allstar game is for allstars

[dbestpro]

Rasheed Wallace is statistically having one of the worst years of his career. He is ranked 51 of top players and 14 as a power foward. You always hear that the fans shouldn't pick the players, but here is an example of a reach by the coaches. Rather than picking the best players it seems many eastern conference coaches are trying to send a message about team play at the expense of the allstar game. Team players are what make championships but are not allstars. It is unfair to the fans who support the rest of the teams.

[TDMVPDPOY]

Dont let stats get to u fool

[exstatic]

Rasheed is as good as any PF in the game. I like the message that the coaches are sending: if you play team ball for a winner, you will be rewarded, not penalized for giving up some stats. I think a stat pig like Carter has less of a place on the team than Rasheed.

[ducks]

duncan could pat his stats more but he does not he shares it
but he still goes to the allstar game

[dbestpro]

It's an allstar game not an all team game. It's suppose to be fun with the best players. Besides the the player left off for Wallace is leading the league in rebounding, Howard from Orlando. You're only a fool if you look at only the offensive stats.

[ducks]

howard
G Min M A Pct M A Pct M A Pct Off Def Tot Ast TO Stl Blk PF PPG
Last game vs DET 1 43 8 11 72.7 0 0 0.0 6 9 66.7 3 11 14 0 3 2 1 3 22
Career vs. DET 5 38.3 6.2 11.6 53.5 0.0 0.0 0.0 3.2 5.0 64.0 3.6 6.6 10.2 0.6 1.4 1.0 1.4 2.6 15.6
Home (this year) 24 36.4 5.5 10.9 50.8 0.0 0.0 0.0 4.1 6.6 61.6 3.2 8.9 12.1 1.3 2.3 0.9 1.5 3.5 15.2
0 Days Rest (this year) 12 38.5 5.8 10.8 53.5 0.0 0.0 0.0 3.8 6.3 60.5 3.4 10.5 13.9 1.3 2.9 0.4 1.4 3.6 15.


wallace
Recent Career FG 3PT FT Rebounds Misc
Year Team G Min M A Pct M A Pct M A Pct Off Def Tot Ast TO Stl Blk PF PPG
2003-04 DET 22 30.6 5.5 12.8 43.1 1.0 3.1 31.9 1.7 2.5 70.4 1.5 5.6 7.1 1.8 1.3 1.1 2.1 2.7 13.7
2004-05 DET 79 34.0 5.9 13.4 44.0 1.0 3.0 31.8 1.7 2.5 69.7 2.2 6.0 8.2 1.8 1.6 0.8 1.5 3.0 14.5
2005-06 DET 48 35.6 5.7 13.1 43.5 2.0 5.3 37.7 1.8 2.4 73.0 1.3 5.3 6.6 2.6 1.1 1.2 1.6 3.1 15.1
Career 759 34.5 6.3 13.0 48.4 0.8 2.3 33.8 2.4 3.4 71.0 1.7 5.2 6.9 2.0 1.8 1.0 1.3 3.0 15.8

[ducks]

walllace and howard go at it friday

lets see who shuts who down

[Despot]

Rasheed Wallace is statistically having one of the worst years of his career. He is ranked 51 of top players and 14 as a power foward. You always hear that the fans shouldn't pick the players, but here is an example of a reach by the coaches. Rather than picking the best players it seems many eastern conference coaches are trying to send a message about team play at the expense of the allstar game. Team players are what make championships but are not allstars. It is unfair to the fans who support the rest of the teams.

So is Duncan.

[genghisrex]

Besides the the player left off for Wallace is leading the league in rebounding, Howard from Orlando. You're only a fool if you look at only the offensive stats.
Wait, so you're saying Howard is a better defender than Rasheed? :lmao

[Brutalis]

4 Pistons getting in is BULLSHIT. Rip and Billups deserved it hands down and even to start.

But Ben Wallace and Sheed? Bullshittttttttttttttttt

[SequSpur]

Rasheed is as good as any PF in the game. I like the message that the coaches are sending: if you play team ball for a winner, you will be rewarded, not penalized for giving up some stats. I think a stat pig like Carter has less of a place on the team than Rasheed.

