Reports say Nash earns NBA MVP award

[conqueso]

Please tell me that some Suns fans hacked ESPN.com and posted this, because otherwise I'm going to gouge out my eyes with a mellon-ball scooper.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2422255

[angel_luv]

That surprises me. Nash didn't even make my radar this year as far as MVP goes.

I saw Kobe or Lebron getting it.

[Supergirl]

Steve Nash deserves it more this year than he did last year - he really showed his value in making players who were mediocre or role players at best (Raja Bell, Boris Diaw, James Jones) look so good, and in the way the Phoenix Suns persevered despite losing Amare and Thonmas. They won't win a championship without Amare and/or Kurt Thomas, but Nash is a stronger candidate than ever before for regular season MVP. Last year I was of the belief that it should have gone to O'Neal.

Nash's main contender is Billups, IMO, who did as much for his team as Nash but led his team to a better record. Dirk put up a great stat line, but has a lot more help. Of the Spurs, Parker is the most deserving of consideration, he carried the team this year.

[Despot]

I'm hesitant to believe that report, I realize that the winner is usually leaked before the announcement is made, but this seems way too early.
For some reason I was under the impression that the ballots were sealed and wouldn't even be counted until just before the Conference finals were to begin.

[ObiwanGinobili]

it better be Dirk or I'm vBookie vFucked.

[nkdlunch]

He deserved it as much as the other guys.

[Trainwreck2100]

No way Nash deserves to be a two time MVP

[ducks]

this was posted in the nba forum hours ago

[leemajors]

this better be true, i got my vmoneys on nash!

[Doug Collins]

If you give the award to Nash last year, than he most certainly deserves it this year. He led the team to the division title without amare, who many consider the best talent on the team. On top of that you add 3 new starters and a totally revamped bench, and they don't miss a beat. Give him some credit, he's taken a group of young no name players and still finished with 54 wins. The only other players who I would consider in the mix are Billups and Dirk, but both those guys have much better surrounding talent and those teams have been together longer. Nash makes everyone around him better and deserves to be the MVP. Yes, I am a Spurs fan but I can respect what he did this year and last.

[ducks]

http://spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=39351

[Jimcs50]

Nash deserves it.

Take him off that team, and have a healthy Stoudamire on it, and they do not make the playoffs, much less win the division.

[ducks]

take kobe off the lakers they do not make the playoffs
take james off the cavs they do not win the playoffs
larry hughes was hurt to much to

[Doug Collins]

Out of those guys, Nash got his team to win the division and not just make the playoffs.

[conqueso]

this was posted in the nba forum hours ago

Sorry, don't read that forum...too many trolls

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

it better be Dirk or I'm vBookie vFucked.

I'm with you.

[Boulevard1]

If you give the award to Nash last year, than he most certainly deserves it this year. He led the team to the division title without amare, who many consider the best talent on the team. On top of that you add 3 new starters and a totally revamped bench, and they don't miss a beat. Give him some credit, he's taken a group of young no name players and still finished with 54 wins. Nash makes everyone around him better and deserves to be the MVP. Yes, I am a Spurs fan but I can respect what he did this year and last.

:tu

However, sucks for Kobe. The MVP is an individual award and Kobe deserved it this year too.

[Dre_7]

Im not a Kobe fan at all, but he and LBJ both should be ahead of Nash in the MVP voting. But oh well, I could care less.

[ShoogarBear]

What a joke. He will be the only back-to-back MVP who couldn't get his team to the Finals.

[yeahone]

mvp has lost all its credibility now

[Obstructed_View]

John Stockton got one first place MVP vote in his entire career, and had a number of seasons as good as Nash has had. Stockton also actually played defense. MVP has become a joke.

[baseline bum]

Congrats to Nash for a well-deserved honor (and I'm not writing this in blue).

[Jimcs50]

It is a done deal. Dan Patrick just announced that Nash is the MVP and Nash will be on the show in a few minutes.

[SirChaz]

John Stockton got one first place MVP vote in his entire career, and had a number of seasons as good as Nash has had. Stockton also actually played defense. MVP has become a joke.


Stockton also had Malone on his team and several of the greatest players in the history of the NBA to compete with for the award.

[polandprzem]

Sorry, don't read that forum...too many trolls

You are troll yourself :troll :flipoff

[kris]

Stockton also had Malone on his team and several of the greatest players in the history of the NBA to compete with for the award.


Who were these other players?

[SirChaz]

It is a done deal.


Uh oh, Jimcs50 posted it was a done deal.

It is sure to go to someone else now.


Now Nash knows who to blame when he doesn't win.

[Trainwreck2100]

Stockton also had Malone on his team and several of the greatest players in the history of the NBA to compete with for the award.

Who doesn't belong on this list

Tim Duncan, Magic Johnson, Michael Jordan, Larry Bird, Moses Malone, Steve Nash.

[SirChaz]

Who were these other players?


Jordan
Bird
Magic
Robinson
Malone
Olajuwon
Drexler
Barkley

[101A]

Stockton also had Malone on his team and several of the greatest players in the history of the NBA to compete with for the award.

Duncan, Kobe, KG, AI, Lebron, Nowitski will all be considered some of the greatest when all is said and done; AND each has more value RIGHT NOW than Nash - Nash & that system fit perfectly, so he puts up sick numbers. He was never a candidate in Dallas; despite a team that won as much or more.

Stockton is the perfect example of why this award has changed so much.

AI - Kidd - Nash; only Duncan and KG have broken the trend of that year's "trendy" guard who is on the team with the big turnaround who wins the award.

[SirChaz]

Who doesn't belong on this list

Tim Duncan, Magic Johnson, Michael Jordan, Larry Bird, Moses Malone, Steve Nash.


Is there a question here?

List of what?

American born players?

Duncan and Nash.

[polandprzem]

Is there a question here?

List of what?

American born players?

Duncan and Nash.

Frickin b2b MVP's dumbass :rolleyes

[SirChaz]

Duncan, Kobe, KG, AI, Lebron, Nowitski will all be considered some of the greatest when all is said and done; AND each has more value RIGHT NOW than Nash - Nash & that system fit perfectly, so he puts up sick numbers. He was never a candidate in Dallas; despite a team that won as much or more.

Stockton is the perfect example of why this award has changed so much.

AI - Kidd - Nash; only Duncan and KG have broken the trend of that year's "trendy" guard who is on the team with the big turnaround who wins the award.


Everyone has different criteria I guess.

Stockton is a bad example for comparison because he played with Karl Malone every year.

I don't know that Nash would get my vote if I had one but he is clearly worthy of consideration this season.

[ShoogarBear]

Bill Simmons said in his chat that Stockton should have grown out his hair and stopped playing defense.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

Dan Patrick is reporting that Nash has won and the voting wasn't even close.

Surprising. I figured if Nash had won that he'd of edged it out by a vote or two.

Good for him though. The Suns play like the team that won all of 28 games a few years back when he's not in the lineup.

[Obstructed_View]

Stockton also had Malone on his team and several of the greatest players in the history of the NBA to compete with for the award.
Wuh. Eek. Nash had an all-star alongside him this year, and two last year. While we are on the subject of teammates, how do the Suns players match up with Thurl Bailey and Blue Edwards talent-wise? Besides, how did Karl Malone make Stockton a better defender?

[Spurminator]

I thought Nash deserved it last year because there was little competition, but given the other legitimate candidates in this year's pool I'm a little surprised he won again.

I sort of agree with how Bill Simmons defined the MVP... when you look back on the 2005-2006 Regular Season, which player do you think of first? And I think he's right to suggest it's Kobe or Lebron, not Nash.

My MVP is still Dirk, because I think he was every bit as spectacular (season-long) as Lebron and Kobe, though he may not have had as many standout performances... so he was somewhat overlooked. Nash just didn't seem to have the kind of year those three guys had.

That said, you have to give him credit for keeping the Suns among the elite despite their injuries and player turnover. "Steve Nash: Two Time MVP" doesn't sound right to me either, but it's not the greatest crime in sports history...

[Obstructed_View]

My MVP is still Dirk, because I think he was every bit as spectacular (season-long) as Lebron and Kobe, though he may not have had as many standout performances...
Dirk lost Finley and had injuries to key players all year, yet his scoring went up a only half a point while every other stat went down. I'm missing the spectacularness here...

[Slinkyman]

The lakers barely made the playoffs, how do you give the MVP to a guy who's team almost misses the playoffs 2 years in a row versus a guy who leads his team to back to back division titles while returning 1 other starter besides himself? Nash has done more with less then kobe has, trust me put nash on the lakers and they win that division.

[SirChaz]

Wuh. Eek. Nash had an all-star alongside him this year, and two last year. While we are on the subject of teammates, how do the Suns players match up with Thurl Bailey and Blue Edwards talent-wise? Besides, how did Karl Malone make Stockton a better defender?


This is part of it also. They lost an All-Star performer and still won the division and 50+ games. Mostly because of Nash.

Nash has been the catalyst for the best offensive team in the league for about 5 years now.

If it was the best player award then the defensive argument would mean more to me. The problem I have with the Stockton argument is he had one player (an MVP candidate) that recieved most of his assists.

To me the MVP is the player that is most valuable to their team's success in a given season.

Some people think it should be someone other than Nash and they have good points. I don't think we should say that Nash is not a candidate because he won last year.

[Slinkyman]

Here's another thing to think about, how many players had the best year of their careers this year for the suns? Marion, Bell, Diaw, Barbosa, House, James Jones! how many players had career years for the lakers? smush parker? Same thing with the mavs. Do Dirk and Kobe make the players around them better? Not the way Steve Nash does! Just look at that list of suns, how many people thought diaw or james jones were good players? nobody, that is until they played with steve nash.

[Spurminator]

Dirk lost Finley and had injuries to key players all year, yet his scoring went up a only half a point while every other stat went down. I'm missing the spectacularness here...

Spectacular isn't in numbers. Besides, the Mavs' scoring as a whole went down by 6 points per game.

