Pacers vs Pistons on TNT

[romsey31]

Who you got?

[Budkin]

Pistons, no doubt.

[cheguevara]

duh!

[GINNNNNNNNNNNNOBILI]

Pacers by 3rd round TKO, oh wait, that was last year.

Pistons in a close game

[spurs_fan_in_exile]

@ Detroit? Gotta pick the P-p-p-p-p-p-pistons.

[romsey31]

@ Detroit? Gotta pick the P-p-p-p-p-p-pistons.

I love it when everyone counts us out....all thats missing now is some MILLER MAGIC!!!

[Dunc]

I don't think anybody has a chance of winning at the Palace until March 28th when they play the Mavs. The Pacers? Don't make me laugh. Oh yes, and this has been in the media lately, so Romsey, tell me, do you agree with J O'Neal that the Pacers match up well with the Pistons?

[rayray2k8]

Who you got?
I dont even think this is even worth talking about..

the pacers of course!!! :spin

[romsey31]

I don't think anybody has a chance of winning at the Palace until March 28th when they play the Mavs. The Pacers? Don't make me laugh. Oh yes, and this has been in the media lately, so Romsey, tell me, do you agree with J O'Neal that the Pacers match up well with the Pistons?

Pacers has beat the Pistons the most out of any other team in the nba during the reg season in the last 3 yrs....6 times. So you answer your question. Do YOU think they match up well....keep laughing who laugh last laugh best.

[WayDowntownBang]

Well, to be fair.. the Pacers could be the only team to beat the Pistons twice this season if you don't count the Jazz.

Won't happen, but they could.

I could win the lotto too, so you never know.

I'd rather lose 3 to the Spurs than 2 to the Pacers. I hate those freaking babies.

[rayray2k8]

Pacers has beat the Pistons the most out of any other team in the nba during the reg season in the last 3 yrs....6 times. So you answer your question. Do YOU think they match up well....keep laughing who laugh last laugh best.
:drunk :smokin

[Dunc]

Pacers has beat the Pistons the most out of any other team in the nba during the reg season in the last 3 yrs....6 times. So you answer your question. Do YOU think they match up well....keep laughing who laugh last laugh best.

And the playoffs? I give you guys alot of credit, you fight hard and you play hard. I just don't think this is your year.

[50 cent]

I'd take the Pacers + the points.

[Dunc]

I'd take the Pacers + the points.

Wouldn't be surprised. What is it, a 9 point spread?

[Duff McCartney]

I'd say the Pistons...I think the only reason Detroit would have a tough time would be if Artest was still on the team. And he's gone.

[Dunc]

I'd say the Pistons...I think the only reason Detroit would have a tough time would be if Artest was still on the team. And he's gone.

With you there. And Stojakovic? He hasn't figured the Pistons out yet. He's had mediocre games all three times he's faced them so far this year.

[samikeyp]

Pistons, big.

[SoCalSpursFan]

Two Words for Detroit.

Peja Stoyonkavitch *spelling? :lol

[Pistons < Spurs]

Sheed can be so damn good when he has it going. AMAZING!

[Dunc]

Ball game. Not near as close as the final score.

[infinite styles]

NO bashing or anything, but why does Flip continue to leave his starters out on the court in the 4th when the team is up by 18 or more? I've been trying to understand the logic of this and the only things I have come up with is that:

A) He's trying to keep the momentum going.
B) He likes to run up the score.
C) Doesn't trust the bench.

This is the wrong time for an injury or anything like that. But Dunc since you follow the Pistons has there been anything said about this?

[ABDENOUR POWER]

NO bashing or anything, but why does Flip continue to leave his starters out on the court in the 4th when the team is up by 18 or more? I've been trying to understand the logic of this and the only things I have come up with is that:

A) He's trying to keep the momentum going.
B) He likes to run up the score.
C) Doesn't trust the bench.

This is the wrong time for an injury or anything like that. But Dunc since you follow the Pistons has there been anything said about this?

Its definately C. You'll notice that the Pistons had a big lead, subs come in, and magically the final score is only a 5 point win. :lol Thats been happening all season.

[Dunc]

NO bashing or anything, but why does Flip continue to leave his starters out on the court in the 4th when the team is up by 18 or more? I've been trying to understand the logic of this and the only things I have come up with is that:

A) He's trying to keep the momentum going.
B) He likes to run up the score.
C) Doesn't trust the bench.

This is the wrong time for an injury or anything like that. But Dunc since you follow the Pistons has there been anything said about this?

