Grades: Spurs @ Kings - Feb. 22, 2024

[timvp]

https://www.spurstalk.com/2024-spurs-kings-grades-56/

[yagozev]

Thanks!

[Fireball]

Thanks for the grades. What a fun game. Wish Wemby had gotten that 5x5 ...

[SpursRussia]

8-21 for Wemby, countless bad shots, especially in crunch time, not moving the ball enough and he gets an A? His play in the 4th cost is a win. I love the guy and I think we should apply higher standards to him, he’s a leader of this team

[Dejounte]

8-21 for Wemby, countless bad shots, especially in crunch time, not moving the ball enough and he gets an A? His play in the 4th cost is a win. I love the guy and I think we should apply higher standards to him, he’s a leader of this team

Careful… you’re tooting the Pauleta horn. Wemby can do no wrong!

[John B]

Thanks for the grades. It was competitive and they got the L, and that, right now, is the best a Spurs fan can hope for. I like watching Wesley and I think he did a better job than C-. I think he is starting to assert himself more offensively and yet still within his role. Defensively he’s there harassing his guy full-court as always. I’d give Wesley a B.

Sochan’s spin moves and handles are greatly improving. He’s a student of the game and a gym rat and it shows with his vast improvement. On the contrary I like that he’s calling his own number more and being aggressive offensively. With 16 pts to show, I’d give Sochan a better grade than B-.

With 37 assists and only 8 TO’s, I think it was a pretty good outing. The Kings were just a little bit efficient shooting and got lucky with a no call on Wemby with less than a minute left, which gave the Kings lead instead. Still I’m happy for the L and a better cushion at 3rd worst. It couldn’t be better for me.

[ambchang]

The team is odd that they seem to have, at most, one player playing well at a time. When Vassell plays well, Victor doesn't, when Victor plays well (many games), every body else sucks, when Sochan plays well, Vassell sucks. If the team can have two or three players consistently play well, this is easily a 35-win team.

The players are trying, but they just seem so lost some times, it's almost like they know one of their teammates are hot, and they don't know what to do. Oh crap, Vassell is on fire, should I shoot or keep feeding him the ball?

They are playing like a pick up team, still. There are clear improvements from the ghastly games at the beginning of the season, but they have a looooooong way to go.

[LeBowen]

Collins needs to start getting DNPs.
This is inexcusable, he's horrible at every aspect of the game.

[MultiTroll]

8-21 for Wemby, countless bad shots, especially in crunch time, not moving the ball enough and he gets an A? His play in the 4th cost is a win. I love the guy and I think we should apply higher standards to him, he’s a leader of this team
True.
Also true Spurs don't have a snowballs chance in the 4th without Wemby.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Looked to me that the team practiced a time or two during the break while Sochan and Wemby were away. The second unit looked somewhat functional at times last night as opposed to their typical trainwwreck.

The closing unit still struggles to work together.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

True.
Also true Spurs don't have a snowballs chance in the 4th without Wemby.

Wemby found a way to contribute in the first half particularly on the boards. The first half was as well as I have ever seen him rebound. Shooting aside, he was getting straight worked down low by Sabonis. Now that tape is out there, everyone is going to be trying it.

[Mugen]

I really hope Barlowe starts getting minutes over Zollins soon man. Bottom 3 is going to be locked in pretty soon tbh.

[MannyIsGod]

Wemby found a way to contribute in the first half particularly on the boards. The first half was as well as I have ever seen him rebound. Shooting aside, he was getting straight worked down low by Sabonis. Now that tape is out there, everyone is going to be trying it.

lol, you think it took an NBA team until 50+ games in to the season to figure out that they should try to push around the rail thin tall guy? Other teams can try it, but how many other teams have a guy like Sabonis? And Wemby gave as good as he got blocking him or making him miss shots several times.

Everyone has been trying Wemby all year and all that's done is led to him leading the NBA in blocks.

[MannyIsGod]

This was a perfect game at this point in the season. Competitive, and fun to watch, young guys played good and showed flashes, and we managed to fuck it up in the last 2 minutes. This is the exact type of game they can learn from.

[rjv]

can we just waive morris so barlow can get signed to an NBA contract? collins level of awfulness has reached an all time-low. i'd rather have barlow out there at this point.

