Future Spur: Maxime Raynaud

[scottspurs]

With the 14th pick in the 2025 NBA Draft the San Antonio Spurs select


Maxime Raynaud


I did a deep dive and I’m fairly certain if he is on the board he will be the pick at 14.


At 1st glance this may seem like a reach but I did a deeper dive and I think it is an appropriate pick.


1st off let me give you an evaluation of the 22-year old big man. At the combine he measured at 7’0 without shoes with a 7’1 wingspan and 9’2 standing reach. 236 lbs.


Averaged 20.2 pts and 10.6 rebounds at Stanford during his senior season. Shot 46.7% from the field, 34.7% from 3, and 77.0% from the line.


Came in 2nd behind Cooper Flagg for ACC player of the year. Pac-12 most improved player in 2024.


Came close to becoming the First Player in ACC history to lead the league in Points and Rebounding. 2nd in scoring, 1st in rebounding. The only other players in conference history that came close to this feat were Tim Duncan and Rasheed Wallace.


Very Durable never missed a game due to injury in College


Team Captain his senior season


2nd in NCAA with 25 double-doubles (Stanford single-season record) only behind Yaxel Lendeborg with 26


Offensive game: scores inside and out. Variety of post moves and uses both his left and right hand. Shows the ability to score at 3 different levels. Outside, mid-range and inside. Won’t shoot many mid range shots in the NBA but he can make them. Shot 34.7% from 3 his senior on 5.5 attempts per game. His 67 made 3’s rank 2nd all-time for a 7-footer in college basketball behind only Lauri Markkanen. Shows ability to put the ball on the ground and showed some playmaking ability with his 1.7 assists per game.


Defense: At first glance when you watch his tape he doesn’t come across as a good or bad defender. Very average. You look at the stats and he only averages 1.4 blocks per game. The further you get into the tape though the better he gets. I’ll touch on this later but he is very much a late bloomer. In March he averaged 2.7 blocks per game and showed some real talent guarding wings on the perimeter. Starts to switch onto guards and does really well. Uses his physicality and athleticism to force ball carriers to undesirable spots.


Overall I believe he has the talent to develop into a two-way player that affects both sides of the ball. He is by far the Highest IQ player in this draft.


Analytics: When I started running analytics on all the players in this draft a player that kept surprisingly popping up was none other than Mr. Raynaud for defense and offense


23rd in Box DBPR
50th in BPR
10th in PER
15th in Defensive Win Shares
22nd in Offensive Win Shares
17th in Win Shares
6th in WARP
25th in True Shooting %


Raynaud is very much a late bloomer and has a similar backstory to the greatest player in Spurs Franchise History. Yes, Tim Duncan. Raynaud only started playing basketball in middle school. He was a very talented swimmer that was one of the best of his age group. He only started playing basketball because his mother wanted him to play a team sport. Not very highly recruited he only really went to Stanford because he could pursue the highest levels of education but also play basketball. His parents were both biotech engineers. Raynaud focused on academic over athletics for most of his life. Like Timmy D he also spent 4 years in College.


Okay cool story but why would the Spurs pick him over much more highly touted prospects. Can’t they get him in the 2nd Round? Raynaud really impressed at the Combine and was the leader on the court for his team. If you watch the games you can clearly see and hear him on the court as he called out to other players where to be on offense and defense. His IQ is 2nd to none in this class. He will rise up draft boards. Will he rise up lottery levels. Probably not for most teams but the Spurs think differently. After potentially drafting Dylan Harper at 2 the Spurs FO may want to transition more to pro ready players. The Spurs biggest need? Well if you check the statistics the biggest glaring weakness last season was rebounding. The spurs ranked in the bottom of the league in almost every rebounding category. They will want to fix that this offseason and Raynaud, one the best rebounders in this class can definitely help.


Still not convinced the Spurs will pick him at 14? Well I have 2 more major reasons why they will. The 2 most important reasons possible. The most important people in the Spurs organization that will be Raynaud’s biggest sponsors/supporters to drafting him.


I’ll start with Sponsor 1a. Mitch Johnson-
The Spurs new Head Coach will want to leave his own mark and build the team that best supports his coaching style. I believe that style will be a team that is highly efficient on the offense. When Johnson played at Stanford the Lopez brothers described him as a Maestro on Offense. A genius when it came to running the offense from the point guard position. When the Spurs first drafted Victor Wembanyama rumors swirled that they wanted to pair him with a big man. No not Zach Collins. Brook Lopez. A big man that could stretch the floor from the 5 position. They tried to do it with Collins and he failed miserably. Last offseason rumors swirled that the Spurs were interested in Lauri Markkanen. Well Danny Ainge. lol Jazz how did that work out? Well now bring it back to this draft. Who is the best 3-pt shooting big in this class. Maxime Raynaud. With NBA spacing his 34% could skyrocket. NCAA basketball is a different breed that can make it hard for shooters. Especially 7-footers. With Mitch Johnson’s Stanford ties I believe he will be a huge supporter for drafting Raynaud. They will have all the information they need on him.




Sponsor 1b. Victor Wembanyama. Really good friends and former teammates. Played at Nanterre and with the French National team together. We all know Victor is very proud of his French heritage and has constantly supported the other French players coming into the league. He went to bat for his other former teammate Coulibaly when they both came out. Even said he was better than the Thompson twins and better than anyone coming out of college. Rumors swirled last year that the spurs would have drafted Tidjane Salaun last year had he been available with pick 8. Rumor was Wemby personally would have taken him under his wing. Raynaud and Wemby are very good friends. They play Chess together often. Raynaud’s grandfather was a Chess Champion in France. Both very highly educated. Both academically inclined. In an interview Raynaud said he goes to sleep at 10pm. Very similar to Wemby. A very mature 22 year old. In that same interview Raynaud talks about how he can play the 4 or 5 and references his on court chemistry with Wemby.


How will Raynaud fit with Spurs his rookie year? More than likely he will slide in as the backup 5 this next season. He will provide much needed rebounding and floor spacing. A connective role player off the bench. In future seasons as the late bloomer continues to develop he could become a running mate next to Victor. The Twin Eiffel Towers. The Check Mate Bros


Overall I believe Maxime Raynaud is a very competitive, athletic, high IQ basketball player that will understand his role and play his part on the court.


Is he who I would pick? At 14 No. Would you pick him? Probably not at 14. Does it matter? No. I don’t believe Queen, Maluach or Sorber will be on the board so I can live with it. Spurs will pick who they want and I believe this will be their guy.


So say hello to Future Spur Maxime Raynaud.

[RC_Drunkford]

I'd draft him in the low 20s, but not at 14

[cutewizard]

https://youtu.be/NyD3duYYSFo?si=1fNbLNJMWDQO8Zx5

[cutewizard]

https://youtu.be/pl8mu3E8FLk?si=tLrMedl9bj2t-JTU

[thOOdee]

https://youtu.be/NyD3duYYSFo?si=1fNbLNJMWDQO8Zx5


would agree as to passing the eye test. Coordination and movement seems really controlled for his height. Maybe even more so than maluach. Not sure about his strength though for the position. Rather spurs move down @38 than take him at 14 if the spurs have the confidence.

[CGD]

I'd draft him in the low 20s, but not at 14

Agree, like if they trade Orlando 14 for 19/26. I’d consider a trade back like that if Bryant, Sorber, and Liam are gone at 14.

[bluebellmaniac]

With the 14th pick in the 2025 NBA Draft the San Antonio Spurs select


Maxime Raynaud


I did a deep dive and I’m fairly certain if he is on the board he will be the pick at 14.


At 1st glance this may seem like a reach but I did a deeper dive and I think it is an appropriate pick.


1st off let me give you an evaluation of the 22-year old big man. At the combine he measured at 7’0 without shoes with a 7’1 wingspan and 9’2 standing reach. 236 lbs.


Averaged 20.2 pts and 10.6 rebounds at Stanford during his senior season. Shot 46.7% from the field, 34.7% from 3, and 77.0% from the line.


Came in 2nd behind Cooper Flagg for ACC player of the year. Pac-12 most improved player in 2024.


Came close to becoming the First Player in ACC history to lead the league in Points and Rebounding. 2nd in scoring, 1st in rebounding. The only other players in conference history that came close to this feat were Tim Duncan and Rasheed Wallace.


Very Durable never missed a game due to injury in College


Team Captain his senior season


2nd in NCAA with 25 double-doubles (Stanford single-season record) only behind Yaxel Lendeborg with 26


Offensive game: scores inside and out. Variety of post moves and uses both his left and right hand. Shows the ability to score at 3 different levels. Outside, mid-range and inside. Won’t shoot many mid range shots in the NBA but he can make them. Shot 34.7% from 3 his senior on 5.5 attempts per game. His 67 made 3’s rank 2nd all-time for a 7-footer in college basketball behind only Lauri Markkanen. Shows ability to put the ball on the ground and showed some playmaking ability with his 1.7 assists per game.


Defense: At first glance when you watch his tape he doesn’t come across as a good or bad defender. Very average. You look at the stats and he only averages 1.4 blocks per game. The further you get into the tape though the better he gets. I’ll touch on this later but he is very much a late bloomer. In March he averaged 2.7 blocks per game and showed some real talent guarding wings on the perimeter. Starts to switch onto guards and does really well. Uses his physicality and athleticism to force ball carriers to undesirable spots.


Overall I believe he has the talent to develop into a two-way player that affects both sides of the ball. He is by far the Highest IQ player in this draft.


Analytics: When I started running analytics on all the players in this draft a player that kept surprisingly popping up was none other than Mr. Raynaud for defense and offense


23rd in Box DBPR
50th in BPR
10th in PER
15th in Defensive Win Shares
22nd in Offensive Win Shares
17th in Win Shares
6th in WARP
25th in True Shooting %


Raynaud is very much a late bloomer and has a similar backstory to the greatest player in Spurs Franchise History. Yes, Tim Duncan. Raynaud only started playing basketball in middle school. He was a very talented swimmer that was one of the best of his age group. He only started playing basketball because his mother wanted him to play a team sport. Not very highly recruited he only really went to Stanford because he could pursue the highest levels of education but also play basketball. His parents were both biotech engineers. Raynaud focused on academic over athletics for most of his life. Like Timmy D he also spent 4 years in College.


Okay cool story but why would the Spurs pick him over much more highly touted prospects. Can’t they get him in the 2nd Round? Raynaud really impressed at the Combine and was the leader on the court for his team. If you watch the games you can clearly see and hear him on the court as he called out to other players where to be on offense and defense. His IQ is 2nd to none in this class. He will rise up draft boards. Will he rise up lottery levels. Probably not for most teams but the Spurs think differently. After potentially drafting Dylan Harper at 2 the Spurs FO may want to transition more to pro ready players. The Spurs biggest need? Well if you check the statistics the biggest glaring weakness last season was rebounding. The spurs ranked in the bottom of the league in almost every rebounding category. They will want to fix that this offseason and Raynaud, one the best rebounders in this class can definitely help.


Still not convinced the Spurs will pick him at 14? Well I have 2 more major reasons why they will. The 2 most important reasons possible. The most important people in the Spurs organization that will be Raynaud’s biggest sponsors/supporters to drafting him.


I’ll start with Sponsor 1a. Mitch Johnson-
The Spurs new Head Coach will want to leave his own mark and build the team that best supports his coaching style. I believe that style will be a team that is highly efficient on the offense. When Johnson played at Stanford the Lopez brothers described him as a Maestro on Offense. A genius when it came to running the offense from the point guard position. When the Spurs first drafted Victor Wembanyama rumors swirled that they wanted to pair him with a big man. No not Zach Collins. Brook Lopez. A big man that could stretch the floor from the 5 position. They tried to do it with Collins and he failed miserably. Last offseason rumors swirled that the Spurs were interested in Lauri Markkanen. Well Danny Ainge. lol Jazz how did that work out? Well now bring it back to this draft. Who is the best 3-pt shooting big in this class. Maxime Raynaud. With NBA spacing his 34% could skyrocket. NCAA basketball is a different breed that can make it hard for shooters. Especially 7-footers. With Mitch Johnson’s Stanford ties I believe he will be a huge supporter for drafting Raynaud. They will have all the information they need on him.




Sponsor 1b. Victor Wembanyama. Really good friends and former teammates. Played at Nanterre and with the French National team together. We all know Victor is very proud of his French heritage and has constantly supported the other French players coming into the league. He went to bat for his other former teammate Coulibaly when they both came out. Even said he was better than the Thompson twins and better than anyone coming out of college. Rumors swirled last year that the spurs would have drafted Tidjane Salaun last year had he been available with pick 8. Rumor was Wemby personally would have taken him under his wing. Raynaud and Wemby are very good friends. They play Chess together often. Raynaud’s grandfather was a Chess Champion in France. Both very highly educated. Both academically inclined. In an interview Raynaud said he goes to sleep at 10pm. Very similar to Wemby. A very mature 22 year old. In that same interview Raynaud talks about how he can play the 4 or 5 and references his on court chemistry with Wemby.


How will Raynaud fit with Spurs his rookie year? More than likely he will slide in as the backup 5 this next season. He will provide much needed rebounding and floor spacing. A connective role player off the bench. In future seasons as the late bloomer continues to develop he could become a running mate next to Victor. The Twin Eiffel Towers. The Check Mate Bros


Overall I believe Maxime Raynaud is a very competitive, athletic, high IQ basketball player that will understand his role and play his part on the court.


Is he who I would pick? At 14 No. Would you pick him? Probably not at 14. Does it matter? No. I don’t believe Queen, Maluach or Sorber will be on the board so I can live with it. Spurs will pick who they want and I believe this will be their guy.


So say hello to Future Spur Maxime Raynaud.

You had me at "Highest IQ". I'm such a sucker for smart players.

Send in the card, they're calling for #14.

[Dejounte]

This would be a Primo level reach tbh

[vander]

I'd rather have a 21032 first round pick

[Atl Spur]

This would be a Primo level reach tbh

Not really being he’s a decorated known commodity. Don’t pander ….or do.