You're stupid.

Carter is an MVP candidate.

[spurs=bling]

You're stupid.

Carter is an MVP candidate.



http://www.geekimages.com/pics/20060206/alicarter.jpg (http://www.geekimages.com)

[TDMVPDPOY]

carter and mvp should not be even mention in the same context or speech. thats just fuckn wrong. if ur definition of mvp is most valueble pansy then yes.

[texbumTHElife]

Here is my take on the whole "If the NBA is a team game and the Pistons are the best team in the NBA then the entire starting 5 should be on the all-star team" bull poop:

The NBA is a team game and the goal of the team is to win the title. That is your reward for being the best team. However the All-Star game is a celebration of individual players having stand out years at their positions. Chauncy Billups is the only Piston deserving of this honor. Every other player in the Pistons starting five as an individual is being out played by at least one other player in the Eastern Confrence.

Fool proof logic. Put it in a book and make it a law.

[SequSpur]

Well who should go in there place?

Shit.

[FreshPrince22]

Stat..... Whore.....

[texbumTHElife]

Well who should go in there place?

Shit.

Redd or Arenas over Hamilton although in retrospect I really cant argue with Hamilton making the team.

Dwight Howard and (as much as I cant stand the douche) Chris Webber over the Wallace boys.

All that aside there was more to my post than just disputing the Pistons boys making it. But take from it what you will.

[baseline bum]

Rasheed is as good as any PF in the game. I like the message that the coaches are sending: if you play team ball for a winner, you will be rewarded, not penalized for giving up some stats. I think a stat pig like Carter has less of a place on the team than Rasheed.

The stats totally lie about Rasheed. He shoots 43% because he pulls opposing bigs to the three point line so as to make it impossible to switch off screens run for Hamilton and to open the interior for dribble penetration. Of course his rebound numbers are way down too since he's spending 80% of the time far from the basket on offense. If you want a stat to show his real impact offensively, consider that his points per shot are 1.15 this season, and he doesn't hurt the team by jacking threes since his team is amazing in transition defense.

He's still unguardable in the post and when they need a basket in crunch-time Rasheed is automatic throwing a jumper or a hook from a step outside the blocks on the baseline. He can get a high percentage shot off on anyone. He's the most underrated defender in the game and if he's not as good as Ben he isn't very far off his level.

He absolutely deserves to be there and he's a much more complete player than Howard, Redd, or Arenas.

[SequSpur]

exstatic has his head up his ass because he can't dunk.

[SpursIndonesia]

I think Billups & BigBen are totally deserving, then the Pistons with their great record deserve 3 spot for allstar, so it should have been either Rip or Sheed for the third spot.

[TDMVPDPOY]

i dont think tp is an allstar, his more of a star player to me, no where near allstar or superstar level.

[FreshPrince22]

The stats totally lie about Rasheed. He shoots 43% because he pulls opposing bigs to the three point line so as to make it impossible to switch off screens run for Hamilton and to open the interior for dribble penetration. Of course his rebound numbers are way down too since he's spending 80% of the time far from the basket on offense. If you want a stat to show his real impact offensively, consider that his points per shot are 1.15 this season, and he doesn't hurt the team by jacking threes since his team is amazing in transition defense.

He's still unguardable in the post and when they need a basket in crunch-time Rasheed is automatic throwing a jumper or a hook from a step outside the blocks on the baseline. He can get a high percentage shot off on anyone. He's the most underrated defender in the game and if he's not as good as Ben he isn't very far off his level.

He absolutely deserves to be there and he's a much more complete player than Howard, Redd, or Arenas.


