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FreshPrince22
01-13-2006, 05:05 AM
Spurs should fear finals matchup with Pistons
Charley Rosen / Special to FOXSports.com
http://msn.foxsports.com/nba/story/5243598

"As the NBA is currently constituted, San Antonio and Detroit are by far the league's best teams.

Barring untimely injuries to any of their core players — or any forthcoming trades that might hugely benefit other ball clubs — it's highly likely that the Spurs and the Pistons will meet again with the championship at stake in June.

Besides Thursday's date in San Antonio, the only regular-season game between these two rivals occurred in Detroit on Christmas Day, resulting in a lop-sided 85-70 victory for the home team. The key factor then was the Pistons' smothering defense, which limited the Spurs to only eight first-quarter points and which also stifled the Spurs' point-making prowess at the end of the game.

The challenge for San Antonio on Thursday was to devise and execute appropriate tweaks in their previous offensive game plan, while Detroit's goal was to keep on keeping on.

Not surprisingly, the determining factor in Detroit's overwhelming 83-68 win was the continued efficiency of their defense and the Spurs' failure to make suitable adjustments.

Here's how the Pistons' defended Tim Duncan:

# Rasheed Wallace was the primary defender, but Ben Wallace and Antonio McDyess also took turns. Their defensive pressure was minimal when Duncan was isolated on the left wing — thereby discouraging him from driving and encouraging him to shoot his highly overrated bank shot (0-3).

# When Duncan was stationed on the right box (his most ineffective post-up spot), B. Wallace moved into a help spot midway up the foul lane — thereby forcing TD to turn baseline and shoot a right-handed jump shot with the backboard unavailable. On one occasion, TD was doubled by Tayshaun Prince. Overall, he was fouled three times when he operated on the right box, missed a jump hook and had two shots blocked for a net total of two points.

# When he received the ball on the left box, the Pistons showed a variety of defensive schemes: They simply let Duncan wheel to the middle and sent one of the Wallaces to challenge his shot. They dropped a guard (usually Rip Hamilton) into the paint to force TD to turn baseline. McDyess sometimes fronted Duncan and sometimes three-quartered him. But Duncan was never doubled. From his favorite spot, Duncan was 2-for-5, committed one turnover, made a pass that gained the Spurs no advantage and tipped in one of his own missed shots. He was fouled the one time that he posted, returned the inbounds pass and then reposted but missed both free throws. Those nine possessions resulted in six points.

# Several sets had Duncan at the high post, where he made reversal passes, set brush picks for Tony Parker and Manu Ginobili and was involved in numerous screen/roll (S/R) situations. From there, Duncan scored a single basket on a tight roll hoopward.

# The Spurs are incapable of beating any of the NBA's better teams if Duncan's post-up game only produces eight points. The rest of his total of 17 points were scored when the Spurs' team-wide ball movement found him alone under the basket and when he trailed a rare fast break.

The Pistons also made Duncan work hard on defense by repeatedly dumping the ball into R. Wallace (who, going head-to-head with TD, registered Detroit's first six points of the game). On several occasions, McDyess made a swift offense-to-defense transition and forced Duncan to run harder than he was used to running in order to keep up.

Basically, Ben Wallace out-muscled Duncan, while both R. Wallace and McDyess out-hustled him. Duncan's final numbers were 7-of-17 from the field, 3-of-10 from the foul line (where he still moves the ball too much in his shot preparation), 13 rebounds, one assist and one block.

Here's how the Pistons defended Tony Parker:

# They virtually shut down the Spurs' big-little S/R game simply by switching. With R. Wallace on him, Parker seemed confused early in the game — and all of his ball fakes and jab steps couldn't lure Rasheed into making a foolish move. (When he tried to force his dribble into the middle, Rasheed's pressure turned one of Parker's patented flip shots into an air ball.) Nor could Parker create sufficient space to shoot long jumpers over R. Wallace's long arms. In the only time Rasheed was late in switching, Parker pulled up and buried a mid-range jumper.

# During the second half, Parker was determined to zip his way to the rim in any circumstances, but the Pistons' bigs were quick to converge and force several missed shots. Parker's game total on S/Rs was a measly two points.

# Forgoing the S/R sets, the Spurs finally moved Duncan into one corner or the other, opened the middle and let Parker utilize his jets. This tactic led to Parker's nailing down a pair of tricky layups late in the second quarter.

