Can we make the Play-In Tournament?!

[TrainOfThought5]

How optimistic are you about us this year?? Is the Play In realistic?!

[exstatic]

Yes.

[SPURt]

They definitely can, just like every NBA team. Will they? They’ll probably get to the play in tournament, assuming Wemby plays regularly and up to his hype.

[stnick2261]

I'm optimistic that Wemby can make the playoffs in every season of his career.

[Mr. Body]

If they fix the defense they can straight up make the playoffs.

[offset formation]

Yes. If there aren't significant injuries to key pieces that keep people out for long stretches. Specifically Vassell, Wembanyama, Sochan.

If not, were the same non playoff team with the bottom 2 worst record.

[Chucho]

I don't see a reason why they shouldn't make the playoffs. I think too many people really think too little of what we got.

[offset formation]

I don't see a reason why they shouldn't make the playoffs. I think too many people really think too little of what we got.

You're aware we were 22-60 last year pretty much with all those same players returning. Now we absolutely tanked a bit and had some injuries, but you are what your record says you are within a few spots, at least. We sucked, sometimes purposefully, but we sucked. Our defense literally was the worst on NBA history.

Imagine a stretch where Wemby cannot play and our defense presumably reverts back to all-time suckage?

I think I can imagine several reasons why people might think little of what we got, and why we might not be playoff bound. In fact, I can easily envision a scenario where we are once again picking well inside the lottery, equally as well as I can see us sneaking into a play-in spot.

[cd98]

Spurs are going to lose a lot of games. They will get another lottery pick this year. But they will still be fun to watch. Wemby is too young and raw to duplicate what Tim Duncan and David Robinson did to turn around the Spurs and also both had more experienced teammates than Wemby. I'll be content if he plays 68+ games and averages double digit points and close to that in rebounds and is top 4 in the league in blocks.

[JPB]

That means you need at least 5 teams behind you... Will there be 5 teams worse than the spurs next year? Hard to say with the tanking game, like Dallas deliberately missing the play in last year, a tanking game we may participate in next year too at the end of the season. If somehow (long shot) spurs are in the fight for a top 6-8 spot, I believe they' ll be all in. Would they try their best for a 9th or 10th spot? I'm not sure.

[John B]

Zach in his interview, thinks if the Spurs improve their defense to top 15-20, they’re a playoff team. I think he knows than anybody here. This is Pop’s team. If anything, they will be a better defensive team. They have the personnel to be one. Wemby’s presence alone will block and alter a lot of shots.

[TD 21]

NBA In Tiers '23-'24 (spurstalk.com) (https://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=302318)

The Spurs had a 22-60 record, but performed like that of a 18-64 team. Yes, they "tanked" and the collective youth might improve, but a lot of bad teams can say the same.

[Seventyniner]

I think the Spurs can make a credible run for the play-in but it's an uphill battle. Top 6 is basically out of the question.

[The Truth #6]

It takes hard work from coaches to lose enough to be bottom 3. It's a concerted effort. A bad team with a coach that actually tries should have a decent chance at the play-in.

[td4mvp2k]

i dont expect wemby to play over 70 games but they should have a shot.. this roster is better than it was a few yrs ago when they made it.

[Mr. Body]

I'm not sure where this idea that they'll be a shitty team again comes from. Even without Wembanyama, if they played out of tank mode they'd be pushing 30 wins. With Wembanyama? Could be another ten wins. There's just this ESPN-driven pessimism about the team that's unfounded. A lot of that stems from this bizarre decision to discount Victor Wembanyama as a player. For some reason y'all think he's gonna suck.

Beyond this... Take a look at the WC. There's also this idea that it's stacked.

Denver won the west with only 53 wins, historically a very weak number for a supposedly elite team.
Memphis was second. They will miss Ja Morant for 25 games and were shakier overall than they were the year before.
Sacramento was third. They look up-and-coming, but hardly worldbeaters.

Phoenix, LA Clippers, LA Lakers, Golden State, all are on the verge of collapse largely due to age. The Suns are paper tigers with no depth. None of the others scared anybody and they're all weaker and getting worse by the day.

Minnesota looks like they're plateauing.

New Orleans is trouble with a fit and active Zion, but that's a huge question mark. Their parts aren't fitting as well together as they hoped, but maybe a bounce-back year.

Dallas is a glass cannon; they can blow you away but are very fragile.

Utah played well above expectations. Can they keep it up?

Only OKC Thunder look to make a major move up, in my mind. They should be top 3 in the west along with Sacramento. The rest? Who do you actually believe in among this lot?

I mark a much lower probability of winning ~22 games for the Spurs than I do ~40.

[JPB]

Interesting ESPN article about the spurs exactly to the convo:

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/38431502/victor-wembanyama-spurs-future-playoff-chances

[JPB]

Full article:

Don't expect an instant turnaround for Victor Wembanyama and the Spurs

Andrew Lopez
Kevin Pelton
Sep 19, 2023, 07:00 AM E

The San Antonio Spurs have been here before.

In 1987, after finishing 28-54, they won the draft lottery and the right to select David Robinson, a 7-foot-1 generational big man out of Navy.

A decade later, following a 20-62 season, they again won the draft lottery and the right to select Tim Duncan, a 6-foot-11 generational big man out of Wake Forest .

Two picks, two Hall of Famers, five NBA championships.

Robinson didn't make his NBA debut until 1989 because of his two-year service requirement with the Navy. The Spurs went 21-61 the season before Robinson's arrival. Led by Robinson, fellow rookie Sean Elliott -- the No. 3 pick in the 1989 draft -- and then-coach Larry Brown, the Spurs jumped to 56 wins in 1988-89, finishing second in the Western Conference and reaching the second round of the playoffs.

Duncan joined a Spurs team that had won at least 55 games in three consecutive seasons before plummeting to 20 wins in 1996-97, when Robinson missed most of the season with a back injury. With a healthy Robinson and Duncan and with Gregg Popovich in his first full season as head coach, the 1997-98 Spurs won 56 games and reached the second round of the playoffs.

Both Robinson and Duncan were All-Stars and named Rookie of the Year in their respective debut seasons -- with Robinson averaging 24.3 points, 12.0 rebounds and 3.9 blocks and Duncan putting up 21.1 points, 11.9 rebounds and 2.5 blocks.

Now Victor Wembanyama, a 7-foot-3½ generational big man out of France, comes to San Antonio on the heels of a 22-60 campaign as the No. 1 pick in the 2023 draft, bringing with him lofty expectations heightened by the perfect circumstances of the Spurs' two previous No. 1 overall picks. Robinson and Duncan each led one of the three biggest turnarounds in NBA history (2007-08 Boston Celtics, +42 wins after acquiring Kevin Garnett and Ray Allen; 1997-98 Spurs, +36 wins in Duncan's first season; 1989-90 Spurs, +35 wins in David Robinson first season). So pencil Wembanyama in for an All-Star trip to Indianapolis in February, a Wilt Chamberlain Trophy as Rookie of the Year and a Spurs trip to the second round of the playoffs, right?

