what happened to the spurs' drafting?

[gambit1990]

sure, the league caught up to drafting foreigners, but did the spurs lose personnel that helped with drafting? scouts, higher ups, etc?

spurs picks from 99 to 08:
• manu
• tony
• (to a lesser extent) john salmons
• scola
• (to a lesser extent) leandro barbosa
• splitter
• dragic

and before you laugh about me mentioning john salmons, that dude would be the 3rd most serviceable player the spurs have drafted over the past 14 years.

the best players the spurs have drafted over the last 14 years: dejounte, keldon... derrick white... then kyle anderson?

[gambit1990]

kudos to the spurs acquiring kawhi on draft night. the pacers drafted him though.

[ChumpDumper]

Have you been watching the San Antonio Spurs this season?

It really looks like you haven't.

[tim_duncan_fan]

It's not like we have been swimming in top 5 picks, and other teams check for players from other continents now.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

kudos to the spurs acquiring kawhi on draft night. the pacers drafted him though.

Lol. Nice recovery.

[rankingtear]

You don't watch the spurs. Stop making threads you troll.

[gambit1990]

Have you been watching the San Antonio Spurs this season?

It really looks like you haven't.
small sample size.

[gambit1990]

It's not like we have been swimming in top 5 picks, and other teams check for players from other continents now.
every player i mentioned drafted from 99 to 08 was drafted outside of the first 25 picks.

[gambit1990]

Lol. Nice recovery.
i gave kudos to where kudos should be given. no shame in that.

[ChumpDumper]

small sample size.You're missing quite a lot tbh.

Try again, sport.

[gambit1990]

You don't watch the spurs. Stop making threads you troll.
i'm not trolling. i'm legitimating wondering about personnel changes within the org.

a lot of teams have hired from the popovich tree. i'm wondering about who helped draft from that period of time.

[gambit1990]

it's crazy how defensive ST gets. i guess that could go for any particular sports forum though. i wouldn't know cause this is the only one i post on.

[rankingtear]

i'm not trolling. i'm legitimating wondering about personnel changes within the org.

a lot of teams have hired from the popovich tree. i'm wondering about who helped draft from that period of time.

You just googled spurs draft picks from bbref that is why Kawhi name did not show.

[lefty20]

OP aint wrong doe.

If u ignored all the picks we've successfully managed to develop, then we really haven't drafted any good players at all.

[ChumpDumper]

i'm not trolling.Oh.

[gambit1990]

You just googled spurs draft picks from bbref that is why Kawhi name did not show.
https://media.tenor.com/f_Mhfr-5yB0AAAAM/shaking-my-head-sigh.gif

i know the spurs didn't draft kawhi because i was watching the draft that night.

anyone else who was truly watching the draft knows that this segment aired, during the draft, before the spurs traded for him:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qczVCZFfUlY

[rankingtear]

https://media.tenor.com/f_Mhfr-5yB0AAAAM/shaking-my-head-sigh.gif

i know the spurs didn't draft kawhi because i was watching the draft that night.

anyone else who was truly watching the draft knows that this segment aired, during the draft, before the spurs traded for him:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qczVCZFfUlY

Congrats u watched the draft. Only spurs fans does.

[gambit1990]

every time anyone sees my name again, never forget how quickly this poster went from:

You just googled spurs draft picks from bbref that is why Kawhi name did not show.
to:

Congrats u watched the draft.

[rankingtear]

every time anyone sees my name again, never forget how quickly this poster went from:

to:

Owned by a troll? We did not draft Kawhi then if you include Barbosa, Salmons and Dragic.

[stnick2261]

Kawhi absolutely counted for the Spurs. They had the deal already set up and had to be sure Kawhi was still available at 15 (otherwise the deal doesn't get done). It's not smart for teams to trade draft picks immediately before the draft because then they don't have the option to trade the next year's 1st round pick. The Spurs told them to pick Kawhi.

[stnick2261]

But to answer the question.... The Spurs are still drafting very well for where they are selecting (let's forget the '21 draft as an outlier). Sam Presti was the one who selected Tony Parker and he left in '07 for Seattle.

