Oh my god...

[T Park]

I just got done playing poker online at 888.com.


I put in 400 dollars, and theyve credited me with another 100.


I played 1 hand at the 30 dollar tables to start for the hell of it.

got 2 downs at 3 clubs ace spades.

so i thought, this sucks

flop

7 spades q spades 5 hearts



Im thinkin, hmm 3 spades, what the heck go for the flush
bet 30, everyone matches

turn

10 spades

(This is where i bet 90, and its matched all the way around AGAIN)

River

K

SPADES!!!

FLUSH!!!

(I bet 120, 2 others match, the pot is now at 896 dollars)

I win.


In little under 5 mins.

I made 7hundred dollars.


Im absolutely floored....

I cashed out and put it in my bank account.


Will I get arressted for this!??! lol

Im still in shock.

[ObiwanGinobili]

awsome. :tu :elephant


now don;t go back! if you go back you will lose $1000 gaurenteed.

[Baby Spears]

what ever keeps you from the spurs froum?
I am all for it!

[Ginofan]

Nice job! I'd be scared to play with that much money, lol. But great for you! Now buy us all Fabricio jerseys ;)

[TDMVPDPOY]

did u end up depositing it into my account?

[Vashner]

Crack habits are bad. Seek counsel.

[SpursWoman]

That's awesome! I'd definitely quit while I was ahead ... it only took once to figure out that beginner's luck fades pretty damn fast. :oops :lol


:elephant

[T Park]

lol

yeah i followed the consensus and went to bed.

Thanks for the kind words!!!!!


Im gonna give it another shot here this afternoon see if I can add to the bank account some more

[George W Bush]

Oh sorry, I read the title and thought you needed me.

But, God Bless America :tu

[GINNNNNNNNNNNNOBILI]

What's your screen name on 888?

[ShoogarBear]

And Tax Time is just around the corner, too.

The IRS Internet Monitors thank you . . .

[T Park]

Ericb25 Ginnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn


Shoogar, STFU

lol

[GINNNNNNNNNNNNOBILI]

Aight, I play there pretty much every night, mostly limit 2/4 - 3/6, but I'l keep an eye out.

My SN is kurt213

[T Park]

Kurt213, ill see ya there.

I played the 3/6 tables,

raising the hands up to 18 a shot is what made me my money


ok logging off now,

just won another 60 bucks lol.

[Melmart1]

WOW, nice job T-Park! You are quite brave for betting with that much money right away. Just make sure you gamble some more to meet your wagering requirement for your bonus, so they don't think you are trying to rip them off. Online casinos can be touchy about that sometimes, though 888.com is one of the best (I am assuming this is Pacific Poker?). The internet has some real idiots playing Poker, if you are smart (and a little lucky), you can make some money.

I do a lot of gambling writing for the internet, not much on Poker (though my assignment today has to do with WSOP 2006). Let me tell you, the sites I write for get e-mail all the time telling of how they won a huge amount, and then blew it all cus they got that flush of victory and let it spoil them. You definetely played smart by quitting while you were ahead. Good luck on the rest of your play!

[T Park]

Thanks for the kind words Melmart!! :)


You are quite brave for betting with that much money right away

Yeah, I was feeling sick to my stomach as I kept anteing (sp dont care) up, and when that final Spade came down, DAMN, what a FEELING of winnin a almost a 900 dollar pot!!!


(I am assuming this is Pacific Poker?).

Yeah thats what my desktop Icon says.

So far the people playing have been really cool with the Nice hands, where ya from, nice area and what not.

Im havin a blast.

Im trying to keep myself from playing more and getting addicted.



The internet has some real idiots playing Poker

Don't I know it.

Im one of em.

one hand I won this morning in the 2 dollar min table, i got dealt on the downs, pair of 8s. I thought what the hell its only 2 min 4 max, give it a whirl.

Well I got the pot up to 80 bucks, and the dude playin me had like a 10 and a 3

the flop was 8 7 9, turn was like a jack, and the river was a 2.

I was like,

why would you keep bidding up?? ARe you trying to bluff someone on a computer? Thats original.

I bluffed myself another few bucks this morning though I must admit lol.

wagering requirement for my bonus???

My bonus was 100 bucks.

