What's good LJ

[benefactor]

I want to get some timvp thoughts on what's the answer here. I know it's early. I know we need patience, but what do we do about this roster? What do we do about this point guard who is not a point guard? What do we do about the rest of these players? Is it more about us just waiting out the season and seeing how it goes and then possibly subtracting and adding players. This roster is actually worth keeping? I want to pick your brain brother. Let's have it. I'll bring some old school thoughts of my own.

[benefactor]

I'm off the next couple weeks on injury from work. So I'm down to put some thoughts in if you were down to put some in as well.

[benefactor]

As for me, I plan on doing some individual breakdowns of players thus far in this season and posting them here. Looking for good discussion from some of my old school posters.

[spurraider21]

they drafted wemby and otherwise brought back the roster they just tanked with. its been apparent this is a "lets see what we have" year.

there will be some games where victor overwhelms. there will be games when our team is overwhelmed. but this isnt going to be a team that plays with the consistency needed to make a playoff push

it feels really weird to put the team in any kind of box because you never know which nights the Wemby volcano will erupt. if you call the team trash, you'll look stupid when we put the tubes to phoenix and them hold off a comeback. but if you say this team is ready for the next step, you'll look stupid when we lose by 40 to the pacers

missing vassell hurts the consistency somewhat, but he's not a guy who really controls the game

[Robz4000]

It's another stealth tank tbh. If Wemby drags this roster to the postseason, cool, but PATFO are seeing who is worth keeping, who can be packaged for a player/asset, and who should be outright cut. That being said, Pop isn't doing anyone any favors with his coaching this season.

[benefactor]

I will go ahead and start with the obvious one.

Jeremy Sochan - PG

I am not truly sure what led to this experiment, but here we are. All teams look back at the picks they made and realize it was a mistake to take a player as high as they did. This one is no exception. Now that said...this does not mean Sochan has no value. I honestly feel like if he was put at a different role he could excel. His passing is not PG level passing, but he has the ability to be an above average passer if put in the right situation. Right now he has been put in a place to fail. Fans have turned on him and for good reason. Putting him at PG takes away most of his natural fluidity as a player. He'd be much better served moving and roaming through the offense then trying to set up the offense. Setting up Wemby becomes easier if a guy like Sochan is moving around off the ball...as he is not near the ball hog some of these current players are on offense.

I see people saying Sochan has no redeemable skills. I personally don't believe that. I think the skills he has have been muted by his role and if he were able to be put in a role that was more in line with what he can bring to the table he could be a decent role player. He should be more of a passing forward...in the mold of Draymond Green...but obviously not that prolific. This will set him up for opportunities at the rim as well. It remains to be seen if the Spurs can find a way to utilize his value...or keep playing him out of position and watching him walk or trading him.

[benefactor]

It's another stealth tank tbh. If Wemby drags this roster to the postseason, cool, but PATFO are seeing who is worth keeping, who can be packaged for a player/asset, and who should be outright cut. That being said, Pop isn't doing anyone any favors with his coaching this season.
I'm going to have a little bit of patience and hold judgment on Pop. I know I've gotten emotional and had my "fuck Pop" moments...as we all will...but we will give it time and see if he is just holding his cards and waiting on the roster to show him what he needs to see.

[Robz4000]

I will go ahead and start with the obvious one.

Jeremy Sochan - PG

I am not truly sure what led to this experiment, but here we are. All teams look back at the picks they made and realize it was a mistake to take a player as high as they did. This one is no exception. Now that said...this does not mean Sochan has no value. I honestly feel like if he was put at a different role he could excel. His passing is not PG level passing, but he has the ability to be an above average passer if put in the right situation. Right now he has been put in a place to fail. Fans have turned on him and for good reason. Putting him at PG takes away most of his natural fluidity as a player. He'd be much better served moving and roaming through the offense then trying to set up the offense. Setting up Wemby becomes easier if a guy like Sochan is moving around off the ball...as he is not near the ball hog some of these current players are on offense.

I see people saying Sochan has no redeemable skills. I personally don't believe that. I think the skills he has have been muted by his role and if he were able to be put in a role that was more in line with what he can bring to the table he could be a decent role player. He should be more of a passing forward...in the mold of Draymond Green...but obviously not that prolific. This will set him up for opportunities at the rim as well. It remains to be seen if the Spurs can find a way to utilize his value...or keep playing him out of position and watching him walk or trading him.

Still like Sochan myself and think he'll be a long-term piece. This experiment with him at PG needs to end, however. Just gonna have to bite the bullet on who gets benched between him and Keldon.

[timtonymanu]

I will go ahead and start with the obvious one.

