil companies are in on it because it will work.

[pgardn]

We will go kicking and screaming into renewables and the drill and burn baby burn will no longer be available to trigger the libs :rolleyes

[ElNono]

If you use the same route to work and know where you charge it you could use an EV if you have a plan.
But right now, it will most likely cost you more if you charge it commercially.

maybe? really depends on the state and basically the price of gas.

Another big difference as well is that you can charge your car at home overnight, and that opens the door to offsetting that cost via solar panels and the like.

There are literally many more possibilities.


Internal combustion engines are drastically more efficient in big hauling machines and its going to take a big leap for batteries to change this. The capacity for batteries to hold enough energy and get smaller is tough. We cant end up with little bombs or something really dangerous it seems. That much energy in a small volume and mass gone wrong and turned into heat energy is worrisome. But I agree the research lies in this area to make it happen. 95% of new power capacity in Texas being readied for use is going to be wind, sun and batteries. And the oil companies are in on it because it will work.

I'm less concerned with larger trucks, etc. If we get close to the point where those are the vast majority of users of diesel/gas, then that'd be good news and a great place to be.

[BackHome]

That won’t happen in our lifetime

[ElNono]

I'm in my 40s, I'm pretty sure it's going to happen in my lifetime, tbh... I do expect big cities to lead the way here though, with the usual dinosaur rural/oil-producing states being much more late as it's typical with innovation.

[pgardn]

maybe? really depends on the state and basically the price of gas.

Another big difference as well is that you can charge your car at home overnight, and that opens the door to offsetting that cost via solar panels and the like.

There are literally many more possibilities.



I'm less concerned with larger trucks, etc. If we get close to the point where those are the vast majority of users of diesel/gas, then that'd be good news and a great place to be.

In majority of states the price of charging an EV is more than the price of gas IF, you charge commercially and not at home. Also the dead driving "looking for a charging station" is a problem which is why a mentioned a known route to work etc...

Agree with the big hauling stuff. Merely pointing out hydrocarbons wont go away anytime soon. With as many cars as California gets stuck on major thoroughfares individual transportation via a combustion engine, its a loser in the long run, absolutely. imo I will definitely see more EV in my lifetime on the road than gas powered, Id put a bet on that.

[Ef-man]

I'm in my 40s, I'm pretty sure it's going to happen in my lifetime, tbh... I do expect big cities to lead the way here though, with the usual dinosaur rural/oil-producing states being much more late as it's typical with innovation.

Same people that cried when automobiles replaced horses crying about issues that no longer matter.

:cry muh horse stable jobs :cry
:cry muh horse manure cleaning jobs :cry
:cry muh food cover to protect against horse flies :cry
:cry muh farrier jobs :cry

[DMC]

he tried to make a snarky point implying that EVs are no greener than traditional combustion vehicles because they also require some form of fuel/energy

Was he wrong?


it was a very stupid point and deserved mockery

You seem to use that line of reasoning for a lot of shit, mostly shit no one asked your opinion about.


you think you're nobly defending the "little guys" like derp, calf tats, and darrin when really you're just one of them
Canta no llores.

[DMC]

No he was not saying this. He was assuming energy must come from fuel. Do you consider wind fuel? Do you consider sunlight fuel?

This is not the way most people refer to fuel.
Dont tell us what he was saying.
No one asked you, faggot.

[pgardn]

No one asked you, faggot.

I dont fkn care so eat me old man.

Dont tell us what Darrin was saying.
Its apparent to me he thought the real fuel for EV had to be hydrocarbons ultimately. Well it does NOT.

[spurraider21]

Was he wrong?

You seem to use that line of reasoning for a lot of shit, mostly shit no one asked your opinion about.

Canta no llores.
Yes he was very wrong

[Ef-man]

I dont fkn care so eat me old man.

Dont tell us what Darrin was saying.
Its apparent to me he thought the real fuel for EV had to be hydrocarbons ultimately. Well it does NOT.

Karrin should speak up and say whether he appreciates a ventriloquist with fat hands trying to tranny-splain what he said, tbh.

[DarrinS]

Yes he was very wrong

Everyone just needs to purchase solar panels and powerwalls.

Moar batteries

[DarrinS]

Just for the UK

"The metal resource needed to make all cars and vans electric by 2050 and all sales to be purely battery electric by 2035. To replace all UK-based vehicles today with electric vehicles (not including the LGV and HGV fleets), assuming they use the most resource-frugal next-generation NMC 811 batteries, would take 207,900 tonnes cobalt, 264,600 tonnes of lithium carbonate (LCE), at least 7,200 tonnes of neodymium and dysprosium, in addition to 2,362,500 tonnes copper. This represents, just under two times the total annual world cobalt production, nearly the entire world production of neodymium, three quarters the world’s lithium production and 12% of the world’s copper production during 2018. Even ensuring the annual supply of electric vehicles only, from 2035 as pledged, will require the UK to annually import the equivalent of the entire annual cobalt needs of European industry."

[spurraider21]

Everyone just needs to purchase solar panels and powerwalls.

Moar batteries
probably not economically viable for everyone. im glad some states like CA give big subsidies. having everybody get at least some of their energy via solar would be a great thing environmentally.

nobody denied that there are environmental drawbacks to making batteries. its still preferable to burning fossil fuels :tu

[spurraider21]

its as though people found a way to convert a quarter into a dollar, celebrating that they're making more money, and your retort is

"heh... you still had to spend a quarter, so it still costs you money"

[DarrinS]

its as though people found a way to convert a quarter into a dollar, celebrating that they're making more money, and your retort is

"heh... you still had to spend a quarter, so it still costs you money"


I don't think its practical for everyone to own EV.

[BackHome]

I'm in my 40s, I'm pretty sure it's going to happen in my lifetime, tbh... I do expect big cities to lead the way here though, with the usual dinosaur rural/oil-producing states being much more late as it's typical with innovation.