[couchman]

I agree that we need to start applying a higher standard to Wemby.
These grades are obviously given on a curve based on expectations, and I think we can all agree that expectations have gone up for Wemby.
This performance would absolutely be worthy of an A early in the season.
We should expect more going forward.

He is so talented, that even on a bad night he stuffs the stat sheet and gives his team a chance to win.
His backup is so fucking bad that a tough night from Wemby is still pretty good.
But let's be honest, last night was a BAD night for Wemby.
On offense where he took too many tough 2 point jumpers early and missed them all. For the game he missed five straight 3pointers before finally making one late in the 4th quarter.
He missed one of his first two free throws. The shot was NOT THERE.
On defense he was much better, but unfortunately he was owned by Sabonis for most of the game.

I LOVE Wemby. I can't believe how lucky we are to have him. He's even better than I expected. ROTY isn't even close. I'm going to keep celebrating him.
That being said, improvement is the name of the game.
I'm likely to spend a lot of the late season focused on what he is doing to improve his weaknesses and inconsistencies.
Fewer turnovers. More efficient shot selection. Better rebounding. Stamina to play 30+ every night. Drawing fouls. Etc, etc.
It's an exciting time to be a Spurs fan

[wildbill2u]

Wemby needs to start putting full games together on offense and defense. Hard to see why he has games where his D is great but offense a little off. Or the other way around.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

lol, you think it took an NBA team until 50+ games in to the season to figure out that they should try to push around the rail thin tall guy? Other teams can try it, but how many other teams have a guy like Sabonis? And Wemby gave as good as he got blocking him or making him miss shots several times.

Everyone has been trying Wemby all year and all that's done is led to him leading the NBA in blocks.

Not with that type of success they have not. I get that you dumbed it down to the tape showing only physicality but Sabonis did more than that. Nice strawman though.

[itzsoweezee]

Fun game. Collins is still horrible. Happy to see champagnie play aggressive

[Mr. Body]

ROB DILLINGHAM would have won this game.

[Mnky]

8-21 for Wemby, countless bad shots, especially in crunch time, not moving the ball enough and he gets an A? His play in the 4th cost is a win. I love the guy and I think we should apply higher standards to him, he’s a leader of this team

Yea Wemby looked the opposite of what OP said. He was slow, lacked normal reactiveness, hardly contested anything without just standing up, pick and roll defense was getting scorched all night as he baby sat the free throw line with no threat. Had no idea what was going on with his pick and roll defense, he wasn't even staying on his guy. Kings attacked his pick and roll defense all night.

His shot was bad and decision making was pretty bad. Took really bad 3s for no reason or without rhythm. He really needs to take LMA advice and develop one or two go to moves because be over thinks and can't seem to figure out what he wants to do. His tunnel vision is such an issue when he's not hitting any type of shot.

He was also slow on his own pick and roll in attacking the basket. Few times his teammates expected him to attack and he's just taking his time walking.

Not to mention the bad passing.

It was a bad game for a young superstar. Really wish the team wouldn't freeze out the hot hand at the end of every game. Vassell was clearly on another level and Vic kept calling his own number. Plenty of coaching tape on this one. On to the next one.

[Raven]

it is kind of hard to understand how they manage to find the loss while playing so well. I guess we get the best of both worlds this season, having a lot of fun while not ruining our lottery seeding.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Wemby was chucking a bit but he did make some playmaking out of his possessions. He managed 4 assists.

What was interesting is that he had only 1 turnovers. He was beating half a dozen before the break.

[rjv]

a player has "slow reactiveness", "hardly contests anything" and winds up with 13 boards, 5 blocks and 5 steals. lol

[MannyIsGod]

Not with that type of success they have not. I get that you dumbed it down to the tape showing only physicality but Sabonis did more than that. Nice strawman though.

Wemby might not be as good as the top 3 centers in the NBA than he is on a night when he doesn't play the top 3 centers but its not like any center in the NBA can just replicate that. That's kind of the point. Yeah, Sabonis did things to score on Wemby but only two other teams have centers who are as good or better than Sabonis (and one of them hung 70 on Wemby) but that doesn't mean any other team in the NBA is going to be able to replicate it or the secret is out.

