Game Thread: Timberwolves (13-11) at Spurs (13-12) Dec. 15, 2024, 6 PM CT

[John B]

Spurs injuries: Stephon Castle- Questionable (left shoulder contusion), Zach Collins-Doubtful (Bilateral low back contusion), David Duke Jr.- Out (G-League), Harrison Ingram- Out (G-League), Keldon Johnson- Out (left calf strain). Tre Jones- Questionable (left shoulder sprain), Riley Minix- Out (G-League).


Timberwolves injuries: Jaylen Clark- Out (G-League), Jesse Edwards- Out (G-League), Joe Ingles- Out (left soleus strain), Leonard Miller- Out (G-League), Daishen Nix- Out (G-League).


The Spurs starts their 3 games home stand. I like the Spurs chances. GSG! :flag::flag::flag:

[baseline bum]

Hope Steph and Tre can go as no way they can survive Branham at PG against a non-tanking team.

[John B]

Hope Steph and Tre can go as no way they can survive Branham at PG against a non-tanking team.

I’m hoping Castle can get back soon. That ROTY is his for the taking. Tre being out gets him more time in the PG position is the silver lining, but I want him building chemistry with Wemby and the SL more.

[Fireball]

:flag:

[skin27]

:flag:

[Mr. Body]

Amazing that these teams have almost essentially the same record.

[exstatic]

GSG!

[timtonymanu]

Collins - doubtful.

Good.

[Seventyniner]

If the Spurs win they will be ahead of the Wolves in the standings. At the end of last season that would have seemed like an impossibility 1/3 of the way through this season.

[Chomag]

Collins - doubtful.

Good.

:lol

[lefty20]

1868423858115760288

Castle upgraded to available.

[LeBowen]

This is the real test.

[Dverde]

Chris Paul should be well rested.

[lefty20]

That poor kid... imagine having to grow up with Zach Collins as your favorite players.

[TimmyBuckets]

Gonna be a tough one. Hope the boys pull through.

[mudyez]

2 Minutes, 2 Blocks....keep it up Wemby!

[LeBowen]

I bet half of us in this topic are more skilled than Gobert, it's ridiculous how untalented he is.

[heyheymymy]

:flag:

[heyheymymy]

BASS MASTER

[mudyez]

I bet half of us in this topic are more skilled than Gobert, it's ridiculous how untalented he is.

Well...sure...maybe on the offensive end.

But the athletic body and defensive abilities are at least 2/3 of the story.

I once played against a guy like him (1on1). Not very skilled but a great athlete. I'm not a bad baller and way better than him, but it was a point in the ass to play against him.

[LeBowen]

Well...sure...maybe on the offensive end.

But the athletic body and defensive abilities are at least 2/3 of the story.

I once played against a guy like him (1on1). Not very skilled but a great athlete. I'm not a bad baller and way better than him, but it was a point in the ass to play against him.

I still can't excuse a max contract 7 footer having no post moves whatsoever and zero touch around the rim.



We need to find some offense, chucking 3s isn't working and driving into the packed paint results in turnovers.

[KingKev]

Missed the entire first quarter because I am Canadian. Please annex us but instead of making Trudeau governor send him to Guantanamo Bay.

[LeBowen]

This has been awful ever since subs started happening, completely out of sync on both ends of the floor.

[heyheymymy]

lol Gobert

[Leetonidas]

Something seriously needs to change with the SL or the rotations because these pitiful first quarters are killing the spurs

[LeBowen]

Something seriously needs to change with the SL or the rotations because these pitiful first quarters are killing the spurs

Starters were fine, it was 14-14 with a couple more shots going halfway in.
Rotations have been awful.

[heyheymymy]

some mamu looks

[heyheymymy]

lol Gobert clown shift

[scott]

Vassell off the bench is a really nice idea unless he does absolutely nothing off the bench, like we got in the first quarter. Consistency is the next step Devin needs to take.

[scott]

Will have to look up the stats later, but rebounding really takes a huge nose dive when Sochan, Bassey or Barnes aren’t on the court (and it’s not even that Barnes is a great rebounder, he’s just in the right spots, blocking out, facilitating rebounds for others)

[Spurs Brazil]

Champagnie can’t make a shot and is playing bad defense

[LeBowen]

Doomer time.

[TimmyBuckets]

Ya this is a loss

[sananspursfan21]

Well, they’re getting decent shots and playing smart-ish offense. Just nothing going in, might be one of those games

[Larry O]

Man, the Good Guys just can't hit the side of a barn at point blank range with a 10 gage shotgun. SMH...

