UNCURSED Game Thread: Mavs at Spurs, 8:30 PM CT,

[benefactor]

Johnson with the hero ball fail

[InRareForm]

Keldon wtf

[scott]

Wemby gets called for 5 ticky tack fouls.

Mavs mug Keldon under the basket, no foul. Wtf

[BatManu20]

Keldon and Sochan are hot trash tonight tbh.

[TekXX]

Pop made to look like a fool with that Sochan move.

[benefactor]

And Luka buries the Spurs. Game over

[KaiRMD1]

Well ... that's game

[LaMarcus Bryant]

Luka owns us more than Dirk ever did LOL
Way to turn it over guys

[3&D_TBH]

fml

[spurs10]

Wow coughing it up.... no boards.

[Robz4000]

Completely one-sided officiating down the stretch.

[scott]

Sochan in for Tre and we immediately go -8

Good stuff.

[couchman]

As soon as we took Tre out our offense looked terrible

[baseline bum]

Fuck was Sochan doing giving Irving that wide open corner three?

[spurs1990]

Johnson ceiling Malik Rose

[SpursFan86]

What the fuck was that Keldon???

[tbdog]

Luka is so damn good.

[LeBowen]

Disappointing execution in the end, oh well.

[Obstructed_View]

Well, that was rather disastrous sequence by KJ. Do we call that heroball?

[cutewizard]

its a good game

we fought, that is what matters in the end

[Raven]

well, we had a chance there, but in the end doncic is just too good and gets to expose our young team without trying too hard. Much easier when it is that bum irving doing the shooting.

[tim_duncan_fan]

Why in the dumbass hell would you leave Kyrie Irving to double someone? That's fucking retarded.

[dbestpro]

Keldon with the game ball for Dallas.

[$pursDynasty]

We need a dude, a vet to lead the young pups, like Butler brought something to the Heat.

[ace3g]

Our double teams weren't executed well, Dallas found the open man for baskets...

[scott]

Maybe we’re still doing the tank in the clutch thing?

[Degoat]

Yeah I know it’s early but I think it’s becoming clear, Sochan needs to go to the bench and Tre start. There is no offensive structure at all when he’s in.

[benefactor]

They were getting Wemby the ball early then it just came unraveled. Good fucking god a PG is needed

[Amuseddaysleeper]

One moronic play after another, let’s keep ignoring wemby absolute idiots

[td4mvp2k]

collins getting beat on boards of course

[blizz]

HOW the F does the 1st pick not touch the ball in the last two possessions? I love KD but WTF was that? Two possessions in a row!! W. T. F.

[CorrectCrusader]

What a fucking disaster on offense lol get your BEST FUCKING PLAYER involved

[DAF86]

Pop had Wemby stay on the 3pt line on the biggest possession of the game. :rofl

[Joseph Kony]

:lmao this team is full of low IQ bums that can't even throw a simple entry pass. trade everyone on this roster and get Vic a real PG

[The Whopper]

You could see that one coming the omens they subbed out jones for sochan.

[hater]

:lmao sochi

Comes back in and dallas goes on 9-0 run to win the game :lmao :lmao

What a fucking scrub

[Spurs21Fan4Ever]

I haven’t watched the NBA much since Duncan retired but Sochan is one of the worst players, let alone starters, that I’ve ever seen.

[benefactor]

:lol what a disappointing ending

[Arcadian]

Did Victor just get frozen out by his own team?

[thiste]

the screen that got called for putting the elbow on the opponent's chest was borderline as he's so tall, there's no way he can touch anything legal

Not only that, but Williams acted the shit out of it, and I also saw Doncic elbow Sochan several times during the game without a call.

[Chomag]

Ok.. does any player on this team know how to rebound???? I don't think I have ever seen rebounding effort this bad on the spurs before

[MultiTroll]

Grandpa Dumbshit gets owned.
TF is our offensive strategy.

And go in balls deep on the refs in the post game.
Shove your classy up your ass.

[timtonymanu]

It’s gonna be a season of ups and downs. The only ones bitching are the ones that thought this was an automatic 50 win playoff team. :lol

[TekXX]

Reality check for those who thought this team was good.

[hater]

Sochi is one of the worst players I have sen in a loong time


Its gona be a loong season :lol

[blizz]

lol Luka with the F bomb

[timtonymanu]

I haven’t watched the NBA much since Duncan retired but Sochan is one of the worst players, let alone starters, that I’ve ever seen.

Idiotic hyperbolic statements like this is what I mean

[baseline bum]

Well, gotta give Grant Williams a lot of credit, locked Wemby the fuck up for three quarters. And Doncic was who he has always been. Still can't believe how wide open Sochan left Irving on that corner three. Felt like that was game right there.

[td4mvp2k]

Pop had Wemby stay on the 3pt line on the biggest possession of the game. :rofl
pop clearly not taking this game seriously

[poopbox]

Atrocious coaching by Pop.

Tre having arguably his best game as a pro. We getting open shots out of him running the offense.

You take him out for Sochan who somehow leaves Kyrie fucking Irving open in the corner and then turns it over on the other end.

Wemby has no plays ran for him after scoring multiple times in a row.

Very first time Pop has to coach for real all year and he completely shits the bed.

[Proxy]

grant williams and luka look like fat babies on the court, we lost to some fat babies today

[$pursDynasty]

Runs at the end of the 2nd, 3rd and 4th, the Spurs need a savvy vet to lead the pups

[paperboy77]

Said it before... NOT starting Tre Jones is stupid. Tre is the Brian Drew of the Spurs (QB from Draft Day Movie). Jeremy certainly belongs but as a PF. Sorry but Kelden should be the odd man out. He could be great all in all but TJ should be running the team. Regardless... this was or should have been a helluva learning experience for the team. Like always, it's up to Pop NOT to continue to fuck things up.

[GAustex]

The Serbian guy is good

Should have taken the under

[Arcadian]

I haven’t watched the NBA much since Duncan retired but Sochan is one of the worst players, let alone starters, that I’ve ever seen.

