Moving into the Top Ten or Lottery

[Mr. Body]

Because we're greedy sorts, there's talk of trying to get a second pick in the top 10, usually to get a point guard. Normally not something the Spurs would do, I'd think, but Wembanyama might accelerate the process. It might be worthwhile to use future capital we might have kept dry.

What picks to target?

- Top third of the lottery, around 3-5
- Picks 6-10
- Later in the lottery

What players to target?

- Amen Thompson
- Anthony Black
- Cason Wallace
- Kobe Bufkin
- Jalen Hood-Schifino
- <other>

What assets to trade?

- Keldon Johnson
- Own draft picks
- Other draft picks (Atl, Chi, Tor)

To me, going after the picks where Amen Thompson is available is not worth it. Not necessarily because I don't believe in him -- or even Scoot -- but because those picks are going to be very expensive.

Orlando and Indiana may be had (6, 7), but we don't have anything clear that they may want.

Utah and Washington (8, 9) both have big needs for PGs, the very spot we're looking for.

Dallas has been discussed elsewhere, with Keldon as a possible dangle, but he is not a good defensive fit for them. It does seem like they may want to trade for an established player or two.

The Spurs have a lot of picks they cannot necessarily take in the years ahead. Is it worth burning assets grabbing a guy they may be able to get in the future?

To me, there's a sweet spot. I don't think going after Amen is worth the price, and then going after a Hood-Schifino doesn't really replace Jones' production. My sweet area is Black and Bufkin. The sad thing is, I believe WAS or UTA grab Black (poor kid, if it's the Wizards). I like Bufkin, but don't know how much I'd give up to actually get him.

Interesting situation. A day ago, I couldn't see the Spurs pushing so high for a second lottery player. Things may have changed.

[duncan2150]

https://twitter.com/KellyIko/status/1658908966674472970

https://twitter.com/JoshuaBRobbins/status/1658897946451034112

Could be really interesting to move up and grab a PG, those are the main targets with Schifino imo

btw i think it will be really expensive to move up in the top 10-15

[slick'81]

Portland wants put of 3 but we gots no vets

[JPB]

https://twitter.com/KellyIko/status/1658908966674472970

https://twitter.com/JoshuaBRobbins/status/1658897946451034112

Could be really interesting to move up and grab a PG, those are the main targets with Schifino imo

btw i think it will be really expensive to move up in the top 10-15

Indeed, and I don't see a player worth it. Moving up in the 20s if possible, or even mid first (hard) why not if spurs want to take a flyer on someone they fell in love with now that they got the big fish but above wouldn't be a wise investment imo. Let's keep those big assets for later moves and maybe focus rather on a vet PG.

[Excessive Egotist]

How will the Spurs handle point guard is the biggest roster question going into next season. Splurge on VanVleet in free agency? Doubtful. Take on a Chris Paul salary dump? Meh. Roll with Jones? He seems better suited as a (strong) reserve point. Rehab Ben Simmons for the cost of Brooklyn draft picks? It's the wrong time to risk locker room poison, even if it came with a couple FRPs. Experiment with Branham or Sochan at point? Maybe, particularly Sochan. But do you really want to ease Wembanyama into the NBA with an experimental point guard? Try to move into the lottery to draft Scoot Henderson or Amen Thompson? Does Portland sniff at Keldon Johnson and future ATL pick for 3? I wouldn't make that trade, but it does give them a win-now piece in Johnson without mortgaging their future, doesn't it? The point guard market is really poor this summer. It's a challenging problem for the front office.

[scott]

Love this exercise, but I'll throw in a wrinkle.

Once we get a feeling of what the cost would be to move up to the range where we could take Black (for example), I'd ask what do you think the cost would be to get Haliburton from Indiana or Ivey from Detroit. Both of these guys may be off limits, but everyone has their price.

If we could get Haliburton or Ivey for our 1 next year + Atlanta's 2025 + the CHI pick + the CHA pick... would you do it? Certainly both of those would be preferable to Black or Wallace?

[Mr. Body]

https://twitter.com/KellyIko/status/1658908966674472970

https://twitter.com/JoshuaBRobbins/status/1658897946451034112

Could be really interesting to move up and grab a PG, those are the main targets with Schifino imo

btw i think it will be really expensive to move up in the top 10-15

Good finds. These teams are looking at ranges of picks and possible movement; they also use them to get to know players entering the NBA in a way they never have a chance to later on.

It is provocative to see the Spurs on these lists, though. I'll stick with my guns. I would seriously consider a package for Black. I'd put together a limit to what they'd be willing to part with and then see what they can do. I'd consider trading two or three FRPs for him, all depending on where those picks fall.

I just don't see a chance to get a player with his size who is probably the best perimeter defender in his class who is simultaneously a playmaker of great potential.

[rankingtear]

Devin gets you 6 I think.

[dbestpro]

Could move up to the middle rounds and land Nick Smith of Arkansas who some saw as a top 5 pick before he got hurt.

[mo7888]

Love this exercise, but I'll throw in a wrinkle.

Once we get a feeling of what the cost would be to move up to the range where we could take Black (for example), I'd ask what do you think the cost would be to get Haliburton from Indiana or Ivey from Detroit. Both of these guys may be off limits, but everyone has their price.

If we could get Haliburton or Ivey for our 1 next year + Atlanta's 2025 + the CHI pick + the CHA pick... would you do it? Certainly both of those would be preferable to Black or Wallace?

No, I wouldn't give the Atlanta pick.....

[mo7888]

Could move up to the middle rounds and land Nick Smith of Arkansas who some saw as a top 5 pick before he got hurt.

I think this is the correct option to pursue.

[SpursBills]

A lot of people are saying to draft a lead guard if we move into the late lottery; what do people think about going another direction and drafting a front court partner instead? Wemby is a tricky fit - need someone who can guard the bigger centers to minimize wear and tear, is switchable, and can do some playmaking in advantage situations when Wemby inevitably gets doubled down the road. Jarace Walker may be sitting there in the mid lottery and if you take him, you may be able to have enough playmaking between him, Wemby, and Sochan to not have to be able to run two defensive wings with them. I guess this all assumes that you see Sochan's ultimate role as a playmaking wing.

[BacktoBasics]

I’m pretty annoyed with the constant need to throw Keldon under the bus. He’s the exact kinda player who produces consistently that a playoff team like us needs. I don’t mind over paying with picks but I think we’d be stupid to give up Keldon and picks. Unless it’s wildly to our benefit.

The most valuable part of this team, now that you have a centerpiece, is that we already have built in high production players that fit the system. Keldon and Vassell getting approx 18ppg and taking pressure off of Wemby is more valuable than taking a swipe at a prospective pg.

With that said I think Black is a perfect fit and Cason looks real good too. Package up some picks. I don’t mind two first and a swap or two if the FO really likes one if them.

But it’s dumb to give up a pick or two and a 20ppg scorer who can drive and shoot effectively. Who also happens to be a great fit on our team culturally and chemistry wise.

[mo7888]

A lot of people are saying to draft a lead guard if we move into the late lottery; what do people think about going another direction and drafting a front court partner instead? Wemby is a tricky fit - need someone who can guard the bigger centers to minimize wear and tear, is switchable, and can do some playmaking in advantage situations when Wemby inevitably gets doubled down the road. Jarace Walker may be sitting there in the late lottery and if you take him, you may be able to have enough playmaking between him, Wemby, and Sochan to not have to be able to run two defensive wings with them. I guess this all assumes that you see Sochan's ultimate role as a playmaking wing.

I think there's good value in the late lottery to around 20. Gregory Jackson II or Kris Murray will be there.... probably Kobe Bufkin, Jalen Hood-Schifino, or NSJ will fall there....and Rayan Rupert, Jordan Hawkins, Dariq Whitehead or Bilal Coulibaly will be there.... not all of them but a few of them will. It won't be that hard to trade into that range.

[mo7888]

I’m pretty annoyed with the constant need to throw Keldon under the bus. He’s the exact kinda player who produces consistently that a playoff team like us needs. I don’t mind over paying with picks but I think we’d be stupid to give up Keldon and picks. Unless it’s wildly to our benefit.

The most valuable part of this team, now that you have a centerpiece, is that we already have built in high production players that fit the system. Keldon and Vassell getting approx 18ppg and taking pressure off of Wemby is more valuable than taking a swipe at a prospective pg.

With that said I think Black is a perfect fit and Cason looks real good too. Package up some picks. I don’t mind two first and a swap or two if the FO really likes one if them.

But it’s dumb to give up a pick or two and a 20ppg scorer who can drive and shoot effectively. Who also happens to be a great fit on our team culturally and chemistry wise.

I think it depends on how high we're shooting for. Keldon is a good player and I think he'd be good here off the bench when we've made some other moves. He's not so good that we have to keep him, but the reason everyone keeps including his name in deals is precisely because he does have value. I think we only have one untouchable. Everything has to be geared to fit around him.

[Mr. Body]

I think there's good value in the late lottery to around 20. Gregory Jackson II or Kris Murray will be there.... probably Kobe Bufkin, Jalen Hood-Schifino, or NSJ will fall there....and Rayan Rupert, Jordan Hawkins, Dariq Whitehead or Bilal Coulibaly will be there.... not all of them but a few of them will. It won't be that hard to trade into that range.

The issue I have with non-PGs is that we already have those players we are in the midst of developing. I don't know if it makes sense to use extra assets to grab a scoring guard like Smith Jr. or a PF prospect like GG when we need to integrate Vassell back in and Sochan. Every move has a balance between what it costs and who gets impacted on the existing team on one side vs. how exceptional that player is.

That said, I've long wanted two good prospects out of this draft and I'm not sure there will be anyone in the early SR. If all they have to pay are other future SRPs then that's next to nothing. Regardless, snaking in and grabbing someone that tumbles... I'm not against anything.

[mo7888]

The issue I have with non-PGs is that we already have those players we are in the midst of developing. I don't know if it makes sense to use extra assets to grab a scoring guard like Smith Jr. or a PF prospect like GG when we need to integrate Vassell back in and Sochan. Every move has a balance between what it costs and who gets impacted on the existing team on one side vs. how exceptional that player is.

That said, I've long wanted two good prospects out of this draft and I'm not sure there will be anyone in the early SR. If all they have to pay are other future SRPs then that's next to nothing. Regardless, snaking in and grabbing someone that tumbles... I'm not against anything.

I don't see NSJ as just a scoring guard. I think he's a PG at this level and played out of position at Arkansas. How one views his ultimate position does play a factor with him I'll have to admit. On Gregory Jackson II and Murray, I don't see where we are stacked there with developing guys. We've got Sochan and who? I can't count Wembanyama because he's going to play a few positions as he develops. Sochan is the only real 4 we have. I guess I could include Mamu and Barlow, but they aren't good enough to pass on talent for.

[Biggems]

saw a mock with us taking Wemby at 1 and Trayce Jackson-Davis with our first pick in the 2nd round. I can live with those two picks.

[Mr. Body]

I don't see NSJ as just a scoring guard. I think he's a PG at this level and played out of position at Arkansas. How one views his ultimate position does play a factor with him I'll have to admit. On Gregory Jackson II and Murray, I don't see where we are stacked there with developing guys. We've got Sochan and who? I can't count Wembanyama because he's going to play a few positions as he develops. Sochan is the only real 4 we have. I guess I could include Mamu and Barlow, but they aren't good enough to pass on talent for.

Mamu would be a 4. Maybe I just don't think anything of GG Jackson and don't see value in trading up to get him. I disagree about Smith's position. I don't really see players who can't pass much and don't have much vision as PGs simply because they are slight of build. His handles are pretty bad, but those can be improved. Otherwise he's a skinny SG. But, sure, he's the type I could see poaching if he tumbles and isn't costly. His slash and floater game could be effective. He'd be drafted into Branham and Wesley territory though.

[BacktoBasics]

I think it depends on how high we're shooting for. Keldon is a good player and I think he'd be good here off the bench when we've made some other moves. He's not so good that we have to keep him, but the reason everyone keeps including his name in deals is precisely because he does have value. I think we only have one untouchable. Everything has to be geared to fit around him.
There is no reason for him to come off the bench unless you’re rocking a legitimate all star 3. Keldon fits great next to Sochan. Regardless of whether Jeremy is at the 4 or the 1. Keldon also fits perfectly alongside Vassell. Those 3 played seemlessly together.

I completely get the talk around wanting another pg but with all the cap space and picks I think trading a timeline player who produces and knows the system is a dumb move.

We could absorb just about any contract. Have McD’s contract if needed. All those pics and cap space.

Unless you’re bringing back proven talent like Fox or Halliburton then it doesn’t make any sense to move a valuable piece for a prospect. Not now.

A year or two years from now? Maybe.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Right now is not the time to be buying draft picks. The price is never higher.

We are going to be better but a 50 win season is where I am thinking the over under is at. I don't see us contending with a lack of a veteran core there is going to be a lot of growing pains.

Carpe diem if you can but failing a team having their prospects pool wiped out and looking to move a pick I don't see a whole lot of value.

[CGD]

Reading the early returns, sounds like the next two drafts are meh for what it’s worth. Apparently Carlos Boozers kid is get lots of hype for 2026.