[baseline bum]

Ugh Wesley getting so many minutes instead of Castle

[Tyronn Lue]

Man, the Good Guys just can't hit the side of a barn at point blank range with a 10 gage shotgun. SMH...
That won't stop them from shooting, win or lose. Let's have no physical contact.

[TimmyBuckets]

Have the 7'3 guy post-up if shots aren't falling

[baseline bum]

So never play Castle and Wemby together wtf Mitch?

[heyheymymy]

wow wwemby really threaded that pass to Wesley for the bucket

[heyheymymy]

cmon devin

[LeBowen]

Can't even blame the coach when our best shooters can't make shit.

[LeBowen]

And these kickouts from inside the paint are getting annoying. Barnes has a perfect fadeaway lined up from just outside the restricted area and he kicks it out to Jeremy of all people.

[TimmyBuckets]

Another prayer for a miraculous comeback. This team is trash quarters 1-3.5

[heyheymymy]

Just can't hit shots tonight. Have had plenty of opportunities.

Sochan helping out some. Really improved his touch finishing near the rim.

[sananspursfan21]

Nobody is shooting well

[baseline bum]

Nobody is shooting well

IDK Ant seems to be killing shit

[scott]

And these kickouts from inside the paint are getting annoying. Barnes has a perfect fadeaway lined up from just outside the restricted area and he kicks it out to Jeremy of all people.

I’ve noticed a lot of this the last few games, most notably from Devin. Mitch has modernized our offense and our 3PA/gm have taken a significant leap… I’m wondering if this these kickouts are by instruction

[TimmyBuckets]

Sochan shoots like a retard

[mudyez]

Wemby quietly building up a quadruple double chance.

[heyheymymy]

Wemby fastest Spur to 2,000 points

2,008 points

[LeBowen]

I’ve noticed a lot of this the last few games, most notably from Devin. Mitch has modernized our offense and our 3PA/gm have taken a significant leap… I’m wondering if this these kickouts are by instruction

I'm all for modern offense, but we shouldn't be giving up shots around the basket for 3pts.
Even on fastbreak I'd rather see a player try and lay it up over a defender than to have a fastbreak 3pt.


Devin is completely out of the game, just sit him, tbh.

[sananspursfan21]

Completely unforced turnovers

[heyheymymy]

oh my god Devin get your shit together man

[TimmyBuckets]

shaping up to be a 20 point loss.

[sananspursfan21]

IDK Ant seems to be killing shit

yeah yeah yeah :lol

[Larry O]

Lots of low BBIQ playing by the Spurs!

[sananspursfan21]

What is Vassell’s deal?

[heyheymymy]

oooo 3rd foul on ANT

[heyheymymy]

Wemby's FT improvement very noticeable

hit those icers in the POR game

[Kawhi Duncan]

Sochan is so bad on offense... Dude makes the worst decisions with his passes... This is the dude Pop wanted to make a PG

[LeBowen]

Devin with team worst -17.
1-6 FG and 0s across the board in 12 minutes played.

[heyheymymy]

Sochan at the half:

10/9/2/2/1

[Spurs Brazil]

Too many players playing bad, Vassell, Champagnie, Castle.

[TimmyBuckets]

when is sochan going to learn to shoot a three?

[thiste]

Wemby 14/6/4/5 at the half

On pace for the quadruple double

[scott]

Can’t even be too mad at this one, tbh.

Minnesota finally playing like one of the top WC teams, as they were expected to be coming into the season, and the Spurs shooting like complete ass. Just showing more than anything, the Spurs just aren’t on that level yet. Team is still out there battling though, so I’m pleased with that.

At the risk of sounding like a broken record… we need to make a couple of smart move to increase the talent level of the core rotation. Use those picks that are destined to become more Branhims

[mudyez]

Wemby 14/6/4/5 in 17 Minutes.

[100%duncan]

Unfortunately Wemby is the only person playing basketball for the Spurs.

[scott]

I'm all for modern offense, but we shouldn't be giving up shots around the basket for 3pts.
Even on fastbreak I'd rather see a player try and lay it up over a defender than to have a fastbreak 3pt.


No disagreements here. Just wondering if it’s a Mitch thing or a low IQ player thing

[Pauleta14]

Sochan at the half:

10/9/2/2/1

Great defensive impact but fucks so many plays up with his low IQ/court awareness and poor shooting

He's as much a strength than an issue

[timtonymanu]

Champ went from having one of his best games to being terrible today. But that’s why he’s a role player. The team does suffer when he struggles though.

[heyheymymy]

damn Spurs shot 34% in the first half and 3/21 3PM

[Larry O]

OK, it's the second half. Let's get into a shooting rhythm, Spurs and play some defense, too, and get back into this game! GSG!!! WOOOO!!!

