It's Official: 2025 Spurs New Big 3 has ARRIVED

[Knoxxx]

Fox > Parker
Castle > Manu
Wemby > Duncan

Now just to assemble the supporting cast. And we are perfectly positioned to navigate the complicated salary cap rules and penalties.

(if I am to be assailed feel free to substitute the > with = signs and I won't argue. I was basing those mostly on potential, not career achievements obviously.)

[z0sa]

Castle suddenly getting good at shooting bodes well for us.

Now if only Mitch starts him and plays him 30 minutes ...

[Russ]

Fox > Parker
Castle > Manu
Wemby > Duncan

To rhyme it:

The key will be . . .

Can Castle play the 3 . . .

[Raven]

they don't mesh.

[RC_Drunkford]

still need another piece to build a big 4 so we can really dominate

[thOOdee]

Rather have 2 s tier stars, and 4 solid pieces ala boston, than a big 3. Think we’re on the right track though.

[baseline bum]

Yeah no, Wemby is an unbelievable prospect but Tim was dominating playoff games at 21.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FB7XD8km7L0

I'm clearly subbing in a < for Wemby vs Tim right now and it's no diss to Victor because Tim is arguably a top 5 player who was also better at the same age.

[z0sa]

Yeah no, Wemby is an unbelievable prospect but Tim was dominating playoff games at 21.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FB7XD8km7L0

I'm clearly subbing in a < for Wemby vs Tim right now and it's no diss to Victor because Tim is arguably a top 5 player who was also better at the same age.

Wemby is more gifted defensively but offensively, he's not in the same realm as Tim (yet, I hope). Tim also had a 4 year college degree and that stuff clearly matters. Wemby is highly intelligent but there's just no substitute for four years of college when it comes to critically thinking and self-reflection, the most important mental attributes for improvement.

[baseline bum]

Wemby is more gifted defensively but offensively, he's not in the same realm as Tim (yet, I hope). Tim also had a 4 year college degree and that stuff clearly matters. Wemby is highly intelligent but there's just no substitute for four years of college when it comes to critically thinking and self-reflection, the most important mental attributes for improvement.

Yeah Victor is already better than Tim defensively IMO, which is saying a lot since Tim should have won a couple of DPOY. But offensively he's nowhere close when Tim was an automatic bucket on the left block from Day 1.

[lefty20]

Fahrenheit 451

[Knoxxx]

Ya’ll not factoring Wemby on a much worse team that he’s carried most his young career or his 3 PT range that Duncan NEVER had.

[bigfan]

Wemby is no TD now and I doubt he ever will be even close in the long run. Folks forget how big and strong TD was under the hoop.

[Dex]

Fox/Castle/Wemby are def the next Big 3 for the Spurs, but let's not start sucking each other's dicks just yet. Comparing them to the Best Trio in NBA history is a LONG WAY AWAY

[scott]

I'm loving what I'm seeing from Castle from these cross-court, whipped skip passes to find guys open for 3. Fox does the same thing and Wemby does to at times (though his are a little out of control at times but he such a unique angle for these passes that once he just settles down a little bit they'll be just as deadly). The meta roster build with these 3 seems pretty clear to me... we need to pair them with two 6'8"+ true 3&D wings who can rebound. Sorry to everyone who loves Sochan and Devin... but they don't fit that. Now, they can be excellent bench pieces (though Vassell is overpaid to be a bench piece), but they simply don't fit the ideal build with our Big 3.

So who does fit? (All the percentiles below are from CraftedNBA.com.

Ferraris (will be costly to get, maybe even impossible, so maybe you just keep dreaming)



Trey Murphy III - 6'8" with a 7' wingspan. 83rd percentile TS%, 95th percentile SQ Index, 69th percentile DRB, 78th percentile Rim Frequency defender, 84th percentile defensive versatility, but only 35th percentile in Crafted DPM.



OG Anunoby - 6'7" with a 7'3" wingspan. 72nd percentile TS%, 65th percentile SQ Index, 71st percentile DRB, 69th percentile BLKpct, 91st percentile defensive versatility, 91st percentile Crafted DPM



Toumani Camara - 6'7" with a 7'1" wingspan. 43rd percentile TS%, 46th percentile SQ Index, 67th percentile DRB, 94th percentile raDTOV, 99th percentile defensive versatility, 87th percentile Crafted DPM. Only a 35.6% 3P shooter this year, but still young which is why I have listed in the Ferrari category. Basically, I don't think POR is letting this guy go.
Pascal Siakam - 6'8" with a 7'3" wingspan. 82nd percentile TS%, 90th percentile DRB, 51st percentile ORB, 94th percentile CraftedOPM, 64th percentile CraftedDPM. We don't need someone of his stature in this role, but he'd fit



BMWs (very nice, and probably attainable if you want to pay the price)