# Generally, the Pistons (mostly Hamilton) played soft defense on Parker, choosing to let him shoot from the perimeter rather than giving him the opportunity to penetrate. But this was the only Pistons' defensive strategy that backfired as Parker shot 3-4 from the outskirts.

# Parker scored the remainder of his 17 points on the run in either fast-break or early-offense scenarios. His stat line included 7-14, one turnover and zero assists.

Here's how the Pistons defended Manu Ginobili:

# By shutting down S/Rs with switching big men. Only once was Ginobili able to successfully beat a switching B. Wallace to the hoop. Another similar attempt led to B. Wallace blocking the resulting shot.

# By playing him soft and allowing him to launch perimeter shots. From downtown, Ginobili was a disappointing 1-of-5.

# By making him fight through screens at the other end of the court — and occasionally having Prince take him into the pivot.

# Off the bench, Ginobili recorded 16 points in 29 minutes, to go along with two assists, two steals and one block.

As stingy as Detroit's defense was, the biggest mismatch occurred on the glass where the Pistons grabbed 56 rebounds (including 16 of their own missed shots) to the Spurs' 32 (including only four offensive caroms). The Pistons' big men were quicker laterally, quicker to the ball and quicker off their feet than were Duncan, Rasho Nesterovic and Nazr Mohammed (who only saw six minutes of action).

In addition, four of the Pistons' starters are capable of producing 30-plus points in any given game (compared with only three of the Spurs). Detroit's offensive sets are therefore much more varied (and harder to defend) than anything the Spurs can implement. Where Detroit's carnivorous defense virtually reduced the Spurs' offense to one-on-one forays, the Pistons flawlessly executed their plays all game long.

Assuming, then, that San Antonio and Detroit will indeed face off for the championship, how can the Spurs defeat such a high-energy and highly proficient team that so easily handled them in their two regular-season contests?

By hoping that several dreams will come true:

# Michael Finley and Nick Van Exel will regain a glimmer of their lost youths;

# Robert Horry will make big shot after big shot after;

# Duncan's bankers will not be foreclosed on account of his insufficient hand mechanics;

# Parker will riddle the Pistons with jumpers;

# Ginobili's madcap, headlong, perpetual hustle will be contagious;

# Bruce Bowen will get a handle on Hamilton's slippery and relentless off-the-ball movement; and

# Mohammed will be resurrected back into the land of the living.

There's a long, long road that stretches from now to then. And anything is possible in the wonderful world of the NBA.

Possible, but not probable."

Amuseddaysleeper
01-13-2006, 05:08 AM
yeah i agree with Rosen


right now we're looking at losing to Detroit in 5

GrandeDavid
01-13-2006, 05:55 AM
I agree with Rosen as well. But in judging by his tone you get the feel that its the end of days for Spurs Nation. Rosen likes to add punch to his columns and has a tendency to overdramatize, i.e. using words like "fear" and "highly overrated bank shot". Please.

carina_gino20
01-13-2006, 06:13 AM
"Fear", I think, is an exaggeration.

George Gervin's Afro
01-13-2006, 09:24 AM
fear? no.

i agree with rosen. for the most part the pistons play the spurs differently than anyone else. play duncan straight up and sag on parker. no other team does this so everynight we play someone other than the pistons we can impose our will. this falls on pop because we had no idea to what to do when the pistons basically played 5 on 5 defensive that sagged. tony parker being defended like this becomes a below avg point guard. our lack of effort in the beginning of the game was sickening but so was the pistons hitting 70% of their shots while we had one after another of our shots bounce around the rim and fall out. this defensive scheme causes us to be out of position concerning rebounding because of the one on one style of play. now i am not stupid and say better rebounding positioning will make a difference because even if we do the level of play will have to be at it's highest. i am not going to even mention the two words 'free throws' because honestly down the stretch i pray for 60%..

Supergirl
01-13-2006, 09:36 AM
Part of what this article ignores is that the Spurs also missed a lot of wide open jump shots, despite having some of the best jump shooters in the game (Horry, Barry, Van Exel, Finley). Had the jumpers fallen more, it would not have allowed the Pistons to collapse so easily on Duncan, which would have allowed him more room.

I think the key is the 1st quarter - the Spurs came out flat and got outrun but the hot shooting Pistons. The Pistons cooled off and the Spurs tried to surge back, but each time the Pistons did just enough to hold off the Spurs.