I don't understand, Ive played poker for a while, but I just got into playin with money on the internets thing.

[Das Texan]

poker is fun.


i hang out on bodog a lot, finally starting to see my luck turn from utter shit to something decent.


bluffing is part of the game, its a hell of a lot easier to bluff in online poker than in live poker. sometimes if you dont bluff you wont win shit and especially if you are in a tourney you will see your chip stack dwindling down to nothing if you never do anything based on the cards you get dealt. its part of the game.

i've never been to pacific, i might have to try that one out sometime.

[Melmart1]

When you get a free bonus from an online casino or Poker room, you agree to bet that $100 (or whatever the bonus is) a certain amount of times before cashing it out. In other words, you were able to withdraw your winnings because it was played with your own funds. However, if you had tried to withdraw everything, they would not have let you withdraw the $100 bonus because you have not played enough raked hands to meet the bonus requirements.

They do this to protect themselves. A good example would be River Belle casino. They offer you $25 of their own money to bet with, and you don't have to deposit a dime to get it. So a bonus hunter would sign up, get the $25 then try to withdraw it. If they allowed this, they would be basically giving away $25 to every idiot on the net who signed up. So they ask you to wager it 20x before withdrawing it.

$25 bonus x 20x wagering requirement= $500

So you have to place $500 worth of wagers before you can cash out that $25. But you can still withdraw anything over that $25 that you won (unless its a shady casino).

As long as you continue to play, even occasionally, you will be good. Just don't try to take blatant advantage of the bonuses, or they will catch you and blacklist you. It's amazing the technology they have to monitor stuff, even compulsive gamblers or underage players.

[SequSpur]

What's your screen name on 888?

beardedlady21

[Marklar MM]

After playing poker with my younger cousin, I don't think I really want to play...he always won, whether it be a K/4/3/9/2/A or what not...always "I win", sorta like Big Daddy.

[scott]

T Park, you are definitely most welcome next time I put together a game.

[T Park]

well I was gonna go, but you backed out.

Make something up for the middle near the end of April.

Thats when ill be available again.

End of March beginning of April, MAYBE.

[GINNNNNNNNNNNNOBILI]

T Park, you are definitely most welcome next time I put together a game.

:lol

when is this next game you speak of??

[MannyIsGod]

I had a good night too:


***** Hand History for Game 3520924431 *****
NL Texas Hold'em Trny:19989224 Level:21 Blinds (10000/20000) - Thursday, February 09, 02:05:42 EDT 2006
Table Multi-Table(591672) Table #1 (Real Money)
Seat 3 is the button
Total number of players : 5
Seat 3: ManuelEsDios ( $54920 )
Seat 5: desiborn ( $433902 )
Seat 6: Scott7198 ( $842388 )
Seat 8: JimM4589 ( $232930 )
Seat 10: Rhashark ( $155860 )
Trny:19989224 Level:21
Blinds (10000/20000)
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to ManuelEsDios [ Ad Qd ]
JimM4589 folds.
Rhashark is all-In [155860]
ManuelEsDios is all-In [54920]
desiborn folds.
desiborn: call it
desiborn: pot odds
JimM4589: call it
Scott7198 will be using his time bank for this hand.
Scott7198 calls [135860].
** Dealing Flop ** [ 8h, Js, 9s ]
** Dealing Turn ** [ 4h ]
** Dealing River ** [ 4d ]
Scott7198 shows [ Jd, Qc ] two pairs, jacks and fours.
Rhashark shows [ Tc, Td ] two pairs, tens and fours.
ManuelEsDios shows [ Ad, Qd ] a pair of fours.
Scott7198 wins 201880 chips from side pot #1 with two pairs, jacks and fours.
Scott7198 wins 174760 chips from the main pot with two pairs, jacks and fours.
Player ManuelEsDios finished in 5 place and received $860
Player Rhashark finished in 4 place and received $1032
ManuelEsDios has left the table.


Oh and as for the bonuses poker rooms give you, some are able to be withdrawn right away. Others require you to play a certain amount of hands. However, if they let you withdraw it then take it right away. I've been doing a fair amount of "bonus whoring" lately where I just deposit money into a poker room to earn the bonus, then withdraw it and repeat at another site. Good way to make extra money while playing.