[Leetonidas]

Spurs have had more successful 29th picks since 2010 then most teams have had successful picks in general. It's the higher picks they seen to whiff on

[stnick2261]

https://towardsdatascience.com/which-nba-teams-are-best-at-drafting-20070ccd1702

Spurs are the 2nd best team at drafting when you take into account what players are still available at the time they select

[K...]

lol, murray has an all start stat line and gambit is here going "WHy wOInt THE SPusees drAFt Starz".

[John B]

The ones who stick out are Luka, Lonnie, Weiskamp, Primo, three of whom did really well at the Combine. Luka was picked over Keldon among others, Primo over Sengun, Moody. Weiskamp was a 2nd-rounder so no big deal. But there seemed to be over-emphasis on Combine performance without much character. Barlow did well at the Combine so let’s see. He seems like a good kid willing to work his way through 2way to get to the NBA.

I’m happy with this years draft. I think Spurs did solid drafting what Spurs need, defense, go-to scorers and even a high ceiling at 26th. But besides those guys mentioned, I think Spurs did pretty well compare to other teams. Most of their picks are still in the NBA, while it’s not true with other picks who mostly last 2-3 years. That’s my take.

[playblair]

when u make a diversity hire who tanked/missed on all his picks with his previous franchise this is what u get...........

[stnick2261]

when u make a diversity hire who tanked/missed on all his picks with his previous franchise this is what u get...........

I don't have the time to look it all up right now... but Wright just started making draft decisions in '21, correct? That was Primo and Wieskamp

Do we know who made the decisions to draft this past summer? Was it still Wright?

[CGD]

I'm positive there were many draft turds between 1999 and 2012 too. Leon Smith, Jean Charles, Ian Mahinmi come to mind right now.

[Kurgan]

The rest of the league caught up. Especially in the realm of international scouting and late bloomer college players.

Also, the Kawhi year long trade drama shook the franchise to it's core and scared them into pivoting towards a "character over ability" mindset in regards to drafting.

[DPG21920]

I dont understand how anyone, without nitpicking, can look at the league as a whole vs Spurs and come to the conclusion SA has a draft problem? Have their been misses? Absolutely.

But more than others? Not really. They may not be “best” any more but they are still upper echelon

[objective]

I don't have the time to look it all up right now... but Wright just started making draft decisions in '21, correct? That was Primo and Wieskamp

Do we know who made the decisions to draft this past summer? Was it still Wright?

I think Wright was director of scouting and assistant general manager for the Pistons when they took Stanley Johnson #8 in 2015 and Henry Ellenson at 18 in 2016, then hired by SA in August 2016

[objective]

Re: the premise, the Spurs need to be a lot better with managing the assets of the draft in total.

They can't waste picks, especially lottery picks.

Milutinov was a mistake. Whether you think he wasn't good enough, or if like me you think he was good enough and was mishandled as an asset, either way that pick was a disaster.

Luka: disaster. Primo: disaster.

Sengun just dropped 26 and 13 last night, while Primo and his lawyer are strategizing on how long his shorts should be when he's next in public.

There's been a cavalier attitude for a long time which I think became part of the culture and has to be overcome in time. Scola was a disaster probably cost them multiple series wins and maybe more. Sure they won titles without him, but how about maximizing the talent through the ways available.

Not picking up Ian's option. Guy played another 10 years.

Letting Anderson and Walker and Joseph hit free agency and walk with nothing in return. Granting De Colo's wish, while the Raptors ruined his chances at an NBA comeback by refusing to release his restricted rights. In a way he would have been better off had they kept him and just granted his freedom after wards.

[objective]

And as much credit they deserve for moving up to take Kawhi, the full context should not be forgotten.

Spurs motivation to make that trade was probably just as much to avoid having to pay George Hill as to get a young wing. If Hill had signaled he would sign cheap, I don't know if that trade even happens

[stnick2261]

I think Wright was director of scouting and assistant general manager for the Pistons when they took Stanley Johnson #8 in 2015 and Henry Ellenson at 18 in 2016, then hired by SA in August 2016

Yes, but he was assistant GM and didn't have the final say in Detroit or SA until he became GM in 2019... and I remember reading that even though he was GM, he still didn't have final say in draft picks right away. I'm not sure if he was the one who chose Devin and Tre or not... I do know he chose Primo and Wieskamp... not sure if he made all the picks this past draft or if Pop got more involved again.