[heyheymymy]

SA 7-3 in comeback games of at least 16 points

[TimmyBuckets]

SA 7-3 in comeback games of at least 16 points

Thats good but why do they always have to make a comeback?

[ginobilized]

Sochan giveth, Sochan taketh

[heyheymymy]

Barnes breathing a little life into the team

3/3 corner threes in the 3Q

[skin27]

Cmon!!!

[heyheymymy]

BAM MOTHERFUCKER

Spurs trailed by as many at 18. It's a 6 point game.

[scott]

Here come the Spurs again!

[Spurs Brazil]

Wemby is dominating on D

[CGD]

Sochan is a beast. His activity is making this possible.

[Guru of Nothing]

Give Champ a bonus for making the wolves call timeout.

[100%duncan]

Lets fucking gooo

[SPURt]

Champagnie deserves props for making himself this good. It’s crazy he’s the undrafted one out of Branham and Wesley. Granted he’s older than them, but still, he’s a legit NBA player.

[ginobilized]

Barnes is so efficient, raining 3s.

How many times has Wemby rejected ANT?

[heyheymymy]

damn Jeremy Sochan has been sensational

double double tonight for Jeremy

[scott]

If we can get some contribution from Vassell and Castle here in the second, we might have a chance here

[heyheymymy]

Barnes is a bad ass

[thiste]

We can't win this if Devin doesn't wake up

[baseline bum]

Fuck these refs

[Guru of Nothing]

Getting a little Diaw vibe from Barnes.

[TimmyBuckets]

This random queef mcdaniels just tosses it and hits net. Meanwhile we can't hit shit.

[Spurs Brazil]

Castle and Vassell are terrible today. They need to step up

[100%duncan]

Refs are letting them play on both ends but some of these contacts are crazy non-calls

[baseline bum]

Spurs can't get a fucking call at the rim and Minnesota gets these last two foul calls?

[heyheymymy]

holy shit Rudy LOLbert

[TimmyBuckets]

Vassell is quickly becoming the KJ of this team aka replaceable af

[heyheymymy]

can't waste a 1-9 night from Naz Reid

GSG!!

[heyheymymy]

hope that resuscitates Devin for the 4Q ahead

[TheBallsbreakers]

Castle playing bad.

[TheBallsbreakers]

Castle playing bad.
And just like that he makes up for it with 2 great plays in a row... and makes a bad pass the next play

[TimmyBuckets]

For every 2 great things Castle does, there's 1 rookie mistake.

[Larry O]

C'mon Rook!

[heyheymymy]

HAHAHA How the fuck is Rudy Gobert so lauded? How the fuck does MIN ruin their future for a decade over getting Gobert?

It's not just tonight, dude was abysmal for FRA in the Olympics this summer too.

Dude has produced a full Shaqtin a fool footage singlehandedly just from the first 3 quarters of tonight's game.

[100%duncan]

Idgaf what anyone says Gobert is so ass :lol

[scott]

Who’s going step up and be a baller in the 4th?

[TheBallsbreakers]

Good thing Gobert is helping out the Spurs.

[ginobilized]

Wemby and Gobert are aiding the Spurs cause tonight!

[baseline bum]

Probably should have included Vassell in those trade talks for Markannen

[Larry O]

WOW! Whata way to start the 4th with a TO!

[SPURt]

Ugh

[sananspursfan21]

4th quarter shut out if they’re just gonna throw up threes

[SPURt]

Who’s going step up and be a baller in the 4th?
None of the above apparently

[Larry O]

Geez! The rims at home are not friendly to the Spurs! SMH...

[100%duncan]

Who’s going step up and be a baller in the 4th?

Not Dev tonight unfortunately

[TimmyBuckets]

Without CP3 this team would have Portland's record. We're still 3 years away from a contender at this rate minimum.

[Thomas82]

This one is getting away from us.

[sananspursfan21]

This doesn’t seem to be one of those shoot yourself out of the funk nights. Get to the rim, this game wouldn’t be out of hand again if they’d just work it in the paint

[Pauleta14]

Without CP3 this team would have Portland's record. We're still 3 years away from a contender at this rate minimum.

Especially if our rookie coach needs to finish his development. smh

[100%duncan]

Refs :lmao

[100%duncan]

Of course Mitch doesnt challenge it

[TimmyBuckets]

Yea it's the coach's fault not the garbage players. The rookie coach is keeping this garbage team at least fighting for a play-in.

