If you waste a season with Victor Wembanyama as your centerpiece...

[Obstructed_View]

You deserve to get fired. You deserve to watch him leave town. You deserve to watch the Las Vegas Spurs open their new arena.

He's a top three player this year. Get him whatever help he needs to get to the tournament. Spend assets.

Bad FO decisions, bad personnel or roster decisions, tolerating bad play, bad defense, low effort. Needs to be gone.

[Joseph Kony]

Mr. Body: You obviously hate this franchise, go be a Thunder fan

[Spurs Homer]

OP is not wrong.

[Rosewood]

You are 100% right. He’s all that was promised and more.

[Obstructed_View]

LeBowen said basically the same thing before I did in the other thread. After seeing Vic's improvement over the summer, it's just a sin to waste any opportunity.

[SpursFan86]

OP might be slight hyperbole but ultimately I’m starting to pretty much think like this. I don’t think it’s farfetched that Wemby is a top 5-10 guy in the league as a sophomore. The idea that we need to draw out the rebuild and go slow for 3 years is foolish.

I’ll be patient one more year. We could be contending by 2025-2026 if PATFO makes the right moves though tbh.

[Chinook]

Nah, you don't go all in. People are confusing his talent and potential with actually being ready to carry a team to a title. However, you don't play for the draft at this point. You play for a playoff spot and not worry about how many distant pick swaps you can fit on the head of a pin.

[vy65]

Nah, you don't go all in. People are confusing his talent and potential with actually being ready to carry a team to a title. However, you don't play for the draft at this point. You play for a playoff spot and not worry about how many distant pick swaps you can fit on the head of a pin.

I agree that he needs to start learning how to climb the mountain. People forget that it takes numerous playoff reps to actually be a contender. All of which makes trading the 8th pick all the more inexcusable. We need talent now to start that climb; not in 2031.

[Spurs Homer]

Nah, you don't go all in. People are confusing his talent and potential with actually being ready to carry a team to a title. However, you don't play for the draft at this point. You play for a playoff spot and not worry about how many distant pick swaps you can fit on the head of a pin.

Wemby is ready to carry a team to MULTIPLE titles...you need to check your eyesight

[Kevin]

Anyone seeing what Wemby is doing with Gobert as his twin tower running mate? Point Wemby with Lauri’s finishing skills would be special. Spurs can’t waste half of his rookie deal on tryout seasons.

[Mr. Body]

Right, which is why the worst decision in the world is to be impulsive and throw money and resources around. Thank God the franchise has an incredible idea of the future. Want to see what happens when you make bad decisions with money and resources? Denver. Milwaukee. Those championship windows are pretty much closed.

So, settle down. We're going to be okay.

[LeBowen]

Nah, you don't go all in. People are confusing his talent and potential with actually being ready to carry a team to a title. However, you don't play for the draft at this point. You play for a playoff spot and not worry about how many distant pick swaps you can fit on the head of a pin.

But noone is asking for them to go all in.

Not counting that fake FRP from Charlotte, we have 12 FRPs up until 20131.
With four more swaps.
And 20 FRPs, including 5 FRPs in '26 for example. Can easily trade up.

Trading away four picks wouldn't mean we blew the load.
We'll never trade for an MVP level player and everyone else would still be obtainable if the opportunity presents itself.

Wemby is going to be the best player in the league in two years at the most.
Devin has established himself as a solid third option on an amazing deal considering the cap inflation.
We just got a #4 pick who looks to be the type of two-way player every championship team has.
We'd still have at least one '25 pick and good cap situation even if we get Markkanen.

Everyone will be lining up to play Wemby and we'll have an easy time getting good role players in FA.
Or getting high end role players with those 8 leftover FRPs.

It just makes too much sense to me.

Entering the season without any major wing reinforcements after puting a #8 pick 7 years down the road would be infuriating, because it's more or less a guarantee that some of those wings picked in mid-late lottery will become a good starter at the very least.

[Mr. Body]

Anyone seeing what Wemby is doing with Gobert as his twin tower running mate? Point Wemby with Lauri’s finishing skills would be special. Spurs can’t waste half of his rookie deal on tryout seasons.

Lauri is Gobert now, despite Lauri being soft as baby shit and nowhere close to the player Gobert is on defense. :lol Settle down.

[Spurs Homer]

Lauri is Gobert now, despite Lauri being soft as baby shit and nowhere close to the player Gobert is on defense. :lol Settle down.

Giving away Dillingham for no reason was a monumental blunder - but you are completely ok with it - because you are used to losing and it fits your personality

Wemby is here now and is ready and if year after year and tank after tank wasnt tiring for you - then you can keep praising these incompetent fools

the rest of us want to win now and hate to see wembys seasons go to waste.

[DAF86]

Anyone seeing what Wemby is doing with Gobert as his twin tower running mate? Point Wemby with Lauri’s finishing skills would be special. Spurs can’t waste half of his rookie deal on tryout seasons.

They played 5 minutes together today. Wemby really exploded in the 15 minutes he didn't have Gobbert taking up his space in the paint.

[vy65]

Right, which is why the worst decision in the world is to be impulsive and throw money and resources around. Thank God the franchise has an incredible idea of the future. Want to see what happens when you make bad decisions with money and resources? Denver. Milwaukee. Those championship windows are pretty much closed.

So, settle down. We're going to be okay.

I mean, no. Those championship windows got closed because of a new CBA that was imposed after they built their teams. DEN/MIN's builds were fantastic, if it weren't for the subsequent death-penalty imposed by the new CBA.

[vy65]

But noone is asking for them to go all in.

Not counting that fake FRP from Charlotte, we have 12 FRPs up until 20131.
With four more swaps.
And 20 FRPs, including 5 FRPs in '26 for example. Can easily trade up.

Trading away four picks wouldn't mean we blew the load.
We'll never trade for an MVP level player and everyone else would still be obtainable if the opportunity presents itself.

Wemby is going to be the best player in the league in two years at the most.
Devin has established himself as a solid third option on an amazing deal considering the cap inflation.
We just got a #4 pick who looks to be the type of two-way player every championship team has.
We'd still have at least one '25 pick and good cap situation even if we get Markkanen.

Everyone will be lining up to play Wemby and we'll have an easy time getting good role players in FA.
Or getting high end role players with those 8 leftover FRPs.

It just makes too much sense to me.

Entering the season without any major wing reinforcements after puting a #8 pick 7 years down the road would be infuriating, because it's more or less a guarantee that some of those wings picked in mid-late lottery will become a good starter at the very least.

Nice

[vy65]

Again, what is the 2025 plan? S/ATL's picks figure to be in the 10-14 range. The free-agent class is ass. Is the plan really to hope against hope that a disgruntled star who happens to fit into the team's designs and who's team would accept whatever package we put together becomes available? Sorry, but if the plan is to adopt what a dude who's drunk out of his mind does at the craps table at 2am as your team building strategy, you need to get fired.

[mudyez]

We might just want to make sure, we are rather "wasting" a season now, than several come his peak.

That said we are not "wasting" anything. The CP3 thing shows, that we are using time with not skipping any steps.

I'm all with PATFO and it would be ugly to blow the big load now, just to sit with empty hands, once Wemby can decide to jump ship because we ran out of assets (like lebron did several times).

We at least have to wait out the '25 Draft, before we can really say, what our team COULD look like. The hawks pick might become someone interesting and hell...I'm even ok with a soft tank while teaching the youngsters.

[exstatic]

But noone is asking for them to go all in.

Not counting that fake FRP from Charlotte, we have 12 FRPs up until 20131.
With four more swaps.
And 20 FRPs, including 5 FRPs in '26 for example. Can easily trade up.

Trading away four picks wouldn't mean we blew the load.
We'll never trade for an MVP level player and everyone else would still be obtainable if the opportunity presents itself.

Wemby is going to be the best player in the league in two years at the most.
Devin has established himself as a solid third option on an amazing deal considering the cap inflation.
We just got a #4 pick who looks to be the type of two-way player every championship team has.
We'd still have at least one '25 pick and good cap situation even if we get Markkanen.

Everyone will be lining up to play Wemby and we'll have an easy time getting good role players in FA.
Or getting high end role players with those 8 leftover FRPs.

It just makes too much sense to me.

Entering the season without any major wing reinforcements after puting a #8 pick 7 years down the road would be infuriating, because it's more or less a guarantee that some of those wings picked in mid-late lottery will become a good starter at the very least.

I love how this typo has become a thing.

It depends on the four picks,

[Joseph Kony]

Body acts like making any move is going to use literally every asset the franchise has :lol: Denver's window isn't closed. Neither is Milwaukee. there are plenty of trades they could orchestrate to improve a little bit and even without them they're still contenders next season. and unlike those teams that are capped out with 3 max salaries right now, the Spurs own a number of other teams picks to trade and don't have any particularly bad contracts on the roster. Spurs could trade 4 firsts + keldon for Lauri and still have a ton of flexibility to make other moves or fill the roster out with draft picks. idk why he thinks making any move = trading every single pick we own

[vy65]

Body acts like making any move is going to use literally every asset the franchise has :lol: Denver's window isn't closed. Neither is Milwaukee. there are plenty of trades they could orchestrate to improve a little bit and even without them they're still contenders next season. and unlike those teams that are capped out with 3 max salaries right now, the Spurs own a number of other teams picks to trade and don't have any particularly bad contracts on the roster. Spurs could trade 4 + keldon for Lauri and still have a ton of flexibility to make other moves or fill the roster out with draft picks. idk why he thinks making any move = trading every single pick we own

More to the point, Mrs. Body doesn't realize that the new CBA is going to absolutely murder teams who wait until their stars mature into their second and third contracts. I mean, the owner of the fucking Boston 2024 NBA Champion Celtics is fucking selling out because he doesn't want to deal with an ownership scenario where he has to reconcile Brown + Tatum making 100 million+ per year with the second apron. All of which is to say that when you have a top-10 player on a rookie contract and don't have to worry about the implications of the CBA, it might be a good idea to maximize that opportunity.

[BackHome]

To make any major move for a top player your going to have to move a player and probably all of Atlanta Hawk picks. At this point I am still on the two year Tank Plan which has worked out so far as we got Wemby with last years pick. So for me 2025 is cool for Pop to do his crazy lineups and gives us a pick hopefully in the 8 to 10 range and then hope the basketball God's don't like the Hawks and they net us a top 5 player......

After 2025 I would start to pivot to making moves and maybe letting some players go to start getting players to not only help in starting but also building out our bench.

[NASpurs]

Fuck the Hawks picks. We're going to draft 19 year olds so they can take 4, 5 years to develop? And there's no guarantee they'll be any good at that. Start using your draft capital now.

[timtonymanu]

It’s okay, if we’re really bad, it’s cause we’re tanking. That’s what people were saying last season which resulted in us trading away one of our lottery picks cause it was a weak draft we “tanked” for lol.

[Blizzardwizard]

Levelling up the roster around a 20-year-old All-NBA/DPOY player?

That's not who we are!

We need to give Champagnie, Branham and Wesley starter minutes for at least another three seasons before deciding whether to move off them.

They're only kids for fuck's sake! Patience!
In the meantime we should be stockpiling future pick swaps because that's the The Spurs Way.

What are we gonna do with those pick swaps down the line? That's family business.

You can't trade your way to a title!

Just look at the Celtics. They couldn't get it done with Tatum and Brown at first but stayed calm, kept a hold of their assets and drafted guys like Derrick White, Jrue Holiday and Kristaps Porzingis to put them over the top.

Brian had a lot of success in Orlando and Detroit so just give him time to build the team his way.

