2025 NBA Draft

[Big Empty]

So we have our own pick, ATLs and possibly the Bulls top 10 protected? Unless ATL blows their roster up their pick will be mid/late teens. Our same team with Castle, about 30-35 win season so also 9-13 kinda pick. We’re probably going to package most of these picks next draft to try to move up into the top 5 if theres someone we like, or we’re going to pull off a major trade this year. Way too early to tell but might as well discuss it.

[scott]

I've got my eyes on a kid named Thirty-Two Unprotected out of Oklahoma City and another kid out of New York named Thirty-One Swap.

Parents giving their kids fucked up names these days.

[heyheymymy]

Tank for Traore

[mystargtr34]

I've got my eyes on a kid named Thirty-Two Unprotected out of Oklahoma City and another kid out of New York named Thirty-One Swap.

Parents giving their kids fucked up names these days.

There’s a guy by the name of Cash Considerations who I think is a lock for the Spurs in the second round.

[TrainOfThought5]

Lol you guys feeling a bit negative lately, eh?

[scottspurs]

Chill and enjoy summer league and this next spurs season. Way too early for 2025 draft talk lol

[TrainOfThought5]

Chill and enjoy summer league and this next spurs season. Way too early for 2025 draft talk lol

I completely disagree. Spurs aren’t going to get anyone significant in the free agency which means we’re going to run back a shit team plus castle, which is basically another tank year. If we’re tanking, we should go and start talking about Prospects now, and why this draft is so amazing to begin with.

[Ariel]

Way too soon, we're too far out to get an accurate picture of the prospect landscape, but also we don't know the Spurs direction until free agency starts and moves are made or not.

[stnick2261]

This draft is looking like a high-end top 4 or 5, but there should be good players further back as well. If I remember correctly, the 2003 draft had a Top 4 (pre-draft), but ended up with 4 possible Hall of Famers, and 9 total All-Stars:

#01 LeBron James - All NBA (future Hall of Fame)
#03 Carmelo Anthony - All-NBA (future Hall of Fame)
#04 Chris Bosh - Hall of Fame
#05 Dwyane Wade - Hall of Fame
#06 Chris Kaman - All-Star
#18 David West - All-Star
#29 Josh Howard - All-Star
#27 Mo Williams - All-Star
#51 Kyle Korver - All-Star

Others:
Boris Diaw
Zaza Pachulia
Keith Bogans
Matt Bonner
Travis Outlaw
Carlos Delfino
Kendrick Perkins
Leandro Barbosa
Kirk Hinrich
T. J. Ford
Jason Kapono
Luke Walton
Nick Collison
Luke Ridnour

In my quest (Google search) of 2003 vs 2025 NBA Draft, I found this gem of a "basketball forum" thread.

https://www.basketballforum.com/threads/predictions-of-the-2003-drafts-players-in-their-prime.33506/

There is some gold in there. Mostly people predicting Darko Milicic as having the brightest future and Chris Bosh not even making it in the NBA.

[Pauleta14]

Tank for Traore

What if Castle shows good signs of become an NBA PG this season?

(I'd love Traore too but putting myself in PATFO's shoes...)

[stnick2261]

What if Castle shows good signs of become an NBA PG this season?

(I'd love Traore too but putting myself in PATFO's shoes...)

If Flagg and Ace are both gone and Traore is the BPA... then you have a 3 guard rotation of Traore, Castle and Vassell. 2 of the 3 on the court at all times. Fill the SF/PF slots in FA (or with another draft pick).

[BatManu20]

Looking forward to seeing how Castle performs this year cause no doubt PATFO are going to see what he looks like at Point. It'll give us a chance to see if he can legitimately play the position or if he's in fact a combo-guard and the PG position is one we need to address moving forward.

Nolan Traore, Cooper Flagg, Ace Bailey, VJ Edgecombe, Khaman Maluach, and Dylan Harper are the 6 marquee names in the 2025 Draft as of right now. Obviously it's early and a lot will change between now and next Summer, but those are the 6 blue-chippers who are projected to go first. Spurs would be lucky to have any one of them tbh, though Maluach is a C so Spurs would likely go another direction if they were fortunate enough to land a top-10 pick. Regardless, this is why we really need ATL to blow this season. Don't think we'll be quite bad enough to get a top-5 pick, and I think CHI ends up tanking down the stretch of next season to ensure they keep their pick.

[Pauleta14]

If Flagg and Ace are both gone and Traore is the BPA... then you have a 3 guard rotation of Traore, Castle and Vassell. 2 of the 3 on the court at all times. Fill the SF/PF slots in FA (or with another draft pick).

I'm not against the logic but that's not how PATFO opperates.

Once they've chosen THEIR guy, they then give him time and trust to develop. Sometime to a fault as we've seen in recent past.

Putting another PG pospect, with a huge hype, in his legs would benefit neither Castle, nor Traore nor the Spurs.

The logic would be going for another position (unless Castle develops an amazing shot next season and can be used as a SG - not very realistic)

[BatManu20]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GRKlrUaWoAAP6hZ?format=jpg&name=large

[stnick2261]

I'm not against the logic but that's not how PATFO opperates.

Once they've chosen THEIR guy, they then give him time and trust to develop. Sometime to a fault as we've seen in recent past.

Putting another PG pospect, with a huge hype, in his legs would benefit neither Castle, nor Traore nor the Spurs.

The logic would be going for another position (unless Castle develops an amazing shot next season and can be used as a SG - not very realistic)

I've never been accused for thinking the same way as PATFO. Castle played on-ball and off-ball for a complicated motion offense at UCONN. He is very smart. Just like Diaw ran point for us but wasn't our PG, I can see us giving Castle a full year experience of running point... but still not hesitating from drafting another PG if they are good enough. Castle needs to develop his shot, but he needs to do that regardless of anything else happening. He (theoretically) can play PG next to Vassell as well as SG next to Traore.

But the defensive potential of Flagg/Wemby... or the offensive potential of Ace/Wemby would just be unreal.

[stnick2261]

Someone I really want to keep an eye on is Liam McNeeley. He's a 3&D (SF) going to play for UCONN. He should be available around one of our picks and plugs a hole in the roster near perfectly (for being a non-star)

[thOOdee]

what's the consensus as to ATL picking ZR and how that will impact where their pick will land next year? Is tanking a strong possibility for them now, since passing on sarr?