Herb Jones - 6'6" with 7'0" wingspan. 73rd percentile TS%, 76th percentile SQ Index, 98th percentile offensive portability, 93rd percentile deflection rate, 96th percentile raDTOV, 59th percentile DRB, 98th percentile defensive versatility, 97th percentile Crafted DPM. Kind of the flip side of the coin from Trey Murphy who is the elite offensive 3&D, Herb is the elite defensive 3&D
Jaden McDaniels - 6'9" with a 6'11" wingspan. 49th percentile TS%, 51st percentile SQ index. 78th percentile in deflections and raDTOV, only 35th percentile DRB, but 78th percentile Rim Defense and 90th percentile defensive versatility. 88th percentile CraftedDPM. Not as good of a shooter... kind of a worse version of Herb in my opinion. Also kind of overpaid IMO
PJ Washington - 6'7" with a 7'3" wingspan. Subpar offensive metrics but very good defensively and on the boards. Has mostly shot well from 3 in his career but up and downs



Toyotas (dependable, probably gettable without too much pain?)







Derrick Jones Jr. Solid defender. Not a great rebounder. Decent shooter but not great
Haywood Highsmith. A little small (6'5") but would be a sneaky get. Pretty good shooter, but limited offensively beyond that. Decent to good rebounder. Really good defender.
Tobias Harris. Not the best shooter as of late, but good defender and really good on the defensive boards.
Isaac Okoro. Undersized. Good shooter, good defender, okay on the glass. Plays smart.
Jake LaRavia. My guy. Good shooter, okay defender, but 91st percentile in deflections, 75th percentile in Rim Defense Frequency and 74th percentile defensive versatility. Not a great DRB guy, but 94th percentile ORB. Maybe something to work with there.
Dean Wade. Here is a sneaky one. Pretty decent shooter but 89th percentile DRB and 98th percentile CraftedDPM. Has a 99th percentile 3PAr, so he's used to the role of just standing around and waiting for the open 3.

[benefactor]

lol

Never change ST

[Knoxxx]

lol

Never change ST

Who peed in your wheaties, sir?

[CGD]

Wemby is more gifted defensively but offensively, he's not in the same realm as Tim (yet, I hope). Tim also had a 4 year college degree and that stuff clearly matters. Wemby is highly intelligent but there's just no substitute for four years of college when it comes to critically thinking and self-reflection, the most important mental attributes for improvement.

All fair point but I don’t know that Wemby is more gifted technically on defense (yet) than Tim. He’s obviously got physical gifts that he uses well.

Man that video brought back good memories.

[baseline bum]

Ya’ll not factoring Wemby on a much worse team that he’s carried most his young career or his 3 PT range that Duncan NEVER had.

Is Wemby an automatic bucket at age 21? Was Tim? Sorry it's not close yet. The difference between how much better offensively 21YO Tim was than Victor is quite a bit bigger than the difference between how much better defensively Victor is than 21YO Duncan. David was amazing but rookie Tim also had AJ, Vinny Del Negro, and Jaren Jackson / Will Perdue starting next to him. Sean missed most of that season IIRC.

[Obstructed_View]

Right now Castle is Tiago Splitter, not Manu.

[daslicer]

Wemby is more gifted defensively but offensively, he's not in the same realm as Tim (yet, I hope). Tim also had a 4 year college degree and that stuff clearly matters. Wemby is highly intelligent but there's just no substitute for four years of college when it comes to critically thinking and self-reflection, the most important mental attributes for improvement.

Victor I would say is on another level than Tim was when it comes to being a shot blocker, but I would say Duncan was just as good at switching and guarding screens as Victor, but Victor covers more length than Duncan did due to his height. One thing I would say Duncan was better than Victor at is guarding great post up players like Shaq. I don't think Victor will ever be as good at guarding physically strong post up players like Tim was due to him just having a weaker frame, but I don't think it will be too much of an issue for him since outside of Jokic there isn't any strong post up players in the current NBA.

Offensively Tim was more dominant than Victor simply because Tim had the great back to basket post-up game and great out of this world footwork. I think Victor can develop great footwork, but he will never be able to post up and muscle guys like Tim was able to for easy automatic buckets. Victor to me on the offensive end will end up more like Kevin Garnett and David Robinson since those guys were not great post players but were great athletes that relied on their jump shot and athletic ability to slash to the basket.

[daslicer]

Wemby is no TD now and I doubt he ever will be even close in the long run. Folks forget how big and strong TD was under the hoop.

Tim was one of the few guys I ever saw hold his own physically against prime Shaq. I was always amazed at how he could box out Shaq underneath the basket for rebounds and also show great resistance to Shaq when Shaq tried to back him down in the post. Duncan didn't have the bulging muscles like David did, so people forget or don't realize how deceptively strong he was, but Duncan was ridiculously strong. He could easily move guys underneath the basket when he would post them up.

[daslicer]

Ultimately, I think Victor will be some hybrid of Durant, David Robinson, Garnett when he reaches his full potential. I think his lack of post-game will hurt him in clutch situations, but this is where we have to hope Fox and eventually Castle can be good enough to be closers in those situations.

