No way No how does getting rid of DJM suggests TANKING

[C-Dub]

Getting rid of a borderline allstar does not mean that the Spurs are going to tank this year. Without injuries to other voted in allstar players, DJM would not be an allstar YET. It's not like the Spurs got rid of a top tier player to suggest a tank move in the works. If they are tanking, they were already tanking, which they weren't.

Going to be better ball movement this year with Tre and Primo running the point. Not saying that the Spurs will have a better record than last year, but I don't believe it's going to be that far off to consider it tanking. In the grand scheme of things, letting go off DJM could very well mean addition by subtraction!

[SpurSpike]

I do think its strange that we have not heard much about even attempting to trade Poeltl. If we are indeed tanking that seems like the obvious move to make.

[KingKev]

Getting rid of a borderline allstar does not mean that the Spurs are going to tank this year. Without injuries to other voted in allstar players, DJM would not be an allstar YET. It's not like the Spurs got rid of a top tier player to suggest a tank move in the works. If they are tanking, they were already tanking, which they weren't.

Going to be better ball movement this year with Tre and Primo running the point. Not saying that the Spurs will have a better record than last year, but I don't believe it's going to be that far off to consider it tanking. In the grand scheme of things, letting go off DJM could very well mean addition by subtraction!

If you look at all moves this off-season are tanking. Especially
if JRich and Jak are moved. Which I hope they are.

We will be a bottom 5 team through AS break for sure. The real barometer will be how the Spurs react when other teams experiencing injuries, internal drama etc who are u unlikely to make a playoff push respond.

[exstatic]

I do think its strange that we have not heard much about even attempting to trade Poeltl. If we are indeed tanking that seems like the obvious move to make.

Spurs don’t generally leak a lot, but timvp said Poeltl will likely be moved before the season. That was during the flurry of signings and trades at the beginning of the FA period.

[Dex]

Spurs don’t generally leak a lot, but timvp said Poeltl will likely be moved before the season. That was during the flurry of signings and trades at the beginning of the FA period.

Assuming that is true (and timvp usually gets his facts straight), maybe the right deal just wasn't there. It doesn't make sense to trade Poeltl just for the sake of doing so...he may net a better return during the season or before the trade deadline.

It will be up to Pop to manage his minutes accordingly to showcase him without affecting the W/L column too much...but let's face it, Jakob isn't one of those guys who is going to go win you games by himself.

[Seventyniner]

I think the Spurs are trying to move Poeltl, but aren't shopping him openly in case they can't get what they want for him. They clearly haven't yet gotten an offer worth taking.

Carrying him into the season is less than ideal because he's expiring. And he's only slightly more likely to sign an extension than Dejounte was (1% vs 0%).

[exstatic]

Assuming that is true (and timvp usually gets his facts straight), maybe the right deal just wasn't there. It doesn't make sense to trade Poeltl just for the sake of doing so...he may net a better return during the season or before the trade deadline.

It will be up to Pop to manage his minutes accordingly to showcase him without affecting the W/L column too much...but let's face it, Jakob isn't one of those guys who is going to go win you games by himself.

If I’m remembering correctly, they already had an offer or offers with picks, plural, but were trying to work him into a deal for an unprotected FRP, which they value much more highly than regular FRPs. I don’t think this will drag on too long, as training camp is weeks away. A team that will value and use Jak will be a good team, and will want to have their roster set for training camp, sort of a soft deadline.

[KingKev]

If I’m remembering correctly, they already had an offer or offers with picks, plural, but were trying to work him into a deal for an unprotected FRP, which they value much more highly than regular FRPs. I don’t think this will drag on too long, as training camp is weeks away. A team that will value and use Jak will be a good team, and will want to have their roster set for training camp, sort of a soft deadline.

Jak will not get you an unprotected or lightly protected FRP unless you are taking a seriously bad contract back.

[TD 21]

^ I still think the most likely trade is probably something like Poeltl and a 2nd for Birch, Flynn and two protected 1sts (top 10 or lottery?).

[KobesAchilles]

We aren’t tanking at all. We will just suck. There’s a difference. But either way we will have the 5th best record in the NBA. Some franchises are just trash. I mean in the West I see us above Hou, OKC, and Sacto and probably add Utah to the list. Just gotta hope that Indy is the really only trash trash team in the East

[rjv]

spurs don't necessarily have to "tank". with the west being as deep as it is, they are going to lose a lot of games. and we still don't know what the final roster is going to look like.

[The Truth #6]

Houston and OKC should be better than us with talent, but they will likely lean into the tank for at least one more season.

[Mr. Body]

I also don't see a tank job. The team likely saw Dejounte going elsewhere before long. A market opened up and they sold sooner, perhaps, than intended, but were happy with the picks. Along with the White trade, they're refashioning on the fly, moving assets that will get too expensive versus current and perceived future value.

At this point, I'd be surprised to see Poeltl traded. I don't see the team going into the season with only an old Dieng and a Collins coming off foot surgery as centers. The young players need a good defensive backdrop in order to learn how to play on that end of the court. Richardson is another matter. Right now I don't feel there's much interest in him... actually, I think the market has cooled for Poeltl, at least at this time.

[exstatic]

I also don't see a tank job. The team likely saw Dejounte going elsewhere before long. A market opened up and they sold sooner, perhaps, than intended, but were happy with the picks. Along with the White trade, they're refashioning on the fly, moving assets that will get too expensive versus current and perceived future value.

At this point, I'd be surprised to see Poeltl traded. I don't see the team going into the season with only an old Dieng and a Collins coming off foot surgery as centers. The young players need a good defensive backdrop in order to learn how to play on that end of the court. Richardson is another matter. Right now I don't feel there's much interest in him... actually, I think the market has cooled for Poeltl, at least at this time.

It’s interesting to note that in a period less than 5 months, our FRPs for 2016,2017, and 2018 are gone.

Collins isn’t coming off foot surgery. That was last year. Between Austin and San Antonio, he played a solid 4 months of his physical basketball style.

[John B]

The issue is to move forward with the future PG that they can build around. And it’s not DJ. His game is flawed. He is twitter-happy. And he seems to bite your hand when cornered. I think PATFO was convinced he’s not the guy. And he’s butt-hurt. PATFO got a haul for him at the best opportunity to unload. Win-Win.

But I don’t agree that DJ’s game is addition by subtraction. Despite the flaw on his game, the guy still averages 21 pts which they will miss. In the long run, yes! His style of play (ball hog iso’s) is not conducive to motion offense which is this team/Pop is high on. I’ve mentioned DJ as a “system player”, someone who can be replaced in due time. Pop has been successful to put DJ (or any player) in a situation to succeed (or suspiciously to pad stats to get a good haul). I argue that Tre on occasions flirted with triple-doubles in the same system. Pop likewise made Demar a better passer/facilitator. I’m convinced Pop can develop Blake/Primo to be credible facilitators, likewise the same with Sochan.

Which brings me to the young core. They are hand selected, seemingly perfect, to fit the positions better as a team, in contrast to the flawed roster brought by Nephew sabotaging possible good returns. Since then, PATFO has been trying to patch leaks, but finally decided to tear it down to build it up. 4 years late, but I’ll take it. Now Spurs have a clearer vision. Blake shows tenacity like Parker as both a scorer and a willing passer. Malaki is a 3D scorer much like Manu. Sochan is a defensive-minded big mobile who can facilitate. And Barlow seems to have a future as an athletic modern day C who has range. Add that to Primo, Devin, Keldon and Tre. (And I’m not losing hope on Weiskamp who has the range and athleticism to make it). And it’s a solid roster, at least on paper. Now it’s time to hone those and develop to NBA players.

Don’t get the wrong impression that the Spurs will be throwing games because of youth. Pop will be demanding the young core to compete every-single-play. It’s not going to be the Rockets hoisting 3’s and not playing D. They will compete. But we all know, because of inexperience, they will not win a lot of W’s. But they will develop playing right basketball, while getting great position to draft high pick(s) next Summer. It will be a growing pain in 2-3 years, until they get a solid core. Then I expect PATFO to get aggressive on a possible FA(s) or trade come 3-4th year to complete the puzzle.

J-Rich, Poeltl and McD are definitely getting moved at the right price, and that means the right time. There’s potential 2-3 FRP’s there and possibly unloading McD contract.

At least that’s my read. Or I could be wrong and wasted 30 minutes of my time writing this on my phone :lol:bobo

[John B]

It’s interesting to note that in a period less than 5 months, our FRPs for 2016,2017, and 2018 are gone.

Collins isn’t coming off foot surgery. That was last year. Between Austin and San Antonio, he played a solid 4 months of his physical basketball style.