The game is disappointing and frustrating, but I'm still not too worried. Let the Pistons take the regular season games, if the Spurs pull it together for the playoffs. Eventually one of their starters will go down with injury and that will throw their chemistry off. They also won't be able to shoot like they did all the time. They're simple playing like they've got a chip on their shoulders right now. Which they do.

Bottom line is, Spurs have all the talent they need to get the job done, they just have to come out strong and fight for it. Which they didn't do last night, at least not for 48 minutes.

SequSpur
01-13-2006, 09:42 AM
The Spurs didn't show up. The problem was...... this game the other team went off in the first 5 minutes of the game........ game over....

The last two games that I have been to.....

Duncan, Parker and a few others do half a layup drill and then go sit on the bench waiting for yall ready for this.

No wonder it takes them the entire first quarter to get going.

JamStone
01-13-2006, 09:56 AM
Eventually one of their starters will go down with injury and that will throw their chemistry off.


Oh no ... not Spurs fan too, anticipating injury to the Pistons as a means to have the best chance to beat that team. I thought only Heat and Cavs fans did that ...

SpurYank
01-13-2006, 10:10 AM
All this "defeatist and 'woe is me'" talk by our fans after last night's game could very easily have been Detroit fans after they lost to the Wizards at home, or the Jazz' victory or the blow out at Dallas. It happens. I prefer to think the real Spurs and their able coaches will learn from this loss, and the loss last Saturday at Phoenix, and the other 10 to 12 losses that are to come. Then finally the second season will begin. All bets are off until then.

The game appeared to matter more to us and the media than to the players. Even in victory, the faces on the Pistons seemed to be saying "Get a grip! It's only Thursday, January 12th, for Christ's sake! There are still 46 games left to play for the Spurs and even more for us."

You better save some of your pissing and moaning for the next 10 to 12 loses that are just around the corner.

leemajors
01-13-2006, 10:29 AM
the only encouraging thing is the pistons couldn't have played a whole lot better the first quarter, and the spurs couldn't have played much worse. unfortunately due to a lack of consistent effort this game was decided in the first 12 minutes. this article did a good job of breaking things down, but he really lets his emphasis on dogging the spurs get in the way of what could have been a great article. not that they don't deserve it, after dogging their last 2 games vs the pistons. i am just surprised he didn't see that if the spurs hadn't been clanging those jump shots this could have been a tightly contested game.

Extra Stout
01-13-2006, 10:49 AM
The Spurs aren't even gonna make it to the finals if they keep playing like they have.
The West is too weak for them not to make it.

spurster
01-13-2006, 10:53 AM
1. The Spurs had no fire until they were down 20, which quickly sputtered, and the same thing happened halfway thru the 4th quarter. You can't do that against elite teams. However, I would guess the Spurs would be slightly more motivated if they make the finals.

2. Rebounding, rebounding, rebounding. The Pistons have won both games based on this. In a finals matchup, the Spurs can prepare for whatever the Pistons are doing, e.g., how to block them out.

3. Fear the Pistons in the finals? Need to make it thru the Western Conference first.

Brutalis
01-13-2006, 10:57 AM
GOOD.

I would love to see the Spurs play with a killer instinct. I would love to see us play with fear. It would only make us better and give us so much more to play for.

MOTIVATION BABY.

leemajors
01-13-2006, 10:58 AM
i would say the spurs are still in really good shape. they seem to be suffering a championship hangover, but still have only 9 losses and over 25 wins. the pistons suffered the same malaise last year and started 12-12. what remains to be seen is if the spurs can shake this off with tim obviously hurting. i would say a trade needs to be made, but i don't think anyone that could make that much of a difference is on the market.

implacable44
01-13-2006, 10:58 AM
good article - except I think the Pistons would sweep all things staying constant. - The Spurs got dominated - Rasheed outplayed TD - Bruce's biggest contribution was on offense and Tony Parker got outplayed and outclassed. Chauncey is 10 times the PG PArker is. 0 assists? - how the heck can you have 0 assists ? as much as he doninates the ball - dribble -0- dribble - dribble and you get 0 assists? What is that you were about to type ? - " other guys have to make shots for him to get assists" - he is the PG and it is his job to get them shots - just like Chauncey did - for the entire game as he broke any and everyone down off the dribble and created opportunities for others.

