View Full Version : Wembabyama is a center
DAF86
07-07-2023, 10:24 PM
Repeat after me, motherfuckers: WEMBANYAMA IS A CENTER.
I didn't really mind dumbfucks here saying Wemby would play in the perimeter but I worry Spurs management thinks the same. Hopefully tonight's game is just the Spurs fucking around and not a glimpse of how they're planning to use Wemby all season.
He's a 7'5" guy. It doesn't matter how good he handles the ball, he shouldn't be trying to cross people over on the 3 pt line while dribbling through 6 arms. He's gonna get stripped a whole lot of fucking times because of physics alone.
Screen setter on pick and rolls and pick and pops, post ups, dump passes, putbacks. These are Wemby's most efficient plays. Play to his strengths, don't make his rookie season harder than it needs to be, tbh.
ducks
07-07-2023, 10:26 PM
You tell pop that and tell them to earn his paycheck or get his ass fired
Atl Spur
07-07-2023, 10:27 PM
He a pf…….. they’ll teach him how to take advantage of his skill set. RELAX
Cry Havoc
07-07-2023, 10:28 PM
Repeat after me, motherfuckers: WEMBENYAMA IS A CENTER.
I didn't really mind dumbfucks here saying Wemby would play in the perimeter but I worry Spurs management thinks the same. Hopefully tonight's game is just the Spurs fucking around and not a glimpse of how they're planning to use Wemby all season.
He's a 7'5" guy. It doesn't matter how good he handles the ball, he shouldn't be trying to cross people over on the 3 pt line while dribbling through 6 arms. He's gonna get stripped a whole lot of fucking times because of physics alone.
Screen setter on pick and rolls and pick and pops, post ups, dump passes, putbacks. These are Wemby's most efficient plays. Play to his strengths, don't make his rookie season harder than it needs to be, tbh.
The flipside to this is that if teams are throwing 2.5+ defenders at him anytime he dribbles to the FT line extended, it's going to open up chasms in their defense.
DAF86
07-07-2023, 10:30 PM
He a pf…….. they’ll teach him how to take advantage of his skill set. RELAX
No, he is not. He never anything other than C in his life. He needs to be at the center of everything on offense. The guy closer to the rim most of the times.
baseline bum
07-07-2023, 10:30 PM
Repeat after me, motherfuckers: WEMBENYAMA IS A CENTER.
I didn't really mind dumbfucks here saying Wemby would play in the perimeter but I worry Spurs management thinks the same. Hopefully tonight's game is just the Spurs fucking around and not a glimpse of how they're planning to use Wemby all season.
He's a 7'5" guy. It doesn't matter how good he handles the ball, he shouldn't be trying to cross people over on the 3 pt line while dribbling through 6 arms. He's gonna get stripped a whole lot of fucking times because of physics alone.
Screen setter on pick and rolls and pick and pops, post ups, dump passes, putbacks. These are Wemby's most efficient plays. Play to his strengths, don't make his rookie season harder than it needs to be, tbh.
Tbh his screens looked weak as fuck tonight. Definitely gotta hit the weight room before that can be a big part of his game.
DAF86
07-07-2023, 10:32 PM
Tbh his screens looked weak as fuck tonight. Definitely gotta hit the weight room before that can be a big part of his game.
The most efficient play of his career is the pick and roll by far.
Obstructed_View
07-07-2023, 10:35 PM
Tbh his screens looked weak as fuck tonight. Definitely gotta hit the weight room before that can be a big part of his game.
Tiago Splitter was as good a screener as the Spurs ever had. He didn't do it with imposing strength.
scott
07-07-2023, 10:36 PM
If he can just continue to collapse the defense like he was doing tonight, he can turn guys like Champ and Bran into 20 ppg scorers in the NBA and average 7+ apg himself.
TekXX
07-07-2023, 10:42 PM
If you're 7'5 why would you want to take a bunch of jumpers, get your arse closer to the basket and eat.
rascal
07-07-2023, 10:43 PM
His size is best used closer to the basket. He shouldn't be jacking up many 3 point shots or dribbling through traffic.
The Spurs need to add real perimeter shooters to the roster.
They have done nothing to set Wemby up with the right teammates, a real PG who can shoot, for a successful rookie year.
slick'81
07-07-2023, 10:45 PM
He definitely falls down alot
DAF86
07-07-2023, 10:46 PM
7'5" guy that shoots 27% from 3 taking a bunch of 3's and off the dribble fade away jumpers. What a sound strategy. :lol
He's gonna be great, though. Just too gifted tecnichally and physically.
Dejounte
07-07-2023, 10:47 PM
PF/C that needs the ball more on the high post, sort of like how we used LMA
MultiTroll
07-07-2023, 10:49 PM
Calm down it was Game 1.
For all we know he was told not to mix it up with Zaza type phucks in the paint.
As to the dribble strip, let him experiment.
FFS Timmy Dunks got beat by Greg Ostertag in Game 1 SL.
Atl Spur
07-07-2023, 10:49 PM
No, he is not. He never anything other than C in his life. He needs to be at the center of everything on offense. The guy closer to the rim most of the times.
In his case height won’t determine his position; his mindset/play of an oversized, too slow / un coordinated sf thus making him a more ideal pf in todays game. He’s settling right now and not properly moving to correct spots. He’ll get better.
He a pf…….. they’ll teach him how to take advantage of his skill set. RELAX
Atl Spur
07-07-2023, 10:55 PM
PF/C that needs the ball more on the high post, sort of like how we used LMA
Him and Zollins in the high low will be a thing of beauty…… they may also throw a little hybrid triangle in there:)
paperboy77
07-07-2023, 10:56 PM
Honestly he did struggle but there are many reasons for that. First game, first game hype, everyone's gunning for him, shitty coaching, Summer League caliber teammates, clearly unfamiliar with the system (don't blame him) and classic overhyped #1 vs previously shit on #2. All in all it was great what i saw. I'm typically a political-Pop hater but a huge coach-Pop fan so I have great faith that he will go thru the tape of this SL and put Wemby in situations he can succeed on. This dude is a unicorn for sure but he needs to get some experience under his belt... more than anything. This is why I wish we took a risk and chased a big free agent star like Dame to keep the focus off of him while allowing him to gain confidece AND gain the respect of the referees which is humongous in the NBA. Pair them up with a pretty good young roster and I think they can make some serious noise. Wemby sucked in the scoring and conditioning department but he was a difference maker on D. Just like mouthbreather-Green predicted.
The future looks very promising for our beloved Spurs.
BatManu20
07-07-2023, 11:02 PM
He definitely falls down alot
The soft frenchie in him tbh. Get used to it. That’ll prob be part of his game throughout his entire career unfortunately, no matter how much muscle he gains. Much like Tony and even Rudy Gobert.
Crazymaddopeyo
07-07-2023, 11:14 PM
You tell pop that and tell them to earn his paycheck or get his ass fired
Not Pop’s change to make tbh. Wemby does not want to play that way and you risk getting an unhappy player if you make that change
offset formation
07-07-2023, 11:25 PM
The word is definitely out on him tho and ppl will defend him when he's out on the perimeter and in the post. Just as Draymond talked about. They're getting up into him and making him take off balance shots. He's going to have to learn to adjust to that and he will. Whether it's learning to dribble backwards and then take the hit and spin off of it or get squared up before you take the bump so you're going up strong. They took his legs out from underneath him all night.
BackHome
07-07-2023, 11:31 PM
Tbh his screens looked weak as fuck tonight. Definitely gotta hit the weight room before that can be a big part of his game.
I am actually kind of scared of him trying to set hard picks I keep thinking something bad going to happen to those knees.
EricB
07-07-2023, 11:35 PM
His size is best used closer to the basket. He shouldn't be jacking up many 3 point shots or dribbling through traffic.
The Spurs need to add real perimeter shooters to the roster.
They have done nothing to set Wemby up with the right teammates, a real PG who can shoot, for a successful rookie year.
bullock and Osman are both 39% three point shooters
yeah they haven’t added anyone.
fucktard
EricB
07-07-2023, 11:37 PM
Lmfao @ people saying he has to change the way he plays after one scrimmage
the guy showed tonight unreal passing and touch and permitted play and you knuckle dragging bozos want him to avoid it.
shut up.
Vince Carter's ankle
07-07-2023, 11:41 PM
https://www.si.com/.image/c_limit%2Ccs_srgb%2Cq_auto:good%2Cw_581/MTk3MjkwNjYzODQ1MzA4NDEx/vw-playtypes.webp
https://www.si.com/nba/draft/newsfeed/the-map-of-victor-wembanyama-shooting-versatility
HankChinaski
07-07-2023, 11:43 PM
He is going to have plenty of time to adjust to the size and speed of the NBA.
Also he'll realize he needs to make adjustments in how he plays the game.
I wish I could have seen the entire game but he is going to be a huge positive moving forward.
DAF86
07-07-2023, 11:45 PM
Lmfao @ people saying he has to change the way he plays after one scrimmage
the guy showed tonight unreal passing and touch and permitted play and you knuckle dragging bozos want him to avoid it.
shut up.
I'm saying completely the oppposite; just keep playing to your strenghts. :lol
DAF86
07-07-2023, 11:46 PM
https://www.si.com/.image/c_limit%2Ccs_srgb%2Cq_auto:good%2Cw_581/MTk3MjkwNjYzODQ1MzA4NDEx/vw-playtypes.webp
https://www.si.com/nba/draft/newsfeed/the-map-of-victor-wembanyama-shooting-versatility
Gracias.
tmtcsc
07-07-2023, 11:50 PM
He’ll be fine. It was one summer league game.
DAF86
07-07-2023, 11:56 PM
He’ll be fine. It was one summer league game.
Yeah, when they inevitably start playing to his strengths.
rascal
07-07-2023, 11:56 PM
He didn't get enough shots inside.
Something isn't right when your 7'5" player doesn't have a single dunk in the game.
rascal
07-08-2023, 12:01 AM
bullock and Osman are both 39% three point shooters
yeah they haven’t added anyone.
fucktard
Bullock and Osman aren't even going to be in the regular rotation. How many shots you think these guys are going to take on average.
rascal
07-08-2023, 12:02 AM
He’ll be fine. It was one summer league game.
I expect better results in game two. The Spurs are going to get him more shots near the basket.
Fireball
07-08-2023, 03:04 AM
He definitely falls down alot
pretty sure that is intentional to keep the pressure from his knees and ankles ...
EricB
07-08-2023, 03:07 AM
He didn't get enough shots inside.
Something isn't right when your 7'5" player doesn't have a single dunk in the game.
lol fucking christ
polandprzem
07-08-2023, 03:08 AM
Tiago Splitter was as good a screener as the Spurs ever had. He didn't do it with imposing strength.
Tiago had some frame on him. That helps too
EricB
07-08-2023, 03:09 AM
Bullock and Osman aren't even going to be in the regular rotation. How many shots you think these guys are going to take on average.
Osman will, Bullock in and out.
No idea we shall see.
the spacing has improved this summer dispute your stupidity.
BillMc
07-08-2023, 03:39 AM
Looks a lot like a taller, far better defensive, Kevin Durant to me. Sure his shots didn't fall, but they will. His talent is obvious.
polandprzem
07-08-2023, 04:18 AM
Yea looks like he has some good inside presents on D. Mak Eaton like :lol
His areas on the floor gonna be seen and develop in few years. You can't tell by the first game. Squad changes game changes how teams gonna play against him etc.
But him being there at the rim is a value
Obstructed_View
07-08-2023, 05:05 AM
Tiago had some frame on him. That helps too
For sure, but I would submit that good technique, good timing, and better ball handlers are most important. The dribbler is as important as the screener.