[T Park]

manuel es dios lmfao

:rollin

[MannyIsGod]

Heh, yeah. I try to switch it up so that people can't track my stats as frequently, and thats what I turned it into this time.

:)

[Kori Ellis]

$860 in a tournament is damn sweet!

Good job.

[MannyIsGod]

Yeah, considering it was a 10 dollar buy in.

In the past 2 weeks I have an outright win in a 10 dollar tourney, a 2nd in a 2.5k freeroll which got me about 250 bucks, and then this. I'm doing well on the tourneys right now.

I fucked up on this tourney though. There was a hand where I gave away about 150k in chips when I was second. I had AK and I misplayed it horribly.

[SequSpur]

Cool... You must have the luck on your side. :lol

Where are you playin? party poker?

[MannyIsGod]

Yeah, that was on Party. I'm still playing on Stars as well, and whatever site I happen to be trying to get a bonus on. (Titan, Absolute, Bodog)

[MannyIsGod]

T Park, you are definitely most welcome next time I put together a game.http://spurstalk.com/forums/images/smilies/smiangel.gifhttp://spurstalk.com/forums/images/smilies/smilol.gif

[CharlieMac]

WOW, nice job T-Park! You are quite brave for betting with that much money right away. Just make sure you gamble some more to meet your wagering requirement for your bonus, so they don't think you are trying to rip them off. Online casinos can be touchy about that sometimes, though 888.com is one of the best (I am assuming this is Pacific Poker?). The internet has some real idiots playing Poker, if you are smart (and a little lucky), you can make some money.

I do a lot of gambling writing for the internet, not much on Poker (though my assignment today has to do with WSOP 2006). Let me tell you, the sites I write for get e-mail all the time telling of how they won a huge amount, and then blew it all cus they got that flush of victory and let it spoil them. You definetely played smart by quitting while you were ahead. Good luck on the rest of your play!

I've always wondered, what are the legalities of online gambling?

[Melmart1]

That is a rather murky subject. They are actually illegal in the US, which is why they are all located overseas. It is not illegal to place a bet, though. Only to accept them, which is why Americans can play. Most of them are licensed by places like Gibraltar, Curacao and Kahnawake in Canada.

There are a few places in the US that won't allow you to even place a bet, but SA is safe. Congress continues to put restrictions on them, saying it is easy to become a compulsive gambler. But for ten years they haven't managed to ban them, and they are far too popular now for that to happen, methinks.

[MannyIsGod]

That is a rather murky subject. They are actually illegal in the US, which is why they are all located overseas. It is not illegal to place a bet, though. Only to accept them, which is why Americans can play. Most of them are licensed by places like Gibraltar, Curacao and Kahnawake in Canada.

There are a few places in the US that won't allow you to even place a bet, but SA is safe. Congress continues to put restrictions on them, saying it is easy to become a compulsive gambler. But for ten years they haven't managed to ban them, and they are far too popular now for that to happen, methinks.There are members of Congress who are still trying to lead a charge against online poker and the like. It is ridiculous. It is their lame attempt - ala the SA city concil and their strip clube crusades - to get their name in the paper and get the votes of the people out there who are out to save the world from cigarette smoke and foul language all in one stroke of the legal pen!

Sincerely,
1 happy poker addict.

GA anyone? :)

[Melmart1]

Yeah, there is a guy named Jon Kyl (R-AZ) who has worked for ten years to defeat the online casinos, and has failed everytime. But he keeps on going, saying its a morality thing, blah blah. More like, it's a career-saving thing, pandering to the 'moral majority'.

Makes me sick, and not just cus I get part of my livlihood from it, either. I guess I just prefer to be treated like an adult and be allowed to make my own decisions.

[CharlieMac]

So what are some of your favorites? What do you use, that is probably the most user friendly as far as the layout is concerned and what have you been comfortable with for years.

No poker sites, because.....well, because I suck.

[Melmart1]

I don't do Poker too much, I am not all that great at it, either.

I can recommend any casino with Microgaming software, especially Viper. Those are all excellent in game selection, platform stability, graphics etc. They all have a CashCheck system where you can see every financial transaction and every wager you ever made, very convenient. With the Viper software, you control speed of play, which is awesome for beginners.