Jeremy Sochan - PG

I am not truly sure what led to this experiment, but here we are. All teams look back at the picks they made and realize it was a mistake to take a player as high as they did. This one is no exception. Now that said...this does not mean Sochan has no value. I honestly feel like if he was put at a different role he could excel. His passing is not PG level passing, but he has the ability to be an above average passer if put in the right situation. Right now he has been put in a place to fail. Fans have turned on him and for good reason. Putting him at PG takes away most of his natural fluidity as a player. He'd be much better served moving and roaming through the offense then trying to set up the offense. Setting up Wemby becomes easier if a guy like Sochan is moving around off the ball...as he is not near the ball hog some of these current players are on offense.

I see people saying Sochan has no redeemable skills. I personally don't believe that. I think the skills he has have been muted by his role and if he were able to be put in a role that was more in line with what he can bring to the table he could be a decent role player. He should be more of a passing forward...in the mold of Draymond Green...but obviously not that prolific. This will set him up for opportunities at the rim as well. It remains to be seen if the Spurs can find a way to utilize his value...or keep playing him out of position and watching him walk or trading him.

I’m a sochan defender (moreso the retarded “he’s jealous of Wemby and doesn’t want to share the ball” nonsense but I agree with all of this. Pretty frustrating that pop has put him in a position to fail just because we don’t have any starting PG. sochan was solid last year too

[baseline bum]

It's another stealth tank tbh. If Wemby drags this roster to the postseason, cool, but PATFO are seeing who is worth keeping, who can be packaged for a player/asset, and who should be outright cut. That being said, Pop isn't doing anyone any favors with his coaching this season.

Who are you even tanking for this year though?

[Pauleta14]

Tanking for a kid that will need a lot of time to develop is really smart.

Wemby must love the idea to compete in 4-5 years

[AusSpur]

Sochan's 8 game post-all star stretch was very promising, averaging 16.9ppg, 7.4rpg, 2.5apg (this includes an 8 minute injury game - team record 4-4) and I was hoping for bigger and better things for him this year.

Obviously the Wemby/PG situations have altered his path substantially.

I am not totally against the PG experiment, as the aim is to have our best 5 players on the court. But I can't understand why he can't ease into the position by still getting reps off ball at the forward positions.

Instead of the first sub being only Osman for Wemby, maybe Tre comes on here too and Sochan slides to the four. It would help maintain his confidence as his PG skills build.

[rascal]

Tanking for a kid that will need a lot of time to develop is really smart.

Wemby must love the idea to compete in 4-5 years

There are three or four pgs in this year's draft who will be better than what the Spurs currently have from year one.

[BackHome]

Tanking for a kid that will need a lot of time to develop is really smart.

Wemby must love the idea to compete in 4-5 years

That's how the Spurs won all those Champions we not the Flakers we are not a free agency destination

[Robz4000]

Who are you even tanking for this year though?

It's a pretty stacked PG draft tbh. Spurs won't be bad enough to get the top two with their own pick but if they like either enough they can easily put together a package to get them.

[baseline bum]

It's a pretty stacked PG draft tbh. Spurs won't be bad enough to get the top two with their own pick but if they like either enough they can easily put together a package to get them.

Just like this year's draft? :lol

[Robz4000]

Just like this year's draft? :lol

:lol

[rascal]

Just like this year's draft? :lol

Next year's draft is better.

[baseline bum]

Next year's draft is better.

I meant the Spurs trading up

[rascal]

I meant the Spurs trading up

Agree, Spurs are not proactive on draft day trading up. There were possibilities like going after Duren the year before.

[Dex]

It's another stealth tank tbh. If Wemby drags this roster to the postseason, cool, but PATFO are seeing who is worth keeping, who can be packaged for a player/asset, and who should be outright cut. That being said, Pop isn't doing anyone any favors with his coaching this season.

Sadly, I'm starting to think this may be the case. And I say "sadly" because I enjoy watching the Spurs win games.

But IMO...Sochan at point guard just isn't working. He just looks out of place, and it causes the entire offense to suffer. Even worse, he gets frustrated and then his defense seems to regress.

If Parker was the engine that made the Spurs go, he was a Ferrari and Sochan is a Kia.

Obviously that could change as he learns and gets used to the position, but early returns just aren't good. It's also giving Sochan a chance to develop passing and play-making in ways that he might not normally get just playing as a forward, and that should pay dividends in the future.

What it does ensure is that the Spurs won't win TOO MANY games, and there is no denying adding another lottery pick to this group would be helpful.

If there IS a proper combination to put on the floor and the team plays up to its potential...their ceiling is probably still play-in team or first-round exit...so as nice as it would be to get back to the playoffs, that doesn't do much for the future other than building confidence.

[exstatic]

Sadly, I'm starting to think this may be the case. And I say "sadly" because I enjoy watching the Spurs win games.

But IMO...Sochan at point guard just isn't working. He just looks out of place, and it causes the entire offense to suffer. Even worse, he gets frustrated and then his defense seems to regress.