No bashing taken. I gotta say, it drives me crazy that he leaves starters in like that. He has said that he likes to use that time to run some different things, so I gotta just assume he knows what he's doing, ya know? But then, that's what practice is for, and if Ben or Chauncey got hurt in a blowout win, Flip would have to go into hiding because we'd fucking kill him, lol. I kinda feel that he doesn't trust the bench, though. It's the only legit reason I can think of. Usually in the heat of a game, the bench is good and more than a couple times have given a spark that the boys used to take a game over early. But late, they can't hold a lead, as you saw when the Pacers scored like 10 straight points in the last minute against the starters and bench as well. (18-3 to end the game *shudder*) The bench gave the starters some good rest, though, compared to some games recently (Tay with 38 min, Sheed with 35, Ben with 28, Rip with 35 and CB with 36, which is still alot, but nobody broke 40 in a game that could have gone either way until the run in the 4th, so it's not that bad, really). Anyway, that's my take.

[infinite styles]

Its definately C. You'll notice that the Pistons had a big lead, subs come in, and magically the final score is only a 5 point win. :lol Thats been happening all season.

I guess but my point is I watched the game and the starters get real complacent when they are up and after watching the last 5 1/2 of the game I would have put McDyess and Hunter in to bring some of the energy back, but I guess thats why Flip gets paid for this and I don't.

[FreshPrince22]

NO bashing or anything, but why does Flip continue to leave his starters out on the court in the 4th when the team is up by 18 or more? I've been trying to understand the logic of this and the only things I have come up with is that:

A) He's trying to keep the momentum going.
B) He likes to run up the score.
C) Doesn't trust the bench.

This is the wrong time for an injury or anything like that. But Dunc since you follow the Pistons has there been anything said about this?

It's because the bench is so young

PG- Acker (22)
SG- Evans (27)
SF- Delfino (23)
PF- Maxiell (just turned 23)
C- Dice (31)

It used to be Darko (20) at center, so it was even worse. But we've got very young guys on the perimeter handling the ball, which, as you saw tonight, can lead to turnovers and easy buckets too quickly. Acker was playing in his 2nd NBA game today, and Lindsey can't really play the point without a main option (like Rip or Sheed) on the floor next to him, because he can't create or handle the ball very well.

BTW, I wasn't too upset tonight. It was a 20 point game at the 6-ish minute mark. Then they starters got kind of lazy and let it back to 13 by about the 4 minutes mark. That's a bit too close for comfort. Plus he played Delfino for most of the 4th quarter.

[Dunc]

Yeah, the bench effort was pretty decent.

[infinite styles]

No bashing taken. I gotta say, it drives me crazy that he leaves starters in like that. He has said that he likes to use that time to run some different things, so I gotta just assume he knows what he's doing, ya know? But then, that's what practice is for, and if Ben or Chauncey got hurt in a blowout win, Flip would have to go into hiding because we'd fucking kill him, lol. I kinda feel that he doesn't trust the bench, though. It's the only legit reason I can think of. Usually in the heat of a game, the bench is good and more than a couple times have given a spark that the boys used to take a game over early. But late, they can't hold a lead, as you saw when the Pacers scored like 10 straight points in the last minute against the starters and bench as well. (18-3 to end the game *shudder*) The bench gave the starters some good rest, though, compared to some games recently (Tay with 38 min, Sheed with 35, Ben with 28, Rip with 35 and CB with 36, which is still alot, but nobody broke 40 in a game that could have gone either way until the run in the 4th, so it's not that bad, really). Anyway, that's my take.

I see what your saying and since most of their I only see through GameCast and what not I don't know the full story. I just see the starters names on the court with the lead in double digits and it baffles me. And after thinking about it I can really only think of like three guys that come off the bench and thats Antonio, Hunter and Delfino. I must say though that the injury bug must only hit up the football team in Detroit cause the Pistons haven't gotten as much as a splinter. Whats the name of the trainer on the team cause if they go all season like this then he needs to be elected to office in the White House or something. :lol
Anyways I agree with you that practice would be the safest way to run new things cause late game blowouts with your starters and their scrubs is risky business.

[Dunc]

I guess thats why Flip gets paid for this and I don't.

That's what I keep telling myself when I freak out over his substitution patterns. He must know what he's doing.... right? Lol

[infinite styles]

BTW, I wasn't too upset tonight. It was a 20 point game at the 6-ish minute mark. Then they starters got kind of lazy and let it back to 13 by about the 4 minutes mark. That's a bit too close for comfort. Plus he played Delfino for most of the 4th quarter.