I thought, "Surely he must have been a beast in college" to justify his 9th overall draft pick. Then I look and see that he averaged 9 points and 6 rebounds in one year.

What did scouts see in him? Was it mainly just the charming accent?

[Floyd Pacquiao]

You got a once in a lifetime player and he doesn’t touch the ball at all in crunch time?

[TimDunkem]

First game hot take:

I actually like KJ and Sochan, but damn they're dumb as rocks. Can't/won't pass, hero ball plays, throwing elbows like it's the 90s.

This team desperately needs some higher IQ players who actually look for their star player.

[Splits]

2nd 3rd and 4th quarters all ended in 0-8 runs

[itzsoweezee]

Two things this game makes crystal clear:
1. Spurs need a real starting point guard
2. Keldon needs to move to the bench

[Russ]

The Spurs lost largely because Wembanyama was in foul trouble from 5 minutes in.

Don't jump off the cliff just yet.

[TekXX]

There's no way a professional coach would continue with Sochan at the point after this game so if it continues i'll just chalk it up to another sly tank season.

[Barfunk]

Reality check for those who thought this team was good.

Yeah definitely. I was one of them. They just didn't look very good.

[thiste]

It’s gonna be a season of ups and downs. The only ones bitching are the ones that thought this was an automatic 50 win playoff team. :lol

Wemby's not gonna be in foul trouble every game you know.

[Arcadian]

I haven’t watched the NBA much since Duncan retired but Sochan is one of the worst players, let alone starters, that I’ve ever seen.

I thought, "Surely he must have been a beast in college" to justify his 9th overall draft pick. Then I look and see that he averaged 9 points and 6 rebounds in one year.

What did scouts see in him? Was it mainly just the charming accent?

[couchman]

This team will be decent.
Sochan had some struggles but he wasn’t terrible.
The biggest issue was Wemby picking up dumb fouls

[ICEBARREL]

Gotta thank the refs for spoiling the generational talent's first game with foul trouble. Gotta let the leagues new fuckboy to get a triple-double.

[ace3g]

2:09
https://a.espncdn.com/combiner/i?img=/i/teamlogos/nba/500/scoreboard/sa.png&scale=crop&cquality=40&location=origin&w=40&h=40
Devin Vassell makes free throw 2 of 2
118
119




Final




1
2
3
4
T


DAL
36
28
32
30
126


SA
43
25
23
28
119

[scott]

Spurs +/-

Devin +4
Tre +1
Wemby 0
Keldon 0
Bran -2
Collins -4
Bassey -6
Doug -7
Sochan -10
Cedi -11

[Barfunk]

It's only 1 game though. Long season, on to the next.

[timtonymanu]

I thought, "Surely he must have been a beast in college" to justify his 9th overall draft pick. Then I look and see that he averaged 9 points and 6 rebounds in one year.

What did scouts see in him? Was it mainly just the charming accent?

Another stupid take

[Barfunk]

Looked like they were hacking us pretty good down there with no calls tbh. Looked like at least.

[thiste]

It’s gonna be a season of ups and downs. The only ones bitching are the ones that thought this was an automatic 50 win playoff team. :lol

Wemby's not gonna be in foul trouble every game you know.

[poopbox]

The Spurs lost largely because Wembanyama was in foul trouble from 5 minutes in.

Don't jump off the cliff just yet.

Yeah if Wemby wasn't in foul trouble we would have blown them out. Beyond his scoring he generates such gravity that everything else for other players are open 3's or lanes for layups.

This team was very bad last year so I don't even think their is a cliff to jump off of tbh.

[Arcadian]

Another stupid take

I'm just genuinely wondering what made him a lottery pick. What was it?

[itzsoweezee]

It’s really sad there’s only one player on the entire roster that can throw a pass to the tallest guy on the court

[Darius Bieber]

Final moments of this game looked like we are tanking for Sarr in 2024

[HankChinaski]

A lot of easily correctable mistakes. KJ closing out the game needed to play more controlled and less forced. Overall excited for the next game and season. This team can still be quite special.

[Knoxxx]

Dubious calls much of the game. The donkey and Williams get away with murder. The Wemby vanish on offense at the end was obviously baffling. Sochan needs to finish better he missed too many bunnies. KJ attacking in the paint is not the go to, he’s too undersized for that. Grandstanding refs all game. Lots of dirty trickster play from a veteran opposing team.

But Wemby showed he can explode any moment and take over a game. On to the next one!

[poopbox]

Spurs +/-

Devin +4
Tre +1
Wemby 0
Keldon 0
Bran -2
Collins -4
Bassey -6
Doug -7
Sochan -10
Cedi -11

Bas stat. Cedi plays almost the whole game with Wemby on the bench. Doug did to. Cedi might be a "minus" most games cause he going to be playing with a bench unit thats probably going to be bad on defense

[BatManu20]

One thing is glaringly obvious: This team is still devoid of top-end talent.

We honestly need to suck ass again this year tbh. Only way we’re going to get elite talent is in the lottery. That’s what needs to happen, cause this team desperately needs some.

[PopTheGOAT]

Run the offense through Vassell and Wemby. Wayyy too much other stuff going on.

[GAustex]

Sochan needs to make layups

[8FOR!3]

The fouls killed us. Tre was better at PG than Sochan tonight. But Tre can't really guard Kyrie or Luka. Keldon also just has physical limitations when it comes to guarding guys like Luka.

I'm not going to take too much away from this game other than that. It was a winnable game and a few things just didn't go our way.

[Obstructed_View]

It's fun watching this place turn into Clutchfans after less than one game. :lmao retards. :lmao

[TekXX]

I'm just genuinely wondering what made him a lottery pick. What was it?

Wright is a reacher, results have not been great.

[Spur|n|Austin]

I haven’t watched the NBA much since Duncan retired but Sochan is one of the worst players, let alone starters, that I’ve ever seen.

[Barfunk]

The fouls killed us. Tre was better at PG than Sochan tonight. But Tre can't really guard Kyrie or Luka. Keldon also just has physical limitations when it comes to guarding guys like Luka.