So quit your yapping and support the team.













:pop:

[MannyIsGod]

I don't think Wemby will be a top 3 player this season. He's going to be an amazing player and will almost certainly be the best player in the league if he stays healthy but y'all gotta calm down a bit on this. Not going all in in year two isn't wasting a year of Wemby.

[scott]

More to the point, Mrs. Body doesn't realize that the new CBA is going to absolutely murder teams who wait until their stars mature into their second and third contracts. I mean, the owner of the fucking Boston 2024 NBA Champion Celtics is fucking selling out because he doesn't want to deal with an ownership scenario where he has to reconcile Brown + Tatum making 100 million+ per year with the second apron. All of which is to say that when you have a top-10 player on a rookie contract and don't have to worry about the implications of the CBA, it might be a good idea to maximize that opportunity.

So absolutely on point.

It is managerial malpractice not to take advantage of having a Top-10 player on effectively what is an MLE deal for the next 3 years. Waiting until Wemby eats up 30% of your cap to start making moves is, for lack of a better term, fucking stupid.

NFL teams, who operate with a true hard cap, have figured this out. If you draft a rookie QB who is a stud, you immediately add pieces while that QB is cheap, because once his first extension kicks in you're going to have a much harder time building around him. The new CBA is forcing NBA teams to think about the consequences of a salary cap in ways they've never had to before, and this is the obvious model.

If Lauri (as an example) costs 4 FRPs... think about it... what are the odds that a FRP, who's placement in the draft is unknown and may end up at #1 or #30, turns out as good as Lauri? If it's 25% odds, which is generous, you've basically traded equal value by sending 4 FRPs.

I don't expect this FO to even attempt to make these very obvious moves, because 25 years ago they got lucky and built a team for the ages and now they think they know better, ignoring the fact that it was a different game played with different rules. Adapt or die, bitches.

[BackHome]

One thing Wemby is going to have to bulk up he going going to be going up against a lot of big dudes in the new season - Gobert, Clingan, Edey, KAT, etc...

[Obstructed_View]

One thing Wemby is going to have to bulk up he going going to be going up against a lot of big dudes in the new season - Gobert, Clingan, Edey, KAT, etc...
I never understand why people say this. It makes no sense.

[LeBowen]

I never understand why people say this. It makes no sense.

Old-fashioned way of thinking.
Rookie Wemby matched up well against Giannis and Jokic, there's absolutely no need for him to bulk up too much.
His length is overwhelming and even if you push him all the way under the basket, his contests are still the best in the league.
The only way to effectively score on him in the post is to have ridiculously good scoring ability and finesse like Jokic or Embiid do.
These scrubs with no post moves wouldn't be able to do shit even if they were 400lbs.


I don't expect this FO to even attempt to make these very obvious moves, because 25 years ago they got lucky and built a team for the ages and now they think they know better, ignoring the fact that it was a different game played with different rules. Adapt or die, bitches.

This is the most frustrating part for me.
They need to realize that Wemby isn't in Timmy, but Admiral situation.
Do people think moves wouldn't have been made early in Timmy's career if he got drafted to a bad roster and not an actual playoff team that had injury misfortune?

Nowdays every NBA team has a dozen nerds all around the world watching under-16 games and scouting talent.
Spurs created a dynasty with no trades because their scouting was way ahead of the curve. Can't do that anymore.

[Chucho]

But noone is asking for them to go all in.

Not counting that fake FRP from Charlotte, we have 12 FRPs up until 20131.
With four more swaps.
And 20 FRPs, including 5 FRPs in '26 for example. Can easily trade up.

Trading away four picks wouldn't mean we blew the load.
We'll never trade for an MVP level player and everyone else would still be obtainable if the opportunity presents itself.

Wemby is going to be the best player in the league in two years at the most.
Devin has established himself as a solid third option on an amazing deal considering the cap inflation.
We just got a #4 pick who looks to be the type of two-way player every championship team has.
We'd still have at least one '25 pick and good cap situation even if we get Markkanen.

Everyone will be lining up to play Wemby and we'll have an easy time getting good role players in FA.
Or getting high end role players with those 8 leftover FRPs.

It just makes too much sense to me.

Entering the season without any major wing reinforcements after puting a #8 pick 7 years down the road would be infuriating, because it's more or less a guarantee that some of those wings picked in mid-late lottery will become a good starter at the very least.


I dunno about people lining up to play with Wemby. It's still San Antonio and we never saw anyone line up to play with Timmy nor Kawhi for that window he was our franchise player. San Antonio, as a city, sucks ass. It's dirtier, uglier and more boring than just 10 years ago.

Wemby doesn't seem to be an introvert the way Duncan was, so I can't see him staying loyal to the Spurs if they aren't aggressive in making this team contend ASAP. When players start lining up to play with Wemby, it wont be in San Antonio as painful as it is to say. Expecting our top guys to be subservient to the team culture and philosophy isn't practical anymore and Wemby showed he has balls by checking himself into games and what not. Guy's desire to win instantly is faster than the pace the Spurs FO like to move. If Pop holds them back again with his sandbagging, cooked-ass management, it's not a matter "if" he leaves, it's simply "when".

This is painful because I just don't see the Spurs willing to change anything in their approach or methodology to cater to star talents that need to be catered to. I strongly believe he's not a Spur longer than he has to be unless the FO does a 180 the next two years.

[K...]

i look forward to op laying out a complex plan to upgrade the roster with vets , and why rob dilligham would have solved cancer , something about sengun and halliburton,

[scott]

I wonder if there is anyone in the Spurs front office who is even thinking this way, let alone voicing these opinions. Or is just a bunch of yes men, slobbering over the fact they get to work with RC and Pop and just soaking it all in?

A good front office should have people fighting over what the right path forward is. RC and Pop have so much (earned) cache that it may just shut down any dissent from the get go, which is a disservice to the team. I actually think RC and Pop would be receptive and open to dissenting opinions and would be open to a compelling case to go another direction (this is just speculation on my part though), but do they even receive it? I definitely doubt they get it from ownership. My guess is that Holt Jr. has put complete faith in RC and Pop to handle everything, and his role is exclusive to finding financial partners to join the group.

I also wonder what governance there is over the Holt family. They are the managing partners, but I don't think they are the majority owners. I know there have been some partners in the past (like Valero, don't know if they still are, Dell now, the PE group, etc) who are accustomed and experienced at running serious businesses. Is there corporate governance in place to exert influence upon management, or is it all just Holt Jr?

[spurraider21]

Body acts like making any move is going to use literally every asset the franchise has :lol: Denver's window isn't closed. Neither is Milwaukee. there are plenty of trades they could orchestrate to improve a little bit and even without them they're still contenders next season. and unlike those teams that are capped out with 3 max salaries right now, the Spurs own a number of other teams picks to trade and don't have any particularly bad contracts on the roster. Spurs could trade 4 firsts + keldon for Lauri and still have a ton of flexibility to make other moves or fill the roster out with draft picks. idk why he thinks making any move = trading every single pick we own
more most teams, trading 4 picks is emptying the coffers when all they really have are their own natural picks. the spurs have a starting point of owning 3 other FRP's, outright, unprotected, in addition to a couple of protected ones. the swaps also make our individual picks more valuable, so trading one swapped pick, like 2030, has more value than a typical team trading their natural 2030 pick

the spurs made all those tank moves to trade for additional draft capital, and within 1 year of going full tank we just wound up getting wemby with our own natural pick anyway, with all the surplus picks to boot

[Pauleta14]

I don't think Wemby will be a top 3 player this season. He's going to be an amazing player and will almost certainly be the best player in the league if he stays healthy but y'all gotta calm down a bit on this. Not going all in in year two isn't wasting a year of Wemby.

Not if you count the defensive impact as well...

[My Fault]

Wasting? He just completed his rookie season and you’re bitching about wasting years? :lol Glad idiots that think like this don’t run the team

[scott]

Wasting? He just completed his rookie season and you’re bitching about wasting years? :lol Glad idiots that think like this don’t run the team

We have Wemby on an MLE deal for 4 years. The first of them has already passed. If you spend the next one soft tanking, then yes... you've wasted one of those years. In Year 5, Wemby will cost us $56MM/yr. It's managerial malpractice to not take advantage of the year's he'll only cost us the MLE.

[NASpurs]

Wasting? He just completed his rookie season and you’re bitching about wasting years? :lol Glad idiots that think like this don’t run the team

STFU faggot, all you do is hit and run with your shitty ass posts like this.

[ChumpDumper]

But they already wasted one right?

Moot thread.

[My Fault]

STFU faggot, all you do is hit and run with your shitty ass posts like this.
Shut up bitch, I didn’t give you permission to speak

[My Fault]

We have Wemby on an MLE deal for 4 years. The first of them has already passed. If you spend the next one soft tanking, then yes... you've wasted one of those years. In Year 5, Wemby will cost us $56MM/yr. It's managerial malpractice to not take advantage of the year's he'll only cost us the MLE.
Oh yes because you give up the farm to go from the lottery to 1st round knockout to keep your superstar :rolleyes

[NASpurs]

Shut up bitch, I didn’t give you permission to speak

Using a troll account because you're a bitch made faggot. :lol

Use your main smegma breath.

[My Fault]

Using a troll account because you're a bitch made faggot. :lol

Use your main smegma breath.
Calling another man a bitch made faggot on the internet because we all know deep down you’re soft as tissue :lol

[NASpurs]

Calling another man a bitch made faggot on the internet because we all know deep down you’re soft as tissue :lol

Says the faggot hiding under an alt :lol

[My Fault]

Says the faggot hiding under an alt :lol
:lol the fact you think this is alt just means you think everyone is a pussy like you. Not everyone is a scared bitch like you :lol

[NASpurs]

:lol the fact you think this is alt says you think everyone is a pussy like you. Not everyone is a scared bitch like you :lol

Says the faggot who hits and runs in and out of threads for 15 years. :lol Go back to the shadows knob slobber

[My Fault]

Says the faggot who hits and runs in and out of threads for 15 years. :lol Go back to the shadows knob slobber
What? You want me here everyday crying like a bitch like you? You’re a whiny bitch who has nothing better to do but be a bitch behind some made up identity:lol

[NASpurs]

What? You want me here everyday crying like a bitch like you? You’re a whiny bitch who has nothing better to do but be a bitch behind some made up identity:lol

:cry Spurs fans don't agree with my pussy ass way of thinking so I'm going to call them out :cry

[My Fault]

:cry Spurs fans don't agree with my pussy ass way of thinking so I'm going to call them out :cry
That’s great way of summarizing how you spent the last 20 years of your life :lol

[tim_duncan_fan]

I would hesitate to commit years of resources to Demar-level pseudo-stars just for the sake of saying I did something.

I ultimately do not care about not getting Paul George or Short Atlanta Guard or Clay Oldson or whoever.


When the money/assets are spent, they should move the needle to conference finals contender, not to just "yay, we got Empty Stats Shooting Guard" hype.

[NASpurs]

That’s great way of summarizing how you spent the last 20 years of your life :lol

Compared to your 15 years of lurking, popping out like a mole and going back into hiding like a bitch. :lol

[timtonymanu]

The Dillingham trade plus the realization that Champenny is our starting SF again next year has put everyone on edge. :lol

[My Fault]

Compared to your 15 years of lurking, popping out like a mole and going back into hiding like a bitch. :lol
Someone gotta come here every now and then to straighten bitches like you out :lol

[gilmor2002]

I don't think Wemby will be a top 3 player this season. He's going to be an amazing player and will almost certainly be the best player in the league if he stays healthy but y'all gotta calm down a bit on this. Not going all in in year two isn't wasting a year of Wemby.

top player currently is easily - Luka, Jokic, Tatum

[taps]

2 pages, we did it!

