The Truth About Nazr

[TDMGTP]

NBA Finals vs detroit

game 1: 26min 4-8FG 2-2FT 7REB(4 on OFF) 2BLK 10pts
game 2: 25min 1-2FG 4-5FT 5REB(3 on OFF) 2BLK 6 pts
game 3: 15min 2-4FG 0-2FT 7REB(3 on OFF) 0BLK 4pts
game 4: 15min 2-6FG 0-0FT 5REB(3 on OFF) 0BLK 4pts
game 5: 25min 3-4FG 0-0FT 3REB(1 on OFF) 0BLK 6pts
game 6: 22min 1-3FG 2-2FT 8REB(5 on OFF) 0BLK 4pts
game 7: 22min 0-3FG 0-0FT 7REB(1 on OFF) 2BLK 0pts -had one very important block

For the min he got, he was not so bad.

vs Denver
G1 34min 7-9FG 1-2FT 15REB(9 on OFF) 1AST 2SLT 4BLK 15pts-must have some talent
G2 23min 0-2FG 4-4FT 7REB (0 on OFF) 1AST 4pts
G3 20min 1-2FG 1-4FT 3REB (3 on OFF) 3pts
G4 26min 2-4FG 2-2FT 7REB (5 on OFF) 1BLK 6pts
G5 32min 3-7FG 4-6FT 13REB(4 on OFF) 1AST 1STL 1BLK 10pts

vs Seattle

G1 23min 1-4FG 1-2FT 7REB (3 on OFF) 2STL 1BLK 3pts
G2 24min 3-7FG EVEN 1-1 3PG 10REB (4 on OFF) 1BLK 7pts
G3 16min 3-3FG 1-2FT 3REB (0 on OFF) 7pts
G4 14min 1-2FG 0-0FT 3REB(1 on OFF) 1BLK 2pts
G5 20min 8-10FG 3-5FT 7REB(3 on OFF) 1AST 19pts ***RASHO NEVER & vs dirty sea
G6 27min 6-9FG 0-0FT 8REB(5 on OFF) 1AST 1STL 1BLK 12pts

vs PH
G1 23min 4-7FG 1-2FT 7REB(4 on OFF) 1AST 2BLK 9pts
G2 28min 5-10FG 1-2FT 8REB(5 on OFF) 3STL 2BLK 11pts
G3 19min 4-6FG 1-2FT 4REB(2 on OFF) 1AST 1SLT 9pts
G4 24min 4-8FG 0-0FT 8REB(4 on OFF) 1BLK 8pts
G5 17min 1-3FG 2-3FT 2REB(1 on OFF) 1STL 1BLK 4pts

okay nazr in the playoffs produce tons of second chances, scored very well in some games where he got lots of mins, and he GETS TO THE FT line too...and lets not forget he was a midseason aquisition and he just steped up after rasho got hurt...
AGAIN his defense might not be the best YET because he is a slow learner and pop refuses to put him in during the regular season games where he can get his bad habits out and make his mistakes, and FUCK who CARES about the regular season HIS DEFENSE OBVIOUSLY DIDNT HURT US ENOUGH LAST YEAR BECAUSE HE GOT A RING SO EVERYONE STF UP ABOUT THAT..."OH HIS DEFENSE SUCKS" "OH HE FOULS TOO MUCH" "OH NAZR LOOKS LOST" BITCHES WE GOT A RING WITH HIM LAST YEAR OKAY LET HIM IMPROVE AGAIN HE IS A SLOW LEARNER ESPECIALLY SINCE D IS MORE X'S AND O'S and REMEMBERING STUFF MAYBE HE SHOULD BE READING WHILE HE ON THE BENCH CUZ OF FUCKEN POP.

NAZ MAN IS TIGHT THOUGH...LETS BE REAL WE NEED HIM IN THERE.

[TDMGTP]

AGAIN WHEN GIVEN MINS:
If you can recall on Xmas day vs detroit NAZR started the second half and he was extremely active 17 min 5-7FG 5 rebounds(2 on O) even 1ast and 10pts.

[Man In Black]

What you need is for him to prove he knows how to play the Spurs way. Pop's principle mistake is letting Fin start above Manu in a game in which a good start is needed.

[TDMGTP]

SON how can he prove that when he is not getting any mins? and he was your starting center that helped you get a RING, WHY QUESTION THAT? AND how is that now playing spurs way??

I like nazr and I love the spurs, he should just say "fuck you spurs(pop)" after this season if they dont give him his rightful time and just go play somewhere else(although I would hate that) and become an ALL-STAR center cuz he is capable of it.
I'm tired of the pop playing all these mind games, and doghouse bs just play him 10 games and we will see.

[vincerodriguez23]

i think Nazr should be the man starting at center. hes alot more dominant than rasho.

-Hey TDMGTP, i know nazr has at least 2pts in game 7 of the finals, i remember he dunked in the fourth qtr.

[Man In Black]

SON how can he prove that when he is not getting any mins? and he was your starting center that helped you get a RING, WHY QUESTION THAT? AND how is that now playing spurs way??

I like nazr and I love the spurs, he should just say "fuck you spurs(pop)" after this season if they dont give him his rightful time and just go play somewhere else(although I would hate that) and become an ALL-STAR center cuz he is capable of it.
I'm tired of the pop playing all these mind games, and doghouse bs just play him 10 games and we will see.

Y'all played organized hoops right? When do you set yourself and show that you deserve that time on the court?

It's called practice. He should earn his minutes. Fin got the well, the guy in front of you got hurt, so you'll start spot. That was Nazr's last year.

And all he had to do to hold it was play better during practice.
Right now, he is getting about as much time as Beno.

Practice man...ya know practice?

[TDMGTP]

i checked the box score again, its has him at 0pts.

[TDMGTP]

dont start with the practice bullshit, you give ur starting center from championship team 2 mins...pop your a fool for this one.

[Man In Black]

If he was so friggen awesome in the playoffs LAST YEAR, then smart guy, please tell us why he is doing such a horrible impersonation of himself THIS YEAR?
Especially after another 4 months of practicing and playing with the team?

[vincerodriguez23]

i checked the box score again, its has him at 0pts.

really? i swear he dunked in the fourth qtr. i remember watching it on my spurs championship DVD. two handed dunk, uncontested.

[TDMGTP]

recall he missed offseason because wife had labor complications, and RASHO has been here longer and he still sucks ass...Id take my chances with NAZR although he is a slow learner on D, he is way more talented

[SouthernFried]

There is something else going on with Pop and Nazr. Mebbe it's a business thing, mebbe it's a personality thing. He is better than Rasho, even with some defensive lapses. Why he's not playing more, I don't think has anything to do with practice time or on the court abilities.

Just my .02

[intlspurshk]

Naza + Barry for PJ Brown or Joel Pryziblla + filler. IF Pop don't use him, trade him then.

[Man In Black]

sure let's just give it to him. hell start sean marks. he dunks hard too

[TDMGTP]

"oh he dunks hard too" NoOoOoOoO
u must be slovenian or just plain stupid. stop fighting it.

[Slomo]

"oh he dunks hard too" NoOoOoOoO
u must be slovenian or just plain stupid. stop fighting it.
Slovenian=plain stupid.

thanks, it makes ignoring your posts so much easier. :flipoff

[Slo spurs fan]

"oh he dunks hard too" NoOoOoOoO
u must be slovenian or just plain stupid. stop fighting it.
Ahm, Filipines = Slovenia??? :lol :lol :lol

You must be "that stupid American". (Sorry all other American friends, but what is too much is too much)

[dn0]

I think pop gets a woodie everytime he starts radoslow nesterovic.

[TDMGTP]

damn slovenians CHILL OUT, i shouldnt have to explain this but I will.
meant that either ur rooting for rasho cuz he is slovenian which is natural to support ur countrymen, or just plain stupid but NOT BOTH. Take it as you may cuz ultumitely I dont care.

