Enough with the Ace Bailey is better than Dylan Harper hype

[SanAntonioSpurs]

Enough with the Ace Bailey hype:
I read one article that said Bailey was the better choice because he's younger than Dylan Harper. Dylan Harper is 19 years old. He is months older. That's an example of the stupidity that I am reading.
The scouts aren't saying these things; amateurs are.

Ace Bailey is not 6'9". He is 6'7". That's what he measured at the combine. Stop saying 6'9". He shot 34.6% from 3. He has a shaky handle. He has poor shot selection.
"shaky handle, rough shot selection, defensive lapses and overall poor decision-making. "
"
Against pressure his handle was often wobbly on his hand and rolling up his wrist, and as a result his decision-making plummeted. This led to some abysmal assist-to-turnover and assist-to-usage numbers and also kept him away from the rim and the free throw line.
"
"in for a rude awakening"

See the advantage of he's 6'10" is that if he's an agile athlete, then you have your position-less basketball. The advantages are that when you're in a close playoff game and they force a switch to gain an advantage and isolate, there is no advantage because the guy is agile enough as a shooting guard to stay with a guard on the perimeter and has length to bother the shot and can defend the post against a big. The other advantage is that you can shoot over the top of almost everybody if you're a 6'10" shooting guard.

But then you find out he's 6'7" and so now he isn't that guy anymore. He won't get his shot off as easily, so you ask does he have a handle to free himself? Ace has a shaky handle. So that explains why he ends up with difficult shots and that explains why he only shot 34.6%. And so without the height and the handle, he is going to need a good handle to get a good shot in the NBA but he didn't have that in college and he won't be able to get it done in the NBA because he doesn't have the handle. So if you rely upon him for scoring, then you will see the same questionable shot-selection and poor shooting percentage.

So, you have a guy who is NOT 6'9 or 6'10" which is what intrigued people but is actually 6'7" and who has a shaky handle and who has questionable shot selection and decision making.

The lack of a handle normally isn't something that improves a great deal. You can develop shooting in a lot of players if they have good coaching and practice it. A handle isn't something that improves very often. Example are Tony Parker and Nephew.
You don't need to be a great athlete to be a good shooter. Larry Bird is an obvious example. To have an elite handle so you can become the primary ball handler requires some athleticism. You can develop that in Junior High and High School and college. If you arrive at the NBA without a handle, it's incredibly unlikely that you will develop into an elite ball handler and be trusted to be the primary ball handler for your team.

Again, you see what you think is a 6'10" shooting guard with good mechanics and you're excited and you don't focus on defects. You think of the advantages, that he can switch and the other team does not get an advantage and he can get his shot off without a problem.

But then you find out Ace is only 6'7" and now everything makes sense. He doesn't have a good handle, so he couldn't create separation and clean looks. So that's why, no wonder, he had questionable shot-selection and that's why he shot 34.6% from 3. And because of this, he's likely to repeat the same struggles in the NBA, likely to struggle to create separation and clean looks and so he will end up taking tough shots and shooting a low percentage and be inefficient.


There's a reason the consensus has Dylan Harper ahead of Ace Bailey.

[SpursFan86]

Are we on the same forum? Like 99% of discussion here has been around taking Harper or trading the pick. No one is talking about or contemplating using the pick to take Bailey :lol

[Leetonidas]

Weird thread. I don't think anyone here has said that Bailey is better than Harper :lol

[exstatic]

I think any Bailey advocacy on the forum evaporated when his measurements came out.

[CorrectCrusader]

He's 6'9 in shoes but whatever. We're not taking Ace and as far as I've seen I haven't seen anyone advocate for us doing that.

Harper is a spur.

[Wu36]

Not that I’d like to see the Spurs draft Bailey, but isn’t 6’7” barefoot 6’9” in shoes like every other player in the league? One inch short isn’t his issue.

[Guru of Nothing]

Finally, an Ace Bailey thread!

[K...]

your late op, were taking Khaman Maluach at two. Twin towers forever

[exstatic]

Not that I’d like to see the Spurs draft Bailey, but isn’t 6’7” barefoot 6’9” in shoes like every other player in the league? One inch short isn’t his issue.

I think that’s the whole point of the disappointment over his measurements. He was touted as 6’10””. If that’s barefoot, he could be Durant sized. Instead,he’s another guy.

[Wu36]

It could be. But I would have thought people would have listed him at 7 feet expecting 6’ 10” barefoot. Again I don’t want. I just think he has more to worry about than the top of his head.