Dallas as a team was only a couple of games back of the Pistons and the Spurs, and of the three teams, Dirk had the least talented supporting cast. The Mavs' success depended on Dirk every bit as much as the Cavs depended on Lebron and the Lakers depended on Kobe, and they ended up 10-15 games better than both of those teams. Even if you were going to argue that Dirk had a better supporting cast, were they 10 games better?

Where would a team led by Jerry Stackhouse and Jason Terry end up in the standings? It's not like either of those guys has had much success on their own.

[Obstructed_View]

This is part of it also. They lost an All-Star performer and still won the division and 50+ games. Mostly because of Nash.

Nash has been the catalyst for the best offensive team in the league for about 5 years now.

If it was the best player award then the defensive argument would mean more to me. The problem I have with the Stockton argument is he had one player (an MVP candidate) that recieved most of his assists.

To me the MVP is the player that is most valuable to their team's success in a given season.

Some people think it should be someone other than Nash and they have good points. I don't think we should say that Nash is not a candidate because he won last year.

I haven't seen anyone suggest that Nash shouldn't be a candidate for MVP, this year or last year. He's a great player, and certainly one of the best at his position in the league. I won't speak for everyone else, but here's why it bothers me: People voted for him this year saying he did a better job with less so he must deserve it since he won it last year, as though that's any justification, because he didn't deserve it last year either, but people voted for him because the Suns won the most games in the league. By that rationale, those same people should have voted for Billups or Parker. They didn't.

I've read people further defending it by saying he scored more points this year. Well, duh, he lost a Amare, Joe Johnson and Q Richardson. Shouldn't he have picked up the scoring more simply because there were more shots to take? That knife cuts both ways. He managed to snare almost one of Amare's nine rebounds that were available per game. Should we give DPOY, too?

[Doug Collins]

Also Nash didn't have the freedom he does now when he played in Dallas. Just watch some of the games when he was still with them and being forced to run pick n' rolls and play in isolation. Plus there he also had dirk and finley who excel in isolation dependent offenses. With the Suns he is the offense. None of those players, with the exception of Marion, can really score one on one. Nash puts them in a position to score and that's what makes everyone of his teammates better. He deserves the MVP.

[T-Pain]

I was expecting LeBron or Kobe. Nash has already proven that he can take his team to the playoffs.

[Trainwreck2100]

I think it should have been Dirk just by process of elimination, Nash should not get b2b MVPs

[mavsfan1000]

Nash shouldn't have gotten this award. By this process of making teams better James Posey should've gotten the award for the Grizzlies in 2003-2004 by taking a 28 win team to 50 wins. This is insane and bullshit. Kobe, Lebron, Dirk, Brand, Billups, and Wade are more deserving of this award.

[ShoogarBear]

You can't have it both ways. You can't say he deserves the MVP this year because he had a better year than last year, then turn around and say back-2-back MVPs is not a reason to vote against him this year.

Phoenix is in a gimmick system that generates stats. You can't tell me they wouldn't have a better chance at a championship if they had Billups instead of Nash at the point.

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

Nash shouldn't have gotten this award. By this process of making teams better James Posey should've gotten the award for the Grizzlies in 2003-2004 by taking a 28 win team to 50 wins. This is insane and bullshit. Kobe, Lebron, Dirk, Brand, Billups, and Wade are more deserving of this award.


Scratch Wade and I agree completely.

[Trainwreck2100]

You can't have it both ways. You can't say he deserves the MVP this year because he had a better year then last year, then turn around and say back-2-back MVPs is not a reason to vote against him this year.

Phoenix is in a gimmick system that generates stats. You can't tell me they wouldn't have a better chance at a championship if they had Billups instead of Nash at the point.


:wtf

[JHoLove]

Nash's main contender is Billups, IMO, who did as much for his team as Nash but led his team to a better record. Dirk put up a great stat line, but has a lot more help. Of the Spurs, Parker is the most deserving of consideration, he carried the team this year.

It's not like Nash had scrubs. Shawn Marion is an all-star.. averaging 22 and 12...

[Slinkyman]

It's not like Nash had scrubs. Shawn Marion is an all-star.. averaging 22 and 12...

who else? do the suns play 2 on 2? diaw, house, james jones, raja bell are all scrubs on any other team.

Spurminator, you think dirk doesn't have the same kind of talent? Dallas has the 2nd largest payroll in the nba, there's alot of talent there it's just bad talent. Stackhouse, KVH, Dampier have talent, they just suck at playing team basketball. Detroit has the least amount of "talent" oh those 3, after the 5 starter who do they have? lindsey hunter? Mcdyess? Also PHX by the way is 22nd in payroll. After Nash and Marion who do they have?

[mavsfan1000]

Raja Bell is not a scrub. He had his breakout year in Utah last year. Diaw is inspired by playing on any other team than Atlanta.

[ShoogarBear]

:wtf

People say "Nash was MVP last year. He's even better this year. Ergo, he must be MVP this year."

Then when you point out giving Nash B2B MVPs is a colossal cosmic joke, the same people say: "You can't take his winning MVP last year into consideration for this year."

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

Jones is averaging roughly what he did in Indy. I believe he is actually shooting a lower percentage in PHX.

How did Joe Johnson fare without Nash this year? He must've gotten signifigantly worse by playing without Nash right?

[Slinkyman]

People say "Nash was MVP last year. He's even better this year. Ergo, he must be MVP this year."

Then when you point out giving Nash B2B MVPs is a colossal cosmic joke, the same people say: "You can't take his winning MVP last year into consideration for this year."

Giving Garnett one MVP is a colossal cosmic joke. An MVP does need talent around him to win, he finds a way to do it even when boris diaw is his starting center.

[Slinkyman]

Jones is averaging roughly what he did in Indy. I believe he is actually shooting a lower percentage in PHX.

How did Joe Johnson fare without Nash this year? He must've gotten signifigantly worse by playing without Nash right?

Joe Johnson scoring went up because he shot more, but he went from 47% in 3s to 35% so yeah he didn't have the same kind of year. James jones went from 5ppg to 9.3ppg so he just about doubled what he did in Indy.

[T Park]

Steve Nash deserves the MVP.

Quit hating people.

[ShoogarBear]

Giving Garnett one MVP is a colossal cosmic joke. An MVP does need talent around him to win, he finds a way to do it even when boris diaw is his starting center.

Boris Diaw >>>>> Michael Olowokandi.

Comparing Nash to Garnett is not a winning tack. You know it's weak when it can cause even someone like me to defend KG.

[Slinkyman]

Boris Diaw >>>>> Michael Olowokandi.

Comparing Nash to Garnett is not a winning tack. You know it's weak when it can cause even someone like me to defend KG.

Trust me, put Kandi man on the suns and he'll look like an all star. Who had even heard of Boris Diaw before this season? who had heard of Joe Johnson before last season? Nash is making more guys rich and famous then American Idol.
Nash >>>> Simon

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

Joe Johnson scoring went up because he shot more, but he went from 47% in 3s to 35% so yeah he didn't have the same kind of year. James jones went from 5ppg to 9.3ppg so he just about doubled what he did in Indy.


James Jones scoring went up because he shot more, but he went from 40% in 3s to 39% so yeah he didn't have the same kind of year. And he averaged 6 more MPG this year than last...

[ShoogarBear]

Trust me, put Kandi man on the suns and he'll look like an all star.

Welcome to Theater of the Absurd.



Who had even heard of Boris Diaw before this season? who had heard of Joe Johnson before last season?

Um, people who followed the NBA. Diaw's stats this year are as much a product of the Suns unorthodox system as due to Nash. And as for Joe Johnson:

03-04 16.7/4.7/4.4 43% FGP
04-05 17.1/5.1/3.5 46% FGP (with Nash)
05-06 20.2/4.1/6.5 45% FGP

Yeah, Nash really made him.

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

No, no and no, Shoog. Just look at the stats that favor Nash, like 3 pt shooting percentage, and if a player averages more PPG this year than last on a different team. Things like minutes, shots taken and the gimmick O should not be brought up at all...

[Obstructed_View]

Giving Garnett one MVP is a colossal cosmic joke. An MVP does need talent around him to win, he finds a way to do it even when boris diaw is his starting center.
Boris Diaw has more talent than KG's starting center. You pretty much shot your own argument in the foot. By the way, who is KG's Shawn Marion?

[Ginobili_20_gold_medalist]

Congratulations to Steve Nash. I think he's much deserving of the MVP again. I was one of the people that thought the Suns' free agent acquisitions were a joke (considering the talent they lost) and when Amare went down I wrote the Suns off as a borderline playoff team. Steve Nash earned my respect this year. I was on the "anti-Nash" bandwagon last year but he makes it all work no matter who they throw on the floor with him.

He's a very efficient player that shoots a high percentage in all areas (FG%, 3Pt, Ft, whatever), the best playmaker in the game today, and he's clutch. There's no doubt he's the leader of that team...people can talk about Shawn "disappearing act" Marion until they're blue in the face. People can talk about the "system" all they want...#13 makes it all go.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

Trust me, put Kandi man on the suns and he'll look like an all star. Who had even heard of Boris Diaw before this season? who had heard of Joe Johnson before last season? Nash is making more guys rich and famous then American Idol.
Nash >>>> Simon

You know, what really impresses me is when Nash does that "turn water into wine" trick of his.

[JHoLove]

who else? do the suns play 2 on 2? diaw, house, james jones, raja bell are all scrubs on any other team.


Spurminator, you think dirk doesn't have the same kind of talent? Dallas has the 2nd largest payroll in the nba, there's alot of talent there it's just bad talent. Stackhouse, KVH, Dampier have talent, they just suck at playing team basketball. Detroit has the least amount of "talent" oh those 3, after the 5 starter who do they have? lindsey hunter? Mcdyess? Also PHX by the way is 22nd in payroll. After Nash and Marion who do they have?

What does pay roll have to do with being the MVP? Charlotte has the lowest pay-roll should they have the MVP? I think LeBron or Dirk deserved it more this year. I think the assist category is very glorified.

[TDMVPDPOY]

let the sunsfans n nash celebrate, cose td n the spurs are goin to abuse them in the WCF

[Trainwreck2100]

You know, what really impresses me is when Nash does that "turn water into wine" trick of his.