[Phenomanul]

The truth about Nazr is that Pop is diminishing his value so that the Spurs don't have to shell out too much money when re-signing him....

His plan of course will backfire:

1. Because we will need more minutes from Nazr during the playoffs in order to contend.... which will again increase his value (and his agent's asking price).

2. The whole situation will piss Nazr off and he will refuse to sign back with San Antonio.

[zeleni]

The truth about Nazr is that Pop is diminishing his value so that the Spurs don't have to shell out too much money when re-signing him....

His plan of course will backfire:

1. Because we will need more minutes from Nazr during the playoffs in order to contend.... which will again increase his value (and his agent's asking price).

2. The whole situation will piss Nazr off and he will refuse to sign back with San Antonio.

Nazr is less important then repeat. Believe me. Who cares about Nazr when his playing is not as good as Rasho's?

[Ginobili_20_gold_medalist]

I agree wholeheartedly with TDMGTP. At this point Nazr doesn't even have to go back in the starting lineup. Just give the man some meaningful minutes on the floor...at least 20-25 minutes. And none of that "2 minutes on the floor and then back to the bench" garbage. If he makes mistakes it's best he's making those mistakes in January and not April-May-June.

It was a blessing in disguise that Rasho got injured last year because let's be honest...the Spurs probably don't win the title last year if Rasho is in the lineup. He's weak and always will be. If Popovich is planning to keep him out on the floor then kiss those title hopes goodbye.

[Kori Ellis]

The truth about Nazr is that he only averaged about 6 and 6 in last season's playoffs in about 28 minutes (I'm guessing) -- those numbers were relatively the same as Rasho's numbers during the regular season last year. But since he dunked the ball and was more active around the rim, Spurs fans glamourized it. I've heard at least three posters in the last few days says, "He outscored and outrebounded the Wallaces COMBINED in games 1 and 2 in the Finals" which is not even close.

He knew enough basics on D to get by in the postseason and Pop wasn't going to switch back to Rasho after Rasho got healthy and disrupt the rotation. But the coaching staff fully expected that this season, Nazr would IMPROVE -- particularly on defense.

He missed the whole training camp (I'm not saying that it's his fault) where they lay down the groundwork for the year. As the season began, Rasho was actually playing decent and rightfully owned the starting job.

We aren't privvy to what goes on inside of practice, but right now if Nazr has actually caught up on D and is working hard in practice - he'd be seeing more playing time.

Rasho sucks against particular teams and I certainly would think that in a game like last night Nazr would have seen some time. I don't think there's a huge conspiracy of holding his value down or not liking him personally. I just think that he likely hasn't earned playing time in practice and he misses far too many rotations when he actually does get playing time.

That all being said, there are times when you need to scrap all the rules for playing time and just let a guy get a stretch on the floor and see how it goes. The Spurs didn't do that with Nazr. But last night was likely a big wakeup call. It will be interesting to see how the player rotations get rattled because of it.

[Phenomanul]

Nazr is less important then repeat. Believe me. Who cares about Nazr when his playing is not as good as Rasho's?


It is difficult for players to get into rythm when playing the minutes Nazr is playing.... from a rebounding standpoint, however, Nazr is better than Rasho... and seeing how the rebounding margin hurt us last night Nazr would have been needed....

Pop seems to have as short of fuse with Nazr as he did with Malik.

Nazr moved on a pick and picked up a turnover.... Pop sat him for the rest of the game.

[leemajors]

rasho was playing pretty well before he got hurt. are you guys forgetting how well the spurs were playing last year before people started getting dinged up? hopefully the opposite is the case this year and we can get stronger as the season goes on.

[Phenomanul]

rasho was playing pretty well before he got hurt. are you guys forgetting how well the spurs were playing last year before people started getting dinged up? hopefully the opposite is the case this year and we can get stronger as the season goes on.


:tu I Believe....

[Man In Black]

Kori breaks it down for you and now all we get is CRICKETS.

Chirp, chirp...Thread starter is where?

Learn what flag represents which country smart guy.

I'm definitely not from Slovenia but I've played this game and know it game well enough to recognize that if you don't produce in practice, you don't desreve time on the court.

[wildbill2u]

It doesn't come down to Nazr v. Rasho. It comes down to our front line v. their front line.

They are more athletic and physical including Rasheed and McDyess. We do not and cannot compete with them in rebounding. So we lose.

And their front line shooting is probably better overall than ours. Tim has been fluky this year at best. Forget about Bowen's 3pt. percentage. If he makes 2-2 and only scores 6 points, what does it matter if McDyess or Rasheed go off for 20?

[abelle23]

Ahm, Filipines = Slovenia??? :lol :lol :lol

You must be "that stupid American". (Sorry all other American friends, but what is too much is too much)


:lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol

[Ginobili_20_gold_medalist]

The truth about Nazr is that he only averaged about 6 and 6 in last season's playoffs in about 28 minutes (I'm guessing) -- those numbers were relatively the same as Rasho's numbers during the regular season last year.

Actually Nazr averaged 7 points and 7 rebounds in 23 minutes in last years playoffs.

Rasho's regular season numbers were 6 points and 7 rebounds in 26 minutes a game.

In the regular season Nazr averaged 6 points and 6 rebounds in only 18 minutes a game. He got Rasho's numbers playing almost a quarter less than him. That kind of tells you something...Nazr is more active than the walking corpse.


That all being said, there are times when you need to scrap all the rules for playing time and just let a guy get a stretch on the floor and see how it goes.

That's all we're asking.

[Kori Ellis]

Like I said - I was just guessing the numbers.


In the regular season Nazr averaged 6 points and 6 rebounds in only 18 minutes a game. He got Rasho's numbers playing almost a quarter less than him.

But Nazr didn't play D and shot only 38 percent (during the reg season) -- none of that really matters.

My point was really that neither one of them are that great. And there were legitimate reasons for Nazr starting in the playoffs last year and there were legitimate reasons why Rasho has been starting this season.

Nazr definitely should have gotten some playing time last night with Rasho mismatched against the Pistons front line. Why that didn't happen, who knows. But he likely isn't proving himself in practice or else he'd be seeing more time on the floor.

That being said .. Manu needs to start. :lol

[Johnny_Blaze_47]

Whoa, whoa, whoa there, Kori...

Don't start trying to bring logic to any of these arguments now.

[Spurminator]

Yeah I like Rasho starting against most teams but I think his """strengths""" (note multiple quotations) are of little use against the Pistons. Nazr's not great , but his """strengths""" fill more of our needs when we play Detroit...

[Ginobili_20_gold_medalist]

My point was really that neither one of them are that great. And there were legitimate reasons for Nazr starting in the playoffs last year and there were legitimate reasons why Rasho has been starting this season.

Nazr definitely should have gotten some playing time last night with Rasho mismatched against the Pistons front line. Why that didn't happen, who knows. But he likely isn't proving himself in practice or else he'd be seeing more time on the floor.

Neither are great but one is clearly better and more active than the other (when he gets almost equal playing time). I see no clear reason why Rasho should be getting that many more minutes. It can't be all about practice. Does anyone really think Rasho looks any better in practice than he does in actual games? :lol It can't be all about defensive rotations either. Did you see the defense last night? Just about every player on the court were missing rotations.

[Kori Ellis]

Neither are great but one is clearly better and more active than the other

More active, yes. Better, debatable. Most people think Nazr's sucky defense doesn't make up for him getting an extra board or two.

As far as practice goes, perhaps Rasho seems to understand position D, rotations, sets, etc better than Nazr in practices. Perhaps he works harder in practice. Who knows. I am just saying that there's many logical reasons why Nazr may not be on the court and we aren't privvy to all of them.