Obstructed_View
07-08-2023, 05:06 AM
pretty sure that is intentional to keep the pressure from his knees and ankles ...
Tony Parker made a long, healthy career doing that.
jesterbobman
07-08-2023, 05:32 AM
Judging based on a single summer league is silly. But the interest of Wemby isn't just what he is, but what he can become.
The Spurs should be looking for how they can help him evolve to be a fluid defender who smoothes out his weaknesses. The rim protection is really good, that'll be the primary way he adds value. He needs to build up his weaknesses of switching / communicating on the switch (also, clearly a thing of getting to know teammates) so that he can play 4 with another big and cover out on the perimeter if he gets spaced out. That'll come, but to be better he has to learn, practice in games, and fail. That's fine.
He'll add strength to punish the switches offensively, and judge when he can and can't dribble on the perimeter, and what will make sense for him to play as in the NBA. Perfectly fine for him not to be a finished product.
But, some of the dribbling and passing flashes were nuts, as were bits of the D.
polandprzem
07-08-2023, 05:37 AM
For sure, but I would submit that good technique, good timing, and better ball handlers are most important. The dribbler is as important as the screener.
yup screening it's still a skill that's why you cant tell now how good Wemby might be.
Not only we had Splitter but nesterovich and Oberto as well. All in all screens are vital point in NBA.
Raven
07-08-2023, 05:41 AM
Tbh his screens looked weak as fuck tonight. Definitely gotta hit the weight room before that can be a big part of his game.
yeah having him as a screener seems like a quick way to get him on the injury report
polandprzem
07-08-2023, 05:46 AM
Tony Parker made a long, healthy career doing that.
tp could fall on his ass and bring the legs up and wemby cant do that.
Also what i saw is not looking much controlled and knees are vague pretty badly. He runs like he shit his pants- pretty bad gate and overall low strength and athleticism. For 19y old he is a bit behind.
JamStone
07-08-2023, 07:15 AM
Even if he’s a center longterm, no reason to play him in the post or closer to the rim on offense too much and expose him to more hard fouls and bruising and banging with the physique he has now. Let him get stronger, build up some muscle, get more familiar with the physicality of NBA athletes, and then slowly allow him to find his way as a center if that’s what he’s destined to be.
Immediate production versus longterm durability. Similar to why Ginobili came off the bench for the Spurs all those years. Did he have the talent to start and play 36 minutes a game? Sure. But his NBA career would probably be several seasons shorter, probably experience more injuries. Would you rather Wembanyama be more productive immediately for an injury riddled 13-14 year NBA career at which point his body starts breaking down or have him struggle a little bit his first couple seasons but play 18 years of relatively healthy and durable NBA basketball?
Dejounte
07-08-2023, 07:23 AM
Even if he’s a center longterm, no reason to play him in the post or closer to the rim on offense too much and expose him to more hard fouls and bruising and banging with the physique he has now. Let him get stronger, build up some muscle, get more familiar with the physicality of NBA athletes, and then slowly allow him to find his way as a center if that’s what he’s destined to be.
Immediate production versus longterm durability. Similar to why Ginobili came off the bench for the Spurs all those years. Did he have the talent to start and play 36 minutes a game? Sure. But his NBA career would probably be several seasons shorter. Would you rather Wembanyama be more productive immediately for an injury riddled 13-14 NBA career at which point his body starts breaking down or have him struggle a little bit his first couple seasons but play 18 years of relatively healthy and durable NBA basketball?
Very true
When I say he’s a pf/c, it’s not really to say that he should play more inside and do what traditional bigs do. It’s that what i see happening (at least this season) is for Victor to be playing sometimes with one true big and sometimes none, like what happened last night when he was out there with Branham, Wesley, Sidy, and Julian.
his natural playstyle is obviously to utilize his handling skills on the perimeter some, but what is a deadly part of his game is to just pull up in general. Crossover and pullup is what he needs to learn right now. The guy that does that best on the current roster is Vassell.
He’ll get his easy shots inside but that will never be a major part of his game. He will never be a roll man either because that would tire him out + he’s not consistently quick enough to get to the basket without someone stepping right in front of him.
this is what I was saying in the game thread. People need to realize the whole offensive scheme is going to change a fuck ton. It’s back to 90s slow down basketball whenever Wemby is on the court.
RC_Drunkford
07-08-2023, 07:55 AM
Repeat after me, motherfuckers: WEMBANYAMA IS A CENTER.
I didn't really mind dumbfucks here saying Wemby would play in the perimeter but I worry Spurs management thinks the same. Hopefully tonight's game is just the Spurs fucking around and not a glimpse of how they're planning to use Wemby all season.
He's a 7'5" guy. It doesn't matter how good he handles the ball, he shouldn't be trying to cross people over on the 3 pt line while dribbling through 6 arms. He's gonna get stripped a whole lot of fucking times because of physics alone.
Screen setter on pick and rolls and pick and pops, post ups, dump passes, putbacks. These are Wemby's most efficient plays. Play to his strengths, don't make his rookie season harder than it needs to be, tbh.
you're still on this? :lol
mo7888
07-08-2023, 08:29 AM
Repeat after me, motherfuckers: WEMBANYAMA IS A CENTER.
I didn't really mind dumbfucks here saying Wemby would play in the perimeter but I worry Spurs management thinks the same. Hopefully tonight's game is just the Spurs fucking around and not a glimpse of how they're planning to use Wemby all season.
He's a 7'5" guy. It doesn't matter how good he handles the ball, he shouldn't be trying to cross people over on the 3 pt line while dribbling through 6 arms. He's gonna get stripped a whole lot of fucking times because of physics alone.
Screen setter on pick and rolls and pick and pops, post ups, dump passes, putbacks. These are Wemby's most efficient plays. Play to his strengths, don't make his rookie season harder than it needs to be, tbh.
No he's not...at least not yet...he's much close to a 3 than a 5 at the moment...
Dejounte
07-08-2023, 08:37 AM
No he's not...at least not yet...he's much close to a 3 than a 5 at the moment...
See, there’s more nuance to this
is he playing like a 3? Yeah, you can see it on offense. Defense, nope.
is he the 3 when you look at what players are on the court with him? Definitely nope. There hasnt been two bigs that have shared the court with him. Ever.
given point number 2, how can anyone call him a 3? When people do, is it because they view the five players on the floor as two guards, two forwards (one of them Wemby) whom neither are 4’s, and one 5? It really doesn’t make sense tbh
mo7888
07-08-2023, 08:50 AM
See, there’s more nuance to this
is he playing like a 3? Yeah, you can see it on offense. Defense, nope.
is he the 3 when you look at what players are on the court with him? Definitely nope. There hasnt been two bigs that have shared the court with him. Ever.
given point number 2, how can anyone call him a 3? When people do, is it because they view the five players on the floor as two guards, two forwards (one of them Wemby) whom neither are 4’s, and one 5? It really doesn’t make sense tbh
I thought his D on Miller on the perimeter was fine and that's what gives me confidence that he can guard most 3's. Obviously he has the reach to give them trouble when shooting from deep and his wingspan helps a ton on the drive. It would need to be in a particular scheme because he's not nimble enough to be isolated out there on multiple possessions. I do maintain that hes closer to a 3 than a 5 at this point. I see him more as a 3/4 at the moment. It may change when he gets stronger, but he can play minutes at the 3 even though most will come at the 4.
slick'81
07-08-2023, 09:04 AM
I thought his D on Miller on the perimeter was fine and that's what gives me confidence that he can guard most 3's. Obviously he has the reach to give them trouble when shooting from deep and his wingspan helps a ton on the drive. It would need to be in a particular scheme because he's not nimble enough to be isolated out there on multiple possessions. I do maintain that hes closer to a 3 than a 5 at this point. I see him more as a 3/4 at the moment. It may change when he gets stronger, but he can play minutes at the 3 even though most will come at the 4.
he'll adjust to the speed of the game
dbestpro
07-08-2023, 09:04 AM
Facepalm. NBA sages posting after one preseason game.
Dejounte
07-08-2023, 09:33 AM
I thought his D on Miller on the perimeter was fine and that's what gives me confidence that he can guard most 3's. Obviously he has the reach to give them trouble when shooting from deep and his wingspan helps a ton on the drive. It would need to be in a particular scheme because he's not nimble enough to be isolated out there on multiple possessions. I do maintain that hes closer to a 3 than a 5 at this point. I see him more as a 3/4 at the moment. It may change when he gets stronger, but he can play minutes at the 3 even though most will come at the 4.
I guess my point is, is he really a 3 on defense if the player he’s guarding is playing the 4 (who you think is a 3)?
I think a lot of our minds today are stuck to the past idea of what players play nowadays. For a long time, people thought Sengun would be able to play the 4 in the NBA. That never stuck in the NBA.
RC_Drunkford
07-08-2023, 09:45 AM
I don't know what y'all talking about. Wembanyama is clearly a 2 guard :lol
mo7888
07-08-2023, 10:09 AM
I guess my point is, is he really a 3 on defense if the player he’s guarding is playing the 4 (who you think is a 3)?
I think a lot of our minds today are stuck to the past idea of what players play nowadays. For a long time, people thought Sengun would be able to play the 4 in the NBA. That never stuck in the NBA.
There's alot of truth there. Usually when we are talking about positions we revert to more traditional positioning and that's what I'm doing here. If we are in a lineup where the opposing team has a more traditional lineup, then I have him as being able to guard the 3 position. If the lineup is Jamal Murray, KCP, Braun, MPJ, and Jokic then he will probably drop to the 4.
r0drig0lac
07-08-2023, 12:39 PM
one fucking game.
slick'81
07-08-2023, 12:40 PM
one fucking game.
A glorified scrimmage. Still,its going to be a wild first season
R. DeMurre
07-08-2023, 12:46 PM
I think one of the secrets to unlocking Wemby's defensive prowess as a defender could be by putting him on the opposing team's least effective offensive player, whether that be a C, PF, or SF, and then letting him play the free safety help defender.
DAF86
07-08-2023, 12:52 PM
one fucking game.
It is not one game, it is how he played his entire career vs how the Spurs made him play yesterday. I've been beating this drum way before last night's game so this isn't an overeaction to one game. It does worry me a bit that the Spurs appear to see him as a 7'5" SG. But it is not a huge concern because I know that sooner or later they will figure out how to best use him.
Really I just made this thread to bump it whenever Wembanyama inevitably starts playing as a full time center (could be 2 years from now), and just troll yall on how much more I know about this shit, tbh.
Tyronn Lue
07-08-2023, 12:54 PM
It is not one game, it is how he played his entire career vs how the Spurs made him play yesterday. I've been beating this drum way before last night's game so this isn't an overeaction to one game. It does worry me a bit that the Spurs appear to see him as a 7'5" SG. But it is not a huge concern because I know that sooner or later they will figure out how to best use him.
Really I just made this thread to bump it whenever Wembanyama inevitably starts playing as a full time center (could be 2 years from now), and just troll yall on how much more I know about this shit, tbh.
You're in a no-lose situation. If he dominates you can say the Spurs found the way to play him, which you suggested. If he bombs, you can say the Spurs didn't take your advice. Is being seen as a pundit here that important that you need a book marker booty call?
DAF86
07-08-2023, 01:00 PM
You're in a no-lose situation. If he dominates you can say the Spurs found the way to play him, which you suggested. If he bombs, you can say the Spurs didn't take your advice. Is being seen as a pundit here that important that you need a book marker booty call?
No, it isn't important, it's just a fun way to spend some of my off time, tbh.
LeBowen
07-08-2023, 01:02 PM
Positions these days are more or less irrelevant. It's about what kind of player you are.