At least we got hauls on DJ and Derrick. It’s Lonnie and (you forgot) Samanic who could be viewed as wasted picks. 4 FRP’s picks in a year.

[John B]

I also don't see a tank job. The team likely saw Dejounte going elsewhere before long. A market opened up and they sold sooner, perhaps, than intended, but were happy with the picks. Along with the White trade, they're refashioning on the fly, moving assets that will get too expensive versus current and perceived future value.

At this point, I'd be surprised to see Poeltl traded. I don't see the team going into the season with only an old Dieng and a Collins coming off foot surgery as centers. The young players need a good defensive backdrop in order to learn how to play on that end of the court. Richardson is another matter. Right now I don't feel there's much interest in him... actually, I think the market has cooled for Poeltl, at least at this time.

I can see J-Rich and Poeltl staying just long enough to help the young core playing a semblance of NBA basketball, but would be moved by trade deadline.

[spurraider21]

from what we saw in summer league, we are clearly tanking if they insist on primo being a point guard

[slick'81]

20 wins or 30 this team is going to suck

[Mr. Body]

It’s interesting to note that in a period less than 5 months, our FRPs for 2016,2017, and 2018 are gone.

Collins isn’t coming off foot surgery. That was last year. Between Austin and San Antonio, he played a solid 4 months of his physical basketball style.

I would still count Collins as not clear from injury risk.

[JPB]

13 and 15 for Jak, tbh...

[poopbox]

Clearly tanking and this is just the beginning cause we going to need to replace the young players with potential that we got when they don't want to sign a second contract with the spurs

[FutureMan]

Jak will not get you an unprotected or lightly protected FRP unless you are taking a seriously bad contract back.

I don’t see how Poeltl isn’t worth an unprotected pick. He is a 9th pick himself. He is also a 9th pick that worked out. Idk what the odds are for top 10 picks being as good as he is but it can’t be over 30-35% right?

[ismael-robert]

The issue is to move forward with the future PG that they can build around. And it’s not DJ. His game is flawed. He is twitter-happy. And he seems to bite your hand when cornered. I think PATFO was convinced he’s not the guy. And he’s butt-hurt. PATFO got a haul for him at the best opportunity to unload. Win-Win.

But I don’t agree that DJ’s game is addition by subtraction. Despite the flaw on his game, the guy still averages 21 pts which they will miss. In the long run, yes! His style of play (ball hog iso’s) is not conducive to motion offense which is this team/Pop is high on. I’ve mentioned DJ as a “system player”, someone who can be replaced in due time. Pop has been successful to put DJ (or any player) in a situation to succeed (or suspiciously to pad stats to get a good haul). I argue that Tre on occasions flirted with triple-doubles in the same system. Pop likewise made Demar a better passer/facilitator. I’m convinced Pop can develop Blake/Primo to be credible facilitators, likewise the same with Sochan.

Which brings me to the young core. They are hand selected, seemingly perfect, to fit the positions better as a team, in contrast to the flawed roster brought by Nephew sabotaging possible good returns. Since then, PATFO has been trying to patch leaks, but finally decided to tear it down to build it up. 4 years late, but I’ll take it. Now Spurs have a clearer vision. Blake shows tenacity like Parker as both a scorer and a willing passer. Malaki is a 3D scorer much like Manu. Sochan is a defensive-minded big mobile who can facilitate. And Barlow seems to have a future as an athletic modern day C who has range. Add that to Primo, Devin, Keldon and Tre. (And I’m not losing hope on Weiskamp who has the range and athleticism to make it). And it’s a solid roster, at least on paper. Now it’s time to hone those and develop to NBA players.

Don’t get the wrong impression that the Spurs will be throwing games because of youth. Pop will be demanding the young core to compete every-single-play. It’s not going to be the Rockets hoisting 3’s and not playing D. They will compete. But we all know, because of inexperience, they will not win a lot of W’s. But they will develop playing right basketball, while getting great position to draft high pick(s) next Summer. It will be a growing pain in 2-3 years, until they get a solid core. Then I expect PATFO to get aggressive on a possible FA(s) or trade come 3-4th year to complete the puzzle.

J-Rich, Poeltl and McD are definitely getting moved at the right price, and that means the right time. There’s potential 2-3 FRP’s there and possibly unloading McD contract.

At least that’s my read. Or I could be wrong and wasted 30 minutes of my time writing this on my phone :lol:bobo

Anytime spent on spurstalk is wasting our time

[exstatic]

At least we got hauls on DJ and Derrick. It’s Lonnie and (you forgot) Samanic who could be viewed as wasted picks. 4 FRP’s picks in a year.

Lonnie will probably make a place for himself in the league as a bench scorer, so only Sammich, who was admittedly a big swing for the fences, was a fail.

[John B]

Lonnie will probably make a place for himself in the league as a bench scorer, so only Sammich, who was admittedly a big swing for the fences, was a fail.

I mean Lonnie as a wasted FRP for letting him just walk for nothing.

[KingKev]

I mean Lonnie as a wasted FRP for letting him just walk for nothing.

He had no trade value. At the time he was an appropriate first round pick but never met expectations. Can’t say he was a failed pick though.

[exstatic]

I mean Lonnie as a wasted FRP for letting him just walk for nothing.

Happens every year. There was a stat years ago that only 50% of NBA FRPs go beyond their rookie deals with their drafting team. I’m sure it’s worse now, as more teams swing for the proverbial fence for upside.

I’m sure they tried to trade him, but most front offices are smarter than the Yahoos who post here, and by last year, even most of us saw that he was NBA junk food.

[rjv]

I mean Lonnie as a wasted FRP for letting him just walk for nothing.

i really can't think of any team that would have offered anything for lonnie.

[John B]

Happens every year. There was a stat years ago that only 50% of NBA FRPs go beyond their rookie deals with their drafting team. I’m sure it’s worse now, as more teams swing for the proverbial fence for upside.

I’m sure they tried to trade him, but most front offices are smarter than the Yahoos who post here, and by last year, even most of us saw that he was NBA junk food.

With Spurs multiple FRP’s, they are most likely to use one as over-the-fence pick. It’s still early, but imo Spurs seem to have hit HR on all 3 FRP’s, Malaki and Blake expected to go higher in some mock drafts. But if ever, Blake could be the higher risk while potentially having the highest ceiling among the 3.

[exstatic]

With Spurs multiple FRP’s, they are most likely to use one as over-the-fence pick. It’s still early, but imo Spurs seem to have hit HR on all 3 FRP’s, Malaki and Blake expected to go higher in some mock drafts. But if ever, Blake could be the higher risk while potentially having the highest ceiling among the 3.

I think at this point in the building of the team, they’re going to take a big swing at anything outside of the lottery.

[Chomag]

What exactly has Primo shown that makes this FO believe that he has a future as a PG in this league is what I'm wondering

[KingKev]

What exactly has Primo shown that makes this FO believe that he has a future as a PG in this league is what I'm wondering

NOTHING.

[RC_Drunkford]

It absolutely does

[rascal]

They didn't get back any player in the Murray trade and traded him for future assets and also made no significant free agent moves to improve the roster.

The spurs are not playing for wins this year and are rebuilding through the future draft so yes they are tanking this year.

[Allan Rowe vs Wade]

Did anyone else read the title as "No way No how does getting rid of DJT suggests TANKING" and thought it belonged in the Political Forum

[KingKev]

Did anyone else read the title as "No way No how does getting rid of DJT suggests TANKING" and thought it belonged in the Political Forum

Just the morons who come here for political discussion yet struggle to spell their own names. Your type sits on both sides of the aisle.

[koriwhat]

Your type sits on sides of the aisle.

Whoa bro! Are you fat shaming rn? :lmao

[Allan Rowe vs Wade]

Just the morons who come here for political discussion yet struggle to spell their own names. Your type sits on both sides of the aisle.


Whoa bro! Are you fat shaming rn? :lmao

KingKev + koriwhat = ....

[offset formation]

Whoa bro! Are you fat shaming rn? :lmao

haha

[koriwhat]

KingKev + koriwhat = ....

And you equal a big fucking pussy you dumbshit troll.

You fucking leftists vote in the last Dixiecrat and yall want to label us white supremacists? :lmao

[Allan Rowe vs Wade]

And you equal a big fucking pussy you dumbshit troll.

You fucking leftists vote in the last Dixiecrat and yall want to label us white supremacists? :lmao

eh, wh?

[offset formation]

And you equal a big fucking pussy you dumbshit troll.

You fucking leftists vote in the last Dixiecrat and yall want to label us white supremacists? :lmao

Dixiecrats = Republicans.

Those Democrats long ago left the Democratic party for the Republican party. Republicans are an existential threat to humanity. The least of the concerns with Republicans is their racist ideals (like White Replacement Theory, and hilarious objection to stuff like CRT), as undeniable as it is. Btw, Democrats are racists too, but I'm not denying that. You need to own your racism.