That being said -- Rasho is far too immobile to log that many minutes against the Pistons ever again.

[Man In Black]

More active true but say if the perimeter players would've held their ground some of those boards could've gotten to a Spur. Tayshaun should be getting double-figure rebounds in a game against the Spurs.

[zeleni]

Just about every player on the court were missing rotations.

Oh yeah....? Which game were you looking at?

[texbumTHElife]

The truth about Nazr is that he only averaged about 6 and 6 in last season's playoffs in about 28 minutes (I'm guessing) -- those numbers were relatively the same as Rasho's numbers during the regular season last year. But since he dunked the ball and was more active around the rim, Spurs fans glamourized it. I've heard at least three posters in the last few days says, "He outscored and outrebounded the Wallaces COMBINED in games 1 and 2 in the Finals" which is not even close.

He knew enough basics on D to get by in the postseason and Pop wasn't going to switch back to Rasho after Rasho got healthy and disrupt the rotation. But the coaching staff fully expected that this season, Nazr would IMPROVE -- particularly on defense.

He missed the whole training camp (I'm not saying that it's his fault) where they lay down the groundwork for the year. As the season began, Rasho was actually playing decent and rightfully owned the starting job.

We aren't privvy to what goes on inside of practice, but right now if Nazr has actually caught up on D and is working hard in practice - he'd be seeing more playing time.

Rasho sucks against particular teams and I certainly would think that in a game like last night Nazr would have seen some time. I don't think there's a huge conspiracy of holding his value down or not liking him personally. I just think that he likely hasn't earned playing time in practice and he misses far too many rotations when he actually does get playing time.

That all being said, there are times when you need to scrap all the rules for playing time and just let a guy get a stretch on the floor and see how it goes. The Spurs didn't do that with Nazr. But last night was likely a big wakeup call. It will be interesting to see how the player rotations get rattled because of it.

Great post Kori.

[boutons_]

"a big wakeup call"

I hate that phrase, but WTF are the Spurs asleep in the first place. Same objective, same team, some coach as last year. Just repeat.

Nick's and Michael's arrival cannot be blamed for destroying the Spurs game.

Where's the fucking problem? Why the big mystery about trying to discover how to play basketball?

[TDMGTP]

okay kori honey you are wrong.

first, Nazr yea he might not always give you a double double every game but if given AT LEAST 25min he will give you a double double 1/10 games and not just any double double more like 20-15 AND WE ALL KNOW RASH WILL NEVER DO THAT CUZ HE HASNT IN 3 YEARS. NAZR HAS MORE UPSIDE.

SKILL COMPARIONS

Rasho (geico robot, seriously should take salsa)
-good defensive positioning...lol
-never gets to the FT a + cuz he sucks at them
-umm D+ mid range shot
-no dunks
-below avg OFF REB
-cant move
-very low profile
-no creativity
-2-4pts per game



VS NAZR (dunker but slow learner)
-minor issues on D
-gets to the line, shoot TD avg
-D- mid range
-a dunker
-one of the best at OFF REB LOOK AT NUMBERS FROM 05 PLAYOFFS
-just moves enough
-stands up for teamates (manu VS seattle in playoffs)
-has creative outbursts (few time during playoffs with fake QB handoff)
-6-10pts per game


ITS SO OBVIOUS WHO IS BETTER AND HAS MORE UPSIDE. C'MON KORI, JUST ADMIT IT UR EMPHATUATED(SP?) BY RASHOS LOOKS...LOL..JK.

AGAIN ON DEFENSE:
how could you say nazr is a liability on defense when we won a championship with him as our starting center. the previous yr we lost so rasho 0, nazr 1 WHO IS THE LIABILITY?? and if we obviously won the championship that means we played the best teams, and STILL WITH NAZR DEFENSE WE WON. we won with nazr sorry defense and now we are losing with rasho's great defensive talents. my point is if we beat denver, seattle, phoenix, DETROIT with nazr in the middle why not give him minutes against atlanta, or all the other sorry ass teams so that he can develop his skills...

AND NO pop didnt leave NAZR in last yr during the playoffs just "to not disrupt the rotations and team" please he disrupted by putting manu as sixthman when he needed it during the playoffs. CASE CLOSE.

PEACE, LET NOT LOSE HOPE ON THE SPURS, THEY NEED TO GET THEIR ACT TOGETHER.
BUT NEVER UNDER ESTIMATE THE HEART OF A CHAMPION

[Kori Ellis]

-good defensive positioning...lol -minor issues on D

This is the key to your whole post. If Nazr's problems on D were minor, he'd be on the floor. Everyone knows when they come to the Spurs they have to catch on to the team D. Nazr hasn't. That's the problem.

Nazr is more athletic than Rasho, he dunks more, he's more animated, he could put up marginal better stats. But bottomline is that if he isn't doing it on D, then he won't see the floor. That's how it is here. Spurs fans act like it's a new concept.

To me, they are both marginal players and can be used situationally to cover the center spot.

And as far as your "looks" comment. Let me go on record as saying Nazr is better looking than blue-lipped FrankenRasho. So I guess that doesn't come into play in my assessment. :lol

[Kori Ellis]

And don't use "upside" in reference to either of them. They are too old to have "upside" or "potential". What you see is what you get.

[SenorSpur]

The truth about Nazr is that he only averaged about 6 and 6 in last season's playoffs in about 28 minutes (I'm guessing) -- those numbers were relatively the same as Rasho's numbers during the regular season last year. But since he dunked the ball and was more active around the rim, Spurs fans glamourized it. I've heard at least three posters in the last few days says, "He outscored and outrebounded the Wallaces COMBINED in games 1 and 2 in the Finals" which is not even close.

He knew enough basics on D to get by in the postseason and Pop wasn't going to switch back to Rasho after Rasho got healthy and disrupt the rotation. But the coaching staff fully expected that this season, Nazr would IMPROVE -- particularly on defense.

He missed the whole training camp (I'm not saying that it's his fault) where they lay down the groundwork for the year. As the season began, Rasho was actually playing decent and rightfully owned the starting job.

We aren't privvy to what goes on inside of practice, but right now if Nazr has actually caught up on D and is working hard in practice - he'd be seeing more playing time.

Rasho sucks against particular teams and I certainly would think that in a game like last night Nazr would have seen some time. I don't think there's a huge conspiracy of holding his value down or not liking him personally. I just think that he likely hasn't earned playing time in practice and he misses far too many rotations when he actually does get playing time.

That all being said, there are times when you need to scrap all the rules for playing time and just let a guy get a stretch on the floor and see how it goes. The Spurs didn't do that with Nazr. But last night was likely a big wakeup call. It will be interesting to see how the player rotations get rattled because of it.

Great stuff Kori. I agree with you and Pop had absolutely nothing to lose by inserting Nazr into that fiasco last night. I think that Nazr is more better suited against big, physical than is Rasho.

[TDMGTP]

ur call on the looks, now did we win the championship with NAZR as a starter??? YES
did we play elite teams? YES
did his defense affect us against those elite teams? apperantly NOT cuz we WON!

so if we beat the elite teams with his Defense, we should be able to beat the not-so-elite with his defense tooo. SO FUCKEN PLAY HIM POPABITCH, thank you.

[TDMGTP]

the teams that rasho usually has problems with are usually playoff bound teams.

[TDMGTP]

But bottomline is that if he isn't doing it on D, then he won't see the floor. That's how it is here. Spurs fans act like it's a new concept.


WE WON THE CHAMPINSHIP WITH HIM LAST YEAR WITH HIS D, AND THIS YEAR WE HAVENT SEEN ENOUGH OF HIM CONSITANTLY TO SAY HE ISNT DOING IT.

