Preferred Starting Five

[pookenstein]

What's your preferred S5 going into the season. Assuming Devin will be back shortly, I'll include him in mine. I think with him coming back sooner rather than later three spots in the starting five will be the same for most of us.

Here are my five starters.
Paul, Champagnie, Vassell, Barnes, Wemby

Julien is actually the reason for this thread. If he is able to continue shooting like he has in preseason his floor spreading would open up so much mor space for Wemby than it would be with Sochan starting.

I expect Pop to go with Paul, Vassell, Barnes, Sochan and Wemby, but I really wouldn't mind JC starting.

What do you guys think? Champ or Sochan? Or would you even throw Castle into the fire right away?

[Dejounte]

Paul, Vassell, Champagnie, Sochan, Wemby

Bench: Wesley, Castle, Keldon, Barnes, Mamu

[DAF86]

I don't think Pop benches Sochan. If anything, Barnes seems like a more likely candidate to go to the bench, if he keeps looking like a stiff. That would fix some positinal issues with the rotation, since it seems like the bench doesn't have a 4 if Mamu is left out from the rotation.

CP3, Vassell, Champagnie, Sochan, Wemby
Jones, Castle, Keldon, Barnes, Collins

Seems like the most balanced rotation, but I agree that the lineup is probably CP3, Vassel (Champ untill healthy), Sochan, Barnes and Wemby. Probably leaving Keldon as the PF off the bench. Ugh.

[DAF86]

Paul, Vassell, Champagnie, Sochan, Wemby

Bench: Wesley, Castle, Keldon, Barnes, Mamu

What do you do with Jones?

[Dejounte]

What do you do with Jones?

He’s probably injected into small ball lineups with Paul from time to time, and he probably alternates with Wesley depending on who is doing good. By mid-season, I predict he’s part of a trade package.

[John B]

Paul, Vassell, Castle, Sochan, Wemby
Wesley, Champagnie, Keldon, Barnes, Collins

I like Champ great shooting and he really deserves to start. But Vassell, Castle and Sochan have higher ceiling and need to be established as the future, especially Castle. CP3 won’t be there long, so try to learn as much playing alongside him.

[RC_Drunkford]

Paul, Vassell, Champagnie, Sochan, Wemby

Jones, Castle, Keldon, Barnes, Mamu

Knowing Pop's dumbass, it will probably be:

Paul, Vassell, Sochan, Barnes, Wemby

Jones, Castle, Champagnie, Keldon, Collins

with Champagnie starting the season for Vassell and Branham replacing his bench minutes. I'd love to start Castle at SF, but you can only do that if his 3-point shooting is consistent enough.

[DAF86]

He’s probably injected into small ball lineups with Paul from time to time, and he probably alternates with Wesley depending on who is doing good. By mid-season, I predict he’s part of a trade package.

Wait, you are projecting that to be Pop's rotation? I thought you were just giving your preferred one. No way Pop leaves Jones out of the rotation.

[Pauleta14]

What's your preferred S5 going into the season. Assuming Devin will be back shortly, I'll include him in mine. I think with him coming back sooner rather than later three spots in the starting five will be the same for most of us.

Here are my five starters.
Paul, Champagnie, Vassell, Barnes, Wemby

Julien is actually the reason for this thread. If he is able to continue shooting like he has in preseason his floor spreading would open up so much mor space for Wemby than it would be with Sochan starting.

I expect Pop to go with Paul, Vassell, Barnes, Sochan and Wemby, but I really wouldn't mind JC starting.

What do you guys think? Champ or Sochan? Or would you even throw Castle into the fire right away?

I'm with you on Champ, by default at least.

I'd like Sochan to be challenged for once in his NBA career to see if there's a real future with him. I like what I saw globally from the last cple games but imo he needs to feel the competition and we need to see what he's got in him before extending him.

We're going to lose some individual defense but Wemby and team defense should compensate for a while (Barnes won't last long physically at his age)

[Pauleta14]

Wait, you are projecting that to be Pop's rotation? I thought you were just giving your preferred one. No way Pop leaves Jones out of the rotation.

I could see Tre (or his agent) even asking for a trade tbh.

He's in the last year of is deal and Spurs drafted a promising lottery pick at his position.

On his side, he won't be able to showcase for a (good) new deal with little PT and on the Spurs's side he's not a difference maker enough despite all the poitive he brings and Castle needs and deserves playing time.

It'd make sense to trade him for both sides.

[KingKev]

I still think CP3/Vassell/Barnes/Sochan/Wemby but Champ’s shooting has made things interesting. Great to see Champ, Castle and Wesley surprising to the upside. Lots of competition for rotation minutes across the board.

[KingKev]

I could see Tre (or his agent) even asking for a trade tbh.

He's in the last year of is deal and Spurs drafted a promising lottery pick at his position.

On his side, he won't be able to showcase for a (good) new deal with little PT and on the Spurs's side he's not a difference maker enough despite all the poitive he brings and Castle needs and deserves playing time.

It'd make sense to trade him for both sides.

Tre and his agent aren’t calling any shots. His brother just got a vet min deal late in free agency. Tyus may have taken some money off the table for that starting role in PHX but Tre isn’t seeing much more if at all. I like Tre Jones as a backup but his negotiation time will come after the season. He has no trade value so there is no reason to work a destination ahead of free agency. He might be a needed backup depending on CP3s fit and Castle/Wesley development.

[dbestpro]

Mamu is going to push Collins out of the rotation.

[LeBowen]

Devin will miss at least 5 games and those will probably decide who gets benched.
If Champagnie can keep shooting like this, he simply can't be benched.

Jeremy still offers very little on offense, way better Spurs than him got benched and played through it.
If he can't take it, too bad, there are plenty of other teams in the league.
Barnes is a consistent veteran and Pop surely won't bench him out of respect unless he really underperforms.