I have accounts with several online casinos as a part of my work but I would personally recommend River Belle, 888.com and InterCasino. If I knew which games you specifically wanted to play, I could make a better one. Some focus on Slots, others on Blackjack, a few on Video Poker. It all depends on what you want to play.

[SpursWoman]

I know someone personally that has had a problem with gambling for many years. I recently found out that this person just wiped out every last cent that they had saved to buy a new house....and I mean buy out-right. And these aren't wealthy people by any stretch. :wow :(

Maybe that's why I'm too chicken to gamble ... I've watched this person too long I guess. So you guys be careful ... apparently that shit is as bad as heroine (or nicotine? :spin ) when you get addicted.

:fro

[CharlieMac]

I don't do Poker too much, I am not all that great at it, either.

I can recommend any casino with Microgaming software, especially Viper. Those are all excellent in game selection, platform stability, graphics etc. They all have a CashCheck system where you can see every financial transaction and every wager you ever made, very convenient. With the Viper software, you control speed of play, which is awesome for beginners.

I have accounts with several online casinos as a part of my work but I would personally recommend River Belle, 888.com and InterCasino. If I knew which games you specifically wanted to play, I could make a better one. Some focus on Slots, others on Blackjack, a few on Video Poker. It all depends on what you want to play.

Well, I'm into slots and betting on actual games and so on. Nothing too serious. Could you post the link to these sites. I could Google them , but I'd be too worried about logging into a spoof site or something.

[Melmart1]

Sure, Eriks. Here are the links...

www.riverbelle.com Has a no-deposit bonus, you don't pay a cent and get $25 to play with. They use Microgaming and have some really fun bonus Slots.

If you like Slots, I would recommend www.allslots.com, they have the best Slots and a great new player bonus, you get $150 free for depositing only $50, or $100 free for depositing $25.

www.intercasino.com is the first online casino to take a bet and they are awesome. They had zero customer disputes last year, absolutely astounding. They take good care of you, but unfortunately the game selection is rather small. But if you are scared to try these places, this is by far the most honest and reputable place to start.

[kris]

There are members of Congress who are still trying to lead a charge against online poker and the like. It is ridiculous. It is their lame attempt - ala the SA city concil and their strip clube crusades - to get their name in the paper and get the votes of the people out there who are out to save the world from cigarette smoke and foul language all in one stroke of the legal pen!

Sincerely,
1 happy poker addict.

GA anyone? :)

They may be trying to do just that, but one reason they could be doing it is for a more efficient allocation of money. Ultimately, gambling usually drains money from the people that need it to the people who don't. Also, those involved in gambling are promoting illegitimate business as opposed to doing something more productive with their money like investing or saving.

Another general reason could be that it's simply hard to regulate the money flowing in and out. Accounting, books, and taxes is easier to dillute and shade online than it is in real life.

I don't know if you were kidding, but I also think the legislation against tobacco companies, although it seems unfair, has a viable reason. The government wants people healthy. Not necessarily because they want everyone walking with bright shiny faces, but because of the rising health care costs unhealthy people bring. I believe government will start losing money annually for social security (somewhat related) in 2013. That might be off, I can't remember.

So the guys with pens sometimes have the right ideals, or so I think.

[Melmart1]

Ultimately, gambling usually drains money from the people that need it to the people who don't. Also, those involved in gambling are promoting illegitimate business as opposed to doing something more productive with their money like investing or saving.

.

You have a very valid point, Kris.

Problem is, that is not why Congress is doing this. If this were the reason why, alcohol and tobacco would be illegal as well. You dont NEED either one, and the alcohol and tobacco people already have enough money. They are all addicting if you go too far- so why only outlaw one and not the other two?

What it comes down to is choice. Yes, a small minority of idiots may gamble too much and blow their life's savings. But should the rest of us suffer? The government is not supposed to hold our hand and keep us away from things that THEY deem harmful. Gambling is not harmful to everyone, only those with an addiction. But as I already stated, lots of things are addicting, are we going to ban them all?

[kris]

You have a very valid point, Kris.