I'm not going to take too much away from this game other than that. It was a winnable game and a few things just didn't go our way.

Agreed, Trey was running it decent, but yeah he'll just get crushed by guys like Luka on defense.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Mavs -4.5

Vegas needed the Mavs tonight and long time NBA official Tony Brothers delivered.
Oh and knock off the point Sochan experiment and give the ball to Jones.

[BackHome]

This team just isn’t that good we need more talent people just need to just enjoy the process. For me just going to really focus on watching Wemby and Vassell every other player is replaceable. So looking forward to seeing them two grow and hopefully the basket ball Gods like us again and we get a high lottery pick and the icing on the cake would be Toronto pick falling in the 7 to 9 range.

[Spurs21Fan4Ever]

It's fun watching this place turn into Clutchfans after less than one game. :lmao retards. :lmao
Nobody is expecting the Spurs to do anything better than make a play-in game, but Wemby only gets one opening night and I think a lot of us wanted it to go well. Between stupid officials and ball hog guards leaving him out of the offense especially towards the end it was frustrating.

How insecure of a person must you be to post something like that?

[BatManu20]

Sochan needs to make layups

Tbh it’s far more important that he learns to shoot the 3 at a decent clip. Because teams are going to be crowding Wemby in the paint and daring Jeremy to shoot it all season long.

[timtonymanu]

Nobody is expecting the Spurs to do anything better than make a play-in game, but Wemby only gets one opening night and I think a lot of us wanted it to go well. Between stupid officials and ball hog guards leaving him out of the offense especially towards the end it was frustrating.

How insecure of a person must you be to post something like that?

You’ve made the dumbest posts tonight so far. Maybe stop being an emotional vagina. “Sochan is the worst starter I’ve seen.”

[BatManu20]

If only we had Dame on the floor during crunch time tbh :cry

[Spurs Homer]

I knew when the spurs never even tried to get lillard that this would happen…

but on the other hand….its just one game and wemby was never allowed to play ..refs did call legit fouls on wemby but on the other hand williams was allowed to foul at will and spurs got ticky tacked to death…

this will still be a decent team and wemby will learn how to stay out of foul trouble- step 1 was tonite as he did not disrespect any ref and being the respectful pro that he is the refs will soon feel comfortable calling shit fairly

a few flashes when wemby came back in is encouraging and sochan will also get better

i dont mind sochan on the floor - he needs minutes and after some growing pains- he WILL pay off

tre jones played well but hopefully pop does not overreact and pull sochan

stay the course - it will take a little bit and then wemby will dominate

[tbdog]

If spurs can't win, you want them to lose like this. Tied game with 2 mins left and then watch Luka show how to close out a game, while we forced the action. That's how you grow as a team. Bit by bit, hopefully we can fix things here and there.

[MannyIsGod]

Game was fine honestly. Lots of good signs and just a very young team that got outplayed by the best player in the game at the end. This team is going to need to learn how to close out games but that's a process. Way more good than bad tonight and lots to build of off. Y'all gotta keep the hype in check. He's going to need to learn all kinds of lessons and this is how that happens.

[Kawhi Duncan]

Sohan too fucking soft... Go up and dunk the ball like a man and stop throwing up pussy ass layups...

[Knoxxx]

It was a shame to see Donkey push off on that last shot and the refs swallow their whistles given all the BS calls they made to that point. Though Sochan was a bit indecisive on that rebound I thought he was probably fouled there too. It seemed like every long offensive rebound went right to the Mavs and the total opposite on the other end. Mavs got more than their share of bounces all night it seemed. Would be nice for someone like Champagnie to develop to replace most of Osman and McDermott’s minutes.

As far as the Sochan PG experiment complaints I get it, but if he finishes better at the rim I think we feel better about him. Wemby and Vassell seemed like the go tos down the stretch, instead we got others playing hero ball and/or just chucking. Jones clearly was the hot hand compared to Sochan at the end though.

[Spurs21Fan4Ever]

You’ve made the dumbest posts tonight so far. Maybe stop being an emotional vagina. “Sochan is the worst starter I’ve seen.”
Speaking of insecure people.

[couchman]

One game guys. One game.
It's too early to be making big pronouncements about this team in any direction, good or bad

[daslicer]

It's fun watching this place turn into Clutchfans after less than one game. :lmao retards. :lmao

For me these games are all house money. It's about just enjoying watching Wemby play which I felt the refs ruined to a large degree in this game. Hopefully the next game he won't be hindered by foul trouble.

[baseline bum]

Game was fine honestly. Lots of good signs and just a very young team that got outplayed by the best player in the game at the end. This team is going to need to learn how to close out games but that's a process. Way more good than bad tonight and lots to build of off. Y'all gotta keep the hype in check. He's going to need to learn all kinds of lessons and this is how that happens.

Vic made some dumb fouls and was getting bodied by Grant Williams the first three quarters, but I loved his response in the fourth. Well not when he committed that stupid reach in on Doncic to begin the quarter. But you know what I mean. :lol

And as much as I wanted to smash the TV seeing how wide open Irving was on that corner three (was like watching slow motion and thinking WTF Jeremy?) gotta have him out there to learn how to play in pressure situations too even if Tre is having a good game since Sochan is in the team's long term plans. Kind of expected the game to go like this honestly. Spurs keep it close on talent but then get their hearts cut out by Doncic at the end.

[timtonymanu]

Speaking of insecure people.

Maybe talk out of your ass less. Dogshit takes lol

[spurraider21]

Well, gotta give Grant Williams a lot of credit, locked Wemby the fuck up for three quarters. And Doncic was who he has always been. Still can't believe how wide open Sochan left Irving on that corner three. Felt like that was game right there.
Grant played as good a game as Dallas can expect out of him.

[John B]

Doncic had a triple-double and was pretty clutch. He would be hard to beat when he beast like that. Just the same our young guys hanged in there. That’s the most we can ask.