My bigger concern is that Castle won't get enough minutes with logjam at guard positions.

CP3/Tre/Wesley
Devin/Castle/Branham
Jeremy/Keldon/Champagnie
Barnes/Mamu
Wemby/Collins

That's 13 players who will expect to get minutes. 11 for 4 positions if we assume we won't play small and one of Wemby and Collins is always on the floor.
Branham hasn't shown any improvement and is at the bottom of that list, but two more will have to get DNPs every night if starters are healthy.
When Devin returns one of Tre/Wesley probably gets dropped and then one of Champagnie/Mamu...but both have been great so it's a tough decision.

We'll have to wait and see how they perform in real games, but suddenly we have too many potentially useful rotation players, but we're still top heavy and don't have enough high end starters.

My preferred rotation when everyone's healthy would be something like:
CP3/Castle
Devin/Champagnie
Jeremy/Keldon
Barnes/Mamu
Wemby/Bassey

Harsh on Tre after the season he's had, but he's a low ceiling player on an expiring contract.
Jeremy as a starter just because I don't want him playing together with Castle, spacing would be bad.


Mamu is going to push Collins out of the rotation.

I don't think playing C would be good for Mamu. Unless opposition also doesn't have an actual big in the lineup.
He's been great offensively, but he's too slow footed and doesn't have any verticality to protect the rim. He'd be a net negative at C if he's not running the other big off the floor with his shooting.
And I don't think his shooting is there just yet.
I think we need to keep using him as a big wing, he could become a decent bench player for us.

[Chomag]

Yep, when Vassel comes back the other for players is going to be a bit tricky. As for trading off Jones thas another tricky one since we don't know if CP3's plans are to stay with the Spurs full season.

[Chomag]

I'm finding it funny how Collins is on no one's list yet yall know full and well thats exactly who Pop's going to play lol

[DAF86]

I could see Tre (or his agent) even asking for a trade tbh.

He's in the last year of is deal and Spurs drafted a promising lottery pick at his position.

On his side, he won't be able to showcase for a (good) new deal with little PT and on the Spurs's side he's not a difference maker enough despite all the poitive he brings and Castle needs and deserves playing time.

It'd make sense to trade him for both sides.

I could see a trade, but I doubt you can get a 1st out of Jones, and I don't see the value in getting a 2nd out of a solid backup PG like Jones. Which means a trade would only make sense if we get a player back. Swaping Jones for a player of his caliber but at the PF position would be ideal.

[Pauleta14]

I could see a trade, but I doubt you can get a 1st out of Jones, and I don't see the value in getting a 2nd out of a solid backup PG like Jones. Which means a trade would only make sense if we get a player back. Swaping Jones for a player of his caliber but at the PF position would be ideal.

We're never getting a 1st for Tre alone, it'd be a package and a players sawp imo

Again, it's not only the Spurs's side that make sense, PATFO bc of their affection for Tre could facilitate a trade in the interest of the player bc the situation sucks for him contractually with less PT

Add the fact that Wesley could take the spot with intengibles like speed and grit that can't be tought but could get better at play/decision making with time and work...

[Pauleta14]

Tre and his agent aren’t calling any shots. His brother just got a vet min deal late in free agency. Tyus may have taken some money off the table for that starting role in PHX but Tre isn’t seeing much more if at all. I like Tre Jones as a backup but his negotiation time will come after the season. He has no trade value so there is no reason to work a destination ahead of free agency. He might be a needed backup depending on CP3s fit and Castle/Wesley development.

- I'm not implying Tre's agent has any power nor would pressure PATFO but that it'd be done in the interest of both parties, not only the Spurs's bc of the relationship they have. Just a guess/feeling.

- His brother's example is the perfect reason why he'd want to leave to be able to showcase his skills with more PT, otherwise his stats will dramatically drop if he stays with the Spurs

- I think he has a real value at a position tough to fill as a back up. He doesn't move the needle much but he's not a negative and is reliable in many areas, takes care of the ball, is a pest on D and is a leader by attitude at least. many teams could need his profile.

- For all that to happen we'd still need to find the right player(s) to trade for and a team willing to do so. I'm just talking theorically, it'd make a lot of sense for BOTH parties.

[poopbox]

Paul, Devin, Barnes, Sochan, Wemby.

Would be shocked if Barnes comes off the bench to start the season.

The real problem I will have is Pop playing Collins way to much, and playing Mamu and Castle not nearly enough. Both of these guys should be getting a guaranteed at least 15 min a night but we both know that won't happen for maybe half the season.

[TekXX]

Not OP getting fooled again by preseason Julien?

[exstatic]

Not OP getting fooled again by preseason Julien?

Julian’s career mark is 37%, above league average. I’m not sure how him shooting well in the preseason is fooling us. He usually shoots pretty well.

[cutewizard]

Wemby at center
Barnes and Sochan at forwards
Paul and Vassell at guards

[heyheymymy]

Starting 5: CP3, Vassell, Barnes, Sochan, Wemby

Subs rotation once the game settles in:

CP3/Jones (Wesley)
Vassell/Champagnie (Branham)
Castle/Johnson
Sochan/Barnes (Mamu)
Wemby/Zollins

Pretty much everyone can mix and match as well as slide up and or down at least one position in certain matchups for flexibility and strategy. Swap Branham for Bassey if he ever gets healthy. Hope Minix earns the spot otherwise.

Cissoko will dress out some games for DNPs. Branham and Zollins on the trading block leaves two rosters slots potentially flexible. Castle plays point wing until one or both Paul/Jones are gone on trade/contract end and in select PG & SG mins before then as well when appropriate.

[Mr. Body]

I can't imagine Barnes won't start. He may very well be on the downslope of his career, but his value as scaffolding and structure for the young players is invaluable. I expect him to knock the rust off as much as anyone.