It's not that simple -- and neither Wembanyama nor the Spurs is expecting to match that kind of immediate success.

"Not [skipping] any steps for me makes sense because it's easy to make that mistake," Wembanyama told reporters on draft night. "I'm glad I got people around me that can help me not make that mistake."

Why the Spurs won't contend for the playoffs this season ...

Despite adding Wembanyama, the Spurs did little to upgrade their roster beyond that this summer. As a result, San Antonio has the lowest wins forecast of any team in preliminary projections for the upcoming 2023-24 campaign, an average expectation of 25.9 wins.

Although it might seem shocking for the Spurs to add Wembanyama and improve by fewer than four wins over their 22 from last season, it's worth noting that San Antonio actually performed much worse in 2022-23 than the team's record indicated. The Spurs were outscored by 10.1 points per game, far worse than the Detroit Pistons (minus-8.2 points per game), who finished with the league's worst record at 17-65.

In fact, San Antonio's 22 wins were tied with the 2020-21 Oklahoma City Thunder for the most in NBA history by a team outscored by double digits on average. Before the Thunder, only the 1990-91 Denver Nuggets had even reached 20 wins while getting outscored so badly.

If we treat the Spurs as an 18-win team (their expected record last year) rather than a 22-win team (their actual record), they are projected to improve by about eight wins. San Antonio used its salary cap space to facilitate three-team trades, taking back expiring contracts for wings Reggie Bullock and Cedi Osman, who are useful but won't likely play ahead of incumbent starters Keldon Johnson and Devin Vassell.

Meanwhile, the Spurs didn't do anything to improve their biggest weakness: point guard depth. San Antonio was outscored by 11.8 points per 100 possessions with starter Tre Jones on the bench, according to NBA Advanced Stats, and went 2-14 in the 16 games Jones didn't play. Yet the Spurs chose to waive veteran point guard Cameron Payne after acquiring him from the Phoenix Suns in another deal that saved another team money, leaving combo guard Devonte' Graham and natural shooting guard Blake Wesley as the backups.

Of course, there's a logic to this. Between Wembanyama and three players drafted in the first round in 2022 (Wesley, Jeremy Sochan and Malaki Branham), San Antonio is building around four players who are 20 or younger. Weighted by subjective projections for minutes played, the Spurs have the NBA's youngest projected rotation.

The benefit will likely be another lottery pick to go along with Wembanyama and Sochan, the No. 9 overall pick in 2022. And San Antonio has plenty more tools to upgrade the roster looking forward. Including team options, the Spurs have 10 players under contract next season with a total of around $80 million in salary, giving San Antonio the ability to extend the contract of wing Devin Vassell ahead of restricted free agency and still have max-plus cap space.

Down the road, as the Spurs start to see their own draft picks come later in the first round, they'll have more coming from other teams. Although some picks are protected in a way that they might not convey, San Antonio has collected five extra first-round picks via trade along with swap rights in 2026 (Atlanta Hawks), 2028 (Boston, so long as the Celtics don't have the top overall pick) and 2030 (Dallas Mavericks).

The 2030 swap, in particular, acquired from the Mavs to take Bullock's contract as part of a sign-and-trade for Grant Williams, symbolizes the Spurs' apparent patience. It's possible that swap could ultimately amount to nothing, but San Antonio timed it for after Luka Doncic's current contract ends and just as Wembanyama -- who will be 26 in 2030 -- should be reaching his peak.

... and why that's all part of the plan

Because he spent four years playing college basketball then two more years in the Navy, Robinson was 24 years and 90 days old when he debuted in the NBA. Duncan was 21 years and 189 days old after spending four years at Wake Forest.

Meanwhile, Wembanyama will be 19 years and 294 days old when he makes his debut for a team that will be significantly younger than the ones Robinson and Duncan joined.

Youth will play a pivotal role in why San Antonio is taking a slow and steady approach to improvement.

On draft night, Popovich was asked about managing expectations -- both Wembanyama's and the team's -- heading into the season.

"It's about not skipping steps, which I say often. It's A to B to C to D on a variety of levels. One is O's and X's of the game. The rules are a little bit different, obviously, than FIBA. He'll have to get used to that," Popovich said of Wembanyama on June 22.

"Because of all the hype, he'll have a target on his back. So more than O's and X's to begin with, we'll be most interested in setting a framework in an environment where he's comfortable, where he can be Victor. He's not LeBron [James] or Tim or Kobe [Bryant] or anybody else. He's Victor, and that's who we want him to be."

Like Wembanyama, James was touted as a generational superstar coming into the league in 2003. But James wasn't able to lift the last-place Cleveland Cavaliers into the playoffs until his third season in the league.

In fact, since 2009, only one No. 1 overall pick has made the playoffs: Markelle Fultz with the Philadelphia 76ers in 2017-18 (and Fultz battled injuries that season and played just 14 games for a team that was finally coming out of the Process rebuild). Half of the teams that made the No. 1 pick since 2000 needed at least three seasons to get back to the playoffs.

"I think when we set out on this draft journey a few years ago, we wanted to find pieces that were very versatile that could play with different types of players, different offensive systems and styles and, obviously, a core thing to us and what we do is the unselfishness, the body movement, the ball movement and trying to play an intelligent brand of basketball," Spurs general manager Brian Wright said on draft night. "We think we have a young group of guys that can do that and, obviously, adding a talent like Victor just only adds to that."

While San Antonio competed in both the NBA's California Classic Summer League in Sacramento, California, and the Las Vegas Summer League, Wembanyama did not. With an eye toward the season and getting acclimated, the Spurs kept him in San Antonio to get practice time with players such as Johnson, Sochan and Vassell, who weren't on the summer league squad.

"I feel like to be able to play through an 82-game season, I got to go through a lot of conditioning and level up on the energy level," Wembanyama said from San Antonio on June 30.

When he did get to Las Vegas, Wembanyama played in only two games -- in part because he was coming off a full season that ended just weeks before the draft but also because there were more chances to work out with the teammates he'll be spending more time with on the court in the regular season. It's all part of the slow process that the Spurs and Wembanyama are hoping will pay off in the long run.

"Some players have tried to win the championship, win a ring, for years and haven't made it," Wembanyama told reporters on draft night. "I don't want to be one of those. This is going to be -- my goal is going to be to get closer and closer every time to the ring and to learn how to make it."

[JPB]

I still believe they win more than 30 games at least. They litterally ignored defense last year.

[GAustex]

I don’t roll with Vegas but last time I spoke to a bettor Vegas thinks no

[drpill]

We'll see how it goes. My hunch is we see a season of experimentation, learning, weird lineups, opportunities for some more marginal players to grow. Competing, playing hard, but not really trying to win in the fullest sense. Definitely the return of defense, which with Wemby will mean more wins than last year. But maybe not a lot more, given how useful another high draft pick could be in the long run. When Wemby and Pop talk about not skipping steps, this could be one of the dimensions they're referring to.

[Mr. Body]

Interesting ESPN article about the spurs exactly to the convo:

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/38431502/victor-wembanyama-spurs-future-playoff-chances

ESPN is just clinically full of shit.

