Grades: Spurs vs. Bucks - Jan. 4, 2024

[timvp]

https://www.spurstalk.com/2024-spurs-bucks-grades-34/

Entertaining game, at least :tu

[yagozev]

:fro

[sananspursfan21]

This season is all about watching Wemby and to a lesser degree Vassell. Both delivered tremendously, so it was a great game. Besides his last shot, I loved what I saw from Tre too. I hope these guys see this game as an actual moral victory.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

It’s clear that you add some decent PG play and the team is immediately more competitive. Weird the Spurs won’t do that for Victor and just the mental health of this group. I hope they can add even a little depth at the position by the trade deadline. One average point guard on an entire NBA roster? What team does that when you have a generational talent on your squad?

But all in all this was a great showcase for the young Spurs and what’s possible for Victor.

[AusSpur]

Pop's 'you don't need a point guard despite everything' hill, is certainly a strange one to die on.

[CorrectCrusader]

Sochan finally got an F grade

[CGD]

Wow, don’t think I’ve ever seen an F before. It was well earned tho.

[TheGreatYacht]

Best grades of the season :tu I was going to say that Pop deserved a bit better until I saw that McDermott was out due to injury and not from the coach’s decision.

That was a great game. It’s a shame Collins, Branham, and McDermott will all be back soon to ruin it. Just hope Tre remains in the SL where he belongs

[John B]

Thanks Timvp. I have to disagree on several points. Firstly you mentioned Wemby hesitating on 3’s. Boy, I thought he should’ve hesitated more. I thought he was a bit impatient shooting the 3’s and should wait to develop sone semblance of team offense. Wemby as great as he is, needs to fathom his offense some on Jokic, developing plays on top of the key. Yes sending them some, but also wait for cutters for nifty passes. It will take for his teammates to make strong cuts to the hoops, but Wemby needs to learn to traffic those.

Wesley’s defense when he’s out there is elite. Several times he was the reason the Bucks POA slowed down. He was a plug out there and affected the player(s) he was guarding setting a play. I think he is a big reason why the Spurs are not giving up big leads lately or not getting down as much. He is a big plug in the POA hole. I really wish Pop could find more minutes for Wesley especially when keeping the leads. Imo the Spurs don’t have as much problem scoring, but sustaining and keeping the leads. And that’s where Wesley could do a lot of help.

Barlow is so nice to watch out there. I hope he keeps healthy because he can help. His rebounding is great, his perimeter defense is great. He has touches around the elbow. He is definitely making the most of his opportunities with Bassey and Collins out. If he could find consistency in shooting outside, I would start believing he could play along with Wemby in the PF position. He has the length, the lateral mobility and the dog in him. Barlow could be a special player if he could continue improving. And he should at only 20 years old.

I thought Sochan had some good defensive rebounds. I wish he would try attacking the board more, and not stop his momentum once he gets to the paint. He should try to finish with contact ala Keldon. Sochan is becoming predictable stopping his penetration once he gets to the paint. He is overthinking (albeit could be affected by the PG experiment) and just start to play loose. He has improved skills, but negated by overthinking. It takes a lot of practice to translate them to instincts, muscle memory to just let the plays develop. I’m still rooting for the kid. He is a very hard worker and willing to do anything out there for the team. He is team first imo. So I feel bad that so called “Spurs fans” crucify him, instead of encouraging him. I think with his athleticism, his dog in him and his willingness to learn, he would be a great asset once he puts them all together. He has shown glimpses, just need to trust his skills and let the game flow.

I wish they won. Still I rather the Spurs get two top 10 picks that will help them a lot either by drafting or using as trade assets for that elusive PG and veteran help. GSG!

[Seventyniner]

The Spurs play one of their best games of the season (a low bar tbh), Sochan gets an F, Pop gets a D+. Per par...?