Paul
Vassell
Sochan
Barnes
Wembanyama

That seems pretty clear to me.

[mo7888]

Paul, Vassell, Champagnie, Sochan, Wemby

[Spurs Homer]

Paul
Castle
Sochan
Barnes
Wemby

Defense first.

[Joseph Kony]

Paul, Vassell, Sochan, Barnes, and Vic

Champagnie will start in Vassell's place until he returns from injury

[KDKSpurs24]

Paul, Vassell, Champaignie, Sochan, Wemby

[spurraider21]

Barnes is giving some Carroll vibes. At least he can shoot.

hope it’s just rust or taking it easy in the preseason

[Barfunk]

I'm finding it funny how Collins is on no one's list yet yall know full and well thats exactly who Pop's going to play lol

:lol

[baseline bum]

Branham, Ingram, Malaki, Wemby, Collins

[Chinook]

I don't think reasonable minds can disagree about Jones being in the rotation, especially if Castle is going to get most of his minutes on the wing. Assuming Paul holds up, Tre is the second-best PG on the team.

I don't see Barnes as a defensive sub. I don't believe he's better on that end than Castle or even Wesley. Insofar as Harrison adds defensive utility, it's in his ability to guard up, not down. With Wmeby on the court, I don't like the match-up against most teams.

I want

Paul
Wesley (Vassell)
Castle
Sochan
Wembanyama

Give Blake his audition time and just plan on Castle being the starter from wire to wire

[LeBowen]

I don't think reasonable minds can disagree about Jones being in the rotation, especially if Castle is going to get most of his minutes on the wing. Assuming Paul holds up, Tre is the second-best PG on the team.

I don't see Barnes as a defensive sub. I don't believe he's better on that end than Castle or even Wesley. Insofar as Harrison adds defensive utility, it's in his ability to guard up, not down. With Wmeby on the court, I don't like the match-up against most teams.

I want

Paul
Wesley (Vassell)
Castle
Sochan
Wembanyama

Give Blake his audition time and just plan on Castle being the starter from wire to wire

That would be a lineup with the worst spacing since 3pt line was introduced.

[Allan Rowe vs Wade]

Paul Tre Wesley Castle Wemby

Run and Oop lineup

[Chinook]

That would be a lineup with the worst spacing since 3pt line was introduced.

The Spurs ran lineups with Duncan at SF.

None of Wesley, Castle or Sochan can make it as a non-shooter. This isn't 2010 when you can have designated spacers to counteract guys who can't get it done. Those guys are going to have to knock down shots and remove the temptation to sign guys like McDermott or Forbes. I think they can.

Yes, long-term, if they can't do that, they need to be swapped out for guys who don't impede Wemby and Vassell. But I don't consider the possibility that the Spurs are an elite defense but struggling offense that horrible a prognosis for next season. It'd be a welcome change of pace.

[LeBowen]

Duncan at SF was 25 years ago.
Even if they can improve and become good shooters, playing even two of them together is a detrimet to the team.
Playing all three would just result in everyone being dared to shoot and Wemby having no space.

If Pop uses functional lineups (big if), we should be fine this season.
Collins is my biggest concern because it's just too difficult to defend without rim protection.

[spurraider21]

I kinda think you need to lean into Barnes and not throw in the towel based on a lackadaisical preseason. Think it’s clear the team likes Champagnie at the 2 which i love since it means Branham isn’t getting de facto minutes. I think castle will find time backing up each of 1-3 but mostly 2-3 at this point. Could see him overtaking Barnes if his strong play continues.

but i think you open with

Paul/Tre
Vassell/Champagnie
Barnes/Johnson
Sochan/Mamu
Vic/Collins

Castle finds work all over the place even if he’s not a “primary” backup at any particular spot at least right away.

[timtonymanu]

Healthy:

Paul Vassell Castle Sochan Wemby
Jones Keldon Champ Barnes Mamu
Wesley Collins

What Pop will do if everyone's healthy:

Paul Vassell Champ Sochan Wemby
Jones Castle Keldon Barnes Collins
Wesley Branham Mamu


What it's gonna be with Vassell out:

Paul Champ Barnes Sochan Wemby
Jones Wesley Castle KJ Collins
Malaki Mamu Cissoko

[Pauleta14]

Ideally...

1st part of the season :

Paul - Castle - Tre/Wes
Vassell - Wes
Champ - KJ - Sidy
Barnes - Sochan - Mamu
Wemby - Collins

2nd part of the season :

Castle - Paul - Tre
Vassell - Wes
Champ - KJ - Sidy
Sochan - Barnes/Mamu
Wemby - Not Collins

[exstatic]

Ideally...

1st part of the season :

Paul - Castle - Tre/Wes
Vassell - Wes
Champ - KJ - Sidy
Barnes - Sochan - Mamu
Wemby - Collins

2nd part of the season :

Castle - Paul - Tre
Vassell - Wes
Champ - KJ - Sidy
Sochan - Barnes/Mamu
Wemby - Not Collins

They’re never going to bench Paul if he’s on the roster and healthy.

[Pauleta14]

They’re never going to bench Paul if he’s on the roster and healthy.

Ideally...

I'm counting on Castle being as precocious as he's looked and becomes essential + Natural drop off from a 40(!!)yo Cp3 that would either lead to Spurs letting him go or him accepting the obvious and doing wht's best for the team.

I know a lot of you are cool with Castle playing diff positions, I just think he needs to play PG as much as possible as soon as possible. Nothing replaces PT experience at that age.

For everythig he brings offensively, Paul will end up being too much of a liability on D

[RC_Drunkford]

Y‘all in for a surprise if you think Barnes is rusty. He couldn‘t guard anybody last season.

[LeBowen]

Y‘all in for a surprise if you think Barnes is rusty. He couldn‘t guard anybody last season.