[Obstructed_View]

Ultimately, I think Victor will be some hybrid of Durant, David Robinson, Garnett when he reaches his full potential. I think his lack of post-game will hurt him in clutch situations, but this is where we have to hope Fox and eventually Castle can be good enough to be closers in those situations.
If Victor has no post game, then he can't be a hybrid of three good post players. Also, Victor's face-up game is terrible as well.

[daslicer]

If Victor has no post game, then he can't be a hybrid of three good post players. Also, Victor's face-up game is terrible as well.

Durant, Robinson, Garnett were not good post up players in the sense they didn't have back to the basket game like Duncan, Jokic, Shaq, Hakeem. Victor is in the same mold of those 3 guys. I would say Victor's face up game can get better, and I think it will over time. That's something he can improve on.

[scott]

I totally glossed over OP comparing Wemby/Fox/Castle to Timmy/Manu/Tony :lol

Yeah, let's pump the brakes on that.

With that said, I'm just super pumped that we have an ACTUAL core to build around now... not some weakass FriendshipCore of Vassell/Sochan/Keldon to delude ourselves into thinking are going to lead us somewhere one day

[Knoxxx]

I only said right from the start Wemby had > or = POTENTIAL to TD. Y’all the ones who morphed it into a point in time comparison of the two. Wemby is still filling out, TD was grown into his frame when he came into the league. Wemby was a buck 98 naked as a rookie, a real beanpole.

[Knoxxx]

Right now Castle is Tiago Splitter, not Manu.

This cannot stand without further explanation.

[Obstructed_View]

This cannot stand without further explanation.
On the bench while the team loses? Thought it was pretty clear.

[Obstructed_View]

Durant, Robinson, Garnett were not good post up players in the sense they didn't have back to the basket game like Duncan, Jokic, Shaq, Hakeem. Victor is in the same mold of those 3 guys. I would say Victor's face up game can get better, and I think it will over time. That's something he can improve on.
Robinson was an elite post player. He was perhaps the best face-up center of all time, which is why he didn't post up more. KG was an outstanding post player but he played in an era with Rasheed, Webber, and Duncan. There is no shame being the fourth best in that group. I have no opinion of Durant's post game, but I think Victor could end up superDurant with all-time levels of defense.

[tonight...you]

Tim was one of the few guys I ever saw hold his own physically against prime Shaq. I was always amazed at how he could box out Shaq underneath the basket for rebounds and also show great resistance to Shaq when Shaq tried to back him down in the post. Duncan didn't have the bulging muscles like David did, so people forget or don't realize how deceptively strong he was, but Duncan was ridiculously strong. He could easily move guys underneath the basket when he would post them up.
Yeah. David was built like an Adonis, but had chicken legs and small hips.
Tim had big legs and strong hips which helped him tremendously with Shaq's weight and force while not looking like a chiseled statue out of marble.

Edit: Tim also had such a strong feel/knowledge of leverage too to get low a bit on Shaq, rather letting him shoot jumpers than successfully backing him down.

[Mugen]

Imma need Wemby to be able to 30+ minutes without needing an iron lung before I'd say he's better than Timmy tbh

[daslicer]

Robinson was an elite post player. He was perhaps the best face-up center of all time, which is why he didn't post up more. KG was an outstanding post player but he played in an era with Rasheed, Webber, and Duncan. There is no shame being the fourth best in that group. I have no opinion of Durant's post game, but I think Victor could end up superDurant with all-time levels of defense.

Robinson, KG, didn't have great back to the basket games from what I saw of them growing up. I got to see all of KG's career and followed David's career closely starting in '94, so I saw him at his peak. David was a great athlete that could face up like you said and drive to the hoop in a way very few 7fters could, but I never really saw him back guys down in the post like Duncan did and that's not a knock-on David because very few guys could play a back to the basket game like Duncan could. It was very rare to see David do it. David's game was predicated from operating from the top of the key and shooting his great mid-range shot or slashing to the hoop for a layup or a dunk.

[exstatic]

Is Wemby an automatic bucket at age 21? Was Tim? Sorry it's not close yet. The difference between how much better offensively 21YO Tim was than Victor is quite a bit bigger than the difference between how much better defensively Victor is than 21YO Duncan. David was amazing but rookie Tim also had AJ, Vinny Del Negro, and Jaren Jackson / Will Perdue starting next to him. Sean missed most of that season IIRC.

Age 21 Tim scored 21 ppg on an EFG% of .549 and a TS% of .577
Age 21 Wemby is scoring 24 ppg on an EFG% .559 of and a TS% of .597

[Dex]

Age 21 Tim scored 21 ppg on an EFG% of .549 and a TS% of .577
Age 21 Wemby is scoring 24 ppg on an EFG% .559 of and a TS% of .597

...while also being the front-runner for DPOY and averaging 11 rebounds and 3.8 blocks per game.