[Chinook]

He's taller than Lebron and is tall enough to play either forward position just fine. If folks were basing their evaluation on anything more than that, that's silly.

[exstatic]

He's taller than Lebron and is tall enough to play either forward position just fine. If folks were basing their evaluation on anything more than that, that's silly.

It’s pretty well known that the taller you are for your position as a prospect, the more flaws teams will overlook. No one is saying he isn’t big enough to play his position, but if he had measure 6’10” barefoot instead of 6’7.5”, that puts him in a whole different category as a skill position prospect.

[dubross]

Being 6’9 with shoes with his skill set is not just another guy. With that being said Harper is the pick at #2

[scottspurs]

lol only hot take artists are saying Bailey is better than Harper. Some are even saying he is better than Flagg. Several current and former NBA players have said as much. I chalk it up to laziness. They watch the highlight videos and that’s it. If you watch just the highlights Ace Bailey looks like the best. Fadeaway jumpers, turnaround jumpers, contested jumpers, highlight reel dunks. Part of it might be the Caitlyn Clark effect of not wanting Flagg to be the best based on him being white. I really don’t know for sure.

That said Bailey does have alot of upside. I agree he is in for a surprise when he arrives in the NBA. He may struggle to start his career but with an attitude adjustment and continued development of his game I think he can be an all-Star level player. He has beautiful shot form. He will play at 6’8 with shoes. He shows a lot of skill at that size. He also doesn’t have a very tight handle at this juncture. One of the easiest things to work on though so that should improve. His floor is probably a Kelly Oubre level of player. Median outcome being Andrew Wiggins level of player. If it all comes together I could see a Tracy Mcgrady career arch. I would be a lot less worried about developing him than let’s say a Carter Bryant or Noa Essengue.

If the Spurs picked him I would be shocked and it would probably be spun as a better fit. In a world where the Spurs were assigned the 3rd pick in the lottery I definitely think he would be in the mix. If the Spurs trade down he will be considered. I like Tre Johnson, Kasparas Jakucionis and Derik Queen more. I think it’s a toss up between Bailey and Edgecombe. I wouldn’t fault the Spurs for picking him over any of those guys though. Now if they picked him over Flagg or Harper I would be upset and hope that I was wrong.

[Chinook]

It’s pretty well known that the taller you are for your position as a prospect, the more flaws teams will overlook. No one is saying he isn’t big enough to play his position, but if he had measure 6’10” barefoot instead of 6’7.5”, that puts him in a whole different category as a skill position prospect.

Eh. I don't disagree with you that some do it. But height is overrated in the NBA.

But how could folks not just look at Ace and know he wasn't seven feet tall (in shoes)?

[spursparker9]

Bailey ceiling is probably Brandon Ingram or a taller JR Smith.

Take Harper all day, any day

[Gagnrath]

Eh. I don't disagree with you that some do it. But height is overrated in the NBA.

But how could folks not just look at Ace and know he wasn't seven feet tall (in shoes)?


Height is not over rated, that's why you don't have someone Muggsy sized in the NBA today.

[mo7888]

Ypu take Harper @ 2. If you aren't sold on him you trade back with Philly or Charlotte and take Ace + assets. That said, if we keep the pick, Harper's the choice.

[exstatic]

Being 6’9 with shoes with his skill set is not just another guy. With that being said Harper is the pick at #2

6’9” guys with guard skills are an NBA type, meaning there are a number of them. 6’10”-6’11” guys with guard skills are not a type. That’s extremely rare.

No one is saying he’s too small or he can’t play his position. The fact is, scout drool over players who are tall for their positions. One of Harper’s non-skill attractions is the fact that he is a jumbo PG, 6’7”. There’s a perceived higher upside for oversized players at a given position. Bailey is no longer in that category. He actually measured out shorter than Flagg.

[TekXX]

Whole ass thread for one persons hot take but then again who knows, some guys step up at the next level.

[Chinook]

Height is not over rated, that's why you don't have someone Muggsy sized in the NBA today.

We're not talking about players who are undersized, though. We're talking about a player who is above-average height for his position not being super-above-average for this position.

[scott]

Glad we put that to bed… but when will someone be brave enough to say ENOUGH with the Hugo Gonzalez is better than Dylan Harper hype?!?!?!

[dubross]

6’9” guys with guard skills are an NBA type, meaning there are a number of them. 6’10”-6’11” guys with guard skills are not a type. That’s extremely rare.