Playing with Wemby is way different from playing with Sabonis.
Everyone except elite defenders looks way worse without a rim protector behind them.

[exstatic]

Ideally...

I'm counting on Castle being as precocious as he's looked and becomes essential + Natural drop off from a 40(!!)yo Cp3 that would either lead to Spurs letting him go or him accepting the obvious and doing wht's best for the team.

I know a lot of you are cool with Castle playing diff positions, I just think he needs to play PG as much as possible as soon as possible. Nothing replaces PT experience at that age.

For everythig he brings offensively, Paul will end up being too much of a liability on D

I’m okay with Castle moving around a bit to get minutes this year, and eventually believe he will be the starting PG, but it won’t be with Paul on the roster. I’m guessing that for him to sign, there was a starting agreement for CP.

[CGD]

They’re never going to bench Paul if he’s on the roster and healthy.

True, but I also think there is a strong chance he won’t be on the roster after the buyout deadline.

My hope is Castle can show enough to win the job by the end of the season.

[CGD]

Y‘all in for a surprise if you think Barnes is rusty. He couldn‘t guard anybody last season.

I agree. I think this acquisition has been overrated some. He looked pretty meh in SAC last year, and has generally been one of those frustrating players throughout his career who people expected more from (think Sean Elliott).

However his biggest contribution will come off the court, which I think will be huge.

[LeBowen]

has generally been one of those frustrating players throughout his career who people expected more from

That's because expectations were too high.
He was supposed to be the 2A/2B with Klay on the Warriors.
Then Mavs got him as someone who could take over from Dirk.
Then he finally settled as a role player with the Kings.

The most important thing for us will be his veteran presence and consistency.
If he can constantly make the right passes and not get lost on defense, it will add value for the team because both our best wings, Jeremy and Keldon, are unpredictable and you never know what you're getting with them.

[exstatic]

I agree. I think this acquisition has been overrated some. He looked pretty meh in SAC last year, and has generally been one of those frustrating players throughout his career who people expected more from (think Sean Elliott).

However his biggest contribution will come off the court, which I think will be huge.

He also CAN shoot and space the floor.

[exstatic]

True, but I also think there is a strong chance he won’t be on the roster after the buyout deadline.

My hope is Castle can show enough to win the job by the end of the season.

I agree that might happen, but he was showing a depth chart with CP coming off the bench, which is what that discussion was about. Don’t see that happening.

[SpurSpike]

Paul, Castle, Vassell, Keldon, Wemby would be interesting.

[paperboy77]

All i know is Devin better get back quick because Champenie ain't it. That dude will be a ghost once the regular season starts.

[spurraider21]

All i know is Devin better get back quick because Champenie ain't it. That dude will be a ghost once the regular season starts.
he's had exactly 1 season as a full time nba player and looks like he's improving

[Gorepopovich]

Paul, Vassell, Castle, Mamu, Wemby. :music

[MultiTroll]

Castle
Vassell
Champagne
Mamu
Wama

[Mugen]

With a healthy Devin:

SL: CP0/Vassell/Champ/Sochan/Wemby
Bench: Tre/Castle/Keldon/Barnes/Mamu with Wesley getting those "energizer" minutes as needed

Obviously Mamu at C is probably not gonna happen as he's terrible there but so is Zollins tbh and Mamu has been better at everything else for almost a year now.

[spurraider21]

am i the only one that sees Mamu as the reserve 4? last year it was a hodgepodge of undersized guys like Osman, Keldon, or the attempts to try Barlow at PF which didnt work. Mamu very much doesnt work as a 5. really seems like a natural way to get him minutes while giving him opportunities to play alongside Vic, and those guys play with good chemistry

should be the primary reserve for Sochan

[LeBowen]

am i the only one that sees Mamu as the reserve 4? last year it was a hodgepodge of undersized guys like Osman, Keldon, or the attempts to try Barlow at PF which didnt work. Mamu very much doesnt work as a 5. really seems like a natural way to get him minutes while giving him opportunities to play alongside Vic, and those guys play with good chemistry

Spot on.
To me he looks like a textbook connective big forward. Does a bit of everything with high IQ.


should be the primary reserve for Sochan

I'd argue that he'll be a reserve for Barnes, similar roles on both ends.

It's actually going to be interesting to see how rotations develop this season because in those final games of the season, Mamu looked way more complementary to Wemby than Jeremy ever did.

The issue is that both him and Keldon are bad defensively, having them play next to Collins is never going to end well on that end.

[paperboy77]

he's had exactly 1 season as a full time nba player and looks like he's improving

As a Spurs fan I will be very glad if he pans out. For me an my eyeballs, he is not very good at all. If you're gonna be a shooter and a starter you MUST give something else like above average defense. This dude is very slow footed and obviously not focused on that department. Osman or Douggie would have given yuu way more than this guy.

[dn0774]

It's actually going to be interesting to see how rotations develop this season because in those final games of the season, Mamu looked way more complementary to Wemby than Jeremy ever did.


Basically this, Mamu seemed to have nice chemistry with Wemby the last couple weeks of last season on the offensive end. Mamu's presence on the defensive end is a problem to say the least; if he is in as the lone big or with any big not named Victor it becomes a layup line for the opposing team.

[Splits]

Preferred: CP0, Jones, Castle, Vassell, VW

100% guaranteed Pop: CP0, Vassell, Barnes, Sochan, VW. I'd bet $1k that isn't the starting lineup once Vassell is healthy.

[KingKev]

Preferred: CP0, Jones, Castle, Vassell, VW

100% guaranteed Pop: CP0, Vassell, Barnes, Sochan, VW. I'd bet $1k that isn't the starting lineup once Vassell is healthy.

You need a bookie?