The worst part is that Republicans are increasingly hell bent toward authoritarianism and anti-intellectualism. Republicans = fascists.

Deal with it. You were raised wrong.

[koriwhat]

You need to own your racism.

Lol "The Switch!"

Kiss the boot and while you're at it keep with those pathetic leftist talking points. :tu

Btw, show me here on ST what I've said that's racist. Just one example is all I ask of you. I doubt you'll find anything note worthy yet here you are acting all high and mighty while yall dumbfucks celebrate your last Dixiecrat in the WH. :lmao

Btw it wasn't me who claimed fuck face Biden was a Dixiecrat but his long lost friend Robert KKK Byrd who dubbed him that. You know, HRC's mentor and Biden's buddy he gave the eulogy for at that klan funeral. :tu :lol

[rascal]

And you equal a big fucking pussy you dumbshit troll.

You fucking leftists vote in the last Dixiecrat and yall want to label us white supremacists? :lmao

Stay in the political forum and stay out of here.

[C-Dub]

Spurs will be a better team this season compared to last season. KJ, DV and Primo are all going to step up there game the same way DJM did for the Spurs after DDR, Patty and the other vets departed. Bigggest difference is that it will be more fun because the ball is going to stick in one person's hand as much as did with DJM. With Tre and Primo handling the rock more, those pick & rolls aren't going to just lead to a dump off to Jakob or a mid range J, it will lead to 2 to 3 more passes to an open shooter like DV or KJ. Should be entertaining and fun to watch. Now if the Spurs part ways with Jakob, Richardson and Mcbucketts, then I'll concede that they are tanking this upcoming season.

[Dex]

Happens every year. There was a stat years ago that only 50% of NBA FRPs go beyond their rookie deals with their drafting team. I’m sure it’s worse now, as more teams swing for the proverbial fence for upside.

I’m sure they tried to trade him, but most front offices are smarter than the Yahoos who post here, and by last year, even most of us saw that he was NBA junk food.

Not only that, but it seemed pretty clear the Spurs had no intention of extending him, so what team is gonna want to give up assets to secure a mid-lo tier talent instead of just taking a chance on him as a FA?

Apparently, that answer was...none teams.

[offset formation]

Lol "The Switch!"

Kiss the boot and while you're at it keep with those pathetic leftist talking points. :tu

Btw, show me here on ST what I've said that's racist. Just one example is all I ask of you. I doubt you'll find anything note worthy yet here you are acting all high and mighty while yall dumbfucks celebrate your last Dixiecrat in the WH. :lmao

Btw it wasn't me who claimed fuck face Biden was a Dixiecrat but his long lost friend Robert KKK Byrd who dubbed him that. You know, HRC's mentor and Biden's buddy he gave the eulogy for at that klan funeral. :tu :lol

Sigh. Robert Byrd changed. Yes, he was a KKK member but evolved. By the end of his life and career, he was very much a civil rights champion. Try it sometime.

And for the record, I didn't mean to imply you are or have said racist things. I simply do not know you well enough to make such a statement. But you are evidently a member of a party that is undeniable racist. And that's not just an opinion of mine in the abstract. It's in the GOP policy initiatives they put forward. And policies they run on. Don't like the association? Sorry. Deal with it.

My last and final point. I'm not going to respond to anything else you have to say on this subject. It is undeniable that the GOP absorbed those former southern Democrats into their ranks. There are like a bazillion books on the matter. I'd happily give you a recommendation if I thought you'd actually open your closed mind to learning something new. Here's a hint though: Nixon and Reagan are on record openly talking about the strategy that began in the 20s to move disgruntled southern whites, through ignorance and misplaced grievances toward electoral victory. And while you laugh at, "the switch," ki dly tell me what was the dominant party in the south in the early to mid 1900s. And what has it been since LBJ rammed through the Civil Rights Act and Voting Rights Act, and then famously said doing so would end the possibility of Democrats winning there for a generation? Dixiecrats are today's Republicans. Any attempt to say otherwise is willful, sheer ignorance. You're welcome.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

Walker had no value in a trade. There's a reason why he's now on a one-year deal for a low-end price. Not sure LA will resurrect his career...we'll see. Hoping for a good season from him, just not the Lakers in general.

I respect the character he's shown in his departure.

[koriwhat]

Sigh. Robert Byrd changed. Yes, he was a KKK member but evolved. By the end of his life and career, he was very much a civil rights champion. Try it sometime.

And for the record, I didn't mean to imply you are or have said racist things. I simply do not know you well enough to make such a statement. But you are evidently a member of a party that is undeniable racist. And that's not just an opinion of mine in the abstract. It's in the GOP policy initiatives they put forward. And policies they run on. Don't like the association? Sorry. Deal with it.

My last and final point. I'm not going to respond to anything else you have to say on this subject. It is undeniable that the GOP absorbed those former southern Democrats into their ranks. There are like a bazillion books on the matter. I'd happily give you a recommendation if I thought you'd actually open your closed mind to learning something new. Here's a hint though: Nixon and Reagan are on record openly talking about the strategy that began in the 20s to move disgruntled southern whites, through ignorance and misplaced grievances toward electoral victory. And while you laugh at, "the switch," ki dly tell me what was the dominant party in the south in the early to mid 1900s. And what has it been since LBJ rammed through the Civil Rights Act and Voting Rights Act, and then famously said doing so would end the possibility of Democrats winning there for a generation? Dixiecrats are today's Republicans. Any attempt to say otherwise is willful, sheer ignorance. You're welcome.

You have a lot of nothing to say just like fat fuck Mono and the rest here.

Tell me bro, who's segregating students for their "safety" in schools, how about employees, ect? What ideology exactly and political affiliation?

Keep talking out your ass and sucking on Robert "I've evolved" KKK Byrd! Fucking loser!

[koriwhat]

Stay in the political forum and stay out of here.

Tell that to the person I was replying to and also stay in your own lane you fucking bitch. :tu

[Joseph Kony]

:lol calf tats getting regulated no matter what forum he posts in

[Rummpd]

Getting rid of a borderline allstar does not mean that the Spurs are going to tank this year. Without injuries to other voted in allstar players, DJM would not be an allstar YET. It's not like the Spurs got rid of a top tier player to suggest a tank move in the works. If they are tanking, they were already tanking, which they weren't.

Going to be better ball movement this year with Tre and Primo running the point. Not saying that the Spurs will have a better record than last year, but I don't believe it's going to be that far off to consider it tanking. In the grand scheme of things, letting go off DJM could very well mean addition by subtraction!

The problem is not getting rid of another fine player (best on team by far) but getting rolled again in return. No surprise here this FO is a pathetic joke and has been for years and yes the Spurs regression to abject mediocrity continues unabated

[J_Paco]

The problem is not getting rid of another fine player (best on team by far) but getting rolled again in return. No surprise here this FO is a pathetic joke and has been for years and yes the Spurs regression to abject mediocrity continues unabated

How are the Washington Wizards doing, again? I would take your opinion seriously if it was for the fact that you think Washington (my local team) has a brighter future. :lol

[KingKev]

How are the Washington Wizards doing, again? I would take your opinion seriously if it was for the fact that you think Washington (my local team) has a brighter future. :lol

Washington, Sacramento, San Antonio are easily worst front offices in the NBA last few years.

[slick'81]

Washington, Sacramento, San Antonio are easily worst front offices in the NBA last few years.

this is a sad reality unfortunately

[Sugus]

Washington, Sacramento, San Antonio are easily worst front offices in the NBA last few years.

Delusional.

There's no other word to describe the comparing of Wash and SAC's FOs (and terrible, terrible moves) to those of SanAn's. Simply delusional.

But since you'll clearly disagree, do say which of SA's moves are as comparably bad as Beal's contract or Sac trading Hali away. Maybe you're a Dejounte truther? :lol

[KingKev]

Delusional.

There's no other word to describe the comparing of Wash and SAC's FOs (and terrible, terrible moves) to those of SanAn's. Simply delusional.

But since you'll clearly disagree, do say which of SA's moves are as comparably bad as Beal's contract or Sac trading Hali away. Maybe you're a Dejounte truther? :lol

In the last 5 years we are a distant third.

[GAustex]

DeMarre Carroll was pathetic

[rascal]

Washington, Sacramento, San Antonio are easily worst front offices in the NBA last few years.

How about the Knicks

[couchman]

Just saw the schedule come out.
We might go 2-12 to start the year.
Tanking or not tanking, it won't matter.
This roster can't keep up in the western conference.

[The Truth #6]

In the last 5 years we are a distant third.