Anyway, if you take stalk in that stuff, might not be bad to consolidate 24 and 25 year picks.

[lmbebo]

I’m pretty annoyed with the constant need to throw Keldon under the bus. He’s the exact kinda player who produces consistently that a playoff team like us needs. I don’t mind over paying with picks but I think we’d be stupid to give up Keldon and picks. Unless it’s wildly to our benefit.

The most valuable part of this team, now that you have a centerpiece, is that we already have built in high production players that fit the system. Keldon and Vassell getting approx 18ppg and taking pressure off of Wemby is more valuable than taking a swipe at a prospective pg.

With that said I think Black is a perfect fit and Cason looks real good too. Package up some picks. I don’t mind two first and a swap or two if the FO really likes one if them.

But it’s dumb to give up a pick or two and a 20ppg scorer who can drive and shoot effectively. Who also happens to be a great fit on our team culturally and chemistry wise.


Not throwing him under the bus. But in the same respect, he's not untouchable either. Might be our most moveable piece where we could get a good return.

[mo7888]

Mamu would be a 4. Maybe I just don't think anything of GG Jackson and don't see value in trading up to get him. I disagree about Smith's position. I don't really see players who can't pass much and don't have much vision as PGs simply because they are slight of build. His handles are pretty bad, but those can be improved. Otherwise he's a skinny SG. But, sure, he's the type I could see poaching if he tumbles and isn't costly. His slash and floater game could be effective. He'd be drafted into Branham and Wesley territory though.

Yea, we see them differently, but everybody I just mentioned is in that range that wouldn't be very costly. We're talking about the 13-20 range. Jackson or Murray will be towards the end of that. JHS, Bufkin, or NSJ will fall towards the end of that. Rupert or Bilal will be available towards the end of that range....not all, but one in each category should be...

[Ariel]

Love this exercise, but I'll throw in a wrinkle.

Once we get a feeling of what the cost would be to move up to the range where we could take Black (for example), I'd ask what do you think the cost would be to get Haliburton from Indiana or Ivey from Detroit. Both of these guys may be off limits, but everyone has their price.

If we could get Haliburton or Ivey for our 1 next year + Atlanta's 2025 + the CHI pick + the CHA pick... would you do it? Certainly both of those would be preferable to Black or Wallace?
Haliburton is a 23 year old coming off an All Star season, he's committed to Indiana and they view him as their franchise player, We had our chance at him and we blew it, he's not going anywhere.
Also, he's on a tier above Dejounte Murray. If the price for Dejounte was 3 picks (2 unprotected) + 1 swap, Haliburton would command significantly more than that, probably including an already established young player and not just picks.
Ivey I don't see Detroit moving, but he's not untouchable IMO. I've lost a lot of interest in him however, since his defense has been awful and he's not the playmaker we'd need. Basically he's a PG sized combo guard. For the right price he'd be a fine addition, but I wouldn't pay prime all star price for him, which is why Detroit surely would ask for.

[Mr. Body]

saw a mock with us taking Wemby at 1 and Trayce Jackson-Davis with our first pick in the 2nd round. I can live with those two picks.

I'm repeating myself because there are so many threads and I'm losing track, but I've about-faced on TJD. Once we loaded up on Bassey, Mamu, and Barlow started showing signs, I didn't think much of using a pick on J-D to crowd things even further. Now with Wembanyama, I think he'd be an excellent alternative to Collins. Heady passer, smart player, has some strength, can cover the perimeter in a pinch on rotations, excellent weak-side shotblocker. Having him and Wembanyama cleaning up mistakes is salivating.

[Mr. Body]

Haliburton is a 23 year old coming off an All Star season, he's committed to Indiana and they view him as their franchise player, We had our chance at him and we blew it, he's not going anywhere.
Also, he's on a tier above Dejounte Murray. If the price for Dejounte was 3 picks (2 unprotected) + 1 swap, Haliburton would command significantly more than that, probably including an already established young player and not just picks.
Ivey I don't see Detroit moving, but he's not untouchable IMO. I've lost a lot of interest in him however, since his defense has been awful and he's not the playmaker we'd need. Basically he's a PG sized combo guard. For the right price he'd be a fine addition, but I wouldn't pay prime all star price for him, which is why Detroit surely would ask for.

Haliburton represented Indiana at the lottery. He's there for good.

[dbestpro]

Moving into the middle rounds to get Nick Smith Jr as a PG who was a top 5 pick as a ,PG before he got injured is a safe move and could be had without moving Keldon. He has size and moves like a PG.

[mo7888]

There is no reason for him to come off the bench unless you’re rocking a legitimate all star 3. Keldon fits great next to Sochan. Regardless of whether Jeremy is at the 4 or the 1. Keldon also fits perfectly alongside Vassell. Those 3 played seemlessly together.

I completely get the talk around wanting another pg but with all the cap space and picks I think trading a timeline player who produces and knows the system is a dumb move.

We could absorb just about any contract. Have McD’s contract if needed. All those pics and cap space.

Unless you’re bringing back proven talent like Fox or Halliburton then it doesn’t make any sense to move a valuable piece for a prospect. Not now.

A year or two years from now? Maybe.

Sochan won't make it as a PG... he may play there this year, but it's not where he's ultimately gonna be. As for Keldon coming off the bench, I'm not talking about immediately necessarily. I'm talking about after we've made moves are are ready to try and contend, but it's still a little problematic this season if Sochan doesn't play PG.

Tre
Devin
Collins
Wembanyama

They are starting... so Sochan or Keldon will have to come off the bench.

[BacktoBasics]

Not throwing him under the bus. But in the same respect, he's not untouchable either. Might be our most moveable piece where we could get a good return.

It would have to be a clear and decisive upgrade. Like Bridges or something to that tune. A legit upgrade.

Moving a piece like Keldon that’s on a great contract for a prospect in the late lottery seems like the kind of irresponsible shit we’d see from other teams.

[Degoat]

I’m gonna say something and I understand he showed nothing this year… are we giving up on Blake Wesley as a future PG? We keep bringing guys up, maybe he’s the answer if he’s improving

[BacktoBasics]

Sochan won't make it as a PG... he may play there this year, but it's not where he's ultimately gonna be. As for Keldon coming off the bench, I'm not talking about immediately necessarily. I'm talking about after we've made moves are are ready to try and contend, but it's still a little problematic this season if Sochan doesn't play PG.

Tre
Devin
Collins
Wembanyama

They are starting... so Sochan or Keldon will have to come off the bench.

I agree that Sochan is not a starting long term pg. Good change of pace etc.

My starting 5 is

Wemby
Sochan
Keldon
Vassell
Tre

I’m not really seeing the need to start Collins. Now if Poeltl were still on this team I could see Jeremy sliding to the 3 and taking Keldon off the bench for the punch.

We are constantly undervaluing Keldon and what he could bring to a playoff team.

[Mr. Body]

I’m gonna say something and I understand he showed nothing this year… are we giving up on Blake Wesley as a future PG? We keep bringing guys up, maybe he’s the answer if he’s improving

I'm not and I don't think the team is. By the end of the year, I started seeing stuff I liked. He was slowing down, not rushing to hit the rim, where he was constantly in trouble. He was starting to use the middle ground between the 3-pt line and the hoop. I still feel there's something there; another year to see. His speed, his defense. He has good vision. He's a good spot up shooter.

I don't think he's ready to start at all.

[Leetonidas]

I’m gonna say something and I understand he showed nothing this year… are we giving up on Blake Wesley as a future PG? We keep bringing guys up, maybe he’s the answer if he’s improving

Too early to tell at this point. But Branham imo could slide into that starting PG spot. he did a really solid job as the season went on. With Wemby/Sochan in the frontcourt, we don't really need a ball dominant PG setting guys up. Let Branham run it as a combo guard

[DPG21920]

Why are people so certain that it will cost too much to move up into the first? I mean, look at the trade deadline; teams valued firsts like crazy because they wanted a shot at Wemby. Now that it’s over?

FA class sucks. Lots of teams that need to win now have lottery picks and are up shit creek asset wise mostly. There’s no consensus after top 3 it appears and tons of risks.

It’s ripe for a lot of trade activity IMO and if firsts are valued highly, SA being willing to move 2 firsts to get one here may very well be enough; especially with a player like Keldon possibly attached

Teams showed they valued the shot at Wemby + firsts in general but that also means getting SA to give up multiple firsts is a big deal possibly.

I would trade every ATL pick if it landed SA Scoot for example (pick 2 or 3). If you can guarantee that one of those ATL turns into a top 3 pick you take it.

Just saying I don’t think it’s clear that it will cost too much to move up for another first but I agree it would not be a surprise.

But no one is going to want to deal with the Spurs after they landed Wemby. Teams hate us :lol

[BacktoBasics]

I’m gonna say something and I understand he showed nothing this year… are we giving up on Blake Wesley as a future PG? We keep bringing guys up, maybe he’s the answer if he’s improving

I see Wesley as someone on a Walker timeline. He definitely needs another year or so.

[mo7888]

I agree that Sochan is not a starting long term pg. Good change of pace etc.

My starting 5 is

Wemby
Sochan
Keldon
Vassell
Tre

I’m not really seeing the need to start Collins. Now if Poeltl were still on this team I could see Jeremy sliding to the 3 and taking Keldon off the bench for the punch.

We are constantly undervaluing Keldon and what he could bring to a playoff team.

I don't think you can play Wembanyama at the 5.... not this early at this age.... he'll play the 4 and/or 3. We shouldn't subject him to the pounding he'd take at the 5.

[Mr. Body]

Why are people so certain that it will cost too much to move up into the first? I mean, look at the trade deadline; teams valued firsts like crazy because they wanted a shot at Wemby. Now that it’s over?

FA class sucks. Lots of teams that need to win now have lottery picks and are up shit creek asset wise mostly. There’s no consensus after top 3 it appears and tons of risks.

It’s ripe for a lot of trade activity IMO and if firsts are valued highly, SA being willing to move 2 firsts to get one here may very well be enough; especially with a player like Keldon possibly attached

Teams showed they valued the shot at Wemby + firsts in general but that also means getting SA to give up multiple firsts is a big deal possibly.

I would trade every ATL pick if it landed SA Scoot for example (pick 2 or 3). If you can guarantee that one of those ATL turns into a top 3 pick you take it.

Just saying I don’t think it’s clear that it will cost too much to move up for another first but I agree it would not be a surprise.

But no one is going to want to deal with the Spurs after they landed Wemby. Teams hate us :lol

Teams value the current pick over future picks. I don't know of any times a team has traded away a high or mid lottery pick for future picks. That's a good way to get a fanbase to revolt against you and get yourself fired as a GM. You need to get something tangible and current.

[DPG21920]

But if you can pick 3 for Keldon + a first or two you do it IMO

[DPG21920]

Teams value the current pick over future picks. I don't know of any times a team has traded away a high or mid lottery pick for future picks. That's a good way to get a fanbase to revolt against you and get yourself fired as a GM. You need to get something tangible and current.

I’m not so sure. Lots of fans in this draft thought it was top 2 or bust it feels like. Look at our own sentiment and convos about trading back or out if we landed pick 4-7. This is unique though because we have several teams that were not supposed to be lottery teams: Dallas, Portland, Washington and even HOU has incentive to get better quickly since they don’t control their own pick next year.

So its not the same as “usual” IMO

[BacktoBasics]

Why are people so certain that it will cost too much to move up into the first? I mean, look at the trade deadline; teams valued firsts like crazy because they wanted a shot at Wemby. Now that it’s over?

FA class sucks. Lots of teams that need to win now have lottery picks and are up shit creek asset wise mostly. There’s no consensus after top 3 it appears and tons of risks.

It’s ripe for a lot of trade activity IMO and if firsts are valued highly, SA being willing to move 2 firsts to get one here may very well be enough; especially with a player like Keldon possibly attached

Teams showed they valued the shot at Wemby + firsts in general but that also means getting SA to give up multiple firsts is a big deal possibly.

I would trade every ATL pick if it landed SA Scoot for example (pick 2 or 3). If you can guarantee that one of those ATL turns into a top 3 pick you take it.

Just saying I don’t think it’s clear that it will cost too much to move up for another first but I agree it would not be a surprise.

But no one is going to want to deal with the Spurs after they landed Wemby. Teams hate us :lol
2 picks and Keldon for scoot I’d get.

But if we’re offering Keldon plus 2 firsts for a pick that is 7-12 we’re idiots. Nothing in that range is worth 2 firsts and a proven player on a killer contract.

2 firsts and a swap for a 7-10 picks is fine by me.

[BackHome]

I don't think you can play Wembanyama at the 5.... not this early at this age.... he'll play the 4 and/or 3. We shouldn't subject him to the pounding he'd take at the 5.

Sochan will probably play the 5 when playing with Wemb. on the defensive side

[DPG21920]

2 picks and Keldon for scoot I’d get.

But if we’re offering Keldon plus 2 firsts for a pick that is 7-12 we’re idiots. Nothing in that range is worth 2 firsts and a proven player on a killer contract.

2 firsts and a swap for a 7-10 picks is fine by me.