[Uriel]

Assuming reasonably good health, at our best, I believe we can win up to 35-40 games. That may be good enough to make the play-in tournament.

[FutureMan]

Well let’s take a look at the past.

In 2021 they made in into the play-in game by winning two games more than the Pelicans. That roster included DeRozan, Murray, White, Aldridge, Johnson, Gay, Walker, & Mills.

In 2022 they barely made the play-in by winning just one game more than the injured Lakers. To get there that team had Murray, Johnson, 2/3 of a season with White, Poeltl, Vassell, Walker, 1/3 season of Richardson, along with McDermott.

This year our rotation, as stands, is Johnson, Vassell, Wembanyama, Sochan, Jones, Collins, TBD, & TBD.

Is is possible? Sure! Is it likely? I don’t think so. Too much would have to “go their way”.

[ambchang]

It will take 1/3 of the season for the coaches to figure out the lineups. This year will be a learning year and I’m thinking 35 wins.

[mo7888]

Yes, we can make the play-in. I think coming down the stretch we'll be in contention for a spot. If we're healthy we'll push for it, but if we're a little dinged up we could mini-tank right at the end to try and get a top 10 pick. I'm hoping we're healthy though.

[KobesAchilles]

I mean we have reasons to be hopeful. Kawhi and PG are made of glass. AD and Lebron are guaranteed injuries. Houston sucks. Minny sucks. Utah sucks. Portland sucks. Zion ate his way out of NO. Ja is out 25 games. Kyrie is back with Dallas. With a hot start, we could win our division.

[LeBowen]

Won 22 games with some of the most disgusting tanking I've ever seen.
Sitting players based on matchups, making sure we lose to other tanking teams etc.

If Spurs actually tried to win last season, would've surely been around 30 wins.
Even without Wemby, everyone is still improving and I'd expect 30-35 wins.

If Wemby lives up to the hype, play-in isn't out of the question.
I'd say 10th to12th seed range is realistic.

But it's still all about development.
Best case scenario would be Wemby living up to the hype and Spurs trading for a disgruntled star before the deadline.

As long as it's an injury-free season, I'll be happy.

[intlspurshk]

Based on the FA signing and trade, there is no intention to try to make playoff. It is still a rebuilding year and to stock up picks or draft in lottery.

[exstatic]

Based on the FA signing and trade, there is no intention to try to make playoff. It is still a rebuilding year and to stock up picks or draft in lottery.

They never said they wouldn't try to make the playoffs. It was a shitty FA year and there was no one really worth investing in, long term. They want to roll with what they have, and see what happens. This thread is just positing that we might be surprised with what that is.

[FutureMan]

It would be awesome for those who are confident the Spurs are definitely going to make the play-in to list the 5 teams that will be worse.

[rascal]

It would be best for one more bad non playoff year to land a potential franchise all star PG in the draft.

[rascal]

They never said they wouldn't try to make the playoffs. It was a shitty FA year and there was no one really worth investing in, long term. They want to roll with what they have, and see what happens. This thread is just positing that we might be surprised with what that is.

Of course they won't be saying that. They didn't upgrade the roster at all outside of Wemby. The Spurs are expected to load manage Wemby's minutes.

San Antonio's 22 wins were tied with the 2020-21 Oklahoma City Thunder for the most in NBA history by a team outscored by double digits on average. Their 22 wins were even more than how they played. They played more like an 18 win team.

[LeBowen]

It would be awesome for those who are confident the Spurs are definitely going to make the play-in to list the 5 teams that will be worse.

Almost every year one or two teams have their season ruined by injuries.
Rockets and Blazers will definitely be worse.
Utah will be on a similar level to the Spurs.
Mavs and NOLA are one more bad season away from a complete meltdown. I'd say that either Zion or Luka will cause massive issues in the upcoming season.

As I said, I don't expect Spurs to make the play-in if Wemby isn't the next bigh thing right away, but there's definitely a chance to get the 10th seed if injuries happen.
Lakers still rely on ancient Lebron and AD who will inevitably get injured.
Clippers are even more injury prone and Warriors just got CP3 on top of all of their stars being at the end of their prime.

[rascal]

Yes, we can make the play-in. I think coming down the stretch we'll be in contention for a spot. If we're healthy we'll push for it, but if we're a little dinged up we could mini-tank right at the end to try and get a top 10 pick. I'm hoping we're healthy though.

I'm hoping for that top 5 draft pick to land that future all star quality PG to pair with Wemby.

People, have a little patience. One more rebuilding year. It's a process to get back on top.
The Spurs even said they are not expecting a one year turn around and are expected to load manage Wemby's minutes.

[rascal]

Almost every year one or two teams have their season ruined by injuries.
Rockets and Blazers will definitely be worse.
Utah will be on a similar level to the Spurs.
Mavs and NOLA are one more bad season away from a complete meltdown. I'd say that either Zion or Luka will cause massive issues in the upcoming season.

As I said, I don't expect Spurs to make the play-in if Wemby isn't the next bigh thing right away, but there's definitely a chance to get the 10th seed if injuries happen.
Lakers still rely on ancient Lebron and AD who will inevitably get injured.
Clippers are even more injury prone and Warriors just got CP3 on top of all of their stars being at the end of their prime.

Houston will be better. They improved their team. Better than the Spurs.

Lakers are better. They were good down the stretch last year.

[Seventyniner]

Of course they won't be saying that. They didn't upgrade the roster at all outside of Wemby. The Spurs are expected to load manage Wemby's minutes.

San Antonio's 22 wins were tied with the 2020-21 Oklahoma City Thunder for the most in NBA history by a team outscored by double digits on average. Their 22 wins were even more than how they played. They played more like an 18 win team.

Pretty much the opposite of the previous season, when the Spurs were tied for the worst record in NBA history by a team with a positive overall point differential.

[Allan Rowe vs Wade]

Hope not

[RC_Drunkford]

I'm absolutely sure we'll be at least an 8th seed this year

[Mr. Body]

It would be awesome for those who are confident the Spurs are definitely going to make the play-in to list the 5 teams that will be worse.

No one is saying anything is definite. That's just poor reading comprehension. There's always a range of possibilities.

Houston
Portland

I would be surprised if they are much good at all.

Minnesota
New Orleans
Memphis (-25 games for Ja)
Dallas

May be mired in mediocrity.

LA Lakers
LA Clippers
Golden State

Are all on the verge of collapse with injuries and age being massive concerns.

If the Spurs push into 40 win territory they'll be better than at least five of those teams. Again, I invite you to look at the actual standings last year. There is not a single team that looks ferocious. The only one I think could be spectacular is the Thunder. Meanwhile, teams are going to have a hard time stopping the Spurs from scoring. If they can get to a mediocre defense, they're going to win games.

[exstatic]

It would be awesome for those who are confident the Spurs are definitely going to make the play-in to list the 5 teams that will be worse.

Who said anything about definite? There are some posters who were "definitely not", but I didn't see anyone who said anything stronger than "if everything breaks right, we could".