I'm not saying Wemby is better than Timmy, but yes...he is a force to be reckoned with even if he isn't putting up 30 a game

[SpursBills]

Age 21 Tim scored 21 ppg on an EFG% of .549 and a TS% of .577
Age 21 Wemby is scoring 24 ppg on an EFG% .559 of and a TS% of .597

Age 21 Tim played in 1997-1998, league average points per game 95.6, EFG% of 0.478 and TS% of .524
Age 21 Wemby in 2024-2025, league average points per game 113.4, EFG% of 0.541 and TS% of 0.574

[Knoxxx]

Age 21 Tim scored 21 ppg on an EFG% of .549 and a TS% of .577
Age 21 Wemby is scoring 24 ppg on an EFG% .559 of and a TS% of .597

I knew these fools were fumbling quite a bit but thanks for the forensic support. I still think this is not an apples to apples comparison as Wemby has bore a heavier load than TD early among other things. We being spoiled brats need to not forget Wemby’s otherworldly exploits due to a recent little slump.

[exstatic]

The thing Tim had was plug in consistency. He was around his averages every night, hence the Groundhog Day nickname. Wemby scores 50, and then a few days later scores 17. He’s kind of all over the place.

[exstatic]

Age 21 Tim played in 1997-1998, league average points per game 95.6, EFG% of 0.478 and TS% of .524
Age 21 Wemby in 2024-2025, league average points per game 113.4, EFG% of 0.541 and TS% of 0.574

They’re both over league averages, and if you compared their year 2 averages instead of age 21, it isn’t even close.

Tim year 2: EFG% .495 TS% .541. He kinda regressed.

[TheBallsbreakers]

I love Tim and he's the reason I even became a Spurs lifer in the first place, but saying Vic "will never be CLOSE to Timmy" is just darn short-sighted.
The reason he's getting as much hype as he is is the god-tier physical attributes that he possesses coupled with clear, natural ball skills that you just don't get from people his size.

Tim was a vastly superior post-up player, yes, but Vic certainly has better tools to be a more multi-faceted scorer in this day and age. Heck. he's actually scoring more than Tim at this point in their careers. Shoots a little less efficiently, yes, but is a way better FT shooter and let's not even talk about the 3-ball.

Furthermore, there's even a solid argument to make that Tim's game wouldn't have worked as well in today's NBA.

What I'm saying is, declaring Vic to be "nowhere close to Tim" and that "he probably never will" OFFENSIVELY is a tad laughable to me.

He's struggling lately but even despite all that, you'd be blind to say he does not have the tools to be one of the greatest scorers in the game, way ahead of Tim, just because what? He can't post up? He's too light, to post up?

Pfffft.

[TheBallsbreakers]

I knew these fools were fumbling quite a bit but thanks for the forensic support. I still think this is not an apples to apples comparison as Wemby has bore a heavier load than TD early among other things. We being spoiled brats need to not forget Wemby’s otherworldly exploits due to a recent little slump.
Exactly. I'm a TD fan for life but to say Vic "is not close and will never be" is just downright insane to me.

[Obstructed_View]

Robinson, KG, didn't have great back to the basket games from what I saw of them growing up. I got to see all of KG's career and followed David's career closely starting in '94, so I saw him at his peak. David was a great athlete that could face up like you said and drive to the hoop in a way very few 7fters could, but I never really saw him back guys down in the post like Duncan did and that's not a knock-on David because very few guys could play a back to the basket game like Duncan could. It was very rare to see David do it. David's game was predicated from operating from the top of the key and shooting his great mid-range shot or slashing to the hoop for a layup or a dunk.
Sooo...your bar for not being good in the post is...not being as good as Timmy.

I guess we have to agree to disagree.

[benefactor]

Who peed in your wheaties, sir?
I mean, you're a faggot.

Hope this helps.

[Obstructed_View]

...while also being the front-runner for DPOY and averaging 11 rebounds and 3.8 blocks per game.

I'm not saying Wemby is better than Timmy, but yes...he is a force to be reckoned with even if he isn't putting up 30 a game
I've said that Wemby is the best player I've seen since Jordan and he's younger than all the guys he's compared to by at least a couple of years.

[timtonymanu]

I love Castle but lol @ Castle > Manu.

[timtonymanu]

Timmy would also frustrate Wemby in the paint that all Wemby would do is start forcing 3s.

[Knoxxx]

I mean, you're a faggot.

Hope this helps.

Very helpful!

[Knoxxx]

Timmy would also frustrate Wemby in the paint that all Wemby would do is start forcing 3s.

As if someone named timtonymanu is going to be able to participate in an unbiased new Spurs big 3 discussion…

[timtonymanu]

As if someone named timtonymanu is going to be able to participate in an unbiased new Spurs big 3 discussion…

Don’t call me out because you came up with such a shit take. Like bene said, shut up faggot.

[Knoxxx]

Don’t call me out because you came up with such a shit take. Like bene said, shut up faggot.

I called you out for you weak take, genius. Not the other way around.

[timtonymanu]

I called you out for you weak take, genius. Not the other way around.