Good thing the Spurs roster will probably change a little bit before the all-star break - and how can Bones, Finley and Van Exel all be so ineffective as Spurs when they have been successful offensive players everywhere else they played ? Why can't they produce here ? - Is it them or is it Pop ? just a question ,... just a question.

implacable44
01-13-2006, 11:02 AM
Who will beat the spurs in the west ? - The Suns ? they will have to hope that Amare comes back and dominates which is something nobody has ever done with his type of injury - I will be suprised if he plays at all this year -- look at C-webb.

The Jazz? - didn't you know they were third in the west ( being that they are leading the NW division) - just kidding - no way

Memphis ? - no chance -

The Mavs have the best chance to beat the Spurs because they match up well and Dirk is a machine. I still don't see that hapenning - could but I doubt it.

boutons_
01-13-2006, 11:10 AM
"The West is too weak for them not to make it.

Fuck WC/EC overall weakness. Think only the playoffs. There are only 2 teams to worry about in the WC, Mavs and Suns, and Spurs will probably have to play them both, hopefully Spurs can maintain HCA at least in WC.

Like a lot of teams, even the absolute crap teams in Nov/Dec (eg Knicks), the Mavs will get better in the 2nd half, esp under new, good coach like Avery (and Larry).

Amare is apparently coming back. He will be probably only as good as last year, instead of much better, like each year so far. I really don't think his return will screw up the Suns. The Suns and Mike aren't that stupid. They will figure out how to integrate their returning top scorer. Wouldn't any team?

Mavs and Suns will take the Spurs to 6 games, maybe 7. They both would destroy last night's Spurs. Spurs are now 2-4 vs Mavs/Suns/Pistons.

Melmart1
01-13-2006, 11:17 AM
The Western Conference is not the powerhouse it has been in the past, but there are still some formidable teams there. I don't get why everyone thinks it will be a cakewalk to the Finals for the Spurs.

leemajors
01-13-2006, 11:58 AM
it won't be a cakewalk for anyone to the finals. they have conference playoffs for a reason.

boutons_
01-13-2006, 12:13 PM
The Spurs WC playoffs will start with 8th seed (or 5th seed if they don't pull their heads out/injuries), then Mavs/Suns or Suns/Mavs. Just forget everybody else in WC.

velik_m
01-13-2006, 12:27 PM
yeah i agree with Rosen


right now we're looking at losing to Detroit in 5

5? right now it looks like a sweep.

BillsCarnage
01-13-2006, 12:36 PM
Who will beat the spurs in the west ? - The Suns ? they will have to hope that Amare comes back and dominates which is something nobody has ever done with his type of injury - I will be suprised if he plays at all this year -- look at C-webb.

Webb was older, had more kneed problems and a worse microfracture injury than Amare. The Suns will need @ 15-20 games to integrate Amare back in and that leads to....


Amare is apparently coming back. He will be probably only as good as last year, instead of much better, like each year so far. I really don't think his return will screw up the Suns. The Suns and Mike aren't that stupid. They will figure out how to integrate their returning top scorer. Wouldn't any team?

If you saw Amare on the bench you'd think he was out with another type of injury. He's hopping around and active on the bench - meeting the team at TO's, etc. What many people don't realize is that what Amare brings, paint presense, rebounding and FT's, are all things the Suns are lacking. So, it's not going to be as difficult as people think. If it was a PG or shooter, then it might be more difficult.


Mavs and Suns will take the Spurs to 6 games, maybe 7. They both would destroy last night's Spurs. Spurs are now 2-4 vs Mavs/Suns/Pistons.

Apathy is what i mentioned prior to the season as the Spurs biggest opponent. Talk all you want about the second season, but the PO's are setup by the regular season. The Spurs need home court in the PO's, especially against the Pistons. They have three teams gunning for them - Suns, Mavs and Pistons. They've all shown they can beat them this year. The Spurs might fall to the 4th seed by the time the PO's roll around and that's probably the most difficult seed to be in.

wildbill2u
01-13-2006, 01:53 PM
I agree with Rosen as well. But in judging by his tone you get the feel that its the end of days for Spurs Nation. Rosen likes to add punch to his columns and has a tendency to overdramatize, i.e. using words like "fear" and "highly overrated bank shot". Please.

Tim used to make a pretty good percentage of his bank shots. Not anymore. Not even from 5-10 feet.

It's a product of:

1. changing his play from facing the basket to posting up with his back to the basket most of the time.

2. I'm guessing, but I doubt Tim puts in the practice time on his shooting any longer, especially practicing his bank shots with enough concentration to get and stay in a groove. Why else has his accuracy on those shots gone down?