Even though we like shitting on him, MDA said it nicely the other day, everyone who has the ball and makes decisions is a point guard.
Then it's about how many point guards with good decision making you can have, without creating defensive issues. He always failed with the last bit, but still.
Wemby should always guard the most passive wing/big. His help defense and rim protection potential is beyond ridiculous and having him guard players man to man is a huge waste.
He'll obviously never be able to guard the likes of Jokic, but Wemby as the nearest help defender on elite post-up bigs should be more impactful than anyone else in the league.
And it's not like there's many elite heavyweight centers in the league.
His offensive game will be the key. If he develops his shot and handles enough to run off all the generic bigs off the floor, then he's most definitely going to be able to play as the biggest man in the lineup.
If he can exploit the likes of Zubac, Nurkic, Adams or even Poeltl on the perimeter, then their teams have no use for them.
Everyone kept talking about his range, despite his low 3pt percentage, but in a lot of highlights I've seen his midrange looked way more reliable. Just simple catch and shoot attempts, LMA style.
He got one of those all game long last night.
All in all, there's a long way to go, but I have no doubt that he'll be significantly more ready at the start of the season. Not just in terms of positioning and knowing his role, but conditioning and balance.
FuzzyLumpkins
07-08-2023, 01:04 PM
No, it isn't important, it's just a fun way to spend some of my off time, tbh.
shit posting is fun. yay!
DAF86
07-08-2023, 01:07 PM
You're in a no-lose situation. If he dominates you can say the Spurs found the way to play him, which you suggested. If he bombs, you can say the Spurs didn't take your advice. Is being seen as a pundit here that important that you need a book marker booty call?
Also, how am I in a no-lose scenario? If Wemby becomes a HoF playing like a 7'5" Allen Iverson, I would be completely proven wrong, tbh.
DAF86
07-08-2023, 01:08 PM
shit posting is fun. yay!
Always with a bit of substance, tbh.
Tyronn Lue
07-08-2023, 01:45 PM
Also, how am I in a no-lose scenario? If Wemby becomes a HoF playing like a 7'5" Allen Iverson, I would be completely proven wrong, tbh.
"I know that sooner or later they will figure out how to best use him" didn't seem to be investing in your "center" assertion.
DAF86
07-08-2023, 01:57 PM
"I know that sooner or later they will figure out how to best use him" didn't seem to be investing in your "center" assertion.
I thought it was very obvious that "how to best use him" implies getting him closer to the basket, tbh.
FuzzyLumpkins
07-08-2023, 02:20 PM
Always with a bit of substance, tbh.
Of course, that is the best way to lie.
TD 21
07-08-2023, 03:40 PM
I think one of the secrets to unlocking Wemby's defensive prowess as a defender could be by putting him on the opposing team's least effective offensive player, whether that be a C, PF, or SF, and then letting him play the free safety help defender.
Yeah. This whole debate is really semantics. He's a hybrid/combo big and like virtually all of them, their individual and team offense is at it's best when they play as the solo big, so the question is how much he can do so now and in the future?
Once his 3 gets to around decent, he'll be able to play alongside any type of big, but I'd still avoid the clear rotational, limited-non shooting C's to maximize flexibility.
It is not one game, it is how he played his entire career vs how the Spurs made him play yesterday. I've been beating this drum way before last night's game so this isn't an overeaction to one game. It does worry me a bit that the Spurs appear to see him as a 7'5" SG. But it is not a huge concern because I know that sooner or later they will figure out how to best use him.
Really I just made this thread to bump it whenever Wembanyama inevitably starts playing as a full time center (could be 2 years from now), and just troll yall on how much more I know about this shit, tbh.
I wouldn't place any limitations on him right away. One, they're in a position to not do so and two, if he fails (relatively speaking) trying to do it his way, it'll be easier to nudge him into being more of a big on offense without it coming off as a dictatorship.
Of course, that is the best way to lie.
Lies mixed in with the truth.
ismael-robert
07-09-2023, 02:08 AM
His substance is the undigested corn...still poo
rankingtear
07-09-2023, 04:21 AM
Once Victor realized he can't do whatever he wants in the NBA the more receptive he is to coaching. He needs a bit of tear down, his shot selection is absurd. And if he put him in a box this early there would be a lot of push back from him because he was successful doing it in the French league.
I do think his perimeter play is what would make him one of the NBA legends. It would be a crime to not stretch and explore it. Let him do wing stuff, what do you really got to lose? Some meaningless games and some bandwagon fans and some armchair GM who always want to optimize lineups.
NameLess Scrub
07-09-2023, 11:20 AM
His size is best used closer to the basket. He shouldn't be jacking up many 3 point shots or dribbling through traffic.
The Spurs need to add real perimeter shooters to the roster.
They have done nothing to set Wemby up with the right teammates, a real PG who can shoot, for a successful rookie year.
If you're 7'5 why would you want to take a bunch of jumpers, get your arse closer to the basket and eat.
He doesn’t have actual size, just height.
NameLess Scrub
07-09-2023, 12:01 PM
I am actually kind of scared of him trying to set hard picks I keep thinking something bad going to happen to those knees.
Like a stick figure falling apart.
R. DeMurre
07-09-2023, 12:25 PM
Yeah. This whole debate is really semantics. He's a hybrid/combo big and like virtually all of them, their individual and team offense is at it's best when they play as the solo big, so the question is how much he can do so now and in the future?
Once his 3 gets to around decent, he'll be able to play alongside any type of big, but I'd still avoid the clear rotational, limited-non shooting C's to maximize flexibility.
Yeah. At a certain point it becomes impossible to definitively say what position someone is playing for certain minutes while a bunch of movement & switching is going on. Of course, I want to see Victor getting closer to the basket, but I've also had a few brief fantasies in recent days of seeing him as the high post guy in a John Wooden type offense, where he's arching easy passes over defenders to another big in the low post, or vice versa. For some reason, in one of these daydreams, he's also dressed as the Statue of Liberty, but maybe that's a discussion for another day.
John B
07-09-2023, 12:41 PM
Center, PF or SF, I don’t think it matters most in today’s positionless basketball. The kid can do everything and it would defend on the match-up. I doubt he defends Jokic or Embiid, on which case he plays PF/SF. Stop trying to label the kid.
NameLess Scrub
07-09-2023, 12:50 PM
Yeah. At a certain point it becomes impossible to definitively say what position someone is playing for certain minutes while a bunch of movement & switching is going on. Of course, I want to see Victor getting closer to the basket, but I've also had a few brief fantasies in recent days of seeing him as the high post guy in a John Wooden type offense, where he's arching easy passes over defenders to another big in the low post, or vice versa. For some reason, in one of these daydreams, he's also dressed as the Statue of Liberty, but maybe that's a discussion for another day.
French born, very tall, and showing in the states to a lot of hype, just like the statue itself.
Spurs Homer
07-09-2023, 01:28 PM
OP should read timvp’s new article..
and then
STFU
spurs know what they are doing- allowing him to experiment and find his way organically…
exstatic
07-09-2023, 01:30 PM
-Heading into Wembanyama’s summer league debut against the Charlotte Hornets, San Antonio’s coaches (including Popovich himself, I’m told) gave the No. 1 overall pick one simple mandate: experiment. The coaches want Wembanyama to use his time in summer league to begin to learn what he can and can’t do against NBA caliber athletes.
Specifically, the Spurs coaches told him to handle the ball as much as possible — particularly in traffic.
“There’s no blueprint for him to follow,” a Spurs source told me about the conversations the Spurs have had with Wembanyama so far. “He’s gotta figure it all out on his own. Step by step.”
The source continued: “He has the ball in his hands at 7-foot-3. No one has done that. There’s nothing and nobody to reference. He needs to express himself, do what comes natural and figure it out. And he will. He absolutely will.”
Yea, sounds JUST like there ready to park him at the 5. :rollin
DAF86
07-09-2023, 01:55 PM
Yea, sounds JUST like there ready to park him at the 5. :rollin
Nobody is asking to "park him at the 5", tbh, but, from time to time, putting him on advantageous positions for him to let him get some easy baskets and the confidence that comes with it.
I'm all for "experimenting" but a couple more games like the one in the debut and the frustration and pressure can start to kick in.
Jokic and Embiid are centers and nobody says they're "parked at the 5" or "being put in a box".
John B
07-09-2023, 02:03 PM
Nobody is asking to "park him at the 5", tbh, but, from time to time, putting him on advantageous positions for him to let him get some easy baskets and the confidence that comes with it.
I'm all for "experimenting" but a couple more games like the one in the debut and the frustration and pressure can start to kick in.
Jokic and Embiid are centers and nobody says they're "parked at the 5" or "being put in a box".
Playing Jokic at the key to distribute is not playing him center. Again this thing about labeling positions does not apply in todays basketball. He will get touches at the post, and he will get the ball at the key. The kid can do everything.
Rocalcio
07-09-2023, 02:06 PM
Repeat after me, motherfuckers: WEMBANYAMA IS A CENTER.
I didn't really mind dumbfucks here saying Wemby would play in the perimeter but I worry Spurs management thinks the same. Hopefully tonight's game is just the Spurs fucking around and not a glimpse of how they're planning to use Wemby all season.
He's a 7'5" guy. It doesn't matter how good he handles the ball, he shouldn't be trying to cross people over on the 3 pt line while dribbling through 6 arms. He's gonna get stripped a whole lot of fucking times because of physics alone.
Screen setter on pick and rolls and pick and pops, post ups, dump passes, putbacks. These are Wemby's most efficient plays. Play to his strengths, don't make his rookie season harder than it needs to be, tbh.
Damn, you’re really obsessed with something that doesn’t matter at all
Rocalcio
07-09-2023, 02:20 PM
The soft frenchie in him tbh. Get used to it. That’ll prob be part of his game throughout his entire career unfortunately, no matter how much muscle he gains. Much like Tony and even Rudy Gobert.
What is wrong with you about French people ? That’s the second time you’ve said that shit.
tonight...you
07-09-2023, 02:25 PM
What is wrong with you about French people ? That’s the second time you’ve said that shit.
He's egging you (or others) on. Tony was one of the toughest SOB's on the court every game. Dude sacrificed his body at full speed for years and years. Gobert didn't get DPOYs for being a soft Frenchie.
He's just playing a role.
He role plays. Probably cosplays.
DAF86
07-09-2023, 02:25 PM
Playing Jokic at the key to distribute is not playing him center. Again this thing about labeling positions does not apply in todays basketball. He will get touches at the post, and he will get the ball at the key. The kid can do everything.
Yeah, because centers never played in the high post. If Jokic isn't a center what position does he play then? :lol
DAF86
07-09-2023, 02:27 PM
Damn, you’re really obsessed with something that doesn’t matter at all
If the position/style of play of the Spurs' franchise player doesn't matter, then nothing matters on this forum, tbh. :lol
John B
07-09-2023, 02:31 PM
Yeah, because center never played in the high post. If Jokic isn't a center what position does he play then? :lol
Jokic playing at the key facilitating is not traditional C play. Again going back to labeling. Jokic can do a lot of things that other “Centers” don’t. Now if you mention Kessler, Drummond those are traditional Centers game. Wemby WILL NOT play that “traditional center” game.
tonight...you
07-09-2023, 02:33 PM
Yeah, because centers never played in the high post. If Jokic isn't a center what position does he play then? :lol
Centward...
Forwan...er...
Dangit, you got me all mixed up!
DAF86
07-09-2023, 02:33 PM
Jokic playing at the key facilitating is not traditional C play. Again going back to labeling. Jokic can do a lot of things that other “Centers” don’t. Now if you mention Kessler, Drummond those are traditional Centers game. Wemby WILL NOT play that “traditional center” game.