I think from our Kawhi trade to having to cut Luka, we we’re pretty awful or at least those years felt awful. It was all short term moves to stay competitive and for Pop to get his record, which he deserves to do, despite how horrible the DDR years were as a fan, but the draft picks were average for the most part, with league average misses. I also think Brian Wright was learning on the job. But with our DJ trade, our more recent picks, I generally think Wright is doing a good to very good job. (Primo pick will need more time to assess, ie not much to love so far).

Anyway, I think now after getting Pop’s record we are finally doing what we need to. The problem for me with holding off on rebuilding for so long is that fan interest and motivation and attendance has gotten so bad that now we have to deal with the possibility of ownership getting cold feet. If they had committed to rebuilding at the point of the Kawhi trade, there would probably be more fan interest at this point. Instead, we’ve been getting worse every single year since Kawhi left, which is having a definite impact on fan interest.

[KingKev]

I think from our Kawhi trade to having to cut Luka, we we’re pretty awful or at least those years felt awful. It was all short term moves to stay competitive and for Pop to get his record, which he deserves to do, despite how horrible the DDR years were as a fan, but the draft picks were average for the most part, with league average misses. I also think Brian Wright was learning on the job. But with our DJ trade, our more recent picks, I generally think Wright is doing a good to very good job. (Primo pick will need more time to assess, ie not much to love so far).

Anyway, I think now after getting Pop’s record we are finally doing what we need to. The problem for me with holding off on rebuilding for so long is that fan interest in motivation and attendance has gotten so bad but now we have to deal with the possibility of ownership getting cold feet. If they had committed to rebuilding at the point of the Kawhi trade, there would probably be more fan interest at this point. Instead, we’ve been getting worse every single year since Kawhi left, which is having a definite impact on fan interest.

I agree. Whoever has been pulling the trigger since the trade deadline has a brain.

The moves, and even worse non moves PATFO made since 2017-18 have been alarming and scream a front office who has no clue what they are doing. Can’t keep riding Tim, Tony and Manu’s coattails. Only so many bobble head nights you can do.

We will finally bottom out when Pop retires and from there the true rebuild begins; 5 years late.

[The Truth #6]

For me, it’s perhaps not about competency but goals.

Yes, they milked whatever they could out of Mills, (was Marco here?/I’ve blocked out his memory evidently), LA, DDR and even signed McBuckets to try and get just enough wins for Pop to stumble into first place wins last year.

I think it’s deserved in the big picture but antithetical to what he preaches, so that’s annoying, but understandable. The draft picks of Lonnie, Luka, and possibly Primo are a separate issue than just milking veterans, but we did great with Tre Jones and Keldon late in the draft so it’s not all bad. So anyway, there’s an argument that the FO hasn’t been “bad” but just had highly questionable motivations. Because, again, as soon as Pop got his record, not long after, DJ is gone and the rebuild is on.

[Seventyniner]

Why would the Spurs have made "win now" moves recently to get Pop the record if he was going to stick around anyway? Even a terrible team will almost certainly win 35 games over two years.

Unless Pop had planned to retire this offseason all along and changed his mind?

[R. DeMurre]

For me, it’s perhaps not about competency but goals.

Yes, they milked whatever they could out of Mills, (was Marco here?/I’ve blocked out his memory evidently), LA, DDR and even signed McBuckets to try and get just enough wins for Pop to stumble into first place wins last year.

I think it’s deserved in the big picture but antithetical to what he preaches, so that’s annoying, but understandable. The draft picks of Lonnie, Luka, and possibly Primo are a separate issue than just milking veterans, but we did great with Tre Jones and Keldon late in the draft so it’s not all bad. So anyway, there’s an argument that the FO hasn’t been “bad” but just had highly questionable motivations. Because, again, as soon as Pop got his record, not long after, DJ is gone and the rebuild is on.


For me, the post-Kawhi years were frustrating because the Spurs moved away from what had traditionally made them great while also taking half measures to stay current with the more successful evolving NBA concepts. I remember one particular time while watching a game where the announcer of the opposing team was going on about how Pop and the Spurs emphasized a "defense first" philosophy, and said if someone didn't play D they wouldn't see the floor... at that moment, Mills, Forbes, and DeRozan were on the floor at the same time... For a number of years, we had all of these 3 pt shooting specialists who were defensive liabilities, but the Spurs were still at the bottom of the league in 3 pt attempts. That seemed like a self-defeating approach. And then to go along with the low frequency of 3 pt shooting, they tried to buck the trend with a two-pronged midrange offense of Aldridge and DeRozan, which really never had a shot at succeeding, so that wasn't much fun to watch. I'm glad they have a clearer direction now, and loved the Sochan pick, but for me there was definitely a sluggish period of relative aimlessness that was frustrating to watch. Oh well-- onward!

[The Truth #6]

RD: I see your point. My response would be that they saw two stars in DDR and LA and tried to plug holes and find role players to fill deficiencies (to get Pop the record). I’m analyzing here not agreeing. I hated that era more than any other in the history of the team.

[jjspur]

For me, it’s perhaps not about competency but goals.

Yes, they milked whatever they could out of Mills, (was Marco here?/I’ve blocked out his memory evidently), LA, DDR and even signed McBuckets to try and get just enough wins for Pop to stumble into first place wins last year.

I think it’s deserved in the big picture but antithetical to what he preaches, so that’s annoying, but understandable. The draft picks of Lonnie, Luka, and possibly Primo are a separate issue than just milking veterans, but we did great with Tre Jones and Keldon late in the draft so it’s not all bad. So anyway, there’s an argument that the FO hasn’t been “bad” but just had highly questionable motivations. Because, again, as soon as Pop got his record, not long after, DJ is gone and the rebuild is on.

There are probably several voices in the spurs front office saying totally different things. Sometimes during the draft they agree to swing for the fences (Luka) , and sometimes they go with the safe choice (Devin Vassell). Same goes with the direction of the team. They tried to make it work with DDR and Aldridge with rather limited success and now they're doing the opposite going with the youngsters. Losing your coaching talent can also change the team direction with stubborn Pop being the last holdover.

It comes down to what you can do with the talent you have and right now we don't have enough to compete. It used to be we drafted talent to compliment our big 3 but we don't have a big 3 any more. We don't even have an "all star" any more.

So this year is going to be a tough one. We will try to develop our young remaining players and our new rookies at the same time, all the while "tanking " but trying not to look like we're tanking like Portland did last year. The goal is to develop our young players, develop our rookies and finish bad enough to draft someone who might be an all star some day. We are starting all over and hopefully we draft a player that our current young players and rookies can compliment. Its a decent strategy, but I think that's what we do in the sort term with what we have and what we have done so far. Maybe someone in the spurs front office surprises us with a trade somewhere and speeds up the process a bit.

[The Truth #6]

Why would the Spurs have made "win now" moves recently to get Pop the record if he was going to stick around anyway? Even a terrible team will almost certainly win 35 games over two years.

Unless Pop had planned to retire this offseason all along and changed his mind?

I’m just speculating on a hypothesis, so to speak. If perhaps you were speaking directly to, why did they sign McBuckets, I’m not totally sure, but I think they had no idea how good or bad they would be this last season, and they probably didn’t think DJ would be as good as he was.

And, I think it’s entirely possible that Pop pulls an Irish Farewell and retires right before the season and Brown takes over. I mean, it’s not outrageous and more likely tgan he sticks around for two more seasons.

[slick'81]

I’m just speculating on a hypothesis, so to speak. If perhaps you were speaking directly to, why did they sign McBuckets, I’m not totally sure, but I think they had no idea how good or bad they would be this last season, and they probably didn’t think DJ would be as good as he was.

And, I think it’s entirely possible that Pop pulls an Irish Farewell and retires right before the season and Brown takes over. I mean, it’s not outrageous and more likely tgan he sticks around for two more seasons.


pop is most definitely coaching this season

[spurraider21]

:lmao

[offset formation]

:lmao

Ha ha. Savage bump.

[baseline bum]

Can't wait to see the Alamodome filled with 35,000 Golden State fans in a 50 point loss in January.

[slick'81]

Sniffers gonna sniff

[scott]

81-1 still in play, tbqh

[rascal]

Delusional.

There's no other word to describe the comparing of Wash and SAC's FOs (and terrible, terrible moves) to those of SanAn's. Simply delusional.

But since you'll clearly disagree, do say which of SA's moves are as comparably bad as Beal's contract or Sac trading Hali away. Maybe you're a Dejounte truther? :lol

Spurs have made a few mistakes to fall into being the worst team in the league.

[K...]

Spurs have made a few mistakes to fall into being the worst team in the league.