[3&D_TBH]

I don’t think I’ve ever fucking complained about the refs once in my entire fucking life, but this is straight bullshit. Stephon Castle can’t get a call to save his fucking life. Fuck this game. and also we can’t make Jack shit. Lol

[100%duncan]

Bitch ass Divicenzo and Conley both have been scrubs this season going off now :lol





It’s like DLo being ass the whole year and shooting lights off when he sees the Spurs

[Spurs Brazil]

Vassell -24
Castle - 23

[scott]

I can’t believe the following words are going to come out of my keyboard….

But Keldon could have been helpful tonight

[Kawhi Duncan]

It's not a coincidence that as soon as Sochan is starting out offense goes to shit again... But ppl can't see it... They look at the stats he gets since he gets left to roam all game... That's the strategy... The opposing coach leaves him open because they know it's better to have everyone else struggle by having sochan's man help

[timtonymanu]

Appreciate their fight but this game is lost if Vassell and castle are looking like they are.

[Kawhi Duncan]

Bitch ass Divicenzo and Conley both have been scrubs this season going off now :lol





It’s like DLo being ass the whole year and shooting lights off when he sees the Spurs

It's our defensive philosophy... We play drop coverage and teams know it, so they shoot knowing it won't be contested

[sananspursfan21]

Sochan’s jump shots should be a technical foul.

[scott]

Holy shit Sochan has gone from a bad 3pt shooter to one of the worst 3pt shooters I’ve ever seen. That corner 3 belongs in the hall of shame.

[sananspursfan21]

Empty the bench. It’s time.

[100%duncan]

77 points in the big 2024 :lol

[CGD]

Man, in case you forgot Chris Paul was 39 today was the reminder. Just can’t get past anyone anymore.

[Spurs Brazil]

Vassell, Paul and Castle were terrible. Impossible to win with those 3 playing that bad

[sananspursfan21]

Every Spur has been basically garbage from the field. The performance won’t make me cliff jump, just annoying that I spent time watching it

[ginobilized]

I like Sochan and Vassell on the 2nd unit

Champagnie has come so far. His D was strong tonight.

[SPURt]

The refs were awful tonight, but the shooting outside of Barnes was just trash. The Spurs need to play inside->out like taking an orgasmic shit, but noooooooo we want to play outside->in like a damn lucid colonoscopy. The beautiful game was setting three point records and that was inside->out, what are they doing?

[rascal]

There is no comeback tonight. Minn is a quality team.

[Guru of Nothing]

Y'all won't believe this shit.

[SPURt]

Cissoko…. Interesting

[Guru of Nothing]

Is this the rapture?

[scott]

Sidy Cissoko, sharpshooter?

[skin27]

Stupid ass loss..damn vassell and castle. Even wemby shoot very poorly

[ginobilized]

Vassell -30 for the win

If Philly, Brooklyn and Detroit plummet, we might have a shot at the Chicago pick.

[Spurs Homer]

Funny that sidy hit those shots…
someone posted a youtube of some spur getting interviewed in the last day or two and sidy was in the background shooting jumper after jumper after jumper…

i remember it struck me that his form had changed a thousand percent and his shots were looking very very fluid…

he might be putting in work and it shows…hope he continues his work ethic…

[Spurs Homer]

….as far as this game…it was just a trap game…playing in portland friday night and flying home…and all of the recent bumps and bruises just seem to throw a few players off…

[timtonymanu]

Tbh our last 2 wins against two very bad teams were almost a loss. I wasn’t expecting a win tonight. The spurs still have a lot of work to do.

[rascal]

Holy shit Sochan has gone from a bad 3pt shooter to one of the worst 3pt shooters I’ve ever seen. That corner 3 belongs in the hall of shame.

Sochan hit all net, the underside of the net airball.

[heyheymymy]

another 3 days off

kinda weird schedule 4 days off, game fri and Sunday, then another 3 days off

Next game 12/19 7pm CST against the ATL HAWKS MUST WIN MUST DESTROY BIRD

[timtonymanu]

….as far as this game…it was just a trap game…playing in portland friday night and flying home…and all of the recent bumps and bruises just seem to throw a few players off…

Trap game is when you lose a game that you should have won or when the other team is facing multiple injuries. This wasn’t a trap game at all.

[rascal]

Wemby looked really awkward at times, trying to do too much and often out of position on defense.

[onechance87]

Should of not fcked with the starting lineup dumbass coach.

[itzsoweezee]

Damn, wemby got absolutely punked by Gobert in the fourth quarter. I’ve never seen Gobert do that to anyone. That’s just embarrassing

[TimmyBuckets]

We need a backup center this draft and we need a second star next to Wemby idk who Antman idc

[Duncan2177]

We need a backup center this draft and we need a second star next to Wemby idk who Antman idc

And also a new coach.