[The Truth #6]

I'm surprising myself to find that I'm much higher on Blake Wesley than I thought I would be over the last two games. I'm not saying his production is actually great, but at least he's playing solid defense as far as I can tell, or at the least trying to play defense, and he's reducing for the most part his trauma-inducing defeats at the rim. I don't know if last night's rotation is feasible long-term, but whoever didn't play last night, I'm not really missing them. And Blake is showing progress and his potential skills are hugely needed: play aggressive defensive and drive and kick. Just do that. Please trade Doug asap.

[John B]

I'm surprising myself to find that I'm much higher on Blake Wesley than I thought I would be over the last two games. I'm not saying his production is actually great, but at least he's playing solid defense as far as I can tell, or at the least trying to play defense, and he's reducing for the most part his trauma-inducing defeats at the rim. I don't know if last night's rotation is feasible long-term, but whoever didn't play last night, I'm not really missing them. And Blake is showing progress and his potential skills are hugely needed: play aggressive defensive and drive and kick. Just do that. Please trade Doug asap.

His dribble penetration is effective. The stats don’t show the assist, but those lead to connecting passes. But the most impressive is his defense. I’m not much on metrics, but I’m sure he has great defensive rating especially defending the POA.

[The Truth #6]

He seemed relatively effective against Ja and Dame, I mean way better than Branham. He didn't back down defending them. It helps set a tone. If nothing else, it makes the games less painful to watch.

[heyheymymy]

Best part about that wemby block is it's everywhere on nba sites today thus highlighting the bullshit shoulder dip and slam Gianis does on EVERY drive.

Badass that wemby absorbed the football hit and still got the clean block

[spurraider21]

Grades:
timvp: A+

[onechance87]

such a shame tre jones cant shoot....we would be so much better

[Dverde]

With the Spurs needing three points, having Sochan and Jones on the court late was a head-scratcher. :bobo

[NASpurs]

Uh oh the floodgates have been opened. An actual F was handed out for the first time instead of a D-.

[spurraider21]

Mugen get your ass in here

[John B]

Best part about that wemby block is it's everywhere on nba sites today thus highlighting the bullshit shoulder dip and slam Gianis does on EVERY drive.

Badass that wemby absorbed the football hit and still got the clean block

That was not easy to block a strong Giannis the Freak head on. Wemby’s stock should go up much especially with the fan votes, he’s currently 8th in the West (not including guards) behind Sengun but two higher than Chet

[cd98]

People can say what they want, but I can't complain about any performance yesterday. Yes, the Spurs lost, which was expected. But I took my 12 year old to the game. He is a huge soccer fan, but had no interest in basketball. Still I tried to get him interested when I took him to the first Clippers game and he was fairly bored. So for Christmas, I got him a Wemby jersey and took him to the game last night. And what a show Wemby (and several other Spurs put on). He became a huge Wemby fan and was blown away with the throw it to himself and dunk it in the first half, the behind the back and dunk in the second half, the Lillard block, and of course the block on the Greek Freak. Though we both had to admit the Greek Freak's and-one dunk was special, Wemby did stuff that the casual person can't ignore as greatness. I remember falling in love with basketball after watching a young Michael Jordan torch the Knicks. I'm glad that Wemby could have that kind of an impact on my son, even in a loss.

And Kudos to fuego Vassell in that game and that crazy reverse windmill dunk by Keldon Johnson. I never left a Spurs loss so happy. Even when the Spurs are losing, we are lucky.

And Sochan may have got an "F", but to my son, him making two one-handed free throws stood out. I know we expect more from a lottery pick, but hey, can we enjoy that he is the only player in the NBA doing that.

[rascal]

Uh oh the floodgates have been opened. An actual F was handed out for the first time instead of a D-.

Your post is funny. While reading it I look over to see Sochan's smiling face.

[ginobilized]

Fun game to watch, great grades to read!

Wesley is starting to play under control, he doesn't look lost out there. He's got some real defensive potential and is finishing at the rim much better than last year.

Sochan really is not fitting in this season, he's so out of sync with where to be offensively. In the way is a good way to put it. It takes 5 players working together and we are finally getting 4 on the same page. Sochan and KJ are so often out of sync,

Wemby has a true competitive fire and clutch gene to go with size, grace, skill and high IQ. After he has faced every team a couple of times and adds some muscle, he will dominate the league. Also, if it hasn't been said enough, he's the best passer on the team.