[benefactor]

https://sports.yahoo.com/2025-nba-mock-draft-10-cooper-flagg-ace-bailey-lead-way-too-early-look-at-next-years-loaded-class-032744663.html

Yahoo Sports breaks down the top talent to keep early tabs on for the 2025 NBA Draft.

[widowmaker]

Trade all of the picks for 2035 first round picks.

[stnick2261]

https://sports.yahoo.com/2025-nba-mock-draft-10-cooper-flagg-ace-bailey-lead-way-too-early-look-at-next-years-loaded-class-032744663.html

Yahoo Sports breaks down the top talent to keep early tabs on for the 2025 NBA Draft.

6. Dylan Harper, GRutgers | Freshman
Harper, the younger brother of Ron Harper Jr. and son of NBA veteran Ron Harper, is a big-bodied lead guard who has cleaned up his decision-making and can really put pressure on the rim. Harper will be playing with Bailey at Rutgers next year and scouts will be making New Jersey a priority stop this college basketball season. The 6-6, 210-pound guard can play on or off the ball and is a tenacious defender who can guard multiple positions.




Imagine having 2 Castles playing side by side (if they both learn to shoot).

[Pauleta14]

I've never been accused for thinking the same way as PATFO. Castle played on-ball and off-ball for a complicated motion offense at UCONN. He is very smart. Just like Diaw ran point for us but wasn't our PG, I can see us giving Castle a full year experience of running point... but still not hesitating from drafting another PG if they are good enough. Castle needs to develop his shot, but he needs to do that regardless of anything else happening. He (theoretically) can play PG next to Vassell as well as SG next to Traore.

But the defensive potential of Flagg/Wemby... or the offensive potential of Ace/Wemby would just be unreal.

This tbh

As much as I hate the perspective of another season of soft tanking, it could really be worth it.

As for Traore, let's wait and see what Castle shows us, who knows, maybe it's true that UCONN's system limited his offensive game

[TrainOfThought5]

Trade all of the picks for 2035 first round picks.

Lebron got a grandkid we don’t know about?

[offset formation]

Looking forward to seeing how Castle performs this year cause no doubt PATFO are going to see what he looks like at Point. It'll give us a chance to see if he can legitimately play the position or if he's in fact a combo-guard and the PG position is one we need to address moving forward.

Nolan Traore, Cooper Flagg, Ace Bailey, VJ Edgecombe, Khaman Maluach, and Dylan Harper are the 6 marquee names in the 2025 Draft as of right now. Obviously it's early and a lot will change between now and next Summer, but those are the 6 blue-chippers who are projected to go first. Spurs would be lucky to have any one of them tbh, though Maluach is a C so Spurs would likely go another direction if they were fortunate enough to land a top-10 pick. Regardless, this is why we really need ATL to blow this season. Don't think we'll be quite bad enough to get a top-5 pick, and I think CHI ends up tanking down the stretch of next season to ensure they keep their pick.

He doesn't need to be at combo guard if he can't find his shot. We'll see how it plays out but a defense that can sag off him makes many of Castle's upsides go away offensively. Defensively, I expect a homerun if his offense is going to struggle.

[offset formation]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GRKlrUaWoAAP6hZ?format=jpg&name=large

But someone told me it wasn't the Cooper Flagg draft.

[LeBowen]

Stop with the tanking narratives, unless Wemby suffers a serious injury we're not getting into top5 odds.

Pistons - still horrible, draftedd anonther non-shooter.
Wizards - still horrible and looking to trade those few established players they have, Kuzma is going to be traded.
Hornets - couldd be trending upwards, but Salaun won't help much. With all the idiots on their roster, chances of them being much better are low.
Raptors - they have some solid pieces, but surely still horrible.
Nets - probably going to be the worst team next season.
Bulls - Demar probably walks, they're shopping Lavine, another horrible team.
Blazers - still in the early phase of rebuilding.
Jazz - Ainge isn't going to stop tanking until he gets a start player in the draft.

With most of the league being one or two injuries away from being horrible. Like Grizzlies this season.

I'd really like to hear some explanation how do you plan on being worse than those teams that will all be intentionally bad?
Wemby will surely average like 25/12/5 with DPOY defense, so unless you want to shut him down and piss him off, we can't get good odds for a top3 pick.
We also got lucky with Wemby, got lucky with moving up to 4th pick and got lucky with Raptors pick.
If they're idiotic enough to ruin Wemby's season, then they deserve to drop for pushing their luck with lottery odds.

There's always a gap in W/L between tanking teams and teams that are trying to make play-in, if we're out of the play-in race, we can always just tank in the final few weeks.
Tanking teams don't win more than ~25 games, that's way too low for a team with top10 player like Wemby.

Realistically, we can get in 8th-12th best odds range, hope to stay in top10 and then trade up a few spots to get the preferred player.
Obviously we're not trading up into top3, but going from let's say 9th to 5th should be easily doable with an additional FRP.


But someone told me it wasn't the Cooper Flagg draft.

Ofc mainstream media will push it as Cooper Flagg draft, he's a white guy playing for Duke, ffs. :lol

[rjv]

Lol you guys feeling a bit negative lately, eh?

lately?

[stnick2261]

But someone told me it wasn't the Cooper Flagg draft.

Same as 2003 was the LeBron draft even though there were 4 hall of famers

[stnick2261]

I'd really like to hear some explanation how do you plan on being worse than those teams that will all be intentionally bad?

With all of those teams tanking, some of them have to win by the sheer fact that they'll be playing each other over the year.


Realistically, we can get in 8th-12th best odds range, hope to stay in top10 and then trade up a few spots to get the preferred player.
Obviously we're not trading up into top3, but going from let's say 9th to 5th should be easily doable with an additional FRP.

If we can get in the 8-12 range, as well as ATL and CHI (11-12)... we either get lucky with ping pong balls, or finally combine those picks, 2nd rounders and future firsts to move up into the top 5 to get Wemby's #2.

[LeBowen]

With all of those teams tanking, some of them have to win by the sheer fact that they'll be playing each other over the year.

Yeah, they'll win 15 to 25 games.