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

Bend over. I'll show you how to make the play-in.

[Mitch Cumsteen]

The west is far from great, but it is deep and it appears that the Blazers -- provided they trade Lillard -- will be the only team in the conference actively tanking.

Go down the list:

The Nuggets are obviously defending champs with a core in their prime. They aren't going anywhere.

The Lakers, Clippers, Suns and Warriors are pot committed with aging rosters and championship windows closing. Also, of those four, only the Warriors own their own first round pick in 2024 and that's only if it falls in the top 4. So even injuries won't push any of them into tank mode.

The Grizz, Kings, Mavs, Wolves and Pelicans are mostly young-ish up and coming rosters, but all believe they can compete. All of them have some sort of urgency to win, now, too. The Pels and Grizz are close to being at tipping points with Zion and Ja. The Mavs need to placate Doncic. The Wolves mortgaged their future and need to show something to Edwards. The Kings just made the playoffs for the first time in 100 years and decided to run it back and commit long term to their core. They gotta keep that beam lit.

The Thunder have a really young talented team hoping to take the next step. The Jazz are probably a notch behind the Thunder, but likewise have some talent. Maybe if things head south for them, they start to punt on the season? That leaves the Rockets, who don't own their pick either, so they have zero incentive to tank.

There isn't any question that the Spurs are going to be better than last year, but it may not show up as much in the win column. They are going to have to stay healthy themselves, and then hope for a lot of weird shit to happen to the other teams to make the play-in. Even if Wemby exceeds year one expectations, this is still an extraordinarily young roster that doesn't know how to win and close out games. Some of those lessons just have to be experienced. This is going to be a season for growing pains, I'm afraid.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

The west is far from great, but it is deep and it appears that the Blazers -- provided they trade Lillard -- will be the only team in the conference actively tanking.

Go down the list:

The Nuggets are obviously defending champs with a core in their prime. They aren't going anywhere.

The Lakers, Clippers, Suns and Warriors are pot committed with aging rosters and championship windows closing. Also, of those four, only the Warriors own their own first round pick in 2024 and that's only if it falls in the top 4. So even injuries won't push any of them into tank mode.

The Grizz, Kings, Mavs, Wolves and Pelicans are mostly young-ish up and coming rosters, but all believe they can compete. All of them have some sort of urgency to win, now, too. The Pels and Grizz are close to being at tipping points with Zion and Ja. The Mavs need to placate Doncic. The Wolves mortgaged their future and need to show something to Edwards. The Kings just made the playoffs for the first time in 100 years and decided to run it back and commit long term to their core. They gotta keep that beam lit.

The Thunder have a really young talented team hoping to take the next step. The Jazz are probably a notch behind the Thunder, but likewise have some talent. Maybe if things head south for them, they start to punt on the season? That leaves the Rockets, who don't own their pick either, so they have zero incentive to tank.

There isn't any question that the Spurs are going to be better than last year, but it may not show up as much in the win column. They are going to have to stay healthy themselves, and then hope for a lot of weird shit to happen to the other teams to make the play-in. Even if Wemby exceeds year one expectations, this is still an extraordinarily young roster that doesn't know how to win and close out games. Some of those lessons just have to be experienced. This is going to be a season for growing pains, I'm afraid.

Yeah, the Power Rankings have us as preseason #15 out of 15 teams. We might legitimately beat the Rockets and Blazers in the standings, but the West won't be a cakewalk by any stretch. That said, some teams will be a bust out of the gate, some will have injuries and embrace the tank, etc. Challenging for the 10th spot isn't super hard these days. Can this squad win 35 games and be in the hunt? Probably.

[Joseph Kony]

zero chance imho

[FutureMan]

No one is saying anything is definite. That's just poor reading comprehension. There's always a range of possibilities.

Houston
Portland

I would be surprised if they are much good at all.

Minnesota
New Orleans
Memphis (-25 games for Ja)
Dallas

May be mired in mediocrity.

LA Lakers
LA Clippers
Golden State

Are all on the verge of collapse with injuries and age being massive concerns.

If the Spurs push into 40 win territory they'll be better than at least five of those teams. Again, I invite you to look at the actual standings last year. There is not a single team that looks ferocious. The only one I think could be spectacular is the Thunder. Meanwhile, teams are going to have a hard time stopping the Spurs from scoring. If they can get to a mediocre defense, they're going to win games.


Poor reading comprehension is reading what I wrote and not understanding that it wasn’t directed to anyone. Assuming there isn’t a single poster/reader who doesn’t believe 100% that the Spurs will make the play-in is quite the gamble.

[spurraider21]

i think if all goes to plan we can definitely make the in-season tournament

[JPB]

At the end of the day, it will mostly depend on how dominant Victor will be.

[LeBowen]

Houston will be better. They improved their team. Better than the Spurs.

Lakers are better. They were good down the stretch last year.

Improved their team with what? Inefficent chuckers on top of their young core also being full of chuckers?
It will take Udoka another season to make them look like a team.

I didn't say the Lakers weren't better, I just said their two stars are injury prone. Remember the last three seasons? If one of them goes down, they're in the play-in struggle.

[The Truth #6]

I think it all depends on what Pop want to do and if he wants to half-tank/take it slow/hope they get one more lottery pick, then play-in is less likely. But we'll see. He has to keep Wemby happy so it remains to be seen in my opinion.

[exstatic]

Improved their team with what? Inefficent chuckers on top of their young core also being full of chuckers?
It will take Udoka another season to make them look like a team.

I didn't say the Lakers weren't better, I just said their two stars are injury prone. Remember the last three seasons? If one of them goes down, they're in the play-in struggle.

The thing that will kill both LA teams and the GSW are the new no-rest protocols.

[exstatic]

Poor reading comprehension is reading what I wrote and not understanding that it wasn’t directed to anyone. Assuming there isn’t a single poster/reader who doesn’t believe 100% that the Spurs will make the play-in is quite the gamble.

You're assuming something that has not been shown. The only poster I saw that said anything remotely like what you assumed was RCDrunkford, and he's been known to be sarcastic on occasion.

[exstatic]

Yeah, the Power Rankings have us as preseason #15 out of 15 teams. We might legitimately beat the Rockets and Blazers in the standings, but the West won't be a cakewalk by any stretch. That said, some teams will be a bust out of the gate, some will have injuries and embrace the tank, etc. Challenging for the 10th spot isn't super hard these days. Can this squad win 35 games and be in the hunt? Probably.

That's all most people are saying, that there's a chance.

[buttsR4rebounding]

Yeah, the Power Rankings have us as preseason #15 out of 15 teams. We might legitimately beat the Rockets and Blazers in the standings, but the West won't be a cakewalk by any stretch. That said, some teams will be a bust out of the gate, some will have injuries and embrace the tank, etc. Challenging for the 10th spot isn't super hard these days. Can this squad win 35 games and be in the hunt? Probably.