[angel_luv]

And as far as your "looks" comment. Let me go on record as saying Nazr is better looking than blue-lipped FrankenRasho. So I guess that doesn't come into play in my assessment. :lol

Kori!

How about this: Your (incorrect!!) point made without wounding me. :lol




And as far as your "looks" comment. Let me go on record as saying Nazr is better looking than Rasho. So I guess that doesn't come into play in my assessment. :lol

[T Park]

WE WON THE CHAMPINSHIP WITH HIM LAST YEAR WITH HIS D

we wont he championship with Robert Horry playing the majority of the minutes in the second half.

BUt yes, I think its prob time to give Nazr more consistent minutes and see what hes got.

Maybe give Oberto a shot.

Rasho aint cuttin it no more.

[sprrs]

The way I saw it during the summer was that we keep Rasho because Nazr can't handle Shaq. But the way things are going Detroit has all but guaranteed their spot in the finals this year, and since Nazr is obviously better suited against physical players like the Wallaces, I think he should be getting more playing time, for when we do need him.

[exstatic]

The minute that Nazr came into the game last night, Detroit stopped shooting jumpers and attacked the rim for a couple of layups and a dunk. Who cares if he's a better rebounder if Detroit is getting shots that have a 90% effective rate? Damn few rebounds even available.

[T Park]

They need a guy who blocks shots, AND rebounds...

Too bad theres no one like that available.

[Kori Ellis]

Speaking of blocks and rebounds, Kendrick Perkins is averaging 5 boards and over a block in 14 mpg. I think he's going to end up being good.

[T Park]

Perkins looked good the other night VS Dallas.

He could be, no question.

[TwoHandJam]

Rasho is never going to cut it against the teams that matter in the playoffs. He just isn't built to excel against fast physical frontcourts - which is what we're going to get a heavy dose of in the playoffs.

If we're not going to trade Nazr then Popovich is being incredibly shortsighted by not giving him meaningful minutes during the regular season so he can at least have a chance to learn from his mistakes in a game situation. I could care less what's going on in practice or any other personal issues between the two because we have no other options. We cannot win a series against the Pistons with Rasho - that much should be clear by now. I don't want to lose the chance at a repeat because of Popovich's inflexibility.

[boutons_]

I've seen enough of Nazr, and knowing his and age years in the NBA, is that the guy isn't going to improve as a Spur, or NBA player, with more minutes.

Nazr is playing a little differently now than last spring, but I figure he knows he has to take every initiative with every chance he gets.

It's tough that he's getting only 12 MPG probably his last contract year, but I'd love to be as poor as he is.

[ChumpDumper]

We cannot win a series against the Pistons with Rasho - that much should be clear by now.We won't with just Nazr either, unfortunately. We are missing a truly athletic frontcourt player which is crucial in today's NBA. If we can't trade for that player, we may as well start trying out guys like Chuck Hayes to see if they could contribute.

[boutons_]

nobody is gonna help the Spurs with trade of an athletic big, only maybe an EC team really desperate.

[ChumpDumper]

Hence, plan B.

[boutons_]

looking at last year's playoffs. Nazr, some Rasho, and Robert split the first 3 qtrs, and then mostly Robert alone closed the games. Not pretty, but it worked.

[boutons_]

I really like that David Lee guy the Knicks picked up. Hustles the boards, can hit from outside. HUGE plus for Knicks. Would Isaiah be so stupid ..... ??

[ChumpDumper]

Would Isaiah be so stupid ..... ??All the youngsters save Ariza are untouchable.
looking at last year's playoffs. Nazr, some Rasho, and Robert split the first 3 qtrs, and then mostly Robert alone closed the games. Not pretty, but it worked.Relying so much on Horry is dangerous in itself, and we're going to have to ween ourselves off him sooner or later anyway.

[Ginobili_20_gold_medalist]

We won't with just Nazr either, unfortunately.

That's kind of hard to say when the guy doesn't get any time on the court to prove himself.

[ChumpDumper]

That's kind of hard to say when the guy doesn't get any time on the court to prove himself.Nah, it's pretty easy to say knowing his play and the general direction of the NBA.

[wildbill2u]

More active, yes. Better, debatable. Most people think Nazr's sucky defense doesn't make up for him getting an extra board or two.

As far as practice goes, perhaps Rasho seems to understand position D, rotations, sets, etc better than Nazr in practices. Perhaps he works harder in practice. Who knows. I am just saying that there's many logical reasons why Nazr may not be on the court and we aren't privvy to all of them.

That being said -- Rasho is far too immobile to log that many minutes against the Pistons ever again.

Tim has become relatively immobile because of injuries as well. And Bowen can't matchup heightwise for rebounds. I don't see an answer for their front line right now anywhere on our club.

[TwoHandJam]

Tim has become relatively immobile because of injuries as well. And Bowen can't matchup heightwise for rebounds. I don't see an answer for their front line right now anywhere on our club.
Maybe Nazr won't be the answer but we'll never know if he doesn't get more meaningful minutes. We know for certain that Rasho isn't the answer. At least Nazr has averaged 8 rpg during his career, something Rasho has never done.

Nazr may never fully grasp our defense but having missed training camp this year and not averaging many mpg this season, Pop's not really giving him a fair shake. He is being very Malik-like with him with his frequent yankings for missed rotations except Nazr isn't a 7 year vet of the system like Malik was.

I'm sure Rasho is a good guy and teammate and maybe he does all the right things in practice compared to Nazr but Pop's love affair with him has to end. All signs indicate that the road to a title with go through the Motor City this year and he isn't going to get the job done.

I sometimes wonder if Pop is so patient with him because of all the trouble he went through to recruit him. Pop had to sweet-talk his parents in Slovenia to get Rasho and now no other GM will touch him with a 10 foot pole. It's time for Pop to stop trying to save face and admit that the Rasho experiment is a failure.

Either give Nazr a fair shake or trade him but stop trying to fit a square peg in a round hole. It's January and this team still has time left.

[boutons_]

"something Rasho has never done."

He scored 8.4 and 11.2 PPG in his last 2 years @MIN.

[leemajors]

rasho's lack of quickness is exposed against teams like phoenix and detroit, but he is fine vs other teams. nazr is the one who needs to pick up the slack against teams with quicker frontcourts. it isn't about a love affair with rasho, it's about nazr being unable to step up and play like he knows what the word defense means. pop stated the center position was up for grabs this year and rasho has earned the starting position.

[mikejones99]

Nazr will play more later. Rasho is good most of the time and especially helpful with Miami becausethey have 2 old slow big like us. If we see Detroit again maybe Alberto will get some more minutes.

[TDMGTP]

"something Rasho has never done."

He scored 8.4 and 11.2 PPG in his last 2 years @MIN


At least Nazr has averaged 8 rpg during his career, something Rasho has never done.


GOTS TO READ CAREFULLY, RPG.

[gameFACE]

Neither Nazr nor Rasho are capable of beating the other out for the starting position. They've each had it due to the absense of the other. But it would definitely be worth it to take a block of 10 games or so and start Nazr just to see if he could get into any kind of groove. It could be Rasho's worst nightmare. Or if not put Rasho back in the starting lineup. I understand the defensive merit system. But why not think outside the Spurs box? Do it Pop.

[superfedja]

I think the only reason why rasho is playing right now instead of nazr is bcuz pop wants to raise rasho's trading value... he wants rasho to get minutes and produce so he can get something better in exchange cuz its obvious the spurs dont need him ... and its obvious they want to trade him cuz he is overpaid BIG TIME... and to me its clear nazr will start in the playoffs... right now pop hopes rasho has a few good games so he can tell: Hey, rasho isnt that bad! He's the starting center of a championship team! ... Pop is only trying to get his trade value up ... I will be really dissapointed if the spurs dont trade rasho before the deadline... I'd trade him for a donut and a cup of coffee ... but that's my opinion what do u guys think? Do you think this might be true?