No they haven't. The edgy position is that we should've tanked sooner. Since 2014 its been a pretty slow decline. Thats amazing management. Some people want the spurs to win the league or the lottery every season but thats not reasonable.

[offset formation]

81-1 still in play, tbqh

Wonder how many universe simulations it takes to make this come true...

[elege]

"Wonder how many universe simulations it takes to make this come true..."


Find the one where Putin drops a nuke on the NBA All Star game. Get rid of all the major stars and we know there will be no Spurs there.

[Sugus]

Spurs have made a few mistakes to fall into being the worst team in the league.
K... is exactly right. Even though I'll easily concede the Spurs FO has been far from perfect, suggesting that being the worst team in the league IN A VACUUM == a Kings/Wash level FO, is disingenuous at best, and terribly obtuse at worst. The Spurs aren't a terrible team because they had all the talent in the world, and mismanaged it, or locked themselves into paying Max money for mediocre players (cough Fox, cough Beal); they slowly decayed after a championship and aging-out of their HOF core, went all-in on keeping the fire going under their new superstar (Nephew), and said superstar just so happened to want to get the fuck out of SanAn.

Whatever happened afterwards is just a consequence of that fundamental, fatal flaw. Could they have started tanking sooner? Yes, maybe. But if you understand that the Spurs as an Org have more goals than just "championship or bust" like so many people here like to think (and yes, Pop's record was indubitably one of them), then what's the critique? That they haven't been doing things your way?

Again, call me when they start making SAC/WASH level moves, like both clubs have (once again) fucked up their futures and locked up their presents.

[baseline bum]

Again, call me when they start making SAC/WASH level moves, like both clubs have (once again) fucked up their futures and locked up their presents.

Primo could be our Stauskas

[poopbox]

Spurs have made a few mistakes to fall into being the worst team in the league.

Since the Kawhi trade we are in consideration for the worst front office in the nba tbh...

Spurs are not tanking because they want to...they are tanking because virtually every other team in the nba has passed them by...

It's crazy to think that this entire franchise with all its great players and history and championship no hinges on the future of a player who isn't even on the team yet...

Everything from "spurs traded for demar derozan" until now has been terrible...

[BacktoBasics]

Since the Kawhi trade we are in consideration for the worst front office in the nba tbh...

Spurs are not tanking because they want to...they are tanking because virtually every other team in the nba has passed them by...

It's crazy to think that this entire franchise with all its great players and history and championship no hinges on the future of a player who isn't even on the team yet...

Everything from "spurs traded for demar derozan" until now has been terrible...You clearly pride yourself on providing the most dickless negative spin possible. You go out of your way to needle into shit post pandering so much so that other malcontents here seems upbeat and interesting.

I don’t consider people like you to be fans and certainly miles away from being analytical in any kind of reasonable sense. There’s absolutely room to be critical and provocative here since we’re right in the middle of a rebuild.

However posters like you are the absolute worst representation of a sports franchise fan base that could possibly exist.

If you tragically killed yourself tomorrow the entire world would be better off for it. Literally no one benefits from your existence including yourself.

I’d rather console ducks over his dead kid than save you from drowning. That’s how bad you are.

[KingKev]

Delusional.

There's no other word to describe the comparing of Wash and SAC's FOs (and terrible, terrible moves) to those of SanAn's. Simply delusional.

But since you'll clearly disagree, do say which of SA's moves are as comparably bad as Beal's contract or Sac trading Hali away. Maybe you're a Dejounte truther? :lol


In the last 5 years we are a distant third.


Since the Kawhi trade we are in consideration for the worst front office in the nba tbh...


Spurs are not tanking because they want to... they tanking because virtually every other team in the nba has passed them by...

It's crazy to think that this entire franchise with all its great players and history and championship no hinges on the future of a player who isn't even on the team yet...

Everything from "spurs traded for demar derozan" until now has been terrible...

Fucking preach. If they could make the play-in this year they absolutely would.

This is an organic bottoming out because PATFO have been fking hopeless in many regards since TD retired.

From failure to adopt 3 pt shooting, to not adopting a player friendly culture for athletes who are making money and SUPER TALENTED, to needless dead cap it’s endless.

Drafting culture and glue guys over talent etc etc.

The only thing we do well outside of social justice is develop players. Thankfully we can be confident we will finally start developing young players who already have a decent base because we are going to be a bottom 5 team for a few years. That is reason to be optimistic.

[rascal]

K... is exactly right. Even though I'll easily concede the Spurs FO has been far from perfect, suggesting that being the worst team in the league IN A VACUUM == a Kings/Wash level FO, is disingenuous at best, and terribly obtuse at worst. The Spurs aren't a terrible team because they had all the talent in the world, and mismanaged it, or locked themselves into paying Max money for mediocre players (cough Fox, cough Beal); they slowly decayed after a championship and aging-out of their HOF core, went all-in on keeping the fire going under their new superstar (Nephew), and said superstar just so happened to want to get the fuck out of SanAn.

Whatever happened afterwards is just a consequence of that fundamental, fatal flaw. Could they have started tanking sooner? Yes, maybe. But if you understand that the Spurs as an Org have more goals than just "championship or bust" like so many people here like to think (and yes, Pop's record was indubitably one of them), then what's the critique? That they haven't been doing things your way?

Again, call me when they start making SAC/WASH level moves, like both clubs have (once again) fucked up their futures and locked up their presents.

They mismanaged K Leonard

[tbdog]

They mismanaged Leonard's personality. Not his injury.

[rascal]

If Robinson and Duncan didn't fall in the Spurs laps they would be no better than Sac and Washington.

[slick'81]

If Robinson and Duncan didn't fall in the Spurs laps they would be no better than Sac and Washington.

Spurs wouldn't even be in sa

[rascal]

They mismanaged Leonard's personality. Not his injury.

Don't put all the blame on the Kawhi Leonard side, Spurs are responsible also.

[offset formation]

You clearly pride yourself on providing the most dickless negative spin possible. You go out of your way to needle into shit post pandering so much so that other malcontents here seems upbeat and interesting.

I don’t consider people like you to be fans and certainly miles away from being analytical in any kind of reasonable sense. There’s absolutely room to be critical and provocative here since we’re right in the middle of a rebuild.

However posters like you are the absolute worst representation of a sports franchise fan base that could possibly exist.

If you tragically killed yourself tomorrow the entire world would be better off for it. Literally no one benefits from your existence including yourself.

I’d rather console ducks over his dead kid than save you from drowning. That’s how bad you are.

It's funny because I used to think the same of some of our more negative posters here and was a happy member and founding member of the self-identifying sunshine pumper club. But now I see poopbox's post as 100% rational whether or not I'm fully in agreement. Negativity is not innately a bad thing if what is being analyzed requires a negative critique.

The Spurs are now inarguably in the midst of what could be a potentially existential phase in their franchise history, as unfathomable as that is to believe even 1 year ago. If we miss out on several more picks that will greatly alter our trajectory and run into multiple losing seasons in a row as other teams like the Kings and Orlando have had, I'm not so sure the Spurs survive in San Antonio. That's worthy of negativity

[BacktoBasics]

It's funny because I used to think the same of some of our more negative posters here and was a happy member and founding member of the self-identifying sunshine pumper club. But now I see poopbox's post as 100% rational whether or not I'm fully in agreement. Negativity is not innately a bad thing if what is being analyzed requires a negative critique.

The Spurs are now inarguably in the midst of what could be a potentially existential phase in their franchise history, as unfathomable as that is to believe even 1 year ago. If we miss out on several more picks that will greatly alter our trajectory and run into multiple losing seasons in a row as other teams like the Kings and Orlando have had, I'm not so sure the Spurs survive in San Antonio. That's worthy of negativity
No one with any real intelligence believes that the Spurs have missed out on an exorbitant amount of picks. They’ve done well in the draft.

This group seemingly thinks that not turning out all stars with late 1sts somehow equates to shit drafting.

[KingKev]

They mismanaged Leonard's personality. Not his injury.

Truth right here. PATFO had their code and didn’t back down. I can’t fault them in that but there were repercussions; such is life. Did they learn from it? I don’t think so.

[BacktoBasics]

Truth right here. PATFO had their code and didn’t back down. I can’t fault them in that but there were repercussions; such is life. Did they learn from it? I don’t think so.
What’s to learn? If you cater to this fuckwits personality you’ll get no games and no production out of him? Fuck Leonard.

[KingKev]

What’s to learn? If you cater to this fuckwits personality you’ll get no games and no production out of him? Fuck Leonard.

They can learn to manage personalities better, especially till we have a true cornerstone who leads by example.

No one gives AF about Pop anymore. They will patronize him based on his pedigree but they don’t want to actually
play for him. Why is that? San Antonio is a C level city but it’s not Alaska.