Yeah thats the main thing I noticed was how they jogged back and forth and started to throw the ball everywhere. Ben was the only one still really playing. But when players get lazy and lose focus thats when accidents happen. So if Flip continues this then I would think he would have to get it in the players heads that they gotta stay focused.

[infinite styles]

That's what I keep telling myself when I freak out over his substitution patterns. He must know what he's doing.... right? Lol

You ain't lying! :lol I try to remember that when I watch the Spurs or else I'll have a heart attack before I reach 30. :lol

[Dunc]

That's what we love about Ben.... he could be winning by 40, losing by 40, or the game could be a game seven OT, he plays it the same no matter what. Ben is the inspiration of the "Goin' to Work" era.

[jochhejaam]

NO bashing or anything, but why does Flip continue to leave his starters out on the court in the 4th when the team is up by 18 or more?

Flips trying to keep the bench scoring down, someone must have told him that the Pistons are 9-0 when the bench scores 10 or fewer points.

[Kori Ellis]

So, you all (Pistons fans) think you can last with just Hunter/Acker as the backup points?

[Dunc]

You ain't lying! :lol I try to remember that when I watch the Spurs or else I'll have a heart attack before I reach 30. :lol

Well, I haven't watched enough of the Spurs this year to be able to comment, but I'm starting to hear some gripes about Pop in that regard, lol. Nice to know we aren't the only ones who freak out, which tells me it's probably normal for fans of great teams. :) Actually, I guess that would just be your team and my team. Huh! :D

[infinite styles]

Well, I haven't watched enough of the Spurs this year to be able to comment, but I'm starting to hear some gripes about Pop in that regard, lol. Nice to know we aren't the only ones who freak out, which tells me it's probably normal for fans of great teams. :) Actually, I guess that would just be your team and my team. Huh! :D

I guess when the only gripe about your team is why they don't pull the starters when they're blowing the other team out then you really can't complain. The thing with Pop is I think he leaves the bench in too long sometimes in key situations but I ain't really complaining. I'd rather them get more minutes in before the playoffs start so that they are more acclimated to the system.

[Dunc]

So, you all (Pistons fans) think you can last with just Hunter/Acker as the backup points?
As long as Chauncey stays healthy and is able to play 39-43 minutes a game? Yes. I'd feel better if we had somebody else back there too, but I'm hoping Flip is seeing something from Acker in practice that's warranting his recent garbage minutes (last night and tonight, both games since Arroyo's departure), something that could indicate he might be soon ready to join the rotation, ya know?
One other thing, Flip is confident in Tay running the point for CB (maybe leaving the Wallaces on the floor with Dice and going with a big lineup). Tay played point for stretches in the game @ San Antonio last month when Arroyo was out with a suspension, and he did a good enough job. Either that or Delfino, who I guess has done it in practice (don't remember seeing him at point this season, but they've talked about it). So there's some options at least.

[Dunc]

I guess when the only gripe about your team is why they don't pull the starters when they're blowing the other team out then you really can't complain. The thing with Pop is I think he leaves the bench in too long sometimes in key situations but I ain't really complaining. I'd rather them get more minutes in before the playoffs start so that they are more acclimated to the system.
That's true. I'd rather lose a game or two than a starter or two, though. I think Pop's theory of more time for the bench rather than less is a good one for the reg season. Especially with you guys winning like you are.

[infinite styles]

Pistons bench must get a lot of run during the practices. I kinda wandered how they were going to manage the backup point position when they traded Arroyo and having Hunter coming back from injury. When is the deadline to sign FA to be eligible for the post season cause I would assume that if Acker doesn't show that he can run it that a vet would be brought in for spot minutes.

[FreshPrince22]

So, you all (Pistons fans) think you can last with just Hunter/Acker as the backup points?

Lindsey was our backup PG last year, so I don't see why not. He is still rusty as hell right now, but his defense is always there. I think we'll see Delfino running the point by the time the playoffs come around (with Lindsey or Rip on the floor to guard the opposing teams PG). He's a great ball-handler, and has good court-vision. Flip has been saying they are working on it in practice. We'll see though.

[SlasherX]

You have to sign a Free agent by March 1st to be eligible for playoffs.

[jochhejaam]

So, you all (Pistons fans) think you can last with just Hunter/Acker as the backup points?
I don't see it as a big hurdle to overcome. I was impressed/encouraged with Lindsey's defense tonight, his foot movement looked much quicker than it did in the previous game I saw him and that was a concern for me (that Lindsey had not or would not get back to being a defensive asset). I don't enough about Ackers game to say but I'd be surprised if he was able to offer much help this year.

