Malik out of rotation

[SlovenianGuy]

Brown has used a ridiculous 19 different starting lineups in 28 games and usually plays all 12 players.

"I never done that my whole life," Brown said. "I'm trying to figure out who to play. I've always been comfortable with eight or nine and that's eventually what we're going to have to do."

The Knicks' newly acquired busts, center Jerome James and shooting guard Quentin Richardson (who will miss tonight's game with a sore back against his old club), likely will be out of the rotation, as will Malik Rose.

link (http://realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/38529/20060102/lb_to_permanently_insert_lee_into_starting_five/)

[ZStomp]

Sucks to be a Knicks fan. :lmao

[ducks]

seems if rose is the the contract ferry would find a way to get him to the cavs

pacers could use a player like rose
they have NO LEADERSHIP On the team

[leemajors]

yeah he's really giving the knicks some leadership, fighting naked in the bathroom and welching on bets.

[Bruno]

Knicks have tons of PFs (Malik, Antonio Davis, Maurice Taylor, Frye and Lee).
Malik played some SF this year and the result was obvious : he sucks.
Stupid Isiah, he can't even make a balanced roster.

[SequSpur]

malik rose blows.

[Bloodline666]

Knicks have tons of PFs (Malik, Antonio Davis, Maurice Taylor, Frye and Lee).
Malik played some SF this year and the result was obvious : he sucks.
Stupid Isiah, he can't even make a balanced roster.
Isiah Thomas is CLEARLY not good at managing a team. If I remember correctly, he at one time owned the CBA, and that league almost went bankrupt during his tenure there.

[bigbendbruisebrother]

When is Malik's albatross (er.. contract) up?

[exstatic]

Did anyone else see Buck Harvey's the year ahead column spoof? He said that Malik was opening a third restaurant with a NY Knicks theme, but you'd need reservations, because dinner was only served in 4 minute increments...:lol

[angel_luv]

Poor Malik. I would love to see him out of New York and to a better team.

[wildbill2u]

seems if rose is the the contract ferry would find a way to get him to the cavs

pacers could use a player like rose
they have NO LEADERSHIP On the team

Leadership is overrated when compared to ability. Another coach (who some believe to be the best in the game) has found Malik wanting.

Maybe now some of our posters will admit that getting rid of MaLIK and his fat contract was a good move by our coach and FO. Nah, probably not.

By the way, I loved Malik for his contributions, but it was time for him to go to greener pastures to reap the reward of that contract.

[angel_luv]

The Spurs were the ones who gave Malik the contract. They must have felt he was worth it. Our franchise is not careless with its money.

[leemajors]

well in a contract year players can play above their ability. it was obvious after he got that contract he wasn't worth it, thus a sucker was found to dump him off on.

[rascal]

I new Rose wasn't any good and wanted him off the spurs for a long time but many here thought he was so important for the spurs.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Malik was worth it when he signed his deal. Also, part of that was a nugget thrown to his agent, who also happened to represent some guy named Tim who was up for a new contract the following season.

After signing that contract Malik was never the same player again, save 1 of every 20 games where he felt like getting off his ass and doing something besides trying to shoot every time he got the ball and throw passes to the guy in the fifth row wearing the Duncan jersey.

Sadly, some people will come along and post about what Malik did back in 99 and 2002 and call Holt Cat cheap, despite the magnificently obvious fact he can't even get off the bench on one of the worst teams in the league.

[Rummpd]

Brown is the one that is so over-rated.

Rose could give that team 10 good minutes a game and provide needed rebounding and leadership but Brown cannot friggin decide what he wants.

[Kori Ellis]

The Lakers offered Malik a similar contract and the Spurs thought Malik was worth keeping for that price rather than let him go to a rival. That's why he got that contract from the Spurs. I don't even think Babby was Malik's agent at that point.

[2centsworth]

Malik seems like a nice guy.

[rascal]

So what if he went to the Lakers. That contract was a mistake for a bench player. The spurs were lucky to unload him.

[angel_luv]

The Lakers offered Malik a similar contract and the Spurs thought Malik was worth keeping for that price rather than let him go to a rival. That's why he got that contract from the Spurs. I don't even think Babby was Malik's agent at that point.


Malik as a Laker! That would have been awful.