Problem is, that is not why Congress is doing this. If this were the reason why, alcohol and tobacco would be illegal as well. You dont NEED either one, and the alcohol and tobacco people already have enough money. They are all addicting if you go too far- so why only outlaw one and not the other two?

What it comes down to is choice. Yes, a small minority of idiots may gamble too much and blow their life's savings. But should the rest of us suffer? The government is not supposed to hold our hand and keep us away from things that THEY deem harmful. Gambling is not harmful to everyone, only those with an addiction. But as I already stated, lots of things are addicting, are we going to ban them all?

You also have a good counter point. I think you will find the answer in history. Think of an imaginary timeline and place spiritous beverages, tobacco, and online poker on it. Alcohol and tobacco usage are rooted in our heritage. It would be impossible to eradicate these staples of so many generations of people. Online gambling, on the other hand, could fairly easily be halted.

Also, if you think about it, Congress has down thier best to restrict alcohol and tobacco use as realistically the best they can. (age limits, permits to carry and serve, stiff penalties on various related crimes, etc.)

However, it simply isn't feasible for Congress to attempt to completely shut these industries down.

[Das Texan]

*sigh*

last night sucked for me in poker.

need to bounce back tonight and make up for my losses nad then some. good thing my stocks are making money :)

[T Park]

No kiddin.

Last night came to a crashing halt for me.

was down 500 at one point, but bounced back to make it only 300.


Oh well, theres always today!

[SequSpur]

The government could shut all of it down, tobacco, alcohol and internet gambling.

You know why they don't? Because they go home and do it also.

[T Park]

lol

very true.


Like AL Gore.

Hated smoking threatened to shut down all the tobacco companies,

but turns out his family owns a tobacco farm.

[George W Bush]

The government could shut all of it down, tobacco, alcohol and internet gambling.

You know why they don't? Because they go home and do it also.

Sequ, you better watch it buddy. Me and my administrations are very serious about anyone criticizing the White House, and by the way, we take it very seriously. Especially from midgets like you.

I like midgets by the way, I once got in a fight with a midget cuz I told him I thought he was snubbed at the Oscars for his work on Wizard of Oz,
He didn't like that very much so he bit my ankle just as I was chokin' on a preztel. I coughed up the pretzel and it hit the midget in the head and it knocked him clear out. And that's what happened.

What can I say,
I won.

Next mornin' I woke up and declared war against all small people and anyone who harbors Sequ-like midgets.
My fellow Americans, stay on alert.

And God Bless America :tu

[MannyIsGod]

They may be trying to do just that, but one reason they could be doing it is for a more efficient allocation of money. Ultimately, gambling usually drains money from the people that need it to the people who don't. Also, those involved in gambling are promoting illegitimate business as opposed to doing something more productive with their money like investing or saving.

Another general reason could be that it's simply hard to regulate the money flowing in and out. Accounting, books, and taxes is easier to dillute and shade online than it is in real life.

I don't know if you were kidding, but I also think the legislation against tobacco companies, although it seems unfair, has a viable reason. The government wants people healthy. Not necessarily because they want everyone walking with bright shiny faces, but because of the rising health care costs unhealthy people bring. I believe government will start losing money annually for social security (somewhat related) in 2013. That might be off, I can't remember.

So the guys with pens sometimes have the right ideals, or so I think.Whose ideals? Yours or mine? And if yours, why are yours better than mine?

I have an idea, its called letting adults decide what is good for themselves. Whether that be a spin of a roulette wheel, a joint, or even perhaps a cigarette.

It may be a novel idea, but I propose that we cut government costs by letting people live their lives instead of intruding into it with our own moralities and making other people abide by them.

I don't know about you, but I feel fairly comfortable in being able to decide what I deem healthy and nessecary in my life. Whether that be a glass of alcohol every now and again, some time at the tables, or a hit of the bong shouldn't be decided by someone who has nothing to do with my life in the interest of making me healthy.

And to be honest, it isn't about healthy. It is about agendas. How can poltician A get his agenda through the door. How can he/she stay in office to promote more of his/her agenda. Well, one way is by solving problems they create. They're going to remove personal responsibility from the equation and save the world while they're at it.