This year we won 22 with rookie Wemby being played out of position for a third of the season, then he played with heavy minutes restriction and in the end we sat most of the team.
We finally added a good perimeter defender, hopefully other young guys also improve, because Wemby is improving at an alarming pace.
I don't see how we win less than 35 games without intentional tanking or major injury trouble.
But we really don't want to piss of Wemby by shutting him down.


If we can get in the 8-12 range, as well as ATL and CHI (11-12)... we either get lucky with ping pong balls, or finally combine those picks, 2nd rounders and future firsts to move up into the top 5 to get Wemby's #2.

The problem is that teams simply don't trade away players projected as generational talent unless they're forced to do it (Wiggins-Love, forced by Lebron) or have absolute morons in their front office (Trae-Luka trade down).

I think 5th-7th is the most optmistic range, even with trade ups.

[spurraider21]

what's the consensus as to ATL picking ZR and how that will impact where their pick will land next year? Is tanking a strong possibility for them now, since passing on sarr?
sarr may have been the tanking option for them, since he is still pretty raw (albeit much more physically talented). clingan/risacher are more plug-and-play than Sarr was. the real question about what this upcoming season will look like is how they handle the backcourt. do they run it back for a third season? do they move Murray, and if so, is the return just picks, or is it closer to how the raptors got quickley/barrett when offloading OG

[RC_Drunkford]

this season will be a tankathon. Spurs should be a play-in team. We still have the ATL pick and the CHI pick might convert. Just move up in the draft and grab Wemby's co-star, simple as that. And if you can get Traore you get him. We play positionless basketball with multiple ball handlers over here, it doesn't matter who's the defacto PG. Castle can play 1 to 3.

Wemby, Castle, Vassell, Sochan and the 25 pick will be your core going forward. Then sign some free agents and make a trade for another All-Star and you got a juggernaut that can dominate the NBA.

[AFBlue]

I want VJ in a Spurs uni. Elite athlete, two-way guard with a fluid smooth game. Reminds me of Victor Oladipo coming out of Indiana.

[scott]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GRKlrUaWoAAP6hZ?format=jpg&name=large

These super early mocks are my favorite because a year from now we'll look back on this and half these guys you'll be like "who?!?!?" :lol

[Mr. Body]

These super early mocks are my favorite because a year from now we'll look back on this and half these guys you'll be like "who?!?!?" :lol

Pretty much. I expect Cooper Flagg will do what every big white guy from Duke does and disappoint. He's been fully grown against high school kiddies and can't even shoot. He also seems to have an arrogant attitude. Life can come at him fast.

Fortunately the draft should be deep.

[KobesAchilles]

I’m hoping for Dylan Harper

[scott]

Lots of great prospects to keep an eye on in 2024-25. Some of these guys won't pan out, but the makings of a high end class are there. I wouldn't call it the Cooper Flagg draft just yet. There are definitely some other guys who could unseat him for that #1 slot.

[LeBowen]

I know nothing about these kids, I'd be happy with a 6'8-6'9 potentially elite shooter who's not a bad defender. Seems about right for mid-lottery pick.

[widowmaker]

Lebron got a grandkid we don’t know about?


The second coming of Jerry West.

[BackHome]

This draft is stacked and not even looking at Flagg as they are some other highly gifted players;

For me I will be looking at.

PG - To draft a PG next year it would only be for these two kids.
* Nolan Traore - If he continues with his development I don't think we have a chance since will will go top 3.
* Egor Demin - I am not to sure what position he would play but the kid can play will definitely want to see what he bring to BYU.​

SG - This is probably the deepest class when it comes to SG as you have a multiple players who could be our second best player.

* Tre Johnson - Will be fun to watch him at Texas the kid is just smooth and can get you buckets pretty easy
* Dylan Harper - I think he goes in top 5 he is someone you can build a team around my only concern he seems very ball dominate.
* Hugo Gonzalez - Plays the right way can do everything and would fit into the team concept pretty easy

SF - Not a strong class but a few guys I like

* Airious Bailey - Very interested in seeing how his games grows at Rutgers he has the athletic part down lets see if he can put the whole package together
* Liam Mcneeley - I forgot the Poster who put me on to this kid but I 100% agree I think he would be a perfect fit as our starting SF. The kid can shoot and he is not bad on defense he would feast with Wemby getting all the attention

PF - Again not a strong draft for PF but a couple will be there if we get multiple picks.

* Noa Essengue - Have not watched a lot but I have liked what I have seen so far he is someone who I think would also be a great fit and someone who can battle for starting minutes sooner rather then latter
* Michael Ruzic - He is a little smaller maybe a tweener SF/PF - But I like his game it will be interesting to see how he develops

[SpursBills]

If he produces similarly in college compared to how he was in HS, McNeeley should 100% be one of the two picks. Castle has a lot of strengths and if developed properly will be a great two way player, but will almost definitely only be a league average or slightly better shooter. McNeeley is the best shooter in the class and more importantly a movement shooter. Hurley will probably use him as a 6'7" Jordan Hawkins/Cam Spencer and if he succeeds in that role will provide the gravity that the spurs desperately need while still possessing good playmaking and defense to not be a liability. It also allows them to get a true scoring wing with their other pick without having to worry about being a dead-eye shooter. The double 6'6" Castle/Vassell backcourt allows you to play two other wings next to Wemby without sacrificing a lot of rebounding or size.

[Obstructed_View]

This tbh

As much as I hate the perspective of another season of soft tanking, it could really be worth it.

As for Traore, let's wait and see what Castle shows us, who knows, maybe it's true that UCONN's system limited his offensive game

At this point, can it be avoided?

[heyheymymy]

This draft is stacked and not even looking at Flagg as they are some other highly gifted players;

For me I will be looking at.

PG - To draft a PG next year it would only be for these two kids.
* Nolan Traore - If he continues with his development I don't think we have a chance since will will go top 3.
* Egor Demin - I am not to sure what position he would play but the kid can play will definitely want to see what he bring to BYU.​

SG - This is probably the deepest class when it comes to SG as you have a multiple players who could be our second best player.

* Tre Johnson - Will be fun to watch him at Texas the kid is just smooth and can get you buckets pretty easy
* Dylan Harper - I think he goes in top 5 he is someone you can build a team around my only concern he seems very ball dominate.
* Hugo Gonzalez - Plays the right way can do everything and would fit into the team concept pretty easy

SF - Not a strong class but a few guys I like

* Airious Bailey - Very interested in seeing how his games grows at Rutgers he has the athletic part down lets see if he can put the whole package together
* Liam Mcneeley - I forgot the Poster who put me on to this kid but I 100% agree I think he would be a perfect fit as our starting SF. The kid can shoot and he is not bad on defense he would feast with Wemby getting all the attention

PF - Again not a strong draft for PF but a couple will be there if we get multiple picks.