No one is saying he’s too small or he can’t play his position. The fact is, scout drool over players who are tall for their positions. One of Harper’s non-skill attractions is the fact that he is a jumbo PG, 6’7”. There’s a perceived higher upside for oversized players at a given position. Bailey is no longer in that category. He actually measured out shorter than Flagg.

Yes an NBA type but there aren’t a lot of these guys. Can you name 10 players that are 6’9 and above that has the potential elite shot making and athleticism of Ace?

[baseline bum]

Ypu take Harper @ 2. If you aren't sold on him you trade back with Philly or Charlotte and take Ace + assets. That said, if we keep the pick, Harper's the choice.

And then you kill yourself if you do that trade because fuck off how are you trading Harper for Bailey.

[mo7888]

And then you kill yourself if you do that trade because fuck off how are you trading Harper for Bailey.

Obviously, I don't. I said "you take Harper", but i have no idea what the FO thinks about it and if they're determined to take Ace, for whatever reason, then get extra assets.

[baseline bum]

Obviously, I don't. I said "you take Harper", but i have no idea what the FO thinks about it and if they're determined to take Ace, for whatever reason, then get extra assets.

I know, but that needs to be the next move for any GM who takes Bailey over Harper.

[exstatic]

Yes an NBA type but there aren’t a lot of these guys. Can you name 10 players that are 6’9 and above that has the potential elite shot making and athleticism of Ace?

Can you name 2 who are 6’11+ legit, consistent shot makers? People had dreams of Ace being KD II. The numbers weren’t there, but if he had been 6’10”-6’11”, they could have squinted and seen it. Not so much at 6’7.5” barefoot.

[dubross]

Can you name 2 who are 6’11+ legit, consistent shot makers? People had dreams of Ace being KD II. The numbers weren’t there, but if he had been 6’10”-6’11”, they could have squinted and seen it. Not so much at 6’7.5” barefoot.

out of 450 players…6’9+ with shot making and elite athleticism is rare is all i’m saying. Hence you can’t name 10 out 450 players or I can’t name 2 besides KD that 6’11 or abovd. So again, it’s not like 6’9 players with Ace type is growing on trees, is all i’m saying. His potential is crazy but I don’t think he will get to his potential at all and he may have the highest ceiling. Again with that being said, he could be a bust and I’d take Harper any day over him.

[scott]

Can you name 2 who are 6’11+ legit, consistent shot makers? People had dreams of Ace being KD II. The numbers weren’t there, but if he had been 6’10”-6’11”, they could have squinted and seen it. Not so much at 6’7.5” barefoot.


out of 450 players…6’9+ with shot making and elite athleticism is rare is all i’m saying. Hence you can’t name 10 out 450 players or I can’t name 2 besides KD that 6’11 or abovd. So again, it’s not like 6’9 players with Ace type is growing on trees, is all i’m saying. His potential is crazy but I don’t think he will get to his potential at all and he may have the highest ceiling. Again with that being said, he could be a bust and I’d take Harper any day over him.

The next guy I think of after KD is Lauri... and then I draw blanks? It's definitely a rare archetype, even throughout history. Rashard Lewis? I bet KG and DRob would have been good 3pt shooters if that had been the style of play back in their day.

[spurraider21]

The next guy I think of after KD is Lauri... and then I draw blanks? It's definitely a rare archetype, even throughout history. Rashard Lewis? I bet KG and DRob would have been good 3pt shooters if that had been the style of play back in their day.
Chet and KP to some degree

MPJ comes close to the height. Peja was about 6'10 as well

[$pursDynasty]

I am a University of Alabama alum and we had the privilege of playing Rutgers last year. I was excited for my team, which was a potential national championship team, play a team with two top 4 NBA picks the following year. Alabama won, barely and I left the game heart racing because of Harper, with an extreme appreciation of Harper's skill. I remember thinking if this guy is the #2 prospect Cooper Flagg must be unreal. However Ace Bailey was barely noticeable, he played I don't know if he was coming off of an injury or anything but what I saw on the court was far from impressive. Side note even though we beat Rutgers and lost to Duke in the tournament I felt Harper was the better prospect than Flagg. Alabama took the court against the consensus top 3 draft prospects last year and neither of the other two impressed me as much as Harper. We also played Castle the year before and he was good, but he wasn't as impressive as Harper, however that might be because his team was deeper, so he didn't need to shine as much.