And nobody is saying he will. I don't know who you're arguing with, tbh. :lol
tonight...you
07-09-2023, 02:34 PM
Yeah, because centers never played in the high post. If Jokic isn't a center what position does he play then? :lol
Actually he plays very much like Tim, who was listed as a PF and considered as the greatest at the position, but basically played Center for much of his career.
poopbox
07-09-2023, 02:37 PM
What does a center in todays nba even do tbh :rollin
How do they even play tbh :rollin
TD 21
07-09-2023, 02:44 PM
Jokic and Embiid are centers and nobody says they're "parked at the 5" or "being put in a box".
I mostly agree with you on this topic, but the difference is, despite their dynamic skills, they're overpowering, can mostly handle traditional big man duties solo and only guard C's.
DAF86
07-09-2023, 02:45 PM
Actually he plays very much like Tim, who was listed as a PF and considered as the greatest at the position, but basically played Center for much of his career.
Exactly, folks getting all semantical to make God knows what point are the first ones to say "Duncan, the greatest PF of all-time" despite him playing more like a center.
I guess Jordan wasn't really a SG because he posted up more than the centers on his teams. Or Lebron is a PG, not a SF, since he does more plamaking than the PGs of his teams.
Weather you want to call Wemby a center or not, the point remains that the best way to utilize him on offense is with him being at the middle of things doing bigmen stuff, rather than having trying to cross over 3 people on the wings. I'm not saying he can't do these things from time to time, but it shouldn't be his main way of offense. Avoid putting him on a box, but give him some structure so he can make the most out of his tools.
Rocalcio
07-09-2023, 02:49 PM
If the position/style of play of the Spurs' franchise player doesn't matter, then nothing matters on this forum, tbh. :lol
You know today’s league doesn’t really care about positions.
BackHome
07-09-2023, 03:02 PM
The only thing I don't want him to be is our PG, our SG, and our Center when we playing against big boys - Other then that I don't really care where he plays on offense or defense as long as he getting points, assist, rebounds, and getting blocks.
I think he’d score 15-20 points in summer league easily if he hung out in the paint instead of behind the 3 point line.
Idk bro, I think turning him into more of a center just because of his height doesn't take advantage of what makes him so unique. I don't mind post play being a part of his repertoire, just not sure about it being the majority of his game.
He is very KD like, in that he can get his shot off over anyone. And his handle is fluid enough to where he can have a similar game. Just needs to continue developing his midrange pull-up/fadeaway package. And the Spurs are really good at developing that in players (Nephew; Vassell, Malaki).
Obstructed_View
07-09-2023, 08:21 PM
Victor is number one on the depth chart at every position for the Spurs other than maybe shooting guard.
skin27
07-09-2023, 08:56 PM
This is what im talking about from the start.. wemby needs to play inside the paint and not doing fadeaway 3's.
exstatic
07-09-2023, 08:59 PM
This is what im talking about from the start.. wemby needs to play inside the paint and not doing fadeaway 3's.
If players only do what they are currently capable of, they never grow. Failure is the only way to succeed.
DAF86
07-09-2023, 09:00 PM
This is what im talking about from the start.. wemby needs to play inside the paint and not doing fadeaway 3's.
His game is always gonna be inside out. Once he got a couple of easy buckets inside, he gained confidence and the rest of his game shined through.
Dejounte
07-09-2023, 09:03 PM
He played a lot more like LMA tonight than KD. Less dribbling into traffic, less dribbling overall
DAF86
07-09-2023, 09:13 PM
He played a lot more like LMA tonight than KD. Less dribbling into traffic, less dribbling overall
That's his game. I don't know why are folks expecting him to do things in the NBA he didn't do in the French league.
Sure, he's gonna get a lot better in a lot of things, but he's not suddenly start changing the way he plays. He's always been a bigman, and he will continue to be that. That's where his strengths are.
Atl Spur
07-09-2023, 09:19 PM
That's his game. I don't know why are folks expecting him to do things in the NBA he didn't do in the French league.
Sure, he's gonna get a lot better in a lot of things, but he's not suddenly start changing the way he plays. He's always been a bigman, and he will continue to be that. That's where his strengths are.
A PF is a big man…….
DAF86
07-09-2023, 09:26 PM
A PF is a big man…….
In today's NBA a PF is more of a perimeter player, tbh. KD, Lebron, Giannis, Gordon. Those are the guys playing PF nowadays.
baseline bum
07-09-2023, 09:51 PM
His game is always gonna be inside out. Once he got a couple of easy buckets inside, he gained confidence and the rest of his game shined through.
Wasn't Wemby's first bucket an 18 footer?
slick'81
07-09-2023, 09:52 PM
Wemby is whatever the fck he wants to be
DAF86
07-09-2023, 09:56 PM
Wasn't Wemby's first bucket an 18 footer?
A pick and pop. Typical bigman play, tbh.
TekXX
07-09-2023, 09:57 PM
Wemby is whatever the fck he wants to be
Point guard?
slick'81
07-09-2023, 10:05 PM
Point guard?
fck it! If it keeps him here :smokin
Point guard?
More like point center.
Tailboar
07-09-2023, 11:16 PM
[QUOTE=exstatic;10928417]If players only do what they are currently capable of, they never grow. Failure is the only way to succeed.[/QUOTE
Knowledge. Facts.
RC_Drunkford
07-10-2023, 11:58 AM
He played a lot more like LMA tonight than KD. Less dribbling into traffic, less dribbling overall
that's what I been saying. Spurs should run the LMA sets for him
Ariel
07-10-2023, 12:06 PM
If players only do what they are currently capable of, they never grow. Failure is the only way to succeed.
True, but you don't want to fall into a downward spiral where too much failure causes you to lose confidence which causes you to keep failing. Set him up for some of the things he CAN do (to keep him confident and productive) mixed with a healthy dose of what he's not yet prolific at (to practice and improve), and you'll have a happy and improving Wemby.
exstatic
07-10-2023, 12:07 PM
In today's NBA a PF is more of a perimeter player, tbh. KD, Lebron, Giannis, Gordon. Those are the guys playing PF nowadays.
Giannis and Gordon aren't really perimeter players because they can't shoot.
exstatic
07-10-2023, 12:07 PM
True, but you don't want to fall into a downward spiral where too much failure causes you to lose confidence which causes you to keep failing. Set him up for something of what he can do (to keep confident and productive) mixed with a healthy dose of what he's not yet prolific at (to improve), and you'll have a happy and improving Wemby.
It's summer league. I don't see it throwing him into a death spiral.
Ariel
07-10-2023, 12:10 PM
It's summer league. I don't see it throwing him into a death spiral.
Of course not. But if you have him mimicking Durant for a whole season with Wesley at the point he'll catch so much flak he might end up scarred.
CorrectCrusader
07-10-2023, 12:17 PM
The flipside to this is that if teams are throwing 2.5+ defenders at him anytime he dribbles to the FT line extended, it's going to open up chasms in their defense.
And it's not like it will be a regular trap. He can just throw over them.
itzsoweezee
07-10-2023, 04:12 PM
If you think the spurs view Victor as a center, you obviously have not been paying attention. He’s a wing. He plays like a wing. The spurs were playing him like a wing.
PrimeMinister
07-10-2023, 04:29 PM
think what makes him unique is that he does everything lol
Atl Spur
07-10-2023, 04:31 PM
Zach will be the center but we shall see.
DAF86
07-10-2023, 04:33 PM
If you think the spurs view Victor as a center, you obviously have not been paying attention. He’s a wing. He plays like a wing. The spurs were playing him like a wing.
https://media.tenor.com/6v1KjBnDCp4AAAAM/alone-lonely.gif
Dude, have you seen any Wemby game before getting to the Spurs? How can you watch him play in France and say "that guy is a wing"? :lol
DAF86
07-10-2023, 04:55 PM
If you think the spurs view Victor as a center, you obviously have not been paying attention. He’s a wing. He plays like a wing. The spurs were playing him like a wing.
9Vv2r4vSa9A
I mean, how do you watch these highlights and think "this guy is a wing"? Pick and pop, offensive putback, rim running the floor on the fastbreak, pick and roll and post ups. All bigmen stuff.
Then you have the spot up 3's (which is a skill required at any position in today's NBA) and that fadeaway 20 footer, which was the only true non-big thing he did to get a bucket.
itzsoweezee
07-10-2023, 05:16 PM
9Vv2r4vSa9A
I mean, how do you watch these highlights and think "this guy is a wing"? Pick and pop, offensive putback, rim running the floor on the fastbreak, pick and roll and post ups. All bigmen stuff.
Then you have the spot up 3's (which is a skill required at any position in today's NBA) and that fadeaway 20 footer, which was the only true non-big thing he did to get a bucket.
Beings center is running the floor and shooting threes? Now you’re just moving the goalposts — being a center is whatever you say it is.
Look at where the team is giving him the ball. That should be a major indication to you that he is not playing center. He is getting the ball almost exclusively outside of the paint, in space. He’s handling the ball on the perimeter. The team lists him as a forward!
DAF86
07-10-2023, 05:42 PM
Beings center is running the floor and shooting threes? Now you’re just moving the goalposts — being a center is whatever you say it is.
Look at where the team is giving him the ball. That should be a major indication to you that he is not playing center. He is getting the ball almost exclusively outside of the paint, in space. He’s handling the ball on the perimeter. The team lists him as a forward!
Jokic gets the ball outside of the paint too, is he a wing?
itzsoweezee
07-10-2023, 07:51 PM
Jokic gets the ball outside of the paint too, is he a wing?
Jokic, a generational talent, a guy who does things we’ve never seen before, does not define what is and is not a center. On a fundamental level, a center plays in the paint, primarily. Victor plays almost exclusively outside of the paint, other than in seeking out offensive rebounds (although he more often starts sprinting to the offense half almost immediately) or in providing help defense.
DAF86
07-10-2023, 10:04 PM
Jokic, a generational talent, a guy who does things we’ve never seen before, does not define what is and is not a center. On a fundamental level, a center plays in the paint, primarily. Victor plays almost exclusively outside of the paint, other than in seeking out offensive rebounds (although he more often starts sprinting to the offense half almost immediately) or in providing help defense.
Dude, are you even watching the guy play? He literally scored 5 out of 8 buckets from the paint. :lol
Not to mention all the shooting fouls he got there too. It is hard to have a productive argument if you say things that simply aren't true, tbh.
Vince Carter's ankle
07-11-2023, 03:49 AM
I think Victor's repertoire in isolation should be based on face up and midrange pull ups
more like what's shown in the video than Durant's playstyle
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Emacyx1gKM0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yuAlWwlA7vE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QKL4BKbbhtU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Emacyx1gKM0
rascal
07-11-2023, 09:57 AM
Dude, are you even watching the guy play? He literally scored 5 out of 8 buckets from the paint. :lol
Not to mention all the shooting fouls he got there too. It is hard to have a productive argument if you say things that simply aren't true, tbh.
That was the huge difference from game one.
He had more looks and shots closer to the basket. That also opened him up and built his confidence for a couple open perimeter shots.
Wemby will be fine.
It's what the Spurs do with the rest of the team and who they surround him with now that matters.
DAF86
07-11-2023, 04:13 PM
Mainstream media starting to realize his stregths are inside, tbh.
zojb_27SnDc
Obstructed_View
07-11-2023, 04:25 PM
Dude, are you even watching the guy play? He literally scored 5 out of 8 buckets from the paint. :lol
Not to mention all the shooting fouls he got there too. It is hard to have a productive argument if you say things that simply aren't true, tbh.
I'm pretty astounded at the number of hot takes from guys who seem to have not watched him play at all.