If Parker was the engine that made the Spurs go, he was a Ferrari and Sochan is a Kia.

Obviously that could change as he learns and gets used to the position, but early returns just aren't good. It's also giving Sochan a chance to develop passing and play-making in ways that he might not normally get just playing as a forward, and that should pay dividends in the future.

What it does ensure is that the Spurs won't win TOO MANY games, and there is no denying adding another lottery pick to this group would be helpful.

If there IS a proper combination to put on the floor and the team plays up to its potential...their ceiling is probably still play-in team or first-round exit...so as nice as it would be to get back to the playoffs, that doesn't do much for the future other than building confidence.

To expect Sochan to even be in spitting distance of HOFer Tony Parker is ridiculous. Hell, Tony Parker didn't start looking like an All Star until like season 4 or 5.

[Mugen]

Season has gone as expected so far tbh.

[Dex]

To expect Sochan to even be in spitting distance of HOFer Tony Parker is ridiculous. Hell, Tony Parker didn't start looking like an All Star until like season 4 or 5.

I'm not suggesting Sochan should be Tony Parker in year 2. I'm just making the comparison between someone who ran a beautiful offense (in his later years), and someone who is still trying to figure out how an offense runs.

I'd love to see Sochan develop some point-forward skills like we had with Bobo, but even Diaw never ran point full time for the Spurs.

I feel like it's becoming a square peg / round hole situation here...but hey, Pop has obviously decided to see if the kid will sink or swim.

[rjv]

my expectations have never been all that high for this season. i want Wemby to develop and hold off amish teen wolf giant Holmgrem from ROTY, for Devin to make his mark as a reliable scorer and defender. if keldon can somehow show us more this season, even better.

[TrainOfThought5]

Season has gone as expected so far tbh.

young team is 3-4 on the season, with ups and downs. Yeah it’s about right… because If we win against Toronto we’d be 4-4. That’s overachieving tbh.

[BacktoBasics]

young team is 3-4 on the season, with ups and downs. Yeah it’s about right… because If we win against Toronto we’d be 4-4. That’s overachieving tbh.

It’s also exactly what the organization said they would do.

1. They wouldn’t through money away in free agency and risk cap flexibility… because there were no major game changing moves available.

2. They’re not going to package up any current heavy rotation players because they wanted to get a look at what they had alongside Wemby.

3. They aren’t going to move all these potential picks until 2 happens or it’s a clear deal that unquestionably solidifies a major need. Without heavily compromising the timeline IE trading for Lilliard.

We’re a half dozen games in and everyone wants them to “do something”. For fucks sake… can they at least have a half season to play around with things and develop guys in and out of position.

Yeah it’s tough seeing Sochan at point but there’s no indication that they see this as a long term solution. It’s a means to an end and Sochan isn’t gonna be worse off for the work. Should improve his handles and ability to set up things down the road.

[TD 21]

We’re a half dozen games in and everyone wants them to “do something”. For fucks sake… can they at least have a half season to play around with things and develop guys in and out of position.

Yeah it’s tough seeing Sochan at point but there’s no indication that they see this as a long term solution. It’s a means to an end and Sochan isn’t gonna be worse off for the work. Should improve his handles and ability to set up things down the road.

I keep hearing this, but it's not so black and white. I don't see most suggesting they blow their load in regards to assets to attempt to solve this issue now, most are just saying start Jones, maybe insert Graham into the rotation, etc. Minor changes so that they can run a functional half court offense.

Sochan might be worse off if his confidence is dented and he loses developmental time in the role he should be in.

[BacktoBasics]

I keep hearing this, but it's not so black and white. I don't see most suggesting they blow their load in regards to assets to attempt to solve this issue now, most are just saying start Jones, maybe insert Graham into the rotation, etc. Minor changes so that they can run a functional half court offense.

Sochan might be worse off if his confidence is dented and he loses developmental time in the role he should be in.

I’m completely open to your first paragraph. Both suggestions are things I’d have no issue with.

But obviously this Sochan thing is a deliberate attempt to accomplish something so it may just need to run its course. Jeremy doesn’t strike me as someone whose confidence would be easily compromised. If he can set aside his ego and aesthetics to take one handed free throws I have little concern about his psyche from playing wildly out of position.

Dude is a bit of a free thinker. I don’t see that going south.

[BackHome]

To be honest if Sochan ego is being hurt then he is not the type of person we need on our team if we ever thinking of winning a Championship. But, I agree with BB I don't think he has a weak mind and I think he is on board with what they are attempting to do so will wait and see what happens. To me I personally don't think it will work out for him as our PG of the future but I definitely think him playing point will help us and his career long term.

This team is going to look drastically different in the next two years.......so sit back and enjoy Wemby as they grow up so fast..