[RC_Drunkford]

He‘s older though so 14 is still a reach. He was mocked in the 2nd round and shot up boards due to having a great combine. You could get a similar player in Kalkbrenner at 28-32

[Frenchfred]

His 3-point shooting form is really unorthodox, not sure if he can improve his percentage. Even though he seems to be able to play with his back to the basket, he doesn’t seem capable of backing other players down. But it seems to have good footwork and he rebounds well, which ultimately is what the Spurs need.

[jjspur]

I like his skillset and he seems like a player that could help the spurs in a position on need, just not at 14. There are several players there, that will be available with a much higher upside. If the spurs trade back into the early to mid 20's, then maybe its possible. There is no need to reach especially in this draft where there are plenty of good players available early on.

[scottspurs]

I agree with everyone that says this would be a bit of a reach. That said at some point the Spurs are going to want to start drafting more ready made prospects. At pick #2 you obviously have to do with the best player available. More than likely that will be 19 year old Dylan Harper. Do the Spurs really want to draft yet another 19 year old at pick 14? Regardless of which 19 year old they draft at 14 that player won’t be able to crack the rotation for at least a year or 2. They will be more of a project.

They tried that with Branham and Wesley and it’s not really planning out. It made sense at the time because you were still in the tear down phase. Now the Spurs are aspiring for the playoffs. You need to build a legit rotation in order to make that happen. Not add another developmental piece. Carter Bryant, Noa Essengue, Will Riley or Asa Newell won’t crack the rotation this next season. Do they have higher upside? Yes, but you can make a case that Raynaud is getting better as well since he is such a late bloomer. Getting better and averaged 20 and 10. The Spurs will definitely take a strong look at that.

Cedric Coward, Nique Clifford, Yaxel Lendeborg (if he stays in draft), Walter Clayton Jr, Kam Jones, Rasheer Fleming and Danny Wolf also fit this mold but you could argue Raynaud is a player that best fits the Spurs. Coward’s production is with a small sample size because he got hurt. Nique Clifford makes a ton of sense but at a position that is less of a need. Yaxel Lendeborg would provide rebounding and shooting as well but he is even older that Raynaud at 23 and is only 6’8 compared to Maxime’s 7 foot. Walter Clayton and Kam Jones will be solid pros but make no sense if the Spurs draft Harper. Rasheer Fleming is worrisome because the shot may not be real and he played against questionable competition. Danny Wolf I’ve warmed up to but he needs to have the ball in his hands to unlock his full potential and is nowhere near the shooter Raynaud is.

Raynaud is a way better version to what the Warriors got in Quentin Post last season. Not a very sexy pick but highly effective and able to crack the rotation. He won’t make it to pick 38. The production and skill level are to good. Hansen Yang is also rising up draft boards. Ryan Kalkbrenner will probably go before pick 38 probably the perfect fit for Boston who will lose some guys. Some team will fall in love with Johni Broome. The Spurs could get wiped out at Center if they wait. Pick 38 probably won’t be who we expect. The Spurs like using that pick on someone that will sign a two way. You could sign someone in free agency but they will only be a bridge player. The Spurs need size and rebounding.

The Spurs need rebounding. Teams are starting to use double bigs more often. Watch the playoffs. Spurs are not making the playoffs next year with the current big situation. They will get pushed around with Harrison Barnes at the 4. Rebounding and size must be added. Why not draft a guy that can bring that but also space the floor

[scottspurs]

That said if Queen, Maluach or Sorber make it to 14 I would be disappointed if they were not the pick. They have way higher upside. Spurs need some dogs that can bang down low though

[John B]

The French Connection is real.

[drpill]

Spurs absolutely need players who can provide size, shooting, and basketball IQ. Any player that can reliably give them all of these should be prominent on their list. With Harper on the team the focus clearly has to be on wings and bigs. Raynaud seems like an interesting and Spursy pick, and if it will make Wemby happy to have his chess partner on the team I'm all for it -- as long as he is actually a useful player as well. There are some intriguing wings around that spot in the draft and it might be disappointing to pass on them in favour of a clear reach. But perhaps they can find someone for the wing spot who is less of a developmental project, via trades or free agency.

[cd98]

No reason to spend more than a second round pick on him, especially with the potential talent around the 14th pick.

[ginobilized]

I could see this if the Spurs trade back to the end of the 1st round/early 2nd round and add a future pick for the war chest.
Reynard with the 26th-32nd pick sounds pretty workable. Brooklyn might be in play here.

Either way, I doubt the Spurs use the 14th pick this draft.

[John B]

I mentioned Raynaud on one of my post as having a great show at the Combine. And I suspect he’s a potential candidate with the Wemby connection. The Saluan and Golly-bally was real. And based on recent draft picks where Spurs heavily relied on performance at the Combine. He definitely addresses the need at mobile big. But there are better choices at 14 I think. But he’s a strong candidate for sure.

[thOOdee]

That said if Queen, Maluach or Sorber make it to 14 I would be disappointed if they were not the pick. They have way higher upside. Spurs need some dogs that can bang down low though

I just don't see one of them not being there at 14. Plus players like essengue and flemming i find more appeal (maybe even wolf). If the spurs see so much value however, I wouldn't mind maybe spurs trading back Boston's pick swap for their 28th pick. It's not a lock but chances would be more substantial at getting raynaud atleast. Or the best available big.

[LeBowen]

I just don't see one of them not being there at 14. Plus players like essengue and flemming i find more appeal (maybe even wolf). If the spurs see so much value however, I wouldn't mind maybe spurs trading back Boston's pick swap for their 28th pick. It's not a lock but chances would be more substantial at getting raynaud atleast. Or the best available big.

Hawks and Bulls are picking right before us, both teams need rim protection.

[rjv]

if mcneeley and sober are both off the board, i'd take raynaud over wolf, and maybe even coward, especially if the spurs could trade down.

[GAustex]

Not really being he’s a decorated known commodity. Don’t pander ….or do.
The putrid stench of Miss Cleo past prognostications precedes you

[thOOdee]

Hawks and Bulls are picking right before us, both teams need rim protection.

You can even add kalkbrenner to the list of availables whose numbers aren't that far off. He even looks to have a more sturdier frame. I will say I'm more on board of the necessity of a shootingforward/guard as a priority as opposed to a center because i think plugging the right piece will require a longer learning curve for whoever that is oppose to a center, but if the spurs can use one of their assets to better their 38 pick with eyes on a bigman, I'm all about it.

[Pauleta14]

100% Spurs material and close friend of Wemby

He can shoot/stretch, defend and a lot more mobile than expected as shown in the combine

I'd take him with the 14th

[Limguogolo]

It would be perfect timing. For a first pick, the choice is made around the best available potential. For a second, around the best player available. And this seems to me especially valid for contender teams. Are the Spurs now a playoff team?


The best possible comparison in my opinion would be the Lakers' choice last year of Konnect (I don't remember how it's spelled). Old, but the best player available capable of being immediately impactful.


Of course, last year, at pick 14, that was precisely where we expected Konnect, from memory. And even if Raynaud seems to be climbing in mocks, it still seems high.


The question that probably arises is not whether the Spurs would be interested. But if they are interested in another player at the time of the 14th pick.


I was the first lawyer to associate Victor with another Frenchman, like Sarr, like Salaün, even Yabusele. But Raynaud already seems better to me than Sarr and Salaün. In a healthy environment, an intelligent player will necessarily adapt much better. So he is already better, but in my opinion he still has room for improvement. While Sarr and Salaün operate among children's playgrounds or gang backyards, it could be that by combining two chess players the silver and black turns into a chessboard.


Regarding his defense, you shouldn't see everything through the blocks. I watched his last college games. He is very impressive vocally. How that would translate with other teammates remains to be seen, but when you have Sochan and Keldon Johnson, I guess it helps.


I would also be impatient to see Raynaud associated with Mamukelashvili.


Last anecdotal point. Raynaud sounds like Reynaud, Émile Reynaud, one of the inventors of cinema (he maded the first preserved cartoon, Pauvre Pierrot). Austin has the oldest known photograph, I can't wait to see Maxime Raynaud presenting a 'film' by Émile Reynaud at the Alamo Mission...

[SpursBills]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aKm6jza27zw

Fun fact - in this now famous video of 16 year old Wemby playing 2 v 2 against Gobert, Raynaud is actually the guy he's playing with against Gobert and Vincent Poirier

[rascal]

100% Spurs material and close friend of Wemby

He can shoot/stretch, defend and a lot more mobile than expected as shown in the combine

I'd take him with the 14th

Moves are awkward and slow.

Spurs will have better options at 14.

[rascal]

I just don't see one of them not being there at 14. Plus players like essengue and flemming i find more appeal (maybe even wolf). If the spurs see so much value however, I wouldn't mind maybe spurs trading back Boston's pick swap for their 28th pick. It's not a lock but chances would be more substantial at getting raynaud atleast. Or the best available big.

No keep that Boston pick swap. Raynaud is nothing special to trade any asset for.

If he wasn't French there wouldn't even be any interest in him.

[Manu&Duncan fan]

At age 22, he only shoots 3s at less than 35%.

Not sure how much improvement he can make.

I would rather trade down for 2 picks - one for him and one for Fleming.

Double insurance.

[scottspurs]

At age 22, he only shoots 3s at less than 35%.

Not sure how much improvement he can make.

I would rather trade down for 2 picks - one for him and one for Fleming.

Double insurance.

Fleming was a sit in the corner guy in college. Raynaud was the focal point of his teams offense at Stanford. Much harder to get up shots when opposing defenses are focused on stopping you. We won’t get that level of attention in the NBA. I’m not saying Raynaud will be better than Fleming or vice versa. All I’m saying is percentages don’t always tell the story. College basketball is much different than the NBA style wise. Sometimes you have to look beyond the numbers. Production is important. Context is also important. Level of competition is also important. You have to piece everything together

[Manu&Duncan fan]

Fleming was a sit in the corner guy in college. Raynaud was the focal point of his teams offense at Stanford. Much harder to get up shots when opposing defenses are focused on stopping you. We won’t get that level of attention in the NBA. I’m not saying Raynaud will be better than Fleming or vice versa. All I’m saying is percentages don’t always tell the story. College basketball is much different than the NBA style wise. Sometimes you have to look beyond the numbers. Production is important. Context is also important. Level of competition is also important. You have to piece everything together

Make sense!

Always love your analysis!

Thank you for sharing!

[Ice009]

100% Spurs material and close friend of Wemby

He can shoot/stretch, defend and a lot more mobile than expected as shown in the combine

I'd take him with the 14th

If I am remembering right, Bruno didn't think he's worth drafting and number 14.

[Degoat]

14 seems a bit too high for him but I’d consider it, we desperately need a backup big.

[Pauleta14]

Moves are awkward and slow.

Spurs will have better options at 14.

Look at the whole picture, not just one aspect.

As I said, his mobility is BETTER than expected, obviously not elite (yet)

But the package this kid brings is super rare, let's not underrate a very high IQ, a close relationship with Victor, a reliable 3pts shooting and already very good defensive mechanics that can only improve with time (and an elite work ethic).

He has the inside/out game we're looking for and the size and defensive presence to help when Vic rests or even being partnered with. Bring in a vet Big to mentor him (and Vic) and we're good.

Drafting a player is like choosing a partner, you don't chose her/him because of his/her qualities only but because you can deal with his/her bad/weak aspects.

His (lack of) mobility isn't the red flag I though it was, I find him about the same as Edey last summer and this one showed he can be more than useful

[Pauleta14]

If I am remembering right, Bruno didn't think he's worth drafting and number 14.

I didn't think either mainly bc of his alleged terrible mobility, I was told he's just a stick of the floor and what I've seen at the combine REALLY surprised me.

No idea about Bruno (who's opinion I value too)'s pov, maybe he's changed his mind too

I have a feeling the big man's game is slowly coming back in the NBA and we've even seen this season a few teams partnering 2 bigs. I think we need to draft one with the 14th

The in/out game with Wemby and another big that can shoot is what will make us unplayable

Not adding another player who can't shoot and needs the ball in his hands all the time (Giannis smh)

[Pauleta14]

14 seems a bit too high for him but I’d consider it, we desperately need a backup big.

Backup or starter

We quit too early on putting Vic with another big bc of Zollins's inability to score

Just imagine Vic and a big that can pass and shoot...

[Maddog]

No keep that Boston pick swap. Raynaud is nothing special to trade any asset for.

If he wasn't French there wouldn't even be any interest in him.

Will the Spurs have to pay a tariff on him (and Wemby)?

[Ice009]

I didn't think either mainly bc of his alleged terrible mobility, I was told he's just a stick of the floor and what I've seen at the combine REALLY surprised me.

No idea about Bruno (who's opinion I value too)'s pov, maybe he's changed his mind too

I have a feeling the big man's game is slowly coming back in the NBA and we've even seen this season a few teams partnering 2 bigs. I think we need to draft one with the 14th

The in/out game with Wemby and another big that can shoot is what will make us unplayable

Not adding another player who can't shoot and needs the ball in his hands all the time (Giannis smh)

Here's some of Bruno's thoughts about it a day or so ago. He had a couple of posts on it about a day or so ago :
https://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=303083&p=11243743&viewfull=1#post11243743
https://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=303083&p=11244056&viewfull=1#post11244056

[spurs10]

Promising!

[bluebellmaniac]

It would be perfect timing. For a first pick, the choice is made around the best available potential. For a second, around the best player available. And this seems to me especially valid for contender teams. Are the Spurs now a playoff team?


The best possible comparison in my opinion would be the Lakers' choice last year of Konnect (I don't remember how it's spelled). Old, but the best player available capable of being immediately impactful.


Of course, last year, at pick 14, that was precisely where we expected Konnect, from memory. And even if Raynaud seems to be climbing in mocks, it still seems high.