[spurraider21]

Preferred: CP0, Jones, Castle, Vassell, VW

100% guaranteed Pop: CP0, Vassell, Barnes, Sochan, VW. I'd bet $1k that isn't the starting lineup once Vassell is healthy.
based

[Splits]

You need a bookie?

Ummm, I set the lines and rake the pot. But lemme know if you need a line of credit

[Splits]

You need a bookie?

I'll give you a free longshot

https://i.ibb.co/Wk8Rs0L/image.png

[scott]

If I were coach:



PG
Min
SG
Min
SF
Min
PF
Min
C
Min


CP3
28
Vassell
30
Champ
18
Barnes
20
Wemb
32


Jones
14
Castle
16
Johnson
24
Sochan
24
Bassey
16


Castle
6
Champ
2
Barnes
6
Mamu
4
Collins
0


TOT
48

48

48

48

48





Player
Minutes


Wemby
32


Vassell
30


CP3
28


Barnes
26


Johnson
24


Sochan
24


Castle
22


Champ
20


Bassey
16


Mamu
4


Collins
0



I didn't list every player I'd give zero to, but wanted to especially make it clear that Collins would get ZERO.

[exstatic]

Preferred: CP0, Jones, Castle, Vassell, VW

100% guaranteed Pop: CP0, Vassell, Barnes, Sochan, VW. I'd bet $1k that isn't the starting lineup once Vassell is healthy.

Only one shooter in Vassell, so terrible spacing. Back court would get exploited on D. You wouldn’t even need big guards to do it.

[Splits]

Only one shooter in Vassell, so terrible spacing. Back court would get exploited on D. You wouldn’t even need big guards to do it.

Also remember, nobody on this team is a proven shooter. So there's that.

[baseline bum]

I agree. I think this acquisition has been overrated some. He looked pretty meh in SAC last year, and has generally been one of those frustrating players throughout his career who people expected more from (think Sean Elliott).

However his biggest contribution will come off the court, which I think will be huge.

On no planet would I ever compare Harrison Barnes to Sean Elliott. Sean's a two time all star who was a high end defender until his transplant and hit one of the most important shots in franchise history that broke the Blazers and basically clinched a title. Sean's not just some feelgood story making it back after kidney failure, he's a franchise legend and the only better SF the team has ever had was Kawhi.

[baseline bum]

If I were coach:



PG
Min
SG
Min
SF
Min
PF
Min
C
Min


CP3
28
Vassell
30
Champ
18
Barnes
20
Wemb
32


Jones
14
Castle
16
Johnson
24
Sochan
24
Bassey
16


Castle
6
Champ
2
Barnes
6
Mamu
4
Collins
0


TOT
48

48

48

48

48





Player
Minutes


Wemby
32


Vassell
30


CP3
28


Barnes
26


Johnson
24


Sochan
24


Castle
22


Champ
20


Bassey
16


Mamu
4


Collins
0



I didn't list every player I'd give zero to, but wanted to especially make it clear that Collins would get ZERO.

I'd probably give Castle the SF minutes you have assigned to Barnes, especially since Vassell will probably be playing more like 33 minutes a night. Love seeing the goose egg for Bran Ham. On paper it looks like the Spurs should trade Tre but he probably doesn't land you anyone good enough to be much of an upgrade over Sochan and Barnes at the PF nor Keldon at the three. Before CP3 came it was pretty obvious to have Tre play say 28 mpg at PG, Castle 12 mpg at PG and maybe 14 more at SG/SF, then Wesley 8mpg to see if he can become somebody. Really wish they'd just salary dump Branham since he doesn't deserve any minutes that should be going to Castle at the SG.

[exstatic]

Also remember, nobody on this team is a proven shooter. So there's that.

Champ is 37% career. Keldon is 36% career. That lineup also severely lacks rebounding, and one of Vassell/Castle will have to defend a PF.

[scott]

I'd probably give Castle the SF minutes you have assigned to Barnes, especially since Vassell will probably be playing more like 33 minutes a night. Love seeing the goose egg for Bran Ham. On paper it looks like the Spurs should trade Tre but he probably doesn't land you anyone good enough to be much of an upgrade over Sochan and Barnes at the PF nor Keldon at the three. Before CP3 came it was pretty obvious to have Tre play say 28 mpg at PG, Castle 12 mpg at PG and maybe 14 more at SG/SF, then Wesley 8mpg to see if he can become somebody. Really wish they'd just salary dump Branham since he doesn't deserve any minutes that should be going to Castle at the SG.

On paper it seems like we have one guy too many, but I think my basic skeleton of a rotation allows you to adjust based on the hot hand. I do think Castle should progress closer to 26-28 mpg as the season moves on, and his minutes should be prioritized over pretty much everyone else in the lineup aside from Wemby and Devin. CP3 and Barnes are what they are, and it's not like any of these other guys are good enough to worry about prioritizing. They're just here until something better comes along.

I did not dignify Branham with a courtesy zero. He should be a camp casualty tbh.

[Chinook]

am i the only one that sees Mamu as the reserve 4? last year it was a hodgepodge of undersized guys like Osman, Keldon, or the attempts to try Barlow at PF which didnt work. Mamu very much doesnt work as a 5. really seems like a natural way to get him minutes while giving him opportunities to play alongside Vic, and those guys play with good chemistry

should be the primary reserve for Sochan

Johnson is the backup PF if this pre-season means anything. Jones and two of Castle/Branham/Wesley seem to be a lock. Maybe they're playing those guys because they don't have a backup center and feel pressed to play Mamu there. However, I feel like backup five would be easier for him to get than PF. If Pop does the right thing and benches Barnes for Castle, then Harrison is the backup PF.