Oh for sure…just saying it feels like there are avenues due so many teams seemingly wanting to or being willing to move picks. Means it lowers costs since teams have multiple options too.

[BackHome]

Too early to tell at this point. But Branham imo could slide into that starting PG spot. he did a really solid job as the season went on. With Wemby/Sochan in the frontcourt, we don't really need a ball dominant PG setting guys up. Let Branham run it as a combo guard

Yeah, I am not in a rush let's see how things work out in Wemby first season - As far as Blake still high on him he was drafted as a prospect with high potential so we should know it's going to take at best two years before we see things clicking. One thing that I really liked is the team played defense when he was playing he really gets into it on that side of the ball he just has to slow his brain down a little on the offensive side.

[BacktoBasics]

Sochan will probably play the 5 when playing with Wemb. on the defensive side

Based on what? Sochan is more the Bruce Bowen who picks up the best offensive player on the other team than he is Duncan playing the 4 next to the number of other bigs we had over the years.

Sochan isn’t picking up AD, Embiid, Sabonis if Wemby is on the floor.

[Ariel]

What picks to target?

- Top third of the lottery, around 3-5
- Picks 6-10
- Later in the lottery

What players to target?

- Amen Thompson
- Anthony Black
- Cason Wallace
- Kobe Bufkin
- Jalen Hood-Schifino
Cason Wallace and Hood Schifino are a pass from me, whenever I've watched them play I didn't come away super impressed.
Anthony Black I love, but I concur 100% he's going to Washington or Utah at 8/9 at the lowest. I think a realistic trade up should target picks 6 (Orlando) and 7 (Indiana). With that said, Indiana needs a PF and I'd be SHOCKED if they move the pick instead of taking one of Cam Whitmore, Taylor Hendricks or Jarace Walker. Orlando I could see moving the pick if the price is right, because they have 11 where they could target need (Gradey Dick?). Their core is set so they need pieces, maybe Keldon Johnson + future first (ideally Charlotte, realistically likely Toronto) would be an enticing offer for that pick, I think Keldon would be much more efficient alongside Banchero and Wagner than he was this past season.
For Bufkin, I think he's a late lottery / mid teens prospect, with a strong fit in Toronto at 13. We could go to Dallas for 10 for maybe Keldon Johnson, but I'm not sure I'd use 10 on Bufkin, I'm more inclined to wait to see if he falls a bit and then if he does you can put together a more reasonable offer for a lower pick, like Atlanta at 15 or Lakers at 17.
I left Amen Thompson for last. I've been saying time and again that I didn't want Amen Thompson to be our top pick. With that said, if the Spurs are truly enamored with him, Houston is rumored to be willing to move the pick for win now pieces. I don't know that we have such pieces, they need to balance out the roster and that requires playmaking, which we don't have in excess. A Derrick White or Dejounte could have been appealing to them, for instance, but right now in terms of value maybe Vassell + 1st would be fair but I don't think they'd do it because of fit.
All in all, I'd be open to opportunities, but those PG options you mention seem pretty difficult / expensive to me. And to be fair, no, I can't come up with a much better one off the top of my head. But some may open up, you never know.
Lastly, I would take a look at Judah Mintz and Marcus Sasser in the 2nd round, not in the same tier, but maybe attainable with either of our seconds which would make for a much more affordable gamble.

[Ariel]

Haliburton represented Indiana at the lottery. He's there for good.
Yeah, but because of what I said and not for representing them in the lottery. Sexton represented Utah and Dalen Terry represented Chicago, and it wasn't because they were in for the long haul (Dalen Terry especially).

[K...]

maintaining wemby's health with a good center pairing is way way more important than getting value for KJ. KJ doesn't deserve to be a starter unless he can be a plus defender. The FO will need to talk to him but part of the trade push is the intuition that a player like him would rather take a chance on another team as a starter than play off the bench or the 4rth fiddle on offense. KJ doesn't have a natural position and with wemby and sochan both being must starts thats two positions KJ can't play. Sochan will be flexible to be a 5 in some situations, but getting a decent center will be much better to develop synergy than playing an undersized point forward all year.

[rascal]

But if you can pick 3 for Keldon + a first or two you do it IMO

I don't think Keldon has as much value as Spurstalk thinks he has.

That package won't get you 2 or 3. Those teams are going to want players like Mikal Bridges or Siakam back for the 2nd or third pick in this year's draft.
I'm seing on Portland boards, that's what they want for 3.

[Ariel]

Centers can be had with capspace, you don't need to trade KJ for that. A low key target could be Mason Plumlee or someone like that (cheaper than Brook Lopez and Poeltl).

[rascal]

2 picks and Keldon for scoot I’d get.

But if we’re offering Keldon plus 2 firsts for a pick that is 7-12 we’re idiots. Nothing in that range is worth 2 firsts and a proven player on a killer contract.

2 firsts and a swap for a 7-10 picks is fine by me.

Teams want a player better than Keldon for the 2 or 3 pick. Especially Portland, they are not looking for future picks but an all star level or slightly lower than all star level veteran and I'm sure it wouldn't be Keldon.

[BacktoBasics]

Cason Wallace and Hood Schifino are a pass from me, whenever I've watched them play I didn't come away super impressed.
Anthony Black I love, but I concur 100% he's going to Washington or Utah at 8/9 at the lowest. I think a realistic trade up should target picks 6 (Orlando) and 7 (Indiana). With that said, Indiana needs a PF and I'd be SHOCKED if they move the pick instead of taking one of Cam Whitmore, Taylor Hendricks or Jarace Walker. Orlando I could see moving the pick if the price is right, because they have 11 where they could target need (Gradey Dick?). Their core is set so they need pieces, maybe Keldon Johnson + future first (ideally Charlotte, realistically likely Toronto) would be an enticing offer for that pick, I think Keldon would be much more efficient alongside Banchero and Wagner than he was this past season.
For Bufkin, I think he's a late lottery / mid teens prospect, with a strong fit in Toronto at 13. We could go to Dallas for 10 for maybe Keldon Johnson, but I'm not sure I'd use 10 on Bufkin, I'm more inclined to wait to see if he falls a bit and then if he does you can put together a more reasonable offer for a lower pick, like Atlanta at 15 or Lakers at 17.
I left Amen Thompson for last. I've been saying time and again that I didn't want Amen Thompson to be our top pick. With that said, if the Spurs are truly enamored with him, Houston is rumored to be willing to move the pick for win now pieces. I don't know that we have such pieces, they need to balance out the roster and that requires playmaking, which we don't have in excess. A Derrick White or Dejounte could have been appealing to them, for instance, but right now in terms of value maybe Vassell + 1st would be fair but I don't think they'd do it because of fit.
All in all, I'd be open to opportunities, but those PG options you mention seem pretty difficult / expensive to me. And to be fair, no, I can't come up with a much better one off the top of my head. But some may open up, you never know.
Lastly, I would take a look at Judah Mintz and Marcus Sasser in the 2nd round, not in the same tier, but maybe attainable with either of our seconds which would make for a much more affordable gamble.

Right now we have Keldon and Vassell that can carry the scoring load. If you move one of them for a prospect you’re not getting back that same or anywhere near that production.

It’s a step backwards.

So many shitty teams struggle with prospect overload and a lack of legitimate production.

What are you going to get from 6 or 7 that would even remotely replace the consistency of Keldon.

Wemby is gonna greatly benefit from having a team around him that takes pressure off. Removing our arguably best and most consistent scorer for players that will be picked in a range we all just got done suggesting we should trade out of seems dumb.

Most of us argued that after 4 there’s a drop off and 5-10 are interchangeable and not really game changer type material. If we landed 4-7 most wanted to trade that pick.

Now we wanna give up our most consistent offensive player and picks to get back a potential project.

[DPG21920]

I don't think Keldon has as much value as Spurstalk thinks he has.

That package won't get you 2 or 3. Those teams are going to want players like Mikal Bridges or Siakam back for the 2nd or third pick in this year's draft.
I'm seing on Portland boards, that's what they want for 3.

Agree - don’t think its enough but you never know.

What about Doug McDermott, Keldon & 1 ATL pick + the CHA pick? POR gets immediate real depth and picks they can use to trade further etc…maybe that does it?

[rascal]

Suddenly Spurstalk doesn't want to part with any of the current roster.

This roster outside of Wemby is bad. Along with Houston the Spurs(outside of Wemby) are the least talented team in the league

[rascal]

Agree - don’t think its enough but you never know.

What about Doug McDermott, Keldon & 1 ATL pick + the CHA pick? POR gets immediate real depth and picks they can use to trade further etc…maybe that does it?

Doubt it. Like I said Portland wants to add quality(an all star to win now) not quantitiy or future draft picks.
I don't see any trade between the Spurs and Portland. Portland will have better trade partners(Toronto) to work a trade with.

[BacktoBasics]

Suddenly Spurstalk doesn't want to part with any of the current roster.

This roster outside of Wemby is bad. Along with Houston the Spurs(outside of Wemby) are the least talented team in the league

I think I probably stand alone on that. I have little interest in trading Keldon but the consensus here is to move him for the 6-7 pick. I’m not overvaluing him. I’d move him for the 3rd pick. But nothing after 4 is worth it.

You’re not getting any production back and Keldon is a contributing player that will take pressure off of Wemby right away.

I don’t think Keldon is Siakam or Bridges. But his value is greater than whitmore, Hendricks, jarice etc.

I’m fine to overpay with draft picks to get back in but I see nothing 5-10 that even remotely replaces what Keldon brings.

There’s a greater chance that 5-10 don’t even end up at keldons level.

[Ariel]

Right now we have Keldon and Vassell that can carry the scoring load. If you move one of them for a prospect you’re not getting back that same or anywhere near that production.

It’s a step backwards.

So many shitty teams struggle with prospect overload and a lack of legitimate production.

What are you going to get from 6 or 7 that would even remotely replace the consistency of Keldon.

Wemby is gonna greatly benefit from having a team around him that takes pressure off. Removing our arguably best and most consistent scorer for players that will be picked in a range we all just got done suggesting we should trade out of seems dumb.

Most of us argued that after 4 there’s a drop off and 5-10 are interchangeable and not really game changer type material. If we landed 4-7 most wanted to trade that pick.

Now we wanna give up our most consistent offensive player and picks to get back a potential project.
I'm not advocating for all those scenarios, some of them (like moving him to land Bufkin) is more of an exercise of what it would take as proposed in the first post, rather than an endorsement. With that said, if you think someone's upside is high enough (say Amen Thompson or Black) and you need to move Keldon for that, you do it. He's not that special to keep you from adding a high upside, long term starter if that's how they're deemed.

[mo7888]

Doubt it. Like I said Portland wants to add quality(an all star to win now) not quantitiy or future draft picks.
I don't see any trade between the Spurs and Portland. Portland will have better trade partners(Toronto) to work a trade with.

What would Toronto Realistically offer? They aren't attaching future firsts in a trade because getting #3 is tantamount to a rebuild and their first would be valuable in that scenario. They can offer Siakim, but is he alone worth #3? Or more to the point, is he worth more than KJ, the Charlotte pick + 1 ATL pick? I don't think so...

[Mr. Body]

Cason Wallace and Hood Schifino are a pass from me, whenever I've watched them play I didn't come away super impressed.
Anthony Black I love, but I concur 100% he's going to Washington or Utah at 8/9 at the lowest. I think a realistic trade up should target picks 6 (Orlando) and 7 (Indiana). With that said, Indiana needs a PF and I'd be SHOCKED if they move the pick instead of taking one of Cam Whitmore, Taylor Hendricks or Jarace Walker. Orlando I could see moving the pick if the price is right, because they have 11 where they could target need (Gradey Dick?). Their core is set so they need pieces, maybe Keldon Johnson + future first (ideally Charlotte, realistically likely Toronto) would be an enticing offer for that pick, I think Keldon would be much more efficient alongside Banchero and Wagner than he was this past season.
For Bufkin, I think he's a late lottery / mid teens prospect, with a strong fit in Toronto at 13. We could go to Dallas for 10 for maybe Keldon Johnson, but I'm not sure I'd use 10 on Bufkin, I'm more inclined to wait to see if he falls a bit and then if he does you can put together a more reasonable offer for a lower pick, like Atlanta at 15 or Lakers at 17.
I left Amen Thompson for last. I've been saying time and again that I didn't want Amen Thompson to be our top pick. With that said, if the Spurs are truly enamored with him, Houston is rumored to be willing to move the pick for win now pieces. I don't know that we have such pieces, they need to balance out the roster and that requires playmaking, which we don't have in excess. A Derrick White or Dejounte could have been appealing to them, for instance, but right now in terms of value maybe Vassell + 1st would be fair but I don't think they'd do it because of fit.
All in all, I'd be open to opportunities, but those PG options you mention seem pretty difficult / expensive to me. And to be fair, no, I can't come up with a much better one off the top of my head. But some may open up, you never know.
Lastly, I would take a look at Judah Mintz and Marcus Sasser in the 2nd round, not in the same tier, but maybe attainable with either of our seconds which would make for a much more affordable gamble.