The real reason is Spurs culture needs a shakeup.

[TD 21]

:lmao At conflating his wanting out with his behavior and pretending the Spurs rigid, archaic ways absolve him of the latter.

[KingKev]

:lmao At conflating his wanting out with his behavior and pretending the Spurs rigid, archaic ways absolve him of the latter.

Not really what I was arguing. Your step daddy issues and self purported blackness aside, PATFO needs to learn to manage personalities better or atleast not shy away from talented guys who have some (perceived) stink on them.

:lmao

[offset formation]

No one with any real intelligence believes that the Spurs have missed out on an exorbitant amount of picks. They’ve done well in the draft.

This group seemingly thinks that not turning out all stars with late 1sts somehow equates to shit drafting.

We've missed enough that if we somehow or another miss on one of the top two players next year, even after a tank job, we are aligning ourselves for a run of bad years. Potentially enough that attendance falls off sufficiently to cause ownership to seek greener pastures.

And you kind of missed my point. It's not so much what we already did miss out on, and there were some misses, it's about what we could potentially miss out on that sets us up for a bad run of luck. Remembering of course that we just lost to another bottom barrel team in this league by nearly 30 at home, in the Pop era with all the advantages thats supposed to bring for player development. We are bad. And its gonna take a superstar or two to bring us out from the doldrums. Bad mojo cooking round this team right now.

[poopbox]

No one with any real intelligence believes that the Spurs have missed out on an exorbitant amount of picks. They’ve done well in the draft.

This group seemingly thinks that not turning out all stars with late 1sts somehow equates to shit drafting.

What? Of course we missed out on exorbitant picks. Every other team traded their franchise player for future picks and now have a top lottery pick to build around and we have what courtesy of the Kawhi Leonard trade?

The pelicans traded their franchise player to the lakers...which in turn netted them another franchise player AND now that the lakers are terrible they are in line to get pick swaps that might be lottery picks AGAIN. That's a fucking home run.

The houston rockets traded their franchise player and that netted them additional picks, allowed them to bottom out, and get the number 2 pick in the draft. Green at worst is going to be an elite level scorer. I think Sengun is going to be good as well. Homerun. Not a grand slam or a 3 run shot. But they have successfully flipped their franchise player into a younger franchise player and they still got picks coming their way.

OKC? They turned westbrook, chris paul, and paul george trades into owning damn near a 3rd of all 1st round picks over the next few years. It almost doesn't matter if Giddy, SGA, Chet, even pan out cause they have so many more draft picks coming. They flipped there 3 star players for arguably the largest draft haul in nba history. Home fucking run. Grand fucking slam.

And our front office, who had Kawhi Leonard, the best of the bunch...because if you ask anyone who is the best player out of Kawhi, Old Chris Paul, Anthony Davis, james harden, and paul george, I think it is pretty easily Kawhi...they turned that into Demar Derozan...Jakob Poeltl...and a draft pick that became Keldon Johnson. That's atrocious. That's sheer incompetence. They had the best two way player in the entire fucking league and the best they could do was turning it into a playoff choker, a center who can't defend centers or make 65% of his free throws, and a guy who is going to grade out as maybe a really good role player on a playoff team. Beyond bad. And don't give me this "but Kawhi tanked his value it was the best they could do" shit when Anthony Davis flat out wouldn't play for the pelicans and his father straight up told boston don't trade for him he won't sign there cause they got a kings ransom for him anyway. James Harden just flat out wouldn't practice with the Rockets and then when he played he sabotaged the team so much that players called him out on it and they still got 3 picks and 4 swaps for it. How did those players behave like straight up assholes but the teams still got a ransom for them but our player asks like an asshole and all we can get is Demar fucking Derozan? Are you kidding me.

Just this one trade alone is sheer incompetence. It shows that our front office just flat out didn't understand how current nba teams think. All they had to do was just send Kawhi home. Someone was going to get desperate and give up whatever we wanted for him. Just like the lakers got desperate and gave that up for AD who they could have just signed in a year. Just like the Nets got desperate and gave that up even though they already had two all nba players on their team. But not us, because our front office is to pussy to deal with player conflict, so we were stuck watching Derozan sulk around for a few yeas and then leave.

It's not about players turning into all stars. It's about our front office not being smart enough to even give us the chance to draft high end basketball talent that could turn into an all star.

[poopbox]

You clearly pride yourself on providing the most dickless negative spin possible. You go out of your way to needle into shit post pandering so much so that other malcontents here seems upbeat and interesting.

I don’t consider people like you to be fans and certainly miles away from being analytical in any kind of reasonable sense. There’s absolutely room to be critical and provocative here since we’re right in the middle of a rebuild.

However posters like you are the absolute worst representation of a sports franchise fan base that could possibly exist.

If you tragically killed yourself tomorrow the entire world would be better off for it. Literally no one benefits from your existence including yourself.

I’d rather console ducks over his dead kid than save you from drowning. That’s how bad you are.

Truth hurts :cry

I know it's hard to come to grips with the fact that your Daddy Gregg with two g's isn't the smartest man on earth...but it's true:cry

If I was you I wouldn't look at some of the other threads on this website where we discussed how Pop absolutely lied with his "we don't tank we don't lose on purpose that is not who we are" and then traded his starting backcourt for almost nothing but picks...cause you'd probably jump out the window having to live with the fact that your sports daddy lies to you just like your real daddy did when he said he loved you :cry

[mystargtr34]

Its only one game but the Hawks crowd and team was pumping on opening night against the Rockets. It looks like DJM is going to help them in areas they have been sorely lacking the last couple years, defense, intangibles, some nasty, bigger playmaker next to Trae etc.

Standing around watching Trae Young dribble dribble dribble and jack up 30 footers can be tiring. Squad seemed a lot more engaged, including John Collins.

[Vince Carter's ankle]

What? Of course we missed out on exorbitant picks. Every other team traded their franchise player for future picks and now have a top lottery pick to build around and we have what courtesy of the Kawhi Leonard trade?

The pelicans traded their franchise player to the lakers...which in turn netted them another franchise player AND now that the lakers are terrible they are in line to get pick swaps that might be lottery picks AGAIN. That's a fucking home run.

The houston rockets traded their franchise player and that netted them additional picks, allowed them to bottom out, and get the number 2 pick in the draft. Green at worst is going to be an elite level scorer. I think Sengun is going to be good as well. Homerun. Not a grand slam or a 3 run shot. But they have successfully flipped their franchise player into a younger franchise player and they still got picks coming their way.

OKC? They turned westbrook, chris paul, and paul george trades into owning damn near a 3rd of all 1st round picks over the next few years. It almost doesn't matter if Giddy, SGA, Chet, even pan out cause they have so many more draft picks coming. They flipped there 3 star players for arguably the largest draft haul in nba history. Home fucking run. Grand fucking slam.

And our front office, who had Kawhi Leonard, the best of the bunch...because if you ask anyone who is the best player out of Kawhi, Old Chris Paul, Anthony Davis, james harden, and paul george, I think it is pretty easily Kawhi...they turned that into Demar Derozan...Jakob Poeltl...and a draft pick that became Keldon Johnson. That's atrocious. That's sheer incompetence. They had the best two way player in the entire fucking league and the best they could do was turning it into a playoff choker, a center who can't defend centers or make 65% of his free throws, and a guy who is going to grade out as maybe a really good role player on a playoff team. Beyond bad. And don't give me this "but Kawhi tanked his value it was the best they could do" shit when Anthony Davis flat out wouldn't play for the pelicans and his father straight up told boston don't trade for him he won't sign there cause they got a kings ransom for him anyway. James Harden just flat out wouldn't practice with the Rockets and then when he played he sabotaged the team so much that players called him out on it and they still got 3 picks and 4 swaps for it. How did those players behave like straight up assholes but the teams still got a ransom for them but our player asks like an asshole and all we can get is Demar fucking Derozan? Are you kidding me.

Just this one trade alone is sheer incompetence. It shows that our front office just flat out didn't understand how current nba teams think. All they had to do was just send Kawhi home. Someone was going to get desperate and give up whatever we wanted for him. Just like the lakers got desperate and gave that up for AD who they could have just signed in a year. Just like the Nets got desperate and gave that up even though they already had two all nba players on their team. But not us, because our front office is to pussy to deal with player conflict, so we were stuck watching Derozan sulk around for a few yeas and then leave.

It's not about players turning into all stars. It's about our front office not being smart enough to even give us the chance to draft high end basketball talent that could turn into an all star.
Let's summarize.
You hate the Spurs culture, players, coaching staff and managers.
Why do you keep following the team? Is this some kind of sadomasochistic practice?

[rankingtear]

What? Of course we missed out on exorbitant picks. Every other team traded their franchise player for future picks and now have a top lottery pick to build around and we have what courtesy of the Kawhi Leonard trade?