No it won't the amount of infrastructure needed to support all electric vehicles is staggering.
1. You would need thousands of rechargeable stations across the city and States.
2. You would need millions of meters and mini charging stations in peoples houses because it takes so long to charge vehicle.
3. You would need to additional power plants to meet this demand understanding most people will charge there vehicles over night so Solar and Wind not so good at night
4.You would need to spending millions on upgrading power lines to handle the demand
5. Battery techanalogy is still not there to support this type of demand - Also batteries are extremely toxic what and how are we going to to handle waste?
6. Your electric bill would sky rocket

[spurraider21]

I don't think its practical for everyone to own EV.
i dont think its currently practical given the prices and that most used cars on the market are not EV.

i think its something to strive for. good way to start would be to produce much more EVs, much less gas vehicles. shift the market. and more subsidies for people to buy electric.

i also recognize that its not as useful for people who are driving very long distances. doesnt have to be 100%. but should be maximized

[spurraider21]

No it won't the amount of infrastructure needed to support all electric vehicles is staggering.
1. You would need thousands of rechargeable stations across the city and States.
2. You would need millions of meters and mini charging stations in peoples houses because it takes so long to charge vehicle.
3. You would need to additional power plants to meet this demand understanding most people will charge there vehicles over night so Solar and Wind not so good at night
4.You would need to spending millions on upgrading power lines to handle the demand
5. Battery techanalogy is still not there to support this type of demand - Also batteries are extremely toxic what and how are we going to to handle waste?
6. Your electric bill would sky rocket
there's no way everybody is going to drive cars. think of the infrastructure we'd need, it's staggering! all the roads and highways. gas stations everywhere. parking lots everywhere. it will never happen.

[ElNono]

In majority of states the price of charging an EV is more than the price of gas IF, you charge commercially and not at home. Also the dead driving "looking for a charging station" is a problem which is why a mentioned a known route to work etc...

Agree with the big hauling stuff. Merely pointing out hydrocarbons wont go away anytime soon. With as many cars as California gets stuck on major thoroughfares individual transportation via a combustion engine, its a loser in the long run, absolutely. imo I will definitely see more EV in my lifetime on the road than gas powered, Id put a bet on that.

I think Tesla sort of set the standard when it comes to charging station anxiety, tbh, most other makers are following suit...

Not only is the car constantly telling you how much charge is left, it's also telling you which charging stations you can reach with what you have left, and will even give you directions to them.

It's a completely different concept from "we'll turn this light on when you have 30 miles left to drive", but until there's a much more widespread infrastructure, it's probably the right approach.

[ElNono]

Everyone just needs to purchase solar panels and powerwalls.

Moar batteries

Not sure what's funny/sarcastic about this, you'll be right in line once it saves you money. It already saves people money, only getting better.

[ElNono]

Just for the UK

"The metal resource needed to make all cars and vans electric by 2050 and all sales to be purely battery electric by 2035. To replace all UK-based vehicles today with electric vehicles (not including the LGV and HGV fleets), assuming they use the most resource-frugal next-generation NMC 811 batteries, would take 207,900 tonnes cobalt, 264,600 tonnes of lithium carbonate (LCE), at least 7,200 tonnes of neodymium and dysprosium, in addition to 2,362,500 tonnes copper. This represents, just under two times the total annual world cobalt production, nearly the entire world production of neodymium, three quarters the world’s lithium production and 12% of the world’s copper production during 2018. Even ensuring the annual supply of electric vehicles only, from 2035 as pledged, will require the UK to annually import the equivalent of the entire annual cobalt needs of European industry."

You already posted this, and I already mentioned we don't know what batteries will look like 30 years from now.

But it also starts from a crappy premise, which is "to replace all UK-based vehicles today with electric vehicles". Nobody is looking to replace all vehicles today. That's why it's a 30 year pledge.

Also, 811 is already an improvement over 622, which requires less Cobalt, which is expensive and harder to acquire. Better chemistry cathodes in the upcoming years are also not out of the question.

That's sort of the point with this tech, it's an area of active research because it helps not just EVs, but electronics in general. Apple is investing a ton on this as well for their phones, etc.

There's nothing else for combustion engines. You can't make them more efficient without breaking the laws of thermodynamics. It's a dead end.

[DarrinS]

i dont think its currently practical given the prices and that most used cars on the market are not EV.

i think its something to strive for. good way to start would be to produce much more EVs, much less gas vehicles. shift the market. and more subsidies for people to buy electric.

i also recognize that its not as useful for people who are driving very long distances. doesnt have to be 100%. but should be maximized


Its also not practical for people who drive infrequently, like me.

Back when I was commuting daily, I had a Prius. I hated that car, but it was efficient and reliable.

And, where I live now, I have to do occasional off-road driving. EV is not for me.

[spurraider21]

Its also not practical for people who drive infrequently, like me.

Back when I was commuting daily, I had a Prius. I hated that car, but it was efficient and reliable.

And, where I live now, I have to do occasional off-road driving. EV is not for me.
people who drive infrequently are lesser contributors anyway with respect to CO2 emissions. goal is to minimize. it doesnt have to be all or nothing.

[ElNono]

No it won't the amount of infrastructure needed to support all electric vehicles is staggering.
1. You would need thousands of rechargeable stations across the city and States.
2. You would need millions of meters and mini charging stations in peoples houses because it takes so long to charge vehicle.
3. You would need to additional power plants to meet this demand understanding most people will charge there vehicles over night so Solar and Wind not so good at night
4.You would need to spending millions on upgrading power lines to handle the demand
5. Battery techanalogy is still not there to support this type of demand - Also batteries are extremely toxic what and how are we going to to handle waste?
6. Your electric bill would sky rocket

1. There are already 43,000 public EV charging stations in the US. That's over 120,000+ outlets. And EV really hasn't taken completely off yet.
2. No you don't. Charging ports for home are cheap ($2k-$5k for a Level 2, and there are subsidies as well). They're not fast chargers like stations, but exploit the fact that most people can charge their car overnight for cheaper.
3. Largely depends on how much people need to charge their cars. We're now reaching ~500 miles range, that's slightly above combustion engines. Will there be more demand? Probably. But there's also much more alternatives for charging. The infrastructure to set up a EV charger is way, way cheaper than the infrastructure needed for gas stations. That's why you see EV chargers in parking lots everywhere here, so you can charge while you shop, work, etc.
4. Sure. What's the problem with that? If the companies are making money or getting subsidies, and there's a ROI, that's how the market works.
5. Battery tech is definitely the weakest link, but it's been improving rapidly, to the point where this is feasible now. It wasn't 10 years ago. As far as toxicity, so are gas fumes. And as far as waste, all of these battery types are recyclable. The biggest ding to battery tech is longevity, and that has improved quite a bit as well, but needs to improve further, IMO.
6. It just has to skyrocket to less or the same than what it costs me to run a gas powered car. Eventually that's going to be the litmus test for electric.