Atl Spur
07-11-2023, 04:26 PM
Mainstream media starting to realize his stregths are inside, tbh.
zojb_27SnDc
His strength depends on the matchup….. inside against a quicker player / outside vs a slower player ( big or small doesn’t matter )
Obstructed_View
07-11-2023, 04:32 PM
If people think the regular NBA refs are going to watch Victor get hacked and grabbed the way he was in Vegas they are going to be really surprised.
Anybody who has watched him prior to summer league knows how strong he is. If teams want to try to body him up, then he will go to the line a dozen times a night. He will beat people with size and quickness and there won't be shit they can do about it. The best way to defend him is the guy who drew the charge on him. Move your feet, hold your position and keep him as far from the basket as you can.
Dingle Barry
07-11-2023, 05:35 PM
Positions are barely even a thing in today's NBA.
I'd rather not have him spend a lot of time trying to create far from the basket. That'd just be a misuse of his talents.
DAF86
07-11-2023, 06:22 PM
Positions are barely even a thing in today's NBA.
I'd rather not have him spend a lot of time trying to create far from the basket. That'd just be a misuse of his talents.
Except center. Teams nowadays play 4 perimeter guys and 1 bigman. The bigman is the one doing most of the screening, most of the rolling to the basket, and being, generally, the guy standing closer to the basket. That guy on the Spurs should be Wemby, 'cause that's where he makes the most out of his length. At least on offense. On defense, if they want to save his body earlier, I'm fine with him acting as a weakside help defender.
The change in playing style on the NBA it is exactly why being the center and being a PF isn't the same, as it once was.
exstatic
07-11-2023, 07:06 PM
Positions are barely even a thing in today's NBA.
I'd rather not have him spend a lot of time trying to create far from the basket. That'd just be a misuse of his talents.
If we stuck Kawhi like a fly in amber with what he could do when he got to the NBA, he would have been Bowen II. What you call a misuse of his talents, most call player development.
tonight...you
07-11-2023, 07:24 PM
If we stuck Kawhi like a fly in amber with what he could do when he got to the NBA, he would have been Bowen II. What you call a misuse of his talents, most call player development.
But!!! But...
They could have cloned him at Jurassic Park.
They would have spared no expense!
Mainstream media starting to realize his stregths are inside, tbh.
zojb_27SnDc
Jeesh, didn’t think there was anyone more than Broussard, but that long hair fuck takes the cake Jeesh
Joseph Kony
07-11-2023, 07:44 PM
Mainstream media starting to realize his stregths are inside, tbh.
zojb_27SnDc
:lol Nick Wright and Chris Broussard are literal retards, why tf does anyone care what these clowns have to say
scott
07-11-2023, 07:58 PM
I apologize if this is an elementary idea, but I'm not understanding how you just doing run PnR with Wemby all day and throw him high lobs at the basket that no one can get up for? Once the opposing D figures it up they'll sag off the perimeter and clog the lane, at which point we should be able to hit them for an open look at a 3. I realize life isn't 2k... but why isn't it this simple?
DAF86
10-31-2023, 11:38 PM
Does anyone have Wemby's numbers when he plays center compared to when he's wandering around in the perimeter? Asking for a friend, tbh. :wakeup
Seventyniner
10-31-2023, 11:58 PM
I apologize if this is an elementary idea, but I'm not understanding how you just doing run PnR with Wemby all day and throw him high lobs at the basket that no one can get up for? Once the opposing D figures it up they'll sag off the perimeter and clog the lane, at which point we should be able to hit them for an open look at a 3. I realize life isn't 2k... but why isn't it this simple?
My first instinct is to say that the screen/roll/catch/finish sequence takes a lot of energy, and Wemby is getting gassed often. Early in games when he's fresh and late when the end is in sight (barring OT) sure, but he needs to save most of his energy for defense and the rest of the game.
As his conditioning improves and hopefully his teammates improve (to take pressure off Wemby) I can see him ramping up his activity on offense.
RC_Drunkford
11-01-2023, 07:19 AM
I apologize if this is an elementary idea, but I'm not understanding how you just doing run PnR with Wemby all day and throw him high lobs at the basket that no one can get up for? Once the opposing D figures it up they'll sag off the perimeter and clog the lane, at which point we should be able to hit them for an open look at a 3. I realize life isn't 2k... but why isn't it this simple?
the reason is cause Wemby can't set a proper screen at all
The Truth #6
11-01-2023, 09:05 AM
Yeah there was a point last night where he was at the top of the key and Jones was driving by him and he could have easily just turned and set pick but it was like a foreign concept to him.
I'm curious to see how he changes his game moving forward.
the reason is cause Wemby can't set a proper screen at all
Yeah, he's not close enough and leaves the screen too early.
DAF86
11-01-2023, 10:08 AM
the reason is cause Wemby can't set a proper screen at all
Well, that's where coaching should come into play. It seems like an easy enough fix.
DAF86
11-01-2023, 04:23 PM
Does anyone have Wemby's numbers when he plays center compared to when he's wandering around in the perimeter? Asking for a friend, tbh. :wakeup
I just came across this stat.
In 20 minutes of action as the center, Wemby is 8/10 from the field, and the Spurs are +15.
8:30 mark:
okpkB5BuSPg?si=F16kzTiXH4347Inf
I have yet to see when did Wemby say that he doesn't like to play center, though. All I heard from him so far is that he doesn't like to be put on a box and that he will do everything that Pop asks from him.
DAF86
11-01-2023, 04:38 PM
I haven't seen a single minute of OKC this season but, according to that video, Chet is playing strictly center for them and seems to be doing ok. I wonder why folks here think Chet can do it but Wemby can't.
Sugus
11-01-2023, 06:03 PM
Does anyone have Wemby's numbers when he plays center compared to when he's wandering around in the perimeter? Asking for a friend, tbh. :wakeup
I don't think the numbers matter much to the original question, which in my eyes has been solved clearly. No matter where he's most efficient, or where he can score the easiest -- Victor Wembanyama, today, is not a center.
He plays the game, sees the game and approaches the game like a jumbo wing does. That's not to say that coaching a change of playing style into him (IMO to his detriment, but whatever) can't be done, or that time and/or injuries might eventually force him to adapt his game into more of a center's (late career Duncan), or even that his most effective role today is playing the C. But the game does not come to him like it does a traditional center, or close to it.
You said it yourself a couple posts above -- he doesn't fill any of the classic "big man duties", doesn't set screens whenever possible, and would much rather dribble into traffic than play the high post. He's just... not a center, tbh.
cutewizard
11-01-2023, 06:08 PM
Robinson at center, Duncan at power forward, Wemby at small forward
Parker and Manu at the backcourt
--------------------------------------------------
Can you imagine????
cutewizard
11-01-2023, 06:18 PM
https://airalamo.com/posts/spurs-playbook-diving-into-how-san-antonio-runs-half-court-sets
DAF86
11-01-2023, 06:54 PM
I don't think the numbers matter much to the original question, which in my eyes has been solved clearly. No matter where he's most efficient, or where he can score the easiest -- Victor Wembanyama, today, is not a center.
He plays the game, sees the game and approaches the game like a jumbo wing does. That's not to say that coaching a change of playing style into him (IMO to his detriment, but whatever) can't be done, or that time and/or injuries might eventually force him to adapt his game into more of a center's (late career Duncan), or even that his most effective role today is playing the C. But the game does not come to him like it does a traditional center, or close to it.
You said it yourself a couple posts above -- he doesn't fill any of the classic "big man duties", doesn't set screens whenever possible, and would much rather dribble into traffic than play the high post. He's just... not a center, tbh.
He played center while in France. I think most of us saw his games while he was there. How did you not realize this?
In fact, he has played like a center in the NBA whenever Pop played him there. The old man just prefers to have him aimlessly wandering around in the perimeter most of the time for some reason.
tim_duncan_fan
11-01-2023, 06:57 PM
He played center while in France. I think most of us saw his games while he was there. How did you not realize this?
In fact, he has played like a center in the NBA whenever Pop played him there. The old man just prefers to have him aimlessly wandering around in the perimeter most of the time for some reason.
Are we sure this isn't a Wemby preference?
DAF86
11-01-2023, 07:04 PM
Are we sure this isn't a Wemby preference?
If it is, that's what coaching is for. Nobody is asking to prevent Wemby from expressing himself, but he's gotta learn where he's most efficient at. Balance your touches a little more. Wemby having way more 3pts attempts than paint touches is just dumb, no matter how you look at it.
tim_duncan_fan
11-01-2023, 09:43 PM
If it is, that's what coaching is for. Nobody is asking to prevent Wemby from expressing himself, but he's gotta learn where he's most efficient at. Balance your touches a little more. Wemby having way more 3pts attempts than paint touches is just dumb, no matter how you look at it.
Yep, yep, agree 115%.
tim_duncan_fan
11-01-2023, 09:46 PM
I don't think the numbers matter much to the original question, which in my eyes has been solved clearly. No matter where he's most efficient, or where he can score the easiest -- Victor Wembanyama, today, is not a center.
He plays the game, sees the game and approaches the game like a jumbo wing does. That's not to say that coaching a change of playing style into him (IMO to his detriment, but whatever) can't be done, or that time and/or injuries might eventually force him to adapt his game into more of a center's (late career Duncan), or even that his most effective role today is playing the C. But the game does not come to him like it does a traditional center, or close to it.
You said it yourself a couple posts above -- he doesn't fill any of the classic "big man duties", doesn't set screens whenever possible, and would much rather dribble into traffic than play the high post. He's just... not a center, tbh.
In your estimation, just based off these first four NBA reg season games, so nothing definite really of course, does he look to be currently good at perimeter things?
rascal
11-01-2023, 11:09 PM
Robinson at center, Duncan at power forward, Wemby at small forward
Parker and Manu at the backcourt
--------------------------------------------------
Can you imagine????
No, Gervin easily at SG over Manu and Captain Late in his prime over Parker but that's close.
onechance87
11-01-2023, 11:30 PM
pop....just gotta sub collins out early for trey if it aint working out with the offence
Vince Carter's ankle
11-02-2023, 02:08 AM
No, Gervin easily at SG over Manu and Captain Late in his prime over Parker but that's close.
🤡
scott
11-02-2023, 02:26 AM
Opponents are shooting 20% FG and 6.7% 3FG against Wemby. Whether he is a center or not, he's having a major impact on the defensive end. Setting a qualifier of 10 DFGA, Wemby's 20% DFG% (7-35) is topped only by Trayce Jackson-Davis at 9.1% (1-11) and Joe Ingles (1-10).
All of these are small sample sizes, but Jackson-Davis and Ingles are especially small. Kris Dunn falls behind Wemby at 20.8% (5-24) and then OG Anunoby is the first true comparable (IMO) at 25.6% (10-39). Note: Drew Eubanks cracks the top 10 (#9) at 27.0% (10-37).
How does this compare against other noted defensive bigs?
AD - 46.5% (46-99)
Evan Mobley - 44.3% (43-97)
Chet - 51.0% (49-96)
K Looney - 42.9% (39-91)
Jak - 37.8% (34-90)
Ayton - 47.5% (38-80)
Zollins - 56.0% (42-75) WOOF
Sochan - 56.3% (36-64) Included just because I saw him on the list
Gobert - 40.6% (26-64)
Embiid - 44.4% (28-63)
JJJ - 50.8% (32-63)
It is interesting to see how not only how effective Victor is early on, but how much teams are avoiding shooting against him.
rascal
11-02-2023, 09:32 AM
Opponents are shooting 20% FG and 6.7% 3FG against Wemby. Whether he is a center or not, he's having a major impact on the defensive end. Setting a qualifier of 10 DFGA, Wemby's 20% DFG% (7-35) is topped only by Trayce Jackson-Davis at 9.1% (1-11) and Joe Ingles (1-10).