He scored all of 22 points. 2 points more than his average. That's not really "getting straight worked" but sure, the tape is out now and everyone will try it. The tape of Jordan's been out for awhile and somehow people haven't been able to replicate him yet. Weird.

[Seventyniner]

I noticed a difference between the first and second half as to how Wemby guarded Sabonis too. In the first half Sabonis was just going right at Wemby with a series of fakes, but in the second half Wemby adjusted and 4 of Sabonis's 10 second half points came from putbacks.

Wemby is such a fast learner that I don't think very many players will consistently beat him one on one. When he has enough games against top opponents to learn their tendencies, watch out.

[spurraider21]

I noticed a difference between the first and second half as to how Wemby guarded Sabonis too. In the first half Sabonis was just going right at Wemby with a series of fakes, but in the second half Wemby adjusted and 4 of Sabonis's 10 second half points came from putbacks.

Wemby is such a fast learner that I don't think very many players will consistently beat him one on one. When he has enough games against top opponents to learn their tendencies, watch out.
for the most part, a lot of it is just his patience and staying down instead of going for fakes. his length and quick bounce give him a nice margin of error when it comes to timing blocks, so he can wait longer than most guys before going into his contest and still being able to block the shot.

with that said, when he allows himself to get driven under the rim, while his ungodly length still allows him to contest the shot, he's still getting himself behind the 8-ball when he does that. the core strength will come with time

[tonight...you]

Wemby might not be as good as the top 3 centers in the NBA than he is on a night when he doesn't play the top 3 centers but its not like any center in the NBA can just replicate that. That's kind of the point. Yeah, Sabonis did things to score on Wemby but only two other teams have centers who are as good or better than Sabonis (and one of them hung 70 on Wemby) but that doesn't mean any other team in the NBA is going to be able to replicate it or the secret is out.

He scored all of 22 points. 2 points more than his average. That's not really "getting straight worked" but sure, the tape is out now and everyone will try it. The tape of Jordan's been out for awhile and somehow people haven't been able to replicate him yet. Weird.
Nobody has hung 70 on Wemby. Embiid hung 70 on over a multitude of players that game.
C'mon.

[Slippy]

DVs attacking game in the keyway just keeps getting better. They were tough and unguardable to say rhe least. Still came through at a high perecentage.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Wemby might not be as good as the top 3 centers in the NBA than he is on a night when he doesn't play the top 3 centers but its not like any center in the NBA can just replicate that. That's kind of the point. Yeah, Sabonis did things to score on Wemby but only two other teams have centers who are as good or better than Sabonis (and one of them hung 70 on Wemby) but that doesn't mean any other team in the NBA is going to be able to replicate it or the secret is out.

He scored all of 22 points. 2 points more than his average. That's not really "getting straight worked" but sure, the tape is out now and everyone will try it. The tape of Jordan's been out for awhile and somehow people haven't been able to replicate him yet. Weird.

I saw 4 post ups in the first half where the combination of early work, changing release points, strength, and footwork saw Sabonis throwing hook shots right in Wemby's face. I had yet to see anyone do anything remotely close to that.

I like Wemby btw.

Embiid did most of his work against Collins and he was using his midrange a lot. I do like how you are making borderline all star Sabonis into a borderline all-NBA though. There are plenty of big men like Davis, Embiid, KAT, Sengun, Giannis, Adebayo, or Jokic off the top of my head.

[CorrectCrusader]

To be fair on the Sochan knock on defense, the refs let Sabonis do moving screens the entire game.

[manufan10]

The team is odd that they seem to have, at most, one player playing well at a time. When Vassell plays well, Victor doesn't, when Victor plays well (many games), every body else sucks, when Sochan plays well, Vassell sucks. If the team can have two or three players consistently play well, this is easily a 35-win team.

The players are trying, but they just seem so lost some times, it's almost like they know one of their teammates are hot, and they don't know what to do. Oh crap, Vassell is on fire, should I shoot or keep feeding him the ball?

They are playing like a pick up team, still. There are clear improvements from the ghastly games at the beginning of the season, but they have a looooooong way to go.

Did it again tonight.