I remember all of that being in one of the many (50 page) draft threads that I'm sure I'll dig through in the coming days

EDIT to say that while I have been happy with the recent trades, I have no idea who was behind the good draft picks (I just know he was behind picking Primo and I'm fine with him leaving because of it)

[K...]

Re: the premise, the Spurs need to be a lot better with managing the assets of the draft in total.

They can't waste picks, especially lottery picks.

Milutinov was a mistake. Whether you think he wasn't good enough, or if like me you think he was good enough and was mishandled as an asset, either way that pick was a disaster.

Luka: disaster. Primo: disaster.

Sengun just dropped 26 and 13 last night, while Primo and his lawyer are strategizing on how long his shorts should be when he's next in public.

There's been a cavalier attitude for a long time which I think became part of the culture and has to be overcome in time. Scola was a disaster probably cost them multiple series wins and maybe more. Sure they won titles without him, but how about maximizing the talent through the ways available.

Not picking up Ian's option. Guy played another 10 years.

Letting Anderson and Walker and Joseph hit free agency and walk with nothing in return. Granting De Colo's wish, while the Raptors ruined his chances at an NBA comeback by refusing to release his restricted rights. In a way he would have been better off had they kept him and just granted his freedom after wards.

That's the NBA you can't sign everyone, especially when you have 3 stars taking a huge chunk of your cap. So yeah ian sucked and wasn't worth keeping. Walker sucks and was worth paying, joseph was ok, but they had patty mills. De colo was a slow crub, These are nitpicking complaints. (PS you missed beno udrih)

[XDT76]

And as much credit they deserve for moving up to take Kawhi, the full context should not be forgotten.

Spurs motivation to make that trade was probably just as much to avoid having to pay George Hill as to get a young wing. If Hill had signaled he would sign cheap, I don't know if that trade even happens

If they did not draft Kawhi, they will draft Butler instead of Cory which would not be bad would it?

[gambit1990]

Sam Presti was the one who selected Tony Parker and he left in '07 for Seattle.
oh yeah, presti totally slipped my mind somehow :tu

[gambit1990]

lol, murray has an all start stat line and gambit is here going "WHy wOInt THE SPusees drAFt Starz".
how retārded are you? i gave murray the #1 ranking among the spurs picks over the 14 years. i literally did that in the first post of the thread.

[K...]

how retārded are you? i gave murray the #1 ranking among the spurs picks over the 14 years. i literally did that in the first post of the thread.

yeah the spurs drafted a star. and you asked what happened. well those who will be stars have not been given the opportunity. like most of your threads you stack the deck with your "questions" so as to weasel out.

[gambit1990]

yeah the spurs drafted a star. and you asked what happened. well those who will be stars have not been given the opportunity. like most of your threads you stack the deck with your "questions" so as to weasel out.
i'm not weaseling out at all. this thread about how fantastic the picks were from 99 to 08 vs the last 14 years.

[gambit1990]

I'm positive there were many draft turds between 1999 and 2012 too. Leon Smith, Jean Charles, Ian Mahinmi come to mind right now.
this speaks to the point of the thread :tu

after 08 was:
• james anderson. looked like he had a solid shot but honestly seemed... a bit heavy / slow for his position. unfortunately hurt his foot and eventually fell out of the league.
• cory joseph. was what he was.
• jean-charles. poster was mistaken, he was drafted after 08.
• kyle anderson. 85% of ST was fine with him being gone.
• nikola milutinov.
• lonnie walker. gone.
• luka šamanić. gone.

[gambit1990]

primo was drafted #12. ST is more upset with a wasted 12th pick than with losing primo.

[scott]

What happened to their drafting? They're still objectively one of the best drafting teams in the league: https://towardsdatascience.com/which-nba-teams-are-best-at-drafting-20070ccd1702

Since 2009, the rank the 2nd best drafting team.

More recently:

2015-20: Spurs Rank #5
2016-20: Spurs Rank #4
2017-20: Spurs Rank #5
2018-20: Spurs Rank #13
2019-20: Spurs Rank #9
2020 Only: Spurs Rank #5

Yeah, you can point at the misses... but are you forgetting the Spurs also drafted Murray, White and Keldon all with the #29 pick? Sure, they aren't finding the Manu's and Tony's, but they are still a well above average drafting team.