* Noa Essengue - Have not watched a lot but I have liked what I have seen so far he is someone who I think would also be a great fit and someone who can battle for starting minutes sooner rather then latter
* Michael Ruzic - He is a little smaller maybe a tweener SF/PF - But I like his game it will be interesting to see how he develops

Great list, pretty much all my tentative targets at this point.

Would be cool to get the Nunez/Gonzales duo for the chemistry. Kinda worry that a lot of those SGs are redundant to Vassell. I like T. Johnson but too much overlap with Dev?

Bailey & Mcneeley would fill current PF depth issues but surely that could be addressed before then? I like the UCONN connections with Mcneeley after seeing Dan Hurley apparently in consultation with PATFO for Castle.

Ruzic seems like the Bertans/Sammich mold SA loves so much.

I like Egor Demin if Tre Jones or Blake Wesley are out or both, would backfill with Castle at PG nicely.

[Robz4000]

Every lottery pick in '25 would've gone #1 this past draft tbh. The obvious targets are Flagg, Ace, and Traore, but Harper and Johnson have sky-high potential too imo.

[RC_Drunkford]

all we need is a pick in the top 10 and we have our future core. I'm against trading any of the picks in this draft since we could then package them and move up or draft 2 players.

[Pauleta14]

At this point, can it be avoided?

I guess not but still lot of time fo stuff to happen tbh

Even unwittingly the Spurs could reach the play-in just bc of Vic's defensive impact, so why not go "all-in" and try to get the best ranking possible? (all while focusing on developement, it's not uncompatible)

There are opportunities that need to be seized NOW (Lauri for ex, u don't trade now you might never get him)

The Graham's deadline extention makes me think something big could happen before the 13/7

edit/ I went a bit out of topic haha

[AFBlue]

This draft is stacked and not even looking at Flagg as they are some other highly gifted players;

For me I will be looking at.

PG - To draft a PG next year it would only be for these two kids.
* Nolan Traore - If he continues with his development I don't think we have a chance since will will go top 3.
* Egor Demin - I am not to sure what position he would play but the kid can play will definitely want to see what he bring to BYU.​

SG - This is probably the deepest class when it comes to SG as you have a multiple players who could be our second best player.

* Tre Johnson - Will be fun to watch him at Texas the kid is just smooth and can get you buckets pretty easy
* Dylan Harper - I think he goes in top 5 he is someone you can build a team around my only concern he seems very ball dominate.
* Hugo Gonzalez - Plays the right way can do everything and would fit into the team concept pretty easy

SF - Not a strong class but a few guys I like

* Airious Bailey - Very interested in seeing how his games grows at Rutgers he has the athletic part down lets see if he can put the whole package together
* Liam Mcneeley - I forgot the Poster who put me on to this kid but I 100% agree I think he would be a perfect fit as our starting SF. The kid can shoot and he is not bad on defense he would feast with Wemby getting all the attention

PF - Again not a strong draft for PF but a couple will be there if we get multiple picks.

* Noa Essengue - Have not watched a lot but I have liked what I have seen so far he is someone who I think would also be a great fit and someone who can battle for starting minutes sooner rather then latter
* Michael Ruzic - He is a little smaller maybe a tweener SF/PF - But I like his game it will be interesting to see how he develops

I wouldn't leave off VJ Edgecombe. IMO he's a more well-rounded prospect than Tre Johnson with higher upside.

[rascal]

I want VJ in a Spurs uni. Elite athlete, two-way guard with a fluid smooth game. Reminds me of Victor Oladipo coming out of Indiana.

Spurs need to add some elite athleticism to the core.

[BackHome]

I wouldn't leave off VJ Edgecombe. IMO he's a more well-rounded prospect than Tre Johnson with higher upside.

Yeah, I left him off the list because I actually think he goes 1 or 2, him and Flagg fighting for the top spot. So just trying to be a little realistic .lol

[exstatic]

Yeah, I left him off the list because I actually think he goes 1 or 2, him and Flagg fighting for the top spot. So just trying to be a little realistic .lol

To get any of these players, we or ATL would have to jump into the top 4. There’s not an enormous difference between the odds for 1 and the odds for 4 from the mid lottery. If you really want to be “realistic”, just strike the top 4 prospects from your list. That would make more sense.

[TD 21]

This'll go hundreds of pages and well into the 100k's of views, only for them to end up with two picks around 10ish (own and Hawks), fail to trade up for Traore who they'll probably be rumored to and legitimately have their eye on, then trade one for an unprotected '75 1st (no roster space for two lottery picks on this loaded roster) and culminate in the usual: perceived choir boy who lack outlier tools (skill and/or physical) and a defined job description.

[TrainOfThought5]

This'll go hundreds of pages and well into the 100k's of views, only for them to end up with two picks around 10ish (own and Hawks), fail to trade up for Traore who they'll probably be rumored to and legitimately have their eye on, then trade one for an unprotected '75 1st (no roster space for two lottery picks on this loaded roster) and culminate in the usual: perceived choir boy who lack outlier tools (skill and/or physical) and a defined job description.
we have enough assets to trade to move us up significantly in the draft.

[Ariel]

This draft is stacked and not even looking at Flagg as they are some other highly gifted players;

For me I will be looking at.

PG - To draft a PG next year it would only be for these two kids.
* Nolan Traore - If he continues with his development I don't think we have a chance since will will go top 3.
* Egor Demin - I am not to sure what position he would play but the kid can play will definitely want to see what he bring to BYU.​

SG - This is probably the deepest class when it comes to SG as you have a multiple players who could be our second best player.

* Tre Johnson - Will be fun to watch him at Texas the kid is just smooth and can get you buckets pretty easy
* Dylan Harper - I think he goes in top 5 he is someone you can build a team around my only concern he seems very ball dominate.
* Hugo Gonzalez - Plays the right way can do everything and would fit into the team concept pretty easy

SF - Not a strong class but a few guys I like

* Airious Bailey - Very interested in seeing how his games grows at Rutgers he has the athletic part down lets see if he can put the whole package together
* Liam Mcneeley - I forgot the Poster who put me on to this kid but I 100% agree I think he would be a perfect fit as our starting SF. The kid can shoot and he is not bad on defense he would feast with Wemby getting all the attention

PF - Again not a strong draft for PF but a couple will be there if we get multiple picks.