He doesn't do that, he makes the water around him better.

[ShoogarBear]

He doesn't do that, he makes the water around him better.How is he with Dasani?

http://www.spurstalk.com/coachowned.jpg

[Cant_Be_Faded]

I don't think he deserves this award this year. Last year was acceptable. But giving the National Basketball Association's Most Valuable Player award 2x in a row to a player who is arguably the worst defender at his position is a farse.

It speaks volumes of the state of the NBA today.

[LilMissSPURfect]

How is he with Dasani?

http://www.spurstalk.com/coachowned.jpg

its a sure LOCK! :angel :lol

[E20]

If Nash really won it, then good for him.

[Cant_Be_Faded]

tony parker, ginobili, and duncan, will be the first ever triad co-finals mvps

[Obstructed_View]

props to nash...he deserves it!

now making a huge push as the second greatest canadian athlete of all time
Nah. Nash is better than Lennox Lewis. :)

[1Parker1]

This is absolutely ridiculous. Nash is an amazing team player, but this isn't the Who Makes his Team-mates the best award. This is an indivual award. I used to think that Nash deserved to win MVP this season, but not anymore because:

1) How can you have an MVP who doesn't play a lick of defense?
2) How can you say he makes team-mates better, when he already had good players around him? Marion and Raja Bell aren't exactly scrubs.
3) The run and gun style the Suns play in makes Nash appear better than he is.
4) If Nash was so valuable...how come the Mavs are doing completely fine without him?
5) Is Nash really that good that he deserves to be in the company of players like MJ and Duncan who've won back to back MVP awards?

Kobe, Dirk, Lebron should have easily been considered ahead of Nash.

[Slinkyman]

This is absolutely ridiculous. Nash is an amazing team player, but this isn't the Who Makes his Team-mates the best award. This is an indivual award. I used to think that Nash deserved to win MVP this season, but not anymore because:

1) How can you have an MVP who doesn't play a lick of defense?
2) How can you say he makes team-mates better, when he already had good players around him? Marion and Raja Bell aren't exactly scrubs.
3) The run and gun style the Suns play in makes Nash appear better than he is.
4) If Nash was so valuable...how come the Mavs are doing completely fine without him?
5) Is Nash really that good that he deserves to be in the company of players like MJ and Duncan who've won back to back MVP awards?

Kobe, Dirk, Lebron should have easily been considered ahead of Nash.


1) how can you have an MVP who doesn't play a lick of defense? then you name too players who don't play a lick of defense, Dirk and Lebron. :rolleyes Honestly if any player deserves the MVP other then nash it would be Kobe, but how can you honestly give the MVP award to a player who's team barely made the playoffs and will be sitting at home watching the playoffs on tv after next week?

[1Parker1]

1) how can you have an MVP who doesn't play a lick of defense? then you name too players who don't play a lick of defense, Dirk and Lebron. :rolleyes Honestly if any player deserves the MVP other then nash it would be Kobe, but how can you honestly give the MVP award to a player who's team barely made the playoffs and will be sitting at home watching the playoffs on tv after next week?


Um, Dirk and Lebron both play a lot more defense than Steve Nash ever has. Moreover, they both have better all around games than Nash. They can block shots, get the steal, etc....and it can be argued that they also make their team-mates better.

Personally, I think Kobe or Dirk should have gotten it. If Kobe had Shawn Marion and Boris Diaw and Raja Bell playing next to him...that team could have won 50 games also.

[exstatic]

Horrible. It was bad enough they gave it to him last year. This year there are probably 4 better candidates: Dirk, Kobe, LeBron, shit even Arenas is a better player.

NBA pimping their show team. Nash is rewarded for playing in a system that doesn't care about defense, and tries to get a shot up as fast as possible. Please, God, let Phoenix lose in the first round and be exposed, AGAIN. Maybe people will "get it" then and stop seeing them as a good team.

[Darrin]

Steve Nash deserves the MVP.

Quit hating people.

I say this one more time- Multiple MVP winners for guards:

Michael Jordan
Magic Johnson
Steve Nash

I'm hating because it's not like last year when he was clearly on the best team in the league after starting the previous season with 29 wins. The team was banged up, and any passer could've gotten 50, but he just happened to win 62.

That's not the case this year. Lebron's team won 50 games for the first time since 1992-93 and all he did was average 31, 7, and 7.

Chauncey Billups increased his assists by 3 a game, his scoring by 2 game to give him similar numbers to Nash. But while Stevie's team lost 8 games more than 2004-05, Billups' team won 10 more for a franchise mark. Applying the logic of Steve Nash winning last season, he should be in serious consideration. He has a better assist-to-turnover ratio than Nash.

Kobe Bryant's team won 11 more games than in 2004-05. His scoring season is top-8 all-time, and only Rick Barry in the top 10 joins Kobe Bryant without a Most Valuable Player award. He scored the most points in a game since Wilt's 100. He made people think 100 was breakable. When people look back at this season, they will think about that game. And somehow Phil Jackson is credited for the 45-37 season. His scoring average only bested his career high by 5 points a game.

Somehow Avery Johnson got all of Dirk Nowitizki's mojo.

On top of the fact that John Stockton, Isiah Thomas, Maurice Cheeks, Jason Kidd, Mark Jackson - all of who won 55-60 games and the assist title - don't have an MVP.

[1Parker1]

I say this one more time- Multiple MVP winners for guards:

Michael Jordan
Magic Johnson
Steve Nash

I'm hating because it's not like last year when he was clearly on the best team in the league after starting the previous season with 29 wins. The team was banged up, and any passer could've gotten 50, but he just happened to win 62.

That's not the case this year. Lebron's team won 50 games for the first time since 1992-93 and all he did was average 31, 7, and 7.

Chauncey Billups increased his assists by 3 a game, his scoring by 2 game to give him similar numbers to Nash. But while Stevie's team lost 8 games more than 2004-05, Billups' team won 10 more for a franchise mark. Applying the logic of Steve Nash winning last season, he should be in serious consideration. He has a better assist-to-turnover ratio than Nash.

Kobe Bryant's team won 11 more games than in 2004-05. His scoring season is top-8 all-time, and only Rick Barry in the top 10 joins Kobe Bryant without a Most Valuable Player award. He scored the most points in a game since Wilt's 100. He made people think 100 was breakable. When people look back at this season, they will think about that game. And somehow Phil Jackson is credited for the 45-37 season. His scoring average only bested his career high by 5 points a game.

Somehow Avery Johnson got all of Dirk Nowitizki's mojo.

On top of the fact that John Stockton, Isiah Thomas, Maurice Cheeks, Jason Kidd, Mark Jackson - all of who won 55-60 games and the assist title - don't have an MVP.


Exactly! Man, I didn't think I'd be so miffed about this. I know it's just an award, and no Spur player was being seriously considered, but this is just pathetic.

[ShoogarBear]

Yes, 2005-2006 will be remembered forever as the Era of Steve Nash Dominance. :lmao

[Winnipeg_Spur]

All this talk about Nash making his teammates better takes away some of the credit that should go to the GM, coach and the players themselves. The system they run in Phoenix is absolutely perfect for Nash's talents, as they rely on him almost exclusively to create shots for teammates. The coaches deserve a lot of credit for crafting such a good scheme.

Also the GM did a great job surrounding Nash with 3 point shooters, and absolutely stole Diaw from Atlanta. Just because Atlanta had no clue what to do with Boris doesn't mean Nash is the only one to credit for his success.

I just think that Phoenix is a well-oiled machine (on the offensive side anyway) and that while Nash is clearly a critical cog, the talk about how little help he has is ridiculous. His whole system is designed to help.

Compare all this with what Kobe has, as the biggest supporting talent on his team (Odom) doesn't really fit. Odom really needs to control the ball to be effective, just as Kobe does, so this creates problems. They're starting to play well now, but it took about a year and a half just to get comfortable with each other.

As for making teammates better, well just glancing at the rest of the roster and realizing that this is somehow a playoff team will tell you all you need to know about that. I mean Smush Parker is their starting PG, and he doesn't even look half bad playing with Kobe. Smush Parker! :)

[Darrin]

Yes, 2005-2006 will be remembered forever as the Era of Steve Nash Dominance. :lmao


People will forever argue: Shaquille O'Neal (1 MVP, BTW) or Steve Nash?

[SANANTOJAMES]

man i hope someone hacked in to it

[SANANTOJAMES]

As much of a spurs fan i am, I have to say this. I think that dirk should get this award cause he has more of an all around game. if he develops a post game the mvp is his for sure. Its hurting me to say this

[word]

Well deserved by Nash. I admit I thought without Amare the man child the Suns were doomed but Nash proved me and a lot of other people wrong.

He's a badass. Just admit it, and move on.

[Holmes_Fans]

I'm buying the "lost amare, johnson ect" argument. Dirk Nowitki lost Steve Nash and Michael Finley, yet lead his team with the same conistent record. Nash loses 1 player and drops 10 games.

[adidas11]

What bugs me about Steve Nash winning the MVP is that during big matchups during the regular season, Nash was OUTPLAYED head to head against other top point guards during the season. Jason Kidd dominated him. Chauncey Billups dominated him. Tony Parker dominated him. And this consistenly happened during the season.

I'm surprised that the voters didn't take this into account.

[leemajors]

I'm buying the "lost amare, johnson ect" argument. Dirk Nowitki lost Steve Nash and Michael Finley, yet lead his team with the same conistent record. Nash loses 1 player and drops 10 games.

look what that one player did vs sa in the conference finals last year. they lost, and the spurs let him get his to an extent, but he dominated. amare at full strength is a force, almost moreso than anyone in the league. he even developed a mid range game, seemingly only in the playoffs. amare = scary.

[word]

I feel your pain. Hey man I like Nowitzki and he's a badass OTHER THAN his personality which doesn't lend itself well to the team concept, IN MY OPINION. Avery Johnson seems to have reeled that in a bit and turned the MAVS more into a TEAM.
But Dirk, he's a great player, without doubt.

