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CubanMustGo
03-28-2006, 04:14 PM
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2006/writers/jack_mccallum/03/28/suns.amare/index.html

Stoudemire shut down
Knee injury could knock Suns star out for season
Posted: Tuesday March 28, 2006 2:42PM; Updated: Tuesday March 28, 2006 3:43PM

If the Phoenix Suns are going to win an NBA championship this season -- and that is their stated goal -- they will most likely have to do it without star frontcourtman Amaré Stoudemire.

Stoudemire's comeback from surgery on his left knee lasted only three games before the Suns decided to shut him down, "maybe for three days, maybe for 10 days, maybe for the rest of the season," according to coach/general manager Mike D'Antoni.

The best guess? The rest of the season.

D'Antoni made the decision hours after the Suns' most disappointing loss of the season, a 110-72 torching by the New Jersey Nets on Monday night at Continental Airlines Arena. Stoudemire started that game but played only 14 minutes (missing all six of his shots from the floor) and was obviously at no more than 30 percent efficiency. He jogged up and down the court, had very little lift and even winced from time to time when he landed.

"It's mostly stiffness but I have some pain, too," said Stoudemire on Tuesday morning from Milwaukee, where the Suns, 47-22 and still the odds-on favorite to win the Pacific Division, are scheduled to play the Bucks this evening. "I felt like I was improving -- that's why I came back -- but then the knee just started getting tighter and tighter. It felt like I was going to pull something all the time."

Stoudemire had surgery on Oct. 11, during the preseason, to repair a microfracture (about one centimeter wide) on his left knee. That was about a week after he had signed a five-year extension worth about $73 million. Dr. Tom Carter, the Suns' team physician, compared the lesion to a "pothole," which Carter said would get bigger and become harder to treat as time passed. Carter used a surgical awl to poke five shallow holes around the lesion, three millimeters apart, to facilitate bleeding that would harden and form the "fibrocartilage" that would fill in the tiny hole.

The Suns heard no dearth of dire reminders about other players (Chris Webber, Penny Hardaway, Kenyon Martin, to name three) whose careers had been thwarted by similar surgeries. But the plan all along was to get Stoudemire back for this season, provided there were no extenuating circumstances; the initial projection was for Stoudemire to come back "around the All-Star Game" in February. Carter said comparisons with other injuries were meaningless, considering Stoudemire's age (he's just 23) and the fact that his knee was in otherwise ideal condition.

Stoudemire rehabbed with trainer Aaron Nelson and began limited on-court workouts in January. His surgically repaired knee started to come around, but he began to experience stiffness and fluid buildup on his right knee, probably from overcompensation, and his comeback was pushed to "sometime in March." He would have one good practice, then not be able to go the following day. It was a roller-coaster ride that continued into the second week of March. Finally, after three straight days of work without much pain or swelling in either knee, the man the Suns call STAT (for "Stand Tall and Talented," the slogan Stoudemire gave himself as a teenager) declared himself ready for a home game against the Portland Trail Blazers on March 23.

D'Antoni decided to start him but monitored his minutes. Stoudemire had 20 points in 19 minutes as the Suns breezed to a 125-108 victory. Suns fans began licking their chops: We were already the third-best team in the Western Conference, probably the fourth-best team in the NBA, without him. How good are we now?

But coaches, teammates and the Suns' medical staff weren't so confident, seeing the extent to which Stoudemire's mobility was limited. (On many nights, a player of Stoudemire's talent needs only to be about 60 percent to dominate the Trail Blazers.) He started two nights later against Denver in a 107-96 loss and looked stiffer and slower. And the game against New Jersey, the start of a weeklong road trip that ends Sunday in a showdown against the Detroit Pistons at the Palace of Auburn Hills, convinced D'Antoni, the Suns' medical staff and Stoudemire himself that he wasn't ready.

"As a coach you always want your best players back," says D'Antoni. "But I had to put on my general manager's hat, too. We have a lot invested in Amaré, and we want him around for a long time. He'll be practicing, doing mostly one-on-one stuff. So we'll see. But he won't come back before he's ready."

