WTF! How the hell does the bank allow this?

[easjer]

As I was getting ready to go to lunch, I remembered that I had to mail two of my bills today, my bed bill and my water bill. They are due right around the same time, so for the last couple of months, I've been mailing them at the same time. I pulled out my check book and opened the bills. Since I pay the same amount each month, I had not opened them when I received them last week.

As I look it over, I notice that the balance on the bed bill is too high. Then I notice that I've accrued a late charge and a finance charge. Which makes no sense because the check cleared on time. Then I look closer and notice that the amount of payment was the amount of my water bill. Which would indeed be under the minimum due and cause a late charge. So I quickly open the water bill to learn that I'm paid up this month and on the next seven months, with the credit.

So the water company cashed my CitiFinancial check. And CitiFinancial cashed my water company check. Checks for different amounts made out to totally different people with completely different account numbers on them are cashed with no problem.

I called Citifinancial and was told that they have NO IDEA how the check was cashed, it should have been returned to me. Oh, and if I don't make a payment over the phone, the extra $16 due of the minimum that I didn't pay last month will be past due on Monday (meaning a second late fee for being over 30 days past due and a notation on my credit file) if I don't make a payment covering that over the phone (plus the additonal $12 over the phone processing fee), and btw, you'll have to make up the additional payment missed last month, or you won't be able to pay it off before the promotional period ends and you become responsible for the $200 interest that has accrued on the account. They did offer to wave the late fee if I paid over the phone and swore on their children that there was no negative action taken on my account or credit file.

So I had to pay an extra $110 dollars that I was not expecting to come out of this months budget to be sure we could pay everything off on time. I guess the bright side is that I don't owe a water bill for the next seven months.

I called the bank and they told me that a computer scans the check for amount and endorsement, but does not link the payee to the endorsement and that they are very sorry this happened, but it was the merchant's responsibility to return the check, and I should file a complaint.

You are damn fucking right I'm filing a complaint with these companies. It's entirely my fault that I spaced out and put the wrong check in the wrong envelope and I'd have been willing to assume the late fees for being such a fucking ditz, but they had no business cashing those checks that were VERY clearly not made out to them. I'm beyond amazed they got them applied to my account with entirely inaccurate account numbers.

How does that happen?

[pache100]

How does that happen?

I don't know. I do all my banking at a credit union. They would call me if something like that happened. They called me one day when I won several bids and made several purchases on eBay with my check card; they were afraid (based on what I was buying) that my card had fallen into the wrong hands and some kid was using it to have fun.

I have a MasterCard through them also, and they will call me from time to time to make sure a purchase they pick up as "unusual" was made by me.

I appreciate their attention to details like this. And, although I have never had the specific problem you described, my former bank's inattention to detail and total lack of concern for me as an individual and paying customer, is the reason I bank at a credit union now.

I hope you get some satisfaction from your complaint.

[ObiwanGinobili]

I did account management for Airgas's regional Southwest div.
85% of our customers were med - large buisness's and corporations... but 15% were joe blow on a ranch or whatever.
We had a contract with Bank One to recieve and process all of our payments and then send us the cancelled checks to apply to the accts were were managing.
At least once or twice a week we got a cancelled check written to Aunt Janice, the electric company, At&T.. all of which look nothign like AIRGAS.
It wsa a constant hassle becasue we'd have to contact the customer, let them know what happend, ask if they'd liek the $$ applied to thier acct or refunded. Of course if they were apst due we'd have to keep a min. of the $$. Then have to call Bank One and complain just to get thier stock apology every time.
Ofcourse it doesn't just happen to the littel people. One time we got a 750k HEB check.. which was great because thier acct's added up to 3mill past 120 days..... except it was written to another vendor.

The banks are so automated nowadays that ther is practically no actual human touch or oversight. *sigh* Just 15 yers ago you would get a call from "sally" at the bank asking about a check she thought looked fishy.

[easjer]

pache100 - I bank with a credit union too. Randolph Brooks FCU, to be exact. This is the first time I've ever had a complaint with them - they generally work very hard to make certain that disputes or questions are answered quickly and accurately. This time, they claim it's not their fault, it's the merchant's fault. The merchants are puzzled by how this happened. It's my fault to begin with, but boy, this makes identity fraud easy! And I now feel so secure knowing my bank doesn't check for things like that, so my $ could theoretically go to anyone endorsing the check, despite who the checks are written too.