[The Truth #6]

Sidy casually swishes two 3s on a night when we couldn't hit shit.

We couldn't score. Horrible 3P%. Low energy. Refs not giving Castle any respect.

Move on.

[Jordan Jackson]

It's not a coincidence that as soon as Sochan is starting out offense goes to shit again... But ppl can't see it... They look at the stats he gets since he gets left to roam all game... That's the strategy... The opposing coach leaves him open because they know it's better to have everyone else struggle by having sochan's man help

No. I see it. But it doesn’t matter that we see it. Does the front office realize it or care. They have to be better this offseason.

Also - scrubs are not just going off on the Spurs just because. You leave an NBA player open long enough they will make shots. The Spurs defense is suspect as hell on the perimeter.

[MannyIsGod]

It's not a coincidence that as soon as Sochan is starting out offense goes to shit again... But ppl can't see it... They look at the stats he gets since he gets left to roam all game... That's the strategy... The opposing coach leaves him open because they know it's better to have everyone else struggle by having sochan's man help

Sochan didn't make people miss wide open shots tonight. Y'all are ridiculous

[onechance87]

vassell is just a role player.Shame i thought he can maybe be the 3rd star with wemby.He cant even do that.We need to get
another potential 2 stars to help wemby cause he vassell aint it.Not even sure if hes better then champ rn

[BackHome]

Spurs need to make some trades and we might have to go backwards in order to move ahead.

[Amuseddaysleeper]

We are dog shit, should look into tanking

[onechance87]

We need a backup center this draft and we need a second star next to Wemby idk who Antman idc

i mean we could of had a real big powerfull center in zach edy,But we passed on him.But yes we do need a big real center to not always
depend on wemby to protect the paint and rebound.

[Russo21]

Vassell with the quadruple zero! 0reb 0ast 0blk 0stl. That's hard to do.

4pts and 2/11FG sucks but it's excusable as sometimes shit happens and shots just don't go in. But the quadruple zero is inexcusable. What does he do out there except look to score? And he isn't even so good at that.

His career and season averages in those categories is ghastly. He plays losing basketball. Hopefully some dumb front office sees his 18ppg and offers something for him at some stage. He just does nothing out there to make the team or anyone around him better

[Fireball]

Wemby and Barnes were fine, Sochan was ok, the rest sucked ... Vassell topping that by being utter shit.

[LeBowen]

Sochan didn't make people miss wide open shots tonight. Y'all are ridiculous

They got their early ~15 points lead after rotations started and we never came back. Starters were fine again in the 3rd.
We're just too top heavy and can't afford no production from the bench.
Vassell's performance was inexcusable, he needs to get his shit together.
Castle is a rookie so he can be excused, but Devin can't. Can't be useless against bench lineups.

[ambchang]

It's not a coincidence that as soon as Sochan is starting out offense goes to shit again... But ppl can't see it... They look at the stats he gets since he gets left to roam all game... That's the strategy... The opposing coach leaves him open because they know it's better to have everyone else struggle by having sochan's man help

Sochan is 7th on the team in ortg and 4th in OBPM.

[onechance87]

Sochan is 7th on the team in ortg and 4th in OBPM.

sochan needs to go back the bench.Fcking with wembys rotations and changing how he plays.

[onechance87]

Bunch of morons on this coaching staff....Im sure castle knows now he has a real shot at roy.But what does the coaching staff do?Send him to the fcking
bench like morons.Great developing from our staff.Castle and wemby were playing great in the starting lineup.You dont fck that up.

[Duncan2177]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AiKAijn7388

[ambchang]

sochan needs to go back the bench.Fcking with wembys rotations and changing how he plays.

Because he botches play by having a higher ORating and OBPM than wemby?

[LeBowen]

Jeremy is far from being a great offensive player, but he was the least of our issues last night.
I feel like a lot of criticism in here is coming from posters who didn't even watch the full game.

Our starters did well against a serious playoff team, our bench was nowhere to be seen.
While we obviously need a couple more players to win serious games on regular basis, we also need our current bench guys to do better.

Then the usual subejctive shit starts. Is Castle a great rookie? Obviously. Was he shit last night? Obviously. Is it a long term issue? Obviously not.
Stop trying to find excuses for him when he has a bad game, he's just a rookie.

[Pauleta14]

Bunch of morons on this coaching staff....Im sure castle knows now he has a real shot at roy.But what does the coaching staff do?Send him to the fcking
bench like morons.Great developing from our staff.Castle and wemby were playing great in the starting lineup.You dont fck that up.