Good thoughts, and not only because we pretty much agree! I keep hearing about Cason Wallace. I wonder how much of that is the "Kentucky guards" thing, where they overperform their college stock once in the NBA (Booker, Herro).

Agree completely on Indiana. They're getting Wallace or Hendricks, maybe Whitmore, and will be pumped. They have to be happy about where they are.

Unsure about Orlando. I'm not sure they really do want that #6, primarily because of who is there, since they're stocked with forwards. I would give a couple of firsts to get there, but they'd need a real piece like Keldon, as you say. If my sense is that the Spurs really value Black, they may really try.

I do like Bufkin, but am unsure what I'd give up for him. He could be very undervalued. Those late lottery picks feel like they'd be hard to jar loose. Dallas's is more possible, just don't think they'd want Keldon or he's worth trading for Bufkin. As for using that pick for Bufkin, I don't mind if he's supposedly projected a bit later.

Amen Thompson - there's probably going to be a splashy bidding war if that spot is auctioned. I seriously disliked going after him if that was our own pick. With Wmby we have the luxury to try things out, but I still feel the salary cost is above where I place him as a player.

I'm not hugely enamored of the later PGs but a Sasser could be a good stopgap talent.

[CGD]

Doubt it. Like I said Portland wants to add quality(an all star to win now) not quantitiy or future draft picks.
I don't see any trade between the Spurs and Portland. Portland will have better trade partners(Toronto) to work a trade with.

Man, Portland would be in a much better place if they drafted Scoot and got a boat load of picks
for Dame in a trade. It’s time for them to change course, and Scoot/Sharpe backcourt would be a hell of a start. Or better yet Simons/Sharpe/Miller.

[rascal]

Right now we have Keldon and Vassell that can carry the scoring load. If you move one of them for a prospect you’re not getting back that same or anywhere near that production.

It’s a step backwards.

So many shitty teams struggle with prospect overload and a lack of legitimate production.

What are you going to get from 6 or 7 that would even remotely replace the consistency of Keldon.

Wemby is gonna greatly benefit from having a team around him that takes pressure off. Removing our arguably best and most consistent scorer for players that will be picked in a range we all just got done suggesting we should trade out of seems dumb.

Most of us argued that after 4 there’s a drop off and 5-10 are interchangeable and not really game changer type material. If we landed 4-7 most wanted to trade that pick.

Now we wanna give up our most consistent offensive player and picks to get back a potential project.

You will probably get a better player than either of those guys with the right trade.

Both KJ and Vassell are role players I don't see ever being good enough to be all stars.

I'd rather take a shot at Cam Whitmore than either of those guys. You couldn't get into the top ten by offering Keldon or Vassell in a trade.

[rascal]

Man, Portland would be in a much better place if they drafted Scoot and got a boat load of picks
for Dame in a trade. It’s time for them to change course, and Scoot/Sharpe backcourt would be a hell of a start. Or better yet Simons/Sharpe/Miller.

They still are trying to win with Dame.

[BackHome]

Based on what? Sochan is more the Bruce Bowen who picks up the best offensive player on the other team than he is Duncan playing the 4 next to the number of other bigs we had over the years.

Sochan isn’t picking up AD, Embiid, Sabonis if Wemby is on the floor.

Well your starting 5 has Sochan and Wemb. so I guess you want Wemb. to guard Embiid and Sanbonis good luck with that as he will get his chest caved in his first season guarding those two.

[offset formation]

Man, Portland would be in a much better place if they drafted Scoot and got a boat load of picks
for Dame in a trade. It’s time for them to change course, and Scoot/Sharpe backcourt would be a hell of a start. Or better yet Simons/Sharpe/Miller.

I feel like they're in a loyalty pact with one another though. Can't see Portlands ownership trading him unless he asked them.

[BacktoBasics]

You will probably get a better player than either of those guys with the right trade.

Both KJ and Vassell are role players I don't see ever being good enough to be all stars.

I'd rather take a shot at Cam Whitmore than either of those guys. You couldn't get into the top ten by offering Keldon or Vassell in a trade.
Cam is a black hole that has no concept of team yet. He needs a few years of coaching and lot of development.

I don’t care about AS appearances tbh. You have two 20ppg scorers that perfectly complement Wemby and give him a nice easy entry into the league.

You need to return proven talent not hoop dreams if you’re gonna move a productive player off this current roster.

Nothing more foolish that trading away your teams leading scorer and putting that burden on Wemby. Or Vassell for that matter.

Witmore is coming into to league and producing right away. I doubt he averages more 10 a game.

[Mr. Body]

Portland and Lillard are lilke two tangled-up skydivers, each refusing to open their parachute.

[rascal]

I think I probably stand alone on that. I have little interest in trading Keldon but the consensus here is to move him for the 6-7 pick. I’m not overvaluing him. I’d move him for the 3rd pick. But nothing after 4 is worth it.

You’re not getting any production back and Keldon is a contributing player that will take pressure off of Wemby right away.

I don’t think Keldon is Siakam or Bridges. But his value is greater than whitmore, Hendricks, jarice etc.

I’m fine to overpay with draft picks to get back in but I see nothing 5-10 that even remotely replaces what Keldon brings.

There’s a greater chance that 5-10 don’t even end up at keldons level.

I disagree. I'd rather have Whitmore, Hendricks or Walker for their upside. The Spurs aren't playing for next year.
They are trying to build a team for the future and those guys have more potential upside than Keldon.

[rascal]

Cam is a black hole that has no concept of team yet. He needs a few years of coaching and lot of development.

I don’t care about AS appearances tbh. You have two 20ppg scorers that perfectly complement Wemby and give him a nice easy entry into the league.

You need to return proven talent not hoop dreams if you’re gonna move a productive player off this current roster.

Nothing more foolish that trading away your teams leading scorer and putting that burden on Wemby. Or Vassell for that matter.

Witmore is coming into to league and producing right away. I doubt he averages more 10 a game.

Again the Spurs are not playing for next year.

They are playing for the future so you go with higher upside players. Cam is going to be better than Keldon.

[BacktoBasics]

I disagree. I'd rather have Whitmore, Hendricks or Walker for their upside. The Spurs aren't playing for next year.
They are trying to build a team for the future and those guys have more potential upside than Keldon.

Not really. Other than a long shot in cam neither of those were projected to be AS.

You’re also missing the point. I’m not arguing that we’re playing for next year. I’m arguing that lightening the load for Wemby now will pay dividends later. Surrounding him by a bunch of prospects is stupid and wishful video game thinking. While overburdening your potential franchise player on day 1.

We can package up all kinds of shit over the next 3 years. The best move is to give Wemby a nice landing spot with proven talent and be patient for the right upgrade.

Dumping our best scorer for an unknown is dumb. Unless it’s something like scoot etc. I’ll concede that.

[Mr. Body]

I disagree. I'd rather have Whitmore, Hendricks or Walker for their upside. The Spurs aren't playing for next year.
They are trying to build a team for the future and those guys have more potential upside than Keldon.

It's fascinating seeing you get fixated on the wrong players for the Spurs. I wonder what type it'll be next year.

[DPG21920]

Doubt it. Like I said Portland wants to add quality(an all star to win now) not quantitiy or future draft picks.
I don't see any trade between the Spurs and Portland. Portland will have better trade partners(Toronto) to work a trade with.

1) Which all stars seem available for trade?

2) Is pick 3 in this draft THAT valuable (Miller or Amen)? You think teams with all stars will value Amen for their all star? Maybe, I’m legit interested to see.

3) They very well may have better trade partners, but not many have the extra picks + good players like Spurs. If you can get solid real depth + draft capital to either use later if Dame bails or trade further? Might be appealing especially if theres too many sellers and not enough buyers.

PS: I would not do that deal if I were the Spurs unless Scoot fell to 3. I’m not trading Keldon + Doug + 2 firsts to gamble on Amen personally. It’s not unreasonable and I would not be “mad” but Keldon is a very good player with real value on a real solid deal.

[rascal]

I remember the last playin game the Spurs were in against NO and Keldon disappeared when the team needed him after Murray went out with foul trouble.

Keldon is just too inconsistent and unreliable to be counted on. There is a reason the Spurs had such a bad record. Their best players aren't very good(Keldon) and their rookies weren't ready yet.

[rascal]

It's fascinating seeing you get fixated on the wrong players for the Spurs. I wonder what type it'll be next year.

You're fixated on wrong players.

Everyone has their opinion.

[BacktoBasics]

I remember the last playin game the Spurs were in against NO and Keldon disappeared when the team needed him after Murray went out with foul trouble.

Keldon is just too inconsistent and unreliable to be counted on. There is a reason the Spurs had such a bad record. Their best players aren't very good(Keldon) and their rookies weren't ready yet.

They held guys out over hang nails. We were tanking. I never realized how bad your takes are sometimes. He’s hardly inconsistent.

[Stump]

I think I probably stand alone on that. I have little interest in trading Keldon but the consensus here is to move him for the 6-7 pick. I’m not overvaluing him. I’d move him for the 3rd pick. But nothing after 4 is worth it.

You’re not getting any production back and Keldon is a contributing player that will take pressure off of Wemby right away.

I don’t think Keldon is Siakam or Bridges. But his value is greater than whitmore, Hendricks, jarice etc.

I’m fine to overpay with draft picks to get back in but I see nothing 5-10 that even remotely replaces what Keldon brings.

There’s a greater chance that 5-10 don’t even end up at keldons level.
I'm in agreement with you. No one below Scoot makes sense to get rid of a reliable young contributor on a good contract.

Would Portland even value him? They may want an all-star player but you have to actually find a team who is willing to trade one away. Keldon + picks would probably not be on their top tier of desirable returns, but they might settle on it if other offers don't work out. For the Spurs, you offer Keldon, let Portland do their due diligence, and then don't sweat it if they don't call you back.

[scott]

I think I probably stand alone on that. I have little interest in trading Keldon but the consensus here is to move him for the 6-7 pick. I’m not overvaluing him. I’d move him for the 3rd pick. But nothing after 4 is worth it.

You’re not getting any production back and Keldon is a contributing player that will take pressure off of Wemby right away.

I don’t think Keldon is Siakam or Bridges. But his value is greater than whitmore, Hendricks, jarice etc.

I’m fine to overpay with draft picks to get back in but I see nothing 5-10 that even remotely replaces what Keldon brings.

There’s a greater chance that 5-10 don’t even end up at keldons level.

I agree with this and let's face be real, Keldon ain't going to get us in the range we'd need to be in for Scoot/Amen.

We need to improve the talent level around Wemby, and do it quickly. I also agree that we have some pieces that fit nicely already (Devin, Sochan, Keldon, Bran). Though I don't see Keldon as a long term piece of the puzzle, in the short term he is fine. Rather than moving picks (or players) for rolls of the dice in the draft, I'd rather up the level of veteran talent surrounding that young core. Move that Charlotte pick for a Derrick White type. I wouldn't be saying this if we weren't pick #1 - but with Wemby coming, we have our young core set, there really isn't a need to keep adding to that pile of developmental assets.

[rascal]

They held guys out over hang nails. We were tanking. I never realized how bad your takes are sometimes. He’s hardly inconsistent.

The Spurs are bad, reason for the tank.

[spurraider21]

Suddenly Spurstalk doesn't want to part with any of the current roster.

This roster outside of Wemby is bad. Along with Houston the Spurs(outside of Wemby) are the least talented team in the league
sochan and vassell are the only guys id feel very reluctant to move

[rascal]

1) Which all stars seem available for trade?

2) Is pick 3 in this draft THAT valuable (Miller or Amen)? You think teams with all stars will value Amen for their all star? Maybe, I’m legit interested to see.

3) They very well may have better trade partners, but not many have the extra picks + good players like Spurs. If you can get solid real depth + draft capital to either use later if Dame bails or trade further? Might be appealing especially if theres too many sellers and not enough buyers.

PS: I would not do that deal if I were the Spurs unless Scoot fell to 3. I’m not trading Keldon + Doug + 2 firsts to gamble on Amen personally. It’s not unreasonable and I would not be “mad” but Keldon is a very good player with real value on a real solid deal.

Mikal Bridges and Siakam will be trade targets for Portland.

[DPG21920]

Mikal Bridges and Siakam will be trade targets for Portland.

If they can land them for pick 3, they absolutely should. But then who does DAL get for pick 10? Who does WAS get?

[Mr. Body]

If they can land them for pick 3, they absolutely should. But then who does DAL get for pick 10? Who does WAS get?

I think WAS keeps their pick and gets Wallace or Black. DAL is not clear. Mocks are starting to suggest a defensive center in Derek Lively but that seems... underwhelming? I feel like they're gonna try to get an established player, whoever it is.

[Leetonidas]

Suddenly Spurstalk doesn't want to part with any of the current roster.

This roster outside of Wemby is bad. Along with Houston the Spurs(outside of Wemby) are the least talented team in the league

It's not about that. I think most of us want to see how they play together first before immediately shipping anyone out

[Mr. Body]

The idea of Lillard to join Harden in Houston is floating around. I think Lillard and Portland have a death grip on each other. But this is the crazy shit Houston is liable to do and may actually rescue the Blazers from their weird hell.