[Kori Ellis]

So what if he went to the Lakers. That contract was a mistake for a bench player. The spurs were lucky to unload him.

In hindsight, sure. But at the time, the Spurs thought he was worth it -- he was a bench player getting significant minutes. The contract started out less than 5M/year. That (to them) was reasonable if he was getting playing time. But when he ended up not, then it was no longer worth it for them.

If the Spurs are keeping Rasho, and everyone wants Nazr re-signed too. Then one of them is going to be a bench player making even more money than that.

[rascal]

Why would it be awful?

[angel_luv]

Cause it would have been one of our hometown favorites to our most hated ( at the time) rival.

[rascal]

Some of us had the foresight to say keeping Malik for that contract was not a good move. Nazr and Rasho are more valuable than Malik would have been.

[leemajors]

yeah who knows maybe if he felt he was spurned he would have tried.

[rascal]

Cause it would have been one of our hometown favorites to our most hated ( at the time) rival.


Hometown favorites? Let it go. Don't keep lousy players due to attached sentimental feelings. Let logical moves to improve the team dictate what you desire not some crush on a player or sentimental feelings.

[Kori Ellis]

Some of us had the foresight to say keeping Malik for that contract was not a good move. Nazr and Rasho are more valuable than Malik would have been.

How do you figure?

Malik's numbers as a Spur even in his worst season averaged 6 and 5 in 17mpg.

Nazr averages about 5 and 3 in 13mpg and Rasho averages 6 and 5 in 22mpg.

I don't even like Malik that much, but Rasho/Nazr are just as bad (if not worse) deals than him.

[rascal]

Yes they are not good deals either. Your splitting hairs with those numbers. I consider none of the players as impact players. I'd rather have Nazr than Rose.


The NY fans did not like the Nazr/Rose trade. Felt that the Knicks were getting screwed.

I never liked Rasho and don't understand what Pop saw in this guy. He plays small for his height.

That was the big free agent acquisition everyone waited 3 years for.

[Kori Ellis]

The NY fans did not like the Nazr/Rose trade. Felt that the Knicks were getting screwed.

True. But he hasn't exactly panned out here so far either. Putting up 5 and 3 isn't exactly an upgrade from whatever Malik did here. Nazr had his moments in the playoffs, but he still hasn't learned much of anything on D. If he wants a raise this summer, then I don't think the Spurs can keep him. If he's willing to take a pay cut and a 3 year deal or something, then maybe. (Unless he vastly improves this season)

Rasho has a use here - he's a good position defender and he stays out of Tim's way. Of course he needs to be a lot more aggressive on offense. But again, he was best available big man at the time the Spurs got him. Who did you want? Olowokandi?

[rascal]

Rose wasn't going to do much for the spurs anymore. Didn't he and Pop have some arguments or some differences also about shot selection and playing time?

[Kori Ellis]

Rose wasn't going to do much for the spurs anymore. Didn't he and Pop have some arguments or some differences also about shot selection and playing time?

Shot selection, yes. Malik never complained about playing time. I'd imagine that Nazr isn't really happy with 18mpg right now. I hope that doesn't become an issue.

[rascal]

Nazr wasn't going to put up big numbers on the spurs as long as he is playing with Duncan. But before the trade last year with the Knicks he was having a good year until he got injured.

Even Robinson sacrificed numbers towards the end when duncan got most of the looks and shots and became the primary focal point for inside offense.

[ChumpDumper]

How quickly people forget the kind of money that was being thrown at big men before the luxury tax had any bite....

Alan Henderson ............. $7,091,250
Eddie Robinson ............. $5,687,000
Michael Stewart ............ $4,160,000
Evan Eschmeyer ............. $3,103,800
Corliss Williamson ......... $4,500,000
Chris Mills ................ $6,000,000
Kelvin Cato ................ $6,696,000
Austin Croshere ............ $6,960,000
Derek Strong ............... $4,212,000
Rick Fox ................... $4,340,231
Brian Grant ................ $11,027,862
Jason Caffey ............... $5,250,000
Jim McIlvaine .............. $4,400,000
Clarence Weatherspoon ...... $4,991,800
Travis Knight .............. $4,000,000
Bo Outlaw .................. $6,585,000
Lawrence Funderburke ....... $3,300,000
Vitaly Potapenko ........... $5,238,750
Calvin Booth ............... $4,992,900
Jerome James ............... $4,546,000
Greg Ostertag .............. $7,799,996
Loy Vaught ................. $5,364,964
Christian Laettner ......... $5,062,500
Jahidi White ............... $4,903,750

All in the same season as Malik's new deal. Let's not pretend there isn't a market and that the Spurs' decisions are made in a vacuum.