[CGD]

On no planet would I ever compare Harrison Barnes to Sean Elliott. Sean's a two time all star who was a high end defender until his transplant and hit one of the most important shots in franchise history that broke the Blazers and basically clinched a title. Sean's not just some feelgood story making it back after kidney failure, he's a franchise legend and the only better SF the team has ever had was Kawhi.

I love Sean, but I think you’re overweighting the Memorial Day Miracle too much. He was also traded and viewed as being too passive before then, though in fairness he was often injured.

Harrison is also an NBA champ with a solid collegiate record. Also has Olympic gold etc

[baseline bum]

I love Sean, but I think you’re overweighting the Memorial Day Miracle too much. He was also traded and viewed as being too passive before then, though in fairness he was often injured.

Harrison is also an NBA champ with a solid collegiate record. Also has Olympic gold etc

Strange you would bring up college careers when trying to minimize Sean Elliott while hyping Barnes considering Barnes was just a good college player while Elliott was a Wooden Award winner.

[RC_Drunkford]

Playing with Wemby is way different from playing with Sabonis.
Everyone except elite defenders looks way worse without a rim protector behind them.

If he plays with Zach Collins That’s like playing with a poor man‘s Sabonis

[8FOR!3]

I'm finding it funny how Collins is on no one's list yet yall know full and well thats exactly who Pop's going to play lol

Yeah lol he's 100% the backup center.

Most likely right now

CP3/Vassell/Barnes/Sochan/Wemby
Tre/Branham/Champagnie/Keldon/Collins
Wesley/Castle/Sidy/Mamu/Bassey

It might make a little more sense to swap Barnes/Champagnie bc Barnes looks like a 4 at this point he doesn't move like a 3 and Keldon is more of a natural fit at the 3 off the bench.

Realistically the only other changes I see room for is if Wesley/Castle get minutes over Branham which obviously could happen bc I think they're both better. Could even cut into Tre's minutes if they're good enough. Really doubt Mamu gets minutes over Barnes/Sochan/Keldon and I doubt Bassey takes Collins' spot.

[CGD]

Strange you would bring up college careers when trying to minimize Sean Elliott while hyping Barnes considering Barnes was just a good college player while Elliott was a Wooden Award winner.

A significant accomplishment no doubt, but in fairness what is the Wooden Award in the 1 and done era? Most recent male winners include Edy, Oscar Tshiebwe, and Luka Garza.

[baseline bum]

A significant accomplishment no doubt, but in fairness what is the Wooden Award in the 1 and done era? Most recent male winners include Edy, Oscar Tshiebwe, and Luka Garza.

And Zion Williamson, Jalen Brunson, Anthony Davis, Blake Griffin, and Kevin Durant.

[SpurSpike]

If anything this thread shows that we have many good potential combinations this year. Can't wait for the season to start!

[heyheymymy]

If I were coach:



PG
Min
SG
Min
SF
Min
PF
Min
C
Min


CP3
28
Vassell
30
Champ
18
Barnes
20
Wemb
32


Jones
14
Castle
16
Johnson
24
Sochan
24
Bassey
16


Castle
6
Champ
2
Barnes
6
Mamu
4
Collins
0


TOT
48

48

48

48

48





Player
Minutes


Wemby
32


Vassell
30


CP3
28


Barnes
26


Johnson
24


Sochan
24


Castle
22


Champ
20


Bassey
16


Mamu
4


Collins
0



I didn't list every player I'd give zero to, but wanted to especially make it clear that Collins would get ZERO.

Wow, these tables are the best way to visualize it. Nice work.

[KingKev]

Ummm, I set the lines and rake the pot. But lemme know if you need a line of credit

re-read your original post.

[rankingtear]

Should just start Branham and Champ , then push Branham out when Devin comes back to have some continuity on the roster.

[DAF86]

Until Vassell comes back:

CP3, Champ, Sochan, Barnes, Wemby
Jones, Castle, Keldon, Mamu, Collins

When Vassell comes back, just analyze how Champ, Mamu and Collins are doing and just erase from the rotation the guy that's doing worse. If Champ does better than Barnes, I would keep Champ in the SL and move Harrison to the bench.

CP3, Vassell, Champ, Socham, Wemby
Jones, Castle, Keldon, Barnes, Mamu/Collins

[cutewizard]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WbXGO1f9-5w

[cutewizard]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M0o7on4Bmys

[CGD]

And Zion Williamson, Jalen Brunson, Anthony Davis, Blake Griffin, and Kevin Durant.

You forgot these legends: Edy, Tshiebwe, Garza, Toppin, Mason III, Heild, Kaminsky, McDermott, Burke, Jimmer, Turner, Crazy ass Hansburough.

[CGD]

Until Vassell comes back:

CP3, Champ, Sochan, Barnes, Wemby
Jones, Castle, Keldon, Mamu, Collins

When Vassell comes back, just analyze how Champ, Mamu and Collins are doing and just erase from the rotation the guy that's doing worse. If Champ does better than Barnes, I would keep Champ in the SL and move Harrison to the bench.

CP3, Vassell, Champ, Socham, Wemby
Jones, Castle, Keldon, Barnes, Mamu/Collins

It’ll be interesting to see what happens to Castle when Vassell returns. Minutes will need to come from somewhere— I suspect that as the season goes on we’ll see Barnes and even Tre have less minutes, and while the assumption might be to cut Champagne’s time, he’s one of the few shooters the team has. Tricky

[scott]

Two games into the season, backup SG is the glaring weakness on this team. Branham isn't necessarily the wrong archetype, he just isn't very good.

Optimal rotation would look something like:

CP3/Castle
Vassell/Branham
Champ/Johnson
Sochan/Barnes
Wemby/Bassey

With Castle displacing CP3 as the starter somewhere around the ASB.

I wonder what it would cost to acquire Cam Thomas who is in the last year of his rookie deal but will be an RFA. I still view him as an ideal backup SG. Self-creating microwave scorer. Not worth giving up any real assets since we aren't trying to compete... but someone like him (or Malik Monk) would fit in so nicely right there.