[rascal]

What would Toronto Realistically offer? They aren't attaching future firsts in a trade because getting #3 is tantamount to a rebuild and their first would be valuable in that scenario. They can offer Siakim, but is he alone worth #3? Or more to the point, is he worth more than KJ, the Charlotte pick + 1 ATL pick? I don't think so...

Yes he is worth more because Portland wants to get the best player they can for that 3 pick to win now with Dame.

Dame is interested in who Portland acquires for this year not future draft picks and Portland is building around the Dame win now window.

It's what they will do unless they change their plan and give up on the idea they can win with Dame and trade Dame and keep that 3 pick. That can be a possibility.

[rascal]

It's not about that. I think most of us want to see how they play together first before immediately shipping anyone out

Not me

I'm not interested in just adding Wemby to a bad team and calling it quits there.

[RC_Drunkford]

I‘ll much rather move up into the late first round with some of those 20 second round picks we got. Somebody will fall and we always draft starting caliber players in the 20s

[Kevin]

Its going to cost Devin plus unprotected Atlanta picks if they want to move into the top 10. Keldon wont do the trick. For Scoot you'd do it in heartbeat but as others said that's unlikely because they want win now players for the pick and could do better than Dev. Not sure if any remaining prospect outside the top three are worth losing Dev plus unprotected Atlanta picks. Too risky.

[Biggems]

I want to see Mamu and Wemby on the floor together.

[mo7888]

Yes he is worth more because Portland wants to get the best player they can for that 3 pick to win now with Dame.

Dame is interested in who Portland acquires for this year not future draft picks and Portland is building around the Dame win now window.

It's what they will do unless they change their plan and give up on the idea they can win with Dame and trade Dame and keep that 3 pick. That can be a possibility.

Nah... there's no way Siakim alone is worth more that KJ, and two firsts (one unprotected). While, they'd prefer siakim over KJ in a vacuum, the value isn't there and Toronto wouldn't offer any firsts to improve the value.

I'm not saying our package gets #3 either, I'm saying there's no way Siakim alone is worth #3.

[Rocalcio]

I already said that earlier this season but with Ivey emerging and Cunningham coming back from injury, Hayes won’t play much next season in Detroit. He’s a good playmaker, his shoot still sucks but nothing unfixable. Most of all, he’s French and will be playing with Wembanyama in national team. Instead of betting on a rookie, it could be the right move.

[TrainOfThought5]

Based on what? Sochan is more the Bruce Bowen who picks up the best offensive player on the other team than he is Duncan playing the 4 next to the number of other bigs we had over the years.

Sochan isn’t picking up AD, Embiid, Sabonis if Wemby is on the floor.

the spurs need to go and get poetl back.

[Mr. Body]

Having a night's sleep and other duties, and still avoiding work... I'm stepping back from moving into the top 10. I think it's unlikely and I agree that Keldon both won't command those picks (although I thought he'd need to be paired with assets) and his role is pretty important right now on the team.

I've been looking at Washington and Utah as taking PGs at their current spots, but they might be in places to bid for the #2 or #3 picks (or even #4) to nab Scoot or Amen. Not sure the packages, but Washington is likely to want a splash. Unsure about Utah. If either (or both) teams get higher-ranked PG types, one of our targets could become more available.

Anyway, I still think the team tries to get two young talents from this draft. One of them is assigned. Feels like the effort will be put into getting into the 20s.

[mo7888]

Having a night's sleep and other duties, and still avoiding work... I'm stepping back from moving into the top 10. I think it's unlikely and I agree that Keldon both won't command those picks (although I thought he'd need to be paired with assets) and his role is pretty important right now on the team.

I've been looking at Washington and Utah as taking PGs at their current spots, but they might be in places to bid for the #2 or #3 picks (or even #4) to nab Scoot or Amen. Not sure the packages, but Washington is likely to want a splash. Unsure about Utah. If either (or both) teams get higher-ranked PG types, one of our targets could become more available.

Anyway, I still think the team tries to get two young talents from this draft. One of them is assigned. Feels like the effort will be put into getting into the 20s.

Let's say your right about getting that 2nd talent in this draft and let's say your right and we're looking for a PG. All that matters is the longterm fit with Wemby, so who do you see as the best fit?

[Mr. Body]

Let's say your right about getting that 2nd talent in this draft and let's say your right and we're looking for a PG. All that matters is the longterm fit with Wemby, so who do you see as the best fit?

If they're not gung-ho about getting back into the lottery, then I don't see a PG as the explicit target. They'd probably just be going for a good talent generally.

If they are trying to poach a good PG type, Black will be out of range. I don't have great feelings about Hood-Schifino, who will be around 20 (probably). I do think Bufkin will be undervalued and teams will regret passing on him. He's probably in the 10-20 range but think he'll go in the late lottery. I don't think they can get there unless they find a team who doesn't need a player now, or can wait until 33, and likes something in the future.

But I think the Spurs will be as conservative with their assets as usual. If there's someone they like regardless of position they might try to trade a bit down, a Whitehead type.

[mo7888]

If they're not gung-ho about getting back into the lottery, then I don't see a PG as the explicit target. They'd probably just be going for a good talent generally.

If they are trying to poach a good PG type, Black will be out of range. I don't have great feelings about Hood-Schifino, who will be around 20 (probably). I do think Bufkin will be undervalued and teams will regret passing on him. He's probably in the 10-20 range but think he'll go in the late lottery. I don't think they can get there unless they find a team who doesn't need a player now, or can wait until 33, and likes something in the future.

But I think the Spurs will be as conservative with their assets as usual. If there's someone they like regardless of position they might try to trade a bit down, a Whitehead type.

Omitting Scoot (because I don't think there's anyway we pay what it'll take to get that high), if we're going for a PG in a range between 10-20 I like 3 guys for different reasons: NSJ (I know we disagree about projecting him as a PG), Cason Wallace, and Kobe Bufkin.

[exstatic]

I’m gonna say something and I understand he showed nothing this year… are we giving up on Blake Wesley as a future PG? We keep bringing guys up, maybe he’s the answer if he’s improving

He's a horizontally elite athlete, and showed blow by speed on a number of occasions. The problem is when he gets into the restricted area, he doesn't know how to finish well. He needs a consistent floater to fall to unlock his finishing skill package. He's also my pick for non-Wemby breakout player this year.

I was watching an interview clip with Doug McD last year talking about the rookies and their progress, and he mentioned that it usually takes 40 games to get your feet under you and figure out the NBA. Because of his MCL tear, Wesley played only 37 games. Don't be surprised by a burst of progress right out of the gate this year.

[Mr. Body]

Omitting Scoot (because I don't think there's anyway we pay what it'll take to get that high), if we're going for a PG in a range between 10-20 I like 3 guys for different reasons: NSJ (I know we disagree about projecting him as a PG), Cason Wallace, and Kobe Bufkin.

That's fair. I really would like them to try to pull a good PG prospect. These are players you might find in the future... maybe... but getting a young talent on board now seems like a good idea.

[John B]

He's a horizontally elite athlete, and showed blow by speed on a number of occasions. The problem is when he gets into the restricted area, he doesn't know how to finish well. He needs a consistent floater to fall to unlock his finishing skill package. He's also my pick for non-Wemby breakout player this year.

I was watching an interview clip with Doug McD last year talking about the rookies and their progress, and he mentioned that it usually takes 40 games to get your feet under you and figure out the NBA. Because of his MCL tear, Wesley played only 37 games. Don't be surprised by a burst of progress right out of the gate this year.

I love Wesley, especially because he is fearless and that dog in him. He believes he belongs out there. He is a bit small but a pesky defender. I mean we had TP who is the same built and speed, same fearless attitude.

And I’ve mentioned on another thread. Wemby coming will elevate a lot of these young players game, the same for MJ’s Bulls, Kobe’s Lakers, Timmy’s Spurs. There is the urgency to get better, to play best because you are close to getting there playing with a player as such. I have no doubt everyone will be in the gym early trying to get better. I have no doubt our young guys will surprise us and it will be fun.

I know they will not push to win a ring this year, too early for that. But they will play to win this time. No more stealth tanking, as some might suggest. I think Wemby’s expectations are to win. So they will play to win. But not necessarily bring vets to win for them, but the young core getting to the next level.

[Russ]

I‘ll much rather move up into the late first round with some of those 20 second round picks we got. Somebody will fall and we always draft starting caliber players in the 20s

Yeah, the value in this draft isn't the top ten.

The value is late first/early second and the Spurs are already poised to make some noise there.

[Dverde]

Word around Mavs trying to move #10 either to get an upgrade or unload a bad contract like Bert or Hardaway.

[BacktoBasics]

Word around Mavs trying to move #10 either to get an upgrade or unload a bad contract like Bert or Hardaway.

I doubt they give up #10 for a cap absorption but that is exactly the kind of thing we should do with our cap space. I don’t think there’s any big time FA this summer that we’d likely target but using up the cap to continue building our war chest is smart.

Overpaying seems to be the new normal. The more assets we have the easier it’ll be to add a piece that we really like.

[RC_Drunkford]

Word around Mavs trying to move #10 either to get an upgrade or unload a bad contract like Bert or Hardaway.

if that's all they want we should jump on it. Then again I doubt that they would trade #10 just to get rid of salary

[spurraider21]

id be on the phone with dallas if black was still available at 10

[lmbebo]

id be on the phone with dallas if black was still available at 10


I think that would work. Not sure the kind of deal to be worked out there. Sure dallas would push for Keldon or someone else of value more than just dumping Bertans.

But if there is a player that works with us for #10 and get Bertans back (familiar with the team, can shoot it, etc). Not a horrible idea. He's got 1 or 2 years left?

[Mr. Body]

id be on the phone with dallas if black was still available at 10

100%. I'd do it for Bufkin. Possibly for Cason.

I don't think Dallas only wants to shed salary. That's remarkably expensive use of a #10 pick. They need a player or other draft capital. I don't think the #33 is enough, but something along those lines. It's a package I'm intrigued by, in any case.

[spurraider21]

100%. I'd do it for Bufkin. Possibly for Cason.

I don't think Dallas only wants to shed salary. That's remarkably expensive use of a #10 pick. They need a player or other draft capital. I don't think the #33 is enough, but something along those lines. It's a package I'm intrigued by, in any case.
id give the hornets pick. i think its fairly likely to convey, but it also will never be higher than 15 anyway. now if they also wanted a player back to help them now, it becomes more complicated. because sure, instead of the pick, we can send a player back, but then they're not really saving salary anyway

[Ariel]

100%. I'd do it for Bufkin. Possibly for Cason.

I don't think Dallas only wants to shed salary. That's remarkably expensive use of a #10 pick. They need a player or other draft capital. I don't think the #33 is enough, but something along those lines. It's a package I'm intrigued by, in any case.
Surely not, and even then they don't seem to have terrible contracts on their roster (2 more years of Hardway and Bertans). With that said, if they do want to dump either of them and sell the pick, the Spurs do have a combination of expiring contracts (McDermott, Graham, Birch), role players (Zach Collins, Tre Jones), future firsts, boatloads of seconds (useful for future trades and flexibility)... I don't know that any of that is enough in itself, but some combination of it may work in a 3 way deal.

[Mr. Body]

Surely not, and even then they don't seem to have terrible contracts on their roster (2 more years of Hardway and Bertans). With that said, if they do want to dump either of them and sell the pick, the Spurs do have a combination of expiring contracts (McDermott, Graham, Birch), role players (Zach Collins, Tre Jones), future firsts, boatloads of seconds (useful for future trades and flexibility)... I don't know that any of that is enough in itself, but some combination of it may work in a 3 way deal.

They really do seem to want to dump salary. At least the idea is getting floated in their local media. The pick outright for dumping salary? No. But, damn it, I'm gonna get obsessed with this possibility and it's never gonna happen

[lmbebo]

Dallas is trying to build a team around Luka now. So they want players ready to help win now more than rookie/draft capital.

If they were interested in Graham + Charlotte pick, I'd do it.

I think McDermott becomes more important with Wemby now.

[DPG21920]

There was an Athletic article that proposed: Keldon + CHA 1st for pick 5 from DET

[Mr. Body]

There was an Athletic article that proposed: Keldon + CHA 1st for pick 5 from DET

Amazing to see the national sports media give a shit about the Spurs now.

[Dverde]

10895626 (tel:10895626)[/URL]]Dallas is trying to build a team around Luka now. So they want players ready to help win now more than rookie/draft capital.

If they were interested in Graham + Charlotte pick, I'd do it.

I think McDermott becomes more important with Wemby now.

:lol McNuggets is never more important in any scenario. He’s just a floor spacing shooter.

[RC_Drunkford]

:lol McNuggets is never more important in any scenario. He’s just a floor spacing shooter.

He'll be a very good trade asset at the deadline

[BacktoBasics]

Dallas is trying to build a team around Luka now. So they want players ready to help win now more than rookie/draft capital.

If they were interested in Graham + Charlotte pick, I'd do it.

I think McDermott becomes more important with Wemby now.It might provide Dallas with more flexibility. They could take whatever pics we trade them and use them to target a player they feel might be an ideal fit.

They wouldn’t do that at the trade deadline but now in the offseason it’s not so much of a problem.