The worst part is that he's being replaced with Sochan who has a poor connection with Wemby and shines when the latter is on the bench.

Castle needs to be back asap in the SL

[John B]

Jeremy is far from being a great offensive player, but he was the least of our issues last night.
I feel like a lot of criticism in here is coming from posters who didn't even watch the full game.

Our starters did well against a serious playoff team, our bench was nowhere to be seen.
While we obviously need a couple more players to win serious games on regular basis, we also need our current bench guys to do better.

Then the usual subejctive shit starts. Is Castle a great rookie? Obviously. Was he shit last night? Obviously. Is it a long term issue? Obviously not.
Stop trying to find excuses for him when he has a bad game, he's just a rookie.

I think Castle plays better with the starting line up, obviously better players to pass to and open opportunities for him. I think Sochan is a spark plug, a high motor guy who can play on both squad, but could best play with the 2nd squad looking at the bigger picture.

[Pauleta14]

Jeremy is far from being a great offensive player, but he was the least of our issues last night.
I feel like a lot of criticism in here is coming from posters who didn't even watch the full game.

Our starters did well against a serious playoff team, our bench was nowhere to be seen.
While we obviously need a couple more players to win serious games on regular basis, we also need our current bench guys to do better.

Then the usual subejctive shit starts. Is Castle a great rookie? Obviously. Was he shit last night? Obviously. Is it a long term issue? Obviously not.
Stop trying to find excuses for him when he has a bad game, he's just a rookie.

Of course Sochan wasn't THE pb during yesterday's loss, it was mostly the bench production.

However, he's a real issue for the Spurs offensive game to be fluid (as it was during his absence) bc he's not a great passer, can't penetrate with the ball like Castle does and is a worse shooter than the latter, meaning he helps pack the paint and puts Wemby in a perimeter role by default bc his inside game is his only option really.

Sochan would be a lot more useful with the 2nd unit and would get more opportunities for simple(r) P&R plays

[LeBowen]

I think Castle plays better with the starting line up, obviously better players to pass to and open opportunities for him. I think Sochan is a spark plug, a high motor guy who can play on both squad, but could best play with the 2nd squad looking at the bigger picture.

Everyone plays better with better teammates around them.
For like a year I've been saying Jeremy should be the glue guy off the bench, but last night he wasn't the problem.


Of course Sochan wasn't THE pb during yesterday's loss, it was mostly the bench production.

However, he's a real issue for the Spurs offensive game to be fluid (as it was during his absence) bc he's not a great passer, can't penetrate with the ball like Castle does and is a worse shooter than the latter, meaning he helps pack the paint and put Wemby in a perimeter role by default bc his inside game is his only option really.

Sochan would be a lot more useful with the 2nd unit and would get more opportunity for simple(r) P&R plays

We can't afford not to start Jeremy against strong wings.
Randle was just 4-11, Jeremy did a great job on him almost every time they matched up.
Barnes is a solid defender, but Randle would have a way easier time in that matchup.
Champagnie is even weaker and Castle is a 6'5 rookie.

We lost against the Lakers because Jeremy was out, he would've easily exhausted old Lebron.

We have no two-way players on the roster other than Wemby and it's a huge issue.
Champagnie is a solid defender, but Castle and Jeremy look like the only legit impact perimeter defenders...but neither of them can shoot well enough.
We have to figure something out.

[scott]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AiKAijn7388

Greatest video title of all time TBH

[Raven]

way too much castle in this team, i'm ready to push him down the depth chart to 4th pg where he belongs until he earns his way back. He's clearly lost confidence in his shot, he needs set plays instead of free flowing bs.

[scott]

They got their early ~15 points lead after rotations started and we never came back. Starters were fine again in the 3rd.
We're just too top heavy and can't afford no production from the bench.
Vassell's performance was inexcusable, he needs to get his shit together.
Castle is a rookie so he can be excused, but Devin can't. Can't be useless against bench lineups.

Vassell has too many of these nothing games in year 5 of his career to be in real consideration for "Our #2" and that notion should quickly leave everyone's brains.

People like to list him as untouchable, but I'd definitely move him in the right deal.

[Pauleta14]

We can't afford not to start Jeremy against strong wings.
Randle was just 4-11, Jeremy did a great job on him almost every time they matched up.
Barnes is a solid defender, but Randle would have a way easier time in that matchup.
Champagnie is even weaker and Castle is a 6'5 rookie.

We lost against the Lakers because Jeremy was out, he would've easily exhausted old Lebron.