The question that probably arises is not whether the Spurs would be interested. But if they are interested in another player at the time of the 14th pick.


I was the first lawyer to associate Victor with another Frenchman, like Sarr, like Salaün, even Yabusele. But Raynaud already seems better to me than Sarr and Salaün. In a healthy environment, an intelligent player will necessarily adapt much better. So he is already better, but in my opinion he still has room for improvement. While Sarr and Salaün operate among children's playgrounds or gang backyards, it could be that by combining two chess players the silver and black turns into a chessboard.


Regarding his defense, you shouldn't see everything through the blocks. I watched his last college games. He is very impressive vocally. How that would translate with other teammates remains to be seen, but when you have Sochan and Keldon Johnson, I guess it helps.


I would also be impatient to see Raynaud associated with Mamukelashvili.


Last anecdotal point. Raynaud sounds like Reynaud, Émile Reynaud, one of the inventors of cinema (he maded the first preserved cartoon, Pauvre Pierrot). Austin has the oldest known photograph, I can't wait to see Maxime Raynaud presenting a 'film' by Émile Reynaud at the Alamo Mission...

Is this translated to English using Google Translate and copy paste here? Because it reads like it was

[RC_Drunkford]

At age 22, he only shoots 3s at less than 35%.

Not sure how much improvement he can make.

I would rather trade down for 2 picks - one for him and one for Fleming.

Double insurance.

the thing is Raynaud was the #1 option for his team though. That and NBA spacing being much better would likely mean he could shoot it at an higher percentage, because he'd be wide open more often than not. He's also NBA ready because he's older. I like him a lot, just think he'd be gettable in the early 20s. If the Spurs really want him just trade #14 to Brooklyn for #19 + #28. I'd rather go 3-and-D wing at 14, but wouldn't be mad with the pick.

[Bruno]

^^ Raynaud is an interesting prospect but I'm not that high on him because he is below average defensively.

To me, centers first quality should be a to be a dissuasive force defensively in the paint. When a team doesn't have that presence in the middle, playing good defense is so much more difficult.
In this draft I'm not as high as most on player like Derrick Queen or Maxime Raynaud. It's just that I find it very difficult to turn this kind of players into players who help to win games because their lack of defense hurt a team so much.

Saying that, I wish hard to be wrong about Raynaud. It's remarkable how he has been able to navigate between academics and playing basketball.

[Pauleta14]

Here's some of Bruno's thoughts about it a day or so ago. He had a couple of posts on it about a day or so ago :
https://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=303083&p=11243743&viewfull=1#post11243743
https://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=303083&p=11244056&viewfull=1#post11244056

I agree with him on the athleticism part but the Zollins comparison is tough, he's much better imo

He might be a late(r) pick depending on who's available and tbh I don't know much about that.

[Pauleta14]

It would be perfect timing. For a first pick, the choice is made around the best available potential. For a second, around the best player available. And this seems to me especially valid for contender teams. Are the Spurs now a playoff team?


The best possible comparison in my opinion would be the Lakers' choice last year of Konnect (I don't remember how it's spelled). Old, but the best player available capable of being immediately impactful.


Of course, last year, at pick 14, that was precisely where we expected Konnect, from memory. And even if Raynaud seems to be climbing in mocks, it still seems high.


The question that probably arises is not whether the Spurs would be interested. But if they are interested in another player at the time of the 14th pick.


I was the first lawyer to associate Victor with another Frenchman, like Sarr, like Salaün, even Yabusele. But Raynaud already seems better to me than Sarr and Salaün. In a healthy environment, an intelligent player will necessarily adapt much better. So he is already better, but in my opinion he still has room for improvement. While Sarr and Salaün operate among children's playgrounds or gang backyards, it could be that by combining two chess players the silver and black turns into a chessboard.


Regarding his defense, you shouldn't see everything through the blocks. I watched his last college games. He is very impressive vocally. How that would translate with other teammates remains to be seen, but when you have Sochan and Keldon Johnson, I guess it helps.


I would also be impatient to see Raynaud associated with Mamukelashvili.


Last anecdotal point. Raynaud sounds like Reynaud, Émile Reynaud, one of the inventors of cinema (he maded the first preserved cartoon, Pauvre Pierrot). Austin has the oldest known photograph, I can't wait to see Maxime Raynaud presenting a 'film' by Émile Reynaud at the Alamo Mission...

Missed that post...:toast

Again it depends on who's available at 14, but he fits a lot of our needs and type of profile/character

[Arguendo]

I'd draft him in the low 20s, but not at 14
Can't wait to see what Bkn does with their 4 1sts + 36, can't imagine they keep all 4 1sts.
Trading 14 and filler for 19 and 26/27, especially if BKN loves someone at 14.

Ideally that'd land us Bryant or Flemming or McNeely (tested almost identically to Harper on athletic tests, better than Edgecome at everything but Max Vert) and Raynaud if Spurs buy his D. Could still package 26 + 38 to move up a few spots to take Raynaud if worried or Wolf if he falls.

[Oscar DeLa]

I don't know what it is but this guy is taller than Flagg, played in the ACC and averaged more points, rebounds and blocks than Flagg. I'll take him

[Limguogolo]

Another French option next to Raynaud for pick 14 would be Noah Penda. The mocks prefer Essengue (which I don't like at all) and Traoré, but for a year, Penda's level has been exceptional.


Yesterday, for the last regular season game, he had the best evaluation of all the games played with 18 points, 13 rebounds, 8 assists and 3 blocks, shooting 2/4 at 3s. A few months ago, during he best French prospects game, he had already been the best player (next to a young PG of barely 16 years old who will undoubtedly be a top 10 in the draft one day).


If the Spurs feel they can acquire an interior on the market or via a trade, or if Raynaud has been pick higher (ah, salaünesque), Penda at 14# could be an interesting option.

He plays SF/PF. It's a sort of Batum, less high flyer (at the time), stronger, but already playing point forward. In his team (the same one from Batum), he runs the floor like a PG, he manages his teammates older than him. In his match yesterday, he rarely made the wrong choice, and in that, you can also compare him to Boris Diaw. He does everything on the floor, and in Spurs tradition, he is only bad at FT.

Still high at 14, but between Traoré and Essengue, I take Penda. (But I would also take Perrin - who played little in his team and who was one of the leaders of the same young French team as Penda and Risacher - before Essengue). His value can still move up as his team is in the PO (not Traoré's one).

As for Raynaud's defense, I prefer a big who doesn't jump, but who puts his hands high and can box out, rather than a Sarr who jumps on all the feints and who practices the relaxing zen massage on the rebound against his opponents.

*This post was generated by ChatGPT, reviewed by Grok and finalized by Google Translate. Remember to remove this mention from your awesome message.*

[scottspurs]

I like Noah Penda but the reason I’m connecting Raynaud to the Spurs is because of the massive need for another big on this team. I’m going to keep bringing up that the Spurs were bottom of the league in almost every rebounding category. It’s the biggest weakness on the team. I like all the French prospects in this draft. Raynaud just makes the most sense considering fit. Even if he is just a backup Center it would be a solid pick even as a reach at 14.

[RC_Drunkford]

I like Noah Penda but the reason I’m connecting Raynaud to the Spurs is because of the massive need for another big on this team. I’m going to keep bringing up that the Spurs were bottom of the league in almost every rebounding category. It’s the biggest weakness on the team. I like all the French prospects in this draft. Raynaud just makes the most sense considering fit. Even if he is just a backup Center it would be a solid pick even as a reach at 14.

true, but the ideal thing for the Spurs would actually be a big who can play C and PF. Kinda like Al Horford in Boston. Sorber fits that profile. Naz Reid does too. I'm all for them drafting a pure center, but a player who plays both positions would be the optimal scenario.

[scottspurs]

true, but the ideal thing for the Spurs would actually be a big who can play C and PF. Kinda like Al Horford in Boston. Sorber fits that profile. Naz Reid does too. I'm all for them drafting a pure center, but a player who plays both positions would be the optimal scenario.

I believe the spurs would draft Sorber over Raynaud for sure. I also think it’s likely Sorber is off the board. Drafting Raynaud doesn’t keep you from going after anyone like Naz Reid. I’m strictly only looking at the draft though. What will the Spurs do at 14? Yaxel Lendeborg would closer fit the profile of a Al Horford but he is leaning going back to school. The other option would be Asa Newell. Some people will say Rasheer Fleming also fits that profile. What happens in the draft doesn’t necessarily mean you can’t double down with someone via trade or free agency. Spurs need plenty of front court help

[cutewizard]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aKm6jza27zw

Fun fact - in this now famous video of 16 year old Wemby playing 2 v 2 against Gobert, Raynaud is actually the guy he's playing with against Gobert and Vincent Poirier

Wow!

There's synergy there

[mo7888]

true, but the ideal thing for the Spurs would actually be a big who can play C and PF. Kinda like Al Horford in Boston. Sorber fits that profile. Naz Reid does too. I'm all for them drafting a pure center, but a player who plays both positions would be the optimal scenario.

I agree with that too. I still like Collins just a tad over Naz, but I'd be thrilled with either.

[BatManu20]

I don't know what it is but this guy is taller than Flagg, played in the ACC and averaged more points, rebounds and blocks than Flagg. I'll take him

He's also 4 years older than Flagg.

[drpill]

The Barlowe brothers both said they consider Raynaud a lottery pick at this point. Interesting.

[ace3g]

DJ2TdLVMfp4

DJ2AotxJEmH

[cd021]

Agree, like if they trade Orlando 14 for 19/26. I’d consider a trade back like that if Bryant, Sorber, and Liam are gone at 14.

As far as trade down options, that would probably be the most ideal, though I don't see the Spurs rostering at least three more rookies.

[Dejounte]

It’s almost like they’re telling us this is happening lol

what better way to keep Wemby forever than to sign his buddy here. If they’re that close, he will never leave.

but then again, it’s a slippery slope. You set a precedent like that, and once some fallout happens it gets ugly

[BatManu20]

Maxim Raynaud measured in at 7’0 1/4 barefoot last week at the Combine, so almost 7’2 with shoes on. And Wemby absolutely towers him… Wemby is 7’6 at least.


https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GrWVFJsXUAA-y4O?format=jpg&name=medium

[scottspurs]

Yeah I feel like I was dead on with this one for better or worse. I’m going to be a little upset if they pass on some of the better bigs but if they are off the board it won’t be the worst reach

[BatManu20]

Maybe 7’7.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GrWc8TLbAAQzYpy?format=jpg&name=360x360

[scottspurs]

I remember when the Spurs traded Tim Duncan’s good buddy Antonio Daniels. So there is president for a superstar losing his best friend with this franchise. I’m okay with it if it makes Wemby happy I guess lol

[PopTheGOAT]

Maxim Raynaud measured in at 7’0 1/4 barefoot last week at the Combine, so almost 7’2 with shoes on. And Wemby absolutely towers him… Wemby is 7’6 at least.


https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GrWVFJsXUAA-y4O?format=jpg&name=medium
He’s still a rail but Wemby might’ve put a few pounds on?

[rankingtear]

I think

[benefactor]

I think
Good tbh

[scottspurs]

I think

Should we be worried?

[CGD]

I was listening to some of the combine scuttlebutt, and sounds like there are concerns about his defense?

[rascal]

Draft friends only with the 38th pick.

There will be better players at 14.

[Trueblood]

I was listening to some of the combine scuttlebutt, and sounds like there are concerns about his defense?

By his age he is a known commodity. If he has defensive issues now they aren't going away. The only thing you can ask yourself is if the team can hide his deficiencies and if his abilities on offense can offset his liabilities. I haven't heard anything promising along the latter so it really comes down to the former. I don't dislike him as a pick, but I don't like him at 14.

[scottspurs]

I was listening to some of the combine scuttlebutt, and sounds like there are concerns about his defense?

I think a lot of his defense woes came because of Stanfords scheme. They changed it his final 6-7 games and he averaged 2.7 blocks per game and was much better.

[John B]

He’s a reach but he’s what the Spurs actually need, a mobile stretch big who can play 4 or backup 5, can rebound, block and shoot 3’s. On top of being French and Wemby’s chess buddy, checkmate!

[cutewizard]

And then get Steven Adams as Mentor

[John B]

He’s still a rail but Wemby might’ve put a few pounds on?

When were these pictures taken. Is Wemby cleared for full contact?

[Manu&Duncan fan]

Raynaud is more and more plausible now.

Sorber's foot injury is a legit concern, especially for a big man.

With biig-4 set, Spurs need safe picks and signings.

[onechance87]

He’s a reach but he’s what the Spurs actually need, a mobile stretch big who can play 4 or backup 5, can rebound, block and shoot 3’s. On top of being French and Wemby’s chess buddy, checkmate!

No spurs need a big who defends the paint and rebounds.Especially when wemby is on the bench resting or
siting out games.It turns into chaos for us with no big who defends the paint and rebounds.

[rascal]

Raynaud is more and more plausible now.

Sorber's foot injury is a legit concern, especially for a big man.

With biig-4 set, Spurs need safe picks and signings.

Sorber is expected to make a full recovery.

You draft Sorber if he is on the board at 14 over Raynaud

[scottspurs]

No spurs need a big who defends the paint and rebounds.Especially when wemby is on the bench resting or
siting out games.It turns into chaos for us with no big who defends the paint and rebounds.


Raynaud was one of the best rebounders in the country. Only Yaxel Lendeborg graded out better in rebounding analytics wise. He was 2nd in the entire country in Double-Doubles. He is an elite rebounder that understands positioning. Very high IQ and great fundamentals. The concerns about his shot blocking are legit but he averaged 2.7 blocks per game over his final 7. Criticizing his rebounding though makes no sense whatsoever though. That’s the strength of his game. That and his shooting/ability to space the floor.