The schedule's a little cramped (8 games in 12 days w/3 btb's since the A-Star game) for the regular season but there are no btb's in the playoffs which allows at least one days rest between games so again I don't feel it'll be much of a concern.
I think Billups can play 38 minutes a game at a high level during the playoffs and Lindsey will be an adequate backup when needed.

[Pistons < Spurs]

So, you all (Pistons fans) think you can last with just Hunter/Acker as the backup points?



...sorta.....kinda...maybe....I hope so. :depressed

I would have liked to see us grab someone today. It would have been nice to have another experienced player for the rest of the year. Once the playoffs arrive though, I think we'll be fine with what we have.

Hunter is no where near in "game shape". And even at his best, he will still struggle to lead this team offensively. He may be able to create some energy/excitement on the defensive side, but that's all I really want to use him for.

Acker? Who knows. No one has really seen him play except for some in the summer league, and some Pre-Season minutes. I actually think he'll be a pretty good player at some point. The question is when.

Delfino may see some time at the point. He always seems to have a good feel for the flow of the game, and has better than average ball handling abilities.

Prince may also see some time at the PG. But to be quite honest, I don't look forward to this.

And what ever happens, please...please do not let RIP get anytime as our backup PG.

As it looks right now, Chauncey will be getting 40 or so minutes a game. From a conditioning standpoint, I don't think that will tax him too much for the final 30 games. I think he can handle it. My fear is what if he tweaks an ankle? What if he suffers a minor injury, or catches the flu. While he can play through it, he would be better served to sit or play limited minutes to heal quicker. Obviously if he goes down for the year, we're basically done. But it's the minor stuff that I think we don't really have an answer for.

I think Joe D may still grab a PG before the March 1st deadline. Locally we're hearing names like Anthony Goldwire and Howard Eisley. Neither are great....or even necessarily good at this point. But they might be servicable players for the rest of the season.

[Dunc]

And what ever happens, please...please do not let RIP get anytime as our backup PG.
Lol, no, guaranteed Rip won't be playing any PG. You take him out of his constant motion and our offense suffers.



Locally we're hearing names like Anthony Goldwire and Howard Eisley. Neither are great....or even necessarily good at this point. But they might be servicable players for the rest of the season.
Really, if they could get one of those guys for 4-5 min a night and let Lindsey play 8-10 min a night, that could drop CB's minutes to 35 or less on average. Might not be a bad idea?

[infinite styles]

I think Joe D may still grab a PG before the March 1st deadline. Locally we're hearing names like Anthony Goldwire and Howard Eisley. Neither are great....or even necessarily good at this point. But they might be servicable players for the rest of the season.

Thats what I was thinking would happen if no trades happened for the Pistons. Goldwire would probably fit more for the 4-5 min/game situation but if there is a doubt that Hunter won't get going then Eisley would be the better choice.

[Vinnie_Johnson]

So, you all (Pistons fans) think you can last with just Hunter/Acker as the backup points?


It's not like we had more last year....

[Kori Ellis]

It's not like we had more last year....

I realize that. But in reading around Pistons forums, I was under the impression that Hunter isn't in game shape (obviously) and there are remaining questions surrounding his health. So I thought there were worries on whether he'd be able to give you guys 10-12 mpg every night.

I apologize if that's not the case :wtf

[Pistons < Spurs]

It's not like we had more last year....
I basically agree......

But last year, Hunter wasn't recovering from an injury, and therefore very rusty.

[bdubya]

So, you all (Pistons fans) think you can last with just Hunter/Acker as the backup points?

Yep. It's a concern, but they got support from Tay and Delfino, which will make a difference, and the main thing is that we can't replace Chauncey regardless, so the backup is almost an afterthought. We got four acceptable options, and we know at least three of them can play solid D.

[Tanya]

The pistons are looking for a back up PG that is willing to play no more than 10 mins a game. Arroyo only played 5 to 6 mins a game and his playing time would drop once Hunter came back. We don't lose nothing for getting rid of Arroyo. But I also don't see any possibilities that we can get a decent back up PG because good PG wouldn't accept that playing time. That's why Joe D and Chauncey said they are satisfied with the current situation.
HOWEVER,
if Hunter doesn't play as good as we expected, if Acker sucks, if Delfino can't handle it, then it's a different story. Let's wait and see.

[ABDENOUR POWER]

Word on the street is that Detroit might pick up Tony Delk if his buyout is completed.

[jochhejaam]

Word on the street is that Detroit might pick up Tony Delk if his buyout is completed.
I see he's only played 1 game this year but he had decent stats the year before averaging 12 pts on 42% shooting in 24 minutes per game.
I think he's primarily a SG but it seems to me that he'd be a decent pick-up.