Portland will be tanking out of the gate. Houston will be much improved. They have some talent and with Ime coaching he will get them playing defense. Also they won't be sitting their best players in the 4th quarter of close games this year. I see the top 3 teams being New Orleans, Denver and Phoenix. Zion will be healthy this year and be in the MVP conversation. I expect him to be top 3 in the voting. The next tier I see is Memphis, Sactown, GS, and lakers. Battling for Play In Clips, OKC, Dallas and Houston. Bringing up the rear Utah, SA and Portland. No one will win 60 games or lose 60 games in the West this year.

[Mr. Body]

Houston - getting rid of KPJ is a major boost. It looks like a team that still makes no sense. Giving the ball to FVV is better than Jalen Green. They're both inefficient but at least one will pass the ball. There's a lot of faith that Udoka is actually a good coach, and the only time he coached was an already established team. It's hard to believe they will be truly competitive much less buy into team much less defensive principles.

New Orleans - they were bad without Zion and he has major issues. Just dunno with them. The tall skinny stoner SF, forget his name, he ain't the guy. Even if Zoin was serious about basketball, he'll get hurt again. I think their window has already closed.

Phoenix - they got destroyed the last two playoffs and I don't see that changing. Durant is a negative asset as a leader, and Beale has been overrated for a very, very long time. They actually won the summer imo due to the cheap pick-ups they got. They could make noise. Ultimately I don't believe in their stars, but then the whole West stinks.

Memphis - already a team on the down ramp from their glory two years ago and Ja is a major headache now. Seem to have real chemistry problems, or something, although getting rid of Brooks will help. They're not surprising teams anymore and could easily fail to make the PO without Morant.

Minnesota - hard to tell with them. Will Edwards live up to his promise? They need to move on from KAT but don't know if they will. The roster is teetering on actually not that great.

Clippers - will just be wrecked by injuries again.

Lakers - supposedly won the summer, but I don't see why. They retained who they should have retained and picked up... Mo Bamba? As always this team depends on Anthony Davis giving a shit and not playing like a ninny. If he just settles for being the fourth best player, they're going to struggle with mediocrity like always. It all depends on how LeBron's illegal drug regimin holds out.

Warriors - The CP acquisition will boost them but they were very much a team in decay. The team that won two years ago was imo the worst championship team we've seen in decades. Can Paul replace the decline in Thompson and Draymond? I don't think so.

[LeBowen]

The thing that will kill both LA teams and the GSW are the new no-rest protocols.

Good point, I completely forgot about that.

Lakers, Clippers, Warriors and Suns are all close to their expiry date.
I'd say that at least two of those rosters are about to have their last attempt to win a(nother) ring.
Odds of all four staying healthy this season are really low, imo.

Mavs, NOLA and even Memphis have internal issues. Kings and Wolves ceiling is too low to win it all.

We just need to be patient for one more season. Then in two years West will be completely different.

[exstatic]

Portland will be tanking out of the gate. Houston will be much improved. They have some talent and with Ime coaching he will get them playing defense. Also they won't be sitting their best players in the 4th quarter of close games this year. I see the top 3 teams being New Orleans, Denver and Phoenix. Zion will be healthy this year and be in the MVP conversation. I expect him to be top 3 in the voting. The next tier I see is Memphis, Sactown, GS, and lakers. Battling for Play In Clips, OKC, Dallas and Houston. Bringing up the rear Utah, SA and Portland. No one will win 60 games or lose 60 games in the West this year.

We're going to have to disagree on this one. He has never, and likely will never be either of those things.

Lakers, Clips and GS will struggle with the new no-rest protocols.

[Mr. Body]

Good point, I completely forgot about that.

Lakers, Clippers, Warriors and Suns are all close to their expiry date.
I'd say that at least two of those rosters are about to have their last attempt to win a(nother) ring.
Odds of all four staying healthy this season are really low, imo.

Mavs, NOLA and even Memphis have internal issues. Kings and Wolves ceiling is too low to win it all.

We just need to be patient for one more season. Then in two years West will be completely different.

People (and the press) get excited that the Lakers made the WCF but somebody had to. Dallas got there the year before. Both teams got absolutely destroyed by the eventual WC winner.

Of Phoenix, Clips, Lakers, Warriors, it's the Warriors who will remain the threat here and they almost lost out to an inexperienced Sacramento team before losing to a mediocre Lakers team.

Not saying the Spurs definitely make the play-in, but this is hardly a murderer's row of teams out there. In two years, all these teams are going to be in full rebuild and it may happen sooner than they think.

[FutureMan]

You're assuming something that has not been shown. The only poster I saw that said anything remotely like what you assumed was RCDrunkford, and he's been known to be sarcastic on occasion.

The reason I made the post was to see if someone is willing to commit and come forward. It wasn’t for anyone in particular. Seems doubtful they would now :lol

I have no problem with clarifying a post like we’re doing right now. Maybe when the seasons begins and the roster is fully set someone should make a poll.

[spurraider21]

People (and the press) get excited that the Lakers made the WCF but somebody had to. Dallas got there the year before. Both teams got absolutely destroyed by the eventual WC winner.

Of Phoenix, Clips, Lakers, Warriors, it's the Warriors who will remain the threat here and they almost lost out to an inexperienced Sacramento team before losing to a mediocre Lakers team.

Not saying the Spurs definitely make the play-in, but this is hardly a murderer's row of teams out there. In two years, all these teams are going to be in full rebuild and it may happen sooner than they think.
The lakers will always be a threat as long as they have reaves

[exstatic]

The lakers will always be a threat as long as they have reaves

Italy shut him down, so maybe not so much.

[JPB]

Good point, I completely forgot about that.

Lakers, Clippers, Warriors and Suns are all close to their expiry date.
I'd say that at least two of those rosters are about to have their last attempt to win a(nother) ring.
Odds of all four staying healthy this season are really low, imo.

Mavs, NOLA and even Memphis have internal issues. Kings and Wolves ceiling is too low to win it all.

We just need to be patient for one more season. Then in two years West will be completely different.

that's really a good point, the configuration of the West could allow a Wemby lead spurs team to be a force in 2-3 years already. Remains to be seen how durable Jokic is. Looks like he could ball in his 50s the way he plays but not sure his diet would agree.

[TD 21]

Ludicrous commentary in this thread. These teams are seemingly being analyzed in relation to championship likelihood, as opposed to whether they can be clearly better than a team that was terrible last season, with no reason to expect them be more anything more than incrementally better (at least standings wise) this one.

Presuming relative health, they only even have a chance of being better than, in order, the Trail Blazers, Rockets, Jazz.


I didn't say the Lakers weren't better, I just said their two stars are injury prone. Remember the last three seasons? If one of them goes down, they're in the play-in struggle.

This is a much better team, one that should be capable of surviving without Davis or James for a decent amount of time.

[LeBowen]

This is a much better team, one that should be capable of surviving without Davis or James for a decent amount of time.

Lakers without Lebron last season: 13-14.
8-18 two seasons ago, 12-15 three seasons ago.

Lakers without AD last season: 12-14.
16-26 two seasons ago, 19-17 three seasons ago.