[adidas11]

I mean seriously, you all don't think that Jason Kidd (even if he is past his *prime*) on the Phoenix Suns team in place of Nash, doesn't do as well or even better? Plus, Kidd plays much better defense than Nash, and rebounds better as well!

I honestly think that if you take any top tier point guard (besides Starbury!) and place him on this current Phoenix Suns team, that you won't see much of a difference record wise. I'm not saying that Nash doesn't *deserve* to win the MVP. But there are definitely better players in the league, and even at the point guard position.

[word]

look what that one player did vs sa in the conference finals last year. they lost, and the spurs let him get his to an extent, but he dominated. amare at full strength is a force, almost moreso than anyone in the league. he even developed a mid range game, seemingly only in the playoffs. amare = scary.

The Suns have a title in their near future. I have no doubt of that. Amare Stoudemire is ....I don't man....yeah...scarey is the right word.

[conqueso]

Horrible. It was bad enough they gave it to him last year. This year there are probably 4 better candidates: Dirk, Kobe, LeBron, [and Billups]....

I hate the American sports media (especially ESPN), but I have enough faith in them to believe that they couldn't be stupid enough to all vote for Nash. So here's what I think happened.

Nash garnered more overall points than any other player because people ended up being split over LeBron, Dirk, and Kobe. Just like what Perot did for Clinton and what Nader did for Bush, those three did for Nash. I bet he was second place on everyone's ballot. They were trying to throw him a bone even though no one thought he should be MVP, or maybe they thought he had the second-best season, or whatever. On the other hand, most ballots had one of the other three legitimate candidates as numbers 1, 3 and 4.

Players get 10 points for every first place vote, 7 points for second, 5 points for third, 3 points for fourth and 1 point for fifth. So let's say there are ten ballots (although the number isn't important since it's the proportions that matter). Consider the following hypothetical. Let's say that each of LeBron, Dirk and Kobe get 3 first place votes, with the tenth going to Nash. Let's also say Nash was second on the other nine ballots. Furthermore, let's say LeBron, Dirk and Kobe were third and fourth on three ballots each, and Billups was fifth on every ballot. That tenth ballot can be randomly assigned after first-place. Here are the ballots, and then the point totals:

1: LeBron 2: Nash 3: Dirk 4: Kobe 5: Billups
1: LeBron 2: Nash 3: Dirk 4: Kobe 5: Billups
1: LeBron 2: Nash 3: Dirk 4: Kobe 5: Billups
1: Dirk 2: Nash 3: Kobe 4: LeBron 5: Billups
1: Dirk 2: Nash 3: Kobe 4: LeBron 5: Billups
1: Dirk 2: Nash 3: Kobe 4: LeBron 5: Billups
1: Kobe 2: Nash 3: LeBron 4: Dirk 5: Billups
1: Kobe 2: Nash 3: LeBron 4: Dirk 5: Billups
1: Kobe 2: Nash 3: LeBron 4: Dirk 5: Billups
1: Nash 2: Dirk 3: Kobe 4: LeBron 5: Billups

Billups: 10
LeBron: 57
Kobe: 59
Dirk: 61
Nash: 70

So while only 10% of the voters thought Nash should have been the MVP, he still won because he garnered enough points off of being haphazardly ranked second-best on everyone's ballot.

Now I know this is all just wide speculation and probably not very accurate, but it's the only rational explanation for how this turd monkey could have repeated as MVP.

Either that, or the voters all felt sorry for him after he was made the butt of about 5000 tasteless visual jokes in the Nash picture thread :)

[Darrin]

Well deserved by Nash. I admit I thought without Amare the man child the Suns were doomed but Nash proved me and a lot of other people wrong.

He's a badass. Just admit it, and move on.

No he's not. Admit it. I can name 10 point guards in the last 15 years better than he is.

[SequSpur]

Nash is a queer.

[adidas11]

I hate the American sports media (especially ESPN), but I have enough faith in them to believe that they couldn't be stupid enough to all vote for Nash. So here's what I think happened.

Nash garnered more overall points than any other player because people ended up being split over LeBron, Dirk, and Kobe. Just like what Perot did for Clinton and what Nader did for Bush, those three did for Nash. I bet he was second place on everyone's ballot. They were trying to throw him a bone even though no one thought he should be MVP, or maybe they thought he has the second-best season, or whatever. One the other hand, most ballots had one of the other three legitimate candidates as numbers 1, 3 and 4.

Players get 10 points for every first place vote, 7 points for second, 5 points for third, 3 points for fourth and 1 point for fifth. So let's say there are ten ballots (although the number isn't important since it's the proportions that matter). Consider the following hypothetical. Let's say that each of LeBron, Dirk and Kobe get 3 first place votes, with the tenth going to Nash. Let's also say Nash was second on the other nine ballots. Furthermore, let's say LeBron, Dirk and Kobe were third and fourth on three ballots each, and Billups was fifth on every ballot. That tenth ballot can be randomly assigned after first-place. Here are the ballots, and then the point totals:

1: LeBron 2: Nash 3: Dirk 4: Kobe 5: Billups
1: LeBron 2: Nash 3: Dirk 4: Kobe 5: Billups
1: LeBron 2: Nash 3: Dirk 4: Kobe 5: Billups
1: Dirk 2: Nash 3: Kobe 4: LeBron 5: Billups
1: Dirk 2: Nash 3: Kobe 4: LeBron 5: Billups
1: Dirk 2: Nash 3: Kobe 4: LeBron 5: Billups
1: Kobe 2: Nash 3: LeBron 4: Dirk 5: Billups
1: Kobe 2: Nash 3: LeBron 4: Dirk 5: Billups
1: Kobe 2: Nash 3: LeBron 4: Dirk 5: Billups
1: Nash 2: Dirk 3: Kobe 4: LeBron 5: Billlups

Billups: 10
LeBron: 57
Kobe: 59
Dirk: 61
Nash: 70

So while only 10% of the voters thought Nash should have been the MVP, he still won because he garnered enough points off of being haphazardly ranked second-best on everyone's ballot.

Now I know this is all just wide speculation and probably not very accurate, but it's the only rationale explanation for how this turd monkey could have repeated as MVP.

Either that, or the voters all felt sorry for him after he was made the butt of about 5000 tasteless visual jokes in the Nash picture thread :)


No, your theory on that is entirely feasible. We will see when they show the acutal voting tally. A similar instance happened in 1990, when Magic Johnson edged Charles Barkley for the MVP. Charles had more 1st place votes, but was displaced by a lot of second place votes by other post/power players like Karl Malone. Magic had very few 1st place votes, but he did have a lot of second place votes, and ended up winning the MVP. I think what might have happened this year is that you had two players who had statistically two of the most impressive individual seasons in NBA history. Kobe averaging 35+, which hadn't been done since Michael Jordan in 1988 (who won the MVP and Defensive Player of the Year that season!), and Lebron who AVERAGED 31-7-7!!! A player had not done something like that since the days of Oscar Robertson (Jordan might have come close to something like that perhaps). Yet Steve Nash who wasn't that statistically impressive, nor played well on defense, beats both of them out for the MVP!?!? It makes your theory all the more plausible.

[Obstructed_View]

Well deserved by Nash. I admit I thought without Amare the man child the Suns were doomed but Nash proved me and a lot of other people wrong.

He's a badass. Just admit it, and move on.
Nash is a great player. The fact that you and many other people did a lousy job of predicting their record both years that he's been there doesn't somehow make him the best player in the league.

[word]

No he's not. Admit it. I can name 10 point guards in the last 15 years better than he is.

The MVP isn't an award of the greatest point guards of the last 15 years.

[exstatic]

Nash is a queer.
Queerly Canadian? :rollin

[exstatic]

The Suns have a title in their near future. I have no doubt of that. Amare Stoudemire is ....I don't man....yeah...scarey is the right word.
The Suns will never win a title with Mike D'entures as their coach. It's Nellie ball, part II. It's a gimmick scheme that comes apart under pressure.

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

The Suns will never win a title with Mike D'entures as their coach. It's Nellie ball, part II. It's a gimmick scheme that comes apart under pressure.

You'd think the MVP would be able to stop a 19-0 run...

[Obstructed_View]

The MVP isn't an award of the greatest point guards of the last 15 years.
Obviously it isn't about winning games, caliber of teammates, having a complete game, putting up statistics or being the best at your position. Maybe they should change it from the "most valuable player" award to the "valuable player" award.

Nash for VP.

[Darrin]

The MVP isn't an award of the greatest point guards of the last 15 years.

No, but when you can't make he's the slam-dunk best in the game today, then the wrong guy has been MVP.

And it has a little to do with it when those other 10 guys ahead of him haven't won ONE MVP.

[Marcus Bryant]

You'd think the MVP would have a ring...

[ducks]

S. Marion = playoff choker

not worth the max I trade him if I am a sun fan

[Darrin]

The Suns have a title in their near future. I have no doubt of that. Amare Stoudemire is ....I don't man....yeah...scarey is the right word.

1987-88 Los Angeles Lakers. That's the last time that an NBA Champion allowed their opponents to score as many points as the Phoenix Suns allowed this season (102.0). Last year it was worse. (103.3).

The last time a Championship team allowed over 100 points a game was 1994-95 when the 47-35 Houston Rockets had to come back from 3-1 twice in the playoffs to become Champions.

Steve Nash is 32. We heard the same hype about the New Jersey Nets, the Sacramento Kings, and the Dallas Mavericks. The last time I checked the Los Angeles Lakers, San Antonio Spurs, and Detroit Pistons won the Championships of this decade.

[1Parker1]

Yes, 2005-2006 will be remembered forever as the Era of Steve Nash Dominance. :lmao

:lol :lol 64-63 Bitch.

[1Parker1]

Oh and by the way...Lakers currently owning the Suns :)

Shoogarbear...I think your prediction may just come true :wow :wow

[ducks]

this is the second straight game the lakers are taking it to the suns
suns were 10-0 against kobe with nash
but phil jackson makes adjustments
suns coach has not
suns are in trouble
lakers are actually looking scary good
but it against the suns without their d men so who knows

[ducks]

they better give it to him in game 5 because that could be the last home game for him this season

[1Parker1]

:lmao Of course as I said that, Nash is currently leading them back into the game.