Thank you. People don't realize that when you factor in Rasheed's three point shooting he's one of the more effecient players in the league. His eFG% is 51%. He's actually more effecient from the field than Duncan, Bosh, JO, Dirk, etc since he takes so many threes. And that doesn't even factor in your point that he pulls shot blockers out of the paint. In that regard he probably buys his teammates 4-5 layups per game, because he can hit shots out to 30 feet from all angles.

[texbumTHElife]

then the Pistons with their great record deserve 3 spot for allstar

This is exactly what I dont agree with. The Pistons record will reward them with home court in the playoffs. Thats not what the all-star game is all about to me. The All-Star game IMO isnt about the accomplishments of the team.

[FreshPrince22]

This is exactly what I dont agree with. The Pistons record will reward them with home court in the playoffs. Thats not what the all-star game is all about to me. The All-Star game IMO isnt about the accomplishments of the team.

These are the COACHES voting, and I'm sure they care more about putting in team-first guys than me-first chuckers.

[TDMVPDPOY]

if this game is for allstars, then wtf is parker doin on teh squad?

[texbumTHElife]

if this game is for allstars, then wtf is parker doin on teh squad?


This season he has played at an All-Star level IMO.

[texbumTHElife]

These are the COACHES voting, and I'm sure they care more about putting in team-first guys than me-first chuckers.

I realise that but this is an exhibition game. Not a game that really determines anything. I realize the game will never be based 100% on fan voting and I agree it shouldnt but I dont agree with team succes dictating All-Star voting. Hell I would rather see a squad of all-nba players take on the And 1 street ballers then watch the Pistons starting 5 play together. I can see that 82 times in a season already.

[FreshPrince22]

I realise that but this is an exhibition game. Not a game that really determines anything. I realize the game will never be based 100% on fan voting and I agree it shouldnt but I dont agree with team succes dictating All-Star voting. Hell I would rather see a squad of all-nba players take on the And 1 street ballers then watch the Pistons starting 5 play together. I can see that 82 times in a season already.

The funny thing is that if it were up to fans voting, Sheed would have been in anyways. In fact, he would be starting in place of JO. He was third overall in Forward voting in the east.

[texbumTHElife]

The funny thing is that if it were up to fans voting, Sheed would have been in anyways. In fact, he would be starting in place of JO. He was third overall in Forward voting in the east.

Which is exactly why I think it should never be 100% up to the fans. The year Vince Carter got voted in after only playing 15 games was absurd.

[FreshPrince22]

Which is exactly why I think it should never be 100% up to the fans. The year Vince Carter got voted in after only playing 15 games was absurd.

OK, but most of this thread is about how Rasheed doesn't deserve to be an all-star. When, in fact, the general public AND coaches think he should.

[TDMVPDPOY]

i think fans should stop lookin at stats, and look at how his presence is on teh court and other sides to his game. This year the pistons have improved there offense alot and considering his not even the main option when it comes to scoring, on certain nites he can give u 30pts when his mojo is on.

I can understand why guys like arenas/howard were left out because they are shit, which part of shit dont u understand?

[Darrin]

Rasheed Wallace is statistically having one of the worst years of his career. He is ranked 51 of top players and 14 as a power foward. You always hear that the fans shouldn't pick the players, but here is an example of a reach by the coaches. Rather than picking the best players it seems many eastern conference coaches are trying to send a message about team play at the expense of the allstar game. Team players are what make championships but are not allstars. It is unfair to the fans who support the rest of the teams.

I can see both sides of this argument. The NBA USUALLY showcases the best teams in the league, so you may end up with a steady diet of the same team and that is boring to anyone who's not a fan of that team. And the coaches are tired of a bunch of hot-dogging players on their roster hoping to make the All-Star team.

But this isn't unprecedented - it's not like the Pistons received special treatment.

The Suns sent three players to the All-Star Game last season (Steve Nash, Amare Stoudemire, Shawn Marion).The Pacers sent two players to the All-Star Game in 2004 (Jermaine O'Neal, Ron Artest).

Multiple appearances for the best record in the league is not unprecedented.