[KobesAchilles]

I was really high on Bailey before I found out his measurements. I’m not saying 6’7 is short or doesn’t have good height. But a legit 6’10 guy with shot making ability and a good form is very rare. I really can only think of KD that has that size and shot making ability. But at 6’7 I’m not taking him with the second pick. You take the guard with playmaking ability to pair with Wemby

[scott]

Chet and KP to some degree

MPJ comes close to the height. Peja was about 6'10 as well

Yeah I was thinking about Chet and KP, but at that point I think you start to get a drop off of athleticism that takes you more into the Wemby-sphere of things and there isn't the same level of fluidity of movement. Wemby is a freak, but he (nor Chet or KP) were the kind of athletic freak that DRob, KG, KD, etc. Even Lauri I think I'm kind of stretching a little bit... Lauri is a different type of athlete. The is fun to think about... MPJ's back kind of robbed him of the ability to fall into that "6'10"+, athletic sniper" category though.

Man, Peja was a bad mofo. I was hoping his son Andrej would become an elite prospect in the mold of his dad. He put up some nice scoring numbers in his sophomore season at Cal, but only shooting 31% from 3. 82% FT shooter though (although he was only 53% his Freshman year) so using's exstatic's favorite shooting signal, there might be some hope for him as an older prospect next year... though hopefully we'll be picking too high with that ATL swap to even consider him. The idea of a modern Peja is exciting though... do we think McNeeley could be that guy?

[scott]

I am an University of Alabama alum and we had the privilege of playing Rutgers last year. I was excited for my team, which was a potential national championship team, play a team with two top 4 NBA picks the following year. Alabama won, barely and I left the game heart racing because of Harper, with an extreme appreciation of Harper's skill. I remember thinking if this guy is the #2 prospect Cooper Flagg must be unreal. However Ace Bailey was barely noticeable, he played I don't know if he was coming off of an injury or anything but what I saw on the court was far from impressive. Side note even though we beat Rutgers and lost to Duke in the tournament I felt Harper was the better prospect than Flagg. Alabama took the court against the consensus top 3 draft prospects last year and none of them impressed me as much as Harper. We also played Castle the year before and he was good but he wasn't as impressive as Harper, however that might be because his team was deeper so he didn't need to shine as much.

Good report, thanks for sharing! Can't wait for the draft to get here so we can pick Dylan and put talk of anything else to rest :lol

[Ice009]

I thought Bailey was 6'8" two inches short of the 6'10" he was said to be before measurements? So is really 6'7" without shoes?

[scottspurs]

Bailey measured as 6’7.5 at the combine without shoes. So on the court he will be a shade under 6’9. Still pretty good height but most thought he would be 6’9 without shoes since Rutgers had him listed at 6’10. In theory he could still grow an inch but that extra 2-3 inches makes a difference. That’s what she said anyway

[spurraider21]

I thought Bailey was 6'8" two inches short of the 6'10" he was said to be before measurements? So is really 6'7" without shoes?
6'7.5 without shoes, and with a 7 foot wingspan

its still legitimately very good size for a 3

[scott]

6'7.5 without shoes, and with a 7 inch wingspan

its still legitimately very good size for a 3

The 7 inch wingspan concerns me. I think there may be health issues down the road.

I asked ChatGPT to draw me a 6'7.5" player with a 7" wingspan but it doesn't understand and just gives me Pokusevski instead

https://videos.openai.com/vg-assets/assets%2Ftask_01jwyhdcapf6dr5yvr0q88br1w%2F1749076 627_img_3.webp?st=2025-06-04T21%3A36%3A20Z&se=2025-06-10T22%3A36%3A20Z&sks=b&skt=2025-06-04T21%3A36%3A20Z&ske=2025-06-10T22%3A36%3A20Z&sktid=a48cca56-e6da-484e-a814-9c849652bcb3&skoid=3d249c53-07fa-4ba4-9b65-0bf8eb4ea46a&skv=2019-02-02&sv=2018-11-09&sr=b&sp=r&spr=https%2Chttp&sig=quaIEcw11LsUxqQY8%2FRrD5SrTxhGnDwjZklI%2BcUuYD w%3D&az=oaivgprodscus

[spurraider21]

:lol asshole

[Uriel]

Glad we put that to bed… but when will someone be brave enough to say ENOUGH with the Hugo Gonzalez is better than Dylan Harper hype?!?!?!
:lol