No matter what mainstream media wants you to believe, without one of their two stars they're not even a .500 team.
As already said, they made WCF because noone else was good enough.
Current versions of both Lakers and Warriors are severely overrated.
Warriors also had losing record when one of their stars got hurt.
You think that additions of Gabe Vincent, Taurean Prince and Christian Wood are good enough to keep them afloat if Lebron or AD go down?

Just to be clear, current Spurs are still a long way from playoff picture, I'm just saying that those teams are old and injury prone.
Them being at full strength all season long isn't a given.

[Fireball]

I don't think so ... 32 wins ...

[buttsR4rebounding]

We're going to have to disagree on this one. He has never, and likely will never be either of those things.

Lakers, Clips and GS will struggle with the new no-rest protocols.

I've read that Zion stayed in New Orleans almost the entire off season. He is in the best shape of his life and is lighter than he has ever been in the NBA. Sure, he may still get injured, but I believe he has finally taken everything seriously and is really working toward staying on the court which I don't believe was ever a priority for him in the past.

[TD 21]

Lakers without Lebron last season: 13-14.
8-18 two seasons ago, 12-15 three seasons ago.

Lakers without AD last season: 12-14.
16-26 two seasons ago, 19-17 three seasons ago.

No matter what mainstream media wants you to believe, without one of their two stars they're not even a .500 team.
As already said, they made WCF because noone else was good enough.
Current versions of both Lakers and Warriors are severely overrated.
Warriors also had losing record when one of their stars got hurt.
You think that additions of Gabe Vincent, Taurean Prince and Christian Wood are good enough to keep them afloat if Lebron or AD go down?

Just to be clear, current Spurs are still a long way from playoff picture, I'm just saying that those teams are old and injury prone.
Them being at full strength all season long isn't a given.

Largely irrelevant when the team changed significantly at the trade deadline and to a lesser extent the off season.

They morphed into essentially an ensemble cast offensively (which is what they need to be with an ancient James). Davis would be a bigger blow, because he props up their defense and they've always been much better on that end in this era.

Still, they should have enough to survive 15-20 games without either and be easily better than the Spurs even if it's more (within' reason).

[rascal]

Lakers without Lebron last season: 13-14.
8-18 two seasons ago, 12-15 three seasons ago.

Lakers without AD last season: 12-14.
16-26 two seasons ago, 19-17 three seasons ago.

No matter what mainstream media wants you to believe, without one of their two stars they're not even a .500 team.
As already said, they made WCF because noone else was good enough.
Current versions of both Lakers and Warriors are severely overrated.
Warriors also had losing record when one of their stars got hurt.
You think that additions of Gabe Vincent, Taurean Prince and Christian Wood are good enough to keep them afloat if Lebron or AD go down?

Just to be clear, current Spurs are still a long way from playoff picture, I'm just saying that those teams are old and injury prone.
Them being at full strength all season long isn't a given.

Lakers were better after the trade deadline. Have to put the stats without James or AD after the trade deadline to get an accurate picture of what the Lakers are today.

[Mr. Body]

Folks really hanging their hats on Rui Hachimura here.

[TD 21]

^ Again, this type of talk is seemingly in relation to championship bona fides . . . which is not the topic.

[RC_Drunkford]

You're assuming something that has not been shown. The only poster I saw that said anything remotely like what you assumed was RCDrunkford, and he's been known to be sarcastic on occasion.

I definitely wasn't sarcastic with that one. I think the entire team will take a leap while adding Wemby and actually trying to win games, plus a lot of the other reasons posters here were mentioning, like a lot of NBA star players aging etc. will make the Spurs a play-in team and a low tier playoff team by old standards (8th seed).

[Seventyniner]

Fluke conference finals runs can lead to teams being overrated. Recently we've seen that from the Blazers, Mavs, and Hawks. I think the Lakers have serious bust potential.

[exstatic]

I've read that Zion stayed in New Orleans almost the entire off season. He is in the best shape of his life and is lighter than he has ever been in the NBA. Sure, he may still get injured, but I believe he has finally taken everything seriously and is really working toward staying on the court which I don't believe was ever a priority for him in the past.
Every year they say this, and it's never been true.

[Mr. Body]

Zion was wrecking his toddler knees in college and he's just fatter now.

[Mr. Body]

Fluke conference finals runs can lead to teams being overrated. Recently we've seen that from the Blazers, Mavs, and Hawks. I think the Lakers have serious bust potential.

I'm here for it.

[JPB]

Folks really hanging their hats on Rui Hachimura here.

Yeah, I'm not sure how some people can imagine a Lebron/AD less (or one of the two) Lakers squad is nothing else than lottery team. Reaves is OK but not a first or even second option on contending team... They barely even made the POs last year and the fact they reached the WCF is a testament to the West overall mediocrity.

[rascal]

Yeah, I'm not sure how some people can imagine a Lebron/AD less (or one of the two) Lakers squad is nothing else than lottery team. Reaves is OK but not a first or even second option on contending team... They barely even made the POs last year and the fact they reached the WCF is a testament to the West overall mediocrity.

The Lakers were not the same at the end of the year as they were at the beginning of the year. And Lebron and AD are still with the team and not injured.

[exstatic]

The Lakers were not the same at the end of the year as they were at the beginning of the year. And Lebron and AD are still with the team and not injured.

That won't last. LeBron's last 3 seasons games played: 55,56,45. AD's last 3 seasons games played: 56,40,36.

[Mr. Body]

Lakers can certainly turn it around, but like ex said their two stars are made of glass. It's a lot to claim they had a great end of the season when they were unimpressive in the playoffs. They somehow dropped two games against a Morant-less Grizzlies and two games against a toothless Warriors team.

I'm looking back at the WC playoff results. It's hard to be impressed by the conference. Nothing against Denver, but they were the only team in the entire playoffs who looked ready to go and did their job. I still can't get over how they only won 53 games in the regular season.

[Russo21]

I think we can make the play in. I'm low key hoping they low key tank the season and use it as developmental especially for Wemby and his body. Tank and we should get another chance at another top 4 draft pick. We build through the draft usually and I don't see Wemby's no.2 running mate on this squad as it stands. Another season of sucking to get Wemby's body more ready and his potential career running mate will be well worth it. We have some solid wings who'll continue to grow. Collins and Jones are ok but the C and PG spots need upgrading before Wemby's prime.

[exstatic]

I think we can make the play in. I'm low key hoping they low key tank the season and use it as developmental especially for Wemby and his body. Tank and we should get another chance at another top 4 draft pick. We build through the draft usually and I don't see Wemby's no.2 running mate on this squad as it stands. Another season of sucking to get Wemby's body more ready and his potential career running mate will be well worth it. We have some solid wings who'll continue to grow. Collins and Jones are ok but the C and PG spots need upgrading before Wemby's prime.

Portland, who finished last year at 33-49, and #5 in the pre lottery standings, might be the model.

[offset formation]

That won't last. LeBron's last 3 seasons games played: 55,56,45. AD's last 3 seasons games played: 56,40,36.

Went beyond those 2 though to when they brought in some guys that filled out their needs better. And Reaves started to flourish with more ball handling opportunities.