[Mugen]

There was an Athletic article that proposed: Keldon + CHA 1st for pick 5 from DET

I think any move into the top 10 will require one of the Atlanta picks tbh. Cam, Walker, and Hendricks all seem like really good fits for DET @ 5.

[Mugen]

I wonder if there's a 3 team scenario with SA/PHX/DAL:
-PHX gets Kyrie via S&T
-DAL gets Ayton and another rotation player, maybe a heavily protected Spurs pick
-Spurs get #10 to facilitate and maybe CP3 w/o giving up Keldon

Spurs buy out CP3 or move him again later in the summer...

Probably way too many moving parts to become reality. But Spurs should absolutely weaponize their cap space to pick up assets this offseason when there's a very poor FA class.

[exstatic]

One thing to keep in mind is that with the new second tax apron kicking in summer of 2024, there will be an urgency to do some some stuff that if it doesn't get done, the new rules will prohibit it next year. Salary dumping could become a free for all. Pick # 10 sounds like a good pick, but it's really marginal, and might not be too high a price for maybe taking both of Dallas's bad contracts. It just seems odd that we are working out top 10 players with no other top 10 pick.

[Degoat]

One thing to keep in mind is that with the new second tax apron kicking in summer of 2024, there will be an urgency to do some some stuff that if it doesn't get done, the new rules will prohibit it next year. Salary dumping could become a free for all. Pick # 10 sounds like a good pick, but it's really marginal, and might not be too high a price for maybe taking both of Dallas's bad contracts. It just seems odd that we are working out top 10 players with no other top 10 pick.

Would be interesting for the spurs to add another top 10 pick but every single year the spurs do this, they’re just doing their due diligence

[Seventyniner]

The Spurs should be able to absorb a contract like Bertans outright (i.e. without sending any salary back) on draft night because it's not expiring, right?

But did Dallas really do that blatant tank and draw the ire of the league just to use the #10 to dump salary? I doubt it.

[Mr. Body]

One thing to keep in mind is that with the new second tax apron kicking in summer of 2024, there will be an urgency to do some some stuff that if it doesn't get done, the new rules will prohibit it next year. Salary dumping could become a free for all. Pick # 10 sounds like a good pick, but it's really marginal, and might not be too high a price for maybe taking both of Dallas's bad contracts. It just seems odd that we are working out top 10 players with no other top 10 pick.

This may be due diligence. Here's a chance to talk to the top players in the draft. This can matter down the line and is pretty common.

[JPB]

Don't know about Dallas real intentions but I would expect them to want some pick(s) and/or a player for #10, I have a hard time imagining them shopping it just to get rid of two bad contracts...

[BacktoBasics]

One thing to keep in mind is that with the new second tax apron kicking in summer of 2024, there will be an urgency to do some some stuff that if it doesn't get done, the new rules will prohibit it next year. Salary dumping could become a free for all. Pick # 10 sounds like a good pick, but it's really marginal, and might not be too high a price for maybe taking both of Dallas's bad contracts. It just seems odd that we are working out top 10 players with no other top 10 pick.

I don't know Dallas tax situation. Is clearing those contracts gonna really free up that much money for them?

[Mr. Body]

Don't know about Dallas real intentions but I would expect them to want some pick(s) and/or a player for #10, I have a hard time imagining them shopping it just to get rid of two bad contracts...

Yeah, it's definitely not to just dump salary.

[Mr. Body]

What teams actually have cap room this summer?

[K...]

Would be interesting for the spurs to add another top 10 pick but every single year the spurs do this, they’re just doing their due diligence

Every single years the spurs have massive draft pick hauls that they must spend?

Getting wemby is worth 5-8 FRP. Building around him shouldn't be the passed, and roster limits mean the draft picks of the future are worth far less to the team. They have to make deals now to soon

[exstatic]

Don't know about Dallas real intentions but I would expect them to get some pick(s) and/or a player for #10, I have a hard time imagining them shopping it just to get rid of two bad contracts...

The player they "get" is Kyrie Irving. Without dumping those two contracts, they cannot sign him without going over the second apron with dire consequences next summer and later.


The second tax apron that’s included in the NBA’s new Collective Bargaining Agreement will be phased in over two seasons, sources tell John Hollinger of The Athletic.

The new financial provision is designed to discourage excessive spending by the league’s wealthiest franchises. It is set at $17.5MM above the luxury tax threshold and places severe restrictions on teams that go above that figure.

Penalties for exceeding the second apron include the loss of the mid-level exception, a ban on including cash as part of trades and the inability to accept more salary in a trade than the team sends out. A team in the second apron will also be unable to aggregate salary in trades and cannot trade its first-round pick seven years in the future (ie. its 2030 pick in 2023/24) or sign players on the buyout market.

Also, if a team exceeds the second apron and remains there in two of the four subsequent years, its frozen draft pick (the one that was initially seven years out) will get moved to the end of the first round, regardless of the team’s record in that season. :dizzy

Hollinger points out that the Clippers and Warriors face the most immediate concerns about the second apron. Both teams are currently about $40MM above the luxury tax line and are locked into payrolls at the same level for next season. Hollinger notes that the only way for either team to substantially reduce its payroll over the next few years is to downgrade its roster.

He adds that the Bucks, Celtics, Mavericks, Lakers and Suns are also more than $17.5MM above the tax line this season, but they have easier paths to avoiding the second apron in the future.

[Mr. Body]

Every single years the spurs have massive draft pick hauls that they must spend?

Getting wemby is worth 5-8 FRP. Building around him shouldn't be the passed, and roster limits mean the draft picks of the future are worth far less to the team. They have to make deals now to soon

Agree, getting Wemby changes things. The team can splurge a little while the timeline is completely different. It's not like they're trading (potentially) just for the #10. They're going after one or two players they think fit this new timeline. And they are starting to gameplan whether one of them is available there.

To me, it's either a PG type who they feel can grow with the young clan. I can see it could be a beefy PF type who can complement Wemby in a way Sochan doesn't necessarily. But I think the target would 100% be a PG.

[kht]

Which team needs bad contracts to offload? What do you guys think about taking on Poole or Ben Simmons?

[JPB]

The player they "get" is Kyrie Irving. Without dumping those two contracts, they cannot sign him without going over the second apron with dire consequences next summer and later.

They can perfectly dump those 2 players without using their #10 pick, which they will if the really want it, SA actually being an option.

[exstatic]

They can perfectly dump those 2 players without using their #10 pick, which they will if the really want it, SA actually being an option.

How?

[JPB]

How?

SRPs and/or protected future firsts. As we've seen this last deadline, SRPs can be valuable. I mean, nobody ever uses #10 picks just to dump salaries, even if it's for signing or extending other players.

[BacktoBasics]

Which team needs bad contracts to offload? What do you guys think about taking on Poole or Ben Simmons?

Poole has underperformed his new contract but that could be for all kinds of reasons. I’m not completely sour on him. Simmons is too much money for a guy who mentally and physically quit his last two teams. I don’t care what his injuries were.

[Mr. Body]

How?

Mark Cuban back rubs.

[Mr. Body]

Which team needs bad contracts to offload? What do you guys think about taking on Poole or Ben Simmons?

Those are completely nasty contracts. I'm not sure any draft capital helps take them on.

[Ariel]

We shouldn't take in more than 2 seasons of bad salaries, because '25 has boatloads of interesting FAs and it may be our last chance to make a big splash before rookie extensions for Sochan & Branham kick in... then we're over the cap and our flexibility goes out the window (but in a good way).

[Ariel]

Those are completely nasty contracts. I'm not sure any draft capital helps take them on.
With Ben Simmons you're basically paying him 80M for early retirement, since he's not going to show up (furthermore, if he does he'll be a distraction). That's worth like 3 unprotected first rounders if not more.

[exstatic]

SRPs and/or protected future firsts. As we've seen this last deadline, SRPs can be valuable.

This second tax apron wasn't looming one year out at the trade deadline. That happened in the last couple of weeks, and yes, it is a big deal.

How many teams, right now, have the ability and desire to absorb both contracts, and basically $86M in guaranteed salary over the next two seasons? Remember, that second year may put a prospective absorbing team onto the second apron themselves, or limiit their ability to sign their own players without doing so.

Have you even read up on the new second apron? You can lose the ability to trade your FRP 7 years out, and if you stay in the second apron for 2 of 4 years, THAT PICK CAN BE MOVED TO THE END OF THE FIRST ROUND, EVEN IF YOUR TEAM SHOULD BE IN THE LOTTERY THAT YEAR.

[spurraider21]

its a pretty big ask for dallas to both unload a bad contract AND get a good rotation player in exchange for the #10 pick

plus, if they get a good player back in exchange for, say, bertans' contract, then they're not really saving much, if at all, against the cap anyway. so they'd need a team to take on multiple bad deals AND give a good player in return for the #10 pick

i dont think they'll find their perfect deal. id eat the bertans deal and give them the hornets pick for #10 if our target is on the board though

[JPB]

Dallas doesnt' need to unload both to the same team. And they wouldn't give #10 just for one without any player or pick attached.

[Ariel]

Dallas doesnt' need to unload both to the same team.
Dallas only has 2 tradable firsts (#10 in '23, and '27), and no 2nd round picks. What do you propose they trade to offload those contracts AND get back players in return?

[exstatic]

Dallas doesnt' need to unload both to the same team. And they wouldn't give #10 just for one without any player or pick attached.

I'm proposing taking both, $86M over two seasons. You cut Bertans after season one and eat his $5M guaranteed money for season 2. That's definitely worth the pick.

[Chinook]

its a pretty big ask for dallas to both unload a bad contract AND get a good rotation player in exchange for the #10 pick

plus, if they get a good player back in exchange for, say, bertans' contract, then they're not really saving much, if at all, against the cap anyway. so they'd need a team to take on multiple bad deals AND give a good player in return for the #10 pick

i dont think they'll find their perfect deal. id eat the bertans deal and give them the hornets pick for #10 if our target is on the board though

Eh, I don't think trading Bertans for Keldon would require more than the 10th pick. But if we were talking like Mikal Bridges it might.

[JPB]

OK guys, you win. Let's get #10 for those two bad contracts. (Curious to see if Dallas would do that).

[mo7888]

Eh, I don't think trading Bertans for Keldon would require more than the 10th pick. But if we were talking like Mikal Bridges it might.

Is Mikal rumored to be moved? Or were you just using that as an example?

[Ariel]

i dont think they'll find their perfect deal. id eat the bertans deal and give them the hornets pick for #10 if our target is on the board though
I'd love this. They don't have any 2nd rounders, throw as many seconds as it takes to make this deal, they can use them later on for more veterans at the trade deadline. Don't think it's enough though.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Don't want Puban's trash. :td

[JPB]

Is Mikal rumored to be moved? Or were you just using that as an example?

Considering he was the gem in the Phoenix trade for NJ, I don't believe so.

[spurraider21]

Eh, I don't think trading Bertans for Keldon would require more than the 10th pick. But if we were talking like Mikal Bridges it might.
dallas making that move doesnt clear cap space for them which is a presumed goal as well if they want to re-sign kyrie and not get absolutely leveled by luxury tax

[Mr. Body]

Mikal Bridges is showing up in a lot of rumors. Not sure what's actually from the Nets. I don't think he's on the market at all.

[kht]

Mikal Bridges is showing up in a lot of rumors. Not sure what's actually from the Nets. I don't think he's on the market at all.

I'm sure they'd want a king's ransom... thinking he's Kevin Durant, which he's not. Teams will need to overpay for Bridges.

[exstatic]

dallas making that move doesnt clear cap space for them which is a presumed goal as well if they want to re-sign kyrie and not get absolutely leveled by luxury tax

He gets it.

[Chinook]

dallas making that move doesnt clear cap space for them which is a presumed goal as well if they want to re-sign kyrie and not get absolutely leveled by luxury tax

That's not going to be the reason they do this trade. They will stretch players like Bertans before they give up a high pick to trade him. Ex is overplaying the leverage a team like the Spurs would have.

[Mr. Body]

So we're saying Dallas would dump salaries for future picks? Or dump salaries for KJ plus?

[Chinook]

Is Mikal rumored to be moved? Or were you just using that as an example?

I don't think the Nets intend on moving him, but teams are askin'

[mo7888]

If taking on Bertans and Hardaway gets you #10, then ot begs the question: does #10 + Keldon get you up to #3 or maybe even #2 if you give Charlotte their 1st back?

I didn't think we could get that high with paying a kings ransom, but there may be a path there?

[mo7888]

I don't think the Nets intend on moving him, but teams are askin'

Interesting... if we could put together something around Keldon that would be interesting...

[Mr. Body]

If taking on Bertans and Hardaway gets you #10, then ot begs the question: does #10 + Keldon get you up to #3 or maybe even #2 if you give Charlotte their 1st back?

I didn't think we could get that high with paying a kings ransom, but there may be a path there?

I have no idea. But I feel like there's going to be a feeding frenzy around those picks, driving up the costs. If Dallas values dumping contracts, those teams won't. I think we have to keep in mind fanbases and how responsive owners and GMs are to the fans. If Dallas comes away from the draft only dumping contracts (and some nebulous future picks), they're going to get slammed.