[Ice009]

It was a shame to see Donkey push off on that last shot and the refs swallow their whistles given all the BS calls they made to that point. Though Sochan was a bit indecisive on that rebound I thought he was probably fouled there too. It seemed like every long offensive rebound went right to the Mavs and the total opposite on the other end. Mavs got more than their share of bounces all night it seemed. Would be nice for someone like Champagnie to develop to replace most of Osman and McDermott’s minutes.

As far as the Sochan PG experiment complaints I get it, but if he finishes better at the rim I think we feel better about him. Wemby and Vassell seemed like the go tos down the stretch, instead we got others playing hero ball and/or just chucking. Jones clearly was the hot hand compared to Sochan at the end though.

We had guys try to hero ball it at the end that really aren't "go-to" players. Oh well, tough game. Some good signs from Victor at the end. Wish we could have gotten the win, but oh well. Looks like Victor took the loss personally as he left the court pretty quickly. The kid wants it. Great to see. His teammates need to get him or Vassell the ball. Most of the other players are nowhere near good enough to try and hero ball.

[poopbox]

I knew when the spurs never even tried to get lillard that this would happen…

but on the other hand….its just one game and wemby was never allowed to play ..refs did call legit fouls on wemby but on the other hand williams was allowed to foul at will and spurs got ticky tacked to death…

this will still be a decent team and wemby will learn how to stay out of foul trouble- step 1 was tonite as he did not disrespect any ref and being the respectful pro that he is the refs will soon feel comfortable calling shit fairly

a few flashes when wemby came back in is encouraging and sochan will also get better

i dont mind sochan on the floor - he needs minutes and after some growing pains- he WILL pay off

tre jones played well but hopefully pop does not overreact and pull sochan

stay the course - it will take a little bit and then wemby will dominate

Why on earth would the spurs want Dame? He'll be retiring by the time this is a championship caliber team.

[RC_Drunkford]

If Wemby doesn‘t get in foul trouble we most likely win the game. It‘s actually surprising we kept it that close with all the mistakes the team made tonight, atrocious coaching included. A lot of stretches of terrible basketball. Also why did Pop not run dribble hand offs for Wemby like he did against Houston in preseason?

[MannyIsGod]

Vic made some dumb fouls and was getting bodied by Grant Williams the first three quarters, but I loved his response in the fourth. Well not when he committed that stupid reach in on Doncic to begin the quarter. But you know what I mean. :lol

And as much as I wanted to smash the TV seeing how wide open Irving was on that corner three (was like watching slow motion and thinking WTF Jeremy?) gotta have him out there to learn how to play in pressure situations too even if Tre is having a good game since Sochan is in the team's long term plans. Kind of expected the game to go like this honestly. Spurs keep it close on talent but then get their hearts cut out by Doncic at the end.

Wemby will learn quickly. Spurs also need to learn to feed him the ball. I love Keldon but he has to feed the hot hand there. They'll all figure it out.

The whole team had a very deer in the headlights look the last two minutes. If they're competitive this season games like this will hopefully help them figure it out.

[Spurs21Fan4Ever]

Maybe talk out of your ass less. Dogshit takes lol
All I hear from you are insults, not an actual take. Maybe try and be a legit contributor to this forum by posting your opinion and take instead of just posting insults and thinking it makes you look smart, cause posting excessive insults on an anonymous forum just makes you look like a desperate keyboard warrior.

[Knoxxx]

While I want to blame the refs 100% for Wemby’s foul trouble, he also just seemed to be off to me on the defensive end.
He roamed to help on the wrong guys or just seems out of position a lot. Someone replay the fouls and tell us which seemed valid. I doubted the one when Donkey drove was legit, that guys creates all kind of contact and to give him a ticky tack seems bogus. I also thought when they took away the 3 as Williams whined and acted butt hurt to draw a foul was BS, maybe I’m wrong. Overall we need to play better and not expect any help from refs not to mention good officiating.

[Trill Clinton]

Good loss. Wemby finished healthy. Vassell looking much improved. Sochan will figure it out. Long season ahead of us. Keep the tank rolling.

[John B]

If Wemby doesn‘t get in foul trouble we most likely win the game. It‘s actually surprising we kept it that close with all the mistakes the team made tonight, atrocious coaching included. A lot of stretches of terrible basketball. Also why did Pop not run dribble hand offs for Wemby like he did against Houston in preseason?

Pop is deflecting the pressure off Wemby, and not having him do too much. It’s his first game and everybody’s eyes on him. This is more just getting his feet wet, get his first game done and over with. This season is just about learning to play with one another

[Knoxxx]

One real positive was Wemby 3 of 5 from three. Again should not be a primary go to, but a worry was Wemby shooting a low 3 pt percentage so that was good to see. Also it is clear the other team can’t stop him, we just need to learn how to use him best on offense.

[Spurs Homer]

Why on earth would the spurs want Dame? He'll be retiring by the time this is a championship caliber team.

because dame has 4 good years left and victor wants to win now

tonite , for example, with lillard putting up his usual 20-25 pts and wemby struggling in a still close game- this would have been a W

this retarded shit “spurs need 4 years to be a championship team” makes me sick

we have the unicorn and we can win now if wemby had some star next to him

but forget lillard- that ship has sailed and its ok

now just let the best players have floor time until they gel which is why i want sochan on the floor and tre jones as backup

it will work, wemby will dominate, the long arms of the defense will start to stymie opponents and spurs will be a pretty good team this season


stay the course

[cd98]

Dallas has players that can execute in close games. Spurs didn’t lose because of the refs. Just poor execution on offense and defense the last two minutes. The Spurs demonstrated their youth. But still saw a lot to like.