For his part, Stoudemire concedes that he's disappointed. "I wanted to come back, help us win a championship this year," he says. "And maybe I still will. But I gotta get this thing right."

BillsCarnage
03-28-2006, 04:24 PM
yup. It appears that if there's no improvement in the next week or so, he's done for the season.

http://www.azcentral.com/sports/suns/articles/0328amare.html

ducks
03-28-2006, 04:33 PM
management and ownership were FUCKING FOOLS BRINGING HIM BACK EARLY

THEY JUST SENT A LOAD MESSAGE TO THE NBA players not to join the suns because they force you to play when hurt

cheguevara
03-28-2006, 04:36 PM
wasn't D'antony coach of the year last year :lmao he's a fuckin idiot!!!!

how can the COY let this crap happen on his team

DDS4
03-28-2006, 04:48 PM
Damn shame.

Even more of a damn shame that this setback might backpeddle his career. Hope managment, coaches, and fans are proud of themselves.

BillsCarnage
03-28-2006, 04:57 PM
management and ownership were FUCKING FOOLS BRINGING HIM BACK EARLY

THEY JUST SENT A LOAD MESSAGE TO THE NBA players not to join the suns because they force you to play when hurt

This was Amare's decision to play. He was cleared medically a while ago. After 3 straight good days of 5-on-5 Amare felt he was ready to go. There's no way to tell if you're in game shape unless you play the game. He tried and D'Ant even said after the Portland game that Amare was playing on adrenaline and the would be bad days.

Saying it the Suns or D'Ant's fault is stooopid when it was Amare's choice.

nkdlunch
03-28-2006, 04:58 PM
No it was definitely not's Amare's decision to play. Amare is not a doctor, he is a kid who obviously wants to play. Suns should have been smarter than that, especially since half the media was skeptical and cautious. Suns are a crappy organization because of this now.

they will be held responsible if additional damage was done to Amare these games.

BillsCarnage
03-28-2006, 05:07 PM
No it was definitely not's Amare's decision to play. Amare is not a doctor, he is a kid who obviously wants to play.

He was cleared by the Dr's a while ago. He just had to get in game shape.
Had you followed his rehab more you'd know this. And it's confirmed by the first section in this story: http://www.azcentral.com/sports/suns/articles/0323amare0323.html

"I'm feeling like suiting up tomorrow," he told Suns head athletic trainer Aaron Nelson.

Three consecutive days of work without problems in his surgically repaired left knee or recently troublesome right knee had made an impact.

Stoudemire found coach Mike D'Antoni and said, "I don't know why I don't play tomorrow."

D'Antoni agreed, as long as everything went well in practice. Once it did, Stoudemire approached D'Antoni again. "I want to play," he said.

"Guess what?" the coach responded. "You're playing.


they will be held responsible if additional damage was done to Amare these games.

How so? Is he going to sue them?

Spurologist
03-28-2006, 05:07 PM
Mcdyess part II.

ducks
03-28-2006, 05:09 PM
amare ment with jerry next day in unifrom
it was not amare decision

timvp
03-28-2006, 05:17 PM
Suns finally get smart.

MoSpur
03-28-2006, 05:24 PM
The guy needs to rest and rehab throughout the whole summer. The Suns area very good team without him, but I don't think they can win the championship w/out him. Its just not their season to win it. Call it a season and comeback next year ready.

ChumpDumper
03-28-2006, 05:25 PM
A conspiracy of dunces.

Xylus
03-28-2006, 05:25 PM
I wouldn't say the Suns organization made a mistake on this one. If anything, Amare thought he was prepared to play and was wrong. If Amare says he feels great, then the organization should believe him. Additionally, it doesn't sound like Amare's going to have lasting problems because of his return. The stiffness in his knees indicates that he just isn't ready to begin playing again.

Shut him down for the rest of the season, and pray that Kurt Thomas comes back in the 2nd round ready to hustle. The Suns still might be able to contend for a title with KT in the lineup (he'll help solve some of the rebounding and interior defense deficiencies), even though their chances are greater with a healthy Amare.

Stoudemire's my favorite basketball player. It would kill me to see him come back too early and screw something up. The Suns need to shut him down for the season and focus on winning the rest of this season and into the postseason.