[DMC]

I dont fkn care so eat me old man.

Dont tell us what Darrin was saying.
Its apparent to me he thought the real fuel for EV had to be hydrocarbons ultimately. Well it does NOT.
No one was talking to you, dipshit.

[DMC]

Gasoline engines will go away mostly in 1st world countries. I can see cities banning them in fact. They will probably still be present on boats and aircraft for quite some time, however most cities are clogged with cars that aren't going more than a few miles from home. Imagine if 90% of the cars were EV, how quiet and clean it would be.

[Winehole23]

"Fighting for the Underderp"

(DMC Bingo jpg.)

[ElNono]

Gasoline engines will go away mostly in 1st world countries. I can see cities banning them in fact. They will probably still be present on boats and aircraft for quite some time, however most cities are clogged with cars that aren't going more than a few miles from home. Imagine if 90% of the cars were EV, how quiet and clean it would be.

Exactly, doesn't have to be all or nothing. Just attacking the most common scenario is a big deal.

[ducks]

Everyone just needs to purchase solar panels and powerwalls.

Moar batteries
I own 50 on my House

[RandomGuy]

What don't you get? Historically Presidents get worried when oil gets over $80 and Biden is getting worried. A lot of people are forecasting $100 bbl and some even $150 - $200 bbl, either would be a disaster for Dems. Whether it happens or not, there is no downside to the GOP starting det narrative now.

Well said. :tu

It is a good play for the NFP, because it is an easy case to make and accessible/impactful for a lot of people.

That is is dumb and dishonest, well that is sort of secondary.

[RandomGuy]

try $4.29/gallon and a rough average of 41 mpg even with hybrid car, factoring in summer and winter.

330 miles per workday, assuming 22 workdays for each of 12 months.

[RandomGuy]

It's the latest outrage de jour. Right wing media makes a shit-ton of money ginning up outrage, because facts and reasoned takes are boring.

I follow a few conservative groups on facebook, and thumb through fox "news" every few days. Always easy to see what ducks or Dupeboi will be posting about before they post it. Gas-prices popped up a week or so ago.


It's quicker to just look on texags politics forum

:lol Possibly.

But where do you think those people are told what to think?

It all boils back to the right-wing propaganda machine, led by the Fox propaganda network.

[RandomGuy]

Gasoline engines will go away mostly in 1st world countries. I can see cities banning them in fact. They will probably still be present on boats and aircraft for quite some time, however most cities are clogged with cars that aren't going more than a few miles from home. Imagine if 90% of the cars were EV, how quiet and clean it would be.

All true. :tu

A lot of interesting things happening all at once:

They are already developing electric twin engine turbo props that appear to have vastly lower operating costs than their liquid fueled counterparts to the stage of putting them in production.

Larger planes are already in development, and I would guess they would have similar cost profiles, especially for short hauls.

As for ships, we could see a lot of them go back to wind power, probably with the same cost dynamic. Oooh the irony.

https://images.maritimeprofessional.com/images/maritime/w400/-126823.jpg

https://images.maritimeprofessional.com/images/maritime/w400/image-wallenius-marine-118660.jpg


Sweden’s Wallenius Marine AB, which designs and builds ships, is currently testing a sleek white model of an “Oceanbird” automobile carrier in a bay in the Baltic Sea.

Per Tunell, Wallenius’ chief operating officer, said results from the seven-meter model were encouraging and that he was “very confident” the full-scale Oceanbird will be ready to order by the end of next year.

The sail-driven ship could be in service in 2024 on Atlantic routes, he said.

The Oceanbird will be 200 meters long with capacity to carry 7,000 cars. It may be the tallest sailing ship ever built, equipped with wing sails reaching 105 meters above the water.

The sails, however, look little like traditional billowing fabric sails, instead more closely resembling aircraft wings rising vertically from the deck.

https://imagesedit.marinelink.com/images/storage/w800h450/oceanbirdimagewalleniusmarine.jpg

The vessel will have engines as a backup, but aims to save 90% of carbon emissions compared to a conventional ship run on polluting bunker fuel.

It will take Oceanbird about 12 days to cross the Atlantic, compared to eight for a fuel-powered ship.

The design “could also be applied as a cruise vessel, a bulk carrier, a tanker,” Tunell said. “One of the key conditions is that it shall be commercially feasible.”

Oceanbird would probably cost a bit more than a conventional car carrier, he said, declining to estimate the exact price.

But operating costs would be lower, especially if governments trying to curb climate-changing emissions impose a price on carbon emissions from using fuel.

The Oceanbird is not the only emerging contender in the low-carbon shipping race.

Neoline in France is seeking orders for a smaller, 136-metre vessel, also suitable for transporting cars or farm machinery.

Like Oceanbird, it reckons its carrier could cut emissions by 90%.

(rest of article here
https://www.maritimeprofessional.com/news/wallenius-bets-wind-powered-cargo-363710 )



All of this technology will end up benefitting from the billions being poured into battery technology. The more energy per unit of mass you can pack into a battery, the more economical it gets for all modes of transportation and all this investment will be pushing that figure up each year.

[boutons_deux]

As long (100+ years) as GHG C02, methane, etc remain in the atmosphere,

slowing GHG production will not remedy AGW.

Human, industrial civilization is fucked and unfuckable.

Capitalist oligarchy, insulated from the AGW catastrophe by their wealth, is now the main culprit, eg, corrupting Manchin to block CEPP and 1000s of other tactics in their strategy of amassing Capital w/o limit.

[pgardn]

Everyone just needs to purchase solar panels and powerwalls.

Moar batteries

The State of Texas is already putting up massive numbers of wind turbines and solar panels.
So next time you charge YOUR EV, maybe give that a thought.

[pgardn]

No one was talking to you, dipshit.