[NASpurs]

Someone gotta come here every now and then to straighten bitches like you out :lol

Gotta step on the roaches when they come out as well.

[skin27]

It’s okay, if we’re really bad, it’s cause we’re tanking. That’s what people were saying last season which resulted in us trading away one of our lottery picks cause it was a weak draft we “tanked” for lol.

This:lol

[My Fault]

Gotta step on the roaches when they come out as well.
Bitch we know you ain’t doing shit, you’re a pussy :lol

[NASpurs]

Bitch we know you ain’t doing shit, you’re a pussy :lol

Keep hiding faggot :lol

[My Fault]

Keep hiding faggot :lol
You keep saying that as you want to meet up but I guarantee you don’t, you’re soft little bitch and I’ll expose the hoe in you should you have balls enough to do to that :lol

[NASpurs]

You keep saying that as you want to meet up but I guarantee you don’t, you’re soft little bitch and I’ll expose the hoe in you should you have balls enough to do to that :lol

This ain't Grindr dumb fuck, why would I want to meet you? :lol Stop hiding behind this alt burrito breath.

[My Fault]

This ain't Grindr dumb fuck, why would I want to meet you? :lol Stop hiding behind this alt burrito breath.
That’s what I thought you’re a bitch! All you had to do was sign a waiver but go ahead king, keep talking big shit on the internet, until someone test you and you back out like the bitch you are. For the record, this was nothing but recruiting effort to turn you to a real man rather than the bitch you are that cries on the internet thinking your opinion will ever matter to the Spurs :lol Wasting 20 years of your life, loser :lol

[NASpurs]

That’s what I thought you’re a bitch! All you had to do was sign a waiver but go ahead king, keep talking big shit on the internet, until someone test you and you back out like the bitch you are. For the record, this was nothing but recruiting effort to turn you to a real man rather than the bitch you are that cries on the internet thinking your opinion will ever matter to the Spurs :lol Wasting 20 years of your life, loser :lol

Again faggot, why would i want to meet you? Key word "faggot"

Fucking dude is trying to get dates on here with other dudes :lmao

[poopbox]

Where do people get this "you need to wait until a player is ready" shit from?

Is that something you guys sniffed out of Pops seat or something?

Who is the nba team that one a title that you can point to and say "oh they waited 3 years until they went and got the second guy on that team"

Like Brunson had one all nba season for the knicks and they shipped out the guy they drafted to be there franchise player for OG, and then they traded most of their draft capital for Mikal, and then they cashed out OG to make sure he doesn't go anywhere.

They did that for Brunson and all he has done is get to the second round.

Were the Knicks supposed to be like "let's wait until Brunson has made an all nba team twice THEN we will start cashing in our picks and cap space for him"?

I can't think of any team competing for a title that said "let's wait until our franchise player has X amount of....something...before we start trying to build around him

I don't know what podcast you guys listened to to come to this conclusion, but you need to listen to a different one

[KobesAchilles]

Yall morons might trust Brian Wrong to make good draft choices. I do not trust him at all. Dude has only had one good draft pick and it was Wemby.

Trade away our picks for Lauri. We still have the Atlanta picks. We have an all star caliber player who can shoot the ball and isn’t ball dominant. And we won’t get killed during the minutes that Wemby doesn’t play.

[My Fault]

Again faggot, why would i want to meet you? Key word "faggot"

Fucking dude is trying to get dates on here with other dudes :lmao
Wanna be a tough guy on the internet then get called on it, results to calling owning up to it as gay, classic bitch behavior. Never say a thing to me again because you already exposed yourself as the bitch you are. Fake internet tough guy

[NASpurs]

Wanna be a tough guy on the internet then get called on it, results to calling owning up to it as gay, classic bitch behavior. Never say a thing to me again because your already exposed yourself as the bitch you are. Fake internet tough guy

:lol sure thing tough guy, give me your fake time and place you want to meet up

[My Fault]

Wanna be a tough guy on the internet then get called on it, results to calling owning up to it as gay, classic bitch behavior. Never say a thing to me again because you already exposed yourself as the bitch you are. Fake internet tough guy
Look, you wanna question me for being on here for 15 years, understand I don’t do this internet shit. I don’t understand this saying shit without consequence, so for me it’s simple, come sign the waiver and we solve this as men, not used to dealing with bitches like you. Put nuts on the table or stfu because you’re not man enough to back your words.

[NASpurs]

Look, you wanna question me for being on here for 15 years, understand I don’t do this internet shit. I don’t understand this saying shit without consequence, so for me it’s simple, come sign the waiver and we solve this as men, not used to dealing with bitches like you. Put nuts on the table or stfu because you’re not man enough to back your words.

:lmao shut up dude, you're about as fake as they come. I'm telling you to give me a time and a place and you keep misdirecting. We all know your bitch ass wouldn't show up.

:cry I'm a tough guy :cry

[My Fault]

:lmao shut up dude, you're about as fake as they come. I'm telling you to give me a time and a place and you keep misdirecting. We all know your bitch ass wouldn't show up.

:cry I'm a tough guy :cry
Check your DMs bitch I’m going to expose you :lol Whether you’re man enough to answer or not I’ll show the bitch in you, legally:lol

[NASpurs]

Check your DMs bitch I’m going to expose you :lol Whether you’re man enough to answer or not I’ll show the bitch in you, legally:lol

This dude sliding into my DMs, imagine that :lol

[My Fault]

Check your DMs bitch I’m going to expose you :lol Whether you’re man enough to answer or not I’ll show the bitch in you, legally:lol
Really shouldn’t have put balls on the table because I’m the right one to expose how small they are. You picked the right one today :lol

[Joseph Kony]

i hear NASpurs runs a tattoo shop near the airport that specializes in calf tats. you should go pay him a visit, his name is Joey

[NASpurs]

i hear NASpurs runs a tattoo shop near the airport that specializes in calf tats. you should go pay him a visit, his name is Joey

Yeah you can't miss my calf tats and long hippie hair

[My Fault]

This dude sliding into my DMs, imagine that :lol
:lol you’re such a bitch :lol Legit gave you a way to back up those words and you folded so quick :lol Come to my gym and sign a waiver is all I said and you folded like the bitch you are :lol

[NASpurs]

:lol you’re such a bitch :lol Legit gave you a way to back up those words and you folded so quick :lol Come to my gym and sign a waiver is all I said and you folded like the bitch you are :lol

:lmao imagine being such a fucking loser that I get to you to DM me :lmao

[My Fault]

:lmao imagine being such a fucking loser that I get to you to DM me :lmao
Imagine being such a bitch that you can’t sign a waiver to back up words you say :lol You’re such a bitch that no one can take you serious. At the end the day I gave you a legal way to back up what you say but you proved nothing to be a pussy. There is nothing else to say because at the end the day you proved to be pussy hiding on the on internet.

[benefactor]

:lmao imagine being such a fucking loser that I get to you to DM me :lmao
Did he really message you:lol

[benefactor]

I'm going to need a screenshot

[My Fault]

Did he really message you:lol
You can come too, lmk and I’ll send you the addy, just sign the waiver :lol

[NASpurs]

Imagine being such a bitch that you can’t sign a waiver to back up words you say :lol You’re such a bitch that no one can take you serious. At the end the day I gave you a legal way to back you but you proved nothing to be a pussy. There is nothing else to say because at the end the day you proved to be pussy hiding on the on internet.

Bitch I pull the strings and I control you like the puppet like you are. That tells me enough of how much of a Cro Magnon moron you are :lol

"Come to my gym and sign a waiver" :lmao holy shit

[benefactor]

You can come too, lmk and I’ll send you the addy, just sign the waiver :lol
I live in East texas. Drive up here I'll meet you right near loop 49 where the exit is. I'll beat the fuck out of you and send you right back to San Antonio.

[My Fault]

Bitch I pull the strings and I control you like the puppet like you are. That tells me enough of how much of a Cro Magnon moron you are :lol

"Come to my gym and sign a waiver" :lmao holy shit
Ok, you’re scared so just say that :lol

[NASpurs]

I'm going to need a screenshot

:lmao https://ibb.co/c8nCHfX

[My Fault]

I live in East texas. Drive up here I'll meet you right near loop 49 where the exit is. I'll beat the fuck out of you and send you right back to San Antonio.
:lmao :lmao :lmao This is easily I’ve never trained a day in my life talk :lol

[benefactor]

:lmao https://ibb.co/c8nCHfX
:lol

[timtonymanu]

I mean if you’re resorting to DMs about meeting up to fight, I think it’s time to step away from the laptop for just a bit. :lol

[benefactor]

:lmao :lmao :lmao This is easily I’ve never trained a day in my life talk :lol
I've been boxing for a long time. But most of my experience came from fighting on sidewalks. Talk about training all you want. Can you street fight? Just let me know

[My Fault]

I live in East texas. Drive up here I'll meet you right near loop 49 where the exit is. I'll beat the fuck out of you and send you right back to San Antonio.
Come to S.A. tough guy and I’ll gladly send you the location to where I train but don’t expect the normal rules, we go by
Brazilian rules. As long as you the balls to sign the waiver :lol and I’ll post everything

[My Fault]

I've been boxing for a long time. But most of my experience came from fighting on sidewalks. Talk about training all you want. Can you street fight? Just let me know
Boxing? :lol I’m so serious, take me up on my offer and I’ll change your world but understand you came me disrespected so don’t expect respect

[benefactor]

Come to S.A. tough guy and I’ll gladly send you the location to where I train but don’t expect the normal rules, we go by
Brazilian rules. As long as you the balls to sign the waiver :lol and I’ll post everything
I'm not fighting you in the gym stupid. Square up out in the grass or on a sidewalk somewhere. Or are you some pussy that only fights on a mat

[timtonymanu]

What a weird thing to tell your buddies: “hey boys! I just challenged this unknown person online to a fight. I have the waiver here. This spurs forum I post on will finally see how much of a loser he is. I’m gonna record it and everything. That’ll show him.”

[benefactor]

Sign a waiver...:lol

What kind of hoe shit is that:lol

[NASpurs]

Brazilian rules :lol Dude is going to dance capoeira and get his brains beat in

[My Fault]

I'm not fighting you in the gym stupid. Square up out in the grass or on a sidewalk somewhere. Or are you some pussy that only fights on a mat
Alright bro then I know you’re not serious because anyone that has actually trained doesn’t do that stupid shit. The fact you even mentioned sidewalk already shows you to be fraud. No true fighter is risking that shit. So again come sign the waiver or stfu pussy

[My Fault]

Brazilian rules :lol Dude is going to dance capoeira and get his brains beat in
Nope, you both just ran into the right side one, so put your nuts on the table or stfu.

[R. DeMurre]

My god, this thread is off the rails :lol

[benefactor]

Alright bro then I know you’re not serious because anyone that has actually trained doesn’t do that stupid shit. The fact you even mentioned sidewalk already shows you to be fraud. No true fighter is risking that shit. So again come sign the waiver or stfu pussy
Oh I know for a fact you aren't risking it. You want to dance around or grapple or some shit like that. Id put you in the hospital.

[timtonymanu]

I hope this makes 10 pages.

[My Fault]

Sign a waiver...:lol

What kind of hoe shit is that:lol
If you truly trained that long then you understand why the waiver so stfu because I’m the first person to see through the bitch in you.

