Rebounds

[RobinsontoDuncan]

So after the Pistons game the biggest problem minus the absence of Manu was the inability of the Spurs to control the boards, last night against the nuggest the spurs again were outrebounded in pretty impressive fashion.

I dont see the spurs winning anything without such a fundamental aspect of good defensive play, in 2003 and 2005 the spurs were a great rebounding team, I dont really see what changed.

Tim Duncan is still an amazing rebounder when he puts his mind to it (and health allows) and that's the one thing one should think Rasho would be capable of doing...altough it is highlty unlikely he is seriosuly capable of anything to be honest.... and Nazr was at his best last season snagging hustle offensive boards and following wit garbage man put back dunks.

Is there a solution to this rather important issue or is it simply a flaw in the 05-06 spurs?

I am more worried about a lack of defenisve...or really all around...tenacity in this team than anything else, the Pistons play with passion in what seems like every game, it seems like the spurs just dont bring it like they used to, especially when i think about rebounding, a category of defensive profesiency i have allways attributed to nothing more than hustle and guts.

Bring back the spurs, and take this sleeping giant away

[T Park]

Yes.

Give a crap and waste energy on games in December.


SPAM.

[raspsa]

Yeah, the poor rebounding isn't reassuring.. rebounding is an important part of the game and if you're going to play the game, you may as well play it the right way. No need to add another weakness aside from their traditional poor foulshooting.

[boutons_]

Something I noted earlier, and both teams have gotten worse in RBs since, is that while the Spurs are 13th in RB diff, the Pistons, with the Wallaces, "long 3" Tayshaun, and McDyess are 15th and NEGATIVE in RB diff.

http://www.nba.com/statistics/sortable_team_statistics/sortable2.html?cnf=1&prd=1#top

Utah is first in RB diff and hapless, helpless Knicks are 2nd.

I remember last season that the Spurs started out #1 about +8 RBs, then by about Jan settled down to +4.

I think this says both Spurs and Pistons are winning more, "lazily", with offense this year, certainly true for the Pistons, than with defense. No surprise that both will pick up the defense in the 2nd half of the season, and in the playoffs.

The stat that reflects more closely the teams actual records is the PPG diff.

http://www.nba.com/statistics/sortable_team_statistics/sortable1.html?cnf=1&prd=1#top

[leemajors]

nazr is averaging less offensive rebounds than rasho. i think you have selective memory about nazr last season, he usually pump faked 5 times and missed a layup or got blocked more than put it back with a dunk. nazr was good in the playoffs last year, but he has done nothing this season to warrant starting, rasho earned the job.

[Kori Ellis]

2005 the spurs were a great rebounding team, I dont really see what changed


Spurs are averaging 42.2 rebounds this season. Last season they averaged 42.5.

[Kori Ellis]

I remember last season that the Spurs started out #1 about +8 RBs, then by about Jan settled down to +4.

I don't know about that, but they were only +2 on the season last year.

[boutons_]

"Last season they averaged 42.5."

And last season they were top or near the top in RBs +diff. Now they are 13th.
It's crazy how stats vary from year to year.

Spurs are 48% in FG%, BEST in the NBA, that's hardly ever mentioned here or anywhere, because we're not a Hollywood, run-and-gun jump-shooting team.

[Kori Ellis]

And last season they were top or near the top in RBs +diff

Last season they finished the year at +2.2. Was that near the top?

[Kori Ellis]

One difference this year is on offensive boards. Last season 12.0 of their 42.4 rebounds were offensive. This season only 9.6 of their 42.2 are O.

Tim, Rasho and Nazr's O boards are all down a little this year. But Rasho and Nazr play less minutes than they did last season because the Spurs run a small lineup more often. Rasho's minutes are down 4mpg and Nazr's are down 5mpg.

[Spurminator]

They were 7th last year in differential. Not exactly a huge difference.

Lopsided rebounding performances like the Detroit game are disheartening, but hopefully rare and limited to early season. I don't think we're at a panic point yet.

[boutons_]

"+2.2. Was that near the top?"

I dunno. The NBA site doesnt have "sortable team stats" for previous season.

IIRC, the Spurs were in the Top3 in PPG and RB +diff, and about worst in opp. 3G% ( opp shot 3Gs very well) but best in opp #G attempts (but opp shot very few).

Maybe some other site has previous season's "sortable team stats"

[Brutalis]

Rebounding is not the problem. It's health, hitting open shots, and FTs. That imo needs work.

[pjjrfan]

Getting outrebounded is not a good sign, and giving up offensive rebounds is an even worse sign. But rebounding is effort and I feel that this team can do it, but for some reason has been having a hard time concentrating and getting it done. And it has cost them. The Hornets and Bucks won because they kept getting offensive boards.

It's a problem that I think Pop won't let get out of hand.

[Solid D]

A lot of rebounding is effort and the Spurs can improve on their effort.

The Spurs offensive rebounds are down this year but I see part of the reason being that the Spurs lead the NBA in FG%. They are also spreading the floor and running a lot of screen rolls, leaving themselves with only one player in position to rebound. A severe example of this was in Detroit, where the Spurs had no interest in sending their players at the wing and corner to the boards. They took away most of the transition opportunities with this approach but to the detriment of offensive rebounding position.

The best rebounding teams aren't necessarily the best teams, as others have mentioned before. They are certainly not the best indicator of defensive ability. Opp FG% and points allowed are much better indicators, with the former being the most important indicator over a season.

The Spurs are starting to improve in these two areas, as evidenced in reverse order of games:
Denver .342 and 88 points
NOKC .416 and 84 points
Indy .456 and 86 points
Det .416 and 85 points

This has led to the Spurs taking over the #1 position in the NBA for Opp. FG% and the #2 position (behind Memphis) in points allowed 89.96. I'd say that is a healthy trend, wouldn't you?

The Spurs do need better effort on rebounds, though, no question.

[RogerIsEatingASandwich]

if it was playoff time , then i'd be worried

[bonesinaz]

So after the Pistons game the biggest problem minus the absence of Manu was the inability of the Spurs to control the boards, last night against the nuggest the spurs again were outrebounded in pretty impressive fashion.


The piston game was an anomaly. No Manu and TD hurt. TD could not hit FTs to save his life for a few games and I think it is b/c of his plantar fasciitis. Playing a revengeful piston team at the palace in December without Manu and a slow TD=loss.

As for the Nugget game...
The Spurs did get out-rebounded in the first half against the Nuggets. But they out-rebounded the Nuggets 20-19 in the 2nd half. If you break down the game this way, you would have been encouraged, not discouraged.

It seems like Pop had a talk with the Spurs at the half and told them to go and win the last 2 quarters. They did that. I am happy with the win.

[pjjrfan]

It's not that the Spurs are getting less offensive rebounds, it's that they are giving up too many offensive rebounds to the opposition. And for a stretch there they got just plain outrebounded.

[RobinsontoDuncan]

If the Spurs are unable to keep the wallaces and prince off the offensive glass there can be no repeat

[leemajors]

it's also impossible to repeat in january.

[Rummpd]

Free Nazr and Oberto for more minutes and the rebounds will come, Rasho and Horry have their strengths but rebounding on a consistent basis is not one of them.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

Rebounding is usually a reflection of effort, similar to the Spurs overall free throw attempts being down this year so far.

I'll stand by the theory that this team just hasn't shifted into high gear yet.

It's hard to analyze the regular season, especially at this point. The team has the second best record in basketball, so there probably hasn't been the need to crank it up. My guess is that you'll see a lot more focus as we get closer to playoff time.