No but you were recasting your perceived minion's words fuk face.
In a completely disingenuous manner...
old fart.

[pgardn]

I think Tesla sort of set the standard when it comes to charging station anxiety, tbh, most other makers are following suit...

Not only is the car constantly telling you how much charge is left, it's also telling you which charging stations you can reach with what you have left, and will even give you directions to them.

It's a completely different concept from "we'll turn this light on when you have 30 miles left to drive", but until there's a much more widespread infrastructure, it's probably the right approach.

Yeah the go finding them are dead miles. For gas its, "the next station on the highway". This will change. But for right now I get it.

[Trill Clinton]

1452596619573145603

Adapt or get left behind

[Millennial_Messiah]

330 miles per workday, assuming 22 workdays for each of 12 months.

once again, only considering work mileage without taking into account personal and pleasure mileage.

I have maybe drove to a work office 5 or 6 times since April 2020 :lol

[RandomGuy]

Yeah the go finding them are dead miles. For gas its, "the next station on the highway". This will change. But for right now I get it.

Think of all that future dead infrastructure. No more gas tanker trucks, no more underground tanks. Charging stations will be everywhere, esp parking garages.

Convenience stores will be a dying breed. oil change shops... ditto.

A lot of disruption.

[Millennial_Messiah]

Think of all that future dead infrastructure. No more gas tanker trucks, no more underground tanks. Charging stations will be everywhere, esp parking garages.

Convenience stores will be a dying breed. oil change shops... ditto.

A lot of disruption.
If and only if tobacco is prohibited. Which I doubt it will be, even despite all the evidence. There's just as much benzopyrene in cannabis smoke, which, causes lung cancer.

For convenience stores around the USA, tobacco is the #1 in-store purchase. It's probably the #2 reason people actually go inside those sketchy places behind taking a mid-trip piss.

[RandomGuy]

1452596619573145603

Adapt or get left behind

https://i0.wp.com/nerdbastards.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/11/so-it-begins.jpg?w=600

Hmmm.

Concept:

Restaurant combined with charger stations. Tables come with small monitor where you can monitor charging progress if you don't have the app on your phone.

Lots of covered parking, with solar panels on top charging on-site batteries. Cities could do some incentives for rainwater capture setups that might help alleviate flooding from non-permeable cover.

[RandomGuy]

If and only if tobacco is prohibited. Which I doubt it will be, even despite all the evidence. There's just as much benzopyrene in cannabis smoke, which, causes lung cancer.

For convenience stores around the USA, tobacco is the #1 in-store purchase. It's probably the #2 reason people actually go inside those sketchy places behind taking a mid-trip piss.

Profit margins for ciggies is low. Declining smoking rates (e-cigs aside) in general make it a slowly losing proposition.
https://www.statista.com/statistics/887938/convenience-store-profit-margin-us-product-category/

[koriwhat]

I never doxxed you. Try again, beta.

You still got my address so what's stopping your lard ass from coming down here to see me besides that dump truck you haul around 24/7 and all those spare tires?

FATTY is scared!

[SnakeBoy]

https://i0.wp.com/nerdbastards.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/11/so-it-begins.jpg?w=600

Hmmm.

Concept:

Restaurant combined with charger stations. Tables come with small monitor where you can monitor charging progress if you don't have the app on your phone.

Lots of covered parking, with solar panels on top charging on-site batteries. Cities could do some incentives for rainwater capture setups that might help alleviate flooding from non-permeable cover.

Should be a pizza place where you make your own pie

[Adam Lambert]

Gasoline engines will go away mostly in 1st world countries. I can see cities banning them in fact. They will probably still be present on boats and aircraft for quite some time, however most cities are clogged with cars that aren't going more than a few miles from home. Imagine if 90% of the cars were EV, how quiet and clean it would be.

I can see all of this happening in 1st World countries not called the United States. Republican Governors and/or Presidents will ban cities from banning gasoline engines for the foreseeable future, just as they've overridden local bans on fracking.

We will be the last 1st World Country to be majority EV's and many 3rd world countries will beat us there as well.

[RandomGuy]

I can see all of this happening in 1st World countries not called the United States. Republican Governors and/or Presidents will ban cities from banning gasoline engines for the foreseeable future, just as they've overridden local bans on fracking.

We will be the last 1st World Country to be majority EV's and many 3rd world countries will beat us there as well.

You can bet Texas, with all the GOP politicians firmly in the back pocket of the oil/gas industry that controls them will lag in the US.

[DMC]

I can see all of this happening in 1st World countries not called the United States. Republican Governors and/or Presidents will ban cities from banning gasoline engines for the foreseeable future, just as they've overridden local bans on fracking.

We will be the last 1st World Country to be majority EV's and many 3rd world countries will beat us there as well.

Sorry this is happening to you. Thoughts and prayers.

[Adam Lambert]

Sorry this is happening to you. Thoughts and prayers.

Just remember how pro-EV you are and how much "quieter" and "cleaner" they would be when you're on this forum in ten years arguing on behalf of your pro-oil overlords who are standing in the way. I think you'll pretty easily forget or discard your convictions altogether as always.

[DMC]

Just remember how pro-EV you are and how much "quieter" and "cleaner" they would be when you're on this forum in ten years arguing on behalf of your pro-oil overlords who are standing in the way. I think you'll pretty easily forget or discard your convictions altogether as always.

I am pro EV. I am also pro choice and pro 2nd Amendment. I don't blame everything on the Dems when I don't get my way though.

You sound like Boutons. You need to take a break.

[koriwhat]

Just remember how pro-EV you are and how much "quieter" and "cleaner" they would be when you're on this forum in ten years arguing on behalf of your pro-oil overlords who are standing in the way. I think you'll pretty easily forget or discard your convictions altogether as always.

Show us who has stock in what when it comes to Congress and especially the Left. :lmao

[Adam Lambert]

I am pro EV. I am also pro choice and pro 2nd Amendment. I don't blame everything on the Dems when I don't get my way though.

You sound like Boutons. You need to take a break.

:lol Triggered by the mere mention of Republicans.

I'm not going to self-edit just to avoid offending your sensitivities.

[DMC]

:lol Triggered by the mere mention of Republicans.

I'm not going to self-edit just to avoid offending your sensitivities.