All of these are small sample sizes, but Jackson-Davis and Ingles are especially small. Kris Dunn falls behind Wemby at 20.8% (5-24) and then OG Anunoby is the first true comparable (IMO) at 25.6% (10-39). Note: Drew Eubanks cracks the top 10 (#9) at 27.0% (10-37).
How does this compare against other noted defensive bigs?
AD - 46.5% (46-99)
Evan Mobley - 44.3% (43-97)
Chet - 51.0% (49-96)
K Looney - 42.9% (39-91)
Jak - 37.8% (34-90)
Ayton - 47.5% (38-80)
Zollins - 56.0% (42-75) WOOF
Sochan - 56.3% (36-64) Included just because I saw him on the list
Gobert - 40.6% (26-64)
Embiid - 44.4% (28-63)
JJJ - 50.8% (32-63)
It is interesting to see how not only how effective Victor is early on, but how much teams are avoiding shooting against him.
Not surprising, Sochan and Collins the worst on the list.
Joseph Kony
11-02-2023, 09:35 AM
No, Gervin easily at SG over Manu and Captain Late in his prime over Parker but that's close.
This is why you don't get any pussy
DAF86
11-02-2023, 11:43 PM
Just have him near the basket and lob it up. It really is as simple as that.
TD 21
11-05-2023, 10:56 AM
We get it. Why are you so obsessed with this?
Fizziksman
11-05-2023, 11:36 AM
Yes are death line up is him at Center, though I think the problem is how much of a defensively liability Collins is downlow
DAF86
11-05-2023, 06:18 PM
We get it. Why are you so obsessed with this?
Becuase Pop for some reason won't do it. The earlier, the most amount of people realize where Wemby's strengths are, the better, tbh.
We get it. Why are you so obsessed with this?
well, probably to make a point that he was right.
FWIW, i think he is. i don't like seeing Wenby spending so much time behind the 3 pts line..... he's so effective and deadly closer to the basket.
I thought the last game was a step in the right direction but this game against Toronto showed that it will be a long process maybe.
Sugus
11-11-2023, 12:14 PM
In your estimation, just based off these first four NBA reg season games, so nothing definite really of course, does he look to be currently good at perimeter things?
Sorry for a late reply.
Was this a sarcastic question by any chance? He looks amazing on perimeter play, WYM? Always remember, the NBA has never been, and never will be, about just "how good" you are at something -- it's always about how good you are at something, at that height. There is no one within 5 inches of Wemby's height, except for Durant, who comes anywhere close to his perimeter play (or none that come to my mind at least).
I'm not at all concerned about %s or efficiency or the like, he's a rookie with a world of power in the form of raw talent. He literally doesn't know the limits to his abilities yet. He can try logo rainbow 3's for all I care about, you gotta stumble to learn. But yes, every perimeter maneuver, every step-back three, every dribble penetration with a guard's handle and a center's height and reach is just fantastic.
I understand why DAF thinks the way he does regarding VW's playstyle, but the NBA just isn't trending "his way" at all. I'd rather Wemby practice perimeter shit over and over, see what he can or can't do, and then get his position closer to the rim. One day, when we can run a 5-out offense with him at C, those perimeter skills will be simply invaluable and his true form.
LeBowen
11-11-2023, 12:44 PM
Imo, these days position is defined by player's defensive skillset and size.
And obviously potential matchups.
Since there are so few dominant post bullies these days, Victor at C needs to become a thing as soon as possible.
Collins will never be good enough to start on a legit playoff team due to his atrocious defense. And then the entire team suffers because he gets torched in every possible way.
On offense, Wemby will play where he needs to depending on the matchup. He can abuse his size advantage or speed advantage. Doesn't have to play the same way every game.
But I can't see how he doesn't become a center long term unless Spurs get another star big to play next to him.
John B
11-11-2023, 01:02 PM
I think eventually Wemby will play a Center once he is NBA strong. If you need to maximize that height advantage, rebounding, putbacks, blockshots, he will dominate more playing the post. Timmy shows his position at PF, but we all know he manned that post as a center especially after DRob and mostly the 2nd half of his career. No difference.
I know before I said KD style. But he’s too big not to maximize that playing perimeter. He is barely averaging 9 rebounds now.
boutons_deux
11-11-2023, 02:00 PM
Opponents are shooting 20% FG and 6.7% 3FG against Wemby. Whether he is a center or not, he's having a major impact on the defensive end. Setting a qualifier of 10 DFGA, Wemby's 20% DFG% (7-35) is topped only by Trayce Jackson-Davis at 9.1% (1-11) and Joe Ingles (1-10).
All of these are small sample sizes, but Jackson-Davis and Ingles are especially small. Kris Dunn falls behind Wemby at 20.8% (5-24) and then OG Anunoby is the first true comparable (IMO) at 25.6% (10-39). Note: Drew Eubanks cracks the top 10 (#9) at 27.0% (10-37).
How does this compare against other noted defensive bigs?
AD - 46.5% (46-99)
Evan Mobley - 44.3% (43-97)
Chet - 51.0% (49-96)
K Looney - 42.9% (39-91)
Jak - 37.8% (34-90)
Ayton - 47.5% (38-80)
Zollins - 56.0% (42-75) WOOF
Sochan - 56.3% (36-64) Included just because I saw him on the list
Gobert - 40.6% (26-64)
Embiid - 44.4% (28-63)
JJJ - 50.8% (32-63)
It is interesting to see how not only how effective Victor is early on, but how much teams are avoiding shooting against him.
boutons_deux
11-11-2023, 02:02 PM
VW May stop the shooter he is facing
But the other four spurs and the other four opponents the worst defense in the league,
So VW's defense on any given shooter is hilariously moot
The Truth #6
11-11-2023, 02:45 PM
Wemby is good in crunch time as center but over the course of a full game you can see he has no interest in being a center, so it doesn't matter what fans think. And at least Pop isn't trying, immediately, to make him di something he doesn't want to do, especially something as important as this.
He's getting better at trying to set screens now but he has not strength down low and is starting to get pushed around.
But I do think they should look to get him the ball when he is moving towards the basket or on the break. But he has no post game and can't establish position. But maybe in a few years.
DAF86
11-14-2023, 10:29 PM
It's time, bros. Let's face it, the only reason Pop has Sochan at PG is because of this stupid idea of "preserving" Wemby from playing center. As if playing center in the NBA was the equivalent of playing RB in the NFL.
Just play everybody on their damn positions and prepare them for the future. Everybody in the Spurs' organization is talking about "seeing what they got", well, you won't see what you got untill you start playing folks where they are supossed to play, and where they will end up playing in the prime of their careers. Stop with the experimenting bullshit.
JeffDuncan
11-14-2023, 10:40 PM
It's time, bros. Let's face it, the only reason Pop has Sochan at PG is because of this stupid idea of "preserving" Wemby from playing center. …
Not true. You didn’t get the memo. You’re so hung up on this you’re missing everything else.
Sochan got penciled in at pg because they wanted better defense than with Tre. Hard to believe now with what we’ve seen, but that’s it.
Nothing to do with what Wemby plays, it was between Sochan and Tre.
If they started Tre at pg they’d still have Collins at center.
DAF86
11-14-2023, 10:46 PM
Not true. You didn’t get the memo. You’re so hung up on this you’re missing everything else.
Sochan got penciled in at pg because they wanted better defense than with Tre. Hard to believe now with what we’ve seen, but that’s it.
Nothing to do with what Wemby plays, it was between Sochan and Tre.
If they started Tre at pg they’d still have Collins at center.
Only because of this overblown idea that if they play Wemby at center, he would explode into a million pieces. So they put him at PF, and since they don't want to bench neither Keldon nor Sochan, they had no other choice but to shoehorn Jeremy at PG.
Any other coach would have played Wemby at center, Sochan at PF and they would have an actual PG running the point.
paperboy77
11-14-2023, 10:55 PM
If you want to win then changes, big changes or trades are in order, or you are a bitch ass and are okay with losing and you are an NBA cuck.
Floyd Pacquiao
11-14-2023, 10:59 PM
Wemby is still to skinny imho to consistently rebound against the bigger teams, so he should still be paired with a big.
honestly just start Bassey next to him. Jones/Vassell/Sochan/Wemby/Bassey. Bring keldon and Collins off the bench
JeffDuncan
11-14-2023, 11:10 PM
Only because of this overblown idea that if they play Wemby at center, …
They gave Collins an extension. To play center. If Tre was starting at pg they would still play Collins at center.
Hello. Anybody there?
You think Wemby should play center. Yeah, ok. But that has nothing to do with the Sochan at pg thing.
Even if they moved Wemby to center, they wouldn’t put Sochan at pf, they’d move Collins to pf, because they’d still want Sochan over Tre.
I say “they” but I mean Pop, of course, the driveling old incompetent nitwit who has become the Spurs albatross.
Pop should have stayed on as an executive consultant a la Jerry West, not as the head coach. Oh well.
Anyway, you want the Big W at center. Fine with me. Not sure it matters if he and his people are already packing their bags.
DAF86
11-14-2023, 11:53 PM
They gave Collins an extension. To play center. If Tre was starting at pg they would still play Collins at center.
They also gave Tre an extension to play PG but have a PF doing that.
Hello. Anybody there?
Are you ok? What was that suppossed to be?
You think Wemby should play center. Yeah, ok. But that has nothing to do with the Sochan at pg thing.
I think I explained very clearly why it is related. Having Sochan at PG is the only way Pop could keep him in the starting lineup while playing Wemby at PF.
Even if they moved Wemby to center, they wouldn’t put Sochan at pf, they’d move Collins to pf, because they’d still want Sochan over Tre.
I say “they” but I mean Pop, of course, the driveling old incompetent nitwit who has become the Spurs albatross.
Pop should have stayed on as an executive consultant a la Jerry West, not as the head coach. Oh well.
Anyway, you want the Big W at center. Fine with me. Not sure it matters if he and his people are already packing their bags.
I don't think that's the case, but if it is, they are wrong.
spurraider21
11-15-2023, 12:33 AM
Sochan playing point guard is not related to wemby playing PF or C
tim_duncan_fan
11-15-2023, 12:43 AM
First order of business to correct this cluster-fuck of a team is to teach entry passes and sky hooks, and we all know who on the team needs to learn what.
Get that KAT mentality out of here.
RC_Drunkford
11-15-2023, 08:19 AM
Only because of this overblown idea that if they play Wemby at center, he would explode into a million pieces. So they put him at PF, and since they don't want to bench neither Keldon nor Sochan, they had no other choice but to shoehorn Jeremy at PG.
Any other coach would have played Wemby at center, Sochan at PF and they would have an actual PG running the point.
any other coach also wouldn't have started Bryn Forbes for 2 seasons straight. Evidently that never happened again afterwards. We're talking about Flopovich, he has to do something crazy just so he can think of himself being smarter than everybody else.
rascal
11-15-2023, 09:29 AM
Didn't Wemby say he isn't a center. Wembanyama prefers not to play center.
daslicer
11-15-2023, 09:35 AM
I see too many times Wemby just chucking up shots. He's not good at getting the easiest shot possible. He's a poor 3-point shooter. Now he's even struggling to hit 5-6 feet jump shots. His touch around the rim is terrible. With that being said I do think he can still be a star but he's definitely a work in progress.
DAF86
11-15-2023, 10:37 AM
Didn't Wemby say he isn't a center. Wembanyama prefers not to play center.
No, he never said that. In fact, he has played center his entire career untill now.