[SlovenianGuy]

Rasho
career 5.9 RPG
best season 7.7 RPG

Nazr
career 5.6 RPG
best season 7.9 RPG

[SlovenianGuy]

why rasho is playin instead of nazr

Do I have to repeat myself?

Spurs vs. Det
with Rasho 24 min 33-36 diff -3
without Rasho 24 min 35-47 diff -12


with Nazr 6 min 6-17 diff -11
without Nazr 42 min 62-66 diff -4

[Ginobili_20_gold_medalist]

Do I have to repeat myself?

Spurs vs. Det
with Rasho 24 min 33-36 diff -3
without Rasho 24 min 35-47 diff -12


with Nazr 6 min 6-17 diff -11
without Nazr 42 min 62-66 diff -4

Let's put it this way.

Nazr in playoffs starting lineup = title last year.
Rasho in starting lineup in the playoffs = no title ever.

[SlovenianGuy]

Let's put it this way.

Nazr in playoffs starting lineup = title last year.
Rasho in starting lineup in the playoffs = no title ever.


Garnett in starting lineup in the playoffs = no title ever.

Nazr > Garnett ????

Stupid logic.

[Ginobili_20_gold_medalist]

Garnett in starting lineup in the playoffs = no title ever.

Nazr > Garnett ????

Stupid logic.

I'm talking starting lineup of the Spurs. Use some common sense. Rasho has NEVER been a key player in ANY Spurs title run.

[TwoHandJam]

Rasho
career 5.9 RPG
best season 7.7 RPG

Nazr
career 5.6 RPG
best season 7.9 RPG
You misunderstood my post. When I said Nazr has at least averaged 8 rpg during his career, I meant he has had at least one season (not his career average) where he averaged 8 rpg or more, which he has. He averaged 9 rpg in 00-01 with the Hawks, 7.9 rpg in 01-02 and 8.1 rpg over 54 games with NYK before he came to SA. All better than Rasho's best averages.

More important than all this however are their stats in the postseason. Nazr's rebounding stats actually rise from 5.6 (career) to 5.9 (postseason) while Rasho's decline markedly from 5.9 (career) to 3.6 (postseason). That is particularly damning.

[Kori Ellis]

Did you see he got pulled out after he let his man go middle?

Bowen got on him about it, but Pop pulled him right afterward anyway.

Like I keep saying, whatever else he does on the floor is going to keep getting overshadowed by the fact he doesn't get the basics on D.

[Kori Ellis]

He averaged 9 rpg in 00-01 with the Hawks

Wasn't that only about 25 games?

[T Park]

But why not think outside the Spurs box?

why, its won 3 rings.

WHy break something if its not broken.

[Man In Black]

You misunderstood my post. When I said Nazr has at least averaged 8 rpg during his career, I meant he has had at least one season (not his career average) where he averaged 8 rpg or more, which he has. He averaged 9 rpg in 00-01 with the Hawks, 7.9 rpg in 01-02 and 8.1 rpg over 54 games with NYK before he came to SA. All better than Rasho's best averages.

More important than all this however are their stats in the postseason. Nazr's rebounding stats actually rise from 5.6 (career) to 5.9 (postseason) while Rasho's decline markedly from 5.9 (career) to 3.6 (postseason). That is particularly damning.

Rasho can say that, as the primary center for the Spurs, he helped them get an NBA record for least points allowed per game. Has Nazr ever done that as a primary center?

[E20]

Rasho can say that, as the primary center for the Spurs, he helped them get an NBA record for least points allowed per game. Has Nazr ever done that as a primary center?
Who was the primary center forthe Spurs playoff run in 2003-2004?

Who was the primary center for the Spurs Championship run in 2004-2005?

[Man In Black]

Okay let's get back to that past tense mode. Do you blame Rasho completely for the loss to LA and Fish's remarkable shot?

It's a team game, you numbskulls keep looking for a magic bullet and you think he wears #2. Pop is looking for the best chance to win by fielding the best starting 5 and he is telling you that his center wears #8.
Ultimately since his view is the strongest, all this whining about Nazr is just that.
The guy won't start until he gets it.

[E20]

If we got past LA we would have to play Detroits' frontline. I don't think Rasho would be a factor, Nazr would play physical with them, but he will only be a little better. The only reason we beat Detroit was because of Horry.

[Rummpd]

For all of Detroits vaunted frontline Duncan had about the scoring of both Wallaces and nearly as many rebounds in the finals last year!


If he is healthy and Nazr plays more Spurs will be ok.

[TwoHandJam]

Wasn't that only about 25 games?Good catch Kori, I didn't pay attention to the # of games that year. However, my second point about the postseason stands.

About Nazr missing assignments, sure he's still making mistakes but I still feel Pop yanks him too often and too quickly. Either give him a fair shake or trade him because we already know Rasho can't hang with Detroit when it's going to really matter. Unfortunately he's missed training camp again this year so Pop has no choice but to give him in-game time if he's really going to evaluate him.

[Kori Ellis]

sure he's still making mistakes but I still feel Pop yanks him too often and too quickly.

Well he got pulled quickly tonight but I don't know if it was too quick.

I don't understand why he doesn't get the basics.

[Man In Black]

What,practice time doesn't help Pop in his evaluation of Nazr?

[Ginobili_20_gold_medalist]

Well he got pulled quickly tonight but I don't know if it was too quick.

I don't understand why he doesn't get the basics.


Yeah, the basics really helped tonight on that Gasol dunk that almost cost the Spurs the game. Just about every player on this team misses rotations.

[TwoHandJam]

What,practice time doesn't help Pop in his evaluation of Nazr?
Apparently Bowen shoots something like 90% from the FT line in practice. Sean Marks was given a chance to make the rotation this year because of his performances in practice. Players coming back from injury rehab like crazy in practice and are still winded when they return. Do you really think practice can tell you all you need to know about a player?

[Peter]

The truth about Mohammed is that when he starts against the Pistons, you don't end up with an average of 2.5 boards per contest, unlike a certain other Spur "center".

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Rasho can say that, as the primary center for the Spurs, he helped them get an NBA record for least points allowed per game. Has Nazr ever done that as a primary center?

Nazr can say that as the primary center he's helped lead the Spurs to a ring. Can Rasho say that?

Of course Nazr is going to fuck up, he doesn't get to play enough to click with his teammates. If you don't play the guy often, and yank him the first time he fucks up when he does, of course he's going to be passive and make mistakes - he's looking over his shoulder every play to see if he's coming out.

I think he outrebounded Rasho tonight with roughly half the minutes of play. Pop needs to pull out the 2005 championship DVD and realize who his starting center was for that run.

[Dre_7]

Of course Nazr is going to fuck up, he doesn't get to play enough to click with his teammates. If you don't play the guy often, and yank him the first time he fucks up when he does, of course he's going to be passive and make mistakes - he's looking over his shoulder every play to see if he's coming out.

DING DING DING!

Thank you AHF! We rarely agree, but this time, you are RIGHT ON!

Play Nazr!

[TexasAggie2005]

Everyone that keeps pimping Nazr: Maybe we won a championship last year in spite of having Nazr start, rather than because of it? Who's to say we wouldn't have won in a more convincing fashion with Rasho starting? It's not like we dominated Detroit. I'll take Rasho's relative lack of mobility of Nazr's defensive lapses any day. Evidently, so would Pop.

Nazr and Barry both should (and probably will) be traded right before the deadline. We're just waiting until other teams are desperate to trade. No one wants to give us anything this early.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Who's to say we wouldn't have won in a more convincing fashion with Rasho starting? It's not like we dominated Detroit.