Nah this thread backfired and now you’re just finding ways to deflect so again shut up faggot

[timtonymanu]

:cry feel free to put = instead of > :cry. It’s possible Wemby passes Timmy but you know damn well people will call you out when you claim stupid shit like Castle > Manu already when Castle’s career has just started.

[Atl Spur]

This is the last year we have a chance to play in the lottery pool….so soft tank. Next year is the time to start the new dynasty.

[Atl Spur]

Castle has a chance to be special! He’s built differently than most rookies.

[Knoxxx]

Castle has a chance to be special! He’s built differently than most rookies.

Chris Mullin turned the team over to Castle with the quickness, picked up on the Alpha right away.

[hater]

Fox > Parker
Castle > Manu
Wemby > Duncan

Now just to assemble the supporting cast. And we are perfectly positioned to navigate the complicated salary cap rules and penalties.

(if I am to be assailed feel free to substitute the > with = signs and I won't argue. I was basing those mostly on potential, not career achievements obviously.)

No

Wemby is not better than Duncan yet

No

Castle is not better than Manu. In playoffs. Yet

Fox is most definitely not better than Parker anywhere.

I give OP a core of 4 out of 10

A weak attempt

[Russ]

No

Wemby is not better than Duncan yet

No

Castle is not better than Manu. In playoffs. Yet

Fox is most definitely not better than Parker anywhere.

I give OP a core of 4 out of 10

A weak attempt

Please remember the average age of those new three is 22.6 years.

[goliath]

Wemby is great and has a bright future but is a long way from Tim. Wemby could win 4 titles, 2 finals mvp, 1 mvp, 14 all star games, 9 all nba 1st teams, 2 all nba 2nd teams, 1 all nba 3rd team, 14 all
NBA defensive teams and still be behind Tim on each one.

[Knoxxx]

No

Wemby is not better than Duncan yet

No

Castle is not better than Manu. In playoffs. Yet

Fox is most definitely not better than Parker anywhere.

I give OP a core of 4 out of 10

A weak attempt

Fox was the one I thought was the most obvious. Tell me again what TP did better than Fox?

[slick'81]

Wemby is great and has a bright future but is a long way from Tim. Wemby could win 4 titles, 2 finals mvp, 1 mvp, 14 all star games, 9 all nba 1st teams, 2 all nba 2nd teams, 1 all nba 3rd team, 14 all
NBA defensive teams and still be behind Tim on each one.


wembys is probably a better defender then timmy but no where near the offensive force

[SpursBills]

Still crazy how underrated Duncan's defense was to this day, and even crazier that Wemby's got pretty good odds to exceed him in that department. Data doesn't go back far enough to look at Hakeem or Bill Russell, but he's got everyone else beat in both peak and longevity.

https://i.postimg.cc/gj5WZSc4/Duncan-DPOY.png

[Spursfanfromafar]

Still crazy how underrated Duncan's defense was to this day, and even crazier that Wemby's got pretty good odds to exceed him in that department. Data doesn't go back far enough to look at Hakeem or Bill Russell, but he's got everyone else beat in both peak and longevity.

https://i.postimg.cc/gj5WZSc4/Duncan-DPOY.png

The dip and take off at age 35 for Duncan. That bit Ammaaazing. If I recall correctly, that was when the pick and roll, guard era took off ..remember Duncan struggling against Nash and Dragic's Suns in 09 or 2010. It is to Duncan's credit that he evolved, becoming brilliant in drop coverage even as the Spurs got the services of their best wing duo in decades in Green and Nephew. The duo's perimeter defense helped Duncan hone his rim protection to reach superlative levels again and made him as effective a defender as he was in his prime.

I really miss TD. He was the personification of the evolving superstar. No one aged as well as he did and which is why I felt he was better than Magic and Bird who had relatively shorter careers in the all time list.

[John B]

Skills set Wemby has more than Timmy, but Timmy knew how to win games at a young age. Wemby will win battles against Timmy, but Timmy will win the war. Because as somebody said, right now Wemby is still all over the place.

Tony and Fox. Fox is the better scorer, but Tony is the better Alpha. Tony has that mamba mentality growing up. He always thinks he’s the best on the court despite being the shortest. He has that “A” hole cutthroat personality. If he weren’t a Spur, I think he’d be hated. He’s really lucky he got teammates like Timmy and Manu who were very unselfish, and a strict coach as Pop who straightened Tony early, because in another environment he would’ve been a showboat. But I love Tony. He’s ambitious and that also helped the Spurs cause. But among the three, he would’ve been the easiest to replace, like maybe by a Jason Kidd.

Manu >>>> Castle. I love Castle and he’ll be great. But it’s not fair to compare him to the most beloved Spur, my all-time favorite player. I mean, Timmy is right now the Spurs GOAT (time will tell if Wemby will surpass him), but Manu unselfishness, bravado and 100% effort day-in and day-out. The guy was just throwing his body out there for the team. His defense, his euro-step, his wicked baseline passes. Manu was a Roman god with his long hair!