Wemby has said he doesn't want to play center.
DAF86
11-15-2023, 11:11 AM
Wemby has said he doesn't want to play center.
If you provide a real link, with him saying exactly that (not some US articles that missinterpreted what Wemby said) I will stand corrected.
DAF86
11-15-2023, 11:13 AM
And regardless of whether Wemby wants to play center or not, it doesn't matter, that's where he will end up playing because that's the position where he will maximize his strengths.
rascal
11-15-2023, 11:30 AM
No, he never said that. In fact, he has played center his entire career untill now.
Yes he did say he isn't a center.
“I’m not a center even though I can play that position, and I have,” Wembanyama said in the post-game presser after the Spurs' preseason game against the Golden State Warriors.
“But, who knows? I don’t like considering me in a certain position as much. I think you've seen in the preseason I've been the screen-setter and the ball-handler as often.”
If you provide a real link, with him saying exactly that (not some US articles that missinterpreted what Wemby said) I will stand corrected.
https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/wemby-watch-victor-wembanyama-prefers-not-to-play-center-so-which-nba-rebuilder-is-best-suited-for-phenom/
I don't disagree that to best use his defensive talents, he may need to play center, but it's not the position he wants to play.
If you provide a real link, with him saying exactly that (not some US articles that missinterpreted what Wemby said) I will stand corrected.
https://www.basketusa.com/news/632216/victor-wembanyama-le-plus-jeune-mais-le-plus-experimente-des-bleuets/
https://www.basketusa.com/news/702497/victor-wembanyama-poste-terrain-spurs/
and many others....
still, i'm with you on this one. i think he will have to play closer to the basket to be the best version of himself. and from what i hear and see from Victor, i don't think that it will be an easy choice and path for him. He really seems to like playing like a taller Durant.....
a lot of player can do what he does behind the 3 pts line, and way better (even if none of them are seven footer but who cares when it comes to win games and titles?). Even factoring the fact that he's only 19 and will improve a lot.
what he does and is able to do in the paint and even from mid range ?..... well, that's another story there. he can change any game there.
by the way, Vincent Collet, his former coach and french NT coach, said several times that Victor shouldn't feel the need to take many 3's each game and play closer to the basket.
rascal
11-15-2023, 11:38 AM
from a CBS article:
Victor Wembanyama prefers not to play center
Off these quotes.
As early as the age of 15, he expected to be the focal point of his offense.
Center is not his preferred position.
Those two notions were summed up by Wembanyama himself in a single quote. "I had literally zero responsibility. I never had the ball, even at practice. The coach played me at center," Wembanyama said of a 2019 showcase he played in. "I was really frustrated even coming to the game. I knew it wasn't going to go well. So it didn't go well."
DAF86
11-15-2023, 11:46 AM
https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/wemby-watch-victor-wembanyama-prefers-not-to-play-center-so-which-nba-rebuilder-is-best-suited-for-phenom/
I don't disagree that to best use his defensive talents, he may need to play center, but it's not the position he wants to play.
https://www.basketusa.com/news/632216/victor-wembanyama-le-plus-jeune-mais-le-plus-experimente-des-bleuets/
https://www.basketusa.com/news/702497/victor-wembanyama-poste-terrain-spurs/
and many others....
still, i'm with you on this one. i think he will have to play closer to the basket to be the best version of himself. and from what i hear and see from Victor, i don't think that it will be an easy choice and path for him. He really seems to like playing like a taller Durant.....
a lot of player can do what he does behind the 3 pts line, and way better (even if none of them are seven footer but who cares when it comes to win games and titles?). Even factoring the fact that he's only 19 and will improve a lot.
what he does and is able to do in the paint and even from mid range ?..... well, that's another story there. he can change any game there.
by the way, Vincent Collet, his former coach and french NT coach, said several times that Victor shouldn't feel the need to take many 3's each game and play closer to the basket.
Those quotes are from the interview that was posted hundreds of times here, where he said he "doesn't want to be put in a box", not that he doesn't want to play center.
DAF86
11-15-2023, 11:46 AM
from a CBS article:
Victor Wembanyama prefers not to play center
Off these quotes.
As early as the age of 15, he expected to be the focal point of his offense.
Center is not his preferred position.
Those two notions were summed up by Wembanyama himself in a single quote. "I had literally zero responsibility. I never had the ball, even at practice. The coach played me at center," Wembanyama said of a 2019 showcase he played in. "I was really frustrated even coming to the game. I knew it wasn't going to go well. So it didn't go well."
Same as above.
DAF86
11-15-2023, 11:48 AM
Yes he did say he isn't a center.
“I’m not a center even though I can play that position, and I have,” Wembanyama said in the post-game presser after the Spurs' preseason game against the Golden State Warriors.
“But, who knows? I don’t like considering me in a certain position as much. I think you've seen in the preseason I've been the screen-setter and the ball-handler as often.”
That sounds exactly to the opposite to "I don't want to play center", tbh. :lol
I don't know if Wemby prefers to play center or not, but in any case it will be just like with Duncan, who also didn't want to say he was a center, but he always was, even when Robinson was on the team.
Those quotes are from the interview that was posted hundreds of times here, where he said he "doesn't want to be put in a box", not that he doesn't want to play center.
If he wanted to be playing center, he would be playing center. I don't think he could tell Pop he wanted to play PG and get what we wanted, but he has the skills to be a PF or C and from everything that I've read, he wants to play C. Did he hold a press conference to announce the position he wants to play? No, but Givony is one of the most connected NBA scouts, and especially overseas. I trust what he says. And the converse is also true, where has he said he wants to play center?
Again, I don't disagree that his defensive talents would be maximized at center. Offensively, his skill set is more power forward in my opinion.
The Truth #6
11-15-2023, 12:44 PM
Man, you're really pushing this idea hard. It's fascinating to watch.
So you think Pop is holding Wemby back from playing center? He's letting Wemby do whatever he wants and Wemby is actively avoiding playing like a classic center. I think that's our answer right now. Forcing him to play a position that he's not naturally gravitating towards sounds just as bad or not worse than the situation we're already in. Now, having the rest of the team set up plays for him is a different situation to take advantage of his height. I get that. For right now, in no ways he is a classic center. He's horrible at boxing out with his technique. He's horrible at setting screens with his technique. He's horrible at establishing position down low. He's horrible at post moves so to speak other than doing fade away turn arounds, though last night he did show a few shots down low, though they did mostly miss.
DAF86
11-15-2023, 01:05 PM
If he wanted to be playing center, he would be playing center. I don't think he could tell Pop he wanted to play PG and get what we wanted, but he has the skills to be a PF or C and from everything that I've read, he wants to play C. Did he hold a press conference to announce the position he wants to play? No, but Givony is one of the most connected NBA scouts, and especially overseas. I trust what he says. And the converse is also true, where has he said he wants to play center?
I never said he wants to play center, I'm just saying that's what he is.
Again, I don't disagree that his defensive talents would be maximized at center. Offensively, his skill set is more power forward in my opinion.
Actually, it's the other way around for me. Maybe in the former NBA he could have fit better as a PF in offense. In today's NBA where every team plays 4 perimeter guys and 1 bigman in the middle, Wemby is best suited on that role as that guy roaming freely through the middle and closer to the basket, while having perimeter touches from time to time, so that he doesn't feel as if he's been "put in a box".
While on defense, I can deal with him being on the other's team worst offensive player just waiting on the wing to provide weak side help.
DAF86
11-15-2023, 01:13 PM
Man, you're really pushing this idea hard. It's fascinating to watch.
So you think Pop is holding Wemby back from playing center? He's letting Wemby do whatever he wants and Wemby is actively avoiding playing like a classic center. I think that's our answer right now. Forcing him to play a position that he's not naturally gravitating towards sounds just as bad or not worse than the situation we're already in. Now, having the rest of the team set up plays for him is a different situation to take advantage of his height. I get that. For right now, in no ways he is a classic center. He's horrible at boxing out with his technique. He's horrible at setting screens with his technique. He's horrible at establishing position down low. He's horrible at post moves so to speak other than doing fade away turn arounds, though last night he did show a few shots down low, though they did mostly miss.
It will be even more fascinating when Wemby inevitably ends up as the center and yall have me here gloating on my superior basketball (and just in general) IQ.
https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/591/928/94f.png
tim_duncan_fan
11-15-2023, 01:27 PM
He has not shown the perimeter dribble ability to do ball-dominant guard stuff. People seem to be avoiding this elephant.
That's not to say he won't ever be doing that stuff, but just a current observation.
The Truth #6
11-15-2023, 01:31 PM
Honestly, he's sort of stuck in no man's land to some degree. He doesn't have to strength to establish position down low consistently. He doesn't have the ability to dribble without getting stripped out on the perimeter consistently. Don't get me wrong. He can do both those things in situations and do it extremely well and look amazing, but he sort of stuck in the middle as far as I can tell, and so I do think that relates to challenges in how the other teammates try to get him the ball.
The Truth #6
11-15-2023, 01:32 PM
It will be even more fascinating when Wemby inevitably ends up as the center and yall have me here gloating on my superior basketball (and just in general) IQ.
https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/591/928/94f.png
He's really tall. Play him at center. Seems like that's the analysis.
baseline bum
11-15-2023, 01:36 PM
First order of business to correct this cluster-fuck of a team is to teach entry passes and sky hooks, and we all know who on the team needs to learn what.
Get that KAT mentality out of here.
I don't think the sky hook would be that great for Wemby right now. He's not going to be able to drag Lanier and Walton up and down the court 48 minutes like Kareem. Not at this point when he can't fight for and get the position on the block Kareem did to make that sky hook such an effective and high percentage weapon. I would love to see him working on it as a tool to add long term but until he has the strength to not get pushed off his spots it's not going to be too useful IMO.
baseline bum
11-15-2023, 01:43 PM
Only because of this overblown idea that if they play Wemby at center, he would explode into a million pieces.
Think it's more of a case of Wemby being pushed around too easily right now. By the time he's 22, maybe 23, and his body has filled out I fully expect him to be center. Ugh it's too bad this is an Olympic year because otherwise I'd be hopeful he could add another 20 lbs of muscle next offseason like he did this summer.
Vince Carter's ankle
11-15-2023, 01:49 PM
Honestly, he's sort of stuck in no man's land to some degree. He doesn't have to strength to establish position down low consistently. He doesn't have the ability to dribble without getting stripped out on the perimeter consistently. Don't get me wrong. He can do both those things in situations and do it extremely well and look amazing, but he sort of stuck in the middle as far as I can tell, and so I do think that relates to challenges in how the other teammates try to get him the ball.
unusual tweener
DAF86
11-15-2023, 03:53 PM
He's really tall. Play him at center. Seems like that's the analysis.
Well, then you haven't actually been paying attention to the thread, tbh.
Sugus
11-16-2023, 02:41 PM
If you want to win then changes, big changes or trades are in order, or you are a bitch ass and are okay with losing and you are an NBA cuck.
:lmao this forum has the weirdest fucking takes on everything, and they're all weirdly homoerotic
You would've thought tanking for a generational prospect literally last year would've changed people's mind, but I guess old dogs never really learn new tricks.
Sugus
11-16-2023, 02:43 PM
Didn't Wemby say he isn't a center. Wembanyama prefers not to play center.
Yes, at this point the discussion really is "he's 7'4'' so he's a center" VS Wemby dribbling into pull-up 3's on every game.
He plays like he reads this thread and actively tries to prove DAFfy wrong :lol
DAF86
11-16-2023, 03:12 PM
Yes, at this point the discussion really is "he's 7'4'' so he's a center" VS Wemby dribbling into pull-up 3's on every game.