[exstatic]

Two games into the season, backup SG is the glaring weakness on this team. Branham isn't necessarily the wrong archetype, he just isn't very good.

Optimal rotation would look something like:

CP3/Castle
Vassell/Branham
Champ/Johnson
Sochan/Barnes
Wemby/Bassey

With Castle displacing CP3 as the starter somewhere around the ASB.

I wonder what it would cost to acquire Cam Thomas who is in the last year of his rookie deal but will be an RFA. I still view him as an ideal backup SG. Self-creating microwave scorer. Not worth giving up any real assets since we aren't trying to compete... but someone like him (or Malik Monk) would fit in so nicely right there.

His career 3 % (35.0) is lower than Champenie’s. If you’re wanting spacing, Champ and Vassell are both better options.

[spurraider21]

Two games into the season, backup SG is the glaring weakness on this team. Branham isn't necessarily the wrong archetype, he just isn't very good.

Optimal rotation would look something like:

CP3/Castle
Vassell/Branham
Champ/Johnson
Sochan/Barnes
Wemby/Bassey

With Castle displacing CP3 as the starter somewhere around the ASB.

I wonder what it would cost to acquire Cam Thomas who is in the last year of his rookie deal but will be an RFA. I still view him as an ideal backup SG. Self-creating microwave scorer. Not worth giving up any real assets since we aren't trying to compete... but someone like him (or Malik Monk) would fit in so nicely right there.
I mean… Champagnie has been starting in Vassell’s place and looks fine. So he’d be a pretty solid backup SG, no?

also, hell no to Cam Thomas. I’d have loved Monk though

[RC_Drunkford]

Two games into the season, backup SG is the glaring weakness on this team. Branham isn't necessarily the wrong archetype, he just isn't very good.

Optimal rotation would look something like:

CP3/Castle
Vassell/Branham
Champ/Johnson
Sochan/Barnes
Wemby/Bassey

With Castle displacing CP3 as the starter somewhere around the ASB.

I wonder what it would cost to acquire Cam Thomas who is in the last year of his rookie deal but will be an RFA. I still view him as an ideal backup SG. Self-creating microwave scorer. Not worth giving up any real assets since we aren't trying to compete... but someone like him (or Malik Monk) would fit in so nicely right there.

just play Mamu instead of him and slide everybody down tbh. No need for a trade for a bench SG.

[cutewizard]

Vassell

We are waiting..,.........

[CGD]

Two games into the season, backup SG is the glaring weakness on this team. Branham isn't necessarily the wrong archetype, he just isn't very good.

Optimal rotation would look something like:

CP3/Castle
Vassell/Branham
Champ/Johnson
Sochan/Barnes
Wemby/Bassey

With Castle displacing CP3 as the starter somewhere around the ASB.

I wonder what it would cost to acquire Cam Thomas who is in the last year of his rookie deal but will be an RFA. I still view him as an ideal backup SG. Self-creating microwave scorer. Not worth giving up any real assets since we aren't trying to compete... but someone like him (or Malik Monk) would fit in so nicely right there.

Those line up are spot on to me, and agree on CP3/Castle swapping later this year. Makes clear the priority in the 2025 draft: upgrading the Champagne position and more shooting off the bench.

I thought Zach looked good yesterday, so I still have him above Bassey for the moment.

[LeBowen]

just play Mamu instead of him and slide everybody down tbh. No need for a trade for a bench SG.

Barnes won't get benched this season and I don't see why woulld he if he keeps his current level.

CP3/Castle
Vassell/Champ
Jeremy/Keldon
Sochan/Mamu
Wemby/Bassey

That would be my rotation.
And I'd look for upgrades with Tre, Zach and even Keldon being available.
Either get another reliable shooter or a legit backup big.

[Ni-G]

Barnes won't get benched this season and I don't see why woulld he if he keeps his current level.

CP3/Castle
Vassell/Champ
Jeremy/Keldon
Sochan/Mamu
Wemby/Bassey

That would be my rotation.
And I'd look for upgrades with Tre, Zach and even Keldon being available.
Either get another reliable shooter or a legit backup big.

You'd need more then one Jeremy Sochan for that rotation. :tongue
Also Collins played in first 2 games better then expected (not that we've expected much out of him) he can pass, he is agressive and as long and he's not bricking multiple 3s he seems to be a better back up C then Bassey so far.

[scott]

I mean… Champagnie has been starting in Vassell’s place and looks fine. So he’d be a pretty solid backup SG, no?

also, hell no to Cam Thomas. I’d have loved Monk though

I like where Champ has progressed to a lot - and I think he fits really well at SF, but I don't love his fit as backup SG when that unit really needs self-creation, which isn't really Champ's strong suit.

[scott]

His career 3 % (35.0) is lower than Champenie’s. If you’re wanting spacing, Champ and Vassell are both better options.

It's almost like self-creation and spacing aren't the same thing.

[Mr. Body]

A bench bucket-getter is a clear need. Champagnie going to the bench doesn't solve the problem - he's not a shot getter. Castle may eventually become one, but iso isn't a huge strong suit right now and I think he'll be starting by next year.

Optimally, Malaki gets to that point. He can get his shots, but may not have the mentality to brutalize teams when needed. I still think they're building him.

Problem is those bucket-getters are usually expensive, want to start, and are terrible at defense.

[LeBowen]

A bench bucket-getter is a clear need. Champagnie going to the bench doesn't solve the problem - he's not a shot getter. Castle may eventually become one, but iso isn't a huge strong suit right now and I think he'll be starting by next year.

Optimally, Malaki gets to that point. He can get his shots, but may not have the mentality to brutalize teams when needed. I still think they're building him.