And if you're looking for numbers:

Rasheed Wallace has set his Pistons career high in points (33 vs. Washington), and rebounds (14 at Memphis) this season. He's shooting his highest percentage from behind the long line (.387) since he was a Sixth Man in Portland (1998-99), is averaging a career high in assists (2.6), his highest steals rate since 2001-02, and a career low in turnovers.

Rasheed's overall numbers: 15.1 ppg, 6.6 rpg, 2.6 apg, 1.15 spg, 1.60 bpg, 1.10 tpg.

[WalterBenitez]

Carter is an MVP candidate. :depressed

I see Nash, TP and many others ahead of Sweet Vince :rolleyes

[dbestpro]

sheed's averaging 2.6 apg my God lets turn hime into a point guard. Shooting a record percentage number 3's for his career? I guess that means Bruce Bowen should start over Kobe. To top it all off the guy is a crybaby jerk. He only becomes considered a team player cause all the Pistons know how to cry in unison.

[smeagol]

You're stupid.

Carter is an MVP candidate.
If you think Carter is MVP material, you are the stupid one (actually, you're stupid even without thinking that).

[Brutalis]

The bottom fucking line is no matter what ignorant fans think. Arenas and Redd got robbed over Sheed and Ben Wallace. That is absurd. Coaches are obviously biased to one team in the East. It's a load of shit. Like the Super Bowl people bitched about that I don't. But once the ASG is here. I'll shutup. Some of you should learn that.

[TDMVPDPOY]

you guys should get this straight, whichever coach voted sheed n ben in was not saunders, so imo pop was either one of them who voted them in :D:D:D

[pache100]

i dont think tp is an allstar, his more of a star player to me, no where near allstar or superstar level.

Good thing they didn't ask you what you think, then.

[Supergirl]

Personally, I think Sheed is the second best PF in the East (after Jermaine O'Neal), so he belongs there.

Ben and CHauncey are no-brainers, IMO. Without them the Pistons are no better or worse than Cleveland, Miami, Indiana (when healthy, if that ever happens again)...

Rip is the one who doesn't belong there I think. I don't care if technically he's the team's leading scorer, he's the fourth and maybe fifth least important person on that team. (Tayshaun plays a much more important role as that coveted "long three")

Vince doesn't really belong there either.

Redd and Arenas, having career, stat-stuffing years and being the ONLY reasons their teams are in the hunt at all, should both be there over Rip and Vince, IMO.

[nkdlunch]

all I know is if Carter was on the Wizards instead of Arenas, the Wiz would have the worst record in the NBA right now.

[pache100]

Rip is the one who doesn't belong there I think. I don't care if technically he's the team's leading scorer, he's the fourth and maybe fifth least important person on that team. (Tayshaun plays a much more important role as that coveted "long three")

:tu :tu :tu

[JamStone]

Rasheed doesn't belong in the all star game. Talent-wise, he might be the second best power forward in the Eastern Conference. But, even though he's sacrificed his stats for team success, he just isn't having an all star type season. I would have put Dwight Howard ahead of Rasheed Wallace. I wouldn't argue Redd or Arenas over Rasheed simply because the Eastern Conference team needed more balance with big men, especially without Jermaine O'Neal.

Now as for Rip Hamilton not deserving, it's pretty surprising to hear any fan say that. As for Rip being the fourth or fifth "least important" person on the team, I'm assuming Supergirl meant fourt or fifth "most important" person on the team. Think about the use of superlatives. At any rate, one could argue that Rip is the second most important player on the team after Chauncey Billups.