[R. DeMurre]

I hope this makes 10 pages.

Put your nuts on the table and sign a waiver, and maybe it will.

[My Fault]

Oh I know for a fact you aren't risking it. You want to dance around or grapple or some shit like that. Id put you in the hospital.
Strike or grapple, just come to S.A. and sign the waiver:lol I’ll take to the deep and film it 100%

[benefactor]

If you truly trained that long then you understand why the waiver so stfu because I’m the first person to see through the bitch in you.
You talk like someone that has never been in a street fight. It's obvious

[NASpurs]

This guy and his fucking waiver :lol Imagine trying to fight people on the internet and getting them to sign waivers

[benefactor]

This is like koriwhat all over again:lol

[My Fault]

You talk like someone that has never been in a street fight. It's obvious
:lol come test that theory or stfu because it sounds to me you're just running your mouth

[Knoxxx]

Can someone please remind me what started this quasi-interesting catfight?

[benefactor]

This guy and his fucking waiver :lol Imagine trying to fight people on the internet and getting them to sign waivers
He doesn't actually want to fight anyone. He wants to bring them to his gym and play touchy feely. He's probably never been a hit hard in the face in his life

[NASpurs]

He doesn't actually want to fight anyone. He wants to bring them to his gym and play touchy feely. He's probably never been a hit hard in the face in his life

It's probably consent so he can touch balls and shit. Wouldn't put it past him.

[timtonymanu]

This guy and his fucking waiver :lol Imagine trying to fight people on the internet and getting them to sign waivers

Ask him to PM it so we can all read it.

[timtonymanu]

He doesn't actually want to fight anyone. He wants to bring them to his gym and play touchy feely. He's probably never been a hit hard in the face in his life

Reminds me of that donut loving spurs fan that also was a massage therapist

[My Fault]

This guy and his fucking waiver :lol Imagine trying to fight people on the internet and getting them to sign waivers
Just say your a bitch if you can sign a simple piece of paper that teaches you to he consequences of ruining your mouth. :lol

[Mugen]

I live in East texas. Drive up here I'll meet you right near loop 49 where the exit is. I'll beat the fuck out of you and send you right back to San Antonio.

:lol

[timtonymanu]

Dude will probably provide that waiver faster than Brian Wrong getting Markannen in a trade tbh

[NASpurs]

Just say your a bitch if you can sign a simple piece of paper that teaches you to he consequences of ruining your mouth. :lol

DM me the waiver so I can read it, post it here, we'll all have a good laugh and I'll get back to you.

[benefactor]

No one is coming to your gym. Get out in the yard and fight Like a man if you are the somebody you claim to be. Otherwise just go be a pussy on someone else's time

[timtonymanu]

No one is coming to your gym. Get out in the yard and fight Like a man if you are the somebody you claim to be. Otherwise just go be a pussy on someone else's time

He will have his waiver ready if anything.

[My Fault]

He doesn't actually want to fight anyone. He wants to bring them to his gym and play touchy feely. He's probably never been a hit hard in the face in his life
That’s what I thought bitch, you act tough and to go to “I’ve been boxing” but we all know that’s the classic bitch response. You’re a bitch and when anyone calls you out you bitch out. Offer stands, otherwise stfu

[My Fault]

No one is coming to your gym. Get out in the yard and fight Like a man if you are the somebody you claim to be. Otherwise just go be a pussy on someone else's time
Why are you scared of a waiver? If you truly believed in your boxing :lol then you’d have no problem signing because it keeps both us of us out of any legal trouble. The only reason you laugh it off it simply you want to say sound tough without backing it up.

[NASpurs]

Just say your a bitch if you can sign a simple piece of paper that teaches you to he consequences of ruining your mouth. :lol

And what consequences? :lol There's been absolutely none for me. Only thing I see is someone so triggered that they're wanting to fight the forum now. Imagine being so triggered while we laugh at you. :lol

[benefactor]

That’s what I thought bitch, you act tough and to go to “I’ve been boxing” but we all know that’s the classic bitch response. You’re a bitch and when anyone calls you out you bitch out. Offer stands, otherwise stfu
Bitches want to fight in a gym with rules and waivers. I appear to be the only man in this conversation.

[NASpurs]

:madrun

[benefactor]

Why are you scared of a waiver? If you truly believed in your boxing :lol then you’d have no problem signing because it keeps both us of us out of any legal trouble. The only reason you laugh it off it simply you want to say sound tough without backing it up.
Legal trouble...:lol

What...are you planning on pressing charges when I smash the fuck out of you?

[benefactor]

It will be more than boxing if it goes down in the street. But you've already expressed you are afraid to do that.

[Chinook]

The Dillingham trade plus the realization that Champenny is our starting SF again next year has put everyone on edge. :lol

I forgot which poster I was telling there was a chance Champ was going to find a way to hold onto his spot. I'm still hoping I'm wrong and assume Castle and Vassell will be the starting wings. But he's the guy that might fit the SL best on paper.

[benefactor]

I come from a place where you knuckle up and go home. This is why I say you've never been in a street fight. You want the security of your mats in the gym and your waivers. Stand in front of me and put your hands up. Let's see who is about what

[My Fault]

Bitches want to fight in a gym with rules and waivers. I appear to be the only man in this conversation.
:lol You’re a self proclaimed boxer and want to talk about rules :lol Stop, you’re a one dimensional fighter and I’ve given you every opportunity to prove otherwise and now it’s rules that stop you from proving me wrong? :lol You truly have gone this long without someone testing you? You’re a pussy and if you want to prove that wrong? Come sign the waiver as it truly does nothing but keep me from a charges, simple as that.

[benefactor]

:lol You’re a self proclaimed boxer and want to talk about rules :lol Stop, you’re a one dimensional fighter and I’ve given you every opportunity to prove otherwise and now it’s rules that stop you from proving me wrong? :lol You truly have gone this long without someone testing you? You’re a pussy and if you want to prove that wrong? Come sign the waiver as it truly does nothing but keep me from a charges, simple as that.
Boxing is just my base. Street fighting is completely different. But it's always been proven you don't want to do that

[My Fault]

I come from a place where you knuckle up and go home. This is why I say you've never been in a street fight. You want the security of your mats in the gym and your waivers. Stand in front of me and put your hands up. Let's see who is about what
Then signing the waiver is the same, act tough online and you may have gotten away with that untested but now you’ve peaked my interest.

[benefactor]

:cry sign my waiver :cry
:cry come to my gym :cry

:lol pussy

[My Fault]

Boxing is just my base. Street fighting is completely different. But it's always been proven you don't want to do that:lol :lol :lol Now I know you’ve never boxed a day in your life, street fight? You might an untrained fighter:lol Great way to get expose yourself :lol

[My Fault]

:cry sign my waiver :cry
:cry come to my gym :cry

:lol pussy
You just mentioned street fighting and exposed yourself, it’s over, you’re a fucking joke I can’t take serious.

[NASpurs]

:cry sign my waiver :cry
:cry come to my gym :cry

:lol pussy


:cry Come to my gym and sign a waiver :cry

https://i.ibb.co/Q6p9Xdw/full-length-profile-shot-of-of-two-people-wearing-protective-body-gear-and-helmets-boxing-during-a-c.jpg (https://ibb.co/wKByYsm)

[benefactor]

:lol :lol :lol Now I know you’ve never boxed a day in your life, street fight? You might an untrained fighter:lol Great way to get expose yourself :lol
I spent a lot more time in yards and on sidewalks than I did in the ring. Come find out.

[timtonymanu]

Can I see the other waivers that people have accepted to signing? I would like to know what I'm getting into before signing the waiver.

[benefactor]

You just mentioned street fighting and exposed yourself, it’s over, you’re a fucking joke I can’t take serious.
Come see if it's a joke.

[My Fault]

:cry Come to my gym and sign a waiver :cry

https://i.ibb.co/Q6p9Xdw/full-length-profile-shot-of-of-two-people-wearing-protective-body-gear-and-helmets-boxing-during-a-c.jpg (https://ibb.co/wKByYsm)
Stay out of grown folk talk because we know you’re too much a pussy to show up

[Chinook]

I feel like I've been transported back to 2013 with this thread.

[benefactor]

This is the point where he claims it's over because he's afraid. He wants to play around in the gym with people. He has never fought behind a building or in the grass. Have fun in the gym.

[NASpurs]

Stay out of grown folk talk because we know you’re too much a pussy to show up

Bitch no one takes you seriously. Are you not noticing that we're laughing at your dumbass? :lol

[timtonymanu]

This is the point where he claims it's over because he's afraid. He wants to play around in the gym with people. He has never fought behind a building or in the grass. Have fun in the gym.

Shouldn't be hard to find the one guy holding pages of waivers ready to hand out

[My Fault]

Come see if it's a joke.
I gave you a legal way out, you truly believe you can do anything then come do without fearing an assault charge. We’re both grown and know fighting the street will result in that but I’m giving you an opportunity to not face those consequences, to laugh it off means you’re not serious because you know what will happen. It’s so simple and I’m willing to put it all camera, balls in your court, tough guy. Come with your “boxing” but expect “street fight” to rules

[My Fault]

I gave you a legal way out, you truly believe you can do anything then come do without fearing an assault charge. We’re both grown and know fighting the street will result in that but I’m giving you an opportunity to not face those consequences, to laugh it off means you’re not serious because you know what will happen. It’s so simple and I’m willing to put it all camera, balls in your court, tough guy. Come with your “boxing” but expect “street fight” to rules
The waiver is I only so I don’t get sued for your medical bills

[benefactor]

Shouldn't be hard to find the one guy holding pages of waivers ready to hand out
It's not hard to find the guy standing under the sun at the loop 49 exit either. Have fun playing hide the pickle with your buddies.

[My Fault]

It's not hard to find the guy standing under the sun at the loop 49 exit either. Have fun playing hide the pickle with your buddies.
Right bitch, come find out life exist outside the internet

[benefactor]

I will not press charges against the poster behind the My Fault account. Good enough for you? Simple internet research can prove its me. I'm here when you're ready

[My Fault]

Bitch no one takes you seriously. Are you not noticing that we're laughing at your dumbass? :lol
Same invite extends to you but keep hiding like a bitch. I have feeling I’ll be exposing one of you very soon. One humbling at a time :lol Ran into the right one :lol

[My Fault]

I will not press charges against the poster behind the My Fault account. Good enough for you? Simple internet research can prove its me. I'm here when you're ready
You’re seriously going to dance around shit? I gave you a very simple path you pussy

[benefactor]

You’re seriously going to dance around shit? I gave you a very simple path you pussy
:lol...that's what I thought.

My work is done here

[NASpurs]

Same invite extends to you but keep hiding like a bitch. I have feeling I’ll be exposing one of you very soon. One humbling at a time :lol Ran into the right one :lol

:madrun "You got me so triggered" :madrun

Weak ass pussy

[Raven]

we don't need to make any trades to be competitive.

[The Truth #6]

I feel like I wasted a full season reading this thread.

[My Fault]

:lol...that's what I thought.

My work is done here
Oh stop being a bitch let’s take this further, I will film it all and expose you for the bitch you are. Either you apologize or be crippled for life :lol

[My Fault]

:madrun "You got me so triggered" :madrun

Weak ass pussy
Shut up bitch, stop pleading for attentions, someone else volunteered :lol

[taps]

I forgot which poster I was telling there was a chance Champ was going to find a way to hold onto his spot. I'm still hoping I'm wrong and assume Castle and Vassell will be the starting wings. But he's the guy that might fit the SL best on paper.