[pache100]

pache100 - I bank with a credit union too. Randolph Brooks FCU, to be exact. This is the first time I've ever had a complaint with them - they generally work very hard to make certain that disputes or questions are answered quickly and accurately. This time, they claim it's not their fault, it's the merchant's fault. The merchants are puzzled by how this happened. It's my fault to begin with, but boy, this makes identity fraud easy! And I now feel so secure knowing my bank doesn't check for things like that, so my $ could theoretically go to anyone endorsing the check, despite who the checks are written too.

Wow, that is unreal. That is who I bank with, too. They call me all the time to ask about stuff. They called me last month to ask about a charge that was made using the MasterCard feature on my debit card to Hawk Electronics (that is who I have my cell phone through), because I usually pay by check, but paid the bill over the phone and set up auto-pay on my debit card (they couldn't run the transaction as a straight debit). RBFCU just wanted to make sure it was me. That is just shocking. Working here on Randolph AFB, I know a bunch of people who bank there (including my family). I have never heard of this type of thing from them. Thanks for the warning though. I will be keeping a vigilant eye on things from now on, because they must have changed their method of processing, or where it's done. Something's definitely changed.

[easjer]

Or they were lying to me so I wouldn't file a complaint.

Like I said, I've been with them for 10 years and have NEVER had a cause for complaint before. I'm lucky that the one company has waived the late fees and penalties and the other credited my account. I'm lucky that my husband just got a job, and this month includes an 'extra' pay period, so we should be able to absorb the hit.

But seriously, how easy does that make identity fraud? It's my fuck up on the front end, no doubt. But it seems to be that the two companies and the bank have fucked up too. I double checked, and the checks were correctly written, with different account numbers and everything. They should have returned the checks to me, or called me or something.

Clearly, I'm still fuming. Mostly, I'm still fuming at myself. But I'm pissed at the companies and bank too.

[pache100]

You're absolutely right about identity fraud. That's scary shit.

I agree about the two companies being equally to blame for this; yes, you made a mistake, but it is their business to look out for these things. It's what we pay them for. The very least they should have done is call you.

Don't be too hard on yourself. You learned something from the experience, and hopefully there won't be a next time on anyone's part.

I am still shocked about this kind of crap from the financial institution I have used for almost 23 years; my parents have been banking there since 1975! I am definitely going to be more careful looking over my statements, etc.

[Ocotillo]

For all intents and purposes, Randolph-Brooks is a bank.......their charter is credit union which has the wonderful benefit of their income is not taxed. Nothing to do with your issue which is on the merchant.

[easjer]

See, I need to double check my statement. I rarely look at them, because I do almost everything online. I save them all for just this kind of thing, fortunately. Online, all it says is check XXXX and the amount, the payee is listed as withdrawal. I have a feeling if I look at my statement, it will have the right company name, but I could be wrong.

Gah. I must've really spaced out, because I distinctly remember thinking that it would suck if I put the wrong check in the envelope. Ugh. :bang

[pache100]

For all intents and purposes, Randolph-Brooks is a bank.......their charter is credit union which has the wonderful benefit of their income is not taxed. Nothing to do with your issue which is on the merchant.

I know all that and don't see how it relates to anything we are discussing.

[easjer]

For all intents and purposes, Randolph-Brooks is a bank.......their charter is credit union which has the wonderful benefit of their income is not taxed. Nothing to do with your issue which is on the merchant.


But I've got a problem with that. Because that means it is on the the thief not to cash my check if he steals it. I agree that the merchants share a big portion of blame here, but my bank has NO safeguards for ensuring that a check is paid out to the person intended to receive it? So anyone could steal my checks out of my mailbox, written to a billing company, or my mother, or whomever, and could cash them. And my bank wouldn't have means of catching that or stopping it? Yes, the majority of the onus is on the company cashing the check to make certain it's properly endorsed, but I'm bothered that there is no safeguard from the bank.

Maybe that's unrealistic of me. I'm just frightened at how easily this money left my account to the wrong people Fortunately, it can be fixed (not resolved the way I want it, but at least I've only blown my monthly budget, not really lost anything). But that's scary.

[pseudofan]

Look, I work for a financial institution (I will not say where) and I have to tell you honestly:

Do you really think that with 35,00 checking accounts there is someone there pulling signature cards on every check that comes through? Seriously? If you sent cash to the wrong person would your FI be responsible for that?

Debit/Credit card activitiy is easily monitored. Transactions are assigned fraud scores based on the amount, merchant category code, and originating state/country, your normal card activity, etc. Once something unusual comes up on your card, someone will get a report and call you.