* Noa Essengue - Have not watched a lot but I have liked what I have seen so far he is someone who I think would also be a great fit and someone who can battle for starting minutes sooner rather then latter
* Michael Ruzic - He is a little smaller maybe a tweener SF/PF - But I like his game it will be interesting to see how he develops
Interesting, but way too soon to be so confident, at this point last year some people had guys like Aday Mara or Izan Almansa at no. 1 and they had to pull out their names from the draft because they probably would have gone undrafted or on a 2 way at best. Looong time before we have something tangible to judge them on.

[TD 21]

we have enough assets to trade to move us up significantly in the draft.

I didn't say they didn't . . . I'll believe them being aggressive and determining they're getting a certain player at virtually all costs when I see it though.

[exstatic]

Stop with the tanking narratives, unless Wemby suffers a serious injury we're not getting into top5 odds.

Pistons - still horrible, draftedd anonther non-shooter.
Wizards - still horrible and looking to trade those few established players they have, Kuzma is going to be traded.
Hornets - couldd be trending upwards, but Salaun won't help much. With all the idiots on their roster, chances of them being much better are low.
Raptors - they have some solid pieces, but surely still horrible.
Nets - probably going to be the worst team next season.
Bulls - Demar probably walks, they're shopping Lavine, another horrible team.
Blazers - still in the early phase of rebuilding.
Jazz - Ainge isn't going to stop tanking until he gets a start player in the draft.

With most of the league being one or two injuries away from being horrible. Like Grizzlies this season.

I'd really like to hear some explanation how do you plan on being worse than those teams that will all be intentionally bad?
Wemby will surely average like 25/12/5 with DPOY defense, so unless you want to shut him down and piss him off, we can't get good odds for a top3 pick.
We also got lucky with Wemby, got lucky with moving up to 4th pick and got lucky with Raptors pick.
If they're idiotic enough to ruin Wemby's season, then they deserve to drop for pushing their luck with lottery odds.

There's always a gap in W/L between tanking teams and teams that are trying to make play-in, if we're out of the play-in race, we can always just tank in the final few weeks.
Tanking teams don't win more than ~25 games, that's way too low for a team with top10 player like Wemby.

Realistically, we can get in 8th-12th best odds range, hope to stay in top10 and then trade up a few spots to get the preferred player.
Obviously we're not trading up into top3, but going from let's say 9th to 5th should be easily doable with an additional FRP.



Ofc mainstream media will push it as Cooper Flagg draft, he's a white guy playing for Duke, ffs. :lol

This. Did no one pay any attention to the last 2-3 weeks of the season? We shut down 2 starters and our sixth man, and still won games.

[SpursBills]

We shut down 2 starters and our sixth man, and still won games.

Or,

We shut down 2 starters and our sixth man, and therefore won games.

:stirpot:

(mostly) kidding

[stnick2261]

To get any of these players, we or ATL would have to jump into the top 4. There’s not an enormous difference between the odds for 1 and the odds for 4 from the mid lottery. If you really want to be “realistic”, just strike the top 4 prospects from your list. That would make more sense.

I would argue that there are better odds that we get lucky with the lottery for a top 4 pick than us being bad enough to naturally end up in the 5-6 range (especially if someone jumps in front of us because of the lottery).

[stnick2261]

* Liam Mcneeley - I forgot the Poster who put me on to this kid but I 100% agree I think he would be a perfect fit as our starting SF. The kid can shoot and he is not bad on defense he would feast with Wemby getting all the attention


Pretty sure that was me. I've been "high" on this kid early. And by "high", I mean I'd rather have Ace Bailey, but this kid would be a perfect fit around the draft position we would probably have. I like that he's a 3&D, but especially love the fact that he's going to UCONN so we should be able to see how smart he is too.




Bailey & Mcneeley would fill current PF depth issues but surely that could be addressed before then? I like the UCONN connections with Mcneeley after seeing Dan Hurley apparently in consultation with PATFO for Castle.


I did not realize PATFO talked with Hurley about Castle. I wonder if we would have drafted Clingan if he would have dropped 1 more spot. Hurley is definitely my personal favorite (at the moment) for taking over Pop someday.

[scott]

Don't have the link, but saw an early Top 10 mock that has us at 9 and 10 and taking Egor and Mcneeley

[BackHome]

[QUOTE=stnick2261;11089270]Pretty sure that was me. I've been "high" on this kid early. And by "high", I mean I'd rather have Ace Bailey, but this kid would be a perfect fit around the draft position we would probably have. I like that he's a 3&D, but especially love the fact that he's going to UCONN so we should be able to see how smart he is too.

Yeah, now I remember it was you - Great find and I have to agree he is not a top 5 pick but he is a pick that I think you can easily pencil in as your starting SF. I also agree him going to UCONN is going to help him so much as there coach is legit good

[CGD]

Because it’s never too early, Tankathon has their 2025 board up already…

https://www.tankathon.com/mock_draft

[mystargtr34]

VJ Edgecombe just put up 20 for the Bahamas (and dunked on Vucevic) against Montenegro. Playing with Ayton, Hield, Gordon.

[CGD]

Wild that in the next draft:

BKN has 4 FRP
UTH has 3 FRP
OKC has 3 FRP
SAS has 2 FRP (maybe 3)
ORL has 2 FRP

[exstatic]

Because it’s never too early, Tankathon has their 2025 board up already…

https://www.tankathon.com/mock_draft
DJ Wagner at #45. :lol

[mystargtr34]

Damn so half the picks belong to 5 teams basically haha.

[Pauleta14]

I had Collin Murray-Boyles 4 times in a row with diff picks

[Knoxxx]

It took me about 5 pulls to get 1-Flagg 10-Demin. Once I got like 3 picks, 8, 10, 11.