Vingianx
03-28-2006, 05:26 PM
i guess they figured the damage he was doing to the team chemistry when they were so deep into the season...

leemajors
03-28-2006, 05:26 PM
He was cleared by the Dr's a while ago. He just had to get in game shape.
Had you followed his rehab more you'd know this. And it's confirmed by the first section in this story: http://www.azcentral.com/sports/suns/articles/0323amare0323.html

"I'm feeling like suiting up tomorrow," he told Suns head athletic trainer Aaron Nelson.

Three consecutive days of work without problems in his surgically repaired left knee or recently troublesome right knee had made an impact.

Stoudemire found coach Mike D'Antoni and said, "I don't know why I don't play tomorrow."

D'Antoni agreed, as long as everything went well in practice. Once it did, Stoudemire approached D'Antoni again. "I want to play," he said.

"Guess what?" the coach responded. "You're playing.



How so? Is he going to sue them?


it's not really their fault, but they really should have been a little more cautious. and he should have known better, seeing what this injury/surgery has done to other players. err on the side of caution in this situation for sure. glad they realized that sooner than later though

Kori Ellis
03-28-2006, 05:26 PM
Well hopefully he didn't suffer any damage from trying to come back. He's a terrific player and I'd hate to see his future be in jeopardy.

Good luck to him.

DDS4
03-28-2006, 05:28 PM
This was Amare's decision to play. He was cleared medically a while ago. After 3 straight good days of 5-on-5 Amare felt he was ready to go. There's no way to tell if you're in game shape unless you play the game. He tried and D'Ant even said after the Portland game that Amare was playing on adrenaline and the would be bad days.

Saying it the Suns or D'Ant's fault is stooopid when it was Amare's choice.


Stupid?

If I was an owner, spent millions on my franchise player over the long haul, I SURE AS HELL don't want Amare playing on knees that weren't 2000% healed. There's too much invested, too much to risk, and there are too many uncertainties coming back too soon. IMO, there was hardly anything to gain by bringing him back too early this season.

Amare might have wanted to return, but I, as an owner, would prevent him if playing if there's even one sliver of doubt he can return and play like 2005.

Now, Amare is battling both knees--probably from overcompensating. It's going to take even longer to get it "right".

MoSpur
03-28-2006, 05:29 PM
He is one of the most athletic big men I have ever seen. It would be a shame to see his career end. I doubt it will. He is young.

BillsCarnage
03-28-2006, 05:33 PM
And if a player says they're ready to play - from any injury - how do you really know they're ready??!?

Let them suit up and play in the game. Whether it was this year or training camp he was going to have to play. Now the know he's not ready and will likely be shut down.

My only concern is that he does not play for the olympic team this summer and spends time rehabbing.

BillsCarnage
03-28-2006, 05:36 PM
IMO, there was hardly anything to gain by bringing him back too early this season.

And that's why you're a fan. Had his comeback been successful everyone would have marveled at him, the Suns, etc.

It's real easy to second guess after the fact.

The Suns and Amare did the right thing based on the info presented to them.

leemajors
03-28-2006, 05:38 PM
i thought they should have immediately wary when he did a 180 after his meeting with colangelo. the only reason i think it is a mistake is because no one has come back close to 100% after this injury. i know he is young and it may be different but holding him out probably would have been best. you can't change the past though, and all they can do is learn from the error.

BigVee
03-28-2006, 05:41 PM
He's young, but may never be the same, most players are not. You could compile a very long list of players who had injuries and never returned to where they were. Could still be a very good player, but by the end of last year he was headed for the stratosphere.....a shame.

JMarkJohns
03-28-2006, 05:58 PM
Perhaps some good will come out of last night's loss afterall!

Get better, Amare.

"There's always next year..."
- Some random Cubs fan

myhc
03-28-2006, 06:02 PM
Suns management NOT pulling him for the rest of the season right now is being foolish and short sighted. You just do not want to mess around with something like this, if in fact something hasn't already happened. Shut him down now, focus on the players you have and wait till next year to make your championship run.

boutons_
03-28-2006, 06:09 PM
GTFO now, Amare.
Rest them, let them heal, re-hab.
We'll forward to you next November.