My feeling is that the 3 or 2 are going to require a current player and a few picks.

[mo7888]

That's not going to be the reason they do this trade. They will stretch players like Bertans before they give up a high pick to trade him. Ex is overplaying the leverage a team like the Spurs would have.

He may be overplaying it, but it's hard to get a feel for how this new CBA effects a team like Dallas next summer.

[Chinook]

If taking on Bertans and Hardaway gets you #10, then ot begs the question: does #10 + Keldon get you up to #3 or maybe even #2 if you give Charlotte their 1st back?

I didn't think we could get that high with paying a kings ransom, but there may be a path there?

Taking on Bertans and Hardaway doesn't get you 10, but Keldon plus 10 would likely get Portland's attention as the continue to rebuild without Lillard's notice.

[exstatic]

So we're saying Dallas would dump salaries for future picks? Or dump salaries for KJ plus?

They don't want salary back, even for a young prospect like Keldon.

[Mr. Body]

Taking on Bertans and Hardaway doesn't get you 10, but Keldon plus 10 would likely get Portland's attention as the continue to rebuild without Lillard's notice.

I really think you have to include Keldon or similar in the trade to Dallas. They need to come away with a current player or draft pick.

[Chinook]

He may be overplaying it, but it's hard to get a feel for how this new CBA effects a team like Dallas next summer.

Certainly some teams have to worry. But Dallas doesn't. They only have one big long-term contract. The penalties Ex was highlighting were for repeat offenders. They wouldn't even need to stretch anyone, though that'd be an option to stay under next year

[mo7888]

I have no idea. But I feel like there's going to be a feeding frenzy around those picks, driving up the costs. If Dallas values dumping contracts, those teams won't. I think we have to keep in mind fanbases and how responsive owners and GMs are to the fans. If Dallas comes away from the draft only dumping contracts (and some nebulous future picks), they're going to get slammed.

My feeling is that the 3 or 2 are going to require a current player and a few picks.

Like I said to Chinook, I don't understand the impacts of the new CBA enough to really analyze how it's gonna effect these teams next summer. Hopefully one of the guys here who follow that sort of thing can give is a breakdown on that...

[Mr. Body]

If Dallas just wants to clear salary and not get a current player, then other teams with space are more likely candidates -- Indiana or Utah, for example, who can give them a later pick or two.

[mo7888]

Certainly some teams have to worry. But Dallas doesn't. They only have one big long-term contract. The penalties Ex was highlighting were for repeat offenders. They wouldn't even need to stretch anyone, though that'd be an option to stay under next year

Does maxing out Kyrie change that formula for them?

[Ariel]

Mikal Bridges is showing up in a lot of rumors. Not sure what's actually from the Nets. I don't think he's on the market at all.
They'd be crazy to move him. I'd love him on the Spurs, unfortunately I don't think the timelines match.

[Seventyniner]

Mikal Bridges is showing up in a lot of rumors. Not sure what's actually from the Nets. I don't think he's on the market at all.

I thought I heard that the Nets were absolutely in love with Mikal and were looking to build around him. But smokescreens happen.

[exstatic]

Certainly some teams have to worry. But Dallas doesn't. They only have one big long-term contract. The penalties Ex was highlighting were for repeat offenders. They wouldn't even need to stretch anyone, though that'd be an option to stay under next year

They'd have to walk away from Kyrie.

[Mr. Body]

I thought I heard that the Nets were absolutely in love with Mikal and were looking to build around him. But smokescreens happen.

That's my feeling, too. I'm in the BKN market. I think they love what they see and there's potential for a star there.

[Mr. Body]

That's my feeling, too. I'm in the BKN market. I think they love what they see and there's potential for a star there.

Bridges is also not a dick, which is a major improvement over the last few years.

[Chinook]

They'd have to walk away from Kyrie.

They aren't in a position where they need to ditch expiring contracts to keep Kyrie. They can be over the apron one year and then slip under or be under for a couple of years and slip over. Both Hardaway Bertans expire after this year. Dallas had plenty of ways to manage their space without paying to dump one of them.

[Chinook]

To clarify, the second apron starts in 2024/25, not this summer. So that freezing penalty wouldn't kick in until 2025/26. Dallas as a high bill this year but basically no one signed that far out. They can dodge the second apron pretty easily and don't need to be forced into a bad trade.

GS or LAC might.

[spurraider21]

They aren't in a position where they need to ditch expiring contracts to keep Kyrie. They can be over the apron one year and then slip under or be under for a couple of years and slip over. Both Hardaway Bertans expire after this year. Dallas had plenty of ways to manage their space without paying to dump one of them.
hardaway is under contract for 2 more seasons, fyi

[exstatic]

They aren't in a position where they need to ditch expiring contracts to keep Kyrie. They can be over the apron one year and then slip under or be under for a couple of years and slip over. Both Hardaway Bertans expire after this year. Dallas had plenty of ways to manage their space without paying to dump one of them.

Hardaway goes thru 2024-2025 and Bertans has $5M guaranteed that second season.

I'm just curious how you think they're going "slip under" the tax in 2024. They will be over the second apron next summer, well over if they sign Irving. They can't attach cash to ANY trades, starting that summer. They can't make a trade that is even one dollar more for the incoming player. They can't aggregate players in a trade. They can't trade their FRP 7 years out (2031), even if it's clear, and the clock starts on it dropping to the end of the 2031 first round if they are in the second apron even ONE year out of the next three. If they are over the next summer, that 2031 pick automatically drops to the end of the first round no matter their record because the 2 in 4 years penalty is met, and their 2032 pick is now on the clock.

The rules are different next summer. This is their last get out of jail free summer period where the old rules apply.

[Chinook]

hardaway is under contract for 2 more seasons, fyi

"This year" means 2024/25 in the context of that post. That's the first year the second apron comes into effect.

[offset formation]

its a pretty big ask for dallas to both unload a bad contract AND get a good rotation player in exchange for the #10 pick

plus, if they get a good player back in exchange for, say, bertans' contract, then they're not really saving much, if at all, against the cap anyway. so they'd need a team to take on multiple bad deals AND give a good player in return for the #10 pick

i dont think they'll find their perfect deal. id eat the bertans deal and give them the hornets pick for #10 if our target is on the board though


I do this all day long and twice on Sundays if my man Bilal is still on the board. Getting a specialty defender (forgetting what he promises offensively of course) like him to shore up our perimeter defense is precisely what's needed now that we'll have Wembanyama helping our interior defense. Not to mention they're already familiar with one another's game.

[JPB]

Dallas has certainly different ways to get rid of Bertans and Hardaway with different teams till next season's end (and over for Hardaway) than panicking and selling off their #10 pick. They don't necessarily have to do it now.

[Chinook]

Hardaway goes thru 2024-2025 and Bertans has $5M guaranteed that second seasons.

I'm just curious how you think they're going "slip under" the tax in 2024. They will be over the second apron next summer, well over if they sign Irving. They can't attach cash to ANY trades, starting that summer. They can't make a trade that is even one dollar more for the incoming player. They can't aggregate players in a trade. They can't trade their FRP 7 years out (2031), even if it's clear, and the clock starts on it dropping to the end of the 2031 first round if they are in the second apron even ONE year out of the next three. If they are over the next summer, that 2031 pick automatically drops to the end of the first round no matter their record because the 2 in 4 years penalty is met, and their 2032 pick is now on the clock.

The rules are different next summer. This is their last get out of jail free summer period where the old rules apply.

The clock starts in 2024/25 and the penalties ramp up in 2025/26. So they can be over in 24 and slip under in 25.

[exstatic]

The clock starts in 2024/25 and the penalties ramp up in 2025/26. So they can be over in 24 and slip under in 25.

How? There are dire trade restriction in the new rules. You act like it will be business as usual in July 2024, and I assure it will not be.

[Chinook]

How? There are dire trade restriction in the new rules. You act like it will be business as usual in July 2024, and I assure it will not be.

Bertans and Hardaway expire in the summer of 25. They don't need to trade them. But they're still allowed to trade them for space in 2024 if they want. The rules didn't stop that.

[Dverde]

According to my Mavs friends, Luka and Hardaway got into some shouting fights and the fan base wants Hardaway gone before the season starts. They are all terrified Luka will ask for a trade if they have another bad season. Hardaway’s father said this last season about Luka…

"They're missing a leader out there. Luka is not a leader, Kyrie is not a leader. Jalen Brunson was a leader," Hardaway said. "A leader shows by example, by playing defense. When he says something, he does it also, and that's what a leader is. And like I said, those two guys are not leaders. They're complementary, dominant great basketball players. Great scorers."

[JPB]

According to my Mavs friends, Luka and Hardaway got into some shouting fights and the fan base wants Hardaway gone before the season starts. They are all terrified Luka will ask for a trade if they have another bad season. Hardaway’s father said this last season about Luka…

"They're missing a leader out there. Luka is not a leader, Kyrie is not a leader. Jalen Brunson was a leader," Hardaway said. "A leader shows by example, by playing defense. When he says something, he does it also, and that's what a leader is. And like I said, those two guys are not leaders. They're complementary, dominant great basketball players. Great scorers."

I don't see how they could win, or even make the finals next year. Small sample size but their record with Luka and FE playing (5-11) is not good and the rest of their roster is overall not good either. Luka is gone after next year if you ask me.

[offset formation]

I don't see how they could win, or even make the finals next year. Small sample size but their record with Luka and FE playing (5-11) is not good and the rest of their roster is overall not good either. Luka is gone after next year if you ask me.

So long as it's not to either LA team, IDGAF.

[Big Empty]

If i was portland id draft Scoot or Miller, trade Lillard to the Mavs for the 10th pick and a possible other FRP, Dallas would need to unload Kyrie. I dont know if this is possible but makes the most sense for both teams. Lillards 50 million a year contract though lol

[duncan2150]

i don't see a lot of path to move into the lottery, we have picks and cap space, i don't see teams in need of picks or who want to unload contracts giving up a pick

Utah could be the first team interested in picks with Ainge and their 16 th, where i think it's start to be really possible to move up is at 21,22 with the Brooklyn pick and after.

The warriors could aslo be open to trade their pick at 19

[DAF86]

After getting Wemby, in terms of fit, the only player worth trading up for in this draft is Scoot. It's not impossible but it might be too expensive.

[The Truth #6]

According to my Mavs friends, Luka and Hardaway got into some shouting fights and the fan base wants Hardaway gone before the season starts. They are all terrified Luka will ask for a trade if they have another bad season. Hardaway’s father said this last season about Luka…

"They're missing a leader out there. Luka is not a leader, Kyrie is not a leader. Jalen Brunson was a leader," Hardaway said. "A leader shows by example, by playing defense. When he says something, he does it also, and that's what a leader is. And like I said, those two guys are not leaders. They're complementary, dominant great basketball players. Great scorers."


Hardaway’s dad sounds convincing to me. With Luka, all of Cuban’s bad choices may be hiding the fact that Luka is not a great leader and deserves some of the blame for Dallas always floundering.

[D-Robinson 50 fan]

I would love if we could some how get Cason Wallace also. Honestly though, I think we shouldn’t do anything too crazy. Scout some solid draft prospects that will be low in the first or early second and go from there.

[Ariel]

Bertans and Hardaway expire in the summer of 25. They don't need to trade them. But they're still allowed to trade them for space in 2024 if they want. The rules didn't stop that.
They can't afford to wait 2 years to do something or they lose Luka. I'd bet good money they pull a few moves by draft night or shortly after.

[Ariel]

I thought I heard that the Nets were absolutely in love with Mikal and were looking to build around him. But smokescreens happen.
It's not a smokescreen. He's been great, he's young, high character, smart, has incredible availability, one of the best defenders in the NBA, very good shooter, 2 way wing, on a cheap contract... if they trade him they deserve to go down in flames, like Phoenix did.

[Chinook]

They can't afford to wait 2 years to do something or they lose Luka. I'd bet good money they pull a few moves by draft night or shortly after.

I agree. That's a different conversation than the one that quote is from though.

[scott]

We get Wemby and now everyone is getting greedy AF.

I love it.

[Rubberducky]

From what I’ve seen on the other team forums:

8 Wizards: Cam Whitmore is the pipe dream (grew up a wiz fan) but he’s unlikely to drop. Otherwise want a guard. They seem VERY split on Wallace vs Black. They are out on other players in this range.

9 Jazz: Also prioritizing a PG. They are also very split on Wallace vs Black. Slight favor on Wallace from what I’ve seen. They are in on Gradey Dick though so that they can field a troll name lineup of Gay/Dick/Sexton. There’s also a heavy debate on Lauri/9/16 to Portland for 3 if Scoot drops.

10 Mavericks: Trade it.

Count me in the camp for trading Keldon and a future first for #10 and draft a PG. I personally prefer Wallace over Black. If neither player is available at 10, stand pat at the lottery and let the season play out with the current team.

[poopbox]

Love this exercise, but I'll throw in a wrinkle.

Once we get a feeling of what the cost would be to move up to the range where we could take Black (for example), I'd ask what do you think the cost would be to get Haliburton from Indiana or Ivey from Detroit. Both of these guys may be off limits, but everyone has their price.