In today's NBA, what guards or perimeter players shoot basically 50% from the field? Not many. There are Tony Parker, Andre Iguodala, and Wally Szcerbiak. And, Wally and Rip are the only perimeter players to shoot around 50% from the field that predominantly shoot jumpers. Rip has been in the top 3 in 3-pt % for basically the entire season, and he has not even been a 3-pt shooting threat most of his career. If you compare his numbers to Michael Redd's, they are very similar. Redd scores more, but takes more shots. Redd rebounds more, but Redd doesn't have the frontline Rip has. Essentially all the other categories are in favor of Rip. At best, choosing between Rip and Redd is a toss-up. And, the coaches leaned towards Rip for whatever reason, maybe it was the team success, maybe it was because he hadn't been in the all star game before. Either way, it was not a travesty or injustice to have selected Rip over Redd.

On Gilbert Arenas, I think he should have made it too. And, had Arenas made it over Rip, I would not have had a problem with it. But, in the converse, I don't really have a problem with Rip over Arenas, simply because I think Rip or Chauncey should have made it over Arenas last year. Every year, there will be deserving players that don't get named to the all star game. That's the life of an NBA star. He can use hundred dollar bills to wipe his tears.

Brutalis, many of your posts earlier stated that you thought Ben Wallace deserved to be an all star. I have seen more recent posts of yours state that Ben doesn't. You hear an argument or two against Ben Wallace, and then you turncoat on your initial opinion. You simply just love to find reasons to hate the Pistons. That's fine. You simply cannot just give credit where credit is due. There is not another center in the Eastern Conference more deserving to be in the all star game than Ben Wallace. You cannot say Arenas deserves it more than Ben or Redd deserves it more than Ben. Arenas and Redd are not centers. When the coaches vote in the reserves, they must vote for at least one center. So, if you have a complaint, then say Zydrunas Ilgauskas deserves to be in the all star game over Ben or Eddy Curry deserves to be in the game over Ben or Brendan Haywood deserves to be in the game over Ben. Know the dynamics of the all star game and how the coaches vote in the reserves. And, then you won't appear so biased and hateful towards the Pistons ... wait, too late for that.

[HeyIt'sMe]

I'm not going to sit here and say Dwight deserves to make it over Rasheed or what not, but I do think he should be rewarded for leading the league in rebounding. As of today, if the season ended, he would be the youngest player EVER to lead the league in boards. He also chips in with 15.2 PPG on 51% shooting while playing with a selfish PG in Steve Francis who is having the worst season of his career. I mean, Francis is the Magic's leading scorer at 16.8 PPG, so it's blatantly obvious that Orlando simply doesn't score that much.

Part of that has to do with the style they play. Brian Hill has played a slow down style this year, in part because the Magic have a lot of chuckers on the team who don't play defense, so he tries to hide their shortcomings on that end of the floor. If Orlando played more uptempo and had someone other than Francis passing him the ball, I think you would see his PPG average rise 2-3 points.

I'm not saying Howard is perfect, he still has some work to make on his game, obviously, but he's clearly having a great season. Not taking the Magic's record into account, because his supporting cast stinks. All that being said, Howard clearly outplayed both the Wallace boys when they played earlier in the year: http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=260103008. We'll see if the game tonight is different.

Oh, and hi :)

[bdubya]

Just to REALLY piss some folks off, remember there's still a chance that Stern picks Tay as the last backup. Flip has already said that he'll put all the Pistons in at the same time, so there's an outside chance that late in the 1st, you'll see the Pistons' starting five take the floor to go head-to-head with the best players in the West. :cry (tears of joy)

A more likely scenario is, late in the 1st, Rip, Chauncey, Ben and Sheed take the floor along with.....Chris Bosh. And a hush falls over Pistons Nation, as we come face to face with What Might Have Been. :cry (just plain tears)

[pache100]

Just to REALLY piss some folks off, remember there's still a chance that Stern picks Tay as the last backup.

That's ok with me, doesn't piss me off at all. I think Tayshaun deserves to be there ahead of some who are already there. He may look fragile like a china doll, but that guy is TOUGH. He will put his body on the line in a heartbeat, and does, often.