[Chinook]

This is why offensive structure matters. I've been harping on Pop actually calling actions much more frequently, on having guys play more traditional and limiting how often folks can break off plays to go for their own points. All of those play a role in Victor struggling. Sochan is going to get better, but the position isn't a natural fit for him, and the sacrifices the offense makes by not having a guy with legit guard agility were more obvious than ever. Because there were no sets, players weren't able to have landmarks for when to pass the ball and where to be to receive that pass. A lot of that depends on chemistry, but there are actually rules to movement and passing windows. The chemistry plays into that by guys trusting each other to read the contingencies correctly. As I've said before, as much as the "Beautiful Game" looked organic, it was built out of a complex offense with a number of options, reads and actions planned out. The team isn't running anything like that right now, and that's led to guys decided to get their own shot way too much. Everyone is taking bad shots, dribbling into trouble, throwing wild passes, setting bad screens, etc. It's a selfish thing. It comes from guys trying to get open rather than being a cog and waiting their turn. When you don't run things to get guys good shots, they look for any shot they can get. That last offensive possession showed everything we needed to see to get a sense of where the team is right now in terms of its offensive coaching.

Defensively, it is what it is. The Mavericks showed why having a legit vet guard matters. There is no sure ball-handler who can get their own shot on the Spurs, and SA saw down the stretch how such guys put pressure on defenses that can elevate role-players. Yes, they fouled too much. Victor can learn; the others will probably just slightly improve. They have to throw their hands in there because their feet aren't going to get it done. Collins is going to be hit or miss, and as long as he stays out of foul trouble, he'll probably be okay. Bassey shows the limits to jumping when one's a short as he is. Vassell wasn't bad, but he's not going to hold up much as the primary perimeter defender. Jones was the best defender on the team last year, and he showed that type of solid play tonight, even if he's going stopping Luka.

No changes should be made in terms of rotation after this game. Too early, and Dallas has some unique attributes that allow them to match up with this version of the Spurs in a way many other teams won't be able to. If Victor played the first three quarters like he did the last, the Spurs might've even won the game. He needs to figure out that he should only expose himself to a foul in certain situations. He showed he can not foul for stretches. That needs to be the default, and the lunges and pokes should be used strategically. As he gets more accustomed, the times where those actions make sense will increase in frequency. He doesn't have to be flashy right away. But this game was enough to show Pop can't be as laissez-faire about the offense if he wants a successful rookie season. He needs to get the reins on some players, and that could mean something like bringing Jones and Osman to the first unit and sending Johnson and Sochan to the bench. That's not starting your best five or whatever, but it is making a function unit on both sides of the ball along with making a more functional bench that isn't relying on Branham carrying.

That would be for later, though. For now, play those five but give them assignments and have them play within those. Have Wemby run certain actions and lead to him getting the ball in the high post or moving toward the rim and let him establish himself offensively. Run actions with Collins to try to get some vertical spacing going. Have Keldon drive -- he flubbed it up at the end, but he had a very good game actually. Take out most of the long passes until they learn to throw them accurately. When Bassey is in the game, have him PnR with whomever is handling the ball. Limit Branham's on-ball time to whenever Wemby isn't playing. Bring Jones in early, probably for Keldon. Continue to limit McDermott's minutes until the offense has enough structure to reincorporate him or until the team finds a perimeter player to replace him. I think it's perfectly fine if the Spurs don't prioritize winning games this year. But it would be nice if they tried something different in terms of their player development. As much as their guys have flashed talent, it's amazing how far they have to come to be role-players. That's what the majority of them are going to be in this league, and they really seem to struggle with it, and I think that lays at the coaching staff's feet.

[timtonymanu]

All I hear from you are insults, not an actual take. Maybe try and be a legit contributor to this forum by posting your opinion and take instead of just posting insults and thinking it makes you look smart, cause posting excessive insults on an anonymous forum just makes you look like a desperate keyboard warrior.

I’ll contribute basketball takes when I don’t see dogshit ones like “Sochan is the worst starter I’ve seen.”

So again, fix your faggotry first.

[FkLA]

KJ has to learn to dial it back in crunchtime. He's a likeable guy and a leader on the team, but going 1 on 1 is not his game. Him attacking the teeth of the defense wrecklessly is also not ideal.

Honestly, the best halfcourt offense down the stretch might be to just give Wemby the ball and have him shoot over his defender from literally anywhere on the court. It's so easy for him to get his shot off.

[Arcadian]

I mean I guess it's good that our guys aren't forcing Victor the ball in awkward places, but...maybe don't completely freeze him out down the stretch? They need to do more to let him find his spots.

[Knoxxx]

One other positive, to come roaring out of gates for 43 points. The chatters on the score couldn’t believe the Spurs could play at that pace. I was like yep, we can. The problem was they got too frenetic and sloppy, keep up the pace but keep it under control. Like Bassey in bound tapping the ball right to the other team.
THINK! We saw a glimpse though, of how the Spurs intend to try and run other teams out of the building and I’m not betting against them being able to, being one of the youngest teams in the league.

[Blizzardwizard]

Hopefully some valuable lessons learned tonight. Can't have Wemby get so few touches and seriously expect to win games this season especially against better teams. Foul-trouble aside there seemed to be a general disinterest in finding Victor even when he was on the court.

At times he was genuinely being well defended but at others he was just being flatout ignored despite being in strong positions. Whether it was down to poor vision, selfishness or just bad luck it can't happen going forwards and it was typified by him taking over in the fourth then being left to stand around on the perimeter for the last minutes as guys around him made bone-headed drives into traffic with the outcome inevitable.

PATFO need to be ruthless on this. Guys have to know whose team this is going to be for the next 15 years or more. One game is far too small a sample size but, over the coming months and years, players who ignore Victor on mismatches, cuts, rolls etc. (whether it's intentional or not) need to be threatened with losing minutes and, failing that, shipped out and replaced by players who know their role and can do the job required.

[Knoxxx]

Chinook I agree with most all you say, basically I had summed that up with too much “hero ball”. Everyone seems to have the green light to shoot and attack all the time, and when you lose concepts like good to great in the process or don’t get your best players enough looks that is what Pop needs to fix. Which seems very doable.

[JeffDuncan]

A lot of easily correctable mistakes. KJ closing out the game needed to play more controlled and less forced. Overall excited for the next game and season. This team can still be quite special.