[x0xbillupsx0x]

If you give the award to Nash last year, than he most certainly deserves it this year. He led the team to the division title without amare, who many consider the best talent on the team. On top of that you add 3 new starters and a totally revamped bench, and they don't miss a beat. Give him some credit, he's taken a group of young no name players and still finished with 54 wins. The only other players who I would consider in the mix are Billups and Dirk, but both those guys have much better surrounding talent and those teams have been together longer. Nash makes everyone around him better and deserves to be the MVP. Yes, I am a Spurs fan but I can respect what he did this year and last.
nash had allstar talent surounding him last year as well.
all the writers said they voted for him over shaq only because of his teams record being the best in the nba!
i wonder whats their excuse this yr!

[exstatic]

nash had allstar talent surounding him last year as well.
all the writers said they voted for him over shaq only because of his teams record being the best in the nba!
i wonder whats their excuse this yr!
The Great White Hoax....

[1Parker1]

^:lol Damn, at least give it to Dirk then. I was so sure on that Vbookie :pctoss

[ShoogarBear]

Shoogarbear...I think your prediction may just come true :wow :wow
Really? :elephant :drunk :drunk :elephant









Oh, you mean the one about the Phoenix-LA series.

[1Parker1]

Really? :elephant :drunk :drunk :elephant









Oh, you mean the one about the Phoenix-LA series.


:lmao

[ManuTim_best of Fwiendz]

I don't know what's with all the Nash hate. This year there wasn't really a clear winner, but I think Nash is legit. I wanted Dirk to get it, but if you think about the "2-time" complainers, just using that logic, "well, I can't vote for Nash, he won it last year..." doesn't really make sense since last year has nothing to do with how he good he was this year as it is for anyone deciding the vote. And Magic Johnson's era, Michael Jordan's era has nothing to do with 2006!

THe Regular Season MVP award isn't even something get worked up about anyway or any of the individual regular season awards. THey're just distractions from the Ring, so who cares, the opponents can rack up their awards while the real ones get the job done.

[MajicMan]

http://img141.imageshack.us/img141/1121/mvpwned7bm.jpg
http://www.filelodge.com/files/hdd2/11452/kobe%20nash.gif

[Darrin]

this is the second straight game the lakers are taking it to the suns
suns were 10-0 against kobe with nash
but phil jackson makes adjustments
suns coach has not
suns are in trouble
lakers are actually looking scary good
but it against the suns without their d men so who knows

You're overstating this a bit. Dominating means to me that you're able to put a team away. The Suns are the more talented team, and that's why the Lakers cannot put them away. The Spurs dominated the Kings in game one. The Pistons dominated the Bucks in game 2.

But the way the Lakers are playing - the relentless pursuit of the basketball, controlling tempo, the solid shot selection, making the big plays, playing smart and hungry, sharing team responsibilities like rebounding and passing amongst 12 guys - those are the things that are keeping the Lakers in this series. That's why I picked them to win this series. They have a long way to go, but they took the first step tonight.

Please, don't get overhyped between games. The only way this game should have struck someone upside the head is if they thought 54 wins guaranteed the Suns a playoff spot in the next round.

Ups to Sasha and Odom playing so well (and of course, Kobe). Kwame played sloppy and/or scared. He made tough turnovers early and late, and some just dumb plays; fouls that weren't even called. And Smush got rattled because his shot wasn't falling. I bring this up because they will need both of these guys to rebound by Game 3 and just play smarter and more loose.

Do you really have to point out the advantage to the Lakers in terms of adjustments? Mike D'Antoni is coached his 17th playoff game tonight. Phil Jackson's 2003-04 playoff run had 23 games.

[Darrin]

I don't know what's with all the Nash hate. This year there wasn't really a clear winner, but I think Nash is legit. I wanted Dirk to get it, but if you think about the "2-time" complainers, just using that logic, "well, I can't vote for Nash, he won it last year..." doesn't really make sense since last year has nothing to do with how he good he was this year as it is for anyone deciding the vote. And Magic Johnson's era, Michael Jordan's era has nothing to do with 2006!

When a vote is this close, it's one of two things. Either everyone is so mediocre that a winner doesn't distinguish himself or there are so many qualified candidates that the winner can't distinguish himself.

The latter is the case here, and I think giving Steve Nash more MVPs that any other guard in the history of the game besides Magic and Jordan is a very good argument for saying "You got one last year Steve, there's just too many great guys this season." What I'm saying is that what will happen to the history of the award should be a tie-breaker, not the first reason to dismiss.

And I don't buy it. Steven A. Smith on the 6PM Sportscenter as much said that since Nash was the MVP last season, and no one really stepped forward to taking it, he cast his vote for Steve Nash. He said "Let me use a boxing medaphor someone has to step up and take your title away from you. I didn't see that happen, and based on the season he had, I voted for Steve Nash."

That's AT LEAST one voter voted for Nash this season and used last season to justify it.

I'll put down my gun when the media, who voted for this, puts down theirs. We vote on Most Improved Player using the previous season as justification. We vote for every award - not in a vaccum - but by what they have done in their careers prior, where there team was before them, etc.


The Regular Season MVP award isn't even something get worked up about anyway or any of the individual regular season awards. THey're just distractions from the Ring, so who cares, the opponents can rack up their awards while the real ones get the job done.

Sure it is. 20 years from now, someone will know who David Robinson was. Will they know who Rasheed Wallace was, Keith Van Horn? My guess is no. MVPs are about saying "This was the best player of this season. Remember him." And Steve Nash is not the best player this year, plain and simple.

1. Kobe Bryant
2. Chauncey Billups
3. Lebron James
4. Dirk Nowitzki
5. Elton Brand
6. Steve Nash
7. Tony Parker
8. Dwyane Wade
9. Gilbert Arenas
10. Vince Carter

That's how my ballot would've looked.

[RonMexico]

To satisfy all you douches out there, I've called the league office and they've created a few new "secret" awards this year. The first year winners are:

MVPFI (Most Valuable Plantar Fasciitis Injury) - Tim Duncan's foot
MVTG (Most Valuable Token Girlfriend) - Tony Parker
MVFA (Most Valuable Flop Artist) - Manu Ginobili
MVRAHS (Most Valuable Ray Allen Hand-Slapper) - Bruce Bowen
MVWMLA (Most Valuable Will Smith Look-Alike) - Robert Horry
GD (Giant Douche) - Brent Barry
MIHTLLBB (Most Improved Haircut To Look Like Brent Barry) - Beno Udrih
MUBATWAC (Most Unabashadly Blantant Attempt to Win a Championship) - Michael Finley and Nick Van Exel (tie)
MPMSRJ (Most Pock Marks Since Randy Johnson) - Gregg Popovich
MPFASFBTAS (Most Pump Fakes and Shuffled Footsteps Before Taking a Shot) - Nazr Mohammed


Anyone who hates on Nash and the Suns refuses to look at the more intangible aspects that make a player the "most valuable" to his team: leadership, humility, unselfishness, and overall control of a game. Nash has all of these qualities, while many of your other darlings (Dirk - yells at teammates on court; Kobe - shoots 100 times per game; LeBron - still a little raw when it comes to leadership). Chauncey is probably the most Nash-like, but he'll have a hard time winning the trophy with that whole starting 5 out there. And many of you are probably ignoring the fact that the Suns would have been pushing 60 games if they hadn't gotten off to such a rough start (4-5) and then lost a key element of their defensive shift (Kurt Thomas) late in the season. I'm not even going to mention the failed attempt to bring Amare back.

Still, most of you like to look at stats for your reasoning, so I'll mention that as a team, the Suns were more "defensively efficient" than even the Pistons (according to John Hollinger of ESPN.com), Nash is one of only 3 players in history ever to shoot over 50% FG, 40% 3pt, and 90% FT (other two are Mark Price and Larry Bird), and of the "9 rebounds" that were missing from Amare, Nash picked up 1, Boris Diaw picked up almost 7, Kurt Thomas had 8, and Shawn Marion picked up an extra one per game. Additionally, for those of you that mention how Nash was able to average more per game because Amare was gone and he needed to pick up a larger scoring load, let's also not forget that he only lost 1 assist per game (worth 2-3 points per game) and his scoring average went up almost 4 points per game.

So what did he do with those 10.5 assists per game and his overall team leadership? He only allowed 6 players on the team to have career scoring years (Raja Bell, Shawn Marion, James Jones, Eddie House, Leandro Barbosa, and Boris Diaw). Call it "the system" or whatever you will, but teams with just a system and not someone who can run it properly don't win 50 games, their division, and the #2 seed in the Western Conference. (Let's not forget that LeBron puts up these numbers against Eastern Conference teams.)

Nash is easily the most valuable to his teams success, regardless of whether he's a strong defensive player or scores the majority of his team's points - which seem to be the criteria you've selected to be most important. Tim Duncan has also won the MVP on averaging 20 and 10 and displaying strong overall leadership and consistent performance. I hope you don't want to remove his MVP trophy because he won while playing with a strong defensive player in David Robinson or the current architect of Dirk's success (I disagree because Dirk still has a lot to work on) - Avery Johnson. MJ didn't win his MVP awards when he was putting up LeBron's numbers, but when he learned how to lead his team to victory and involve his teammates in the overall success of the basketball operation.

[ManuTim_best of Fwiendz]

When a vote is this close, it's one of two things. Either everyone is so mediocre that a winner doesn't distinguish himself or there are so many qualified candidates that the winner can't distinguish himself.

The latter is the case here, and I think giving Steve Nash more MVPs that any other guard in the history of the game besides Magic and Jordan is a very good argument for saying "You got one last year Steve, there's just too many great guys this season." What I'm saying is that what will happen to the history of the award should be a tie-breaker, not the first reason to dismiss.