[HeyIt'sMe]

Just to REALLY piss some folks off, remember there's still a chance that Stern picks Tay as the last backup. Flip has already said that he'll put all the Pistons in at the same time, so there's an outside chance that late in the 1st, you'll see the Pistons' starting five take the floor to go head-to-head with the best players in the West. :cry (tears of joy)

A more likely scenario is, late in the 1st, Rip, Chauncey, Ben and Sheed take the floor along with.....Chris Bosh. And a hush falls over Pistons Nation, as we come face to face with What Might Have Been. :cry (just plain tears)

It seems as though Arenas will replace Jermaine, and if so, well deserved. He should of been on the team in the first place.

[lilmads]

Tayshaun deserved to be there. IMO, he is better than Hamilton for sure.

[Bruno]

It seems as though Arenas will replace Jermaine, and if so, well deserved. He should of been on the team in the first place.

It's sure http://www.nba.com/wizards/
And welcome.

[HeyIt'sMe]

Tayshaun did NOT deserve to be there. Good god, the overhyping of the Pistons has to stop. He's a good player, but he's no All-Star. I could make a case for all the other Pistons players (although I thought Howard should of been in over Rasheed), but give me a break with the Prince talk.

[lilmads]

Well deserved by Areanas. :tu

[lilmads]

Well deserved by Arenas. :tu

[JamStone]

Tayshaun did NOT deserve to be there. Good god, the overhyping of the Pistons has to stop. He's a good player, but he's no All-Star. I could make a case for all the other Pistons players (although I thought Howard should of been in over Rasheed), but give me a break with the Prince talk.


The people who said Tayshaun deserved to be there (lilmads and apache100) are Spurs fans, not a Pistons fans. Most Pistons fan will agree Tayshaun does not deserve to be an all star this year.

And, if you read my post above, even as Pistons fan, I stated that I thought Dwight Howard should have been selected as a reserve over Rasheed Wallace.

How's that for "overhype?"

[pache100]

give me a break with the Prince talk.

Ok. Soon as you give me a break with the Prince hate. People have different opinions and we all think we are right for our own reasons. Lighten up.

[HeyIt'sMe]

I was just stating my opinion. The Pistons are a great team because they have a very good starting 5 countered by a strong bench. They play well together and fit their system to a T. All that being said, does that make Prince an All-Star. The fact is, no one would talk about him as an All-Star on any other team in the league. He's a good role player, I'd love to have him, but he's no All-Star.

[JamStone]

I agree that Prince is not an all star, but put Prince on several other teams in the NBA, he probably has a better shot at being an all star. For example, put Tayshaun Prince on the ORLANDO MAGIC team as the starting small forward, he would put up 18 ppg, 5 rpg, and 6-7 apg. He would get some consideration. Put Tayshaun Prince on Atlanta or Charlotte and he would be a 20 pt scorer.

He is not an all star. I will agree with that. But, to say he wouldn't get all star consideration playing for any other team is underestimating and undervaluing what he does for a team.

[Rummpd]

No discussion = needed R. Wallace is a great defender and is clutch and helps his team-mates.

End of story. Move on.

[ABDENOUR POWER]

The bottom fucking line is no matter what ignorant fans think. Arenas and Redd got robbed over Sheed and Ben Wallace. That is absurd. Coaches are obviously biased to one team in the East. It's a load of shit. Like the Super Bowl people bitched about that I don't. But once the ASG is here. I'll shutup. Some of you should learn that.

So Brutalis, you're saying that you think Arenas and Redd should get in over Sheed and Ben? My God, do you want the whole team to be made up of guards? I think there would be a bit of a problem if AI, Wade, Hamilton, Billups, Vince Carter, Redd, and Arenas were all on the same team....

And those of you saying that Sheed and Ben being all-stars is "bullshit" .... I understand what you're saying, but come on. Look at the PF's and C's behind them! Are you honestly going to tell me that you think better big men got left off? If they were in the West, they wouldn't have gotten in. But, outside of Shaq, the East has no good big men. Its not their fault they are in a weak conference.

Quit your bitching.