[Ariel]

To get any of these players, we or ATL would have to jump into the top 4. There’s not an enormous difference between the odds for 1 and the odds for 4 from the mid lottery. If you really want to be “realistic”, just strike the top 4 prospects from your list. That would make more sense.
Actually 1-4 is probably more realistic than 5-7, if you believe Spurs and Atlanta right now are about in the 8-12 range (I don't think they'll be worse than Brooklyn, Washington, Detroit, Utah, Charlotte, Portland and Chicago). Say Spurs and Atlanta end up 9 & 10, which as things stand right now would not seem unreasonable. The combined chances would be 1: 7.5% - 2: 8.1% - 3: 8.8% - 4: 9.7%, which totals a 34.1% chance at a top 4 pick (assuming Spurs own 9&10 seeds pre-lottery), that is a bit more than 1 in 3. Definitely not unrealistic.

[scott]

Wild that in the next draft:

BKN has 4 FRP
UTH has 3 FRP
OKC has 3 FRP
SAS has 2 FRP (maybe 3)
ORL has 2 FRP

It's actually maybe 4 (though unlikely) for SAS. I would love to see 5 teams have 16 of the 30 picks just for the LOLs

[scott]

Because it’s never too early, Tankathon has their 2025 board up already…

https://www.tankathon.com/mock_draft

This is a really fantastic visual representation for folks to see just how overstated the "5 FRPs for Bridges!" deal is. 2 of those 5 are currently projected to be pick #24 and 25. Pick quality definitely matters. Variables that improve pick quality: 1) for near term picks, being from a bad team 2) being far out in the future if from a currently good team (value comes from the unknown and variance)

[BackHome]

First roll I got Spurs moving up 5 to get 4th pick for Traore and Atlanta pick at 10 we pick Egor Demim - Sweet

Yeah, I get your point I freaked out when I saw OK with 3 picks but then looked at trade partners and they all probably early 20’s at best.

[Knoxxx]

This is a really fantastic visual representation for folks to see just how overstated the "5 FRPs for Bridges!" deal is. 2 of those 5 are currently projected to be pick #24 and 25. Pick quality definitely matters. Variables that improve pick quality: 1) for near term picks, being from a bad team 2) being far out in the future if from a currently good team (value comes from the unknown and variance)

And the legend only grows as one article I read said it was 6 FRPs!

[scott]

First roll I got Spurs moving up 5 to get 4th pick for Traore and Atlanta pick at 10 we pick Egor Demim - Sweet

Yeah, I get your point I freaked out when I saw OK with 3 picks but then looked at trade partners and they all probably early 20’s at best.

I did about 50 rolls and could never get CHI to drop down to 11, and I think that's going to be the reality. Fits better for the pick to roll to 2026 anyway.

[onechance87]

VJ Edgecombe just put up 20 for the Bahamas (and dunked on Vucevic) against Montenegro. Playing with Ayton, Hield, Gordon.

he had another good game today.He may be the number 1 pick if he keeps this up.

[stnick2261]

bumping so more threads don’t get started

[exstatic]

Ttt

[heyheymymy]

Because it’s never too early, Tankathon has their 2025 board up already…

https://www.tankathon.com/mock_draft

haha just went there today to look at 2024 stuff again and saw 2025 already loaded up like it's just one rabbit hole right into the next

draft is a helluva drug

[Mr. Body]

Someone screen shot the mocks. We can track how wildly wrong they are.

[LeBowen]

I've got no clue about any of these players except the few most hyped prospects, the only thing I know is that I hope we get a legit wing.
If Castle is legit, we're done with guards and we obviously don't need another big.

[CGD]

Someone screen shot the mocks. We can track how wildly wrong they are.

Yeah, I wonder who the Isiah Collier of 2025 will be.

[scott]

This will be a fun project:

Tankathon July 9, 2024

https://i.ibb.co/rfHLhfF/Tankathon-July-9-2024-Lotto.png

https://i.ibb.co/L9x1Bcs/Tankathon-July-9-2024-Back-Half.png

[scott]

One thing that important to note as we go on Tank Watch:

Among the teams projected to be the worst this upcoming season, 6 of them have picks to protect:

WAS (Top 10 Protected owed to NYK)
DET (Top 13 Protected owed to NYK)
UTA (Top 10 Protected owed to OKC)
CHA (Top 14 Protected owned to SAS)
POR (Top 14 Protected owed to CHI)
CHI (Top 10 Protected owed to SAS)

We also have SAC, who Tankathon projects as a Play-In Loser in the Lottery, with a Top 12 protected pick owed to ATL

That also gives a little bit of insight as to the quality of some of the picks in certain teams warchest. Fortunately for the Spurs, these are the two "worst" picks that we own, but NYK and OKC have a lot like this.

Of the picks OKC and NYK have incoming, none appear to be unprotected. SAS, UTA and HOU are the teams that have a stash of unprotected picks incoming (BKN traded all of theirs to HOU to get their own picks back). There are a few others out there, but those are the three teams with the heftiest stashes.

[Knoxxx]

Based on the current Tankathon seedings, I typically pull a top 4 pick for SAS about 40% of the time. Sometimes it even comes up Spurs picking 1 and 2. Via ATL or vice versa. To me ATL looks like a bad team in 2024-5. Seems like it is essential to keep these two lotto tickets. We or ATL could be worse than the 9-10th worst teams as per current projections. If we got the 2 instead of the 1, Ace Bailey probably warrants tanking for too. Either Wemby or Trae Young missing any significant time would likely put either team in contention for a bottom 5 record and stronger lotto odds.

[RC_Drunkford]

I'd definitely want an SF out of this draft. I'd be fine with someone like Egon Demin. There should be future All-Star players available in the 10-15 range with how good this draft is.

[Ariel]

Based on the current Tankathon seedings, I typically pull a top 4 pick for SAS about 40% of the time. Sometimes it even comes up Spurs picking 1 and 2. Via ATL or vice versa. To me ATL looks like a bad team in 2024-5. Seems like it is essential to keep these two lotto tickets. We or ATL could be worse than the 9-10th worst teams as per current projections. If we got the 2 instead of the 1, Ace Bailey probably warrants tanking for too. Either Wemby or Trae Young missing any significant time would likely put either team in contention for a bottom 5 record and stronger lotto odds.
Yeah, I already posted the complete breakdown of the chances Spurs get a top 4 pick via their own pick or Atlanta's.