I just said I'm sorry this is happening to you, as you continue your downward spiral, screaming out "republicans!... curse you!" :lol

You're the one who tried to provide narrative.

:lol not going to self edit while using an alt, how clever.

I don't want you to self edit. I like watching you spin out of control :tu

[koriwhat]

:lol not going to self edit while using an alt. How clever.

:lmao:tu

[Adam Lambert]

I just said I'm sorry this is happening to you, as you continue your downward spiral, screaming out "republicans!... curse you!" :lol

You're the one who tried to provide narrative.

:lol not going to self edit while using an alt, how clever.

I don't want you to self edit. I like watching you spin out of control :tu

You're projecting again.

I made a prediction based on recent history with regard to state legislation preventing cities from enacting bans on fracking (not to mention masking, vaccine mandates, etc.) and that post got you all butthurt because, also owing to that recent history, I described those state leaders as Republicans.

And you can't handle that. Because while you may hold some liberal beliefs, you hate liberals more than your own convictions. It's why you claim to be "pro choice" yet spend hours and dozens of posts here arguing against the pro-choice position.

Maybe it's because people like Derp and Darrin and koriwhat make you feel safe, while the liberals here make you feel stupid? I don't know. But you shouldn't be handing out any mental health diagnoses if you're going to melt down like this every time someone acknowledges a flaw in Republican leadership.

[DMC]

You're projecting again.

:lol no


I made a prediction based on recent history with regard to state legislation preventing cities from enacting bans on fracking (not to mention masking, vaccine mandates, etc.) and that post got you all butthurt because, also owing to that recent history, I described those state leaders as Republicans.

You made a very predictable comment based on your bias. Nothing more. If the GOPers can get more votes by supporting EV, they'll support EV. If they cannot, they won't.


And you can't handle that. Because while you may hold some liberal beliefs, you hate liberals more than your own convictions. It's why you claim to be "pro choice" yet spend hours and dozens of posts here arguing against the pro-choice position.

Yeah that's it. If you're for something (choice) you must also be for the repercussions of it (abortions). You can be pro choice and still be anti-abortion. I am pro 2nd Amendment but also pro choice when it comes to owning a firearm.


Maybe it's because people like Derp and Darrin and koriwhat make you feel safe, while the liberals here make you feel stupid? I don't know. But you shouldn't be handing out any mental health diagnoses if you're going to melt down like this every time someone acknowledges a flaw in Republican leadership.
I don't feel the need to run to an alt to feel safe :lol
Safety is taking the consensus view and echoing the majority. That's your shtick, not mine.

[DarrinS]

https://www.edmunds.com/car-news/california-mandates-electric-cars-for-2035.html

[spurraider21]

https://www.edmunds.com/car-news/california-mandates-electric-cars-for-2035.html
you'd do well to read the whole article. might get you to stop parroting outdated talking points

https://i.gyazo.com/68e463c8cff88ba5497231e56d482cba.png
https://i.gyazo.com/2b2c894ab65b7b3afe9cf64544e77fbe.png

[DarrinS]

You left this out



At the moment, California's infrastructure is woefully unprepared for the 2035 executive order. During recent summer heatwaves, utilities have been forced to impose rolling blackouts to deal with both hot-weather demands and fire danger. At its peak draw while charging, an electric vehicle can consume as much electricity as three households. It's clear the electric grid cannot currently handle this shift to EVs, but a lot can change in 15 years

[spurraider21]

im glad that the "at the moment" in october 2020 when this was written, we were not ready for standards to go into place by 2035

not to mention that even if those mandate stays in place, a very significant portion of vehicles on the road in 2035 will still be combustion

[ChumpDumper]

im glad that the "at the moment" in october 2020 when this was written, we were not ready for standards to go into place by 2035

not to mention that even if those mandate stays in place, a very significant portion of vehicles on the road in 2035 will still be combustion

BUT DID YOU KNOW IN 2011 THERE WEREN'T ENOUGH CHARGING STATIONS TO HANDLE THE NUMBER OF EVs IN 2021?

[ElNono]

im glad that the "at the moment" in october 2020 when this was written, we were not ready for standards to go into place by 2035

not to mention that even if those mandate stays in place, a very significant portion of vehicles on the road in 2035 will still be combustion

Yep, it's not an on-off switch, it's a transition. But if you don't set goals then it never will get moving.

[DMC]

Yep, it's not an on-off switch, it's a transition. But if you don't set goals then it never will get moving.

Not sure what you two are discussing but it sounds personal.

[ElNono]

Not sure what you two are discussing but it sounds personal.

Not sure if you knew, but you can click on the "Originally posted by..." line and go back and see what we're discussing. I mean, in case you want to chime in.

[Ef-man]

Not sure if you knew, but you can click on the "Originally posted by..." line and go back and see what we're discussing. I mean, in case you want to chime in.

He can’t, fat fingers.

[DMC]

Not sure if you knew, but you can click on the "Originally posted by..." line and go back and see what we're discussing. I mean, in case you want to chime in.

It just sounded like some transition talk :lol

[ElNono]

It just sounded like some transition talk :lol

I knew you were going there, I was being facetious as well :lol

[SnakeBoy]

https://charts.stocktwits.com/production/original_401015527.png

[ChumpDumper]

https://charts.stocktwits.com/production/original_401015527.png

What happened to muh energy independence?

[SnakeBoy]

What happened to muh energy independence?

Nothing. We have plenty of oil.

Why is Biden freaking out over $80 bbl oil?

[SnakeBoy]

Oil prices will hit $100 a barrel 'before you blink your eyes,' United Refining billionaire argues

https://media3.giphy.com/media/f9eYHQ8RZ4zfc4unXx/giphy.gif?cid=790b7611b2f065ba728a2ce1068e6950bc21 952c9dce68ec&rid=giphy.gif&ct=g

[SnakeBoy]

Biden Admin Weighing Shutting Down Oil Pipeline In Michigan As Gas Prices Skyrocket Across U.S.: Report
https://www.dailywire.com/news/biden-admin-weighing-shutting-down-oil-pipeline-in-michigan-as-gas-prices-skyrocket-across-u-s-report

[ChumpDumper]

Nothing. We have plenty of oil.