I really like the current roster except Sochan at 4. I’m sorry but he’s too short and cannot shoot. Markkanen would’ve been great and I think would’ve completed the whole (plus minor tweaking in the bench). I really like Danny Wolf as a very smart player in the mold of Diaw/Splitter, a solid 7 footer with true NBA body who can space Wemby. He’s a junior and contributes on day 1. The Spurs can get another athletic 6’8, but I would want one of their two picks to be Danny Wolf. Watching him play, he contributes to every facet of the game, defense, manning the paint, blocking shots, posting, pushing the ball, facilitating, making the correct passes, can score in many ways. I’d be happy if the Spurs draft him.

[RC_Drunkford]

for everybody comparing Castle to Manu, it seems like Manu coaches him quite a bit. At least when I was in Paris Manu was on the sidelines during Castle's warm ups. I don't know if that's a regular occassion, but he's definitely in his ear.

[cutewizard]

I'm loving what I'm seeing from Castle from these cross-court, whipped skip passes to find guys open for 3. Fox does the same thing and Wemby does to at times (though his are a little out of control at times but he such a unique angle for these passes that once he just settles down a little bit they'll be just as deadly). The meta roster build with these 3 seems pretty clear to me... we need to pair them with two 6'8"+ true 3&D wings who can rebound. Sorry to everyone who loves Sochan and Devin... but they don't fit that. Now, they can be excellent bench pieces (though Vassell is overpaid to be a bench piece), but they simply don't fit the ideal build with our Big 3.

So who does fit? (All the percentiles below are from CraftedNBA.com.

Ferraris (will be costly to get, maybe even impossible, so maybe you just keep dreaming)



Trey Murphy III - 6'8" with a 7' wingspan. 83rd percentile TS%, 95th percentile SQ Index, 69th percentile DRB, 78th percentile Rim Frequency defender, 84th percentile defensive versatility, but only 35th percentile in Crafted DPM.



OG Anunoby - 6'7" with a 7'3" wingspan. 72nd percentile TS%, 65th percentile SQ Index, 71st percentile DRB, 69th percentile BLKpct, 91st percentile defensive versatility, 91st percentile Crafted DPM



Toumani Camara - 6'7" with a 7'1" wingspan. 43rd percentile TS%, 46th percentile SQ Index, 67th percentile DRB, 94th percentile raDTOV, 99th percentile defensive versatility, 87th percentile Crafted DPM. Only a 35.6% 3P shooter this year, but still young which is why I have listed in the Ferrari category. Basically, I don't think POR is letting this guy go.
Pascal Siakam - 6'8" with a 7'3" wingspan. 82nd percentile TS%, 90th percentile DRB, 51st percentile ORB, 94th percentile CraftedOPM, 64th percentile CraftedDPM. We don't need someone of his stature in this role, but he'd fit



BMWs (very nice, and probably attainable if you want to pay the price)



Herb Jones - 6'6" with 7'0" wingspan. 73rd percentile TS%, 76th percentile SQ Index, 98th percentile offensive portability, 93rd percentile deflection rate, 96th percentile raDTOV, 59th percentile DRB, 98th percentile defensive versatility, 97th percentile Crafted DPM. Kind of the flip side of the coin from Trey Murphy who is the elite offensive 3&D, Herb is the elite defensive 3&D
Jaden McDaniels - 6'9" with a 6'11" wingspan. 49th percentile TS%, 51st percentile SQ index. 78th percentile in deflections and raDTOV, only 35th percentile DRB, but 78th percentile Rim Defense and 90th percentile defensive versatility. 88th percentile CraftedDPM. Not as good of a shooter... kind of a worse version of Herb in my opinion. Also kind of overpaid IMO
PJ Washington - 6'7" with a 7'3" wingspan. Subpar offensive metrics but very good defensively and on the boards. Has mostly shot well from 3 in his career but up and downs



Toyotas (dependable, probably gettable without too much pain?)




Derrick Jones Jr. Solid defender. Not a great rebounder. Decent shooter but not great
Haywood Highsmith. A little small (6'5") but would be a sneaky get. Pretty good shooter, but limited offensively beyond that. Decent to good rebounder. Really good defender.
Tobias Harris. Not the best shooter as of late, but good defender and really good on the defensive boards.
Isaac Okoro. Undersized. Good shooter, good defender, okay on the glass. Plays smart.
Jake LaRavia. My guy. Good shooter, okay defender, but 91st percentile in deflections, 75th percentile in Rim Defense Frequency and 74th percentile defensive versatility. Not a great DRB guy, but 94th percentile ORB. Maybe something to work with there.
Dean Wade. Here is a sneaky one. Pretty decent shooter but 89th percentile DRB and 98th percentile CraftedDPM. Has a 99th percentile 3PAr, so he's used to the role of just standing around and waiting for the open 3.