Anyone that can rebound like him at over 7-foot will play 10 years in the NBA. Spurs biggest weakness is rebounding. Spurs were one of the top shot blocking teams in the nba. They dont necessarily need another shot blocker. That would only be a luxury

[onechance87]

Raynaud was one of the best rebounders in the country. Only Yaxel Lendeborg graded out better in rebounding analytics wise. He was 2nd in the entire country in Double-Doubles. He is an elite rebounder that understands positioning. Very high IQ and great fundamentals. The concerns about his shot blocking are legit but he averaged 2.7 blocks per game over his final 7. Criticizing his rebounding though makes no sense whatsoever though. That’s the strength of his game. That and his shooting/ability to space the floor.

Anyone that can rebound like him at over 7-foot will play 10 years in the NBA. Spurs biggest weakness is rebounding. Spurs were one of the top shot blocking teams in the nba. They dont necessarily need another shot blocker. That would only be a luxury

sheesh lendeborg would fit nicely with wemby.

[John B]

sheesh lendeborg would fit nicely with wemby.

7 footer vs 6’9. Raynaud can also play a backup center.

I mean Raynaud is not my 1st choice at 14. But given he’s French and Wemby’s chess buddy, and he checks all the boxes. There is a good argument he could be Spurs pick at 14 or trade down to get him.

[rascal]

7 footer vs 6’9. Raynaud can also play a backup center.

I mean Raynaud is not my 1st choice at 14. But given he’s French and Wemby’s chess buddy, and he checks all the boxes. There is a good argument he could be Spurs pick at 14 or trade down to get him.

He might even be there with the 38th pick.

You guys are over valuing him because he's Wemby's chess buddy.

[cutewizard]

Harmony is priceless

[cutewizard]

That 2014 Team

Helluva bench consolidated by good friends Manu, Diaw and Mills

Harmony is everything

[Ice009]

That 2014 Team

Helluva bench consolidated by good friends Manu, Diaw and Mills

Harmony is everything

Manu and Diaw had extreme skill and talent. Patty was decent too, but if it was three Patty's out there, then they don't go anywhere. The caliber of players matters.

[John B]

Manu and Diaw had extreme skill and talent. Patty was decent too, but if it was three Patty's out there, then they don't go anywhere. The caliber of players matters.

Coffee Gang >>>> Power of Friendship

[scottspurs]

Maybe the chess gang will destroy what ever the power of friendship is. Can someone explain that one to me? Also Raynaud is not making it to pick 38. Late blooming riser that averaged 20 and 10. If Spurs pass on him I expect the thunder to pick him with one of their two firsts. He won’t make it out of the 1st round regardless. 28.7% rebound rate is a rare trait.

[scottspurs]

Rebound % is a good indicator of who the best rebounders are. There is a 73% translate rate from college to pros. Meaning there is a good chance if a player is a good rebounder in college he will replicate it in the pros. Here are the top guys in this draft class


Offensive rebound %




Khaman Maluach- 16.5
Johni Broome- 14.1
Asa Newell- 13.9
Alex Condon - 12.5
Yaxel Lendeborg- 11.6



11% is usually the threshold that translates to the pros and these are the only 5 prospects that met that mark


Defensive Rebound %




Maxime Raynaud-28.7
Nique Clifford- 26.0
Johni Broome- 26.0
Danny Wolf- 25.0
Yaxel Lendeborg- 24.9
Derik Queen- 24.6
Collin Murray-Boyles- 23.8
Rasheer Fleming- 22.8
Thomas Sorber- 21.9
Cooper Flagg- 21.2
Trevon Brazile-20.3
Alex Condon- 19.3
Khaman Maluach- 19.2
Liam Mcneely- 18.7
Ryan Kalkbrenner-18.4
Carter Bryant- 17.8
Ace Bailey-17.5
Vladislav Goldin- 17.4
Coleman Hawkins- 17.4
Cedric Coward-17.2



Typically 17% is acceptable/above average. 20% is good. 23% is great. Anything above 26% is elite


Total rebound %




Johni Broome- 20.2
Maxime Raynaud-18.8
Yaxel Lendeborg- 18.1
Khaman Maluach- 18.0
Danny Wolf- 17.7
Derik Queen- 16.9
Nique Clifford- 16.4
Collin Murray-Boyles- 16.3
Thomas Sorber- 15.6
Rasheer Fleming- 15.3



+15% is usually the threshold translates translates to a college player being a good all around rebounder in the NBA and these only 10 prospects that meet that threshold

[benefactor]

He might even be there with the 38th pick.

You guys are over valuing him because he's Wemby's chess buddy.
For once rascal and I agree. It's actually the only reason this thread exists at all. OP saw the chess thing in the news and decided to throw some shit against the wall hoping it would stick

[Manu&Duncan fan]

Maybe the chess gang will destroy what ever the power of friendship is. Can someone explain that one to me? Also Raynaud is not making it to pick 38. Late blooming riser that averaged 20 and 10. If Spurs pass on him I expect the thunder to pick him with one of their two firsts. He won’t make it out of the 1st round regardless. 28.7% rebound rate is a rare trait.

Thank you ScottSpurs!

I'm on board now. Draft him, even at #14, if trade down is not possible.

[John B]

Rebound % is a good indicator of who the best rebounders are. There is a 73% translate rate from college to pros. Meaning there is a good chance if a player is a good rebounder in college he will replicate it in the pros. Here are the top guys in this draft class


Offensive rebound %




Khaman Maluach- 16.5
Johni Broome- 14.1
Asa Newell- 13.9
Alex Condon - 12.5
Yaxel Lendeborg- 11.6



11% is usually the threshold that translates to the pros and these are the only 5 prospects that met that mark


Defensive Rebound %




Maxime Raynaud-28.7
Nique Clifford- 26.0
Johni Broome- 26.0
Danny Wolf- 25.0
Yaxel Lendeborg- 24.9
Derik Queen- 24.6
Collin Murray-Boyles- 23.8
Rasheer Fleming- 22.8
Thomas Sorber- 21.9
Cooper Flagg- 21.2
Trevon Brazile-20.3
Alex Condon- 19.3
Khaman Maluach- 19.2
Liam Mcneely- 18.7
Ryan Kalkbrenner-18.4
Carter Bryant- 17.8
Ace Bailey-17.5
Vladislav Goldin- 17.4
Coleman Hawkins- 17.4
Cedric Coward-17.2



Typically 17% is acceptable/above average. 20% is good. 23% is great. Anything above 26% is elite


Total rebound %




Johni Broome- 20.2
Maxime Raynaud-18.8
Yaxel Lendeborg- 18.1
Khaman Maluach- 18.0
Danny Wolf- 17.7
Derik Queen- 16.9
Nique Clifford- 16.4
Collin Murray-Boyles- 16.3
Thomas Sorber- 15.6
Rasheer Fleming- 15.3



+15% is usually the threshold translates translates to a college player being a good all around rebounder in the NBA and these only 10 prospects that meet that threshold

And who among these can play stretch big, which is the ideal fit with the current Spurs roster.

Again Raynaud checks many boxes.

[mo7888]

I'd love to have Raynaud, but #14 is a little high. If they really want him maybe trade back with Brooklyn and take Raynaud + Powell and trade #38 for future assets.

[scottspurs]

I agree with anyone that says it’s a reach and if they got him in a trade back that would be preferable. Like someone said above I’m just throwing shit against the wall or whatever but the connecting dots are strong.

[CGD]

I'd love to have Raynaud, but #14 is a little high. If they really want him maybe trade back with Brooklyn and take Raynaud + Powell and trade #38 for future assets.

Absolutely too high at #14. We have an army of SRPs though, that can be used to trade up with in the late first round, early second if he’s there.

[Ocotillo]

Absolutely too high at #14. We have an army of SRPs though, that can be used to trade up with in the late first round, early second if he’s there.

This is the approach that I like. If you give up 14 and try to move back you run the risk of someone else taking him before you and you end up without 14. On the other hand, what are the odds these Spurs are going to bring three rooks into camp?

[CGD]

This is the approach that I like. If you give up 14 and try to move back you run the risk of someone else taking him before you and you end up without 14. On the other hand, what are the odds these Spurs are going to bring three rooks into camp?

I'd prefer they just pick at #38 as opposed to moving up. I dont tend to count the SRPs as true rookies honestly, but more projects for Austin.

I wouldnt be mad if they did the Minnesota special this year too, but I'm increasingly of the mind they can get a really good player at 14. There are some players in that range in this draft that would have easily gone #6 (Salaun) last year, maybe even at #5 (Holland). The Spurs also need bargain depth, and it does finally feel that players like Devin, Keldon, Maliki, and Blake, are not long for this team.

[Brazil]

I'm convinced, let's draft him at #2 Harper is a bad fit anyway

[benefactor]

In all seriousness, this pick would be perfectly fine at 38. If the Spurs go ahead and pick at 2 and 14 they won't trade back up into the first for another player. They will wait until 38 or trade the 38th pick. If he is still there it's actually a pretty safe bet this kid will be the player.

[thOOdee]

can someone make the argument as to why the spurs should draft Maxime Raynaud over a player like Ryan Kalkbrenner, without relying on the french connection.

Understanding these are "highlights" and should be taken w a grain of sault, Raynaud seems to move smoother and more natural w the ball, and looks to let it fly from 3 more. However, Kalkbrenner just seems bigger and sturdier to better fit the center position. Anybody more familiar with their games have any different perspectives?

gHiPLAPq4cU

OfIBf0Hr6D8

[benefactor]

can someone make the argument as to why the spurs should draft Maxime Raynaud over a player like Ryan Kalkbrenner, without relying on the french connection.

Understanding these are "highlights" and should be taken w a grain of sault, Raynaud seems to move smoother and more natural w the ball, and looks to let it fly from 3 more. However, Kalkbrenner just seems bigger and sturdier to better fit the center position. Anybody more familiar with their games have any different perspectives?

gHiPLAPq4cU

OfIBf0Hr6D8
Wemby tbh

[rascal]

This is the approach that I like. If you give up 14 and try to move back you run the risk of someone else taking him before you and you end up without 14. On the other hand, what are the odds these Spurs are going to bring three rooks into camp?

What's the logic in trading back to get two weaker players than who you can get at 14 just to target Raynaud who you can likely just draft him at 38?

If he's not there at 38, so what, you still have the player/better draft pick at 14.

[mo7888]

What's the logic in trading back to get two weaker players than who you can get at 14 just to target Raynaud who you can likely just draft at 38?

If he's not there at 38, so what, you still have the player/better draft pick at 14.

It really just comes down to how the Spurs value him. I value him in the late 20's.

[Ocotillo]

What's the logic in trading back to get two weaker players than who you can get at 14 just to target Raynaud who you can likely just draft at 38?

If he's not there at 38, so what, you still have the player/better draft pick at 14.

Guess I wasn't clear, I am saying hang onto 14. If you feel like Raynaud will go higher than 38 and you want him, trade 38 and some other future second rounders to move up where you think you need to be.

[bevo]

Kevin O'conner has him as a riser in the draft after the colombine. Thinks he's a top 15 talnet. Right now thinks he's a 1st round pick for sure, maybe 20s right now.

[RC_Drunkford]

can someone make the argument as to why the spurs should draft Maxime Raynaud over a player like Ryan Kalkbrenner, without relying on the french connection.

Understanding these are "highlights" and should be taken w a grain of sault, Raynaud seems to move smoother and more natural w the ball, and looks to let it fly from 3 more. However, Kalkbrenner just seems bigger and sturdier to better fit the center position. Anybody more familiar with their games have any different perspectives?

gHiPLAPq4cU

OfIBf0Hr6D8

He doesn't get talked about enough. Probably because he's not Wemby's friend. I see him in the same tier as Raynaud and would be fine with either of them, which is another reason why you don't pick Raynaud at 14, cause Kalkbrenner will most likely go 28-32

[rjv]

Raynaud is not going to be there at 38. His pulling out of day 2 at the combine has some draft analysts saying that this is because he must have received a 1st round promise from one or more teams.

[The Truth #6]

Kevin O'conner has him as a riser in the draft after the colombine. Thinks he's a top 15 talnet. Right now thinks he's a 1st round pick for sure, maybe 20s right now.

KOC is often a good barometer of what is not going to happen. But in fairness I'm just getting up to speed on Max...

[Manu&Duncan fan]

Yes. Draft Fleming and Raynaud.

Trade Keldon or Vassel to Get John Collins

Sign a vet center like Steven Adams as back-up 5.

Sign a cheap shooter with min.

We will be all set. This off season is fun and yet easy!

[dn0774]

Raynaud is not going to be there at 38. His pulling out of day 2 at the combine has some draft analysts saying that this is because he must have received a 1st round promise from one or more teams.

I wonder with him and Wemby being friends and sharing an agent if a team made a promise to Raynaud would that info get back to the Spurs and they could trade up (from 2nd round) or back (from 14) to snipe him with a better value pick.

[Biggems]

I really want Broome. Our biggest weakness is our classwork. Broome has proven to be Windex in college.

That would only leave consistent perimeter shooting asourother main weakness.

[thOOdee]

DJ2TdLVMfp4

DJ2AotxJEmH


on another note, if serious discussions had been had w wemby about considering maxime @ 14, you would think advice would be given to keep a lower profile of the two.

[mudyez]

I wonder with him and Wemby being friends and sharing an agent if a team made a promise to Raynaud would that info get back to the Spurs and they could trade up (from 2nd round) or back (from 14) to snipe him with a better value pick.

I guess it will, coz the promise probably is from the team with pick #14.

At this point I wouldn't blame them, if they take him at #14. He is a great fit and should somewhat make sure, Wemby is happy, while not being Thiannis.

Get him + Adams.

[Limguogolo]

For once rascal and I agree. It's actually the only reason this thread exists at all. OP saw the chess thing in the news and decided to throw some shit against the wall hoping it would stick
The only reason this thread exists is his combine days.

[heyheymymy]

Yeah this time last year we all saw those pics of Wemby with Salaun at the lake and maybe CHA sniped him at #6 before SA's #8 but I could see that being the Bilal special where Wemby helps a friend get paid via exposure more than the Spurs ever actually wanting the player.