Why is Biden freaking out over $80 bbl oil?You're the one posting here.

:lol So independent!

[koriwhat]

Oil prices will hit $100 a barrel 'before you blink your eyes,' United Refining billionaire argues

https://media3.giphy.com/media/f9eYHQ8RZ4zfc4unXx/giphy.gif?cid=790b7611b2f065ba728a2ce1068e6950bc21 952c9dce68ec&rid=giphy.gif&ct=g

I can't wait to wake up one of these days soon and the news is reporting, "Let's Go Brandon died today from natural causes." or better yet, "Let's Go Brandon was assassinated by John Wilkes Booth's great great great grandson earlier today."

Fuck Joe Biden and everything to do with that fucking worthless corpse!

[MultiTroll]

Biden Admin Weighing Shutting Down Oil Pipeline In Michigan As Gas Prices Skyrocket Across U.S.: Report
https://www.dailywire.com/news/biden-admin-weighing-shutting-down-oil-pipeline-in-michigan-as-gas-prices-skyrocket-across-u-s-report
Huntington Beach oil spill: Officials raise potential oil spill amount to 144,000 gallons amid cleanup efforts - ABC News (go.com) (https://abcnews.go.com/US/major-oil-spill-closes-californias-huntington-beach-airshow/story?id=80378732)

[ElNono]

Biden Admin Weighing Shutting Down Oil Pipeline In Michigan As Gas Prices Skyrocket Across U.S.: Report
https://www.dailywire.com/news/biden-admin-weighing-shutting-down-oil-pipeline-in-michigan-as-gas-prices-skyrocket-across-u-s-report

Brandon :tu

[SnakeBoy]

Biden administration considers action to ease gas price hikes
Secretary of Energy Granholm says the U.S. could release oil from its strategic reserve
https://www.consumeraffairs.com/news/biden-administration-considers-action-to-ease-gas-price-hikes-110821.html

$80 oil is a crisis :lmao

[Winehole23]

Brandon sics the FTC on greedy oil companies with one hand...

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FEaJazRWQAc9dqW?format=jpg&name=medium

[Winehole23]

...while holding the biggest offshore leasing auction ever

US auctions off oil and gas drilling leases in Gulf of Mexico after climate talks (https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2021/nov/17/biden-administration-gulf-of-mexico-oil-gas-drilling-leases)
https://cdn.offshorewind.biz/wp-content/uploads/sites/6/2020/10/16085545/BOEM-1.jpg

[Trainwreck2100]

What happened to muh energy independence?

1 week old but what happened was the bottom fell out during the pandemic and a bunch of the drillers didn't pay their debts so now, nobody wants to give them money because they know they'll get super fucked when the bottom falls out again

[Winehole23]

gas prices were higher 7 years ago

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FEayebsXwAM2MZl?format=jpg&name=4096x4096

[SnakeBoy]

1 week old but what happened was the bottom fell out during the pandemic and a bunch of the drillers didn't pay their debts so now, nobody wants to give them money because they know they'll get super fucked when the bottom falls out again

By 2015-16 shale producers over supplied the market while taking on tons of debt. By 2019 investors had cut off the money for more production until producers showed restraint and started delivering on the promised ROI. Then the pandemic happened.

All that's happening is the oil market coming back into balance, shale producers are showing restraint on increasing production and instead focusing on free cash flow and debt reduction. Most are planning to begin increasing production again by 2nd qtr '22.

So what's happening now is what was destined to happen anyways. Gas prices are returning to the sustainable price they should be as Winehole's chart shows. Repugs are effectively blaming Dems for it and Biden is freaking out. Jmo, but it looks like Biden is going to succumb to political pressure and make things worse by trying to intervene in the energy market. Just in time for the midterms.

[ElNono]

Ford Plans To Produce 600,000 EVs a Year By the End of 2023

Ford CEO Jim Farley announced that the automaker is planning to produce 600,000 electric vehicles per year by the end of 2023 (https://www.engadget.com/ford-600000-electric-vehicles-2023-061606689.html), "which will double the number of EVs it originally intended to manufacture," notes Engadget. From the report: According to Automotive News (https://www.autonews.com/manufacturing/ford-aims-double-ev-production-capacity-two-years-ceo-jim-farley-says), production will be spread across the Mustang Mach-E, F-150 Lightning and E-Transit. Ford's current EV lineup is wildly popular, Farley said, and the demand is "so much higher" than the company expected. The Mustang Mach-E is selling on three continents, while the Ford F-150 Lightning has been popular from the time it was announced. Ford received 100,000 reservations within three weeks after it was unveiled, and that number's now up to 160,000 -- all placed with a $100 refundable deposit. Due to the high demand for the F-150, Ford previously decided to invest $250 million to boost its production, creating 450 new jobs to help it make 80,000 trucks a year. It's unclear how much that target would change now that the company is doubling its manufacturing goal.

[ElNono]

Norway Is Running Out of Gas-Guzzling Cars To Tax

When it comes to sales of electric cars, Norway is in a league of its own. In September, battery-powered electric vehicles accounted for 77.5 percent of all new cars sold. That figure makes Norway a world leader by a long way (https://www.wired.com/story/norway-electric-vehicle-tax/) -- leapfrogging over the UK, where 15 percent of new car sales were electric as of October, and the US, where that number is just 2.6 percent. From a report:Norway's electric dream has been credited to a series of tax breaks and other financial carrots that mean brands like Tesla can compete on price with combustion engines. But these incentives -- and their success -- have created a unique predicament: Norway is running out of dirty cars to tax.

It's quite a big problem. The previous government -- a center-right coalition that was replaced by a center-left minority government in October -- estimated that the popularity of EVs was creating a 19.2 billion Norwegian krone ($2.32 billion) hole in the country's annual revenue. While EVs might be great news for the environment, their rapid success in Norway is now forcing some serious fiscal consternation. The road to this point has been long -- and offers lessons to other countries racing to ditch gas-guzzling combustion engines. In Norway, the most progressive electric vehicle policies in the world started with a pop group, an environmentalist, and a small red Fiat Panda. It was 1988 when activist Frederic Hauge, along with fellow green campaigners from the band A-ha, traveled to the Swiss city of Bern, where they found the red Fiat. A previous owner had converted the car to run off a lead battery, and the group planned to use the vehicle to persuade the Norwegian government to encourage electric vehicle uptake.