-------------------------------------------

thanks good Sir,. excellent analysis

[cutewizard]

Spursss new big three, save us from the desert , hehehehe


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mGF4sveUmn8

[cutewizard]

Wemby
Castle
Fox

>>>>>>>>>>> bring us to Life!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[CGD]

Fahrenheit 451

I mean we’re about to start burning books in this country soon, so why not!

[TD 21]

Tim was one of the few guys I ever saw hold his own physically against prime Shaq. I was always amazed at how he could box out Shaq underneath the basket for rebounds and also show great resistance to Shaq when Shaq tried to back him down in the post. Duncan didn't have the bulging muscles like David did, so people forget or don't realize how deceptively strong he was, but Duncan was ridiculously strong. He could easily move guys underneath the basket when he would post them up.

I recall once Nowitzki being asked if he could have one skill from another player, what would he want and he said Duncan's base.

Attributable somewhat to genetics obviously, but also growing up a swimmer.



Age 21 Tim played in 1997-1998, league average points per game 95.6, EFG% of 0.478 and TS% of .524
Age 21 Wemby in 2024-2025, league average points per game 113.4, EFG% of 0.541 and TS% of 0.574

As useful as advanced stats are, too often they don't contextualize for era and because of that they're often used out of context.

Give Duncan the rules/spacing of this era and two healthy knees for longer than he had them and his counting/advanced stats would have been at the level of Jokic, Antetokounmpo, Embiid, Davis and eventually Wembanyama.

[SpursBills]

I recall once Nowitzki being asked if he could have one skill from another player, what would he want and he said Duncan's base.

Attributable somewhat to genetics obviously, but also growing up a swimmer.




As useful as advanced stats are, too often they don't contextualize for era and because of that, they're often used out of context.

Give Duncan the rules/spacing of this era and two healthy knees for longer than he had them and his counting/advanced stats would have been at the level of Jokic, Antetokounmpo, Embiid, Davis and eventually Wembanyama.

I think you're agreeing with my point - that it's misleading to use stats like TS% or EFG% to compare players of different eras, and that those numbers really need to be scaled to league average at that time to account for different styles of play and rule changes over different eras

[ambchang]

Sooo...your bar for not being good in the post is...not being as good as Timmy.

I guess we have to agree to disagree.

I’m probably the biggest Robinson fan but he was known not to have a good back to basket game, he spent a summer trying to put a hook shot in but that never really worked. He had a nice spin for a loo catch because of his speed and athleticism , he had a semi reliable turnaround jumper but his post up game was lacking. His main thing was high post, pivot, face the basket for either a jump shot or drive o the basket for a foul. His lack of post game was a main reason his stats fall off a cliff in the postseason because he was constantly getting doubled and tripled so he can’t drive to the basket at all and when he faces Utah the refs won’t call anything on pedo (like robinson was called for a foul while getting a concussion by getting elbowed in the head).

Hakeem, Ewing, rik smits, even Brad Dougherty and Ring seikaly had a better post game. Can’t say the same about mourning or mutombo because those guys don’t have much offensive game to begin with.


I recalled robinson admitting to not getting the feel for post game himself. He’s really a SF playing centre his entire career.

[Obstructed_View]

I’m probably the biggest Robinson fan but he was known not to have a good back to basket game, he spent a summer trying to put a hook shot in but that never really worked. He had a nice spin for a loo catch because of his speed and athleticism , he had a semi reliable turnaround jumper but his post up game was lacking. His main thing was high post, pivot, face the basket for either a jump shot or drive o the basket for a foul. His lack of post game was a main reason his stats fall off a cliff in the postseason because he was constantly getting doubled and tripled so he can’t drive to the basket at all and when he faces Utah the refs won’t call anything on pedo (like robinson was called for a foul while getting a concussion by getting elbowed in the head).

Hakeem, Ewing, rik smits, even Brad Dougherty and Ring seikaly had a better post game. Can’t say the same about mourning or mutombo because those guys don’t have much offensive game to begin with.


I recalled robinson admitting to not getting the feel for post game himself. He’s really a SF playing centre his entire career.
This is a stupid post. You don't know what the fuck you're talking about, as usual. Lmao you blame Robinson's post game for the team losing in the postseason. Jesus.

Your bullshit might work for someone who wasn't an adult living in San Antonio from Robinson's rookie year. Take it to someone else.

[Spurminator]

Yeah no, Wemby is an unbelievable prospect but Tim was dominating playoff games at 21.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FB7XD8km7L0

I'm clearly subbing in a < for Wemby vs Tim right now and it's no diss to Victor because Tim is arguably a top 5 player who was also better at the same age.

I really do sometimes wonder what Wemby's offensive numbers would look like if he was used in the same 4-down scheme though.

[baseline bum]

I really do sometimes wonder what Wemby's offensive numbers would look like if he was used in the same 4-down scheme though.

They'd be lousy, Wemby's not a dump it to him on the left block kind of player.

[Knoxxx]

This is a stupid post. You don't know what the fuck you're talking about, as usual. Lmao you blame Robinson's post game for the team losing in the postseason. Jesus.