If we could get Haliburton or Ivey for our 1 next year + Atlanta's 2025 + the CHI pick + the CHA pick... would you do it? Certainly both of those would be preferable to Black or Wallace?

I'd give up the motherload for Haliburton but he is the pacers future franchise player so completely off limits. That would be like them calling us about the number 1 pick.

[rascal]

Target Utah with the 16th pick. Jalen Hood-Shifino will be just as good as Black and or Wallace and will cost less in a trade.

Will be great with a lob threat like Wemby.

Also an excellent mid range shooter off the dribble.

[Dejounte]

Rayan Rupert will be the target if there is a trade up tbh

Freak athlete with elite measurements. Can pick up point guards full court. French. Friends with Wemby already.

[Mr. Body]

How does Keldon's contract work, hypothetically? If he's traded before or during the draft, it counts at the current, smaller number? But if he's traded after the draft, it's at the new, extension number?

[Mr. Body]

Rayan Rupert will be the target if there is a trade up tbh

Freak athlete with elite measurements. Can pick up point guards full court. French. Friends with Wemby already.

Toolsy French guards who can't shoot seem like an archetype you can get every other draft.

[exstatic]

How does Keldon's contract work, hypothetically? If he's traded before or during the draft, it counts at the current, smaller number? But if he's traded after the draft, it's at the new, extension number?

It’s really fucking complicated to trade him before the new league year starts in July.

[Spursfanfromafar]

It's not a smokescreen. He's been great, he's young, high character, smart, has incredible availability, one of the best defenders in the NBA, very good shooter, 2 way wing, on a cheap contract... if they trade him they deserve to go down in flames, like Phoenix did.

Mikal Bridges is the new Jimmy Butler in the making. An incredibly consistent and hard working player who will elevate your team. Neigh impossible to get him on the Spurs but he would be a great great fit.

[rascal]

Rayan Rupert will be the target if there is a trade up tbh

Freak athlete with elite measurements. Can pick up point guards full court. French. Friends with Wemby already.

He shoots poorly 19% off the dribble which pgs need to do.

[Mr. Body]

It’s really fucking complicated to trade him before the new league year starts in July.

Makes sense. So, hypothetically, the Spurs could just absorb a Bertans contract outright on draft day because they're way under the cap?

[rascal]

Mikal Bridges is the new Jimmy Butler in the making. An incredibly consistent and hard working player who will elevate your team. Neigh impossible to get him on the Spurs but he would be a great great fit.

I wanted the Spurs to trade up and get Bridges on his draft night. It didn't take much to get him on draft night.

[Dejounte]

He shoots poorly 19% off the dribble which pgs need to do.

Small sample size and was a 5th option on offense due to his youth.

can people please do their research first before they respond to me instead of opening up one page of stats and thinking they know it all

[rascal]

Small sample size and was a 5th option on offense due to his youth.

can people please do their research first before they respond to me instead of opening up one page of stats and thinking they know it all

I've watched his tape and it's generally considered he isn't a strong shooter overall and I can see from his tape he isn't as good of a mid range sooter compared to Jalen Hood-Shifino who would be my target outside of Scoot( who would be unlikely to get).

[mo7888]

Rupert has very good form on his shot and his work ethic is reportedly very good. Those things give optimism that he will be able to improve in that area.

[mo7888]

Double post

[Mr. Body]

**cough cough**Killian Hayes**cough cough**

[mo7888]

**cough cough**Killian Hayes**cough cough**

I don't see the similarities...then again, I don't see Rupert as a PG either....more of a defensive stopper with secondary playmaking skills.... However, if teams do see him as being able to transition into a full-time PG then he'll rise up the board over this next month.

[Mr. Body]

I don't see the similarities...then again, I don't see Rupert as a PG either....more of a defensive stopper with secondary playmaking skills.... However, if teams do see him as being able to transition into a full-time PG then he'll rise up the board over this next month.

So he doesn't even have what made Killian Hayes a good prospect?

[mo7888]

So he doesn't even have what made Killian Hayes a good prospect?

He's just a different archetype than Hayes...

[rankingtear]

I wanted the Spurs to trade up and get Bridges on his draft night. It didn't take much to get him on draft night.

To be fair the 2021 unprotected MIA pick was the best draft asset at that time.

[bluebellmaniac]

Small sample size and was a 5th option on offense due to his youth.

can people please do their research first before they respond to me instead of opening up one page of stats and thinking they know it all

BOOM!!!

[DPG21920]

I really wonder if TOR would give SA 13 for their top 6 protected pick back? Seems like a solid move. TOR is in flux and they can lock in the cost of Jakob to pick 13 vs risk it be pick 7-12 and they are definitely in a bit of flux and having your pick back in the future to use/trade may be enough to get it done?

[Mr. Body]

I really wonder if TOR would give SA 13 for their top 6 protected pick back? Seems like a solid move. TOR is in flux and they can lock in the cost of Jakob to pick 13 vs risk it be pick 7-12 and they are definitely in a bit of flux and having your pick back in the future to use/trade may be enough to get it done?

Interesting. Who would you take?

[spurraider21]

at that range i'd like Bufkin

[CorrectCrusader]

https://twitter.com/KellyIko/status/1658908966674472970

https://twitter.com/JoshuaBRobbins/status/1658897946451034112

Could be really interesting to move up and grab a PG, those are the main targets with Schifino imo

btw i think it will be really expensive to move up in the top 10-15

Anthony Black would be awesome.

[Mr. Body]

Me, too. I'd 100% grab Bufkin now instead of leaving the pick for next year. Spurs likely already have 2 FRPS next year.

Really want a PG type with rangy length and good defense.

[DPG21920]

Interesting. Who would you take?

Bilal if he’s there. Black. Cason? Walker? Something like that.

[DPG21920]

at that range i'd like Bufkin

Another good one for sure. Lots of options

[DPG21920]

Trade TOR pick back for pick 13. Trade pick 13 + CHA pick to move up for Black or Whitmore if he falls some?

[Mr. Body]

Trade TOR pick back for pick 13. Trade pick 13 + CHA pick to move up for Black or Whitmore if he falls some?

I'm all for them being aggressive to land one of those guys. I like the idea of getting a good PG type on board to grow with Wemby right away and not all drafts have good prospects, especially defensive ones. With a good defensive guard this team could be nasty. And then those CHA and TOR picks are sort of gravy at the moment.

[BatManu20]

1659550757161451522

[mo7888]

Trade TOR pick back for pick 13. Trade pick 13 + CHA pick to move up for Black or Whitmore if he falls some?

Or

Trade Toronto back for #13 then trade 13 + Charlotte + keldon for #3 and draft Scoot... lol

[spurraider21]

if we trade around pick 10 or so, i'd like black as the target. if we move into the mid teens, bufkin. if he slips slightly past projections into the 20's, id want to move up from 33 and go after dereck lively

[Mr. Body]

if we trade around pick 10 or so, i'd like black as the target. if we move into the mid teens, bufkin. if he slips slightly past projections into the 20's, id want to move up from 33 and go after dereck lively

I feel like Black won't go past Washington or Utah at 8 and 9. And it seems like Lively will rise. Helps him that there aren't a lot of centers in this draft.

[spurraider21]

I feel like Black won't go past Washington or Utah at 8 and 9. And it seems like Lively will rise. Helps him that there aren't a lot of centers in this draft.
yeah. lively wasnt very productive but there are a lot of good traits there. theres even the faint scent of a jumper which would be massive

[Ariel]

I feel like Black won't go past Washington or Utah at 8 and 9. And it seems like Lively will rise. Helps him that there aren't a lot of centers in this draft.
The problem with centers is that, unless you're absolutely elite, you can get comparable production for much cheaper. Case in point: DeAndre Ayton vs Jock Landale. I feel this may end up the case with Duren (gets overpaid on potential, never goes past role player). Which is why you shouldn't invest heavily on a non star center.

[exstatic]

Trade TOR pick back for pick 13. Trade pick 13 + CHA pick to move up for Black or Whitmore if he falls some?
Toronto not pick could be as high as 7. Should be nothing else needed to get into the top 10

[thiste]

To me Cason Wallace is the target. Mini Kawhi.

[T Park]

1659550757161451522

Lmfao Dusty gmafb

[rascal]

To be fair the 2021 unprotected MIA pick was the best draft asset at that time.

Spurs could have offered a similar unprotected pick. They needed to make a play at getting Bridges on draft night. I saw his potential.

[rascal]

There are a few solid PG options in this draft class and I expect the Spurs to be actively looking to add one of them.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Not me

I'm not interested in just adding Wemby to a bad team and calling it quits there.

This reads like you positioning yourself against what the team is stated to want to do so you can continue to bitch nonstop.

[rascal]

This reads like you positioning yourself against what the team is stated to want to do so you can continue to bitch nonstop.

It reads like what I don't want to happen and nothing more than that.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

It reads like what I don't want to happen and nothing more than that.

Lowe and others have stated that Wright and co have indicated that they want to bring in Wemby and see what they have first then adjust.

It's what is going to happen most likely.

But hey if you want to pretend anything less than KJ's awesome contract and several of those future firsts is going to get a blue chip prospect which these top 5 teams already have in hand then have fun.

Unfortunately, the UFA is shit for point guards. There is a scenario where clubs will be looking to shed salary given the new CBA. We could get a guard through there. Outside of that they are going to see how Johnson, Vassell, Sochan, Collins, Branham, Jones, Mamu, and Graham develop.

[rankingtear]

Spurs could have offered a similar unprotected pick. They needed to make a play at getting Bridges on draft night. I saw his potential.

MIA unprotected would still be more valuable at that time.

[Ariel]

Rayan Rupert will be the target if there is a trade up tbh

Freak athlete with elite measurements. Can pick up point guards full court. French. Friends with Wemby already.
Can't say I'm super excited, but I wouldn't complain if we pick him up in the 20s. If he learns to shoot (big if) he could be special.

[rascal]

Lowe and others have stated that Wright and co have indicated that they want to bring in Wemby and see what they have first then adjust.

It's what is going to happen most likely.

But hey if you want to pretend anything less than KJ's awesome contract and several of those future firsts is going to get a blue chip prospect which these top 5 teams already have in hand then have fun.

Unfortunately, the UFA is shit for point guards. There is a scenario where clubs will be looking to shed salary given the new CBA. We could get a guard through there. Outside of that they are going to see how Johnson, Vassell, Sochan, Collins, Branham, Jones, Mamu, and Graham develop.

It may turn out that way but I'm sure they will explore adding a PG so it's not set in stone they won't add anyone else and just see what they have with the current roster.

That's why they are bringing some pg's in for workouts.

[Ditty]

On the No Dunks Podcast, a trade proposal for the #5 pick for Keldon Johnson and Toronto’s pick. Detroit really doesn’t want to keep drafting young players and need wing help. Plus get a possible lottery pick next year.

[Mr. Body]

I think Detroit revolts if that's all they get. From what I understand, trading Keldon on draft day is next to impossible.

[Mr. Body]

I just noticed that Brooklyn has no picks at all next year. I'm sure they want to move up with their two this year, but wonder if they'd swap one for the Charlotte. They also don't have any in 2026, putting Chicago's potentially in play.

[Thomas82]

To me Cason Wallace is the target. Mini Kawhi.

He would be my choice for point guard. I would also be happy with Nick Smith or Anthony Black.

[Payote75]

I believe our core is almost in place and I don't get wanting to trade a 23 yr old still ascending Keldon he should be part of this core and Devon should be untouchable core is there now it's about the point guard and supporting pieces.

I am more team trade the unknown (picks) for the known asset or start dumping some vets or players not part of the future for picks or someone in an unhappy situation/salary dump of use.

Definitely feel Keldon Devon and Sochan should be here to stay with Wemby.

[Frenchfred]

I just noticed that Brooklyn has no picks at all next year. I'm sure they want to move up with their two this year, but wonder if they'd swap one for the Charlotte. They also don't have any in 2026, putting Chicago's potentially in play.

I read that the Spurs could get Ben Simmons for a pick + McDermott. Is that something to consider?

[Ignazzz]

I read that the Spurs could get Ben Simmons for a pick + McDermott. Is that something to consider?
In my opiniom Yes

[Dverde]

You don’t want Ben Simmons anywhere near this team with Wemby on it.

[Mr. Body]

I read that the Spurs could get Ben Simmons for a pick + McDermott. Is that something to consider?

Simmons' contract is hideous and the belief is strong that he will not play again, or much. If he actually tries to play, that's one thing, but he never cared much for basketball, even at LSU, and torpedoed two franchises already. I wouldn't consider this at all.

[Frenchfred]

Simmons' contract is hideous and the belief is strong that he will not play again, or much. If he actually tries to play, that's one thing, but he never cared much for basketball, even at LSU, and torpedoed two franchises already. I wouldn't consider this at all.

I agree, the biggest problem is his contract otherwise it would be worth the risk.

[Mr. Body]

I agree, the biggest problem is his contract otherwise it would be worth the risk.

Oh, no, you mistake me: he's an awful personality. I wouldn't let someone who is lazy and disinterested anywhere around a young, impressionable team.