The Fiat became the centerpiece of a nine-year campaign in which Hauge and members of A-ha drove the car on Norway's toll roads without paying. The fines racked up, and when they remained unpaid, the vehicle would be impounded and sold at auction, where Hauge would buy it back and repeat the cycle of toll dodging. A-ha's celebrity members added glitz to the crusade against toll fees for EVs and Hauge -- who has led an environmental group called Bellona since 1986 -- courted press attention to demand incentives for electric cars. "By being a positive vigilante, he made the media and also the politicians aware of the electric car," says Oyvind Solberg Thorsen, director of Norway's Road Traffic Information Council, which publishes statistics about the country's roads and vehicles.

[boutons_deux]

OPEC sets the world oil price and USA domestic manufacturers are quite happy to raise their domestic production to the world price

[SnakeBoy]

Biden eyes Strategic Petroleum Reserves crude oil release in coming days
https://news.yahoo.com/biden-eyes-spr-crude-oil-203355448.html

The U.S. release is expected to be between 30 million and 35 million barrels and would be carried out over time, one of the people said.

A release of that magnitude would represent about three day's worth of U.S. crude oil production.

[DMC]

I can't wait to wake up one of these days soon and the news is reporting, "Let's Go Brandon died today from natural causes." or better yet, "Let's Go Brandon was assassinated by John Wilkes Booth's great great great grandson earlier today."

Fuck Joe Biden and everything to do with that fucking worthless corpse!

This kind of shit can get you on a watch list.

[Winehole23]

1463567832449536006

[SnakeBoy]

Oil Will Hit $125 a Barrel in 2022, $150 in 2023: JPMorgan
https://www.thestreet.com/investing/oil-will-hit-125-a-barrel-in-2022-150-in-2023-jpmorgan

[Chucho]

Fucking $4.88 here in the Central Valley of CA.

[Isitjustme?]

Oil Will Hit $125 a Barrel in 2022, $150 in 2023: JPMorgan
https://www.thestreet.com/investing/oil-will-hit-125-a-barrel-in-2022-150-in-2023-jpmorgan

You were the guy pointing out this wasn't Biden's fault in another thread when you broke character for two seconds

[Isitjustme?]

This kind of shit can get you on a watch list.

Commiserating with KW, huh? You're kind of his level now so its cool he has a compadre and friends considering how sad his life is

[Winehole23]

(fighting for the underderp)

[DMC]

Commiserating with KW, huh? You're kind of his level now so its cool he has a compadre and friends considering how sad his life is
Seemed like a fair warning. Pretty sure Kori Ellis doesn't want the SS snooping around these forums and bring heat down on the site owners.

You still have a shit job? You seem upset.

[SnakeBoy]

You were the guy pointing out this wasn't Biden's fault in another thread when you broke character for two seconds

What's happening in the oil patch is years in the making. Biden is POTUS tho.

"It's not my fault" rarely works in politics.

Besides, I'm not sure I buy the $100+ oil idea. Theoretically possible but then again pumpers pump.

[ElNono]

Nissan Lays Out $17.6 Billion Plan To Electrify Its Future

Nissan has announced plans to spend around $17.6 billion over the next five years (https://www.theverge.com/2021/11/29/22807700/nissan-electric-vehicle-investment-plan-concepts) to accelerate the roll-out of electric vehicles. "And to emphasize that point, Nissan unveiled a pack of delightful EV concepts, including an adorable pickup truck, an outdoorsy SUV, and a sleek sports car," reports The Verge. From the report: Nissan said it will produce 23 new electrified models by 2030, 15 of which will be fully electric. The company is targeting a 50 percent electrification mix for its Nissan and Infiniti brands by the end of the decade. In the US, Nissan plans to take things a little slower, only targeting 40 percent of its sales to be EVs by 2040. On batteries, Nissan is pursuing what it calls "all-solid-state batteries (ASSB)" by 2028. The company is preparing a "pilot plant" in Yokohama, Japan, for early 2024. Solid-state batteries could theoretically charge faster, hold more power, and last longer than traditional lithium-ion batteries, which use liquid electrolytes to move energy around. While solid-state batteries have eluded researchers for years, some companies claim that a breakthrough is nearly at hand.

Nissan says that solid-state batteries will help make EVs more affordable by reducing the price of battery packs down to $75 per kWh by 2028. The company aims to bring it further down to $65 per kWh to achieve cost parity between EV and gasoline vehicles in the future. To underline its commitment to an electric future, Nissan revealed a handful of EV concepts: a small pickup truck called Surf-Out; a boxy crossover called Hang-Out; a compact SUV called Chill-Out; and a convertible sports car called Max-Out. [...] It's an impressive commitment, but Nissan notably stopped short of making the same promise that other automakers have to phase out the production of gas-powered vehicles. For example, Volvo and General Motors have vowed to become EV-only companies by 2030 and 2040, respectively.

[DMC]

Nissan Lays Out $17.6 Billion Plan To Electrify Its Future

Nissan has announced plans to spend around $17.6 billion over the next five years (https://www.theverge.com/2021/11/29/22807700/nissan-electric-vehicle-investment-plan-concepts) to accelerate the roll-out of electric vehicles. "And to emphasize that point, Nissan unveiled a pack of delightful EV concepts, including an adorable pickup truck, an outdoorsy SUV, and a sleek sports car," reports The Verge. From the report: Nissan said it will produce 23 new electrified models by 2030, 15 of which will be fully electric. The company is targeting a 50 percent electrification mix for its Nissan and Infiniti brands by the end of the decade. In the US, Nissan plans to take things a little slower, only targeting 40 percent of its sales to be EVs by 2040. On batteries, Nissan is pursuing what it calls "all-solid-state batteries (ASSB)" by 2028. The company is preparing a "pilot plant" in Yokohama, Japan, for early 2024. Solid-state batteries could theoretically charge faster, hold more power, and last longer than traditional lithium-ion batteries, which use liquid electrolytes to move energy around. While solid-state batteries have eluded researchers for years, some companies claim that a breakthrough is nearly at hand.