But I like Raynaud. Twin Eiffels. Not sure about it at #14 and agree he may not last past 20s certainly not #38. I liked the idea of trying to jump up in a trade with #38 + etc more than splitting down from #14 via trade.

[HankChinaski]

Kalkbrenner would be a great pick up at 38.

Raynaud at 14 is a bit early but he has the ability to generate his own shot on a team where he was the focal point of that Stanford team. He won't have the level of attention if we pick him up and I think he could do more with a lesser role.

The difference that stands out between the two right off the bat.

[CorrectCrusader]

I'm down. Fills a need and has interesting traits that are rare for a big.

[Trueblood]

The thing about Raynaud is that he is a known commodity at this point. At his age the chances of him developing into more than what he is now is slim (statistically speaking). Obviously he can do little things to improve, but he's a high floor/low ceiling guy. People making a big deal about his highlights this year need to remember he's playing against kids and a lot of them were 3-4 years younger than him; he should be dominating them. I feel like the same people on here getting excited about him on here are the same ones that want us to draft Fleming. They're excited about a guy dominating younger/less developed players but I don't think either Raynaud or Fleming would have looked nearly as good if they had been playing in the G-league last year. The question we have here is do we use 14 to swing for the fences and take a high upside guy with bust potential or play it safe and get a player who has already developed in college?

[scottspurs]

The thing about Raynaud is that he is a known commodity at this point. At his age the chances of him developing into more than what he is now is slim (statistically speaking). Obviously he can do little things to improve, but he's a high floor/low ceiling guy. People making a big deal about his highlights this year need to remember he's playing against kids and a lot of them were 3-4 years younger than him; he should be dominating them. I feel like the same people on here getting excited about him on here are the same ones that want us to draft Fleming. They're excited about a guy dominating younger/less developed players but I don't think either Raynaud or Fleming would have looked nearly as good if they had been playing in the G-league last year. The question we have here is do we use 14 to swing for the fences and take a high upside guy with bust potential or play it safe and get a player who has already developed in college?

I disagree! He picked up a basketball later than most because he was a swimmer. He is a late bloomer and can definitely improve more than your average 4-year senior. Same for Yaxel Lendeborg. If he had been playing basketball since he was a youth it would be a different story. Case in point 1a Tim Duncan. Another guy that was a late bloomer that picked up basketball later than most was Hakeem Olajuwon. I’m not saying Raynaud will be as good as those guys but plenty of older prospects improve once they arrive to the NBA.

[LeBowen]

He picked up a basketball later than most because he was a swimmer.

Where have I heard that one before...

[Guru of Nothing]

Kind of intrigued by the idea of grabbing both Raynaud and Sorber, and bringing them aboard as a tandem where they can grind on each other 24x7, in much the same way I want see Castle and Harper develop. It's feasible if say dealing the #14 and #38 to Brooklyn for #19 and #26 (Seems natural for Brooklyn to do at least a little upward consolidation, right?). ...chances of getting both with #19 and #26 may be dwindling, I know.

Followup thought: it's a tall order (Well, now the pun is intended) to onboard three rookies in one season, but I feel it, the message that now is the time to stuff this roster to the gills with young talent and develop it. It might be bumpy in November and December, but my current expectations are that the Spurs will legit finish top-6 this upcoming season and every single media mouth will be talking about the Spurs are the one team nobody wants to face in the playoffs. Pretty sure I'm not wrong.

[ginobilized]

I could live with Raynaud at 14, but, really wonder if this will be a case of the Spurs taking advantage of his stock rising and grabbing another player.
The idea of adding another 7'+ player who shoots the 3 well is intriguing with 3 guards who excel at getting to the rim. Atlanta might grab him, too.
Essengue, Bryant and Raynaud seem like strong possibilities in the 12 -16 range.

[sfernald]

I think spurs should either draft a center at #38 or maybe try to move up 10 or so spots with a couple of our ‘26 seconds and take one of sorber/wolf/raynaud/kalkbrenner/beringer/condon/yang.

One of those dudes will be left at #38 and if we move up a bit we might have one of the good picks of the litter.

i have no idea which would be best. I would completely trust our scouting dept on this one honestly.

[Trueblood]

I think spurs should either draft a center at #38 or maybe try to move up 10 or so spots with a couple of our ‘26 seconds and take one of sorber/wolf/raynaud/kalkbrenner/beringer/condon/yang.

One of those dudes will be left at #38 and if we move up a bit we might have one of the good picks of the litter.

i have no idea which would be best. I would completely trust our scouting dept on this one honestly.

Most mocks have Sorber going in the late teens. I’m thinking he’ll be off the board before 19. If the Spurs really want him they would probably have to reach a little with 14

[BatManu20]

Raynaud at 14 would be a pretty sizable reach imo. But he's also not making it to the 2nd Round, so the Spurs will have a tough decision to make there.

[sfernald]

Most mocks have Sorber going in the late teens. I’m thinking he’ll be off the board before 19. If the Spurs really want him they would probably have to reach a little with 14

Yeah most likely but I’ve seen a few mocks that have him (or wolf) at the bottom of the first round and with the injury he is a potential drop case.

[scott]

Being tall, French, and friends with Wemby is a recipe for FRP millions. Wemby should get a cut of all these guy's contracts.

[RC_Drunkford]

I'll draft Sorber over Raynaud any day of the week. Sorber is just 19 and already super polished with potential to play some minutes at the 4. If he's there at 14 you get him.

[Guru of Nothing]

Sorber is still at the top of my wish list at the 14 (unless somebody interesting falls). Draft Sorber and bring in the Green Kornet to shore up our 4/5, and then we can all complain in unison about needing 3&D.

[spurraider21]

I'll draft Sorber over Raynaud any day of the week. Sorber is just 19 and already super polished with potential to play some minutes at the 4. If he's there at 14 you get him.
yeah at the very least he should wind up as a very good backup who could have some trade value for a team who thinks he can expand his role as opposed to being overshadowed by wemby. we see this happen all the time with bigs. Suns traded 3 SRPs for Nick Richards who was always a decent backup but never showed starter ability, because they banked on him being able to handle more responsibilities. Poeltl was a backup for TOR and eventually was able to handle a starting gig for us and did quite well. no reason Sorber cant do something similar, even if it turns out that he and wemby cant share the floor much

[Dejounte]

I think Hartenstein too

[scott]

That's the model, IMO.

You have your core (Wemby/Castle/Harper, plus Fox for now). Everyone else is transitory. Just draft good players who you can flip for more players and picks before their extension kicks in, and use those picks to repeat the cycle. This is how I think OKC plans to approach things going forward. Sorber would seem to be a great candidate for this kind of routine.

[Guru of Nothing]

That's the model, IMO.

You have your core (Wemby/Castle/Harper, plus Fox for now). Everyone else is transitory. Just draft good players who you can flip for more players and picks before their extension kicks in, and use those picks to repeat the cycle. This is how I think OKC plans to approach things going forward. Sorber would seem to be a great candidate for this kind of routine.

I like this line of reasoning. I would add to it that now might be a good time to explore opportunities to acquire more furture draft picks, as a priority, and fuel that churn.

[Biggems]

I would have no issue drafting him in the late-1st or 2nd.

If Sorber is gone at 14, I would have no issue moving back in the draft. Then, take Broome and Raynaud.

PG Fox, Harper
SG Castle, Champ
SF Vassell, Johnson, Ingram
PF Sochan, Broome, Mamu
C Wemby, Raynaud

[CGD]

KOC is often a good barometer of what is not going to happen. But in fairness I'm just getting up to speed on Max...

Truth nuke! I like him as an entertainer and his interviews with draftees are cool, but his are not at the top of evaluations I trust most.

[Eaglenole2002]

Would anyone care about Raynaud if he didn’t have a connection to Wemby?

[mo7888]

Would anyone care about Raynaud if he didn’t have a connection to Wemby?

Sure... I'd like him in the late 20's...

[Eaglenole2002]

Sure... I'd like him in the late 20's...

I feel like we might as well keep Mamu if we’re looking for a bad defensive big that can shoot and pass a bit. At 38, seems fine. I wouldn’t want to spend the resources to trade up from 38 for him, and I’d be disappointed if we took him at 14 or a bit later for him.

[CGD]

Im more interested in drafting wings at 14. There are plenty of backup Cs that can be had in free agency.

[rascal]

It would be poor value to waste the 14 pick on Raynaud when Sorber, McNeeley, Fleming, Bryant or Newell will be there.

No problem using additional 2nd round picks to move up from 38 to draft him.

[scottspurs]

If you just lined up the best 14 players and disregarded potential. Maxime Raynaud would be in the top 14. 20 and 10 in the ACC.

[scottspurs]

A lot of people are going to cry on draft night when the Spurs draft this guy at 14. They don’t care what you or I think.

[rascal]

If you just lined up the best 14 players and disregarded potential. Maxime Raynaud would be in the top 14. 20 and 10 in the ACC.

Can't disregard potential

[scottspurs]

Can't disregard potential
I just said that because people are talking like this is some kind of massive reach. The Thunder very easily could pick him at 15 as a replacement for Hartenstein

[rascal]

I just said that because people are talking like this is some kind of massive reach. The Thunder very easily could pick him at 15 as a replacement for Hartenstein

It's a massive reach at 14.

[scottspurs]

It's a massive reach at 14.
By what standard?

[Leetonidas]

I would have no issue drafting him in the late-1st or 2nd.

If Sorber is gone at 14, I would have no issue moving back in the draft. Then, take Broome and Raynaud.

PG Fox, Harper
SG Castle, Champ
SF Vassell, Johnson, Ingram
PF Sochan, Broome, Mamu
C Wemby, Raynaud

Where is Barnes? :lol

[rascal]

By what standard?

There are several players with higher upsides because they show more skills. This guy is being overrated by some in here because he's Wemby's friend.

[scottspurs]

There are several players with higher upsides because they show more skills. This guy is being overrated by some in here because he's Wemby's friend.
Higher upside I agree with. Overrated I will not. Agree to disagree. 20 and 10! 28% rebound rate is rare. Elite rebounding. Skill with production to back it up

[rascal]

Higher upside I agree with. Overrated I will not. Agree to disagree. 20 and 10! 28% rebound rate is rare. Elite rebounding. Skill with production to back it up

He won't put anything close to that in the NBA. He's too weak and slow to be a double digit rebounder and 20 point scorer in the NBA.

[Mr. Body]

I agree with rascal. We're all over this guy because he plays chess with Victor and can hit a jump shot. He looks like in-the-20s territory or in the early 2nd.

[rascal]

I agree with rascal. We're all over this guy because he plays chess with Victor and can hit a jump shot. He looks like in-the-20s territory or in the early 2nd.

Yes, that is the correct value for him. If the Spurs really want him they can put up a package of 2nd rounders to move up with the 38 and some team will bite on the offer. Spurs have an excess of 2nd round picks and need to use some.

There is no need to waste the 14 on Raynaud.

[scottspurs]

He won't put anything close to that in the NBA. He's too weak and slow to be a double digit rebounder and 20 point scorer in the NBA.


Nobody puts up the same numbers from college to the pros. The most transferable stat has always been rebounding. He is not a stiff like Edey. He moves incredibly well for his size. He may be weak but has tremendous fundamentals and high IQ. Half the battle when it comes to rebounding is knowing how and where to position yourself. He ran faster than Cooper Flagg at the combine if you want to call him slow

[cd98]

Why is everyone advocating taking a guy likely to go in the second round with our 14 pick? Makes no sense.

[scottspurs]

Why is everyone advocating taking a guy likely to go in the second round with our 14 pick? Makes no sense.
How are you sure he would go in the 2nd round? What makes you think this?

[Mr. Body]

Why is everyone advocating taking a guy likely to go in the second round with our 14 pick? Makes no sense.

BECAUSE HE PLAYS CHESS. WITH VIC.

[rascal]

Why is everyone advocating taking a guy likely to go in the second round with our 14 pick? Makes no sense.

Because some people are beleiving he's worth the players who are mocked around 14.

[rascal]

How are you sure he would go in the 2nd round? What makes you think this?

He's not likely to go in the lottery

[scottspurs]

BECAUSE HE PLAYS CHESS. WITH VIC.
He averaged 20 and 10 in the ACC. Show me another player that did that. You will have to go back to Rasheed Wallace and Tim Duncan. His tape was good not great. He also plays chess with Wemby

[scottspurs]

He's not likely to go in the lottery
I agree with that. For the record I don’t think he should be the Spurs pick. I just don’t think it’s a massive reach

[SpursFan86]

USA Today: not mocked in the 1st round
Bleacher Report: mocked at 29
ESPN: mocked at 24
Yahoo: mocked at 23
Tankathon: mocked at 27
CBS: 28th on their latest big board

Maybe things change between now and the draft, or maybe NBA teams are much higher than all of the draft “experts” out there…but as of now I don’t see how you can argue that taking Raynaud at 14 wouldn’t be a fairly big reach. It just seems extremely likely he will still be there in the 20s.

[rascal]

I agree with that. For the record I don’t think he should be the Spurs pick. I just don’t think it’s a massive reach

Then what are you arguing about if you don't think he should be the Spurs pick at 14? It's not a massive reach? But still a reach which is not the best move.

Spurs need to maximise the best move for that 14th pick.

[scottspurs]

Then what are you arguing about if you don't think he should be the Spurs pick at 14? It's not a massive reach? But still a reach which is not the best move.

Spurs need to maximise the best move for that 14th pick.

Yes, I’m arguing that it’s not a massive reach. With so many guards on the spurs roster there is a good chance they will have to reach at 14. The top player on the spurs board at 14 may be a guard.