ShoogarBear
03-28-2006, 06:18 PM
I don't see how playing the last three games could possibly have ruinedhim forever.

But the smart thing now clearly is to not even THINK about bringing him back this year.

SenorSpur
03-28-2006, 06:19 PM
Dude should've never bothered to try this failed experiment

Ah, the ignorance of youth!

Good luck next season.

CosmicCowboy
03-28-2006, 06:21 PM
wow...you guys seem to have written him off...I wouldn't be so quick to do so. I am confident that they have done extensive MRI's etc. and are comfortable that they have repaired the problem to the left knee and that there was no significant danger of re-injury. As someone who has had multiple knee surgeries from sports injuries the "echo" to the other knee is very common...the body mechanics of walking/running/jumping are a fine balance and one thing can affect another...and it just takes time to work it out. Some people take longer than others, and surprisingly the "super-tuned" athletes like Amare may actually have more difficulty getting their natural balanced "gait" back than others...

I expect Amare to come back next year at 100% with a major "attitude" to kick ass and take names...

tlongII
03-28-2006, 06:28 PM
Why the hell didn't they make this decision BEFORE they played Portland???

Ed Helicopter Jones
03-28-2006, 06:31 PM
I don't see how playing the last three games could possibly have ruinedhim forever.

But the smart thing now clearly is to not even THINK about bringing him back this year.

I agree. It's obvious he isn't healed yet, but I don't think he's done irreversible harm to himself in these last three games.

I'm a fan of Amare's game and for his sake I hope he sits until next season.

Borosai
03-28-2006, 07:05 PM
At least Nash's knees are good enough to dance like a freak...

Viva Las Espuelas
03-28-2006, 07:12 PM
damn.....................NEXT

slayermin
03-28-2006, 07:23 PM
I don't see how playing the last three games could possibly have ruinedhim forever.

But the smart thing now clearly is to not even THINK about bringing him back this year.

I think that is what Sun Fans are telling themselves.

Amare relies on athleticism as much as anyone else in the association. He's gonna have to be patient.

I hope everything turns out well for him because he is fun to watch.

Tom_Foolery
03-28-2006, 07:33 PM
Let's not forget the JOE JOHNSON incident.

The Suns organization were trying to make him play through his injury as well.

Yeah, I'd have to question the Suns organization about now. Every player wants to play and for every doctor that can clear a player, there's another doctor that probably wouldn't.

If you think the team physicians & doctors are not "pressed" by team mgt to "clear a player" for play, then you're retarded.

Amare should not be playing and if Amare's career is hindered because of this early attempt at coming back early, then so be it. It's their own fault.

Joe Johnson was right for leaving Phoenix.

exstatic
03-28-2006, 07:33 PM
It's real easy to second guess after the fact.

Actually, with the history of MF surgery, a lot of us (your's truly included) first guessed it before the fact. I know that Colangelo is running USABasketball, but if they even let him play this summer, they're doubly stupid. Shut him down from competitive basketball until training camp, and let him continue his rehab and work on whatever parts of his game he wants to at walk thru speed. He could work on his shot, and basic post pivot footwork without stressing the knee.

slayermin
03-28-2006, 07:49 PM
Actually, with the history of MF surgery, a lot of us (your's truly included) first guessed it before the fact. I know that Colangelo is running USABasketball, but if they even let him play this summer, they're doubly stupid. Shut him down from competitive basketball until training camp, and let him continue his rehab and work on whatever parts of his game he wants to at walk thru speed. He could work on his shot, and basic post pivot footwork without stressing the knee.

Micro fracture surgery did not sound anything like getting a knee scoped. I heard and read plenty of media people talking about how dangerous this procedure is to Amare's career.

exstatic
03-28-2006, 08:45 PM
Why the hell didn't they make this decision BEFORE they played Portland???

Like THAT even matters. Porty is one of two teams already officially eliminated from the playoffs. Amare did you guys a favor by increasing your odds/ ping pong balls.

nkdlunch
03-28-2006, 10:02 PM
this experiment has sent the Suns in a tailspin. Suns lose again by 20 tonight