They'll be top 5 this year. Could be top 2 if injuries don't ravage them.

[exstatic]

Went beyond those 2 though to when they brought in some guys that filled out their needs better. And Reaves started to flourish with more ball handling opportunities.

They'll be top 5 this year. Could be top 2 if injuries don't ravage them.

That’s like saying the Beautiful game would have thrived with T,T, and M playing 40-50 games each, because Boris, Patty, and Beli could carry the load.

The Lakers will go only as far as Bron and AD take them. Everyone else is a support piece who’s success is in playing off those two.

[TD 21]

^ Yeah, in the playoffs. Again, the topic here is making the play-in.

The Lakers appeared in the process of morphing into the "beautiful game" Spurs, not in terms of aesthetics, but the way they functioned (less star centric) after their trade deadline shakeup.

[offset formation]

That’s like saying the Beautiful game would have thrived with T,T, and M playing 40-50 games each, because Boris, Patty, and Beli could carry the load.

The Lakers will go only as far as Bron and AD take them. Everyone else is a support piece who’s success is in playing off those two.

Except in their case they had a really good record with Bron on the bench.

[exstatic]

Except in their case they had a really good record with Bron on the bench.

13-14 isn’t really good. If you’re going to drop a statement like that, you’ll need to bring receipts.

[Mr. Body]

Not being dominant with two players and spreading the shots is not the beautiful game. It just means they're depending on role players more. The beautiful game was driving and kicking and moving the ball. The Lakers were just as iso-dependent as they ever were.

And LOL at calling the Lakers a top 5 team in the league much less top 2. Man you guys need to turn off the ESPN.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

With Kevin Tran in uniform I'm feeling much more confident about our chances this year.

[PrimeMinister]

the dejounte led play in team won 34 games and landed as the 10 seed

core of young players is now more complete, 2 way franchise cornerstone in wemby. I'd be inclined to think that 34 win mark is closer to their floor than it is their ceiling and I think play in should be the expectation.

[spurraider21]

the dejounte led play in team won 34 games and landed as the 10 seed

core of young players is now more complete, 2 way franchise cornerstone in wemby. I'd be inclined to think that 34 win mark is closer to their floor than it is their ceiling and I think play in should be the expectation.
spurs over/under is set at 29.5

[PrimeMinister]

spurs over/under is set at 29.5

free money!

[manufan10]

I don't want the Spurs to tank this season, and I don't think they will. I think they would be better suited at trying to get the best out of everyone and letting the chips fall where they may be. They won't get a good understading of what they have with Wemby or his teammates or the direction they need to head if they don't try and maximize every opportunity and try to win every game.

[exstatic]

spurs over/under is set at 29.5

O/U is set so that bets come down even on both sides, so you're hedging on the dumb as rocks general public and a load of casuals being right.

[Mr. Body]

What a fucked up world where people look at betting lines set out by Vegas as any sort of thing to pay attention to. They're not Greek Oracles, they want your money.

[PrimeMinister]

idk if it was just an observation being made or a counter but either way if i was a betting man....

[TD 21]

the dejounte led play in team won 34 games and landed as the 10 seed

core of young players is now more complete, 2 way franchise cornerstone in wemby. I'd be inclined to think that 34 win mark is closer to their floor than it is their ceiling and I think play in should be the expectation.

The league doesn't stay static and that team had two of the best and then most underrated role players in the league, in White and Poeltl.

People keep acting as if the Spurs youth will collectively show linear progression, but somehow none of the other bad teams will.

[spurraider21]

O/U is set so that bets come down even on both sides, so you're hedging on the dumb as rocks general public and a load of casuals being right.
vegas must have made a killing off of spurstalk last year:lol

[PrimeMinister]

The league doesn't stay static and that team had two of the best and then most underrated role players in the league, in White and Poeltl.

People keep acting as if the Spurs youth will collectively show linear progression, but somehow none of the other bad teams will.

i guess we'll find out

[TrainOfThought5]

vegas must have made a killing off of spurstalk last year:lol

to be fair, Vegas would’ve known we were tanking, meanwhile ST is blindsided by trading Josh Richardson and Poetl.

[JPB]

vegas must have made a killing off of spurstalk last year:lol

They make a bunch out of optimistic fans betting on their own team, which you should never do.

[GAustex]

IIRC the unders won last year

[rascal]

13-14 isn’t really good. If you’re going to drop a statement like that, you’ll need to bring receipts.

What was their record after the mid season trades? That's the record you have to look at not the entire season .

[exstatic]

What was their record after the mid season trades? That's the record you have to look at not the entire season .

That wasn’t what was being discussed. It was the record without LeBron. Take a seat.

[rascal]

That wasn’t what was being discussed. It was the record without LeBron. Take a seat.

Your argument is flawed

Lakers will have a better record than the Spurs.

[offset formation]

13-14 isn’t really good. If you’re going to drop a statement like that, you’ll need to bring receipts.

Well since we're talking about after the trade deadline when they added pieces they went 7-6. Not as good as memory serves but they went 5-3 over their last 8 without him as they got more minutes together.

[offset formation]

That wasn’t what was being discussed. It was the record without LeBron. Take a seat.

It absolutely was what I was referencing. I even talked about Reaves getting way more run as the PG as the season waned.

I'll acknowledge it wasn't a "really good record" but it was over .500 after the deadline and getting better as the season closed out.

[rascal]

It absolutely was what I was referencing. I even talked about Reaves getting way more run as the PG as the season waned.

I'll acknowledge it wasn't a "really good record" but it was over .500 after the deadline and getting better as the season closed out.

Spurs would have a great season if they can reach 41 wins.

[offset formation]

Spurs would have a great season if they can reach 41 wins.

Agreed.

[exstatic]

the dejounte led play in team won 34 games and landed as the 10 seed

core of young players is now more complete, 2 way franchise cornerstone in wemby. I'd be inclined to think that 34 win mark is closer to their floor than it is their ceiling and I think play in should be the expectation.

Yeah, posters are saying we’ll win 10 more games. We could have won 10 more games last year if we were trying. We beat both Finals teams and Milwaukee. We took Phoenixdown to the wire late in the season. It wasn’t a good team, but it also wasn’t a 22 win team without a LOT of effort.

[TD 21]

Yeah, posters are saying we’ll win 10 more games. We could have won 10 more games last year if we were trying. We beat both Finals teams and Milwaukee. We took Phoenixdown to the wire late in the season. It wasn’t a good team, but it also wasn’t a 22 win team without a LOT of effort.

Another myopic, homer view. "We" had the point differential of a team 3-4 games worse than "our" actual record, which was tied for second worst in the league. Plenty of other teams engaged in "tanking", too.

Bad teams beating good teams is inevitable throughout the course of an 82 game season. It's usually a combination of one or both sides being due and/or the better team coasting. It shouldn't be read into.

[exstatic]

Another myopic, homer view. "We" had the point differential of a team 3-4 games worse than "our" actual record, which was tied for second worst in the league. Plenty of other teams engaged in "tanking", too.