[MannyIsGod]

I saw 4 post ups in the first half where the combination of early work, changing release points, strength, and footwork saw Sabonis throwing hook shots right in Wemby's face. I had yet to see anyone do anything remotely close to that.

I like Wemby btw.

Embiid did most of his work against Collins and he was using his midrange a lot. I do like how you are making borderline all star Sabonis into a borderline all-NBA though. There are plenty of big men like Davis, Embiid, KAT, Sengun, Giannis, Adebayo, or Jokic off the top of my head.

I mean in the old position system Sabonis would be borderline All NBA. He's pretty clearly the best center in the league other than Embiid and Jokic. This isn't some kind of hot take. I would take him and rank him above AD, KAT Adebayo and Sengun on your list. AD is a tough one, but AD is made of glass so yeah.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I mean in the old position system Sabonis would be borderline All NBA. He's pretty clearly the best center in the league other than Embiid and Jokic. This isn't some kind of hot take. I would take him and rank him above AD, KAT Adebayo and Sengun on your list. AD is a tough one, but AD is made of glass so yeah.

His post % puts him in the middle of though guys. He did not even make the all star team.

You rank is based on nothing.

[MannyIsGod]

His post % puts him in the middle of though guys. He did not even make the all star team.

You rank is based on nothing.

My ranking is based on nothing? lol

My ranking is based on watching more NBA basketball than you my dude; the same guy who thought the NBA figured out Wemby the other night and was scared the tape of that was going to reveal some crazy secret on how to abuse Wemby in the post. Yeah, he didn't make the All Star team this year because they put KAT there in his place. By all means argue KAT is better than Sabonis all you want. It would be a bad take but by all means, he was an all star and Sabonis was not so run with it.

Its incredible to say my rank is based on nothing. Look at his stats for fucks sake. Or don't, whatever. Be sure to bump this when NBA teams use the ground breaking tape against Wemby.

[MannyIsGod]

Just going to casually leave this here.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_2024_advanced.html#advanced_stats::vorp

[FuzzyLumpkins]

My ranking is based on nothing? lol

My ranking is based on watching more NBA basketball than you my dude; the same guy who thought the NBA figured out Wemby the other night and was scared the tape of that was going to reveal some crazy secret on how to abuse Wemby in the post. Yeah, he didn't make the All Star team this year because they put KAT there in his place. By all means argue KAT is better than Sabonis all you want. It would be a bad take but by all means, he was an all star and Sabonis was not so run with it.

Its incredible to say my rank is based on nothing. Look at his stats for fucks sake. Or don't, whatever. Be sure to bump this when NBA teams use the ground breaking tape against Wemby.

:lol your basis is a fantasy where the amount of basket ball you claim to have watched and :lol VORP?

You are just flailing. I talked about his post FG% and your brain tells you to say I should look at his stats.

https://www.nba.com/stats/players/playtype-post-up?dir=D&sort=EFG_PCT

His eFG% out of the post is lesser than Poeltl.

And he did not make the all star team because he was not in the top 13 of his conference. You like story time in your head.

[MannyIsGod]

Sure my dude, I looked at the VORP and BPM rankings because of you and not becaue I routinely check advanced metrics because I’m an avid basketball fan. Definitely just because you pulled a random out of context stat out. And lo and behold the advanced metrics show exactly what I claimed above. Guess I’m just that lucky.

Youre not familiar and you’re now projecting about people going to stats after the case. There’s a reason I made my claim and there’s a reason the stats back it up but by all means continue on with eFG and all star selections over advanced metrics. Can’t wait to see what the next argument is going to be.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Sure my dude, I looked at the VORP and BPM rankings because of you and not becaue I routinely check advanced metrics because I’m an avid basketball fan. Definitely just because you pulled a random out of context stat out. And lo and behold the advanced metrics show exactly what I claimed above. Guess I’m just that lucky.

Youre not familiar and you’re now projecting about people going to stats after the case. There’s a reason I made my claim and there’s a reason the stats back it up but by all means continue on with eFG and all star selections over advanced metrics. Can’t wait to see what the next argument is going to be.

We are talking about Sabonis's ability to score on Wemby in the post.

eFG% out of the post in your brain is out of context but your aggregate stats attempting for comprehension are applicable?

Your attempts at expertise are laughable, Mr. Advanced Stat Wizard.