I thought he might be out of summer league at this point unless it’s all for Castle development. Just seems like he’s been around a Little long for SL.

[scott]

Wait, who are we signing off waivers?

[NASpurs]

Wait, who are we signing off waivers?

:lol

[JPB]

Nah, you don't go all in. People are confusing his talent and potential with actually being ready to carry a team to a title. However, you don't play for the draft at this point. You play for a playoff spot and not worry about how many distant pick swaps you can fit on the head of a pin.

that's kind of the whole point. You do'nt even make the play in with the roster as such or just adding anoter random vet. CP3 doesn't move the needle. HOU and NO got/will get better, MEM will get Ja back... you're not top 10 next year without adding some serious talent.

[JPB]

I agree that he needs to start learning how to climb the mountain. People forget that it takes numerous playoff reps to actually be a contender. All of which makes trading the 8th pick all the more inexcusable. We need talent now to start that climb; not in 2031.

Proven talent, not an uncertain rookie who will take years to devvelop into a starter if he ever will.

[Ice009]

I don't know, one of those videos that Cutewizard posted (lol, I ended up clicking on a few), led to a Nick Wright video (Unless he doesn't want the Spurs to be good? Is he generally a Spurs hater or fan?), and he says the slow approach is the right one. He was using NO and a young Anthony Davis as an example saying that tried to get him help really fast by bringing guys like Jrue Holiday in and it didn't work out. I know this is completely different as I think Victor is already amazing and getting better and better, but it's an interesting thought/take that I didn't really think about.

I also don't remember where I read/heard this (could have been here, on a video, or maybe Ronny said it in the broadcast last night, I just don't remember), but it was mentioned building slower to last longer. I really don't know what approach the Spurs should take. Maybe they need to ask Victor directly, or do you guys think they've already discussed all this with him?

[Bill_Brasky]

Michael Jordan didn't win a championship until he was like 27. Same for Lebron. Yall are some stupid fucks tbh. Can't really expect much more though from a website of little boys challenging to fight each other.

[Ginobili2Duncan]

No one is going to waste shit. Victor is coming off his rookie season and our core pieces are still under 25 and still developing. I’m sure Victor and the FO are in lockstep on the future plans on how to build the team going forward. From afar it looks like they are going to use one more draft cycle to get another core piece and see which players develop and they can keep and who they move off. This was always going to be a 2-3 year process to figure how they wanted to build the identity of the team. How people on this message board think they know more than the paid professionals who have forgotten more about team building than we’ll ever know and are actually around the players everyday is truly beyond me.

[LeBowen]

No one is going to waste shit. Victor is coming off his rookie season and our core pieces are still under 25 and still developing.

Who exactly is developing?
Devin is already a 20ppg scorer.
Jeremy needs to learn how to play basketball if he's to stay on the roster.
Castle is the only question mark.
Others are scrubs who won't be here long.


I’m sure Victor and the FO are in lockstep on the future plans on how to build the team going forward.

There are way too many bad decisions and red flags surrounding Brian Wright and his team for us not to be concerned.


From afar it looks like they are going to use one more draft cycle to get another core piece and see which players develop and they can keep and who they move off.

Why didn't we get another rookie with #8 pick then.
It can't possibly be that they thought not a single player picked from #8 onwards would become an NBA level starter?
Instead they kicked that pick 7 years down the road and who knows if it's even going to be a lottery pick.
The only reasonable explanation is that they decided to use it as an asset in a trade.


This was always going to be a 2-3 year process to figure how they wanted to build the identity of the team.

You can't build for 3 years when your franchise player is already on all-NBA and DPOY level.
There will be 8 teams that are going to blatantly tank next season. Unless Wemby gets injured or shut down, we're more or less guaranteed to be better than them.
He's going to average 25/12 with ease while being the best defender in the league.
At that point, having 9th or 12th best odds is irrelevant. Just play to win and gain experience.


How people on this message board think they know more than the paid professionals who have forgotten more about team building than we’ll ever know and are actually around the players everyday is truly beyond me.

Yeah, let's act like every front office in the league is competent and every team is doing well.
The only fact right now is that we're on the second longest lottery streak after Pistons.
If we didn't get beyond lucky with 14% odds to get Wemby, we'd still be one of the worst teams in the league and looking at at least 2 more years of blatant tanking.
No competent front office needs 7 years of lottery, even if they get unlucky in the draft.

Let's not even mention how they picked a subpar player with #9 pick in 2022 and wasted two more FRPs on two players who will likely be out of the league after this season.
Or how they reached to pick a player noone had in lottery in 2021, only for him to turn out to be a scrub even before he started swinging his dick around.

[Ginobili2Duncan]

Who exactly is developing?
Devin is already a 20ppg scorer.
Jeremy needs to learn how to play basketball if he's to stay on the roster.
Castle is the only question mark.
Others are scrubs who won't be here long.



There are way too many bad decisions and red flags surrounding Brian Wright and his team for us not to be concerned.



Why didn't we get another rookie with #8 pick then.
It can't possibly be that they thought not a single player picked from #8 onwards would become an NBA level starter?
Instead they kicked that pick 7 years down the road and who knows if it's even going to be a lottery pick.
The only reasonable explanation is that they decided to use it as an asset in a trade.



You can't build for 3 years when your franchise player is already on all-NBA and DPOY level.
There will be 8 teams that are going to blatantly tank next season. Unless Wemby gets injured or shut down, we're more or less guaranteed to be better than them.
He's going to average 25/12 with ease while being the best defender in the league.
At that point, having 9th or 12th best odds is irrelevant. Just play to win and gain experience.



Yeah, let's act like every front office in the league is competent and every team is doing well.
The only fact right now is that we're on the second longest lottery streak after Pistons.
If we didn't get beyond lucky with 14% odds to get Wemby, we'd still be one of the worst teams in the league and looking at at least 2 more years of blatant tanking.
No competent front office needs 7 years of lottery, even if they get unlucky in the draft.

Let's not even mention how they picked a subpar player with #9 pick in 2022 and wasted two more FRPs on two players who will likely be out of the league after this season.
Or how they reached to pick a player noone had in lottery in 2021, only for him to turn out to be a scrub even before he started swinging his dick around.

So what’s your plan of action to get the Spurs to contention status as soon as next year? And how would your plan make the Spurs better than Dallas, Minnesota, Denver and Boston? If you want to win now they have to be better than those teams right now.

[LeBowen]

So what’s your plan of action to get the Spurs to contention status as soon as next year? And how would your plan make the Spurs better than Dallas, Minnesota, Denver and Boston? If you want to win now they have to be better than those teams right now.

That's the problem with a lot of fans.
There's no easy way to contention.
We can't go from 0 to 100.
First we need to become a good regular season team, then have some playoff failures and then start contending.
We have to start somewhere, we surely won't draft another generational talent with like qurater of the league tanking on purpose.
We can get more solid pieces, but those players will take a few years to develop.
But every year outside of the playoffs pushes that contention window further down the line.
Before you know it, Wemby is on a max deal already with Spurs still building around him and nothing to show for.

Scott had a great NFL analogy last night.
Since NFL teams are hard capped, if they draft an elite QB, they start building around him right away and take advantage of that cheap deal.
Wemby has three years left on a cheap deal and it would be awful if we didn't use those final two years to win some actual playoff series.

Trading for Markkanen would enable us to make the playoffs this season.
If his price is 4 FRPs, we'd still have 9 FRPs in the next 7 drafts and we wouldn't lose any significant roster pieces.

Castle, Devin, Markkanen, Wemby core, with one or two '25 FRPs and maybe Jeremy developing looks great to me.
Then we add solid role players via late FRPs or use some in trades.
Role players will all want to play with Wemby in free agency, we'll become a desirable destination for players that have winning as their priority.

[Spursfanfromafar]

So what’s your plan of action to get the Spurs to contention status as soon as next year? And how would your plan make the Spurs better than Dallas, Minnesota, Denver and Boston? If you want to win now they have to be better than those teams right now.

1. Get Markkanen via a reasonable trade that is commensurate to the fact that his is an expiring contract this year and the fact that he is an All-Star already in his prime. Trade Keldon Johnson if need be to get him. Ensure that the Atlanta 2025 pick and the Boston unprotected pick remain, along with the Spurs' own picks from 2026 onwards but the Charlotte, Chicago, Atlanta swap and 2027 unprotected, the Minnesota swap and Minnesota unprotected picks along with Keldon can be a good package for Markkanen.

2. Get a competent wing player on a reasonable FA contract - Gary Trent Jr should be first choice, Isaac Okoro can be second choice and Caleb Martin can be third choice. The last two can come for relatively cheap too. Try to get Haywood Highsmith on an one-year contract or a reasonable one.

3. A team which has CP3, Vassell, Okoro, Markannen, Wemby backed up by Jones, Castle, Sochan, Highsmith, Bassey/Collins and an extended bench with Wesley, Cissoko, Champagnie, Ingram and Collins/Bassey can contend for the play-offs at least if Wemby's progression into All NBA First Team player and DPOY happens as per expectations and Markkanen performs to his All-Star expectations even as Vassell grows into a more useful No 3. Castle can be eased into the starting lineup over time.

4. I believe that the Atlanta pick for 2025 can be a lottery pick and the Spurs can ride their luck to get a decent player in the Top 10 next year despite being playoff contending this year. And they can try the 2026 Free agent market for another star if Markannen/ Vassell fail to deliver.

[Ginobili2Duncan]

That's the problem with a lot of fans.
There's no easy way to contention.
We can't go from 0 to 100.
First we need to become a good regular season team, then have some playoff failures and then start contending.
We have to start somewhere, we surely won't draft another generational talent with like qurater of the league tanking on purpose.
We can get more solid pieces, but those players will take a few years to develop.
But every year outside of the playoffs pushes that contention window further down the line.
Before you know it, Wemby is on a max deal already with Spurs still building around him and nothing to show for.

Scott had a great NFL analogy last night.
Since NFL teams are hard capped, if they draft an elite QB, they start building around him right away and take advantage of that cheap deal.
Wemby has three years left on a cheap deal and it would be awful if we didn't use those final two years to win some actual playoff series.

Trading for Markkanen would enable us to make the playoffs this season.
If his price is 4 FRPs, we'd still have 9 FRPs in the next 7 drafts and we wouldn't lose any significant roster pieces.

Castle, Devin, Markkanen, Wemby core, with one or two '25 FRPs and maybe Jeremy developing looks great to me.
Then we add solid role players via late FRPs or use some in trades.
Role players will all want to play with Wemby in free agency, we'll become a desirable destination for players that have winning as their priority.

I understand there’s no easy path to contention that’s why I’m in the minority of the fan base that would rather sit back and let our FO cook and view the results before I decide I have a problem with them. Again Wemby just finished his rookie season. As good as regular success sounds I think it’s smarter to see how our younger players develop first. Some of them aren’t even legal drinking age yet. I’d rather they take another year to see what they have than to potentially give up on a young player too soon.

Moves like LM are for when you already have an established identity and you’re looking for a final piece to put you over the top. The Spurs aren’t in the business of looking for a final piece yet. At best this is a 32 win team. Use next years draft picks to add another core piece and establish a firm direction of the team. Then you use your assets to make moves that will put you over the top.

Football careers are generally much shorter than basketball careers and football players come into the league older than when basketball players do. Not sure how good a comparison that is.

Right now the Spurs are where they need to be. I don’t believe in making knee jerk win now moves that raise your floor but don’t put you in contention status.