And I don't buy it. Steven A. Smith on the 6PM Sportscenter as much said that since Nash was the MVP last season, and no one really stepped forward to taking it, he cast his vote for Steve Nash. He said "Let me use a boxing medaphor someone has to step up and take your title away from you. I didn't see that happen, and based on the season he had, I voted for Steve Nash."

That's AT LEAST one voter voted for Nash this season and used last season to justify it.

I'll put down my gun when the media, who voted for this, puts down theirs. We vote on Most Improved Player using the previous season as justification. We vote for every award - not in a vaccum - but by what they have done in their careers prior, where there team was before them, etc.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ManuTim_best of Fwiendz



The Regular Season MVP award isn't even something get worked up about anyway or any of the individual regular season awards. THey're just distractions from the Ring, so who cares, the opponents can rack up their awards while the real ones get the job done.



Sure it is. 20 years from now, someone will know who David Robinson was. Will they know who Rasheed Wallace was, Keith Van Horn? My guess is no. MVPs are about saying "This was the best player of this season. Remember him." And Steve Nash is not the best player this year, plain and simple.

1. Kobe Bryant
2. Chauncey Billups
3. Lebron James
4. Dirk Nowitzki
5. Elton Brand
6. Steve Nash
7. Tony Parker
8. Dwyane Wade
9. Gilbert Arenas
10. Vince Carter

That's how my ballot would've looked.


Well Kobe Bryant had a lot less argument than Steve Nash because he is a 7th seed with PHil Jackson. 81 points may fool a few people, but Nash and Lebron play a more rounded game than Kobe. Kobe Bryant is hype, and he backs up some, but the marketing tries to sell him as MVP when a 7th seed team never wins MVP.
All I meant by" Steve Nash's season winning it Last year does not take away how good he was this year" was this...Like Steve A Smith's logic (no taking away form the fact that he is a douche) "Steve Nash made his case again, and no one stepped up." Therefore, what's the problem. You're acting like I said MVP's of the past are completely irrelevant, when I just meant MVP's are being voted in the context of the season for the most part. Everyone who votes for MVP will refer to previous seasons, but they still fall back at the Numbers right now! and that's all I was saying about Nash's legitmacy. As for the Kobe award. The MVP goes to best TEAM PLAYER, it's an award in the context of the TEAM. People confuse it with Most TALENTED PLAYER AWARD. Put any greatly talented player on a team with a great Coach, They'll make the playoffs.

Nash is more Crucial to his Team, and it's system than Kobe has been to the Lakers. Last year could have hurt Kobe if they considered it. 50 % team is not impressive. Lakers have been compromised around a guy who has to get HIS, which risks a few losses in the regular season, over team. Kobe's talented no doubt, but seeing him break away from the system time and time again when thinks everything he chucks is gold, is not what Basketball "purists" like to see. He's impressive but he's selfish at times, and that has hurt his case.

[Tanya]

I was surprised when I knew Nash gets the award this year.
Without Kobe and Lebron, LAL and CLE are just NOTHING, never had a chance to go to the playoffs. However without Nash, PHX still got some good players.
Without Dirk and Chauncey, DAL and DET have no chance to win the champ. However, even with Nash, I don't consider PHX as champ contender, simply because they don't play defense.

Therefore, if I pick one from all those candidates, I would pick Kobe or Lebron, because they have an amazing year carrying their garbage teams on their backs.
If I pick one from Kobe and Nash, I would pick Kobe, because he is the best player. I personally think the best player = the most valuable player.
If I pick one from Nash and Chauncey, I would pick Chauncey. Nash had more all stars around him last year. Larry Brown has gone but DET have the best record is because Chauncey runs Flip's offense system perfectly, at the same time he still plays defense. Chauncey is playing the best ball in his career. If they don't give Flip "coach of the year", give the MVP to Chauncey.

I hope Kobe would get it, if not Kobe then Dirk, Chauncey, just not Nash. I don't hate Nash. But I just never thought he would repeat.

[Darrin]

good to see your homerism jump in.

A team win 64 games, the most since the 1999-00 LA Lakers (67-15), he jumps his numbers from 16 and 6 to 19 and 9 and his turnover don't increase. An NBA Finalist the season before, they win 10 more games. A year before, the MVP averaged 15 and 11 for a 62-win team.

Yeah, that's complete homerism.

As for Kobe Bryant, I am not a fan. I just don't like him. But I know an MVP when I see him. And all you have to do is look at his pursuit of the basketball in the game tonight. He wasn't playing to score points; I saw him break into bad shots maybe 3 of his 21 shots. He's smarter, more mature of a player. The loads of talent and bullshit the Lakers have put up with is apparently paying off.

He increases his scoring by 5 points a night, shoots a career high in Field Goal Percentage, and his team win 11 more games and gets back in the playoffs. Yeah, the guy is completely selfish, worrying about the wrong things out there.

[ManuTim_best of Fwiendz]

Kobe hasn't played like this all season. It's an aberration. Jackson had a good talk with him and showed in the 3 50 Point games he had against the Suns that ended in Losses. Kobe is not stupid. But he's a bit of an egomanica loon, and he has not maintained a consistent unselfish game his whole career. He's biting his tongue right now because he's not going to take for granted a post-season, that he eeked by in thanks to a water-down league this season and a defensively challenged team.

I'm not sold on Kobe. He's a great talent. An amazing opponent, but I can't buy into this guy.

[RonMexico]

RonMexico (member.php?u=1535)
http://spurstalk.com/forums/images/smilies2/smitu.gif well said


Thanks, man. I wasn't trying to be mean at all (and I left this final paragraph out by accident), but I was basically saying in a sarcastic manner that the Spurs have tons of good parts that go together to make up a champion, and I would much rather receive no individual awards (although Bowen deserves DPOY this year more than ever before), and be at the top of everyone's short list to be the NBA Champion (which SA and Detroit are). The Spurs and the Pistons are the at the top of the league because they are strong overall teams - a pinnacle the Suns undoubtedly hope to achieve. However, you can't point to a specific link in the chain on each of those teams that is the most valuable to his team's success (Mavs aren't even part of this conversation because despite their record, they still have a non-clutch shoot-first PG and a 7-footer that gets dominated by a 6'6" defender) - all the pieces on SA and Detroit work together to win these games.

Nash, on the other hand, is the seemingly most important link on another "team-based" organization and I think that's why people continually vote for him for the award. Comparisons to Stockton, Bird, MJ, Moses Malone are irrelevant based on changes in gameplay, eras, and the types of supporting casts they had around them (Stockton always had Karl Malone - Nash had a motley crew of players rejected from other teams and no Amare this year).

[Darrin]

Let's not paint the Spurs like they are without postseason hardware (without counting titles). Pop has been named Coach of the Year and TD is an MVP twice (despite Jason Kidd probably deserving it in 2001-02).

So far, the only thing the Suns have won the Spurs haven't is a Most Improved Player award.

[ManuTim_best of Fwiendz]

Thanks, man. I wasn't trying to be mean at all (and I left this final paragraph out by accident), but I was basically saying in a sarcastic manner that the Spurs have tons of good parts that go together to make up a champion, and I would much rather receive no individual awards (although Bowen deserves DPOY this year more than ever before), and be at the top of everyone's short list to be the NBA Champion (which SA and Detroit are). The Spurs and the Pistons are the at the top of the league because they are strong overall teams - a pinnacle the Suns undoubtedly hope to achieve. However, you can't point to a specific link in the chain on each of those teams that is the most valuable to his team's success (Mavs aren't even part of this conversation because despite their record, they still have a non-clutch shoot-first PG and a 7-footer that gets dominated by a 6'6" defender) - all the pieces on SA and Detroit work together to win these games.

Nash, on the other hand, is the seemingly most important link on another "team-based" organization and I think that's why people continually vote for him for the award. Comparisons to Stockton, Bird, MJ, Moses Malone are irrelevant based on changes in gameplay, eras, and the types of supporting casts they had around them (Stockton always had Karl Malone - Nash had a motley crew of players rejected from other teams and no Amare this year).
I think Nash deserves the award, his unselfish play is great and needs to be promoted for the up and coming players. Sure I don't care to see him lead his team to the championship, because he has to do it against the Spurs. I give him props because he's a premiere player, and it's a bit of a cheap shot with the most "undeserving 2-Time MVP" complaints. It's not like him winning it is gonna take that away from the past players. I think Kobe can win MVP some time down the road, he can have it who cares, but I don't care to see him win it off personal stats all season ignoring the scrubs, then finally he starts playing WITH the team on the first game of the postseason. Nash has done that with two teams in a row, with Nash all you have to be is a professional baller and you'll be avg 15 ppg each.

[Darrin]

Kobe hasn't played like this all season. It's an aberration. Jackson had a good talk with him and showed in the 3 50 Point games he had against the Suns that ended in Losses. Kobe is not stupid. But he's a bit of an egomanica loon, and he has not maintained a consistent unselfish game his whole career. He's biting his tongue right now because he's not going to take for granted a post-season, that he eeked by in thanks to a water-down league this season and a defensively challenged team.

I'm not sold on Kobe. He's a great talent. An amazing opponent, but I can't buy into this guy.

It's an aberration I have seen in 10 Lakers games this season, including a win to the Pistons. Let him be an egomaniac, as long as it doesn't hurt his team, I don't care. We're not judging MVP by who we'd like to have lunch with.

Like I said before, I don't like him. I respect him as the MVP he is, though.

[ManuTim_best of Fwiendz]

We're not judging MVP by who we'd like to have lunch with.
Hey. Don't put words in my mouth, guy. Favoring a player for MVP, because I see him as more "unselfish" than other players has nothing to do with me liking their personality. I never liked Michael Jordan, but could see him for his greatness on the court. I don't like what Kobe does on the court at times, and I think that's why he shouldn't be MVP. I just think it's better for a sport that's meant to be played for the team.

Obviously, we disagree. Your opinion is for Kobe, that's fine. Mine's for Nash. But don't digress, allude to other things, and act like I'm saying stuff I'm not.

You've done that in the last couple posts.

[Darrin]

You've done that in the last couple posts.

My apologies. Sometimes I get carried away.