[T Park]

I never liked Rasho and don't understand what Pop saw in this guy. He plays small for his height.

That was the big free agent acquisition everyone waited 3 years for

damn,

you talk about not wanting to let something go.


yeesh.

[missmyzte]

Malik as a Laker! That would have been awful.
I personally think Malik as a Laker is a fantastic idea :)

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Kori, stats are only part of the picture. I can't even remember the number of times taller guys (Dirk in particular) just reared up and shot jumper after jumper over Malik's outstretched arms, not to mention the last two years of Malik on the Spurs when he got outhustled by other teams' hustle players and outjumped for rebounds like a midget trying to fight Manute Bol and Gheorge Muresan for a rebound.

[Kori Ellis]

Kori, stats are only part of the picture. I can't even remember the number of times taller guys (Dirk in particular) just reared up and shot jumper after jumper over Malik's outstretched arms, not to mention the last two years of Malik on the Spurs when he got outhustled by other teams' hustle players and outjumped for rebounds like a midget trying to fight Manute Bol and Gheorge Muresan for a rebound.

Nazr is a horribly sucky defender. So I didn't want to start comparing defense.

It's better just to stick to O if you are trying to make Nazr look good.

[Kori Ellis]

By the way, AHF, where's Nazr's 10 and 10?

[angel_luv]

I personally think Malik as a Laker is a fantastic idea :)

Well he would be the best thing that has come to that franchise in a long time. ;) :lol

[Tek_XX]

Malik was our energy guy, and when he started to get out hustled it was time for him and his contract to go.

[T Park]

where's Nazr's 10 and 10?

pretty had to do that playing 10 to 12 minutes a night.

And Pop thinking that the All Star Oberto was playing great for some reason against Denver.

[E20]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v99/TurqHardConec/FreeNazr.jpg

[angel_luv]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v99/TurqHardConec/FreeNazr.jpg


You want the team to let Nazr go?






;) :lol

[Obstructed_View]

Some of us had the foresight to say keeping Malik for that contract was not a good move. Nazr and Rasho are more valuable than Malik would have been.
And some of us are full of shit and have 20/20 hindsight. Besides, if you look at it, the Spurs didn't keep Malik for that contract, they traded it for value. The fact is that the contract was worth it just to keep Malik from the Lakers, and the Spurs turned it into a starting center for a championship run (with an expiring contract).

[exstatic]

Basicly, SA traded Malik for a larger Malik with a MUCH shorter contract. Anyone who thinks that Nazr is coming back next year should put on the dunce cap at this time and go stand in the corner.

[leemajors]

pretty had to do that playing 10 to 12 minutes a night.

And Pop thinking that the All Star Oberto was playing great for some reason against Denver.


i thought oberto was playing pretty well. then again i must think he is an all star anyway. nazr got some minutes and seemed ineffective. i'm sure if pop thought nazr's play warranted more playing time he would get it. i was glad oberto did get some minutes though.

[Notorious H.O.P.]

The Lakers offered Malik a similar contract and the Spurs thought Malik was worth keeping for that price rather than let him go to a rival. That's why he got that contract from the Spurs. I don't even think Babby was Malik's agent at that point.


I don't think so either. I remember it having more to do with the idea that Malik is/was Tim's best friend and they thought it might have some weight with Tim's decision to stay.

I doubt it was a clear green light for the Spurs after that but if it made Tim feel easier about staying they it was worth it, especially since we don't have the contract anymore.

Unfortunately, the Spurs are usually pretty lucky with their draft picks despite their end-of-round status and we had to give two to the Knicks. If Nazr could just "get it", then it would definitely be worth it. If he doesn't, the Spurs, the Knicks and Malik all suffered from it.

Malik's problem after the contract is the pressure he put on himself to play up to it. All Pop wanted was hustle, energy and effort. Malik thought he needed to be mini-Duncan from an offensive standpoint.