[LeBowen]

I understand there’s no easy path to contention that’s why I’m in the minority of the fan base that would rather sit back and let our FO cook and view the results before I decide I have a problem with them. Again Wemby just finished his rookie season. As good as regular success sounds I think it’s smarter to see how our younger players develop first. Some of them aren’t even legal drinking age yet. I’d rather they take another year to see what they have than to potentially give up on a young player too soon.

My opinion is that players develop way better in a winning enviroment, that's why we developed so many great role players when we were winning and competing.


Moves like LM are for when you already have an established identity and you’re looking for a final piece to put you over the top. The Spurs aren’t in the business of looking for a final piece yet. At best this is a 32 win team. Use next years draft picks to add another core piece and establish a firm direction of the team. Then you use your assets to make moves that will put you over the top.

Check out that other topic about potential wings we could get.
I made a really long list and I'm so high on Markkanen because he's easily the best fit in the entire league in terms of basketball fit with Wemby, age and availabilty.


Football careers are generally much shorter than basketball careers and football players come into the league older than when basketball players do. Not sure how good a comparison that is.

And as of late window contentions in the NBA are way shorter than they should be.
Denver won, looked like a dynasty in the making and now they're on the decline due to having three max deals.


Right now the Spurs are where they need to be. I don’t believe in making knee jerk win now moves that raise your floor but don’t put you in contention status.

Remember those games at the end of the season when every starter except Wemby got shut down?
And third stringers played on the level of our starters?
We don't really have many young players who could develop.
And trading for Markkanen wouldn't take away from any of them because he's a type of player we're missing. Forward with elite shooting.

Remember when PATFO actually tried to improve the roster while we were on top?
Why chase JKidd if you're already the reigning champion?
Why chase Jermaine O'Neal?
Why trade George Hill for an unknown kid who can't dribble or shoot the ball?
If there's a move that makes perfect sense, you make it.

Noone is asking them to trade for Trae or to sign a 34 year old PG on a 5 year deal.

[Ginobili2Duncan]

1. Get Markkanen via a reasonable trade that is commensurate to the fact that his is an expiring contract this year and the fact that he is an All-Star already in his prime. Trade Keldon Johnson if need be to get him. Ensure that the Atlanta 2025 pick and the Boston unprotected pick remain, along with the Spurs' own picks from 2026 onwards but the Charlotte, Chicago, Atlanta swap and 2027 unprotected, the Minnesota swap and Minnesota unprotected picks along with Keldon can be a good package for Markkanen.

2. Get a competent wing player on a reasonable FA contract - Gary Trent Jr should be first choice, Isaac Okoro can be second choice and Caleb Martin can be third choice. The last two can come for relatively cheap too. Try to get Haywood Highsmith on an one-year contract or a reasonable one.

3. A team which has CP3, Vassell, Okoro, Markannen, Wemby backed up by Jones, Castle, Sochan, Highsmith, Bassey/Collins and an extended bench with Wesley, Cissoko, Champagnie, Ingram and Collins/Bassey can contend for the play-offs at least if Wemby's progression into All NBA First Team player and DPOY happens as per expectations and Markkanen performs to his All-Star expectations even as Vassell grows into a more useful No 3. Castle can be eased into the starting lineup over time.

4. I believe that the Atlanta pick for 2025 can be a lottery pick and the Spurs can ride their luck to get a decent player in the Top 10 next year despite being playoff contending this year. And they can try the 2026 Free agent market for another star if Markannen/ Vassell fail to deliver.

I can get behind this especially if the Spurs keep those two ATL picks. Those are vital. The only problem is I suspect the Jazz will ask for them.

[stnick2261]

Oh stop being a bitch let’s take this further, I will film it all and expose you for the bitch you are. Either you apologize or be crippled for life :lol

https://i.imgur.com/b0C8MQa.jpg

[TheChillFactor]

someone call brian wright and tell him if he doesn't trade for Jokic he's fired.

[z0sa]

Michael Jordan didn't win a championship until he was like 27. Same for Lebron. Yall are some stupid fucks tbh. Can't really expect much more though from a website of little boys challenging to fight each other.

How old was Tim Duncan? This false equivalency and apples-to-oranges comparison from different eras (and comparing a player in LeBron who jumped ship like the biggest asshole ever) needs to stop. There's no reason at all to just mail it in 6 years because "MJ and LeBron had to wait." Guarantee you they didn't want to and neither did their fans.

[LeBowen]

How old was Tim Duncan? This false equivalency and apples-to-oranges comparison from different eras (and comparing a player in LeBron who jumped ship like the biggest asshole ever) needs to stop. There's no reason at all to just mail it in 6 years because "MJ and LeBron had to wait." Guarantee you they didn't want to and neither did their fans.

As if Lebron not winning before he left the Cavs is a good thing.
Cavs were beyond incompetent.

MJ played in a different era, without much movement of high-end talent.

[TD 21]

No one is going to waste shit. Victor is coming off his rookie season and our core pieces are still under 25 and still developing. I’m sure Victor and the FO are in lockstep on the future plans on how to build the team going forward. From afar it looks like they are going to use one more draft cycle to get another core piece and see which players develop and they can keep and who they move off. This was always going to be a 2-3 year process to figure how they wanted to build the identity of the team. How people on this message board think they know more than the paid professionals who have forgotten more about team building than we’ll ever know and are actually around the players everyday is truly beyond me.

I've never understood this response. Why come to a message board then? You know full well it's a place for hardcore fans to commiserate about their team.

Much of what you see here you'd see on virtually every board about every team in every sport.

It's not about "knowing more than them", it's about them doing a "better" (a lot of is luck) job than the other 29 front offices because for the last three quarters of a decade, they've done a lousy one and would still be in the wilderness if they didn't luck into a whopping third GOAT prospect.

On top of that, they do myriad things that other franchises don't do because of this holier than thou crap.

It's absolutely fair game to criticize and pontificate, but if it bothers you so much, you know what to do . . .

[Sugus]

No one is going to waste shit. Victor is coming off his rookie season and our core pieces are still under 25 and still developing. I’m sure Victor and the FO are in lockstep on the future plans on how to build the team going forward. From afar it looks like they are going to use one more draft cycle to get another core piece and see which players develop and they can keep and who they move off. This was always going to be a 2-3 year process to figure how they wanted to build the identity of the team. How people on this message board think they know more than the paid professionals who have forgotten more about team building than we’ll ever know and are actually around the players everyday is truly beyond me.

It really is notorious, this is a very arrogant board overall.

You would think the Spurs had Atlanta or post-MJ-Chicago's trajectory the way people here talk about the team and FO. Yet the Spurs are like the third most winning franchise in NBA history, to this day. Funny how that works.

[R. DeMurre]

Wait, who are we signing off waivers?

:lol

[LeBowen]

It really is notorious, this is a very arrogant board overall.

You would think the Spurs had Atlanta or post-MJ-Chicago's trajectory the way people here talk about the team and FO. Yet the Spurs are like the third most winning franchise in NBA history, to this day. Funny how that works.

Yeah, third most winning franchise because they had arguably the greatest leader and teammate in the history of the game.
Times change, the game changes, there are plenty of instances where amazing front offices and coaches fuck up and end their reign on a sour note.

Look at the Warriors. They wanted to emulate what the Spurs did, wanted the two timelines rebuild and after wasting all those assets now they're fucked.
They either have Steph treadmill his way into the retirement or trade away all their assets for a couple more first round exits.

Which good, big moves have the Spurs made since Duncan retired in 2016?
Nephew fucked them over, they refused better offers and decided not to tank.
Demar and LMA thing was obviously first round exit, best case scenario, they still stuck with them.
LMA got old and lost his value, we still kept treadmilling even after trading DDR away for peanuts.
Everyone reasonable was on board with tanking after 2018. It was a case of needing to pull the plug from a dying roster.
Then after four years in the lottery we get the potential GOAT, he's already ridiculous, we have a shitton of assets and can't get top5 record anymore...but now PATFO wants to tank?
Where's the logic in that?

The only truth and fact is that even after 5 years of lottery Spurs would be a top3 worst team in the league if we didn't get extremely luck with 14% chance and got the potential GOAT.
If we had anyone else from 2023 draft, we'd be looking at two more years of tanking, minimum.

That's some Hornets and Pistons shit, ffs.

[Spurs Homer]

You just wait - this #8 pick we just drafted might be the rookie of the year!

Oh shit...wait!

[Uriel]

He's a top three player this year. Get him whatever help he needs to get to the tournament. Spend assets.
He’s not a top three player.

He’s top one.

[Sugus]

Yeah, third most winning franchise because they had arguably the greatest leader and teammate in the history of the game.
Times change, the game changes, there are plenty of instances where amazing front offices and coaches fuck up and end their reign on a sour note.

If you don't understand or appreciate the work it took from the Spurs to retain that GOAT level player through his entire career here, and be able to elevate him by consistently surrounding him with top-tier talent, then we simply won't agree. I will not hand-waive and dismiss close to two decades of excellent team-building, asset management, and the fielding of continuously champion-level rosters, as something "typical" or "expected" or "natural".

The Spurs FO overall was as GOAT-contentious in its own field, as Tim Duncan was on the court, is my point. I challenge you to find better success and management over time in other teams, hell, in other sports even -- the Spurs are remarkable worldwide on this. Hell, the Bulls had an even greater prospect than TD, and how's their winning % looking like nowadays? It's not only about the player, or close to that.

I don't disagree that time changes, but I do disagree that they've changed to such an extent - or that the Spurs have not adapted, besides the public "old school" persona front they put out as branding - that all of their experience, know-how is now worthless. Again, agree to disagree, but the stats and team success, even post-TD, remain.


Look at the Warriors. They wanted to emulate what the Spurs did, wanted the two timelines rebuild and after wasting all those assets now they're fucked.
They either have Steph treadmill his way into the retirement or trade away all their assets for a couple more first round exits.

Yeah, terrible asset management from them, they're no Spurs tbh :lol. I also don't think they really emulated the Spurs in the period you're critiquing - they built their core and team much like the Spurs, but the past few years haven't managed them like the Spurs would've. They got really desperate, which was surprising IMO.

[Sugus]

Which good, big moves have the Spurs made since Duncan retired in 2016?
Nephew fucked them over, they refused better offers and decided not to tank.
Demar and LMA thing was obviously first round exit, best case scenario, they still stuck with them.
LMA got old and lost his value, we still kept treadmilling even after trading DDR away for peanuts.
Everyone reasonable was on board with tanking after 2018. It was a case of needing to pull the plug from a dying roster.
Then after four years in the lottery we get the potential GOAT, he's already ridiculous, we have a shitton of assets and can't get top5 record anymore...but now PATFO wants to tank?
Where's the logic in that?

Broke this into 2 posts for easier replying.

I personally liked their pivot into the post-Kawhi era. The Spurs weren't willing to tank, which is as much a team as it is a business decision, and on that paradigm made the best of a terrible, terrible situation. I didn't like the Ingram package which was the only real offer besides DDR, which lands us here, really. And to your tanking point - the Spurs actively delayed the tank while waiting for Wemby to be eligible (there's a Timvp article on the Spurs' preparation for this if you haven't read it), and got the GOAT candidate. Again, something I think they should get credit for, rather than bashed, considering that having followed your "tank in 2018" idea (not yours only ofc, most of ST was on it), they wouldn't have Wemby today. They waited for it.

I haven't seen any mentions of wanting to tank from PATFO this season, so do loop me on that if I've missed it. From the looks of it, they want to field a competitive team while retaining flexibility, which is a path I like, though I wouldn't mind Markkannen for the right price.