Bad teams beating good teams is inevitable throughout the course of an 82 game season. It's usually a combination of one or both sides being due and/or the better team coasting. It shouldn't be read into.

You understand that the differential was part of the tank, right? Sochan played 6 games each in Feb and Mar, and none in April. That’ll put a ding in your PD.

And yes,I’m a homer. If you’re not, you’re not a fan, you’re a spectator. The word fan itself derives from the word fanatic.

[rascal]

You understand that the differential was part of the tank, right? Sochan played 6 games each in Feb and Mar, and none in April. That’ll put a ding in your PD.

And yes,I’m a homer. If you’re not, you’re not a fan, you’re a spectator. The word fan itself derives from the word fanatic.

A Homer is a fan whose judgment is clouded by their love for a particular team. So your judgment is clouded as a Homer.

[exstatic]

A Homer is a fan whose judgment is clouded by their love for a particular team. So your judgment is clouded as a Homer.

What you described is a fan. You’re a bystander.

[TD 21]

You understand that the differential was part of the tank, right? Sochan played 6 games each in Feb and Mar, and none in April. That’ll put a ding in your PD.

And yes,I’m a homer. If you’re not, you’re not a fan, you’re a spectator. The word fan itself derives from the word fanatic.

:lmao Somehow everything was part of the grand plan by the genius, but other bad teams were just plain bad. The "PD" was league worst with Sochan.

I'm an objective fan who pays attention to the rest of the league. All fans are "spectators".

[Mr. Body]

Yeah, posters are saying we’ll win 10 more games. We could have won 10 more games last year if we were trying. We beat both Finals teams and Milwaukee. We took Phoenixdown to the wire late in the season. It wasn’t a good team, but it also wasn’t a 22 win team without a LOT of effort.

This is correct. Yanking players and devaluing defense. Members here will acknowledge that we were tanking last year - a term which means 'losing on purpose' - implicitly acknowledging there were more games they could have won.

Now, I don't think those are a ton of games, but a deliberately competitive team would have won more.

They will lose a good number this year. It's an inexperienced and young team that needs to learn how to kill runs, find scores when desperate, and especially score and shut teams down at the end of games. Do I think they will learn? Of course. But do I think they're going to be a handful for teams? Yes. But it will take time (which is why the idea of tanking again is complete nonsense). The range of teams they can beat any given night is pretty good, and consistently. I think their floor is 30 wins and that's not including the giant mutant X of what Wemby gives us.

[Joseph Kony]

:lmao some of the sniffer takes in this thread are hilarious

[NASpurs]

:lmao some of the sniffer takes in this thread are hilarious

Especially when they talk in a very "matter of fact" manner but it's obvious they don't know shit :lol

[Bill_Brasky]

:lmao

[TrainOfThought5]

:lmao some of the sniffer takes in this thread are hilarious


to be fair Pop said he would prioritize winning then Started Sochan at PG and has had Wemby on a 25 minute restriction for two months for a mild ankle injury.

[vander]

The team doesn't even try to play D, there was the Sochan experiment, and Wemby minutes restriction.

Spo would have this team at 25 wins right now.

[cd98]

If Jones started over Sochan at the start of the season do we will more than one or two games anyway?

[baseline bum]

If Jones started over Sochan at the start of the season do we will more than one or two games anyway?

They were 5-30 not starting Jones and are 5-13 since, so yes. They're awful starting Jones but they were historically terrible starting Sochan and even worse Bran Ham at PG.

[offset formation]

:lmao some of the sniffer takes in this thread are hilarious



Yes. If there aren't significant injuries to key pieces that keep people out for long stretches. Specifically Vassell, Wembanyama, Sochan.

If not, were the same non playoff team with the bottom 2 worst record.


You're aware we were 22-60 last year pretty much with all those same players returning. Now we absolutely tanked a bit and had some injuries, but you are what your record says you are within a few spots, at least. We sucked, sometimes purposefully, but we sucked. Our defense literally was the worst on NBA history.

Imagine a stretch where Wemby cannot play and our defense presumably reverts back to all-time suckage?

I think I can imagine several reasons why people might think little of what we got, and why we might not be playoff bound. In fact, I can easily envision a scenario where we are once again picking well inside the lottery, equally as well as I can see us sneaking into a play-in spot.


Quite frankly I'm feeling positive on my prediction/take but what's sad is I called our record except I assumed there would have to be injuries to keep us down as bad as we've been.

Otherwise, my shit was pretty spot on, per normal. :reading

[baseline bum]

Glad I didn't post in this thread :lol

IIRC I think I thought they had a real shot at the play-in but would prob finish around 35 wins and miss it. So much for that shit :lol

[TD 21]

The team doesn't even try to play D, there was the Sochan experiment, and Wemby minutes restriction.

Spo would have this team at 25 wins right now.

:lmao At thinking coaching makes a significant difference.

[rascal]

They were 5-30 not starting Jones and are 5-13 since, so yes. They're awful starting Jones but they were historically terrible starting Sochan and even worse Bran Ham at PG.

They also went through a soft part of the schedule during this 5-13 run.

[JPB]

They were 5-30 not starting Jones and are 5-13 since, so yes. They're awful starting Jones but they were historically terrible starting Sochan and even worse Bran Ham at PG.

They still can go 5-30 with Tre starting :lol

Even if they go 9-or 10-30 (remains to be done), the difference wouldn't honestly be that significative and mostly due to getting a bit more used to each others and the time for opponents to establish the scoutng report with that new configuration and adapt... They had a little run when Tre got back in the SL, winning some games, but now it feels the NBA adapted and spursc can't win anymore again, or only close games on oppponents missing potential game winners...

[RC_Drunkford]

I thought they were bad on D last season on purpose. Turns out it's who they are and Pop really thinks those schemes work :lol I massively overrated these scrubs. Still mind boggling to me how they got worse from last season while adding Wemby.

[Chomag]

:pop: Over my dead body. These kids need to learn that there is more out there in this world then wining and competing with each other.
Why spend so much time memorizing plays when there are maps of Africa that can be studied.

[timtonymanu]

:pop: Over my dead body. These kids need to learn that there is more out there in this world then wining and competing with each other.
Why spend so much time memorizing plays when there are maps of Africa that can be studied.

“If you criticize my coaching, then there’s something wrong with you. Also stop booing Kawhi, its not what we are.”

[Brazil]

:lol not sure I posted in this thread... hopefully not :lol

[John B]

Should they miss out on lottery picks, possibly help Toronto get their pick, just so they could get pounded in the 1st round?? Smart…

[TrainOfThought5]

Lmao no one predicted Pop was going to tank this shit into the ground, but to be honest, if we nail a top three pick, and a top ten pick to put besides Wemby, I won’t complain

[Joseph Kony]

Lmao no one predicted Pop was going to tank this shit into the ground, but to be honest, if we nail a top three pick, and a top ten pick to put besides Wemby, I won’t complain

i knew we had no shot regardless of pop


zero chance imho

team was abysmal last season and honestly probably worse than their record despite what the sniffers think. i thought it was pretty obvious that adding Victor alone wasnt going to propel the worst team in the league to a play in spot