Tre is our best bet to get the team organized. He's also the low-water mark for a PG for this squad. We just need someone better than him and things should start to improve.

Pop is a bit of a head-scratcher. He is so engaged and actively providing teaching moments to the youngsters. I can only imagine his teaching is on point basketball-wise. His overall coaching as a strategist, planner, and game manager seem off.

[rjv]

tre showed us why he is the best fit to start at PG this season and also why he is not the best fit to remain the starting PG beyond this season.

[Robz4000]

:wow Pop and Sochan get the grades they deserve

[SouthernFryd]

I was surprised at Sochan's numbers too. He looked so lost and just terrible out there. Yet, his numbers weren't bad, probably because he gets way too many minutes. You're gonna get something if you constantly playing over 30 minutes a game. I don't feel comfortable when he is on the court...especially in crucial final minutes. And he always is...

He needs to be coming off the bench. Who knows, it may be exactly what he needs.

[TimmehC]

Spurs had a chance to win in spite of Pop. The fact that Tre Jones was even in the game on that final play instead of Cedi when the team needed a three tells you all you need to know. Just mind-bogglingly stupid unless you're intentionally tanking.

[John B]

I was surprised at Sochan's numbers too. He looked so lost and just terrible out there. Yet, his numbers weren't bad, probably because he gets way too many minutes. You're gonna get something if you constantly playing over 30 minutes a game. I don't feel comfortable when he is on the court...especially in crucial final minutes. And he always is...

He needs to be coming off the bench. Who knows, it may be exactly what he needs.

On the contrary Sochan needs to be there more. The kid just started PG the 1st quarter of the season, arguably to improve his overall skills. He is overthinking out there, and just needs to let the game flow, and it’s by constant repetition, until they become instinctive. Sochan is athletic and has shown a willingness to learn and do everything. You don’t bench a 2nd year top 9 pick after he’s bought in trying different things. Already he improved his FT and shooting 37% at the arch. He’s a hard-worker and I’m sure only good things come out of hard work.

[SouthernFryd]

Coming off the bench is not necessarily a bad thing. Manu did it, Sochan can too.

He looks the most lost out of all the sub-par starters. He seems to never know where to be. Blame it Pop's PG experiment or whatever...but, he needs a LOT less minutes. And a try at coming off the bench might even showcase him a little more. It might work for him, because he looks terrible. I think the alternative to coming off the bench would be worse for him. Just sayin'

[freetiago]

Sochan is the dumbest player I’ve ever seen in a Spurs jersey. He can’t shoot so he can’t start next to Victor. On top of his airballs literally every game, the amount of times I see this clown running into people who have the ball to clog up the lane or running into a guy cutting is insane.

[Sugus]

On the contrary Sochan needs to be there more. The kid just started PG the 1st quarter of the season, arguably to improve his overall skills. He is overthinking out there, and just needs to let the game flow, and it’s by constant repetition, until they become instinctive. Sochan is athletic and has shown a willingness to learn and do everything. You don’t bench a 2nd year top 9 pick after he’s bought in trying different things. Already he improved his FT and shooting 37% at the arch. He’s a hard-worker and I’m sure only good things come out of hard work.

Exactly, why is this so hard to grasp? Prospects were halfway through their college career at his age 15 years ago. People are crazy demanding nowadays.

[spurraider21]

Exactly, why is this so hard to grasp? Prospects were halfway through their college career at his age 15 years ago. People are crazy demanding nowadays.
benching him isnt the trade as cutting him. let him prove he can be a net positive in a smaller role before giving him an expanded one

instead theyre just giving him the keys and waiting for him to figure all of it out

[The Truth #6]

So the alternative is to...start Mamu? Sochan is learning to finish at the rim, that's one deficiency of many he needs to work on, but we have time this year and he needs more time.