My fellow Ag, you need to watch more games. The difference between teh physicality of Nazr vs. Rasho is night and day. If you kicked Rasho in the balls he'd go on the injured list for the rest of the season. If you kicked Nazr in the balls he'd shrug it off and rip your head off and shove it down your throat.

There is no comparison between the two.

[TDMGTP]

Who's to say we wouldn't have won in a more convincing fashion with Rasho starting? It's not like we dominated Detroit. I'll take Rasho's relative lack of mobility of Nazr's defensive lapses any day. Evidently, so would Pop.


GET A LOAD OF THIS GUY(TEXASAGGIE2005)....LOL

RASHO'S PLAYOFF CAREER:
19MIN 4.2PTS 3.6REB

NAZR'S PLAYOFF CAREER:
20MIN 6.8PTS 6REB --------- 1 RING AS A STARTER
7-9FG 1-2FT 15REB(9 on OFF) 1AST 2SLT 4BLK 15pts
3-7FG 4-6FT 13REB(4 on OFF) 1AST 1STL 1BLK 10pts
8-10FG 3-5FT 7REB(3 on OFF) 1AST 19pts in 20mins too
in the playoffs he scored 6 times 10pts or more.

so you are tellin me that rasho could of done this in the playoffs last year?

do you remember the the last time rasho rebounded in double figures...NOT THIS SEASON. NAZR is getting dissed and has still managed to get in reb double figures, 10 @ Golden State 11/23/05.

ITS SO OBVIOUS, NAZR MIGHT FUCK UP HERE AND THERE, BUT HE GIVES YOU BETTER GAMES MORE OFTEN THAN NOT.


AGAIN GET A LOAD OF THAT GUY AGGIE2005

[leemajors]

both of them are extremely foul prone and not that great at the moment. i think nazr had 3 fouls in like 6 mins last night. i don't see any compelling evidence that nazr is that much better than rasho. last playoffs maybe, but nazr hasn't shown us jack this season. again, rasho isn't the reason the spurs collapsed last night. neither one of them has any business being on the court with under 10 mins left in the 4th.

[TwoHandJam]

I agree that Nazr may not be the answer but lets at least give him the chance to prove or disprove it by letting him start for a few games in a row - missed rotations or not.

[ChumpDumper]

Nazr gets a chance to prove himself every time he hits the floor and he fails. Everybody knows what he needs to do including him. I imagine Pop would be open to giving him all the welfare minutes you guys would like to give him were Rasho not rotating better. If Nazr is as good as you advertise, he'll show it in practice and games. I hope he is.

[boutons_]

"I don't understand why he doesn't get the basics."

because he has poor head for the game, low BB IQ.

8 years in the NBA, and he still doesn't have a clue about a lot of stuff. He's tall, long arms, sometimes aggressive on the offense boards (what's wrong with the defensive boards?), and gets rebounds. Beyond that, almost nothing to recommend him.

Sean was almost mocking Nazr last night when he was mis-matched on a guard in the corner, had his arms up, the guard danced a little, Nazr dropped his arms, went back on his heels, the guard bombed a 3G uncontested. They even ran it on replay.

Compare with Fabricio smothering Tay in pretty much the same situation so hard that Tay had to call a timeout. Fabricio doesn't have the height, but he understands how to play.

[Ginobili_20_gold_medalist]

"I don't understand why he doesn't get the basics."

Sean was almost mocking Nazr last night when he was mis-matched on a guard in the corner, had his arms up, the guard danced a little, Nazr dropped his arms, went back on his heels, the guard bombed a 3G uncontested. They even ran it on replay.

Compare with Fabricio smothering Tay in pretty much the same situation so hard that Tay had to call a timeout. Fabricio doesn't have the height, but he understands how to play.

That is a dumb comparison. Prince had picked up his dribble on the baseline when he got smothered by Oberto. Nazr was guarding Bobby Jackson with a live dribble by himself. That's why it's called a "mis-match".

And I'll ask again. Where were those "basics" when the Spurs were blowing their lead last night? Where were the "basics" when the Spurs were giving up a dunk to Gasol that almost cost them the game?

[boutons_]

I'm sure Farbricio would have defended Bobby Jackson better, had a hand in his face, than "my arms hurt/can't concentrate too long" Nazr.

[TexasAggie2005]

GET A LOAD OF THIS GUY(TEXASAGGIE2005)....LOL

RASHO'S PLAYOFF CAREER:
19MIN 4.2PTS 3.6REB

NAZR'S PLAYOFF CAREER:
20MIN 6.8PTS 6REB --------- 1 RING AS A STARTER
7-9FG 1-2FT 15REB(9 on OFF) 1AST 2SLT 4BLK 15pts
3-7FG 4-6FT 13REB(4 on OFF) 1AST 1STL 1BLK 10pts
8-10FG 3-5FT 7REB(3 on OFF) 1AST 19pts in 20mins too
in the playoffs he scored 6 times 10pts or more.

so you are tellin me that rasho could of done this in the playoffs last year?

do you remember the the last time rasho rebounded in double figures...NOT THIS SEASON. NAZR is getting dissed and has still managed to get in reb double figures, 10 @ Golden State 11/23/05.

ITS SO OBVIOUS, NAZR MIGHT FUCK UP HERE AND THERE, BUT HE GIVES YOU BETTER GAMES MORE OFTEN THAN NOT.


AGAIN GET A LOAD OF THAT GUY AGGIE2005

Total crap. Stats are entirely dependent on the situation you're being put in, what teammates you're playing with, the minutes you get, etc. Plus there are so many things that don't show up on stat sheets, like missed rotations on defense. You can't keep screaming at me about how Nazr's averaging 0.6 rebounds (whatever it is) more than Rasho and tell me that obviously makes him a better player. Maybe Nazr wrestles them away from Tim and Rasho just boxes his man out better so Tim can pick it up. Who knows? Stats are so overrated as a measure of a player's worth.

And turn the caps lock off.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Sean was almost mocking Nazr last night when he was mis-matched on a guard in the corner, had his arms up, the guard danced a little, Nazr dropped his arms, went back on his heels, the guard bombed a 3G uncontested. They even ran it on replay.

What a retarded ass comparison. I've seen Tim get beat by guards before in mismatches, I guess we should bench his "low BB IQ" ass too.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Total crap. Stats are entirely dependent on the situation you're being put in, what teammates you're playing with, the minutes you get, etc. Plus there are so many things that don't show up on stat sheets, like missed rotations on defense.

As a starter:
Nazr: 1 ring
Rasho: 0 rings

Scoreboard.

[TexasAggie2005]

As a starter:
Nazr: 1 ring
Rasho: 0 rings

Scoreboard.

This is also one of the dumbest basis for comparison I've ever seen. You're basically saying Nazr's the entire reason we won the championship. I'm sure the rest of the guys would love to hear that. Hold up, let me give it a shot.

As a starter:
Nazr: 1 ring
KG: 0 rings

"Scoreboard". Obviously, Nazr's better than KG. I mean, he has more rings, right?

[T Park]

^^ Dont expect a nice response ag....

[Ginobili_20_gold_medalist]

As a starter:
Nazr: 1 ring
KG: 0 rings

Obviously, Nazr's better than KG. I mean, he has more rings, right?

This is the 2nd time in this thread someone has come back with this stupid analogy :lol

What the hell does KG have to do with being the SPURS STARTING CENTER?!?

Simply put...The Spurs have won a championship with Nazr as the starting center and getting the majority of the minutes at that position in the playoffs. The Spurs have ZERO championships with Rasho as the starting center. It shouldn't be that freakin difficult to comprehend.

No one said Nazr is the entire reason the Spurs won a title but he made his contribution and wasn't a weak link. If he was a weak link the guy wouldn't have been on the floor in the 4th qtr of a Game 7 against the Pistons.

[gameFACE]

why, its won 3 rings.