Once he got the ball, it was unlikely he was going to give it up. He forced way too many shots, especially in the post against guys way taller than him. He became too emotional on the court (some would say off also) and it cost the Spurs momentum at times when he would commint silly fouls that had no purpose.

I loved the old Malik as a player and I love the current Malik as a person, but unless he can bring back some of the old traits and put away the current bad ones, he is going to continue to have problems.

If he uses these experiences to get his mind straight, then if he can be moved someplace that needs a PF (unlike NY), he can begin to contribute again. If he doesn't and starts developing an attitude because he feels he's been slighted, then he is going to have a miserable time in NY until his contract is up.

[spurschick]

Hmmmm.... when is the trade deadline again? I'd be interested in a vbookie to see what kind of money people would throw down to say who will go, if anyone. :hat

[angel_luv]

All I know is who had better not go.

[SequSpur]

I knew Malik sucked before he ever played for the Spurs... the next time the Spurs want to save money or make a smart decision, they should send me a pm.

[pjjrfan]

seems if rose is the the contract ferry would find a way to get him to the cavs

pacers could use a player like rose
they have NO LEADERSHIP On the team

I agree with this, I think the Cavs, Bulls, and Wizards, young teams with some good talent could use someone like Malik in the lockerroom and bench. Of course they would have to curtail the gambling. :lol :lol

[FromWayDowntown]

Of course they would have to curtail the gambling. :lol :lol

And make a rule that Malik can't be in the shower at the same time as a smallish point guard.

[Johnny_Blaze_47]

I knew Malik sucked before he ever played for the Spurs... the next time the Spurs want to save money or make a smart decision, they should send me a pm.

They'll probably send you a PM the next time they need a fill-in for the Uniform Races.

[Vashner]

Remember that year when like David Robinson was gonna come up for the draft and our season was REALLY bad..

Well this is like that.. it's basically a wreaking ball "UNDER CONSTRUCTION" should be put on the Knicks website..

Then take that sign off on draftday.....

[ducks]

New York Knicks indefinitely suspended Jerome James
seem if rose gets any minutes
rember thomas just inked james to a 30 million deal

[Dre_7]

Nazr averages about 5 and 3 in 13mpg and Rasho averages 6 and 5 in 22mpg.

If Pop were to switch around those MPG, Nazr would have better numbers than Rasho. Especaily the rpg!

[ChumpDumper]

Well, Malik got four minutes in tonights three-overtime game....

[ChumpDumper]

If Pop were to switch around those MPG, Nazr would have better numbers than Rasho. Especaily the rpg!And our opponents' FG% would be about five points higher....

[Vashner]

Hum... Artest to Knicks??

[bigbendbruisebrother]

Well, Malik got four minutes in tonights three-overtime game....

Unbelievable! Having watched a those double OT games last season, I learned that everybody plays when it gets that late. Talk about writing on the wall for Malik.

How's this for a line. In a triple overtime game...

Malik played 4 minutes, 33 seconds. He did not attempt a shot. He hit two free throws. He racked up one rebound. He committed one foul and turned the ball over once. :lol

[whottt]

Malik was worth it when he signed his deal. Also, part of that was a nugget thrown to his agent, who also happened to represent some guy named Tim who was up for a new contract the following season.

After signing that contract Malik was never the same player again, save 1 of every 20 games where he felt like getting off his ass and doing something besides trying to shoot every time he got the ball and throw passes to the guy in the fifth row wearing the Duncan jersey.

Sadly, some people will come along and post about what Malik did back in 99 and 2002 and call Holt Cat cheap, despite the magnificently obvious fact he can't even get off the bench on one of the worst teams in the league.


False, Malik's best year was the second year after he signed his contract...the year we won the second championship...his second best year was the first year after he signed it...he played huge in that Lakers series we lost.

Malik put up 10 and 6 off the bench and went for about 15 and 10 when DRob was injured in 03...

I am still waiting for Rasho or Nazr to put up 10 and 6 as a starter....much less off the bench.

[ChumpDumper]

Well, the minutes will change at some point after the next big trade.

[whottt]

Brown will get the Knicks turned around...but I am not too surprised Malik and Brown aren't exactly a match made in heaven...few are with Brown...including David Robinson.