He plays like he reads this thread and actively tries to prove DAFfy wrong :lol
The problem is that he's actually proving me right with his turnovers and awful jumpshooting %. :lol
DAF86
11-16-2023, 03:18 PM
But for real now, Wemby does establish position early and asks for the ball downlow plenty of times. We just don't have good passers on the team.
DAF86
11-16-2023, 03:22 PM
And all the times he takes ill adviced threes or tries to become Iverson, is because of frustration of not getting the ball for long stretches, and since he's standing on the perimeter 90% of the time by design, there's nothing else he can do.
I think many of us watched the French playoffs, Wemby didn't use to take so many low % shots.
TD 21
11-16-2023, 04:52 PM
We're into season 9 of this era and not once have they had a roster comprised of their best players being able to adequately space the floor and in the past half decade, defend either.
paperboy77
11-16-2023, 08:09 PM
:lmao this forum has the weirdest fucking takes on everything, and they're all weirdly homoerotic
You would've thought tanking for a generational prospect literally last year would've changed people's mind, but I guess old dogs never really learn new tricks.
Wacky perspective as usual. This guy is probably a flat earther supporter.
RC_Drunkford
11-16-2023, 10:11 PM
We're into season 9 of this era and not once have they had a roster comprised of their best players being able to adequately space the floor and in the past half decade, defend either.
there‘s only one solution to this: the old man has to go
rankingtear
11-17-2023, 04:06 AM
He just can't be a pure finisher and expect to be a superstar. Dependent players don't carry their teams to titles.
ambchang
11-17-2023, 11:45 AM
I’ve always on the camp of wemby being a giant Garnett instead of KD. He’s great at certain perimeter skills for someone his size but not for an nba player. He can dribble but he’s not Kyrie Irving, he can shoot jumpers but he’s not curry. But he is wash above average for someone who’s a seven footer and he should use that to his advantage. The way to do it though is to do it in doses rather than doing it exclusively for long stretches in the game.
Garnett became very good at it over time in terms of when to post up, when to be a passer at the high post, when to go midrange and when to drive, but more importantly when NOT to do them, based on what the matchups are and what the schemes are for both teams. It is unreasonable to expect a 19 year old rookie to figure this out against high level nba players. That job falls squarely on the coaching staff.
I’m a huge supporter of PATFO and grateful for what they’ve done over the years for us fans but man this season is hard to watch. It’s depressing.
itzsoweezee
11-17-2023, 01:58 PM
Becuase Pop for some reason won't do it. The earlier, the most amount of people realize where Wemby's strengths are, the better, tbh.
He’d foul out in 15 minutes playing center. Also, he doesn’t want to play center.
DAF86
11-17-2023, 02:41 PM
He just can't be a pure finisher and expect to be a superstar. Dependent players don't carry their teams to titles.
Shaq says hi.
Sugus
11-17-2023, 05:48 PM
The problem is that he's actually proving me right with his turnovers and awful jumpshooting %. :lol
No way you're taking percentages for a rookie alien so seriously. The fact that he's even capable, let alone remotely good at these shots, is already insane. When else is he going to get reps getting used to the NBA line and shooting game other than in his NBA rookie season??
Again, no matter where he might be physically best positioned to play, he just doesn't have a center's game. I'm really curious to see how his career pans out, because no doubt I (and you and everyone on this planet...) see the benefit in him playing C to some degree. But he might be more Anthony Davis than we expected, even in that regard.
His shooting stroke is so pure that I can't not want him to shoot it, tbh. He's destined for it.
Sugus
11-17-2023, 05:49 PM
Wacky perspective as usual. This guy is probably a flat earther supporter.
Says the fucking boomer :lmao
DAF86
11-17-2023, 06:20 PM
No way you're taking percentages for a rookie alien so seriously. The fact that he's even capable, let alone remotely good at these shots, is already insane. When else is he going to get reps getting used to the NBA line and shooting game other than in his NBA rookie season??
Again, no matter where he might be physically best positioned to play, he just doesn't have a center's game. I'm really curious to see how his career pans out, because no doubt I (and you and everyone on this planet...) see the benefit in him playing C to some degree. But he might be more Anthony Davis than we expected, even in that regard.
His shooting stroke is so pure that I can't not want him to shoot it, tbh. He's destined for it.
That's what I've been saying since the beggining, that Wemby is more Davis than Durant. I don't know why you are acting as if Davis isn't a center in today's NBA.
Bill_Brasky
11-17-2023, 06:31 PM
That's what I've been saying since the beggining, that Wemby is more Davis than Durant. I don't know why you are acting as if Davis isn't a center in today's NBA.
He could just end up being like a bigger Giannis with a better shot. Giannis wasnt even in Wemby's universe when he was 19.
DAF86
11-17-2023, 06:38 PM
He could just end up being like a bigger Giannis with a better shot. Giannis wasnt even in Wemby's universe when he was 19.
I don't see it. Giannis was always a perimeter player, he played there since he was a kid. He has always had perimeter player handles. Wemby has always been a bigman. He has good handles for a bigman, not for a full-time perimeter player.
rankingtear
11-17-2023, 08:18 PM
Shaq says hi.
I give you that, but Shaq can hold his position for a full shotclock. He is not dependent on 4 chris pauls.
Gagnrath
11-18-2023, 02:13 AM
I’ve always on the camp of wemby being a giant Garnett instead of KD. He’s great at certain perimeter skills for someone his size but not for an nba player. He can dribble but he’s not Kyrie Irving, he can shoot jumpers but he’s not curry. But he is wash above average for someone who’s a seven footer and he should use that to his advantage. The way to do it though is to do it in doses rather than doing it exclusively for long stretches in the game.
Garnett became very good at it over time in terms of when to post up, when to be a passer at the high post, when to go midrange and when to drive, but more importantly when NOT to do them, based on what the matchups are and what the schemes are for both teams. It is unreasonable to expect a 19 year old rookie to figure this out against high level nba players. That job falls squarely on the coaching staff.
I’m a huge supporter of PATFO and grateful for what they’ve done over the years for us fans but man this season is hard to watch. It’s depressing.
seems like there was a fairly dependent player named Shaq who went to get a title with a couple of teams. I suppose that it could have just been Kobe and Wade that were responsible for those though.
polandprzem
11-19-2023, 03:09 AM
He can't play much inside when he is pushed off by likes of Fox
Dude is super weak what I have been saying. He might act tough but without actual strength he willbe unable to stabilize positions inside
objective
11-19-2023, 04:18 AM
He may not be strong but he definitely deters players from even trying shots at the rim when he's around
Unlike Collins who gets eaten alive and there's zero fear of him doing anything. He gets manhandled and treated like trash so he acts out and yet no opponent cares about his antics
This team would be better off with Collins or better yet Barlow hanging out as the help guy on the perimeter where maybe their length will do some good. Because Collins at the rim is a disaster.
tbdog
11-19-2023, 05:55 AM
He may not be strong but he definitely deters players from even trying shots at the rim when he's around
Unlike Collins who gets eaten alive and there's zero fear of him doing anything. He gets manhandled and treated like trash so he acts out and yet no opponent cares about his antics
This team would be better off with Collins or better yet Barlow hanging out as the help guy on the perimeter where maybe their length will do some good. Because Collins at the rim is a disaster.
Teams usually can dictate where they want the opposition to be on the court.
Kawhi_6rings
11-19-2023, 08:58 AM
wemby can't even made 10feet jumper
DAF86
11-19-2023, 10:42 AM
wemby can't even made 10feet jumper
Butter smooth, tbh.
Kawhi_6rings
11-19-2023, 01:33 PM
BRICK AND SHORT..........
JeffDuncan
11-19-2023, 01:44 PM
BRICK AND SHORT..........
A fine pair of accountants.
spurraider21
12-08-2023, 06:52 PM
He’s starting at center today.
sochan, branham, Vassell, keldon, wemby starting
Robz4000
12-08-2023, 06:55 PM
He’s starting at center today.
sochan, branham, Vassell, keldon, wemby starting
Step in the right direction :tu
spurraider21
12-08-2023, 06:57 PM
Step in the right direction :tu
Just had to start tre instead of branham…
Robz4000
12-08-2023, 06:58 PM
Just had to start tre instead of branham…
Can't expect too much from Pop sadly
scott
12-08-2023, 07:12 PM
He’s starting at center today.
sochan, branham, Vassell, keldon, wemby starting
We're getting closer.
DAF86
12-10-2023, 08:24 PM
He’s starting at center today.
sochan, branham, Vassell, keldon, wemby starting
Immediately makes history. :lol
DAF86
12-13-2023, 10:35 PM
It will be even more fascinating when Wemby inevitably ends up as the center and yall have me here gloating on my superior basketball (and just in general) IQ.
https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/591/928/94f.png
3 games as a center and the difference is night and day. He looks like a veteran that plays with a purpose and knows what to do out there, instead of a kid on a playground trying to figure things out. The best thing is that playing as a center doesn't take away from the rest of his game, he can still shoot 3's, bring the ball up and create off the dribble. He's just doing it more efficiently and at his own pace now.
https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/591/928/94f.png
TheGreatYacht
12-13-2023, 10:38 PM
Good call by OP but he’s still Argentinian sadly
3 games as a center and the difference is night and day. He looks like a veteran that plays with a purpose and knows what to do out there, instead of a kid on a playground trying to figure things out. The best thing is that playing as a center doesn't take away from the rest of his game, he can still shoot 3's, bring the ball up and create off the dribble. He's just doing it more efficiently and at his own pace now.
https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/591/928/94f.png
:lol :lol :lol
It’s not hard, is it?
TheChillFactor
12-13-2023, 11:02 PM
https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/001/893/700/a10.jpg
DAF86
01-18-2024, 04:56 PM
Great video explaining how Wemby improved with his move to center.
s0disDJ1AYg?si=eD1mvMV-1b3fGJ62
Thinking having Wemby doing crossovers in the perimeter and shooting tough fadeaways was the way to go. :lol
spurraider21
01-18-2024, 05:04 PM
gotta give DAF86 his props on this one
spurraider21
01-18-2024, 05:37 PM
also, the simulation is real
this video also came out within the last day :lol... near identical title
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9TQv3hOpkHk
i mean it's always been a case of his endurance and whether he can be a full time center. He could hit a new rookie wall or become fatigued. If wemby is this good and won't fade then all power to him. But it was a known question in the off season whether he'd stand up to the grind.
spurraider21
01-18-2024, 06:11 PM
i mean it's always been a case of his endurance and whether he can be a full time center. He could hit a new rookie wall or become fatigued. If wemby is this good and won't fade then all power to him. But it was a known question in the off season whether he'd stand up to the grind.
one of the easier ways for him to help endurance wise, aside from just naturally growing into his body, is to make his jump shot a more consistent weapon. not having to dive toward the rim and soar for a dunk on every possession, or put some post moves, spin, hang before shooting, will help. if he can take a couple of possessions "off" while still being a scoring threat, would go a long way toward preserving him. right now, his jumper isnt good enough to support that.
another thought is that maybe his best usage will be high intensity bursts... so while im not suggesting staying at a 24-25 minute limit, maybe he should mostly be playing around 30-31 minutes where he can feel free to expend more energy and be active without worrying about getting gassed. jokic/embiid are very high usage guys that usually play around 33 minutes. OTOH anthony davis pushes 35-37 minutes per game most years
that does mean we need capable backups to hold the fort though. hell, lends credence to the idea of drafting Sarr, not necessarily with the intention of a 2-big lineup (didnt work with wemby at the 4, and sarr is less capable a perimeter player than he is), but to both keep them fresh and flying around, basically having one of them on the floor at all times
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.5 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions Inc. All rights reserved.