[gambit1990]

Yeah, you can point at the misses... but are you forgetting the Spurs also drafted Murray, White and Keldon all with the #29 pick?
maybe read the first post in the thread?

[gambit1990]

two people in the thread have pointed to this: https://towardsdatascience.com/which-nba-teams-are-best-at-drafting-20070ccd1702.

dismiss that. the raptors are #1, over twice as high as any other team :lol

the raptors haven't even drafted that many good players. and the study consists of player's play . . . in their conference. demar is a perfect example of bloated number in the regular season, against weak teams in the east.

also, the study is after 08. so even if the spurs have been #2 since then, that doesn't mean there hasn't been a dramatic fall off.

[rankingtear]

two people in the thread have pointed to this: https://towardsdatascience.com/which-nba-teams-are-best-at-drafting-20070ccd1702.

dismiss that. the raptors are #1, over twice as high as any other team :lol

the raptors haven't even drafted that many good players. and the study consists of player's play . . . in their conference. demar is a perfect example of bloated number in the regular season, against weak teams in the east.

also, the study is after 08. so even if the spurs have been #2 since then, that doesn't mean there hasn't been a dramatic fall off.

No dramatic fall off there is a link to a site where you can adjust starting year.

[rankingtear]

I don't have the time to look it all up right now... but Wright just started making draft decisions in '21, correct? That was Primo and Wieskamp

Do we know who made the decisions to draft this past summer? Was it still Wright?

2020 Vassell and Tre.

[Mr. Body]

I dont understand how anyone, without nitpicking, can look at the league as a whole vs Spurs and come to the conclusion SA has a draft problem? Have their been misses? Absolutely.

But more than others? Not really. They may not be “best” any more but they are still upper echelon

Yeah, it's a stupid narrative.

Look at GSW right now. Wiseman is possibly the worst player in the NBA, no exaggeration. He's not their only problem but he's awful. Kuminga looks pretty awful, too. And then they gave Jordan Poole a huge amount of money and he's not looking good, either.

[Mr. Body]

primo was drafted #12. ST is more upset with a wasted 12th pick than with losing primo.

The Primo pick sucks, but iirc the only players obvious at that spot they missed are Sengun and Trey Murphy. (No one rated Herb Jones at that point.)

Franchises have flubbed top ten picks much worse. And there really wasn't that much left at that point.

[DPG21920]

Ya - Primo draft just sucked overall. Spurs spot and past that it was pretty bad. I was made the second that pick was made tbh…but it was about process. Im not mad about any players they missed on. No one good enough to care about in that regard.

[gambit1990]

timvp didn't post because he agreed. where's Bruno?

i mostly chalk this up to the league catching up and sam presti leaving. i know that can't be the whole story though.

if you think there isn't a significant drop-off between 99 to 08 vs the last 14 years then you're as retārded as K...

[objective]

I don't think presti was as big a part of the draft success as might be theorized. So he was one of two video guys (iirc the original story before it became a legend, there were 2 guys) who put a reel together to convince higher ups to give Parker a second workout. I guess that makes him a legend.

2001 was the same draft the Spurs passed on drafting Nocioni because they couldn't figure out how to read a calendar and realize he was draft eligible. Presti again?

After that in the first round they traded out of the Salmons pick, traded out of the Barbosa pick, took Beno who was a decent back up, took Ian while acting like they were secret agents, didn't have a 1st in 06, and he was gone to Seattle in June 2007. That Ian draft, while I do love Ian, did have a good amount of real NBA players to go after him, unlike the Beno draft that was pretty sparse by the end of the first.

There was the on paper positive of Scola in the second. Also trading into the second to take Sanikidze right ahead of Ariza.

And on Presti's say-so they took Karaulov with a second rounder, even though Presti had never seen him play in person, or on tape, and if memory serves had never even seen a photograph of. Not that there were any notable undrafted guys that year other than Coat Thief.

[gambit1990]

I don't think presti was as big a part of the draft success as might be theorized. So he was one of two video guys (iirc the original story before it became a legend, there were 2 guys) who put a reel together to convince higher ups to give Parker a second workout. I guess that makes him a legend.
yeah, i honestly can't think it was all presti.

i think the spurs drafted so well that scouts and others got poached by other teams.