[Tyronn Lue]

Spurs don't need more rookies, so tanking is not likely. They need a savvy veteran presence at least one. Victor shouldn't be the blame/credit guy this early and the other pieces don't make blame/credit salary.

[Chomag]

SPURS FO should be looking to trade for a solid vet that compliments Wenby because Wemby doesn't need more rookies alongside him. He is the guy and needs to be treated as such.

Just look how the Bulls did it to go on their dominant runs with Michael Jorden and Pipen (Wemby and Visal as parallel) the rest of the team that they built around those two was mostly solid vets that they would change out over the years.

This team doesn't need another lottery pick is what I'm saying, they have enough there. The FO just needs to stop acting stupid and add players that our franchise player needs.

[rjv]

Spurs don't need more rookies, so tanking is not likely. They need a savvy veteran presence at least one. Victor shouldn't be the blame/credit guy this early and the other pieces don't make blame/credit salary.

spurs don't need any more middle of the road rookies but they can certainly use more talent, regardless of where it comes from. my hope is that they are using this year to gauge what players will play a role in the future and which players will not. then, use their draft and free agency to begin the process of building that core into a contender over the next few years. this is not going to happen overnight so i think rookies can still very much be a part of this process.

[Tyronn Lue]

spurs don't need any more middle of the road rookies but they can certainly use more talent, regardless of where it comes from. my hope is that they are using this year to gauge what players will play a role in the future and which players will not. then, use their draft and free agency to begin the process of building that core into a contender over the next few years. this is not going to happen overnight so i think rookies can still very much be a part of this process.
I'm saying you don't get a generational talent then tank again. Spurs have to play to win, not spend 82 games experimenting with what's likely to be a group of NBA journeymen.

[exstatic]

I'm saying you don't get a generational talent then tank again. Spurs have to play to win, not spend 82 games experimenting with what's likely to be a group of NBA journeymen.

I’m sure the Holts will be calling you for an interview.

[spurs10]

Yes it is perplexing watching the Sochan experiment, though he was one of our best players at MSG. I heard before the season we were 'paying to win.' I think Pop is not out there desperate to win and is giving these guys some playing time and experience. So I'll refrain from panicking and try to be patient.

[rankingtear]

I'm saying you don't get a generational talent then tank again. Spurs have to play to win, not spend 82 games experimenting with what's likely to be a group of NBA journeymen.

There is no really a clear cut formula. Generational talents don't win anything this early. Some try to accelerate some try to be patient, it still ends up that the prime years of your superstar is the clear championship window.

[exstatic]

Yes it is perplexing watching the Sochan experiment, though he was one of our best players at MSG. I heard before the season we were 'paying to win.' I think Pop is not out there desperate to win and is giving these guys some playing time and experience. So I'll refrain from panicking and try to be patient.

If that is supposed to say ‘playing to win’, you heard wrong. In every interview Pop has consistently said that this was an experimental season, that they were trying to see what worked, in terms of player combinations and plays.

[Old School 44]

Nice idea to try Sochan at pg, but it’s just not working, go back to Tre and move Sochan to sixth man.
Although I appreciate the effort, Wemby needs to not go after everything on defense. He’s wearing himself out.

[exstatic]

Nice idea to try Sochan at pg, but it’s just not working, go back to Tre and move Sochan to sixth man.
Although I appreciate the effort, Wemby needs to not go after everything on defense. He’s wearing himself out.

IT'S
BEEN
EIGHT
GAMES

[spurs10]

If that is supposed to say ‘playing to win’, you heard wrong. In every interview Pop has consistently said that this was an experimental season, that they were trying to see what worked, in terms of player combinations and plays. Yes, a typo, but thats good to hear. That's the whole story there, Pop is experimenting as he should. People like to see wins, but best temper their expectations.

[Tyronn Lue]

I’m sure the Holts will be calling you for an interview.
Likewise, asshole

[Tyronn Lue]

There is no really a clear cut formula. Generational talents don't win anything this early. Some try to accelerate some try to be patient, it still ends up that the prime years of your superstar is the clear championship window.
It's not championship or nothing. There's a lot of success in just making the playoffs.

[Old School 44]

IT'S
BEEN
EIGHT
GAMES
NOW
IT’S
NINE ☹️

[jeebus]

I want to get some timvp thoughts on what's the answer here. I know it's early. I know we need patience, but what do we do about this roster? What do we do about this point guard who is not a point guard? What do we do about the rest of these players? Is it more about us just waiting out the season and seeing how it goes and then possibly subtracting and adding players. This roster is actually worth keeping? I want to pick your brain brother. Let's have it. I'll bring some old school thoughts of my own.

son do you believe timvp will talk with us peasants now that the season is over?

[ismael-robert]

He's probably thinking he'll give his input as long as yall keep yours to yourselves