The only truth and fact is that even after 5 years of lottery Spurs would be a top3 worst team in the league if we didn't get extremely luck with 14% chance and got the potential GOAT.
If we had anyone else from 2023 draft, we'd be looking at two more years of tanking, minimum.

That's some Hornets and Pistons shit, ffs.

That's neither truth nor a fact, it's a supposition lmao. And it's not even a right one because different events necessitate different choices - had the Spurs not gotten Wemby and instead Amen Thompson or w/e, they would not have made the moves they have, and might've pushed harder for a trade or bigger shakeup. You can't just assume it all plays out the same.

And in any case, as teams like the Hornets and Pistons you mention show, it's not about how bad you are but how good you're building yourself up to be. Otherwise, being bad has no end. And on this point, I didn't see the Spurs being rudderless at any point post-Nephew - just going in directions that I might disagree with. But clueless? Only once, when the Primo stuff blew up in their faces, tbh.

[Chinook]

that's kind of the whole point. You do'nt even make the play in with the roster as such or just adding anoter random vet. CP3 doesn't move the needle. HOU and NO got/will get better, MEM will get Ja back... you're not top 10 next year without adding some serious talent.

I think the Spurs are going to have to try pretty hard to be bottom-10 this year. Too many teams that want to lose and a lot more talent this you're suggesting. The only thing that would've sunk them (besides injury) was if Pop started Castle at PG and he had a Sochan-like effect. But once they signed Paul, that risk went away. People seem to not be taking into account how Jeremy being able to grow as a PF playing off an elite play-maker could help is game. But that's neither here nor there. I don't think it's productive to get into another debate over the relative talents of the players. That'll sort itself out. I'm in favor of a pretty big move. I'm not particularly in favor of the types of trade people are talking about right now, though.

The Spurs shouldn't have to trade five unprotected picks to have a realistic chance of making the playoffs. That's just silly and would be a sign their roster isn't at the point where such an acceleration would have the long-term effects they're hoping for. If they can't improve to 35-44 wins with solid vets and growth, then they need to go back to the draft. But I think they can, so it's fine.

[Sugus]

I think the Spurs are going to have to try pretty hard to be bottom-10 this year. Too many teams that want to lose and a lot more talent this you're suggesting. The only thing that would've sunk them (besides injury) was if Pop started Castle at PG and he had a Sochan-like effect. But once they signed Paul, that risk went away. People seem to not be taking into account how Jeremy being able to grow as a PF playing off an elite play-maker could help is game. But that's neither here nor there. I don't think it's productive to get into another debate over the relative talents of the players. That'll sort itself out. I'm in favor of a pretty big move. I'm not particularly in favor of the types of trade people are talking about right now, though.

The Spurs shouldn't have to trade five unprotected picks to have a realistic chance of making the playoffs. That's just silly and would be a sign their roster isn't at the point where such an acceleration would have the long-term effects they're hoping for. If they can't improve to 35-44 wins with solid vets and growth, then they need to go back to the draft. But I think they can, so it's fine.

This, so much. People understandably want big moves right now, but another season of growth is best course. Wemby isn't going anywhere and the only thing "wasted" would be the Spurs' assets on the wrong trade, which Dallas saw firsthand and is still paying the costs of with their Porzingis trade.

Actually, that Porzingis trade sounds eerily similar to the Markkannen trade people are proposing. I don't recall the assets dealt, but it seemed like a "jump the gun" move the moment it happened.

[Ginobili2Duncan]

I've never understood this response. Why come to a message board then? You know full well it's a place for hardcore fans to commiserate about their team.

Much of what you see here you'd see on virtually every board about every team in every sport.

It's not about "knowing more than them", it's about them doing a "better" (a lot of is luck) job than the other 29 front offices because for the last three quarters of a decade, they've done a lousy one and would still be in the wilderness if they didn't luck into a whopping third GOAT prospect.

On top of that, they do myriad things that other franchises don't do because of this holier than thou crap.

It's absolutely fair game to criticize and pontificate, but if it bothers you so much, you know what to do . . .

Discourse doesn’t bother me. It’s the internet. I’m simply offering a different point of view by pointing out the irony of some of the people being critical of the organization at this very moment when we don’t have all the facts. We don’t know the FO plans are yet. All I’m suggesting is that it’s better to wait until we have more information before making assumptions that the organization is dropping the ball after Wemby’s rookie season.

[KobesAchilles]

I’ve seen what Wright does with picks in the 8-12 range (where we should end up next season) and he’s not going to pick the magical second star like everyone around here says he is going to. I don’t see where fans get the faith that he will.

Also fans having the gall to have an opinion on a spurs message board. How dare fans think they know more than paid professionals. Especially on a Spurs message board. We should just remain happy that we haven’t made the playoffs in 6 seasons bc PATFO know more about basketball than us. Well they need to start acting like it.

Pop was way too egotistical last year. He thought he could teach Sochan how to play PG. That thought crossed his mind and his ego told him that he could. All by himself. And he was wrong. He also by his own admission didn’t run plays for Wemby or come up with plays for Wemby. Let’s compare that to Andy Reid who as soon as he gets a player he draws up plays for them and goes into the lab to tinker out stuff. But Pop just said eh I will figure it out at some point. Yeah half a season down the drain before Pop gets this magical idea that maybe he should pair Wemby with a point guard…

And he didn’t treat Wemby like the franchise player to start the year. This gets the whole season off on the wrong foot. There needs to be a hierarchy on your team. And Wemby should’ve been on top of it to start the season. These are all obvious things that Pop didn’t care about. Every great coach hits a wall where they can’t coach anymore. Pop hit that wall. It’s ok. But to be like well Pop knows more about basketball so he should coach forever. That’s just stupid.

In the 1970s the Reds were the best team in baseball. They had a huge run of success and nobody thought it would end. Until it did. Your sports franchise isn’t infallible to becoming bad just bc they were once good. Taking/making the least amount of 3s in today’s nba is stupid. Idc if Pop knows more about basketball than me. The Spurs need more shooting. The only way to win in today’s league is to have a buncha shooters on your team that can hit 3s.

Final part to my long rant. People keep saying how young we are and our youth haven’t hit their stride yet. Ok. If you truly believe in the youth Sugus. Like 100% believe in Sochan and Vassell and Castle and Branham and Wesley (Mr. Body) then why don’t we trade our picks for a 27 year old all star player who fits seamlessly with the team. We have our core youth players. They are only going to get better. Lauri is in his prime and will still be a good player 4 years from now. If you really believe in our players then trading for Lauri just for draft picks alone should be the opportunity you want. Instead you don’t believe in them. You think they aren’t that good. They aren’t championship level. That Brian Wright didn’t draft very well. And so really you just agree with us

[Chomag]

The Fo worked so hard tanking to get yound talent through the draft just to trade away their 8th for nothing anytime soon.

What are they even doing?

[TD 21]

Discourse doesn’t bother me. It’s the internet. I’m simply offering a different point of view by pointing out the irony of some of the people being critical of the organization at this very moment when we don’t have all the facts. We don’t know the FO plans are yet. All I’m suggesting is that it’s better to wait until we have more information before making assumptions that the organization is dropping the ball after Wemby’s rookie season.

Maybe so, but that's typical message board fodder for you. In this case, it's not unfounded either because we've seen their overly conservative/rigid act for decades.

[Sugus]

Final part to my long rant. People keep saying how young we are and our youth haven’t hit their stride yet. Ok. If you truly believe in the youth Sugus. Like 100% believe in Sochan and Vassell and Castle and Branham and Wesley (Mr. Body) then why don’t we trade our picks for a 27 year old all star player who fits seamlessly with the team. We have our core youth players. They are only going to get better. Lauri is in his prime and will still be a good player 4 years from now. If you really believe in our players then trading for Lauri just for draft picks alone should be the opportunity you want. Instead you don’t believe in them. You think they aren’t that good. They aren’t championship level. That Brian Wright didn’t draft very well. And so really you just agree with us

A lot of what makes the FO discourse/criticism so asinine to me is just how much of it is built off narratives and entirely unproven prerrogatives that establish the "worldview" that the critics attack. An example from your own post: how the fuck do you know that it was a Pop alone, Pop's ego decision, to give Sochan run at PG, and not a decision discussed with the coaching staff beforehand? That maybe an assistant coach saw value in Sochan's handling and Pop valued that and green-lit the experiment? You simply do not know, tbh, but one narrative gives you a clear enemy, and the other doesn't.

Anyway, on to your question: while yes, I "believe" (lol?) in the Spurs' youth, I'm not so interested in Lauri because 1) I don't think the Spurs have a roster that is one trade away from true contention, instead having numerous holes to fill first, and 2) given point 1, I don't believe the Spurs can maximize Lauri's talents to match the very high price that getting him would take. Then you have to re-sign him to a near-max or max deal at the end of next season, and the problems begin. I've been drumming the Porzingis to Dallas trade as a parallel and an example of why I dislike this move, this early, consistently.

But I'm not "hard passing" on Lauri. If he can be had for just Keldon and a pick? Fuck it, of course. I just don't think that'll be the case. I'm only engaging in this trade if I'm winning it because I don't see the Spurs being rushed to push for this specific "star" at all, when again, more are sure to become available in the near future, just like Kawhi once became.

[KobesAchilles]

A lot of what makes the FO discourse/criticism so asinine to me is just how much of it is built off narratives and entirely unproven prerrogatives that establish the "worldview" that the critics attack. An example from your own post: how the fuck do you know that it was a Pop alone, Pop's ego decision, to give Sochan run at PG, and not a decision discussed with the coaching staff beforehand? That maybe an assistant coach saw value in Sochan's handling and Pop valued that and green-lit the experiment? You simply do not know, tbh, but one narrative gives you a clear enemy, and the other doesn't.

Anyway, on to your question: while yes, I "believe" (lol?) in the Spurs' youth, I'm not so interested in Lauri because 1) I don't think the Spurs have a roster that is one trade away from true contention, instead having numerous holes to fill first, and 2) given point 1, I don't believe the Spurs can maximize Lauri's talents to match the very high price that getting him would take. Then you have to re-sign him to a near-max or max deal at the end of next season, and the problems begin. I've been drumming the Porzingis to Dallas trade as a parallel and an example of why I dislike this move, this early, consistently.

But I'm not "hard passing" on Lauri. If he can be had for just Keldon and a pick? Fuck it, of course. I just don't think that'll be the case. I'm only engaging in this trade if I'm winning it because I don't see the Spurs being rushed to push for this specific "star" at all, when again, more are sure to become available in the near future, just like Kawhi once became.
Pop is head coach. The head coach gets the blame. It comes with the job. The assistant coaches don’t have a win loss record and they aren’t making 16 million a year. I don’t care if an intern came up with the idea, it was Pop who implemented it and therefore he gets the blame for not being able to do it.

What about KJ and 4 picks? 3 our own and the CHI pick. We keep all our youth. Lauri will still be in his prime as the youth gets to learn how to play. So you either have faith that they can become championship pieces or you don’t. If you do have faith then we don’t need major pieces for when we are title contenders. Just small trades and the right vet signings. And yeah the Spurs have a great history of signing star players who want out. We’ve done it once in our entire history

[ambchang]

My guess is that PATFO is looking at a team like the wolves and the nuggets and realize that as a small market team, you are unlikely to ever have a dynastic run in today’s cap structure. Ultimately the second apron will severely limit building dynasties (look at Celtics cap) and the best way to prolong the wemby timeline is basically to continuously rebuild the team while he is in his prime with a core of mid level role players and a young hired gun as support. At this point that core isn’t developed yet and there are no ideal guys to trade for, having players like Tre young and Lauri will just hamper cap room and make the spurs a pretender like the Knicks or at best the Mavs.