The pelicans traded their franchise player to the lakers...which in turn netted them another franchise player AND now that the lakers are terrible they are in line to get pick swaps that might be lottery picks AGAIN. That's a fucking home run.

The houston rockets traded their franchise player and that netted them additional picks, allowed them to bottom out, and get the number 2 pick in the draft. Green at worst is going to be an elite level scorer. I think Sengun is going to be good as well. Homerun. Not a grand slam or a 3 run shot. But they have successfully flipped their franchise player into a younger franchise player and they still got picks coming their way.

OKC? They turned westbrook, chris paul, and paul george trades into owning damn near a 3rd of all 1st round picks over the next few years. It almost doesn't matter if Giddy, SGA, Chet, even pan out cause they have so many more draft picks coming. They flipped there 3 star players for arguably the largest draft haul in nba history. Home fucking run. Grand fucking slam.

And our front office, who had Kawhi Leonard, the best of the bunch...because if you ask anyone who is the best player out of Kawhi, Old Chris Paul, Anthony Davis, james harden, and paul george, I think it is pretty easily Kawhi...they turned that into Demar Derozan...Jakob Poeltl...and a draft pick that became Keldon Johnson. That's atrocious. That's sheer incompetence. They had the best two way player in the entire fucking league and the best they could do was turning it into a playoff choker, a center who can't defend centers or make 65% of his free throws, and a guy who is going to grade out as maybe a really good role player on a playoff team. Beyond bad. And don't give me this "but Kawhi tanked his value it was the best they could do" shit when Anthony Davis flat out wouldn't play for the pelicans and his father straight up told boston don't trade for him he won't sign there cause they got a kings ransom for him anyway. James Harden just flat out wouldn't practice with the Rockets and then when he played he sabotaged the team so much that players called him out on it and they still got 3 picks and 4 swaps for it. How did those players behave like straight up assholes but the teams still got a ransom for them but our player asks like an asshole and all we can get is Demar fucking Derozan? Are you kidding me.

Just this one trade alone is sheer incompetence. It shows that our front office just flat out didn't understand how current nba teams think. All they had to do was just send Kawhi home. Someone was going to get desperate and give up whatever we wanted for him. Just like the lakers got desperate and gave that up for AD who they could have just signed in a year. Just like the Nets got desperate and gave that up even though they already had two all nba players on their team. But not us, because our front office is to pussy to deal with player conflict, so we were stuck watching Derozan sulk around for a few yeas and then leave.

It's not about players turning into all stars. It's about our front office not being smart enough to even give us the chance to draft high end basketball talent that could turn into an all star.

We tried though. Magic Johnson laughed at us for asking for multiple picks. It was a different market then. FO are afraid of becoming BKN. The AD trade set the market.

[RC_Drunkford]

some of us knew in the 2017 offseason when the Gasol and Mills extensions happened, that this was the beginning of the end

[Ice009]

some of us knew in the 2017 offseason when the Gasol and Mills extensions happened, that this was the beginning of the end

I HATED those signings. I remember repeatedly saying that if I was Kawhi, I'd ask out. I'm not sure if those signings had even a little bit to do with him wanting out, but I didn't think it would actually happen a year later.

[Extra Stout]

The Spurs made the choice in 2018 to try to stay competitive rather than blowing it all up when they traded Leonard. It netted one low playoff berth and three years of play-in mediocrity with that “competitive” core. So now they’re four years down the road with little to show for that choice, and just now starting the long road of rebuilding they eschewed back then.

Maybe they have “goals” of one sort or another, but the reality is that they are already in the longest playoff drought in franchise history, and obviously will shatter the franchise record for consecutive losing seasons before they are ever competitive again. This is the worst position they ever have been in.

Is all that worth the 7th seed in 2019 and a few play-in losses?

[offset formation]

The Spurs made the choice in 2018 to try to stay competitive rather than blowing it all up when they traded Leonard. It netted one low playoff berth and three years of play-in mediocrity with that “competitive” core. So now they’re four years down the road with little to show for that choice, and just now starting the long road of rebuilding they eschewed back then.

Maybe they have “goals” of one sort or another, but the reality is that they are already in the longest playoff drought in franchise history, and obviously will shatter the franchise record for consecutive losing seasons before they are ever competitive again. This is the worst position they ever have been in.

Is all that worth the 7th seed in 2019 and a few play-in losses?

Spot on, and admittedly, I was late to that party...

But to me, the bigger and ultimately most important question is whether or not that unavoidable run of losing seasons we are now in the midst of completely tanks the attendance and other sponsorships aside from the Frost and HEB ones.

And to me, it's clear it completely rides on getting Wembanyama. Not only will he make the team better probably by 10+ wins overnight, people will crowd in to watch him play, even when we still generally suck. Landing another player outside the top two or three in this upcoming draft will be dangerous for this team's future as it simply may not move the needle much.

Edit for additional context:
For example, this is the first year in forever that I won't be going to any games or paying for a subscription to watch them. I won't be the only one. And imagine what a economic downturn does to attendance of a 6-28 (or whatever) team...

[K...]

some of us knew in the 2017 offseason when the Gasol and Mills extensions happened, that this was the beginning of the end

Oh it wasn't HOF top five Duncan retiring? That wasn't the thing? Did you quit the spurs when they signed franky elson, Garry Neal, the centerpiece? Richard Jeff?. Cuz mills and gasol were better than those scrubs. These new age spurs fans who think 2014 was the norm will kill me. Spurs have always used scrubs. It just mattered less with duncan because he was good

[rankingtear]

The Spurs made the choice in 2018 to try to stay competitive rather than blowing it all up when they traded Leonard. It netted one low playoff berth and three years of play-in mediocrity with that “competitive” core. So now they’re four years down the road with little to show for that choice, and just now starting the long road of rebuilding they eschewed back then.

Maybe they have “goals” of one sort or another, but the reality is that they are already in the longest playoff drought in franchise history, and obviously will shatter the franchise record for consecutive losing seasons before they are ever competitive again. This is the worst position they ever have been in.

Is all that worth the 7th seed in 2019 and a few play-in losses?

Maybe they just don't want half empty arenas.

[Ice009]

It was the amount of money they gave Gasol and Mills. Most of those other guys didn't get paid that much.

[Extra Stout]

Maybe they just don't want half empty arenas.
The bill comes due eventually. Now with accrued interest.

[poopbox]

Let's summarize.
You hate the Spurs culture, players, coaching staff and managers.
Why do you keep following the team? Is this some kind of sadomasochistic practice?

How does me pointing out their egregious mistakes equate to me hating them?

It's just a truthful critique of how bad they were in this situation.

It's shocking how many posters on this site aren't emotionally mature enough to understand that critique or criticism doesn't equal dislike or hate.

I don't like the way this pizza taste doesn't equal i hate all pizza everywhere all the time in any situation.

[Vince Carter's ankle]

How does me pointing out their egregious mistakes equate to me hating them?

It's just a truthful critique of how bad they were in this situation.

It's shocking how many posters on this site aren't emotionally mature enough to understand that critique or criticism doesn't equal dislike or hate.

I don't like the way this pizza taste doesn't equal i hate all pizza everywhere all the time in any situation.
You don't hate all pizza, only South Texas pizza. c:

[poopbox]

We tried though. Magic Johnson laughed at us for asking for multiple picks. It was a different market then. FO are afraid of becoming BKN. The AD trade set the market.

I disagree with "we tried". Magic could say what he wants, but lets see what he has to say when the lakers are struggling and lebron is in his ear to get him some help, i am very confident he is going to pick up that phone and say what is it going to take to get kawhi. Because all they had to do to get Anthony Davis and keep their young players and all their picks was wait a year. That's it. Just wait. Just let time pass. But they didn't. They gave up every young asset they had except for Kuzma. They gave up every immediate 1st round pick they had AND pick swaps.

In situations like this teams always get desperate and pay the kings ransom. The funny thing about it is even in the one instance that a team doesn't...Kevin Durant in Brooklyn...the Nets were smart enough to just not trade him. He asked for the GM to be fired. They didn't care they didn't trade him. He asked for the coach to be fired. They didn't care they didn't trade him. And now here he is about to slog through another dysfunctional season in brooklyn, because Brooklyn is smart enough to understand its better to be an uncomfortable trainwreck in front of everyone than to get food stamps on the dollar for a top tier nba player, like we did. Somebodies going to come with that god offer with Durant. Or Durant is just going to have to suck it up and play in Brooklyn. Brooklyn front office is fine with either result.

[rankingtear]

The bill comes due eventually. Now with accrued interest.