These are the odds of landing AT LEAST one top 4 pick (maybe 2) for every possible combination between Spurs' own pick and Atlanta's (in yellow the range you specified):


https://i.postimg.cc/WzJbRt3Z/top4.png
Tankathon currently has Spurs and Atlanta at 9 & 10 respectively, that's a 32.14% chance, roughly 1 in 3... and a Trae Young ankle sprain from improving those odds.

[Ariel]

I'd definitely want an SF out of this draft. I'd be fine with someone like Egon Demin. There should be future All-Star players available in the 10-15 range with how good this draft is.
Haven't watched them so I won't give names, but yeah, a big wing would be perfect.

[JPB]

=stnick2261

If we can get in the 8-12 range, as well as ATL and CHI (11-12)... we either get lucky with ping pong balls, or finally combine those picks, 2nd rounders and future firsts to move up into the top 5 to get Wemby's #2.


we have enough assets to trade to move us up significantly in the draft.

If there's potential Hofers in the top 5, teams won't trade that pick (that's litterally why they'll tank next season for that supposedly high quality draft on top) or at a very hefty price spurs fans won't like.

[TrainOfThought5]

If there's potential Hofers in the top 5, teams won't trade that pick (that's litterally why they'll tank next season for that supposedly high quality draft on top) or at a very hefty price spurs fans won't like.

we have to consolidate at some point. Consolidating for HOFer on Rookie scale contracts to mold into Spurs culture is the way to do it versus trading for expensive aging vets with bad habits and Diva attitudes.

[exstatic]

Based on the current Tankathon seedings, I typically pull a top 4 pick for SAS about 40% of the time. Sometimes it even comes up Spurs picking 1 and 2. Via ATL or vice versa. To me ATL looks like a bad team in 2024-5. Seems like it is essential to keep these two lotto tickets. We or ATL could be worse than the 9-10th worst teams as per current projections. If we got the 2 instead of the 1, Ace Bailey probably warrants tanking for too. Either Wemby or Trae Young missing any significant time would likely put either team in contention for a bottom 5 record and stronger lotto odds.
I think people don’t understand how hard it is to stop a backwards slide once it starts. ATL went from ECF to first round out for two years, to missing the playoffs. They’re offloading assets with basically little or no return: John Collin’s, Huerter, DJ. They’re going to suck this year.

[exstatic]

One thing that important to note as we go on Tank Watch:

Among the teams projected to be the worst this upcoming season, 6 of them have picks to protect:

WAS (Top 10 Protected owed to NYK)
DET (Top 13 Protected owed to NYK)
UTA (Top 10 Protected owed to OKC)
CHA (Top 14 Protected owned to SAS)
POR (Top 14 Protected owed to CHI)
CHI (Top 10 Protected owed to SAS)

We also have SAC, who Tankathon projects as a Play-In Loser in the Lottery, with a Top 12 protected pick owed to ATL

That also gives a little bit of insight as to the quality of some of the picks in certain teams warchest. Fortunately for the Spurs, these are the two "worst" picks that we own, but NYK and OKC have a lot like this.

Of the picks OKC and NYK have incoming, none appear to be unprotected. SAS, UTA and HOU are the teams that have a stash of unprotected picks incoming (BKN traded all of theirs to HOU to get their own picks back). There are a few others out there, but those are the three teams with the heftiest stashes.
Our stash is awesome. Three unprotected FRPs. Two unprotected swaps. Two swaps protected only for pick #1.

One interesting thing is that SA seems to be integrating vertically. We have a lot of the years covered with unprotected picks/swaps, but now they’ve doubled up in 2030 with Minny swap protected #1 and a Dallas unprotected swap, basically a best of 3 pick, barring Minnesota winning the lottery.

[Guru of Nothing]

Believe!

https://i.imgur.com/kgdra7D.png

[Knoxxx]

I think people don’t understand how hard it is to stop a backwards slide once it starts. ATL went from ECF to first round out for two years, to missing the playoffs. They’re offloading assets with basically little or no return: John Collin’s, Huerter, DJ. They’re going to suck this year.

Well I do think ATL has a better chance to be a bottom feeder than us in 2024-2025.

[stnick2261]

Believe!

https://i.imgur.com/kgdra7D.png

Stephon Castle
Devin Vassell
Ace Bailey
Cooper Flagg
Victor Wembanyama

we might get a winning record with that lineup

[heyheymymy]

lol also love how DET fell out of the top 4 again

[JPB]

we have to consolidate at some point. Consolidating for HOFer on Rookie scale contracts to mold into Spurs culture is the way to do it versus trading for expensive aging vets with bad habits and Diva attitudes.

Sure, but why would teams trade their potential Hofers on rookie scales? That's my point, the price would be INSANELY high. If you can pick a future franchise player,, you don't rtade the pick for 2 firsts and 2 secounds, specially that those firsts aren't probbly gonna be top 5, if top 10.

[rascal]

Based on the current Tankathon seedings, I typically pull a top 4 pick for SAS about 40% of the time. Sometimes it even comes up Spurs picking 1 and 2. Via ATL or vice versa. To me ATL looks like a bad team in 2024-5. Seems like it is essential to keep these two lotto tickets. We or ATL could be worse than the 9-10th worst teams as per current projections. If we got the 2 instead of the 1, Ace Bailey probably warrants tanking for too. Either Wemby or Trae Young missing any significant time would likely put either team in contention for a bottom 5 record and stronger lotto odds.

Agree

If the Spurs land in the top 5 there is their 2nd future star and a foundational piece to building the dynasty. No playoffs for one more year and some more lottery luck is the best results for the future.

[Trueblood]

Sure, but why would teams trade their potential Hofers on rookie scales? That's my point, the price would be INSANELY high. If you can pick a future franchise player,, you don't rtade the pick for 2 firsts and 2 secounds, specially that those firsts aren't probbly gonna be top 5, if top 10.

You never really know in these scenarios. Teams might have their eye on someone at 5 but then they get scooped up at 4, so instead they trade back for two picks. Teams can get tunnel vision on a player and if they miss out often their backup options are a few spots back. Saying none of these teams would do a trade like this makes no sense because something like this happens in almost every draft. And this is a DEEP draft so trading 5 for 9 & 10 is not as far fetched as you make it seem.