[objective]

Presti might have been more instrumental in their trades. I have a vague memory that he played a role in the multi team trade that involved getting Hedo and Mercer for a retiring Ferry contract

[Mr. Body]

We've gone over Presti before. Not sure his drafting prowess is all that great. Sure, he got Durant, Westbrook and Harden, but those were high picks and barely controversial. He did squeeze SGA and scads of picks out of LAC, but that's not the same as drafting.

Leaving aside his recent picks (Giddey looks good, unsure about the others), his drafting since about 2010 has almost universally been terrible. The only players that have been good, other than a good Stephen Adams pick, were on behalf of other teams.

Take a look:
https://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/OKC/draft.html

[MannyIsGod]

kudos to the spurs acquiring kawhi on draft night. the pacers drafted him though.

You love making bullshit threads JFC.

[MannyIsGod]

Y'all should just ignore this attention whore. He basically stopped by, couldn't bump his other thread, and decided to make a new one that is also just as full of shit. Just ignore this dude. He's a troll.

[exstatic]

I'm positive there were many draft turds between 1999 and 2012 too. Leon Smith, Jean Charles, Ian Mahinmi come to mind right now.

Leon Smith was drafted FOR Dallas, and traded on draft night. LJC was injured. Mahinmi didn’t make it here, but played over 600 NBA games, and had glowing things to say about the organization during his in game interview this year. Just because a player moves on doesn’t mean he was a whiff. GHill has played almost 900 games. Udrih played over 800 NBA Games. Corey Joseph has played over 700 games. Kyle Anderson has passed the 500 game mark.

[B1gduff]

20 years of succes does that. If you look 20oo and onwards, they still did pretty damn solid for drafting in the lat 20s. Blair, Scola, Mahinmi, Splitter etc had solid careers in the NBA.

There has been a notabale shift in the drafting over the past several years, the team went from drafting older and foreign players, to high risk and high reward type of guys.
Best way to this decribe these few drafts for the Spurs have been a miss and hit.
Luka; Was miss, but onces again was a high risk high reward type of pick
Primo; was a dumbass. fuckem iidoit

The hits:
Dj: borderline All-star and is showing again this year.
Kj; early in the season, but from what we saw from last year and this year he's playing at an border-line all star level, and a solid 2nd.3rd option on a playoff team. He still can improve and be more of point forawrd if he develops.
Devin; I think Vassel also has solid upside and we are seeing it. I can see him being 18-20 pg guy in the league with good defense. I also think he might have better and more of a complete offensive game than KJ.

The only outliner from this is Lonnie;
Who's been average and so far he's good better than average this season.

Overall the drafts have been solid, nyour going to hit and your also going to have misses it opart of the game. heck as the Kings and their fans.

Now lets looks at our newest draft picks;
Sochan; I think is going to be special. Defenisvley, he probably is the best defender on the team at the moment. offensively, there's work but he's shown us solid tools. he's shown he has an adequate dribble, he does need to learn to finsih and be more control of his game, improve his mid0range and than work on his 3pt release. But the upside is elite.
Wesley; its unfoctunate that he got hurt, but I do beleieve that he could be the steal of the draft. the biggest knock on him was the lack of 3 pt shot and that he was raw. The limited time we saw him, it looked like those were not much of concerns.
Malaki; is hard to judge at the moment, but he looks like a nature scorer. He's going to score but the defemsiove end with determien but type of player he is.

[Drom John]

Small sample worst players this year, FiveThirtyEight:

244) Brandon Clarke, Killian Hayes, Tyus Jones, Jordan Poole, James Wiseman
249) Jabari Smith, Jr.
250) Norman Powell

[Mr. Body]

Small sample worst players this year, FiveThirtyEight:

244) Brandon Clarke, Killian Hayes, Tyus Jones, Jordan Poole, James Wiseman
249) Jabari Smith, Jr.
250) Norman Powell

Not sure what's up with Tyus Jones and Brandon Clarke, but the Memphis support doesn't look as fearsome this year yet. Jordan Poole is probably checked out after Kerr failed to do anything after Draymond tried to spin his face around his neck. Probably permanently. I always suspected Jabari Smith was a high level 3&D role player, drafted too high very expensive one, and Houston is positively the worst place for him. And James Wiseman has always been terrible. Imagine drafting a guy who ran away from an easy college program to hide how bad he was.