Blake somehow improved over time, so incremental change can happen. I'm not loving how he's playing at all, but I don't love the idea of just burying him for a player with even less of a ceiling. If they get a better player to play power forward in the offseason, then that's a different calculation.

[spurraider21]

its true that the spurs lack a starting caliber 4, especially after wemby moved to the 5

[JADG79]

Last timeout was unnecessary, we had the momentum.

[Mugen]

https://38.media.tumblr.com/d2d97e94e4b5bd5d9334cf2f85f88ddf/tumblr_n8tqcqPhPB1thowlgo1_250.gif

[CorrectCrusader]

Coming off the bench is not necessarily a bad thing. Manu did it, Sochan can too.

He looks the most lost out of all the sub-par starters. He seems to never know where to be. Blame it Pop's PG experiment or whatever...but, he needs a LOT less minutes. And a try at coming off the bench might even showcase him a little more. It might work for him, because he looks terrible. I think the alternative to coming off the bench would be worse for him. Just sayin'

Manu was a superstar level player.
Sochan is one of the worst in the NBA.

Let's not pretend they're the same.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

The Spurs play one of their best games of the season (a low bar tbh), Sochan gets an F, Pop gets a D+. Per par...?

Timvp hides his frustration better than most, but he’s obviously aware this team is underperforming. It’s really a dissservice to Wemby and the fan base that we’re making no attempt to be more competitive.

I’d love a snapshot of the blueprints for the grand rebuild because right now the payoff appears to be half a decade away and we’ve got a recent draft history of throwing random darts at the board, or so it seems from how these guys are panning out. If we’re committed to building through the draft, but can only pick a winner when it’s obvious, that payoff strategy may never come to fruition.

[SouthernFryd]

Sochan is the dumbest player I’ve ever seen in a Spurs jersey...the amount of times I see this clown running into people who have the ball to clog up the lane or running into a guy cutting is insane.

This. If you can't see this, you simply are not aware. He's always out of position, clogging the lanes and running into guys. It's ridiculous.

[cd98]

Sochan is the dumbest player I’ve ever seen in a Spurs jersey. He can’t shoot so he can’t start next to Victor. On top of his airballs literally every game, the amount of times I see this clown running into people who have the ball to clog up the lane or running into a guy cutting is insane.

In fairness, it’s really every player. The offense looks like a pick up game. And let’s not go overboard. He’s not the dumbest player in the NBA. He is a second year player with maybe 80 games of experience. He might flame out. Most players in the NBA do. But I’m giving him 3 seasons. If he was a better scorer, I’d say bring him off the bench. But he’s not. It’s a complement to KJ to come off the bench bc scoring drops significantly with this bench unit, especially without Collins. We can’t afford to not have a legit scorer come off the bench.

[DAF86]

timvp being bullied into giving Sochan an F.

[spurs10]

Thanks for the grades. There were some very great moments out there, especially for Wemby and Vassell. Thought Jones was good in the starting line-up. Biggest complaint was the defense on Los Freak when Wemby wasn't there. He passed right by Sochan without much resistance, Jones too, but that should be expected.

[ducks]

Well pop should have gotten a f but pretty good grades

[Chinook]

Has this been put in there yet?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2gH4Q055hLE&ab_channel=FilmSession

I honestly thought the Spurs did a good job for much of the game, but it's also clear they need to follow the "Giannis rules" and didn't really execute that at all down the stretch. As I've mentioned before, you see progress, but you also see reversion, on both ends.

[Leetonidas]

Is that the first time timvp gave someone an F :wow

[Raven]

thought tre deserved his patented D- and sochan an easy B, but whatever

[Splits]

1743104432475156589

[jjspur]

Its amazing what the spurs can do when they have a real point guard playing even in a loss. If only pop would use this lineup more, maybe we would win a few games against a lesser team. I know if we win more games we get a worse draft pick, however nobody from this draft has wowed me yet. I just hope the spurs win more than 10 games this season so they don't break the 76ers all time loss record. We can be bad to get a decent pick, we just don't have to be that bad. Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't this the worse won / loss percentage the spurs have had in their history ?