We have no two-way players on the roster other than Wemby and it's a huge issue.
Champagnie is a solid defender, but Castle and Jeremy look like the only legit impact perimeter defenders...but neither of them can shoot well enough.
We have to figure something out.

I agree with the points you make, actually, but they highlight more the roster's deficiencies.

Sochan is, and I'm afraid will always be a cost on offense as much as a necessity on defense as long as he has so many technical deficiencies (not just the shooting), he messes up so many easy plays and forces Wemby (who doesn't need to) to play on the perimeter bc he's such a great passer and Sochan can't shoot and lack court awareness or passing abilities to combine.

Sochan needs to be able to switch inside/out with Wemby for them to become a reliable duo, he just can't as of now and it's a massive issue that Spurs fans refuse to acknowledge bc they like the dude and just look at his own production even if that one can happen at the detriment of the team

[LeBowen]

Vassell has too many of these nothing games in year 5 of his career to be in real consideration for "Our #2" and that notion should quickly leave everyone's brains.

People like to list him as untouchable, but I'd definitely move him in the right deal.

I don't want to write anyone off too soon, but if he can't stay healthy and consistent this season, he should be used in a trade where we actually get a high end starter.
As I wrote in trade ideas topic, if Fox asks out Wright should be on the phone right away and get him with Devin and Hawks picks package.



I agree with the points you make, actually, but they highlight more the roster's deficiencies.

Sochan is, and I'm afraid will always be a cost on offense as much as a necessity on defense as long as he has so many technical deficiencies (not just the shooting), he messes up so many easy plays and forces Wemby (who doesn't need to) to play on the perimeter bc he's such a great passer and Sochan can't shoot and lack court awareness or passing abilities to combine.

Sochan needs to be able to switch inside/out with Wemby for them to become a reliable duo, he just can't as of now and it's a massive issue that Spurs fans refuse to acknowledge bc they like the dude and just look at his own production even if that one can happen at the detriment of the team

Of course our roster is deficient. Without Wemby they wouldn't reach 20 wins.

I actually think Jeremy improved on his decision making and plays with way more confidence in the pain, which was my biggest criticism last season.
He's a non-shooter, but what frustrated me even more were random attempts in the paint that made no sense. This season he's looked like a player with the purpose on most attempts in the paint, big improvement.

As for Wemby playing in the paint, he averaged a dozen threes per game even without Sochan, Wemby is playing on the perimeter because he (and the coaching staff) wants to.

My concern right now would be Vassel.
Both his health and ability.
He already got paid and we need him to start playing on the level of money he's been getting. He was just atrocious last night, none of his shots were even close.

[scott]

Looking at various two-man combos, Wemby-Sochan is still a net positive duo but predictably the offensive production takes a dive. Below are all of the two-man combinations with Wemby, and you can see how the pairing with Sochan provides a defense and rebounding boost but comes at a pretty noticeable drop off in offensive production.

Also of note... the combination of Wemby and Devin, which so many were excited about based on the chemistry it appeared the two might have been developing last season, is the worst pairing Wemby is involved in... rivaled only by pairing him with Branham, one of if not the worst player in all of the NBA.

https://i.ibb.co/M6hZxvS/twoman.png

[Pauleta14]

Of course our roster is deficient. Without Wemby they wouldn't reach 20 wins.

As for Wemby playing in the paint, he averaged a dozen threes per game even without Sochan, Wemby is playing on the perimeter because he (and the coaching staff) wants to.

My concern right now would be Vassel.
Both his health and ability.
He already got paid and we need him to start playing on the level of money he's been getting. He was just atrocious last night, none of his shots were even close.

I'm aware Wemby plays a lot on the perimeter anyway, my point was that we're hoping for him to find a right balance with his inside game (that is soooo much more efficient % wise) and that he doesn't need the insentive Sochan "provides" by default. It makes Wemby even more "comfortable" staying on the perimeter IMHO
He needs an inside/out switch front court partner (like Lauri smh)

As for Vassell, I'm not worried YET on the basketball aspect, only worried on his fitness.

Let's be honest a min, Devin hasn't been put in the most comfortable situation since he came back and it's normal for him to need time to find his groove and be ok with his NEW role.

Yesterday he was horrible, but it was a one off, he's had many efficient games too recently and it's not easy to become a bench player and 3rd option (at best) when you used to start and be 1st/2nd all the time.

He's shown last season post ASG that when put in the right situation and well coached he could become a very good playmaker along with his shooting efficiency, he became Wemby's main assist provider in front of Tre who had the ball more often for ex.




Looking at various two-man combos, Wemby-Sochan is still a net positive duo but predictably the offensive production takes a dive. Below are all of the two-man combinations with Wemby, and you can see how the pairing with Sochan provides a defense and rebounding boost but comes at a pretty noticeable drop off in offensive production.