Yeah, call me stupid, but I'm pretty sure the way to save governmental related expenses isn't by creating more legislation and government. You need look no further than prohibittion as an exampe of government creating problems that it then needs to solve. The current drug war is another shining example of laws that are meant to "save" people that inevitably have a much worse effect on a larger number of people.

[ShoogarBear]

So, taking the arguments to their logical conclusion, why have laws against ANY drugs and prostitution?

This, of course, is the libertarian argument. What's so magical about alcohol as opposed to heroin? And what would happen to the crime rate if all drugs were legalized?

[T Park]

weed should be legalized.

Crack and that other stuff??

Keep it illegal.

We dont need millions of people walking around on crack.

That is seriously bad stuff.

[SequSpur]

Drugs are bad.

Legalizing this stuff would increase health problems and probably criminal activity.

I kind've agree with Manny though on ideals. If he wants to play poker then so be it, if he wants to smoke dope, then so be it, just don't sell it.

My ideals are only important to me.

[ShoogarBear]

weed should be legalized.

Crack and that other stuff??

Keep it illegal.

We dont need millions of people walking around on crack.

That is seriously bad stuff.
Ah, but as soon as you say that, you open the door for someone else to say that the line should be drawn at booze. More people die in this country due to effects of alcohol (accidents, liver disease) than any other drug.

I don't have an answer. I'm just saying it's hard to argue there's a clear line between "good" and "bad" drugs.

[George W Bush]

weed should be legalized.

Crack and that other stuff??

Keep it illegal.

We dont need millions of people walking around on crack.

That is seriously bad stuff.

Shut up fat boy. Your huge butt crack should be illegal.

by the way,
God Bless America :tu

[T Park]

I don't have an answer. I'm just saying it's hard to argue there's a clear line between "good" and "bad" drugs

I agree.


I just posted this as a brag type thread to begin with to be like Mr Sportschick and manny.

But its turned into a morality debate.

[ShoogarBear]

Drugs are bad.

Legalizing this stuff would increase health problems and probably criminal activity.

Let's look at alcohol:

When it was illegal: probably less health problems (but hard to say), but definitely more criminal activity.

Legal: more health problems, less criminal activity.

Who's to say it would be different for any other drug?

[ShoogarBear]

I agree.


I just posted this as a brag type thread to begin with to be like Mr Sportschick and manny.

But its turned into a morality debate.
Eh, I don't really see a debate. Everyone has their own feelings on it, but I haven't seen anyone claim to have alll the answers and the other guy's a moron.

Me, I've never even done weed and think it tends to turn people into bozos, but can't really see why it's illegal and alcohol isn't.

[MannyIsGod]

Big Zak should be the poster child for legalized weed.

[GINNNNNNNNNNNNOBILI]

If the goverment was smart, they'd legalize Online Gambling, so they would be able to tax the websites and tax the winnings, then that money could be used for good causes.

[T Park]

and tax the winnings, then that money could be used for good causes.

it would go to pork barrel bullshit like

200 grand to the rock and roll hall of fame in cleveland or some bullshit like that.


I wish this country was patient enough for a change, but everyone is "status quo"

[T Park]

Big Zak should be the poster child for legalized weed.




I thought you wanted it legalized?

[MannyIsGod]

Oh, and the argument that if Heroin was legal we'd have millions of people walking around on Heroin is fucking stupid. Does anyone actually belive that the only reason we don't have that right now is legal fear?

[Melmart1]

Alcohol and tobacco usage are rooted in our heritage

So is gambling. Gladiators used to turn their chariots over, mark the spokes and make bets based on the spins. Today, we call it Roulette. Cavemen made the first dice out of bones and rocks. Today, we use them for Craps. The first Slot machine has been around since the 1800s. Blackjack was invented in France since before the French Revolution. The Chinese invented forms of lottery to buy weapons for territorial wars to defend their villages.

In other words, it isn't going away anytime soon. So, like Ginnnnobili said, why not make it legal and tax it? Then the government can interfere like they seem to need to, but still allow me to make an adult choice about whether or not gambling is acceptable for me. Everyone is happy.

[ShoogarBear]

Gladiators used to turn their chariots over, mark the spokes and make bets based on the spins. Today, we call it Roulette.
I DID NOT KNOW THAT. That's some wild, crazy STUFF.