[scottspurs]

Only player in the country averaging more than 20 points and 10 rebounds per game. First major conference player to average 20 & 10 with more than 50 made threes in a season since Kevin Durant in 2006-07 and Carmelo Anthony in 2002-03

[scottspurs]

Ended season second in NCAA history in single-season 3-pointers by a player over 7-feet (67), trailing only Arizona’s Lauri Markkanen (69, 2016-17)
Finished second nationally with 25 double-doubles, led all major conference players. Just the fifth high major player in the past five years to have at least 25

[Trueblood]

I disagree! He picked up a basketball later than most because he was a swimmer. He is a late bloomer and can definitely improve more than your average 4-year senior. Same for Yaxel Lendeborg. If he had been playing basketball since he was a youth it would be a different story. Case in point 1a Tim Duncan. Another guy that was a late bloomer that picked up basketball later than most was Hakeem Olajuwon. I’m not saying Raynaud will be as good as those guys but plenty of older prospects improve once they arrive to the NBA.

I get what you're saying, and maybe he has some additional room to grow, but both Tim and Dream were dominant forces in college already and that domination carried over into the pros. He's not a bad player, and I wouldn't be upset with us drafting him at 14 (although it is a reach), but I don't think he has the potential to be much more than he is right now, a flawed player that can be fit into a system as a regular starter. The question is do you want to spend the 14th pick on that?

[scottspurs]

I get what you're saying, and maybe he has some additional room to grow, but both Tim and Dream were dominant forces in college already and that domination carried over into the pros. He's not a bad player, and I wouldn't be upset with us drafting him at 14 (although it is a reach), but I don't think he has the potential to be much more than he is right now, a flawed player that can be fit into a system as a regular starter. The question is do you want to spend the 14th pick on that?

It would be a bit of a reach but I’m pounding the table for rebounding so if Sorber is gone it’s between him, Asa Newell and Yaxel Lendeborg. I would be okay with any of those 3. Would also be okay with Fleming but im starting to get the vibe that teams think he is a low IQ player that doesn’t quite get it.

[scottspurs]

They could also get rebounding from the wing position though if they drafted Coward, Clifford or Mcneely but I prefer a big.

[Trueblood]

It would be a bit of a reach but I’m pounding the table for rebounding so if Sorber is gone it’s between him, Asa Newell and Yaxel Lendeborg. I would be okay with any of those 3. Would also be okay with Fleming but im starting to get the vibe that teams think he is a low IQ player that doesn’t quite get it.

I'm with you. Personally I'm team Sorber. But I'm just not high on guys who are juniors or seniors without a ton of room to grow. I'd rather gamble on upside.

[scottspurs]

I'm with you. Personally I'm team Sorber. But I'm just not high on guys who are juniors or seniors without a ton of room to grow. I'd rather gamble on upside.

That’s fair and history says Brian Wright will agree with you. I don’t believe he was the GM last time we drafted an older prospect (Derek White). It’s been all teenagers

[scott]

I'll say this about Maxine: I like him more than Wolf

[Trueblood]

They could also get rebounding from the wing position though if they drafted Coward, Clifford or Mcneely but I prefer a big.

We need a big. One we can develop alongside Wemby. It's looking more and more like we're going to run a three guard set with Fox being the starter and Castle, Harper, and Vassell all being bigger guards in the rotation. If we don't get any wings in the draft or free agency it's not the end of the world, but we really need another floor spacing big to make up for the lack of consistent 3 point shooting from our guards.

[scottspurs]

I'll say this about Maxine: I like him more than Wolf

someone described Wolf as a 6’11 Kyle Anderson and now I can’t unsee it lol

[mo7888]

Yes, that is the correct value for him. If the Spurs really want him they can put up a package of 2nd rounders to move up with the 38 and some team will bite on the offer. Spurs have an excess of 2nd round picks and need to use some.

There is no need to waste the 14 on Raynaud.

I've got him #27 overall and in my 7th tier which runs from 22-30

[dn0774]

The math says one of the late lottery pick 3&D wings or Sorber will be available @ 14, picking Raynaud there wouldn't feel great. He won't be available @ 38 either, he is getting the 'Wemby Bump' that Salaun got last year by the looks of it. Maybe trade down from 14 into the late 1st round and get Raynaud there while picking up another 1st rounder/compelling swap down the road?

[Biggems]

Where is Barnes? :lol

I couldn't remember if he was still under contract at the time of my response.

[RC_Drunkford]

the bottom line is you don't draft a player with bench player potential at 14. You draft somebody who could become a starter.

[Limguogolo]

I call it the "Batum effect". A long, long time ago, it was almost certain that Batum (drafted 25) would go to Spurs to join his compatriot TP. It was already the time when, thanks to TP and Manu, in particular, the Spurs were considered geniuses in the draft. It was before Kawhi too (drafted 15). Portland then agreed with Houston to go ahead, and the Spurs finally had George Hill at pick 26 instead of Batum.


This is undoubtedly what happened last year with Salaün. Bad students, when they want to be sure of the right answer, look at the Spurs copy. Even probably still today. In 4, last year, Salaün would have been high, especially if they had confidence in Castle. Result, Charlotte chooses Salaün in 6... so as not to play him for the year (his clean criminal record should not plead in his favor).


The question is perhaps not to take Raynaud at pick 14. But to take a Kawhi at this stage if he exists. Given the supposed level of this draft, there is indeed a Kawhi hiding in this draft. Let's let the Spurs do the work, we'll judge them next year.


As for Raynaud, it's fair game if the Spurs take advantage of the Batum's effect by making it appear that they are very interested. Spurs like to play chess too... They distract attention while they look elsewhere (and in five years, Raynaud will come to Spurs like Diaw was able to do in place of Batum).

[mo7888]

The math says one of the late lottery pick 3&D wings or Sorber will be available @ 14, picking Raynaud there wouldn't feel great. He won't be available @ 38 either, he is getting the 'Wemby Bump' that Salaun got last year by the looks of it. Maybe trade down from 14 into the late 1st round and get Raynaud there while picking up another 1st rounder/compelling swap down the road?

I think I'd rather keep 14 and trade up from 38 with Brooklyn to take Raynaud. I know it's 3 rookies and they probably won't do that, but I believe I would.

[Manu&Duncan fan]

Nobody puts up the same numbers from college to the pros. The most transferable stat has always been rebounding. He is not a stiff like Edey. He moves incredibly well for his size. He may be weak but has tremendous fundamentals and high IQ. Half the battle when it comes to rebounding is knowing how and where to position yourself. He ran faster than Cooper Flagg at the combine if you want to call him slow

That's incredible! I'm all in!

[John B]

Would anyone care about Raynaud if he didn’t have a connection to Wemby?

That’s the intriguing part. That French Connection is real. And Spurs would do good to please its young franchise. Reynaud is a reach at 14 but checks off a lot of boxes. He can be Spurs future 4 or at worst backup big.

[bluebellmaniac]

Broome and Raynaud are the way. Whichever order you want.

Trade 14 & 38 + maybe another future 2nd (or two) for Brooklyn's 2 firsts.

[John B]

Broome and Raynaud are the way. Whichever order you want.

Trade 14 & 38 + maybe another future 2nd (or two) for Brooklyn's 2 firsts.

Underwhelming but good combination and I could see the Spurs taking that at #14 and #38. I doubt Broome is available at #38.

I really like Goldin at #38. I watched a lot of Michigan basketball last season and enjoyed the Twin Towers and ball movement, really reminded me of Spurs basketball. Goldin is 7 footer barefoot with 9’3 standing reach. He’s already 24 but should contribute from day 1. Reynaud could be that over-the-fence at #14.

[John B]

Why is everyone advocating taking a guy likely to go in the second round with our 14 pick? Makes no sense.

Who cares what we think, but what we suspect the FO will do. Reynaud checks off a lot of boxes, mobile big, 7 1/4 barefoot, 9’2 standing reach, great rebounder which Spurs was terrible last season, can block, and shoot outside. He can play both 4 and 5, and on top of that, Wemby’s chess-pal. Personally I want Fleming. I think he can be molded into Naz Reid. I would be thrilled with what a big man like Sorber could bring. And I also like Danny Wolf as I see a lot of Diaw in him. But again, if I were to guess what the FO would do, they will take Reynaud at #14. Primo always comes to mind when FO like a player even when Primo was mocked at mid-twenties and they could’ve traded down.

[Bruno]

Signing/drafting a player partially because he is friend with Wembanayama would be opening a can of worm for Spurs. They haven't done it so far and I hope they won't do it.
If Spurs draft Raynaud, it should be only because of his level and not at all because of his link with Wembanyama.

[rjv]

Signing/drafting a player partially because he is friend with Wembanayama would be opening a can of worm for Spurs. They haven't done it so far and I hope they won't do it.
If Spurs draft Raynaud, it should be only because of his level and not at all because of his link with Wembanyama.


if the spurs draft Reyaud, it would be reminiscent of signing Oberto and drafting the never-was-a Spur Scola. yes, they were friends with Manu but they had coveted skill sets and Pop was enamored with the Argentinian national team.

[Ariel]

My guess is Raynaud's draft trajectory will go somewhere along the lines of Jaime Jaquez Jr and Podziemski, the whole time projected to go in the early 2nd round but jumping into the teens late in the process. I like Raynaud, but I'm not sold on him being the best option at 14. Plus like it was pointed a few posts above, it would seem odd that such a tight lipped, poker faced organization would help their true targets raise their profiles like it happened with Salaun last year and now Raynaud. Not ruling it out, they drafted Primo after all so they proved they can do dumb shit every now and then, but I'd lean towards trying to help his draft stock rather than actually going after him.

[SOMA Spur]

What would be the plan for Raynaud in our rotation? Is he just a Backup C playing 12 minutes a night backing up Wemby? Or would he play next to Wemby for significant minutes? Have they ever played together in a game? French Youth or Olympics program? Anyone got any intel if there is some actual chemistry on the court, or are they just chess buddies?

[drpill]

What would be the plan for Raynaud in our rotation? Is he just a Backup C playing 12 minutes a night backing up Wemby? Or would he play next to Wemby for significant minutes? Have they ever played together in a game? French Youth or Olympics program? Anyone got any intel if there is some actual chemistry on the court, or are they just chess buddies?

They played together at times for Nanterre. In the classic video of a 16 year old Wemby scoring on Rudy Gobert, Raynaud is Wemby's partner in the 2v2.

[Russ]

Signing/drafting a player partially because he is friend with Wembanayama would be opening a can of worm for Spurs. They haven't done it so far and I hope they won't do it.
If Spurs draft Raynaud, it should be only because of his level and not at all because of his link with Wembanyama.

Yeah, it's a double-edged sword.

You draft him to curry favor with your star.

But then what happens when you need to get rid of him?

[bluebellmaniac]

Yeah, it's a double-edged sword.

You draft him to curry favor with your star.

But then what happens when you need to get rid of him?

I think it really comes down to does he help us in a position of need and is he the best player for that position of need when his draft pick is up. If the answer is yes, then draft him.

[Russ]

I think it really comes down to does he help us in a position of need and is he the best player for that position of need when his draft pick is up. If the answer is yes, then draft him.

If he somehow falls to 38 you pretty much have to take him.

(Unless you can find a stud like Sidy Cissoko or Harrison Ingram.)

[John B]

They played together at times for Nanterre. In the classic video of a 16 year old Wemby scoring on Rudy Gobert, Raynaud is Wemby's partner in the 2v2.

Sold! He’s the guy.

[heyheymymy]

Wonder if Spurs play the bluff to see if Raynaud falls to #38 in a steal for them. At that pick SA could afford to swing on him and as a 2RP he would know his place/role level on the team and expendableness.

With CHA jumping for Salaun on that Spurs scouting trust and then even knowing he was going to be a long project still not really looking super worth it at least for now maybe it takes the wind out of the sails on copying San Antonio's homework right when we need it to most. I like Raynaud but I think it would be best if he somehow fell to #38 inexplicably vs. getting reached on at #14 and am seeking for factors that may lead to this. I fear Raynaud will impress in workouts and rise. I like other prospects more at #14, Sorber, Bryant perhaps. But Raynaud is intriguing draft selection reach notwithstanding.

[stnick2261]

I think I'd rather keep 14 and trade up from 38 with Brooklyn to take Raynaud. I know it's 3 rookies and they probably won't do that, but I believe I would.

Shoooot… I’d take 4 rookies this year. We need to cut out a bunch of dead weight. I’d call Brooklyn and see if they’d take Vassell and his contract (and #38) into their cap space for #19 & #26.

I’d take McNeeley, Fleming, and Reynaud.

PG/SG - Fox / Castle / Harper
SF - Sochan / McNeeley / Johnson
PF - Barnes / Fleming
C - Wemby / Reynaud

I think that adds so much BBIQ, Shooting, Defense, and Rebounding (everything we are missing while removing a negative player).

[scott]

Shoooot… I’d take 4 rookies this year. We need to cut out a bunch of dead weight. I’d call Brooklyn and see if they’d take Vassell and his contract (and #38) into their cap space for #19 & #26.

I’d take McNeeley, Fleming, and Reynaud.

PG/SG - Fox / Castle / Harper
SF - Sochan / McNeeley / Johnson
PF - Barnes / Fleming
C - Wemby / Reynaud

I think that adds so much BBIQ, Shooting, Defense, and Rebounding (everything we are missing while removing a negative player).

I really like this idea, but I'm taking Yaxel, Coward or Penda and Powell. Penda offers me more size than Coward and maybe the possibility to flex to be a situational 4... but Coward is probably going to be a better 3. Unfortunately I don't end up with a center, but then I'm offering Adams as much as the MLE I need and trying to see if I can get a 3rd C with the BAE

[ace3g]

https://x.com/DraftExpress/status/1925669690950484229

[drpill]

^Raynaud says in this interview that the Stanford walk-on story is false.


https://youtu.be/T_JXSYH-0ic?si=Xhy-sRCoPbp1Qw0_

[bluebellmaniac]

I really like this idea, but I'm taking Yaxel, Coward or Penda and Powell. Penda offers me more size than Coward and maybe the possibility to flex to be a situational 4... but Coward is probably going to be a better 3. Unfortunately I don't end up with a center, but then I'm offering Adams as much as the MLE I need and trying to see if I can get a 3rd C with the BAE

Which of those are you taking over Harper at #2?