Then Wembys rookie deal is up and he would want out while the roster around him craters. PATFO would want to time the deals and development such that it is ascending rather descending during Wembys negotiations. They probably learned that from duncan when they almost lost him to the magic.

[Tyronn Lue]

Isn't Pop also still the president of basketball ops? Seems like blame has his address listed on its contact page.

[thOOdee]

My guess is that PATFO is looking at a team like the wolves and the nuggets and realize that as a small market team, you are unlikely to ever have a dynastic run in today’s cap structure. Ultimately the second apron will severely limit building dynasties (look at Celtics cap) and the best way to prolong the wemby timeline is basically to continuously rebuild the team while he is in his prime with a core of mid level role players and a young hired gun as support. At this point that core isn’t developed yet and there are no ideal guys to trade for, having players like Tre young and Lauri will just hamper cap room and make the spurs a pretender like the Knicks or at best the Mavs.

Then Wembys rookie deal is up and he would want out while the roster around him craters. PATFO would want to time the deals and development such that it is ascending rather descending during Wembys negotiations. They probably learned that from duncan when they almost lost him to the magic.


I’m not a cap guy, but even big market teams are going to have to rethink how they hold and bring in talent. Dynasties are going to be fewer and far between. Those wanting to blowntheir load will have us looking like Cleveland in no time.

i will say though, anything less than multiple championships is a failure when all things said and done.

[daslicer]

I’m not a cap guy, but even big market teams are going to have to rethink how they hold and bring in talent. Dynasties are going to be fewer and far between. Those wanting to blowntheir load will have us looking like Cleveland in no time.

i will say though, anything less than multiple championships is a failure when all things said and done.

The way the cap is setup I feel the NBA is going to become like the NFL where most of time you will see a new champion every year and back-to-back titles will be very rare. You won't even see a run like what the Spurs did from the '99-'07 due to the way the cap is currently set up. If this current CAP set up existed back during the big 3 era there is a high chance the Spurs would not have been able to keep high quality role players like Bruce Bowen, Brent Barry, Horry, Michael Finley, etc which would have impacted their title runs. Also, there is a chance they wouldn't have been able to keep the big 3 together.

[Brazil]

so the Spurs made a move to get the team more more competitive next year and SFs are still bitching :lol

[Obstructed_View]

so the Spurs made a move to get the team more more competitive next year and SFs are still bitching :lol
They traded away one of the highest lottery picks in team history and signed the corpse of a great point guard with a handshake deal to let him go ring chasing at the trade deadline.

More competitive than 20 wins is...what?

What I'm saying is, the Spurs need to just accept that they aren't going to be relying on their own first round picks anymore. They're going to be in the late 20s, hopefully for a long long time. Accepting that, you can spend what assets you have to build the team now. Anything you need to find out about the young players you can find out whether the Spurs win 20 games or 50.

Jordan didn't do shit in the playoffs until he got other good players and a good coach. It took the Bulls too long to figure that out. The 2024 Spurs don't have Bird, Barkley and Isiah blocking their path. The timeline is shorter.

To the people talking up Pop and the FO for being so smart, are you hoping to luck into Tony Parker and Manu Ginobili a second time? That would be an amazing strategy.

[Obstructed_View]

He’s not a top three player.

He’s top one.
That kid is so fucking special. I hope he stays healthy for 20 years.

[UNT Eagles 2016]

Right, which is why the worst decision in the world is to be impulsive and throw money and resources around. Thank God the franchise has an incredible idea of the future. Want to see what happens when you make bad decisions with money and resources? Denver. Milwaukee. Those championship windows are pretty much closed.

So, settle down. We're going to be okay.
Denver and Milwaukee each have a championship title to their names, which is the ultimate prize, so they didn't completely fail like the 2010s OKC Thunder did

[UNT Eagles 2016]

The way the cap is setup I feel the NBA is going to become like the NFL where most of time you will see a new champion every year and back-to-back titles will be very rare. You won't even see a run like what the Spurs did from the '99-'07 due to the way the cap is currently set up. If this current CAP set up existed back during the big 3 era there is a high chance the Spurs would not have been able to keep high quality role players like Bruce Bowen, Brent Barry, Horry, Michael Finley, etc which would have impacted their title runs. Also, there is a chance they wouldn't have been able to keep the big 3 together.
I've always advocated for an NFL-style hard cap and no max contracts.

Also, in the load management era, instead of raising individual's salaries so much, why not expand roster size to 18 (and you can select 15 for the active roster every game)? That way you'll have more players overall in the NBA and they can play more minutes because of all the softie stars that don't feel like playing 82 games anymore like the stars of yesteryear.

[Obstructed_View]

I didn't know if there was a "win now" pick in this last draft, and I hoped for a "star upside" pick. Even though the Spurs pissed away one of their lottery picks, it looks like they got both in Castle.

[Atl Spur]

Broke this into 2 posts for easier replying.

I personally liked their pivot into the post-Kawhi era. The Spurs weren't willing to tank, which is as much a team as it is a business decision, and on that paradigm made the best of a terrible, terrible situation. I didn't like the Ingram package which was the only real offer besides DDR, which lands us here, really. And to your tanking point - the Spurs actively delayed the tank while waiting for Wemby to be eligible (there's a Timvp article on the Spurs' preparation for this if you haven't read it), and got the GOAT candidate. Again, something I think they should get credit for, rather than bashed, considering that having followed your "tank in 2018" idea (not yours only ofc, most of ST was on it), they wouldn't have Wemby today. They waited for it.

I haven't seen any mentions of wanting to tank from PATFO this season, so do loop me on that if I've missed it. From the looks of it, they want to field a competitive team while retaining flexibility, which is a path I like, though I wouldn't mind Markkannen for the right price.



That's neither truth nor a fact, it's a supposition lmao. And it's not even a right one because different events necessitate different choices - had the Spurs not gotten Wemby and instead Amen Thompson or w/e, they would not have made the moves they have, and might've pushed harder for a trade or bigger shakeup. You can't just assume it all plays out the same.

And in any case, as teams like the Hornets and Pistons you mention show, it's not about how bad you are but how good you're building yourself up to be. Otherwise, being bad has no end. And on this point, I didn't see the Spurs being rudderless at any point post-Nephew - just going in directions that I might disagree with. But clueless? Only once, when the Primo stuff blew up in their faces, tbh.

True… nice post

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

How did this thread about our shitty front office devolve into a pissing match between two posters for multiple pages?

Come on guys, if you're going to beat someone up, go stuff that dipshit Brian Wrong in a trash can.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

A lot of what makes the FO discourse/criticism so asinine to me is just how much of it is built off narratives and entirely unproven prerrogatives that establish the "worldview" that the critics attack. An example from your own post: how the fuck do you know that it was a Pop alone, Pop's ego decision, to give Sochan run at PG, and not a decision discussed with the coaching staff beforehand? That maybe an assistant coach saw value in Sochan's handling and Pop valued that and green-lit the experiment? You simply do not know, tbh, but one narrative gives you a clear enemy, and the other doesn't.

Anyway, on to your question: while yes, I "believe" (lol?) in the Spurs' youth, I'm not so interested in Lauri because 1) I don't think the Spurs have a roster that is one trade away from true contention, instead having numerous holes to fill first, and 2) given point 1, I don't believe the Spurs can maximize Lauri's talents to match the very high price that getting him would take. Then you have to re-sign him to a near-max or max deal at the end of next season, and the problems begin. I've been drumming the Porzingis to Dallas trade as a parallel and an example of why I dislike this move, this early, consistently.

But I'm not "hard passing" on Lauri. If he can be had for just Keldon and a pick? Fuck it, of course. I just don't think that'll be the case. I'm only engaging in this trade if I'm winning it because I don't see the Spurs being rushed to push for this specific "star" at all, when again, more are sure to become available in the near future, just like Kawhi once became.

You really think anyone in that building forced Pop to run Sochan at point? God, you're dumb.

Pop's demonstrated repeatedly that he can't think forward. He's stuck on what worked for the Tim Duncan prime years. Stuck on trying to find the next Horry to shoehorn into a point forward. Stuck on finding the next athlete to build into Kawhi. And both are stupid. The game has changed.

[Fireball]

Wasting a year of a 20 year old player? :lmao

The moves the Spurs made are totally fine.

[Obstructed_View]

Wasting a year of a 20 year old player? :lmao

The moves the Spurs made are totally fine.
Thanks, hindsight. :lol

[Sugus]

You really think anyone in that building forced Pop to run Sochan at point? God, you're dumb.

I neither said nor implied that, and my point was to the contrary of that; unsurprisingly it went over your head.


Pop's demonstrated repeatedly that he can't think forward. He's stuck on what worked for the Tim Duncan prime years. Stuck on trying to find the next Horry to shoehorn into a point forward. Stuck on finding the next athlete to build into Kawhi. And both are stupid. The game has changed.

Pop developed a playbook and blueprint for a legendary championship run after Duncan's prime years, that is still being used by the league today, what the fuck are you talking about? :lol

I'd like for him to retire from coaching and hand the seat over to a young new blood coach, but you don't gotta be idiotic with criticism of him, he's done plenty wrong for real.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

I neither said nor implied that, and my point was to the contrary of that; unsurprisingly it went over your head.



Pop developed a playbook and blueprint for a legendary championship run after Duncan's prime years, that is still being used by the league today, what the fuck are you talking about? :lol

I'd like for him to retire from coaching and hand the seat over to a young new blood coach, but you don't gotta be idiotic with criticism of him, he's done plenty wrong for real.


Nothing went over my head. Pop's stuck in 2017. It's 2024. try to keep up.

You need three point shooters, not mid-range "athletes". And we don't even have enough of those either.

[Sugus]

Pop is head coach. The head coach gets the blame. It comes with the job. The assistant coaches don’t have a win loss record and they aren’t making 16 million a year. I don’t care if an intern came up with the idea, it was Pop who implemented it and therefore he gets the blame for not being able to do it.

Sure, I'm not talking about blame here. I'm talking about the retarded delusion that Pop runs some diabolical, egocentric clown show with the team, as if he doesn't have plenty of team advisors and staff overseeing the Spurs' decisions and moves. Again, just an example there from a rhethoric often seen around here.


What about KJ and 4 picks? 3 our own and the CHI pick. We keep all our youth. Lauri will still be in his prime as the youth gets to learn how to play. So you either have faith that they can become championship pieces or you don’t. If you do have faith then we don’t need major pieces for when we are title contenders. Just small trades and the right vet signings. And yeah the Spurs have a great history of signing star players who want out. We’ve done it once in our entire history

For that price? I'd be in. The more the market has developed, and teams like the Warriors appear to have stopped their chase, the more I've grown to like a trade for Lauri. He would fit the current, projected team extremely well, and Wemby is just MVP-level at this moment. You can't go against that.

I honestly think he could have a '03 Timmy run in him by next season if the chips around him are good enough, tbh.

[Sugus]

Nothing went over my head. Pop's stuck in 2017. It's 2024. try to keep up.

You need three point shooters, not mid-range "athletes". And we don't even have enough of those either.

Hey, I'm not the one saying the '14 run was during Timmy's prime, how about you keep up with your own mouth, tbh?

I don't disagree about the rest.

[Obstructed_View]

The Spurs 2014 plan: have a full roster of veterans who understand how to play basketball and let them pick and roll the rest of the league to death.

Paul and Victor is hopefully a good start to that.