WHy break something if its not broken.
I would be careful with that logic. You could say it's worked 3 out of the last 7 years but then you could also say it has not worked 4 out of 7 years. But the Spurs have actually made some pretty ballsy moves that are outside the Spurs box. One is keeping a center that had little time with the team as a starter even after the normal starter was "recovered" from his injury.

I'd also like to address an issue Kori brought up early about glamourizing Nazr's dunks and maybe giving the illusion that he is better. I don't think it makes him better, technically. Rasho is the better technical player. He knows where he is supposed to be. A great "by the book" kind of guy to have around. He can put the star on the Christmas tree without a ladder and probably reach the cereal box from on top of the refrigerator with no problem. But in the playoffs Nazr's aggressivenes maybe brings an extra edge. Even if the dunk is just glamour it brings an intangible that is necessary once playoffs begin. That is worth a lot in playoff basketball. Rasho has traditionally shown a drop in the playoffs.

So despite his deficiencies on D why not start Nazr for a few games and see what he can bring?

[Pero]

So now it`s Rasho`s fault the Spurs didn`t win the championship in 2004?

[leemajors]

This is the 2nd time in this thread someone has come back with this stupid analogy :lol

What the hell does KG have to do with being the SPURS STARTING CENTER?!?

Simply put...The Spurs have won a championship with Nazr as the starting center and getting the majority of the minutes at that position in the playoffs. The Spurs have ZERO championships with Rasho as the starting center. It shouldn't be that freakin difficult to comprehend.

No one said Nazr is the entire reason the Spurs won a title but he made his contribution and wasn't a weak link. If he was a weak link the guy wouldn't have been on the floor in the 4th qtr of a Game 7 against the Pistons.

rasho nor nazr is out there closing a game. closing a game horry is out there with duncan. rasho and or nazr start the game, just because they get some token minutes in the 4th doesn't mean they are out there with under 5 mins left. they are both weak links in that situation, come again.

[T Park]

One is keeping a center that had little time with the team as a starter even after the normal starter was "recovered" from his injury

So, thats ballsy for not disrupting team chemistry?

Interesting.


Even if the dunk is just glamour it brings an intangible that is necessary once playoffs begin

LOL

Now I've officially heard it all......



If he was a weak link the guy wouldn't have been on the floor in the 4th qtr of a Game 7 against the Pistons.

Nazr played about 2 to 3 minutes in the 4th.

The rest was Horry and Duncan......

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

As a starter:
Nazr: 1 ring
KG: 0 rings

Obviously, Nazr's better than KG. I mean, he has more rings, right?


Why stop there? Kerr has five rings, more than Manu and Parker combined, so he's obviously a better player than both.

Look, Nazr played the majority of the minutes at center for the Spurs last year in the playoffs. They won a ring.

Rasho played the majority of minutes the prior year, we lost.

No one is saying that the individual players are the sole reason for winning/losing a ring. We are saying that a guy who helped lead us to a ring should be given a chance to prove his worth.

And this will probably go over your head given the great KG analogy you sprung on me, but Detroit is a physical team. That style of play (physical) is something Nazr is better at dealing with than Rasho, bar none. It's not even a comparison.

Hell, take a look at what the two have done in the two meetings with our biggest competition for a title (which is what we should be prepping for, IMO):

Rasho: 40 minutes, 5 points, 5 boards, 1 block, 0 assists
Nazr: 22 minutes, 10 points, 5 boards, 0 blocks, 1 assist

Obviously stats don't tell the whole story, but they tell part of it. Like I said, the bottom line is Nazr is more athletic and plays more physical than Rasho.

Dicking Mohammed around during the regular season because he missed a rotation isn't helping him or this team getting ready for a hungry and damn good Detroit team that we'll be meeting in the Finals, and one Rasho has shown that he can't matchup with.

I wish Pop would play more matchups like he used to - just match people up according to our opponents.

Rasho is great against the bigger centers in the league like Ming. But he sucks against the more athletic types. Nazr is completely the opposite way.

Unfortunately this seems lost on a lot of people, including our coaches.

[T Park]

I wish Pop would play more matchups like he used to - just match people up according to our opponents.



Something you used to routinely critisize him for......


Unfortunately this seems lost on a lot of people, including our coaches.

Yeah, them there morons might come around, hee yuk.

[MannyIsGod]

The fact that this thread has gone on as long as it has prooves how little most of you watch/know what happens off the ball in basketball. Nazr's off the ball play is only surpassed in atrociousness by his on the ball play. He's absolute shit when it comes to rotating and being an off the ball defender. A man that athletic and that tall should not have difficulty changing peoples shots. It is simply a matter of getting the timing down and Nazr is no closer to doing it this season than he was last season and I see no reason to play him because of this.

On offense, he's a blackhole who makes me long for the days of Maliks pumpfakes because at least Malik could hit free throws and a fifteen-footer. I cringe every time he catches the ball in the post because his lack of footwork is stunning for an NBA player.

Nazr lacks key fundementals which he simply won't pick up! Whether its footwork, rotations, or how to score from 2 feet out he has extreme trouble with it. Rasho isn't an all star, but he's certainly better in many catagories than Nazr at the moment.

[T Park]

at least Malik could hit free throws and a fifteen-footer.

free throws yeah.

Fifteen footer??

whoa, no..

[gameFACE]

So, thats ballsy for not disrupting team chemistry?

Interesting.

Well that was just one part of it. The other was starting Barry in place of Manu. So all of a sudden you have two new starters after losing the first playoff game. Pretty ballsy to me for the normally rigid Spurs.


LOL

Now I've officially heard it all......

I didn't realize that was the last thing you needed to hear. Glad I could help, bro. When Rasho brings something to the table beyond the mechanical it will be a sunny day.

[T Park]

I didn't realize that was the last thing you needed to hear

It isn't, but its the most idiotic..


When Rasho brings something to the table beyond the mechanical it will be a sunny day.

mechanical, twice the defender, twice the intelligence.


But Im willing to give Nazr about a month of 28 to 30 minutes.

See if he has it.

By the end of March if hes still playing like a combination of Malik and Vinny Del Negro,

then Im willing to do any trade not involving Duncan, Parker, Ginobili, Bowen, to win.

[TDMGTP]

But Im willing to give Nazr about a month of 28 to 30 minutes.

See if he has it.

thats all we are asking for, if his so called "bad rotations" didnt hurt us last year during the playoffs who cares how they affect us now...you never know he might learn it and be a "rasho" defender and the agressive nazr AND WE ALL WIN.

GET A LOAD OF THAT GUY AGGIE2005.

[MannyIsGod]

They did hurt us last year during the playoffs. In fact, they hurt the team more than his inability to be a viable offensive option for penetrating guards due to his stone hands.

[Obstructed_View]

It's always funny to read posts of guys comparing stats between the person playing against the opponent's first team and the guy playing against the opponent's second team and somehow making a judgment about why the coach, who spends every day with the players, is somehow not as smart as they are.

[Dre_7]

It's always funny to read posts of guys comparing stats between the person playing against the opponent's first team and the guy playing against the opponent's second team and somehow making a judgment about why the coach, who spends every day with the players, is somehow not as smart as they are.

Nazrs stats STARTING against Det as a Spur: 5pts 6reb

Rashos stats STARTING against Det as a Spur: 2.5pts 2rebs

[Man In Black]

If you kicked Nazr in the balls he'd shrug it off and rip your head off and shove it down your throat.


Are we sure that Nazr would KNOW where the head is and more importantly, to open up mouth to insert head in esophagi?
Wait, does Nazr know what is an esophagi?

[TDMGTP]

They did hurt us last year during the playoffs. In fact, they hurt the team more than his inability to be a viable offensive option for penetrating guards due to his stone hands

they actually didnt because we WON...YEA!