Also of note... the combination of Wemby and Devin, which so many were excited about based on the chemistry it appeared the two might have been developing last season, is the worst pairing Wemby is involved in... rivaled only by pairing him with Branham, one of if not the worst player in all of the NBA.

https://i.ibb.co/M6hZxvS/twoman.png

Compare those data to last season's post ASG and you'll realize that it's mostly due to the situations players are being put in.

Devin was Vic's best assist provider and his game started to evolve with better playmaking.

He can do it again

[stnick2261]

Looking at various two-man combos, Wemby-Sochan is still a net positive duo but predictably the offensive production takes a dive. Below are all of the two-man combinations with Wemby, and you can see how the pairing with Sochan provides a defense and rebounding boost but comes at a pretty noticeable drop off in offensive production.

Also of note... the combination of Wemby and Devin, which so many were excited about based on the chemistry it appeared the two might have been developing last season, is the worst pairing Wemby is involved in... rivaled only by pairing him with Branham, one of if not the worst player in all of the NBA.

https://i.ibb.co/M6hZxvS/twoman.png

I just did the same search, but with 3-man lineups (including Wemby) to look for context. I sorted by worst NETRTG, and no shocker but Wemby, Vassell and Branham had a -85. What did shock me was the fact that they only played 10 minutes together. I thought there would be more overlap to account for both being much worse than the others, but it seems both players have each played poorly with Wemby (separately).

Also, it seems when Johnson joins the Castle/Wemby duo, they drop off pretty good (-23.9)

When Sochan joins the Castle/Wemby duo, the defense is really good... and rebounding is really good... but the assist% drops to 65% and the assist/turnover ratio drops to 1.0

I was getting my kids to bed last night when I turned the game on my phone, near the end of the first half. I was just in time to see Sochan complete 3 turnovers in a row from bad passes.

[RC_Drunkford]

Looking at various two-man combos, Wemby-Sochan is still a net positive duo but predictably the offensive production takes a dive. Below are all of the two-man combinations with Wemby, and you can see how the pairing with Sochan provides a defense and rebounding boost but comes at a pretty noticeable drop off in offensive production.

Also of note... the combination of Wemby and Devin, which so many were excited about based on the chemistry it appeared the two might have been developing last season, is the worst pairing Wemby is involved in... rivaled only by pairing him with Branham, one of if not the worst player in all of the NBA.

https://i.ibb.co/M6hZxvS/twoman.png

start Wesley

[spurs10]

When Paul, Vassell, and Castle shoot this poorly we ain't winning. Wemby, sans his 3 pt shots, kept us in it with his D and hustle.

[Duncan2177]

Greatest video title of all time TBH

:lol

[exstatic]

Spurs need a wake-up call occasionally, like most young teams, and this was one. I liked that Castle saw an actual locked in All D defender in Jaden McDaniels who had size on him, and he struggled with it. It’s something he needs to learn to deal with.

[Raven]

Spurs need a wake-up call occasionally, like most young teams, and this was one. I liked that Castle saw an actual locked in All D defender in Jaden McDaniels who had size on him, and he struggled with it. It’s something he needs to learn to deal with.

I've been saying this since the start of the season. He can defend bigger guys on the perimeter, but the moment they penetrate, he struggles more than his peers. On point guards though, it looks a lot better.

[koriwhat]

They lost because I was in the audience... I'm their bad luck unfortunately. Actually the Spurs are probably a little over .500 when I attend games. :lol

My girlfriend enjoys the fries there at the arena so regardless she was content with the loss.

[exstatic]

They lost because I was in the audience... I'm their bad luck unfortunately. Actually the Spurs are probably a little over .500 when I attend games. :lol

My girlfriend enjoys the fries there at the arena so regardless she was content with the loss.

She is probably used to taking the L by now.

[koriwhat]

She is probably used to taking the L by now.

LMAO... Yours is used to taking 3" though.

[Leetonidas]

They lost because I was in the audience... I'm their bad luck unfortunately. Actually the Spurs are probably a little over .500 when I attend games. :lol

My girlfriend enjoys the fries there at the arena so regardless she was content with the loss.

That's why the last few years I always try to go to games against shitty teams :lol cheaper and more likely to win

[koriwhat]

That's why the last few years I always try to go to games against shitty teams :lol cheaper and more likely to win

I get free tickets in the lower level row 10 so I can't pass them up when they're given to me. Win or Lose, I'm still winning! Not winning at the concession stand though; that shit's expensive!

Merry Christmas, bud! :tu