[ManuTim_best of Fwiendz]

My apologies. Sometimes I get carried away.
No prob. I guess it's that time of year again in sports. Whenever they hand out the awards the sentiments start flyin'.

We're gonna be hearing it all this week.

[LEONARD]

Why does team record matter???

If Amare comes back next year and avg's 35 pts, 13 reb's, and 4 blocks a game, but the Suns win the same # of games as they did this year, he can't be the MVP based on many of the arguments in this thread...

[Obstructed_View]

Why does team record matter???

If Amare comes back next year and avg's 35 pts, 13 reb's, and 4 blocks a game, but the Suns win the same # of games as they did this year, he can't be the MVP based on many of the arguments in this thread...
Team record mattered a hell of a lot to voters for Nash last year because the Suns happened to have the best record.

Everybody predicted that the Suns would suck last year because they'd won 29 games the year before. When the Suns did well, they gave Nash the MVP rather than admit that their predictions were stupid. This year, everyone predicted the Suns would suck because Amare is out. When the Suns did well, they gave Nash the MVP rather than admit that their predictions were stupid.

[Scobe]

I like Nash. Have no problem with him because he makes great plays and gets others involved in a way that few PG do these days. Sort of like Bob Cousey with long hair. Congratulations to him. MVP and an imminent postseason defeat for two straight years.

Like I said, I like Nash but he got absolutely abused by Kobe in game 2 on that dunk. I haven't seen anyone get that abused in quite a while, can't wait to see that one on a poster. Talk about finding yourself at the wrong place at the wrong time.

[word]

Like I said, I like Nash but he got absolutely abused by Kobe in game 2 on that dunk.

Which was a clear charging call. Refs made two bad calls last night against the Suns, at critical times. The first loose ball non-foul and not calling Koby on the charge. With less than two minutes left, that made a difference of 5 points and two possessions we don't know what would have happened.

Anyway....I thought phoenix was DONE with Amare out. Wouldn't even make the playoffs. Nash kept 'em in the hunt.

And above all I just like watching him play. He's magic Johnson like with the assists and a hella three point shooter. Recall the Dallas game 5 and the three ? Sure Terry left him for the three but he busted it from deep.

Then of course Dirk went off on Jason Terry causing much controversy because they were going into OT and that's not the time for that. Mind you, Dirk had a right to be mad since he's brought 'em back from oblivion but still....

You move on to win the OT. Nowitski's leadership skills have always been a question mark to me.

At that point in time, in a semi-playoff game, you deal with it, go to the huddle, pump up your team, tell Terry to 'fuggit about it' and move on to win the F'in game....

That's the diff between Nash and Nowitzki.

Koby ?...Don't get me started.....

[Scobe]

Which was a clear charging call. Refs made two bad calls last night against the Suns, at critical times. The first loose ball non-foul and not calling Koby on the charge. With less than two minutes left, that made a difference of 5 points and two possessions we don't know what would have happened.

...
I disagree there. The foul on Nash was absolutely the right call because Nash was almost directly under the basket and well within the semi-circle that the NBA has established for taking charges. The only way that a player can take a charge inside of that semi-circle is if the opposing player uses either his hands or arms/legs to push the defender out of the way. Nash just got caught under the basket and had no choice but to foul there.

And Odom just made a great hustle play. He was willing to dive for the ball while the Suns guy made a half assed attempt at it. There was no foul there, Odom just beat him to the ball because he wanted it more. Great hustle play. Hustle plays like that win close games, especially in the P.Os.

[RonMexico]

Like I said, I like Nash but he got absolutely abused by Kobe in game 2 on that dunk.


Yeah, that was an obvious charge, and one that I'd expect Joey Crawford to make in that situation - I'm kind of disappointed in the officiating towards the end of the game. The Suns lost by 6 points and there were 3 different times where Kobe had 2 pts that shouldn't have counted -- the dunk on the charge (2), where Lamar Odom obviously passed to himself and there was no call on the travel (Kobe jumper), and Kobe "beating" the shot clock when the ball was still in his hand (I know this because I did slow motion on TiVo to see if he had gotten if off and he hadn't).

The thing that pissed me off a lot was that Doug Collins never stopped nutting all over Kobe that entire night and then goes on to comment "now the Lakers lead the series 1-1; maybe we'll see an all LA second round!!!" If you've had a losing record as a coach, you shouldn't be allowed in the booth - period. He nuts all over Kobe and they don't even recognize that he might have gotten the shot off after the clock expired - much less whether he was already out of bounds when he made that little tip pass falling down... the only time they called out anything was on the obvious charging play that was the difference maker in the game (the other bad no-call was on the Kwame loose ball foul).

I feel as if towards the end of the game, the refs were trying to make up for Kobe getting slapped on the forehead at the end of game 1 (despite the fact that he took about 4 steps anyways). I'd also like to point out that the when the Suns rarely get calls, they often do not complain and perhaps that sportsmanship backfires on them in the end because they do go the free throw line the least in the league (and yes, they do shoot a lot of jumpshots, but they get slapped around inside quite a bit and you never see them bitching). I guess Nash should lead by example again and start calling out the refs like Kobe and Phil (let's not forget George Karl either).

[RonMexico]

I disagree there. The foul on Nash was absolutely the right call because Nash was almost directly under the basket and well within the semi-circle that the NBA has established for taking charges. The only way that a player can take a charge inside of that semi-circle is if the opposing player uses either his hands or arms/legs to push the defender out of the way. Nash just got caught under the basket and had no choice but to foul there.

And Odom just made a great hustle play. He was willing to dive for the ball while the Suns guy made a half assed attempt at it. There was no foul there, Odom just beat him to the ball because he wanted it more. Great hustle play. Hustle plays like that win close games, especially in the P.Os.


I disagree with your whole comment because it is inaccurate on all accounts. First, Nash was outside the semi-circle and firmly planted before Kobe took off (all elements of a charge... if you don't believe me, click back to page 5 and look at the photo that is posted). Secondly, no one is denying that Lamar Odom hustled to get the ball, while diving on the ground as the Suns pretty much pussed out (I'm the first to call out this team when they act soft). The loose ball foul we're talking about is the one where Kwame mis-handled the pass like a 2-year-old and then blatantly ran over Raja Bell trying to get it back before slapping it in the direction where Odom could jump on it.

Just want to make sure that the facts are solid before you go running your mouth off Stephen A. Smith-style

[word]

I disagree with your whole comment because it is inaccurate on all accounts. First, Nash was outside the semi-circle and firmly planted before Kobe took off (all elements of a charge... if you don't believe me, click back to page 5 and look at the photo that is posted). Secondly, no one is denying that Lamar Odom hustled to get the ball, while diving on the ground as the Suns pretty much pussed out (I'm the first to call out this team when they act soft). The loose ball foul we're talking about is the one where Kwame mis-handled the pass like a 2-year-old and then blatantly ran over Raja Bell trying to get it back before slapping it in the direction where Odom could jump on it.

Just want to make sure that the facts are solid before you go running your mouth off Stephen A. Smith-style

Beat me to it, but said it well. Hell I'm no Suns fan, never have been .....it's like Koby is Reggie Bush to some people....Rush for 500 yards against a nobody Fresno State, you win a Heisman. Same kind of shit with Koby. Score 70 whatever against a nobody...suddenly your a darling of the media with your clear charging foul all over ESPN as 'posterizing' Nash.

Both were pathetic.
:elephant

[spurofthemoment]

John Stockton got one first place MVP vote in his entire career, and had a number of seasons as good as Nash has had. Stockton also actually played defense. MVP has become a joke.
yeah right but there was Barkley Bird Jordan Drexler Malone and Magic back then I agree with u though I hated Stockton more than Malone,,it shoulda been Kobe or Lebron CAUSE ALL THREE ARE GOING TO ELEVATE THEIR TEAMMATES BUT KOBE AND lEBRON WERE AWESOME

[Obstructed_View]

Steve Nash tried to draw a Darrell Armstrong charge under the basket. It was a block, in my opinion. Let's see what the NBA rules have to say:

A defensive player is not permitted to move into the path of an offensive player once he has started his shooting motion.
The speed of the offensive player will determine the amount of distance a defensive player must allow.
The mere fact that contact occurs on these type of plays, or any other similar play, does not necessarily mean that a personal foul has been committed. The officials must decide whether the contact is negligible and/or incidental, judging each situation separately.

[RonMexico]

Steve Nash tried to draw a Darrell Armstrong charge under the basket. It was a block, in my opinion. Let's see what the NBA rules have to say:

A defensive player is not permitted to move into the path of an offensive player once he has started his shooting motion.
The speed of the offensive player will determine the amount of distance a defensive player must allow.
The mere fact that contact occurs on these type of plays, or any other similar play, does not necessarily mean that a personal foul has been committed. The officials must decide whether the contact is negligible and/or incidental, judging each situation separately.


That whole comment is idiotic. I could go on more, but I have a shit to take that is more important than responding to your post. Bringing out the official NBA rule book can be useful when it pertains to your statement. You bold the most unimportant part of the rule because it is obvious that Joey Crawford thought the contact was not negligible because he, in fact, blew the whistle. Also, by official NBA definition, a "Darrell Armstrong" charge is described as "throwing your body in a backwards motion when little or no contact is involved, often using a shrill yell to draw attention to your action. See Manu Ginobili." If you watch the replay again, you will see that actual contact occurred and the only person yelling is Kobe Bryant. What happened was, according to definition again, a "make-up call" which is defined as "when Kobe gets hit on the face in Game 1 with no call and he and Phil bitch about it a lot, then make sure any questionable calls go his way at crucial points in the 4th quarter."

You will see in the replay (and reiterated in my post above) that Nash was present before the shooting motion (i.e. lift-off for dunk) began and that he left the proper amount of space based on the speed of Kobe's upward thrust to garner a charging call. When Doug Collins says the officiating is bad (especially against his baby Kobe), then it was a bad call. That's in the official rule book too, section 34, dedicated specifically to Doug Collins insults.