[T Park]

wow thats somethin else.

[Melmart1]

I DID NOT KNOW THAT. That's some wild, crazy STUFF.

You learn something new everyday!

[Jekka]

So is gambling. Gladiators used to turn their chariots over, mark the spokes and make bets based on the spins. Today, we call it Roulette. Cavemen made the first dice out of bones and rocks. Today, we use them for Craps. The first Slot machine has been around since the 1800s. Blackjack was invented in France since before the French Revolution. The Chinese invented forms of lottery to buy weapons for territorial wars to defend their villages.

In other words, it isn't going away anytime soon. So, like Ginnnnobili said, why not make it legal and tax it? Then the government can interfere like they seem to need to, but still allow me to make an adult choice about whether or not gambling is acceptable for me. Everyone is happy.

The most popular sports in early American history, though lasting far past the Revolutionary War, were bloodsports - cockfighting, dog fights, bull and bear baiting, horse racing - all of these games were rooted in gambling and betting. They are a huge part of early American culture (both high and low) and modern cultural formation. Like MelMart1 said, it's not going away any time soon. You might as well try to bring Prohibition back, since that was so successful.

[kris]

Whose ideals? Yours or mine? And if yours, why are yours better than mine?

I have an idea, its called letting adults decide what is good for themselves. Whether that be a spin of a roulette wheel, a joint, or even perhaps a cigarette.

It may be a novel idea, but I propose that we cut government costs by letting people live their lives instead of intruding into it with our own moralities and making other people abide by them.

I don't know about you, but I feel fairly comfortable in being able to decide what I deem healthy and nessecary in my life. Whether that be a glass of alcohol every now and again, some time at the tables, or a hit of the bong shouldn't be decided by someone who has nothing to do with my life in the interest of making me healthy.

And to be honest, it isn't about healthy. It is about agendas. How can poltician A get his agenda through the door. How can he/she stay in office to promote more of his/her agenda. Well, one way is by solving problems they create. They're going to remove personal responsibility from the equation and save the world while they're at it.

Yeah, call me stupid, but I'm pretty sure the way to save governmental related expenses isn't by creating more legislation and government. You need look no further than prohibittion as an exampe of government creating problems that it then needs to solve. The current drug war is another shining example of laws that are meant to "save" people that inevitably have a much worse effect on a larger number of people.

I think it would be great if the government had less intrusion into the lives of American citizens. And it's not the people like you that necessitate all of the programs, spending, and legislation - it's the people that are inable, for whatever reason to take care of themselves.

I agree with you that the system has major flaws from congressman with personal agendas to a deficit that will never be mastered, but I think overall we are better for it. Simply put, I think the key problem with your notion is the small percentage (say 5%) of the population that would be at a loss without government taxation, restrictions, guidelines, etc.

Another issue is where to draw the line. That's a really hard give and take.

To me there is the potential to have a good system, if you look at the skeleton of our government, but it gets bogged down with the individual imperfections of those who run it. There is a lot of corruption, laziness, greed, and inefficiency but to me that just seems what happen when humans garner power.

[CharlieMac]

Do you people feel safe sending your card information through sites like 888.com?

[MannyIsGod]

I think it would be great if the government had less intrusion into the lives of American citizens. And it's not the people like you that necessitate all of the programs, spending, and legislation - it's the people that are inable, for whatever reason to take care of themselves.

I agree with you that the system has major flaws from congressman with personal agendas to a deficit that will never be mastered, but I think overall we are better for it. Simply put, I think the key problem with your notion is the small percentage (say 5%) of the population that would be at a loss without government taxation, restrictions, guidelines, etc.

Another issue is where to draw the line. That's a really hard give and take.

To me there is the potential to have a good system, if you look at the skeleton of our government, but it gets bogged down with the individual imperfections of those who run it. There is a lot of corruption, laziness, greed, and inefficiency but to me that just seems what happen when humans garner power.I can't disagree with that.

[MannyIsGod]

Do you people feel safe sending your card information through sites like 888.com?Your card will probably be denied through them. Most US credit cards will nto work with online gambling sites. You'll have to setup an account with a service like Neteller (the paypal of gambling) or just do it through echeck.

Personally I love my neteller account.