There is still an NBA team in Sacramento and they don't play home games outside their arena. Some teams just can't afford it. Thank the tech billionaires for this rebuild.

[rankingtear]

I disagree with "we tried". Magic could say what he wants, but lets see what he has to say when the lakers are struggling and lebron is in his ear to get him some help, i am very confident he is going to pick up that phone and say what is it going to take to get kawhi. Because all they had to do to get Anthony Davis and keep their young players and all their picks was wait a year. That's it. Just wait. Just let time pass. But they didn't. They gave up every young asset they had except for Kuzma. They gave up every immediate 1st round pick they had AND pick swaps.

In situations like this teams always get desperate and pay the kings ransom. The funny thing about it is even in the one instance that a team doesn't...Kevin Durant in Brooklyn...the Nets were smart enough to just not trade him. He asked for the GM to be fired. They didn't care they didn't trade him. He asked for the coach to be fired. They didn't care they didn't trade him. And now here he is about to slog through another dysfunctional season in brooklyn, because Brooklyn is smart enough to understand its better to be an uncomfortable trainwreck in front of everyone than to get food stamps on the dollar for a top tier nba player, like we did. Somebodies going to come with that god offer with Durant. Or Durant is just going to have to suck it up and play in Brooklyn. Brooklyn front office is fine with either result.

We can't wait a year Kawhi is expiring. Durant has 4 years left on his deal. We waited half a year to trade Kawhi and the offer went down. What are you saying.

[TXstbobcat]

It's funny because I used to think the same of some of our more negative posters here and was a happy member and founding member of the self-identifying sunshine pumper club. But now I see poopbox's post as 100% rational whether or not I'm fully in agreement. Negativity is not innately a bad thing if what is being analyzed requires a negative critique.

The Spurs are now inarguably in the midst of what could be a potentially existential phase in their franchise history, as unfathomable as that is to believe even 1 year ago. If we miss out on several more picks that will greatly alter our trajectory and run into multiple losing seasons in a row as other teams like the Kings and Orlando have had, I'm not so sure the Spurs survive in San Antonio. That's worthy of negativity

The determining factor in whether the spurs have a long-term future in San Antonio is going to do be determined by whether they get a new arena in the next 5 to 7 years. If the answer is no they are definitely leaving SA. Multiple losing seasons and continued decline in fan support in my opinion will lead to SA saying no to the spurs on a new arena.

The city of San Antonio doesn’t even run the VIA Park and ride busses to and from Spurs games anymore due to a lack of fan usage.

[RC_Drunkford]

Oh it wasn't HOF top five Duncan retiring? That wasn't the thing? Did you quit the spurs when they signed franky elson, Garry Neal, the centerpiece? Richard Jeff?. Cuz mills and gasol were better than those scrubs. These new age spurs fans who think 2014 was the norm will kill me. Spurs have always used scrubs. It just mattered less with duncan because he was good

the fuck does Duncan retiring have to do with that? The 2017 Spurs were better than the 16 Spurs. It was after Zaza where they should've looked to further improve instead of resigning old vets. Mills earned double of what he earns in Brooklyn per season now, and Gasol still got paid by the Spurs once he was out of the league. Those were clearly bad deals.

[RC_Drunkford]

a lot of people here still got Pop's dick in their mouth

[Vince Carter's ankle]

Mills earned double of what he earns in Brooklyn per season now
And he was 6 years younger.

Which free agent would keep Kawhi in SA?
Free agent market 2017:
1) Steph, Lowry, Jrue, George Hill, Jeff Teague
2) J.J. Redick, Dion Waiters, Caldwell-Pope, Hardaway Jr.
3) Durant, Hayward, Porter, Iguodala, Gay
4) Griffin, Millsap, Ibaka, Gallinari, JaMychal Green, James Johnson, Nowitzki
5) Noel, Olynyk, Plumlee, Nene

[poopbox]

We can't wait a year Kawhi is expiring. Durant has 4 years left on his deal. We waited half a year to trade Kawhi and the offer went down. What are you saying.

The offer didn't "go down". The spurs just didn't have the patience for the offers to come up. They didn't have the patience for a team to get desperate and give them whatever they wanted for Kawhi.

Just like Brooklyn got offers for Durant. And they didn't like any of those offers. So Durant stays in Brooklyn.

The spurs didn't want to deal with a player who might say fire the GM. Who might say fire the coach. So they decided to just ship him out for the best they thought they could get. That was a dumb mistake. You don't trade a player of that magnitude for "the best you can get". Because if you wait you can always get better.

[K...]

a lot of people here still got Pop's dick in their mouth

Any dickwad could point out, once duncan left we weren't winning anything. Saying the spurs fucked up is just agenda setting. Theres nothing to fuck up. Offhand comments “it was over when they gave patty a loyalty contract. " are moronic.

[RC_Drunkford]

Any dickwad could point out, once duncan left we weren't winning anything. Saying the spurs fucked up is just agenda setting. Theres nothing to fuck up. Offhand comments “it was over when they gave patty a loyalty contract. " are moronic.

the Spurs were in the WCF up 30 in Golden State. They were the 2nd best team in the league at that point. They were clearly still contending. You changing your mind 5 years later doesn't change that

[RC_Drunkford]

And he was 6 years younger.

Which free agent would keep Kawhi in SA?
Free agent market 2017:
1) Steph, Lowry, Jrue, George Hill, Jeff Teague
2) J.J. Redick, Dion Waiters, Caldwell-Pope, Hardaway Jr.
3) Durant, Hayward, Porter, Iguodala, Gay
4) Griffin, Millsap, Ibaka, Gallinari, JaMychal Green, James Johnson, Nowitzki
5) Noel, Olynyk, Plumlee, Nene

none except maybe Paul George who said he was down to team up with nephew in San Antonio. That doesn't make the Mills and Gasol contracts any better

[TD 21]

Not really what I was arguing. Your step daddy issues and self purported blackness aside, PATFO needs to learn to manage personalities better or atleast not shy away from talented guys who have some (perceived) stink on them.

:lmao

In a roundabout way, it's always what you're arguing: That anything having to do with not just the organization, but the city itself is third rate and virtually everything anywhere else is amazing.

As I've long said, they either need to change their stripes (not happening) or at least get some intestinal fortitude and show a backbone for once when one of these pukes sounds off on them (also not happening).

:lmao Once again wrong on both counts about me personally. Keep fishing.

[JPB]

If we get Victor next year, not tanking 3-4 years ago will prove brilliant tbh...

[offset formation]

The determining factor in whether the spurs have a long-term future in San Antonio is going to do be determined by whether they get a new arena in the next 5 to 7 years. If the answer is no they are definitely leaving SA. Multiple losing seasons and continued decline in fan support in my opinion will lead to SA saying no to the spurs on a new arena.

The city of San Antonio doesn’t even run the VIA Park and ride busses to and from Spurs games anymore due to a lack of fan usage.

Agree. Chicken and egg argument though to some extent...a new stadium is almost a given if the Spurs are rocking a young and ostensibly really talented team with a potential generational talent like Wembanyama. If we don't get those kind of players we will be mired in mediocrity at best and people won't attend the games. Those two factors are very intricately intertwined.

[offset formation]

If we get Victor next year, not tanking 3-4 years ago will prove brilliant tbh...

CIA Pop with the Chef's kiss on the way out the door to humble us all.

[CGD]

DJM ballin in ATL. That team is fun to watch, as is Orlando who they played last night.

[Thomas82]

The Spurs made the choice in 2018 to try to stay competitive rather than blowing it all up when they traded Leonard. It netted one low playoff berth and three years of play-in mediocrity with that “competitive” core. So now they’re four years down the road with little to show for that choice, and just now starting the long road of rebuilding they eschewed back then.

Maybe they have “goals” of one sort or another, but the reality is that they are already in the longest playoff drought in franchise history, and obviously will shatter the franchise record for consecutive losing seasons before they are ever competitive again. This is the worst position they ever have been in.

Is all that worth the 7th seed in 2019 and a few play-in losses?

And if they keep going down this road, they won't survive in San Antonio.

[Thomas82]

The determining factor in whether the spurs have a long-term future in San Antonio is going to do be determined by whether they get a new arena in the next 5 to 7 years. If the answer is no they are definitely leaving SA. Multiple losing seasons and continued decline in fan support in my opinion will lead to SA saying no to the spurs on a new arena.

The city of San Antonio doesn’t even run the VIA Park and ride busses to and from Spurs games anymore due to a lack of fan usage.

That's why the upcoming draft is so critical.

[cd98]

What the hell are we doing? How do we beat Indiana? and 76ers? I go away for one weekend and the Spurs start winning games that they should easily be losing. I mean, Indiana is our tanking competition and 76ers, really? How do they lose to the Spurs?