SMH ..

[scott]

Which of those are you taking over Harper at #2?

SMH ..

We're talking about 14, 19 and 26. If you can't keep up with the conversation, maybe you shouldn't inject yourself into it.

[bluebellmaniac]

We're talking about 14, 19 and 26. If you can't keep up with the conversation, maybe you shouldn't inject yourself into it.

Wut?!!!

[Ice009]

Wut?!!!

They were talking about trading Devin Vassell and 38 for 19 and 16 with Brooklyn (not sure if Brooklyn goes for it).

[Splits]

I know y'all get invested with different options as the draft approaches, but the idea of the Spurs signing 4 firsts to guaranteed deals and developing all of them at the same time is really.... bad. We're talking Sochan/Wesley/Branham and Samanic/Keldon bad.

The only draft in recent memory you could argue they were able to develop 2 rookies simultaneously is the Vassell/Jones draft. The organization is not suited to do it and this year is no exception. I'd be reasonably surprised if 14 isn't moved for future capital.

[scott]

I know y'all get invested with different options as the draft approaches, but the idea of the Spurs signing 4 firsts to guaranteed deals and developing all of them at the same time is really.... bad. We're talking Sochan/Wesley/Branham and Samanic/Keldon bad.

The only draft in recent memory you could argue they were able to develop 2 rookies simultaneously is the Vassell/Jones draft. The organization is not suited to do it and this year is no exception. I'd be reasonably surprised if 14 isn't moved for future capital.

Well you are right about this - I don't even expect us to necessarily add more than 1 rookie on a guaranteed deal. We can all still talk about what *we* would do though (but honestly I wouldn't take 4 rookies either... I just have a longer list of late FRP prospect I like than normal.)

[Ariel]

Taking multiple rookies isn't the problem as much as taking projects, a group of Flagg/Harper + Lendeborg/Clifford + Kalkbrenner/Proctor isn't the same as another made of Ace Bailey/Fears + Newell/Essengue + Hugo Gonzalez/Hansen Yang. We just need to avoid multiple rookies in the latter category (like, say, Samanic, Primo, Blake Wesley, Hernandez, etc).

Multiple teams have done that with success, in 2021 New Orleans took Trey Murphy, Herb Jones and Jose Alvarado, while OKC took Giddey, Tre Mann, Jeremiah Robinson Earl and Aaron Wiggins; in 2022 OKC took Chet, Dieng, JDubb and Jaylin Williams. Imagine if those teams had said "we have too many rookies, let's take just one"? They would have missed on a lot of talent.

What the Spurs need to avoid is clogging the pipeline with projects that take their entire contract just to find out what you have and whether it's a viable NBA player, you should know in 2 years with 90%+ certainty whether you want to keep the player long term or not, and if not you just move on. But the draft is still a numbers game, and you need to take your chances even if you're good at it.

[scott]

Taking multiple rookies isn't the problem as much as taking projects, a group of Flagg/Harper + Lendeborg/Clifford + Kalkbrenner/Proctor isn't the same as another made of Ace Bailey/Fears + Newell/Essengue + Hugo Gonzalez/Hansen Yang. We just need to avoid multiple rookies in the latter category (like, say, Samanic, Primo, Blake Wesley, Hernandez, etc).

Multiple teams have done that with success, in 2021 New Orleans took Trey Murphy, Herb Jones and Jose Alvarado, while OKC took Giddey, Tre Mann, Jeremiah Robinson Earl and Aaron Wiggins; in 2022 OKC took Chet, Dieng, JDubb and Jaylin Williams. Imagine if those teams had said "we have too many rookies, let's take just one"? They would have missed on a lot of talent.

What the Spurs need to avoid is clogging the pipeline with projects that take their entire contract just to find out what you have and whether it's a viable NBA player, you should know in 2 years with 90%+ certainty whether you want to keep the player long term or not, and if not you just move on. But the draft is still a numbers game, and you need to take your chances even if you're good at it.

Someone print out 1000 copies of this and mail them to One Spurs Way Attn: Brian Wright.

[RC_Drunkford]

Taking multiple rookies isn't the problem as much as taking projects, a group of Flagg/Harper + Lendeborg/Clifford + Kalkbrenner/Proctor isn't the same as another made of Ace Bailey/Fears + Newell/Essengue + Hugo Gonzalez/Hansen Yang. We just need to avoid multiple rookies in the latter category (like, say, Samanic, Primo, Blake Wesley, Hernandez, etc).

Multiple teams have done that with success, in 2021 New Orleans took Trey Murphy, Herb Jones and Jose Alvarado, while OKC took Giddey, Tre Mann, Jeremiah Robinson Earl and Aaron Wiggins; in 2022 OKC took Chet, Dieng, JDubb and Jaylin Williams. Imagine if those teams had said "we have too many rookies, let's take just one"? They would have missed on a lot of talent.

What the Spurs need to avoid is clogging the pipeline with projects that take their entire contract just to find out what you have and whether it's a viable NBA player, you should know in 2 years with 90%+ certainty whether you want to keep the player long term or not, and if not you just move on. But the draft is still a numbers game, and you need to take your chances even if you're good at it.

couldn't have said it better. Reports say the Spurs are high on this class, so I hope we add 3 guys.

[Seventyniner]

couldn't have said it better. Reports say the Spurs are high on this class, so I hope we add 3 guys.

There was a lot of buzz over the years about the 2025 draft class being really deep. This year's Atlanta pick was viewed for a long time as being the most valuable of the assets the Spurs got in the Dejounte trade. It ended up being one ping-pong ball away from jumping to #1.

[RC_Drunkford]

There was a lot of buzz over the years about the 2025 draft class being really deep. This year's Atlanta pick was viewed for a long time as being the most valuable of the assets the Spurs got in the Dejounte trade. It ended up being one ping-pong ball away from jumping to #1.

I mean while people don't think it has a lot of All-Star level talent, this draft is loaded with role players. There are 30-40 players in this class who could stick in the NBA as solid contributors.

[OldMan88]

Interesting interview.

https://youtu.be/T_JXSYH-0ic?si=fwjIEc4t9-I6_Apd

[BatManu20]

Seems like a smart kid. Well-spoken and confident. Def the type of personality PATFO would like tbh.


pl8mu3E8FLk

[Ice009]

Man, the Spurs really need another pick in the first round if the really want Maxime. He seems like he'd fit the team great personality wise, but I just don't think pick 14 is the number to draft him at.

As someone said a day or two ago, this could be the last lottery pick the Spurs have for a while and I think you want to take a bigger swing for someone with upside to be a starting level player than a role player. I don't know, glad I don't have to make the decision. Maybe Raynaud could become a really, really good player worthy of picking at number 14. I really like him. Just watched that draft combine interview in the post above, and he's really sold himself nicely there. Definitely the type of person the Spurs would want. Darn, I wonder if the Stanford connection is going to come into play with Mitch.

[OldMan88]

I think getting hung up on not wanting to use the 14th “lottery pick” on a player that isn’t ranked that high is unproductive. I’m sure there are several higher ranked players that for one reason or another get erased from the spurs board after our #2 pick is taken. Now, all the players remaining get bumped up. Same thing happens on a smaller scale as other teams make their picks. It’s a dynamic process and deciding not to take someone with a particular pick number is just nuts. If it was that easy, it would only take a team a few seconds to submit their pick.

[scottspurs]

lol when I see “not ranked that high” that tells me all you do is form your opinion based on what others evaluations are. Go watch the player. Go look at stats and analytics. Go look at the measurements and athletic testing. The spurs don’t give a shit how high the player is ranked nor should you.

[John B]

Seems like a smart kid. Well-spoken and confident. Def the type of personality PATFO would like tbh.


pl8mu3E8FLk

”I’m actually the best 7 footer shooter in the history of NCAA with the most 3 pointer in the season.” Confident, but not humble. He’s a chess-player and a Stanford guy who excels in Science. A smart kid. He’s selling himself to teams as part of the process. I buy it, but I expect that alpha mentality to fuel that drive to continually get better. I don’t care how other people rank. Spurs could care less. Primo was against everybody’s opinion, but it didn’t deter the Spurs to draft him at 12th. And Reynaud checks a lot of boxes, and can play both 4 and backup 5. He’s a fellow Freshman. The more I read about him, the more I suspect he will be Spurs pick at #14. I still like a bruiser backup big at #38.

[John B]

Seems like a smart kid. Well-spoken and confident. Def the type of personality PATFO would like tbh.


pl8mu3E8FLk

”I’m actually the best 7 footer shooter in the history of NCAA with the most 3 pointer in the season.” Confident, but not humble. He’s a chess-player and a Stanford guy who excels in Science. A smart kid. He’s selling himself to teams as part of the process. I buy it, but I expect that alpha mentality to fuel that drive to continually get better. I don’t care how other people rank. Spurs could care less. Primo was against everybody’s opinion, but it didn’t deter the Spurs to draft him at 12th. And Reynaud checks a lot of boxes, and can play both 4 and backup 5. He’s a fellow Frenchman. The more I read about him, the more I suspect he will be Spurs pick at #14. I still like a bruiser backup big at #38.

[rascal]

Spurs should be able to trade themselves into a position to draft Raynaud while not buring the 14 pick on him.

[Allan Rowe vs Wade]

No more frenchies in the lottery this decade pls

[Dejounte]

He’s honestly in the same boat as Danny Wolf for me. Productive players but very… average looking. Doesn’t pop off the screen.

[Manu&Duncan fan]

Spurs should be able to trade themselves into a position to draft Raynaud while not buring the 14 pick on him.

That will be ideal! But there is always risk that another team takes him before us.

I don't think FO takes risk like that. If they really like Raynaud, they will likely draft him at 14.

[BatManu20]

Spurs should be able to trade themselves into a position to draft Raynaud while not buring the 14 pick on him.

Agreed. I know PATFO don't care about public opinion and will do whatever they please, but 14 is too high for Raynaud imo. There will be better, younger prospects on the board. Hopefully they go with the latter if they don't trade the pick altogether.

[Limguogolo]

Not a fan of this alpha side either. But it's not supposed to be something very American, this foolproof self-confidence?! Perhaps he has learned his lesson too well and is imitating local usage...

Overconfidence is rarely a good advisor. Seeing him join Victor in this sense would perhaps do him more harm by reinforcing him in this inclination... Intelligence should not turn into a spirit of superiority. And to be honest, this fault is sometimes even expressed on the floor: what's the point in spreading his legs so roughly and getting back on the basket when he dunks? It's anecdotal, but it can also reveal a form of arrogance. On the pediment of Stanford University is written this maxim in Latin "reflectum im rectum contemplus ut flexis". Which basically means "can't flex here."

Let him go to Boston. He will take the opportunity to continue his studies at Harvard... Oh no, not possible, the reigning alpha male has decided that foreigners are no longer welcome there.

(I have the solution: the Spurs keep the 14th pick, they exchange two second round picks for a third pick in the first round, they draft Alpha Raynaud, Raynaud does not score a single basket during the summer league, for x reason, the Spurs are dominant inside without him, and little by little, with regained humility, Beta Raynaud integrates into the rotation by putting himself at the service of his leaders.)

It's going to be a long time until the start of the season...

[stnick2261]

Any teams in the 15-25 range that could trade down to our #38 and multiple future 2nd round picks? That's probably not enough to move up, right?

[mudyez]

I'd like to get Flemming, then Sorber...but if both are gone, I'm totally fine with Maxime. In a perfect world, we can get two of them. If we invest some of our seconds it might be in play.

My guess is, the Spurs already promised Maxime the #14.

Btw: With all the Primo mentions, I would have thought, we took him at #6 or #7. Really forgot about it "only" being #12

[onechance87]

Are we sure raynaud not gonna be another zach collins type big?Cant handle another big clanking opens 3s
and getting bullied in the paint another 4 years.

[John B]

I'd like to get Flemming, then Sorber...but if both are gone, I'm totally fine with Maxime. In a perfect world, we can get two of them. If we invest some of our seconds it might be in play.

My guess is, the Spurs already promised Maxime the #14.

Btw: With all the Primo mentions, I would have thought, we took him at #6 or #7. Really forgot about it "only" being #12

It’s the picks after Primo that still hurt, Sengun #16, Trey Murphy #17, Jalen Johnson #20, Cam Thomas #27, Herb Jones #35 even Austin Reaves Undrafted. I just console myself that it all led to drafting Wemby

[Ariel]

It’s the picks after Primo that still hurt, Sengun #16, Trey Murphy #17, Jalen Johnson #20, Cam Thomas #27, Herb Jones #35 even Austin Reaves Undrafted. I just console myself that it all led to drafting Wemby
Santi Aldama, Aaron Wiggins, Moses Moody, Quentin Grimes, Ayo Dosunmu... That class was overflowing with useful players, it was one of the best drafts in recent memories, with really good players and even stars well into the second round, and Spurs managed to make the worst pick of the entire draft. You couldn't have made a worse pick if you had picked a name by writting each one on a piece of paper and drawing one at random.

[John B]

Santi Aldama, Aaron Wiggins, Moses Moody, Quentin Grimes, Ayo Dosunmu... That class was overflowing with useful players, it was one of the best drafts in recent memories, with really good players and even stars well into the second round, and Spurs managed to make the worst pick of the entire draft. You couldn't have made a worse pick if you had picked a name by writting each one on a piece of paper and drawing one at random.

I think it’s the point of the other thread. It wouldn’t hurt as much if it were a SRP but a Lottery pick? And where Reynaud would be picked at #14 if he turned out to be a bust at that high where other prospects were available at #14 who would turn out better. There is a higher risk of being a “stupid pick” going against the consensus.

[mudyez]

Ok

[Ariel]

Watched some of Raynaud in those raw clips Dejounte posted a while back. I don't love the catapulty shot from 3, plus I was surprised at some of his bad misses and finishes. Came away underwhelmed.