[Darrin]

I must say though that the injury bug must only hit up the football team in Detroit cause the Pistons haven't gotten as much as a splinter. Whats the name of the trainer on the team cause if they go all season like this then he needs to be elected to office in the White House or something. :lol

Mike Abdenour is the long-time trainer of the team. With exception to a 3-season stint in Philadelphia (1992-93 to 1994-95), the Pistons have had Mike in some capacity since 1975. He's been around for everyone from Bob Lanier to Jason Maxiell. When Grant Hill talks about the trainer that took the X-Ray after Game 2 of the 2000 NBA Playoffs, and got bug-eyed and said "Oh Shit! Grant, don't move! I'm going to get you some crutches," he's talking about Mr. Abdenour.

The Pistons other hidden gem is Stength and Conditioning Coach Arnie Kander. He is widely regarded as the best in the business in terms of treating chronic injuries like sprains and knee soreness, and creating prevention programs tailor-made to each player's individual position, build, style, and potential injuries.

Kander is so good, that Grant Hill tried to get him to leave with him in 2000 - on Hill's personal payroll (along with now-Spurs shooting coach Chip Engelland). Dana Barros credits the guy with allowing him to play with his kids now without pain and soreness in his back. Kander literally taught Barros how to walk again. He had over-compensated in his stride so he could play in pain after his back surgery, and it had caused a chronic problem.

[Darrin]

So, you all (Pistons fans) think you can last with just Hunter/Acker as the backup points?

I think that backup position at point guard is the position is more likely to be a weakness this season. It was nice to have someone of Arroyo's ability as the third guard behind Lindsey Hunter. That was Arroyo's role in the rotation last season. He wasn't going to go back to that role this season, and he was too much a defensive liability to stay the number one option off the bench behind Billups.

Especially with Hunter looking out of shape, understandable with his ankle break in the NBA Finals last season, and Alex Acker's inexperience at this level, it seems to me that this is a question mark much like the backup 2/3 spots were entering this season (filled nicely by Mo and Delfino).

I do want to point out that the Pistons went through Championship run in 2004, one that is almost to the day just as long as this season (Rasheed trade on February 19th, Darko trade on February 15th), without a backup behind Rip Hamilton.

Rip broke his nose in Los Angeles about 4 games into Rasheed's Pistons career (THE MASK), and sat out the next three games. All the Pistons did was start a streak of holding opponents under 70 points, including the Denver game where they had 18 dunks, the Nuggets didn't have a single player in double digits (first time in shot-clock era) in the first matchup with the Nuggs since the Carmelo Anthony drafting controversy (Carmelo said the night the Pistons won the lottery he was going to love being in Detroit, Joe said he was drafting Darko, and Melo cancelled his workout). All of this without their leading scorer.

The Pistons played with two point guards (or pint-sized SGs) - Mike James and Lindsey Hunter. They would slide Billups to shooting guard is some instances, or use James and Hunter as a two-man press.

The Pistons have above-average passers at shooting guard (Delfino) and small forward (Prince). They have a defensive backup in Hunter, and what appears at this point in the season to be a warm body in Alex Acker. It's not a dire situation when we're talking about 10 minutes a game. If Carlos Arroyo had still been here, the Pistons couldn't afford a Chauncey Billups injury, so nothing has changed. Would I like to see a Tony Delk on the roster? Sure. Do I hate the fact the Pistons didn't do this trade before Chucky Atkins signed with Memphis? Absolutely.

But I'll just hold my breath and hope nothing happens like when Mike James was Hamilton's backup.

[bdubya]

Stength and Conditioning Coach Arnie Kander.

He was my therapist on a knee rehab back in the 80s. He was a total pro, and it's been good to see him move up in the world since then. Worth noting as well is that Grant Hill supposedly offered him a HUGE pay increase (like x2), which he turned down to stay with the Pistons. :tu :tu :tu

[infinite styles]

Mike Abdenour is the long-time trainer of the team. Stength and Conditioning Coach Arnie Kander.

You think that Buford could get with Dumars and arrange a trade to gt them. I'm sure we could give up Rasho and Marks for the two. :lol :lol A healthy TD and Manu would be the greatest payoff. :angel

[Darrin]

You think that Buford could get with Dumars and arrange a trade to gt them. I'm sure we could give up Rasho and Marks for the two. :lol :lol A healthy TD and Manu would be the greatest payoff. :angel

That sounds like it's worth it. :)