Keldon is not correctable. What we saw is what he is. People should have realized that by now. Gung ho, bull in a china shop. There are times it’s ok, but he doesn’t have the height or hops to make it work in heavy traffic. You can’t teach “taller.” And we definitely can’t rely on him to playmake in heavy traffic. I don’t like Pop putting Keldon in a position to fail.

Nor is it “easily” correctable to make them get the ball to Wemby near the basket, altho it’s probably possible with more time and practice. One would hope.

But like you, I’m also excited for this season, and I expect them to get significantly better.

[TrainOfThought5]

This is why offensive structure matters. I've been harping on Pop actually calling actions much more frequently, on having guys play more traditional and limiting how often folks can break off plays to go for their own points. All of those play a role in Victor struggling. Sochan is going to get better, but the position isn't a natural fit for him, and the sacrifices the offense makes by not having a guy with legit guard agility were more obvious than ever. Because there were no sets, players weren't able to have landmarks for when to pass the ball and where to be to receive that pass. A lot of that depends on chemistry, but there are actually rules to movement and passing windows. The chemistry plays into that by guys trusting each other to read the contingencies correctly. As I've said before, as much as the "Beautiful Game" looked organic, it was built out of a complex offense with a number of options, reads and actions planned out. The team isn't running anything like that right now, and that's led to guys decided to get their own shot way too much. Everyone is taking bad shots, dribbling into trouble, throwing wild passes, setting bad screens, etc. It's a selfish thing. It comes from guys trying to get open rather than being a cog and waiting their turn. When you don't run things to get guys good shots, they look for any shot they can get. That last offensive possession showed everything we needed to see to get a sense of where the team is right now in terms of its offensive coaching.

Defensively, it is what it is. The Mavericks showed why having a legit vet guard matters. There is no sure ball-handler who can get their own shot on the Spurs, and SA saw down the stretch how such guys put pressure on defenses that can elevate role-players. Yes, they fouled too much. Victor can learn; the others will probably just slightly improve. They have to throw their hands in there because their feet aren't going to get it done. Collins is going to be hit or miss, and as long as he stays out of foul trouble, he'll probably be okay. Bassey shows the limits to jumping when one's a short as he is. Vassell wasn't bad, but he's not going to hold up much as the primary perimeter defender. Jones was the best defender on the team last year, and he showed that type of solid play tonight, even if he's going stopping Luka.

No changes should be made in terms of rotation after this game. Too early, and Dallas has some unique attributes that allow them to match up with this version of the Spurs in a way many other teams won't be able to. If Victor played the first three quarters like he did the last, the Spurs might've even won the game. He needs to figure out that he should only expose himself to a foul in certain situations. He showed he can not foul for stretches. That needs to be the default, and the lunges and pokes should be used strategically. As he gets more accustomed, the times where those actions make sense will increase in frequency. He doesn't have to be flashy right away. But this game was enough to show Pop can't be as laissez-faire about the offense if he wants a successful rookie season. He needs to get the reins on some players, and that could mean something like bringing Jones and Osman to the first unit and sending Johnson and Sochan to the bench. That's not starting your best five or whatever, but it is making a function unit on both sides of the ball along with making a more functional bench that isn't relying on Branham carrying.

That would be for later, though. For now, play those five but give them assignments and have them play within those. Have Wemby run certain actions and lead to him getting the ball in the high post or moving toward the rim and let him establish himself offensively. Run actions with Collins to try to get some vertical spacing going. Have Keldon drive -- he flubbed it up at the end, but he had a very good game actually. Take out most of the long passes until they learn to throw them accurately. When Bassey is in the game, have him PnR with whomever is handling the ball. Limit Branham's on-ball time to whenever Wemby isn't playing. Bring Jones in early, probably for Keldon. Continue to limit McDermott's minutes until the offense has enough structure to reincorporate him or until the team finds a perimeter player to replace him. I think it's perfectly fine if the Spurs don't prioritize winning games this year. But it would be nice if they tried something different in terms of their player development. As much as their guys have flashed talent, it's amazing how far they have to come to be role-players. That's what the majority of them are going to be in this league, and they really seem to struggle with it, and I think that lays at the coaching staff's feet.

good point on role player mindset and mentality. Keldon, Vassel, and to a point Sochan all feel like any shot they take is a “good” shot, and they’ll have to adjust because of the way we played last year. In the 4th quarter especially it has to be Vassell and Wemby Time.

[Chinook]

Well, gotta give Grant Williams a lot of credit, locked Wemby the fuck up for three quarters. And Doncic was who he has always been. Still can't believe how wide open Sochan left Irving on that corner three. Felt like that was game right there.

Williams locked up Wemby because Pop let it happen. Wemby is too tall to be a low post player. He probably won't ever be particularly good at it. Once he filled out in seven years and plays more center, he'll have success. But his game should basically be for him to shoot from wherever he gets the ball. He had a lot of success in the fourth doing that. Williams cannot guard Victor if he just shoots over him. If he doesn't have an immediate turnaround jumper or pop shot in his game, he needs to get one. As he gets more comfortable and improves, he'll be able to get positioning facing guys up and driving to his spot. That isn't going to work if his defenders don't have to worry about him trying to score immediately. Until then, it's possible the Spurs will have to do interior screens to get him positioning. Those screens are much harder to mess up, and it should allow for some big-to-big passes that will help add rim pressure. Grant Williams is a good defender, but there are many ways Victor and the Spurs can avoid playing into his strengths.

The Irving shot felt like game, but I'm not sure a Luka and-1 would've felt like it either. Wemby's foul trouble basically took him out of any Doncic drive. Ideally, Vic should be able to provide some help while still staying near his man. He sort of messed that up in the first quarter by overcommitting without help being there. But a more patient Wemby could've trusted his length, agility and timing to get him back to the play while not giving Dallas such an opening.

[spurs10]

That last two minutes were just hard to watch. If I were Kidd I'd be more worried about the Mavs who barely scrapped by. Their defense ain't gonna cut it. Mavs are lucky they won.