Nissan says that solid-state batteries will help make EVs more affordable by reducing the price of battery packs down to $75 per kWh by 2028. The company aims to bring it further down to $65 per kWh to achieve cost parity between EV and gasoline vehicles in the future. To underline its commitment to an electric future, Nissan revealed a handful of EV concepts: a small pickup truck called Surf-Out; a boxy crossover called Hang-Out; a compact SUV called Chill-Out; and a convertible sports car called Max-Out. [...] It's an impressive commitment, but Nissan notably stopped short of making the same promise that other automakers have to phase out the production of gas-powered vehicles. For example, Volvo and General Motors have vowed to become EV-only companies by 2030 and 2040, respectively.

Elon Musk - "hold my beer"

[Winehole23]

Elon Musk - "hold my beer"
Poor quality and unsafe, tbh

[SnakeBoy]

1466517282859933698

:lol

[DMC]

Poor quality and unsafe, tbh

:lol ok

[Millennial_Messiah]

1463567832449536006

Because of the reckless left wing keynesian government spending bullshit over the past 2 years causing the massive inflation that shouldn't have existed in the first place to "adjust for".


Oil Will Hit $125 a Barrel in 2022, $150 in 2023: JPMorgan
https://www.thestreet.com/investing/oil-will-hit-125-a-barrel-in-2022-150-in-2023-jpmorgan

Hopefully getting rid of the dems in all except the very most blue areas/states and appreciating the value of my hybrid camry even as the years go by

[ChumpDumper]

:lol "supply and demand" doesn't exist anymore in Trumptardnomics.

[Ef-man]

:lol "supply and demand" doesn't exist anymore in Trumptardnomics.

Boomers :lol
:cry I remember filling up my car with $5 and getting a free set of dishes
:cry Kids are spoiled rotten, wearing seatbelts and having airbags in cars
:cry In my day, you had to know hand signals to change lanes

[SnakeBoy]

Place your bet

https://charts.stocktwits.com/production/original_414151560.png

[Chucho]

Elon Musk - "hold my beer"


On his dime? Bullshit.

[Winehole23]

https://local12.com/news/local/gas-prices-drop-in-cincinnati-across-the-country-ohio-kentucky-indiana-gasoline-gallon-pump-pay

[SnakeBoy]

1476195521161277440

[ElNono]

Same estimate from gas buddy has a sharp drop after the summer going towards the end of 2022.

[Ef-man]

Same estimate from gas buddy has a sharp drop after the summer going towards the end of 2022.

Those estimates must be from high priced gas stations off highway or downtown areas (where they overcharge, bigly) as it is $2.85 at local Costco here in VA.

[Chucho]

The prices for Sacramento have lowered a good 30 cents or so per since this recent quote.

[Robz4000]

The prices for Sacramento have lowered a good 30 cents or so per since this recent quote.

Most other sources I've seen have gas prices peaking about 50 cents less than gasbuddy's estimates tbh.

[ElNono]

Those estimates must be from high priced gas stations off highway or downtown areas (where they overcharge, bigly) as it is $2.85 at local Costco here in VA.

My understanding is that it’s a projection based on the typical increased demand during the summer months, based on current prices. I don’t think the model assumes govt intervention, now or in the summer, so while it’s useful in otherwise normal times, it might be a bit skewed now.

[Winehole23]

Long-suffering Americans grappling with runaway inflation are finally enjoying some reprieve. After a relentless climb, prices at the pump have been heading south, with national average gas prices tumbling to a 10-week low of $3.28 a gallon, according to AAA. Fuel prices started leveling out after President Joe Biden announced on November 23 the biggest-ever release from the Strategic Petroleum Reserve, though experts have dismissed it as a mere band-aid. Whereas many people have placed the blame for high gas prices on the Biden administration, the real culprit has more to do with Wall Street than Pennsylvania Avenue.


The genesis of today’s high gas prices can be traced back to financial pressure on oil companies from a decade of devastating losses and poor shareholder returns that have forced them to dramatically alter their business models. For years, Wall Street has pressured oil and gas companies to cut capex, and shift their cash to financial goals like boosting dividends and buybacks, paying down debt, as well as decarbonization, after the fracking revolution left the U.S. shale patch bleeding cash and deeply indebted.


Consequently, investment in new wells has crashed 60% since its peak in 2014, causing U.S. crude oil production to plummet by more than 3 million barrels a day, or nearly 25%, just as the Covid virus hit, and then failed to recover with the economy.
https://oilprice.com/Energy/Oil-Prices/Chronic-Underinvestment-Could-Push-Oil-Prices-Higher-In-2022.html

[Winehole23]

According to the IEA, crude consumption is expected to improve to 99.53 million barrels per day (bpd), up from 96.2 million bpd this year, leaving it just a hair short of 2019's daily consumption of 99.55 million barrels. That will, of course, depend on the world bringing the new Omicron variant of Covid-19 quickly under control.


Higher oil demand will put pressure on both OPEC and the U.S. shale industry to meet demand. But let's not forget that numerous OPEC nations have already been struggling to add to output, while the U.S. shale industry has to deal with investor demands to hold the line on spending. So far, the U.S. shale industry has not responded to higher oil prices as they had done previously, with overall U.S. production averaged 11.2 million bpd in 2021 compared with a record of nearly 13 million bpd in late 2019. U.S. production is expected to only increase by 700,000 b/d in 2022 to 11.9 b/d, according to Rystad Energy's senior vice-president of analysis, Claudio Galimberti.


Canada, Norway, Guyana, and Brazil could try to bridge the supply-demand gap, but several Wall Street punters are betting it will not be enough and oil prices will remain elevated.


In fact, Barclays has predicted that the WTI contract price will increase from the current rate of $73 to an average price of $77 in 2022, noting that the Biden administration's sale of oil from the Strategic Petroleum Reserve isn't a sustainable way to bring down prices. Barclays says prices could go even higher than that forecast if COVID-19 outbreaks are minimized and thus allow demand to grow more than expected.


Goldman Sachs shares that bullish outlook and has predicted a Brent price of $85 per barrel by 2023 compared to the current $76.30.

[Robz4000]

:lol welp, gas shot up 30 cents around town today