[TDMGTP]

The fact that this thread has gone on as long as it has prooves how little most of you watch/know what happens off the ball in basketball.

man why you still posting here, and NO! MANNYISNOTGOD!!

[E20]

Nazr shoots 80% from the line while Malik shoots 71% from the line in the 2005-2006 season.

[Melmart1]

Nazrs stats STARTING against Det as a Spur: 5pts 6reb

Rashos stats STARTING against Det as a Spur: 2.5pts 2rebs

If the Spurs made decisions based on stats alone, then Bruce Bowen would not be on this team.

Stats do not lie, but they are deceptive. THEY DO NOT TELL THE WHOLE STORY. If there were a stat for number of pump fakes that led to turnovers or botched defensive assignments, then maybe we could have a stat-only argument. But since there is no such thing, we must talk of things other than numbers, such as defensive prowess and rotations. Rasho trumps Nazr in both, EASILY. And doesn't defense win championships?

[leemajors]

they actually didnt because we WON...YEA!

they did, we barely won. do you not remember games 3-7 where ben wallace was all over nazr's pump fakes?

[TDMGTP]

yea I do...so whats your point WE STILL WON, barely or whatever, this year we are 0-2 with rasho starting vs detroit during the playoffs we were 4-3 w/ nazr ANSWER THIS IF YOU HAVE THE BALLS WHICH RECORD WOULD YOU TAKE???. He gave us enough to win. Now do you remember what he did before that?...you can see the first page of the thread.

Thanks for pointing games 3-7 out...next time tell me something I didnt know k.

[MrChug]

It seems to be almost sacrelige, but Pop is bombing on this decision. Did he start Fin one or even TWO too many games? Yes. But Rasho is NOT making his time work. Should Pop feel some affinity for Rasho because he speaks fluent Serbian? NONONONONO! So his stubbornness and his ego are keeping Rasho in the starting lineup. Is Nazr truly is a difference maker? Not really, but next Nestairballovic he looks like Hakeem Fucking Olajuwan!!! :shootme

[leemajors]

we were 0-2 vs detroit last year, one of those games nazr started. you need to simmer down. answering questions has nothing to do with balls. if nazr had started both of those games, we still would have lost. nazr alone is not gonna plug the dyke. he is not the magic answer to our problems vs. detroit, so shut your pie hole already.

[TDMGTP]

yea and he produced more that 2pts 4rebs...okay he is 4-4 as a starter vs pistons.

[TDMGTP]

shut your pie hole already...good one.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

we were 0-2 vs detroit last year, one of those games nazr started.

Hmm, I could be wrong, but the only time it mattered he came out ahead 4-3...

[Dre_7]

0-2 against Det last year??

I thought it was 1-1 (In the loss, Timmy got hurt).

[MrChug]

God I hate Rasho Nesterovic...I really do. I wanted to like this guy but FUCK.

[hussker]

Hmm, I could be wrong, but the only time it mattered he came out ahead 4-3...

WHOOP!

[leemajors]

you like nazr's defensive performance tonight? letting gasol dunk twice in a row to take the lead at the half? with rasho and duncan on the bench the grizz erase a 9 point lead quickly.

[Dre_7]

I like his D overall tonight. What can SA's bigs do about the foul trouble. Other than that, Nazr has been playing great tonight.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

you like nazr's defensive performance tonight? letting gasol dunk twice in a row to take the lead at the half?

Nazr's having to pick up the slack for the whole team on defense.

Don't see you bitching about Duncan letting Gasol dunk it twice, including the first play of the game.

Little bit hypocritical, don't you think?

[TDMGTP]

nazr and rasho both suck, but rasho is better as sucking.

[leemajors]

not really. duncan wasn't in the game, so the defense sucked anyway. but nazr left gasol twice and he dunked twice in a row. it looked like nazr thought they were switching, and left gasol. you can't sit there and say nazr looked even passable on d tonight. gasol wa scoring on everyone, but nazr's brain farts at the end of the first half were god awful.

[Obstructed_View]

Nobody with a lick of sense could defend Nazr's performance tonight. Nazr lost track of his man, didn't rotate, backed off of Gasol and completely failed to get position or box out. A nine point lead quickly turned into a one point defecit with him on the floor.

[TexasAggie2005]

Why stop there? Kerr has five rings, more than Manu and Parker combined, so he's obviously a better player than both.

I'm the one trying to point out that having more rings doesn't mean you're better. Thanks for proving yourself wrong for me.


Look, Nazr played the majority of the minutes at center for the Spurs last year in the playoffs. They won a ring.

Rasho played the majority of minutes the prior year, we lost.


So you're basing your entire argument on the fact that we won in 2005 with Nazr and not in 2004 when Rasho was starting. This might be a valid argument if the rest of the team was exactly the same, the rest of the teams we played were exactly the same, and every circumstance came out exactly the same. Otherwise you're comparing unequal situations. I don't see how you managed to deduce that the single deciding factor was who our starting center was. Maybe we won in 2005 (and not in 2004) because Tony and Manu were playing better. I don't know, call that one a wild-ass guess, but I think they probably had more to do with it than Nazr's 20-30 minutes a game.


And this will probably go over your head given the great KG analogy you sprung on me, but Detroit is a physical team. That style of play (physical) is something Nazr is better at dealing with than Rasho, bar none. It's not even a comparison.


Oooohhh, you called me stupid. Great argument, I'm totally convinced you're right now that you've insulted me properly. :tu

Let me spell it out for you. KG plays on a different team than Nazr played on when he won the title last year. Not surprisingly, Nazr also played on a different team in 2005 than Rasho did in 2004. Obviously KG's team was more different from Nazr's than Nazr's was from Rasho's, but it's an analogy (and obviously a bit of a stretch intended to illustrate how ridiculous your comparison was).

[Obstructed_View]

I'm confused, Aggie. What does Rasho have to do with Hedo Turkoglu's inability to make a wide open jump shot?

[travis2]

Nazr sucks. Last night was no different than any other Nazr horror flick.

Only thing I can figure why some people here are drooling all over this stiff is Malik nostalgia. Same hands, same pump-fakes, same happy feet.

[Obstructed_View]

Nazr sucks. Last night was no different than any other Nazr horror flick.

Only thing I can figure why some people here are drooling all over this stiff is Malik nostalgia. Same hands, same pump-fakes, same happy feet.
Although he was great in the first quarter. If only both centers could become consistent. Wouldn't that be nice?

[E20]

The game against the Grizzlies can't be an assesment. All of our F/C's played like rat crap.

[Rasho Fan 88]

if yall are all sayin nazr is better, how come he is playing such less minutes, yet hes only one turnover down from Rasho. .....Who makes more mistakes? Rasho for president.

[Obstructed_View]

People that quote stats to support or condemn a center on this team need to just plead idiocy and bow out of the conversation. There are no stats for rotating, intimidating a shot or setting screens. Rebounds, blocks and points are gravy in the Spurs' system.

[MannyIsGod]

The motherfucking truth about Nazr was on display tonight. The truth is that Rasho is much better.

[Rummpd]

Tonight I think I lost my case at least against Shaq - Nazr was the worst big man Spurs put on floor, Marks did better.

[Dre_7]

The motherfucking truth about Nazr was on display tonight. The truth is that Rasho is much better.

Rasho=7'0
Nazr=6'10

I would hope Rasho is better than Nazr against Shaq.

Rasho is better against Shaq than Nazr. I will freely admit that. I have said that all along. The play of both Rasho and Nazr against Shaq went just as I thought.

[E20]

5 fouls 6 minutes. :wow

wow............

[MannyIsGod]

Its not even about 1 on 1 against Shaq. Rasho has a much better post game on the offensive end, and Nazr can't ever hope to be the help defender Rasho is.

Nazr is JV right now.