Checks are totally different. Unfortunately checks are "read" through a micr machine at both the Federal Reserve Bank and your FI. Whatever is encoded at the bottom of the check dictates what reflects on your account. Nothing else is looked at. Not the date on the check (post dating a check is useless unless someone is presenting it to the actual teller), not the payee, nothing. The only time anyone at your FI actually looks at a check is if someone walks it into a teller. The teller will look at the date, the signature panel, check the payee, etc.

Does it suck not to get personal service like that from your FI? Probably. There are many small FIs that would probably give you that type of service, but you're not getting a debit card from them because they can't support it. You'll be lucky to get checks with designs... Can they offer you ATMs through out your city? Doubt it. You'll have to pay the service fees or take the trip to their one location that closes at 3 all week long and 12 on Saturdays...but you'll get that personal service you desire!

[easjer]

Good point psuedofan.

I do 80% of my banking via debit. These are two of the four things that have to be done via check because they don't offer debit service option. I'll just be more careful in the future.

For what it's worth, I don't have designer checks and almost never use ATMs. I always get cash when I go to the store and buy that one thing I left of my grocery list. POS cash back is a lovely thing for me. :lol

[ObiwanGinobili]

See, I need to double check my statement. I rarely look at them, because I do almost everything online. I save them all for just this kind of thing, fortunately. Online, all it says is check XXXX and the amount, the payee is listed as withdrawal. I have a feeling if I look at my statement, it will have the right company name, but I could be wrong.

Gah. I must've really spaced out, because I distinctly remember thinking that it would suck if I put the wrong check in the envelope. Ugh. :bang

I use SACU and they have an image of my check front and back available to view within in 24hrs of it clearing. Maybe you should as kyour bank if they will be gettign a service liek that?

[pache100]

Good point psuedofan.

I do 80% of my banking via debit. These are two of the four things that have to be done via check because they don't offer debit service option. I'll just be more careful in the future.

For what it's worth, I don't have designer checks and almost never use ATMs. I always get cash when I go to the store and buy that one thing I left of my grocery list. POS cash back is a lovely thing for me. :lol

Do you have the Freedom Check Card? You can use the MasterCard feature to pay bills to most places that won't accept debit cards. To you, it looks exactly like a debit charge; to them it looks like a charge. The only difference is that it takes a couple of days to POST it to your checking account, rather than the immediate withdrawal that a debit shows.

[easjer]

Oh goodness yes. I love that card. I use it all the time. It's most helpful at the gas stations near my house that will not accept a debit card, but will accept a credit card. And in restaurants, so I don't have to write a check. It is goodness.

[pache100]

Oh goodness yes. I love that card. I use it all the time. It's most helpful at the gas stations near my house that will not accept a debit card, but will accept a credit card. And in restaurants, so I don't have to write a check. It is goodness.

I use it to pay my Time Warner Cable bill, my Guadalupe Valley Electric Coop bill, my Green Valley Special Utilities District water bill, my Hawk Electronics cell phone, my Sage Telecom home phone bill, and my AOL bill (all on auto-pay). And I also use it at gas stations and restaurants as well as Walmart, HEB, and Target. It is indeed wonderful!

[pseudofan]

Good point psuedofan.

I always get cash when I go to the store and buy that one thing I left of my grocery list. POS cash back is a lovely thing for me. :lol

Well, here's a good reason to stop doing that too!

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/11731365/


Happy reading!

[Vashner]

I use frost bank. They called me last year "there are a lot of litle transactions on your account" I said ah don't worry that's just porn... well I said "internet purchases" :)
It was ebay shit too.

[MannyIsGod]

I'm going to go out on a limb here because I didn't see it, but what if the mistake was you actually wrote the wrong check to each company?

[pseudofan]

I'm going to go out on a limb here because I didn't see it, but what if the mistake was you actually wrote the wrong check to each company?


Huh? You mean maybe she wrote the amount for the CitiFinancial bill but wrote the payee as the water company? And vice versa?

Hmmm....

[MannyIsGod]

Huh? You mean maybe she wrote the amount for the CitiFinancial bill but wrote the payee as the water company? And vice versa?

Hmmm....Its possible. You really don't know who made the error at this point until you see an actual check copy.

[easjer]

I have duplicate checks. I looked - the right amount went to the right company. But you're right, it's a good question.

[HB22inSA]

USAA is by far the best bank in the World.

They would have corrected the situation and paid any finance or late charges.