[SpursBills]

As time goes on, more and more teams are controlling other teams' draft picks/futures with potential to have a high lottery pick. In a draft like 2025 or any draft with legitimate tanking targets, I wonder if we will see some gamesmanship and lopsided trades at the trade deadline to try and influence the lottery odds

For example, consider this situation next year:
Atlanta sucks big time because Capela is washed/no rim protection

Utah gives Walker Kessler to Atlanta for free, OKC gives Utah a couple crappy first rounders

Utah wants Atlanta to get better and eliminate a competitor for a top lottery pick, and also wants to tank for a better pick
OKC doesn't want SA, its future competitor to get a top lottery pick and has plenty of first rounders to spare
Atlanta doesn't own their own pick, so it'll happily accept free talent in order to improve at a position of need

Or maybe we cut OKC out of this example altogether and Utah basically just gives away Walker Kessler to Atlanta for nothing rather than accept a few second rounders or a 1st rounder from another team, viewing the price as worth it to improve a competitor for a high lottery pick

I'm not saying that this exact situation happens, but rather I wonder if there's now an opportunity for gamesmanship similar to this because teams control draft picks of other teams that have the potential of getting high lottery picks in good drafts

[Knoxxx]

The number of teams tanking by season’s end may make it very hard to have a handle on how good or bad more teams than that actually are.

[exstatic]

As time goes on, more and more teams are controlling other teams' draft picks/futures with potential to have a high lottery pick. In a draft like 2025 or any draft with legitimate tanking targets, I wonder if we will see some gamesmanship and lopsided trades at the trade deadline to try and influence the lottery odds

For example, consider this situation next year:
Atlanta sucks big time because Capela is washed/no rim protection

Utah gives Walker Kessler to Atlanta for free, OKC gives Utah a couple crappy first rounders

Utah wants Atlanta to get better and eliminate a competitor for a top lottery pick, and also wants to tank for a better pick
OKC doesn't want SA, its future competitor to get a top lottery pick and has plenty of first rounders to spare
Atlanta doesn't own their own pick, so it'll happily accept free talent in order to improve at a position of need

Or maybe we cut OKC out of this example altogether and Utah basically just gives away Walker Kessler to Atlanta for nothing rather than accept a few second rounders or a 1st rounder from another team, viewing the price as worth it to improve a competitor for a high lottery pick

I'm not saying that this exact situation happens, but rather I wonder if there's now an opportunity for gamesmanship similar to this because teams control draft picks of other teams that have the potential of getting high lottery picks in good drafts

I think the league would step in and CHRIS PAUL that trade.

[exstatic]

The number of teams tanking by season’s end may make it very hard to have a handle on how good or bad more teams than that actually are.

Take the over on whatever games Vegas sets for the spurs for this very reason.

[scott]

Take the over on whatever games Vegas sets for the spurs for this very reason.

LOL, Vegas books salivating over the return of Spurs Over bettors :lol

[JPB]

LOL, Vegas books salivating over the return of Spurs Over bettors :lol

:lol

[JPB]

Barring any trade, I really don't believe spurs will be in the play in contention, and that, giving the nature of next year's draft and the fact Victor made his point last year (winning ROTY) and will continue to do so next season, it will be easier to buy him into tanking the last part of the season, even eventually shutthing him down a little after a busy olympic summer.

[exstatic]

Barring any trade, I really don't believe spurs will be in the play in contention, and that, giving the nature of next year's draft and the fact Victor made his point last year (winning ROTY) and will continue to do so next season, it will be easier to buy him into tanking the last part of the season, even eventually shutthing him down a little after a busy olympic summer.

If you saw the end game videos for the Knicks and Nuggets, Wemby throwing one ball into the stands and spiking the other one about 20 feet into the air there’s no way this man buys into another tank. He burns to win, any game every game.

[Mitch Cumsteen]

The number of teams tanking by season’s end may make it very hard to have a handle on how good or bad more teams than that actually are.


Take the over on whatever games Vegas sets for the spurs for this very reason.

Most of the hardcore tankers are in the east - Nets, Wiz, Pistons for sure. Then Hornets, Bulls, Raptors in the next tier. That's only 12 games on the Spurs schedule. Notwithstanding injury, in the west it's really only Portland and maybe Utah, who will at least be marginally competitive as long as Markkanen is there. There aren't going to be many free wins in the western conference.

Those east win totals at the bottom of the standings are going to be a little bloated because all the tankers are going to have to play each other multiple times. Somebody has got to win. It's going to be challenging to have that multiple teams lose 60 games. If you want to bet some over win totals, I would invest heavily in upper middle class eastern teams. Orlando, Cleveland, Indiana and Miami are going to have a lot of gimmes on their schedule. I hate to say it, but maybe even Atlanta puts up a better number than people think.

[LeBowen]

Most of the hardcore tankers are in the east - Nets, Wiz, Pistons for sure. Then Hornets, Bulls, Raptors in the next tier. That's only 12 games on the Spurs schedule. Notwithstanding injury, in the west it's really only Portland and maybe Utah, who will at least be marginally competitive as long as Markkanen is there. There aren't going to be many free wins in the western conference.

Those east win totals at the bottom of the standings are going to be a little bloated because all the tankers are going to have to play each other multiple times. Somebody has got to win. It's going to be challenging to have that multiple teams lose 60 games. If you want to bet some over win totals, I would invest heavily in upper middle class eastern teams. Orlando, Cleveland, Indiana and Miami are going to have a lot of gimmes on their schedule. I hate to say it, but maybe even Atlanta puts up a better number than people think.

No free wins in the West, but that applies to everyone.
We're obvbiously not a playoff team as of now, but Wemby is a bad matchup for a lot of teams.
They won't prepare as much for us in regular season and we can get wins against everyone.

On paper Minnesota is the worst matchup for Wemby and he still averaged 20/11/4 with 3 blocks in 4 games against them.
Won only one, but every loss was in single digits.

Wemby played in 16 losses by 16 or more points, only 2 were after the all-star break.
We improved dramatically even before those final few weeks.

Other than Minnesota, no team in the West has an elite rim protector and long wings around him.
Grizzlies will be an interesting matchup with Edey and JJJ, I guess.

East has a lot of teams that are well-equipped to deal with Wemby.

[BackHome]

Spurs are 1 injury away from easily having a top 5 pick

[stnick2261]

Spurs are 1 injury away from easily having a top 5 pick

What’s Tonya Harding doing lately?

[BackHome]

She going bird hunting. Lol