[drpill]

Watched some of Raynaud in those raw clips Dejounte posted a while back. I don't love the catapulty shot from 3, plus I was surprised at some of his bad misses and finishes. Came away underwhelmed.

Yeah actually I agree... I watched the same video and you summed it up pretty well. He also looked useless at times against players with a lot of size. His shot actually looks really bad; very little touch. Defense is not great at times. I don't think the Spurs would draft this guy; certainly not at 14 with multiple high upside wings available.

[Ice009]

I haven't watched a second of him, but darn, from what you guys say, I don't think I need to. His percentage look OK, but from what you guys are saying, I guess you need to actually use the eye test too. "Catapulty" doesn't sound good at all. I expected that he had a fairly normal looking set shot. Do you have a link to the clip/s?

[rascal]

Watched some of Raynaud in those raw clips Dejounte posted a while back. I don't love the catapulty shot from 3, plus I was surprised at some of his bad misses and finishes. Came away underwhelmed.

Agree

Shot mechanics look weird and he moves uncoordinated and a bit awkward, lacks quickness and explosiveness.
His size advantage can work at a lower level but not be as much of a factor in the NBA.

I don't see what people are seeing in this guy to consider drafting him at 14 or even in the first round.

[Ariel]

I haven't watched a second of him, but darn, from what you guys say, I don't think I need to. His percentage look OK, but from what you guys are saying, I guess you need to actually use the eye test too. Catapulty doesn't sound good at all. I expected that he had a fairly normal looking set shot. Do you have a link to the clip/s?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QtS-9GCpjoM
Playlist with 2025 draft class vids: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLcvWWzUR7OwbPMFOMCTbPOX7JQ9tzCFEo

[SpursFan86]

To the people who are actually saying they’d be fine/happy taking him at 14: can you honestly say you’d be saying the same thing if he wasn’t a French guy who was friends with Wemby?

It’s hard for me to imagine there not being at least 3 guys available at #14 that are clearly better prospects than Raynaud. And it’s even harder for me to imagine that anyone in their right mind thinks drafting a worse player for the sake of appeasing your franchise player is a good idea. If we want to waste a late SRP on some French dude then go for it, but you don’t do it with a fucking lottery pick :lol

If you’re advocating trading down from 14 or up from 38 then that’s a different story and I’m a little more open to the idea.

[Limguogolo]

I agree. And all this without mentioning the fact that he has one leg shorter than the other. Let's also not sweep the fact that his obsequious smile undoubtedly hides a sexual predator that we should be wary of. Ah, I forgot, he had leprosy as a child, coupled with a pubonic plague. I wish him the best in Leper Colony League.


Suddenly, Maxime Ray-no becomes good for the potter's field... Hey, he's just the king's fool, the queen's hidden lover.

[SpursGuy91]

We literally just rid ourselves of Zach Collins and now folks want to draft a slightly more mobile version of him…

[drpill]

We literally just rid ourselves of Zach Collins and now folks want to draft a slightly more mobile version of him…

Yep, someone mentioned Collins earlier and my PTSD kicked in... Combined with the clunky highlights it's become an easy no for me at 14. If he's there at 38, sure, we need a big body. Raynaud could be worthwhile but it's far too risky in the lottery.

[RobinsontoDuncan]

To the people who are actually saying they’d be fine/happy taking him at 14: can you honestly say you’d be saying the same thing if he wasn’t a French guy who was friends with Wemby?

It’s hard for me to imagine there not being at least 3 guys available at #14 that are clearly better prospects than Raynaud. And it’s even harder for me to imagine that anyone in their right mind thinks drafting a worse player for the sake of appeasing your franchise player is a good idea. If we want to waste a late SRP on some French dude then go for it, but you don’t do it with a fucking lottery pick :lol

If you’re advocating trading down from 14 or up from 38 then that’s a different story and I’m a little more open to the idea.


I'm not sure if Raynaud is my top choice for the Spurs at 14, but honestly I don't think it's as much of a stretch as folks are making it out to be. Raynaud doesn't get enough credit for his athleticism and fluidity at 7 feet. For those of you who remember Luka Samanic, Raynaud reminds me a lot of him from a pure athleticism standpoint, and of all the reasons why Luka didn't work out, that was really not the problem. I would almost argue that Raynaud is the more fully realized version of what the Spurs were hoping that Luka could be when they drafted him. He's also a really good rebounder, his shot is not theoretical, the data are real and he's a better shooter than most of the guards in this draft. He's also a really smart player -- the guy went to Stanford for the education, and was a basketball team walk-on. He was also an elite swimmer growing up which means he is shredded with lean muscle and can be a really really physically strong player in the Spurs athletic training and nutrition program. It also shouldn't be lost on people that he played in the ACC last year.

On defense, I have real questions. From what I've read, it sounds like he was a very strong and loud communicator on that end during the Combine scrimmages, which is a good sign. He has the athletic potential to be a good defender from a quickness and vertical pop perspective, and measurements. Whether he will be truly a plus player on that end remains to be seen, but his rebounding is statistically likely to translate which solves a major problem for the Spurs.

Here's the thing -- none of the other guys I'd consider at that pick are fully slam dunks either. I really like Fleming for instance, but his free throw percentage is a little concerning, and while he shot a solid percentage from 3, I just never felt super confident about his touch when he was taking them. I don't know how to explain it other than it had a tendency to hit a lot of iron before going in and when he missed, Fleming missed pretty badly at times. I wouldn't say the defense is as much of a question mark with him, but I would really need to be in the interview room to get a good sense of his BBall IQ given the level of comp he faced.

Thomas Sorber fits a lot of theoretical boxes for me. I like his size, strength, wingspan, and Stocks rate in the Big East. He gets rave reviews from analysts about his IQ, and I have no reason to doubt that, but I do have a lot of concerns about his lack of vertical pop (which was evident in film, and we do not have combine testing to say otherwise), his tendency to struggle against bigger and stronger players, and potential issues with his lateral quickness. He also is coming off a foot injury, and who knows how serious that is. All that said -- I am not convinced the defense will truly translate at the next level which is the primary reason I would draft Sorber.

Bryant I like a lot. I have been high on him for months and think he would be a really good player in the Spurs system. If he's available, I would have trouble picking between him and Raynaud because I like them both a lot and they both have the potential to check different boxes the Spurs really need (shooting, size) so I guess its a question of who is more ready to contribute right away and what do we need more of (perimeter defense or rebounding?)

//

All this is to say I think people are a little too low on Raynaud. Truth be told, I think teams would be smart to avoid drafting freshman bigs based on the last 20+ years of data we have on the draft. Bigs really need a lot of time to develop and grow as players because they have so much responsibility on the defensive end of the court. I think one of the reasons why we don't have the same level of talented big men as we once saw in the 70s, 80s, and 90s is that the trend of drafting younger, less experienced players and developing them during their most formative years in the NBA without much playing time has meant that the bust rate has just been really high. Most of the best bigs in NBA history actually spent 3 or 4 years in college and came to the league as more or less finished products.

[buttsR4rebounding]

I agree. And all this without mentioning the fact that he has one leg shorter than the other. Let's also not sweep the fact that his obsequious smile undoubtedly hides a sexual predator that we should be wary of. Ah, I forgot, he had leprosy as a child, coupled with pubonic plague. I wish him the best in Leper Colony League.


Suddenly, Maxime Ray-no becomes good for the potter's field... Hey, he's just the king's fool, the queen's hidden lover.

Did he pick that up from Primo?

[Ariel]

his shot is not theoretical, the data are real and he's a better shooter than most of the guards in this draft. He's also a really smart player -- the guy went to Stanford for the education, and was a basketball team walk-on. He was also an elite swimmer growing up which means he is shredded with lean muscle and can be a really really physically strong player in the Spurs athletic training and nutrition program. It also shouldn't be lost on people that he played in the ACC last year.
Raynaud is a career 34.7% 3P shooter (which is exactly the same he shot last season) and 73.2% from FT, that is far from a guaranteed shooter from the NBA 3pt line. I don't have the breakdown on his shots inside, but 46.7% overall and 53% from 2 doesn't impress me a great deal for a 7'+ center at the college level. Again, it's not like I've watched much of him (no games, mostly highlights and recently that raw clip I posted) but those stats are not the kind of "real data" that trumps all else.

[TD 21]

I think one of the reasons why we don't have the same level of talented big men as we once saw in the 70s, 80s, and 90s is that the trend of drafting younger, less experienced players and developing them during their most formative years in the NBA without much playing time has meant that the bust rate has just been really high. Most of the best bigs in NBA history actually spent 3 or 4 years in college and came to the league as more or less finished products.

Bigs (and players in general) are more talented than ever and will continue to incrementally become so going forward.

[Seventyniner]

Did he pick that up from Primo?

Is that why his shorts all fall down?

[RobinsontoDuncan]

Bigs (and players in general) are more talented than ever and will continue to incrementally become so going forward.

I really don't think there's a single non-Victor Big in the league that I would put on the same tier as David Robinson, Hakeem, Ewing, Duncan, Garnett, Shaq, or Kareem today. It's true those guys didn't shoot threes, but that doesn't mean those guys wouldn't totally dominate today. Giannis is hardly a 3 point shooter and half this board wants us to trade half our roster for him. That said, I don't really want to spend a lot of time arguing the point. I understand why someone would watch a guy like KAT and think he was more skilled than Robinson or Duncan, but I honestly think he would be a bench guy during an era when they actually played defense and called travels.

[RobinsontoDuncan]

To the people who are actually saying they’d be fine/happy taking him at 14: can you honestly say you’d be saying the same thing if he wasn’t a French guy who was friends with Wemby?

It’s hard for me to imagine there not being at least 3 guys available at #14 that are clearly better prospects than Raynaud. And it’s even harder for me to imagine that anyone in their right mind thinks drafting a worse player for the sake of appeasing your franchise player is a good idea. If we want to waste a late SRP on some French dude then go for it, but you don’t do it with a fucking lottery pick :lol

If you’re advocating trading down from 14 or up from 38 then that’s a different story and I’m a little more open to the idea.

I'm not making the decision here, so all I know is what I can see and read, but a 7 footer who can play defense out to the perimeter and do windmill dunks in transition is pretty enticing. He's a guy I would want to really get to know and workout before drafting because it's a big upside risk, but I think he's going to be a 10 year pro as a back-up center as his floor. That's not an ideal outcome for the 14th pick, but if they see something they really like I could understand the appeal with upside like that.

[pad300]

I really don't think there's a single non-Victor Big in the league that I would put on the same tier as David Robinson, Hakeem, Ewing, Duncan, Garnett, Shaq, or Kareem today. It's true those guys didn't shoot threes, but that doesn't mean those guys wouldn't totally dominate today. Giannis is hardly a 3 point shooter and half this board wants us to trade half our roster for him. That said, I don't really want to spend a lot of time arguing the point. I understand why someone would watch a guy like KAT and think he was more skilled than Robinson or Duncan, but I honestly think he would be a bench guy during an era when they actually played defense and called travels.

Jokic?

[RobinsontoDuncan]

Raynaud is a career 34.7% 3P shooter (which is exactly the same he shot last season) and 73.2% from FT, that is far from a guaranteed shooter from the NBA 3pt line. I don't have the breakdown on his shots inside, but 46.7% overall and 53% from 2 doesn't impress me a great deal for a 7'+ center at the college level. Again, it's not like I've watched much of him (no games, mostly highlights and recently that raw clip I posted) but those stats are not the kind of "real data" that trumps all else.

I'm not saying I think he's going to be Dirk. But unlike the other Bigs in this draft outside of Fleming -- who is far from a star shooter himself -- Raynauld has actually hit 3s at a pretty good clip in college. Sorber, Maluach (who I really like), Newell and Queen are all theoretical 3 point shooters -- decent FT shooters who seem to have some touch closer to the basket who you hope can get to a league average % from 3. That's all I mean.

[RobinsontoDuncan]

Jokic?

I wonder sometimes how well Jokic would do in the 90s or 00s. The athleticism he would have faced inside back then would have been much, much better than what he goes up against now. 50-50 on that.

EDIT: Giannis would almost certainly have been good in the 90s or 00s. He wouldnt have been able to get the same amount of fast break points and would have had to really bang down low for his points, but he would have probably have been an all star level player back then.

[Pauleta14]

I haven't watched a second of him, but darn, from what you guys say, I don't think I need to. His percentage look OK, but from what you guys are saying, I guess you need to actually use the eye test too. "Catapulty" doesn't sound good at all. I expected that he had a fairly normal looking set shot. Do you have a link to the clip/s?

If we've never heard of him and you watched Jokic shooting a 3, how would you describe it?

[BackHome]

If Bryant is gone and both Sober and Coward come up with medical red flags I would not having a problem drafting him and I still would try to get Adams to mentor him and Wemby.

[RC_Drunkford]

All I can say is that none of the 90s bigs would get locked up by Alex Caruso...

[ambchang]

The issue with the bigs today isn’t the bigs but eh way the rules are called. The league saw the explosion in popularity with Jordan, where a high flying athletic perimeter player do almost super human things on the court, but was stifled by the “dirty” pistons, so they changed the rules for him and made him king. He retired for the first time, the league ranked mightily because no one can score even with a number of ridiculously skilled bigs in hakeem, Shaq, robinson and Ewing with others such as mourning, smits, Daugherty and mutombo being main players on their very good teams. The leagues popularity tanked.

Then Jordan came back and all is good again. But then he retired again and the league realized that they can just loose the rules for these very athletic perimeter players to help push things alone. Kobe, iverson, tmac, Carter, stackhouse, all benefitted but player such as Shaq, duncan, and Weber still led the best teams. Then players like Garnett and Dirk, bigs who have perimeter skills are very popular and slowly try to encourage bigs to play like perimeter players too, and it worked. The easiest way to do it is to make it easier to score outside than it is inside, and here we are.