[Splits]

1717395380256768460

[RC_Drunkford]

This was a game where playing Wemby at the 5 on defense made the most sense. The Mavs scored at will at the rim, you could easily stop that with Wemby there. That‘s when we made the run in the 4th

[John B]

Are we having this much criticism had they won? Geez, they lost by 7 points to Luka beasting a triple-double. That and despite Wemby in foul trouble, understandable in his first NBA game. Pop will seat and show him films. He will adjust. The underlining is the 33 assists that means they are sharing. They committed 19 turnovers, but it’s a young team, youngest in the NBA. They will settle down and should be better next game. Moving on.

Geez, people writing a book after one game??

[Arcadian]

Rookie tracker

Wembanyama: 15/5/2/2/1
Miller: 13/3/2/0/0
Henderson: 11/3/4/0/0
Holmgren: 11/4/3/1/0

[Chinook]

Chinook I agree with most all you say, basically I had summed that up with too much “hero ball”. Everyone seems to have the green light to shoot and attack all the time, and when you lose concepts like good to great in the process or don’t get your best players enough looks that is what Pop needs to fix. Which seems very doable.

Hero-ball is part of it. But I think it also has to do with Pop not really coaching offense over the past six years. Basically the whole DeRozan era was a slow decline in Pop's offensive involvement. Maybe it was Murray getting hurt sort of borking the whole plan he had going into that season or DeRozan and LMA not wanting to do any of that "system" stuff. But basically the Spurs' offense has built more on ideas and players rather than Xs and O's. Older heads will remember me bitching about the "amoeba" philosophy and Pop's push for multiple PGs that really started with Kidd or at least Ford but only really bloomed with DeRozan, White and Murray. Post LMA we saw it dubbed a "hydra" offense with guys like Johnson lighting it up in the bubble playing in a smaller-ball unit. They ran that the next year and sort of pushed Aldridge out to run with a guy like Poeltl who could run with the guys and clean up after them on both ends. Then as that next season went on they started getting rid of their guards and replacing them with wings while maintaining their four-out positionless play-style. Eventually the fact that no one really learned to shoot meant Poeltl wasn't versatile enough for the offense, so they moved onto Collins.

By the time they drafted Wemby they ended up with a hodgepodge of guys who cut their teeth just sort of flailing on the court and opportunistic but not sound; willing passers, but underdeveloped play-makers; versatile, but without skills to truly hang their hats on. Through circumstance, yes, but also through deliberate decisions by PATFO, the Spurs find themselves trying to create order out of chaos. They're trying to make a serious system with guys who've never had to have that level of accountability. We'll see how that process plays out. Step one of the whole thing is Pop intervening, and I don't know that he has any intention to do so, whether this year or ever again.

[spursparker9]

Rookie tracker:

Wembanyama: 15/9/2/2/1
Miller: 13/3/2/0/0
Henderson: 11/3/4/0/0
Holmgren: 11/4/3/1/0

:lol Look like Wemby still in the lead for ROY

[spursparker9]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1CzbMmyCxeQ

[ace3g]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a0NBa3AgMz0


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TqakmpddibE

[spursparker9]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ng0CVqdAkPk

[spursparker9]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cnlVAMx0K2I

[SPURt]

Pretty great first half. The Spurs kept it tight in the second and got less than 25 mins with VW due to Wemby fouling. For being a team that just won the lottery when Wembayama sits, wasn’t a horrible start. The last few possessions were trash though. They’ll clean it up.

[John B]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a0NBa3AgMz0


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TqakmpddibE

Man I really have to give credit to Devin working on his body in the off season. He looks so much stronger, plays with a lot of confidence ready to take the team on his back, posting 23 points in his 1st game. I think we will see the same numbers from him, and even more once Wemby really gets more touches and openning the lanes for Devin. From 18 pts last season, I expect him at nearly 25 points a night. I hope he still gets considered for MIP if he continues, but likely an AS with that kind of number. Good stuff.

[Floyd Pacquiao]

https://x.com/spurs_muse/status/1717402999776063772?s=46&t=LuwMf5WBB-5n035NQ5t8gg

[k830713]

Lively 16/10/1/1/1

[Rocalcio]

I stopped watching the game at the end of the third, it was 5:30 am in France, I needed to sleep a bit more and for me the fourth would have been the same disappointment. I just watched it in replay, what an end of game !
Without the foul trouble he could have had a monster game. With the win it would have been the perfect story for a debut. So encouraging !

[Fizziksman]

Silver needs to fire these refs after getting one of the most anticipated rookies debut into foul trouble.

[spurraider21]

Silver needs to fire these refs after getting one of the most anticipated rookies debut into foul trouble.
Wemby committed dumb fouls. It’s on him

[playbonner15]

Lively 16/10/1/1/1
Lively ROY

[Obstructed_View]

Wemby committed dumb fouls. It’s on him
The first one wasn't a foul. It was on Pop to challenge it. With that foul rescinded, the rest of the game is different.

[Obstructed_View]

KJ has to learn to dial it back in crunchtime. He's a likeable guy and a leader on the team, but going 1 on 1 is not his game. Him attacking the teeth of the defense wrecklessly is also not ideal.

Honestly, the best halfcourt offense down the stretch might be to just give Wemby the ball and have him shoot over his defender from literally anywhere on the court. It's so easy for him to get his shot off.
Going one-on-one I could live with. He went one-on-three.

[Obstructed_View]

Meanwhile, Dejounte Murray (-15) and Demar Derozan (-29) led their teams in minus/plus in losses.

Be grateful.

[Rocalcio]

It’s gonna be a season of ups and downs. The only ones bitching are the ones that thought this was an automatic 50 win playoff team. :lol

Damn it’s so annoying reading idiots complaining about guys who play for the team they support, some of them were only posting to bitch about that. Just go away and support the Warriors like all bandwagonners.