Your bullshit might work for someone who wasn't an adult living in San Antonio from Robinson's rookie year. Take it to someone else.

His post was accurate and why it triggered you to curse a blue streak along with revisionist history is puzzling.

[Spurminator]

They'd be lousy, Wemby's not a dump it to him on the left block kind of player.

That's more about usage than ability, though.

https://www.statmuse.com/nba/ask/tim-duncan-career-shot-chart
https://www.statmuse.com/nba/ask/wembanyama-shot-chart

I could buy that his numbers might not be better, but a player like Wemby is simply not going to ever have awful numbers if you're putting the ball in his hands nearly every possession, regardless of where he is on the floor.

[ambchang]

This is a stupid post. You don't know what the fuck you're talking about, as usual. Lmao you blame Robinson's post game for the team losing in the postseason. Jesus.

Your bullshit might work for someone who wasn't an adult living in San Antonio from Robinson's rookie year. Take it to someone else.

This is the most convincing post I’ve ever read on spurstalk, full of backup arguments and well thought out points. I’m convinced.

I will just ignore years of watching Robinson and how he was routinely doubled and tripled and can’t score in the post over those. Or how it was basically common knowledge that robinsons game was based on his super human athelticism, but he was criticized for years for not developing a post game, or even himself saying he couldn’t do it well enough.

Your emotional lash out like a whiney little 4 year old is so convincing I will yield and admit Robison was a superb post player.

Edit: also, the amazing arguments you made will make me rethink my own post that has nothing to do with robinsons lack of post game causing the spurs to lose in the post season.

Edit 2: you must be the only adult living in San Antonio since robinsons rookie year, because it’s about the first time I’ve ever heard of someone saying robinsons post game being elite.

[cutewizard]

[QUOTE=ambchang;11206993]I’m probably the biggest Robinson fan but he was known not to have a good back to basket game, he spent a summer trying to put a hook shot in but that never really worked. He had a nice spin for a loo catch because of his speed and athleticism , he had a semi reliable turnaround jumper but his post up game was lacking. His main thing was high post, pivot, face the basket for either a jump shot or drive o the basket for a foul. His lack of post game was a main reason his stats fall off a cliff in the postseason because he was constantly getting doubled and tripled so he can’t drive to the basket at all and when he faces Utah the refs won’t call anything on pedo (like robinson was called for a foul while getting a concussion by getting elbowed in the head).

Hakeem, Ewing, rik smits, even Brad Dougherty and Ring seikaly had a better post game. Can’t say the same about mourning or mutombo because those guys don’t have much offensive game to begin with.


I recalled robinson admitting to not getting the feel for post game himself. He’s really a SF playing centre his entire career.[/QUOTE

..............

In that sense, Robinson is a more muscular Wemby.....

Or Wemby is David with the three point shot?

[Gagnrath]

This is a stupid post. You don't know what the fuck you're talking about, as usual. Lmao you blame Robinson's post game for the team losing in the postseason. Jesus.

Your bullshit might work for someone who wasn't an adult living in San Antonio from Robinson's rookie year. Take it to someone else.
I was very young for most of the Robinson Spurs and the lack of supporting cast was more of an issue than Robinson's post game, that said other High end bigs of the Era were better at back to the basket backing people down. Robinson wasn't bad at it, but he wasn't an all time great at that either. What he had was great speed for his size pretty good handles, (for his size and era very good) and good strength. His back issues were a major limiting factor in his later career. It would have been really interesting seeing a different era Robinson, but in a lot of ways game wise Robinson was very comparable to Garnett in that he would and could be effective in the post and backing people down but his natural preference was to face up.

[Obstructed_View]

I was very young for most of the Robinson Spurs and the lack of supporting cast was more of an issue than Robinson's post game, that said other High end bigs of the Era were better at back to the basket backing people down. Robinson wasn't bad at it, but he wasn't an all time great at that either. What he had was great speed for his size pretty good handles, (for his size and era very good) and good strength. His back issues were a major limiting factor in his later career. It would have been really interesting seeing a different era Robinson, but in a lot of ways game wise Robinson was very comparable to Garnett in that he would and could be effective in the post and backing people down but his natural preference was to face up.
I agree almost completely with your points. My recollection is similar to yours.

Once more, I'm unsure how Robinson not being the greatest post player of all time or among the great centers of his era means he's a poor post player. I watched him post up great defenders. He was very good. He just did most of his damage facing up or on the fast break. He is one thousand times the back to basket player that Victor is.

It's a testament to the greatness of Victor that he puts up the numbers he does without a face up or post game. The league should be terrified of how dominant he is as a young raw player.

[cutewizard]

Spurs Classical Universe >>>

1) Duncan, Anchor
2) Manu, Heart and Soul
3) Parker, Motor



Spurs Hypermodern Universe >>>

1) Wemby, Air Force/ICBM
2) Fox, Swift Cavalry Strike Force
3) Castle, Heavy Infantry

Looking for our Fourth,
4) Cold blooded Assassin (3D Forward)