[gambit1990]

You love making bullshit threads JFC.
K... level retārded right here.


Y'all should just ignore this attention whore. He basically stopped by, couldn't bump his other thread, and decided to make a new one that is also just as full of shit. Just ignore this dude. He's a troll.
i'm not trolling.

[exstatic]

20 years of succes does that. If you look 20oo and onwards, they still did pretty damn solid for drafting in the lat 20s. Blair, Scola, Mahinmi, Splitter etc had solid careers in the NBA.

There has been a notabale shift in the drafting over the past several years, the team went from drafting older and foreign players, to high risk and high reward type of guys.
Best way to this decribe these few drafts for the Spurs have been a miss and hit.
Luka; Was miss, but onces again was a high risk high reward type of pick
Primo; was a dumbass. fuckem iidoit

The hits:
Dj: borderline All-star and is showing again this year.
Kj; early in the season, but from what we saw from last year and this year he's playing at an border-line all star level, and a solid 2nd.3rd option on a playoff team. He still can improve and be more of point forawrd if he develops.
Devin; I think Vassel also has solid upside and we are seeing it. I can see him being 18-20 pg guy in the league with good defense. I also think he might have better and more of a complete offensive game than KJ.

The only outliner from this is Lonnie;
Who's been average and so far he's good better than average this season.

Overall the drafts have been solid, nyour going to hit and your also going to have misses it opart of the game. heck as the Kings and their fans.

Now lets looks at our newest draft picks;
Sochan; I think is going to be special. Defenisvley, he probably is the best defender on the team at the moment. offensively, there's work but he's shown us solid tools. he's shown he has an adequate dribble, he does need to learn to finsih and be more control of his game, improve his mid0range and than work on his 3pt release. But the upside is elite.
Wesley; its unfoctunate that he got hurt, but I do beleieve that he could be the steal of the draft. the biggest knock on him was the lack of 3 pt shot and that he was raw. The limited time we saw him, it looked like those were not much of concerns.
Malaki; is hard to judge at the moment, but he looks like a nature scorer. He's going to score but the defemsiove end with determien but type of player he is.

I was ready to post something just like this. There was a clear dividing line after the dreadful 2010 playoff loss. Before that, Spurs were filling their roster with vets they knew could immediately produce 8p/5r or 7p/4a. They had zero time to develop players that weren’t ready to play. Even Tony, drafted at 19, had played professionally since he was 16, and was a near immediate starter. That’s not the same thing as a 19 YO US player who’s highest level of comp was probably wild west AAU.

In 2011 we traded for the Kawhi pick, and grabbed CoJo at the end of the round. Kawhi was so elite on defense that they could just stick him in the corner on offense for a couple of years. CoJo was the Spurs first developmental project, by accident. He wanted to play, and wasn’t at all, so he asked to be assigned. That paid dividends, and became the model with very few exceptions. The Spurs realized that they could no longer put only aging vets around their now aging core. They needed some young blood, and they were going to have to develop those players.

[gambit1990]

20 years of succes does that. If you look 20oo and onwards, they still did pretty damn solid for drafting in the lat 20s. Blair, Scola, Mahinmi, Splitter etc had solid careers in the NBA.
uh, scola and splitter fit my window. i mentioned them in the first post.




The hits:
Dj: borderline All-star and is showing again this year.
Kj; early in the season, but from what we saw from last year and this year he's playing at an border-line all star level, and a solid 2nd.3rd option on a playoff team. He still can improve and be more of point forawrd if he develops.
Devin; I think Vassel also has solid upside and we are seeing it. I can see him being 18-20 pg guy in the league with good defense. I also think he might have better and more of a complete offensive game than KJ.
i mentioned DJ and KJ in the original post.

DJ, KJ, and Devin in the past 14 years are nothing compared to 99 to 08.

[Sugus]

At the very least, you gotta give OP some credit tbh. It can't be easy spending your every day thinking of new ways of trying to shit on your supposedly favorite team, and just keep digging that hole regardless of reality checks. It takes effort, people!

On the real side, :lmao at yet another pathetic troll attempt. The second you make a Spurs Draft analysis thread, and willingly exclude Kawhi, you know you're full of shit. I do wonder whether you thought ST of all places would let that slide, OP? You don't know your public all too well it seems...