Problem is those bucket-getters are usually expensive, want to start, and are terrible at defense.

As I said before, Devin should play with the bench unit at the end of first and start of second quarter.
Middleton does it.
KD did it a lot in his career.
Kyrie does it for the Mavs.

He'll have less time on the ball with the starters, but he can easily shred most benches while starting and closing out both halves.

[Mr. Body]

As I said before, Devin should play with the bench unit at the end of first and start of second quarter.
Middleton does it.
KD did it a lot in his career.
Kyrie does it for the Mavs.

He'll have less time on the ball with the starters, but he can easily shred most benches while starting and closing out both halves.

I can see that eventually. I wouldn't want to count on his health too much and having another option would be good to have.

[DAF86]

As I said before, Devin should play with the bench unit at the end of first and start of second quarter.
Middleton does it.
KD did it a lot in his career.
Kyrie does it for the Mavs.

He'll have less time on the ball with the starters, but he can easily shred most benches while starting and closing out both halves.

Not gonna happen 'cause Pop already does that with Wemby.

[scott]

As I said before, Devin should play with the bench unit at the end of first and start of second quarter.
Middleton does it.
KD did it a lot in his career.
Kyrie does it for the Mavs.

He'll have less time on the ball with the starters, but he can easily shred most benches while starting and closing out both halves.

I agree with the idea of a rotation like this, but I still don't think it quite solves the problem. I think a Lonnie/Branham is the right archetype... it's just that Lonnie never got there and Bran isn't close (and doesn't look like he'll get there either).

With our abundance of draft picks, that's an archetype that might be worth taking flyers on with our non-premium picks. Since this archetype is usually a dime a dozen and suck at defense, these aren't guys you want to dish out 2nd contracts to... just keep a fresh pipeline of guys on rookie deals flowing through the roster.

[spurraider21]

I like where Champ has progressed to a lot - and I think he fits really well at SF, but I don't love his fit as backup SG when that unit really needs self-creation, which isn't really Champ's strong suit.
Castle would be the initiator of that unit and you have Keldon who can create buckets too. Theoretically Mamu if Pop realizes he’s allowed to play him at the 4

[scott]

Castle would be the initiator of that unit and you have Keldon who can create buckets too. Theoretically Mamu if Pop realizes he’s allowed to play him at the 4

I'm just not seeing it, but maybe I'm not being creative enough.

A Castle-Champ-Keldon-Mamu-Bassey (I'm not letting go of this... fuck Collins) still lacks that self-creating bucket getter. Maybe Castle can get there... but by the time he does he should be starting. Of course this can be somewhat mitigated by overlapping rotations.

[Mr. Body]

I agree with Scott. Ideally you want a guy who can manufacture points out of nothing. Get him into iso and let him work. Manu used to be able to do this.

[LeBowen]

I agree with Scott. Ideally you want a guy who can manufacture points out of nothing. Get him into iso and let him work. Manu used to be able to do this.

Manu was an all-NBA player who accepted the 6th man role.
Almost everyone who can average 15ppg these days has inflated ego and gets overpaid. Not to mention that a lot of self-creators are low IQ chuckers.
Obviously we'll need someone in due time, but I don't think that player is high on the priority list right now.
When I mentioned Devin as the second unit leader, I referred to this season. Who knows what happens a few years down the line.

[Chinook]

I had a really strong opinion on the starting five, but now I think I'm okay with it as it is now. Barnes has a consecutive-starts streak going, and I think he's playing more than well enough to keep that going. He's not taking up too many minutes after the first stint of the half, so we're good. Sochan is playing well, and while he and Barnes have a similar profile, I think they do such different things that they work okay together. Wemby is Wemby. Paul is Paul. I think the only choice is Champ and Castle. I actually think Castle and Paul make a good duo. They compliment each other well. But I think you can get that by playing them together at other points in the game. Castle could start, but I don't think he NEEDS to start. I like his fit with Collins and Keldon. Zach gives him a more bog-standard big to play off, and Keldon's downhill style fits well with the fast and tough nature of Castle. Champ is playing well, and his size at SG is really unique, especially combined with Barnes and Sochan. If Paul were a stronger offensive force, I think Champ would be even better. That's probably a question for next year though.

[spurraider21]

I had a really strong opinion on the starting five, but now I think I'm okay with it as it is now. Barnes has a consecutive-starts streak going, and I think he's playing more than well enough to keep that going. He's not taking up too many minutes after the first stint of the half, so we're good. Sochan is playing well, and while he and Barnes have a similar profile, I think they do such different things that they work okay together. Wemby is Wemby. Paul is Paul. I think the only choice is Champ and Castle. I actually think Castle and Paul make a good duo. They compliment each other well. But I think you can get that by playing them together at other points in the game. Castle could start, but I don't think he NEEDS to start. I like his fit with Collins and Keldon. Zach gives him a more bog-standard big to play off, and Keldon's downhill style fits well with the fast and tough nature of Castle. Champ is playing well, and his size at SG is really unique, especially combined with Barnes and Sochan. If Paul were a stronger offensive force, I think Champ would be even better. That's probably a question for next year though.
i like barnes starting but this is among the things i really wouldnt consider a factor in that decision. i would imagine pop does though

[Chinook]

i like barnes starting but this is among the things i really wouldnt consider a factor in that decision. i would imagine pop does though

If it mattered more, that would be one thing. But they don't need to start anyone over him, so rather than randomly tinker, let him keep the streak going. It's the longest in the league I think, and he's done nothing to lose it.

[DAF86]

I really hope the little experiment of giving Wesley minutes is done. This team needs to maximize what little shooting they have as much as possible. Wesley needs to GTFO and Mamu needs to be inserted into the rotation. Make Castle the full-time backup untill Tre Jones is back. We have too many brick layers to be handing out minutes to a scrub like Wesley, tbh.