[Doug Collins]

You will see in the replay (and reiterated in my post above) that Nash was present before the shooting motion (i.e. lift-off for dunk) began and that he left the proper amount of space based on the speed of Kobe's upward thrust to garner a charging call. When Doug Collins says the officiating is bad (especially against his baby Kobe), then it was a bad call. That's in the official rule book too, section 34, dedicated specifically to Doug Collins insults.


He does have a point, Section 34 is specifically dedicated to me. :elephant :princess :elephant :fro :king

[Scobe]

That whole comment is idiotic. I could go on more, but I have a shit to take that is more important than responding to your post. Bringing out the official NBA rule book can be useful when it pertains to your statement. You bold the most unimportant part of the rule because it is obvious that Joey Crawford thought the contact was not negligible because he, in fact, blew the whistle. Also, by official NBA definition, a "Darrell Armstrong" charge is described as "throwing your body in a backwards motion when little or no contact is involved, often using a shrill yell to draw attention to your action. See Manu Ginobili." If you watch the replay again, you will see that actual contact occurred and the only person yelling is Kobe Bryant. What happened was, according to definition again, a "make-up call" which is defined as "when Kobe gets hit on the face in Game 1 with no call and he and Phil bitch about it a lot, then make sure any questionable calls go his way at crucial points in the 4th quarter."

You will see in the replay (and reiterated in my post above) that Nash was present before the shooting motion (i.e. lift-off for dunk) began and that he left the proper amount of space based on the speed of Kobe's upward thrust to garner a charging call. When Doug Collins says the officiating is bad (especially against his baby Kobe), then it was a bad call. That's in the official rule book too, section 34, dedicated specifically to Doug Collins insults.

You also have to be firmly planted and stationary to draw the charge. Nash was still moving forward BEFORE the contact. So it is a block. And shut the FUCK up with that stephen a smith shit. I was nice and polite before, but your dumb ass has to get fucking personal. I dont like Kobe, but it was not a charge. Get the fuck over it.

[mathbzh]

Nash is the MVP. He makes teammates better.

But as a french fan I must say something about Diaw.
He is no a Nash product.

- Last summer he was the best French player during the Euro (better than TP). He was probably the second european player behind Dirk. For those who think that european game is bullshit, just look at theresults of the last Olympics games.

- With Nash out for two games, Diaw had to tripple-doubles.

- Diaw struggled in Atlanta because is coach was a moron. D'antoni knows how to coach Euro-players. Of course Nash help, but whoever your teammates are you don't have 4 tripple-double a year and 13/7/6 statistics if you are a mediocre player.

[Obstructed_View]

Also, by official NBA definition, a "Darrell Armstrong" charge is described as "throwing your body in a backwards motion when little or no contact is involved, often using a shrill yell to draw attention to your action. See Manu Ginobili."
Good luck with that shit, because you are certainly full.

[RonMexico]

You also have to be firmly planted and stationary to draw the charge. Nash was still moving forward BEFORE the contact. So it is a block. And shut the FUCK up with that stephen a smith shit. I was nice and polite before, but your dumb ass has to get fucking personal. I dont like Kobe, but it was not a charge. Get the fuck over it.

The problem with that is: "quite frankly," he wasn't moving... thanks Stephen A.

[FloppinIsGreat]

The problem with that is: "quite frankly," he wasn't moving... thanks Stephen A.
You're wrong. He was moving forward. You have to be SET for the charge if the guy is already in the air. And Kobe was in the air while Nash was moving forward. I respect your convictions, but you are completely wrong here and nothing you say can change that. :lol

[Brutalis]

Nash getting another MVP award is just bullshit.

If people are going to be like that they need to just vote for Kobe or LBJ instead of a dude that can't seem to come up with any answers when a playoffs is over.

[batman2883]

Nash definetly doesnt deserve the mvp award thats horrible shit right there

[Brutalis]

pity is what it is to me.. you don't get far with pity..

[batman2883]

then officials are saying that ben wallace will win the defensive player of the year award again thats bs....damn this shit is fucking ridiculous

[Brutalis]

i won't dog ben wallace because the ugly dude goes out there and does what nobody else hardly can and play defense. all i can say is when popularity out-weighs who deserves it then you have a serious problem. and a welcome to the typical NBA floomat.

[batman2883]

yes its a fucking popularity contest, but even so, im sorry to say it but Kobe Bryant deserves the MVP award more than any other player....this man carried a nobody team to the playoffs.....nash has a real team of players, Nash, Marion, Bell, Diaw, both Thomas', i mean who does kobe have??? exactly it was all just some politcal bullshit or something.....as for as DPY......Bruce clearly beats any other player in the league....Bruce's defense is stealer and consitantly locks down prime time players....this is a freaking travesty

[Brutalis]

I don't like Kobe either but I agree that he is the MVP. Most Valuable Player.

Odom is some flippy flopping trash. Smush Parker is laughable. Brian Cook is slower than corn syrup running uphill, and Kwame is the only bit of future I see in anyone they have. And Kobe truely does it by himself.

Maybe that bastard Phil came back for that reason. To help Kobe and make him a leader among boys?

Whatever the case, if Nash gets MVP I would just assume Duncan could have gotten it too then.

[batman2883]

exactly i have to completely agree with you on that,

[Warlord23]

Look, Kobe is the best individual player in the league. But you look at the guys who play with Nash and look like stars, and try and recall where they were before the joined Nash.

Eddie House was waived by the freaking Bobcats. Tim Thomas was a bum and a cancer; he was D-U-N done for all practical purposes before he got to Phoenix. Diaw was averaging 4 ppg on the lowly Hawks, and is now a triple-double threat.

This team has no serviceable big man left. After Amare went down, their only legitimate "big" in Kurt Thomas got injured. Brian Grant and his knees have been MIA since he was dealt by Miami to LA. They still won 54 games. And before you start over-rating D'Antoni, this was the coach who won a whopping 21 games with Amare, Marion and Joe Johnson. Nash arrived, he won 62 and COY.

Spurs fans have a short memory. We beat the Suns in 5 all right, by shutting down the others; we couldn't stop Nash and Amare on the pick-n-roll. How many easy dunks and layups did Amare get off the pnr? Pop said something to the effect that Nash and Amare made the Stockton and Malone pick-n-roll look like kid stuff.

Yes, he can't play a lick of defense. But has any other team won 54 games in the West with a bunch of SFs and guards: their entire rotation right now is either SFs (Marion, Tim Thomas, Diaw, James Jones) or guards (Nash, Bell, House, Barbosa). He's pulled off something neither Kobe nor LeBron could. Heck, LeBron has a better supporting cast and won 4 games less in the East.

[nkdlunch]

i won't dog ben wallace because the ugly dude goes out there and does what nobody else hardly can and play defense. all i can say is when popularity out-weighs who deserves it then you have a serious problem. and a welcome to the typical NBA floomat.


so you're saying Nash is more popular than Lebron, Kobe, etc???

[Brutalis]

so you're saying Nash is more popular than Lebron, Kobe, etc???
no.. dont go out of context. we're speaking about DPOY.

[nkdlunch]

So NBA did the right thing picking Nash right?

[RonMexico]

Look, Kobe is the best individual player in the league. But you look at the guys who play with Nash and look like stars, and try and recall where they were before the joined Nash.

Eddie House was waived by the freaking Bobcats. Tim Thomas was a bum and a cancer; he was D-U-N done for all practical purposes before he got to Phoenix. Diaw was averaging 4 ppg on the lowly Hawks, and is now a triple-double threat.

This team has no serviceable big man left. After Amare went down, their only legitimate "big" in Kurt Thomas got injured. Brian Grant and his knees have been MIA since he was dealt by Miami to LA. They still won 54 games. And before you start over-rating D'Antoni, this was the coach who won a whopping 21 games with Amare, Marion and Joe Johnson. Nash arrived, he won 62 and COY.

Spurs fans have a short memory. We beat the Suns in 5 all right, by shutting down the others; we couldn't stop Nash and Amare on the pick-n-roll. How many easy dunks and layups did Amare get off the pnr? Pop said something to the effect that Nash and Amare made the Stockton and Malone pick-n-roll look like kid stuff.

Yes, he can't play a lick of defense. But has any other team won 54 games in the West with a bunch of SFs and guards: their entire rotation right now is either SFs (Marion, Tim Thomas, Diaw, James Jones) or guards (Nash, Bell, House, Barbosa). He's pulled off something neither Kobe nor LeBron could. Heck, LeBron has a better supporting cast and won 4 games less in the East.


Great points all around... and the fact that D'Antoni inherited a team mid-season that was already losing a lot and dealing with injuries to Amare's ankle... trying to change a whole philosophy is very difficult with young players, so the addition and leadership of Nash including a fresh start the next season helped the team win 62 games... while also adding some players that would buy into the system

[Warlord23]

And before you jump to the conclusion that Kobe was robbed, just cast your eye over this comparison:

1986-87
Michael Jordan: 37.1 PPG, 5.2 RPG, 4.6 APG, 48.2% FGP, 40 wins did not win the MVP
1988-89
Michael Jordan: 32.5 PPG, 8.0 RPG, 8.0 APG, 54% FGP, 47 wins did not win the MVP.

2005-06
Kobe Bryant: 35.2 PPG, 5.3 RPG, 4.5 APG, 45% FGP, 45 wins, no MVP

What makes you think Kobe was robbed. Michael had a far better year on those two occassions. Guess who he lost to? Magic, whose team won 65 and 57 wins in those 2 years respectively.

For all those who say Kobe's doing it without a good supporting cast: Jordan in 86-87 had Charles Oakley as the 2nd best player on the Bulls. A far cry from Bryant who has Odom. Magic on the other hand was playing with a few gentlemen by the names of Kareem, Worthy, Scott, Cooper, AC Green; each of who was better than Oakley. At least Odom is comparable to Marion, and the Lakers have bigs who are way better than Phoenix's.

Bottomline: history is repeating itself. Jordan's one-man army lost the MVP to Magic and his stacked teams. Kobe is losing it to Nash, who doesn't have that strong a team that Magic had.

[nkdlunch]

wow good point. what were Magic's stats that year?