[Rocalcio]

The Serbian guy is good

Should have taken the under

He’s from Slovenia…

[GAustex]

He’s from Slovenia…
I even googled it but got Modric
My bad

[tapiefan]

Rookie tracker

Wembanyama: 15/9/2/2/1
Miller: 13/3/2/0/0
Henderson: 11/3/4/0/0
Holmgren: 11/4/3/1/0

15/5/2/2/1 (5 boards, not 9)

[Raven]

Said it before... NOT starting Tre Jones is stupid. Tre is the Brian Drew of the Spurs (QB from Draft Day Movie). Jeremy certainly belongs but as a PF. Sorry but Kelden should be the odd man out. He could be great all in all but TJ should be running the team. Regardless... this was or should have been a helluva learning experience for the team. Like always, it's up to Pop NOT to continue to fuck things up.

i really don't see why keldon or sochan can't run a pick and roll, it's a learnable skill they just have to practice it... we have time

[RC_Drunkford]

15/5/2/2/1 (5 boards, not 9)

Modric is Croatian

[spursparker9]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y2oiMOceCY4

[spurraider21]

The first one wasn't a foul. It was on Pop to challenge it. With that foul rescinded, the rest of the game is different.
I’m not sure. Have to go back and find a replay. But i remember watching it live and didn’t think it was awful. I think another officiating crew might have made a non call but I’m not sure it was egregious enough to be overturned. I thought the level of contact was unnecessary. Wemby has enough length to give guys some space and block shots anyway.

the foul that was maybe the most annoying was the one on his forearm in post position. But it’s something he has to be careful with

[Obstructed_View]

I’m not sure. Have to go back and find a replay. But i remember watching it live and didn’t think it was awful. I think another officiating crew might have made a non call but I’m not sure it was egregious enough to be overturned. I thought the level of contact was unnecessary. Wemby has enough length to give guys some space and block shots anyway.

the foul that was maybe the most annoying was the one on his forearm in post position. But it’s something he has to be careful with
There was contact, but Vic went straight up. Textbook verticality call.

Yeah, the offensive foul was bullshit, but without that first foul, it wouldn't have been cause to take him off the floor.

[Arcadian]

15/5/2/2/1 (5 boards, not 9)

My bad, edited

[spurraider21]

There was contact, but Vic went straight up. Textbook verticality call.

Yeah, the offensive foul was bullshit, but without that first foul, it wouldn't have been cause to take him off the floor.
you may be right. i havent seen a replay of either of those since the game, so im just going off my live impression

[Obstructed_View]

you may be right. i havent seen a replay of either of those since the game, so im just going off my live impression
So am I. I could be wrong. But Pop was pretty free with the challenges in the preseason and didn't use any last night.

[heyheymymy]

Maybe Doncic is Slovenian for "I need Wemby on his 5th foul to win games"

Spurs were like 68-54 in the third quarter. Kinda seems like Spurs were trouncing the Mavs. Go watch, SA was pulling away before some suppression came down. Kinda funny when Wemby was unleashed in the 4th with his 5 fouls he was TORCHING the Mavs and leveled the game up. Wonder what would've happened if he was allowed to play but that would bruise Luka's marketability so can't have that. To be fair, Wemby's gotta be smarter and manage his foul situation, total rookie mistake/exploit.

Lively was bouncing around like a pinball machine, not sure about all his action but hats off to the effort. Does seem like he was allowed to be a bull in a china shop a bit though I don't have many specific qualms other than him going over the back on Zollins but it was a foul on Zollins. Lots of "automatic" and 1s for Luka that were BS. Who was it Kyrie? did the classic Harden jump into defender unnaturally to get contact during jumpshot that I thought the league wasn't calling that shit anymore?

Wemby struggled with calls on his screens and yeah they technically weren't perfect but you see that as non-calls all the time so I don't appreciate the fucking magnifying glass on Wemby last night (esp when it's a blind eye on the other end) when it's his rookie debut you just gotta let em play. Refs put the stranglehold on this game, some absurd level non genuine game feel going on. Refs diddled this game. Waaaaay too much extraneous orchestration, why not just tie one hand behind Wemby's back and suck Luka's dick some more? Sochan got thrashed on one of those last plays going for a Reb, no call. Williams was manhandling all game with no whistle scrutiny. Was hilarious watching Cubes Pubes celebrating his rig job win like a 12 year old kid.

Some salty media exec or some greedy Vegas oddsmen wielding too much influence over the game. Wemby is going to get the last laugh buster.

That said, KJ had a 3Q cold streak that hurt, Sochan trying too much offensively and not connecting, Zollins whipping up some bad looks from 3PT in the 3rd Q killed SA (0-4 3PM and I think 3 of those were in a short span of the 3rd), pulling Tre for Sochan at 2:00 4Q hurt SA bad. Tre left the game right at 25 min, wonder if there was a mins cap for him specifically at 25 or something because he was a hot hand and it was not a good idea to pull him there unless you are managing some wear and tear and has preset his cap at 25. Other players got more mins so it would have to be some specific rule for Tre who knows maybe he's not in shape yet or dealing with a nag injury? Why pull him there?

[Sugus]

:lol Spurstalk early dramatic cliffjumping is always delicious to read through, what a tradition it's turned into.

I take it all the folks ITT saying Sochan is trash and can never be a PG were following a different team through Dejounte's journey from rookie "coudln't dribble if they paid him gold for it" to All-Star PG a few years later with Spurs' development staff? So many comments seem just copy-pasted from that era, it's insane. We just watched this, those who have been following the team at least.

Anyways, nothing majorly problematic was seen last night, which is great. Rookie team, lots of mistakes, crunchtime worries - did anyone expect differently? And to that folk saying Wemby's night was "ruined", uh, he had a great opener, WYM? Every game Wemby gets through without injuries or injury scares in his first few years is a W in my book tbh.

[ace3g]

https://twitter.com/Josh810/status/1717654760055058759

[spurraider21]

3 missed calls all on same possession

first, collins traveled and they didnt call it. ball went to keldon, he got hacked and didnt get called, then sochan got the rebound and was hacked when he was stripped and went uncalled. if they just called the original travel on collins, the rest wouldnt have happened