Throwing the Book at Bryant

[Man In Black]

Some LAL fans told me they know their superstar, but hey- It's like Kobe once said on MTV. "You think you know but you have no idea."

http://www.latimes.com/sports/la-sp-jackson12oct12,1,2817100,print.story?coll=la-home-sports

Throwing the Book at Bryant
In new diary, Jackson paints Laker star as key figure in last season's tumult, says he wanted to trade him.
By J.A. Adande
Times Staff Writer

October 12, 2004

The "unavoidable" conflict between coach Phil Jackson and Kobe Bryant led Jackson to ask the Lakers to trade Bryant in January and hampered the team's shot at the 2004 championship, Jackson wrote in a soon-to-be-released diary of the season.

A 5,500-word excerpt of "The Last Season" will appear in the November issue of Los Angeles magazine, which will hit newsstands Monday. The book, published by Penguin Press, will come out this month. A copy of the magazine excerpt was made available to The Times on Monday.

Although the book is Jackson's personal look at the tumultuous year, Bryant emerges as the central figure.

"I do know that there were many occasions this year when I felt like there was a psychological war going on between us," Jackson wrote. "Amazingly, we came to a truce, even to a higher level of trust. Ultimately, though, I don't believe we developed enough trust between us to win a championship."

Jackson details their deteriorating relationship, marked by Bryant's defiance and Jackson's own budding prejudice against him.

The coach had a January "tirade" about Bryant in front of General Manager Mitch Kupchak in which Jackson demanded the team trade Bryant and said, "I won't coach this team next year if he is still here. He won't listen to anyone. I've had it with this kid."

Jackson also revealed that he wanted to trade Bryant to the Phoenix Suns for Jason Kidd and Shawn Marion during the 1999-2000 season, Jackson's first with the Lakers, but that Jerry West, then the team's general manager, told him owner Jerry Buss would never trade Bryant. Jackson wrote that Kupchak told him the same thing last season.

Jackson suspected that the organization's public announcement in February that it had suspended contract negotiations with him was a means of appealing to Bryant, who became a free agent at the end of the season.

In their final meeting, days after the Lakers lost to the Detroit Pistons in the NBA Finals, he asked Bryant whether Jackson's return would influence his decision to re-sign with the Lakers, "He said I should make up my mind about my future independently of his decision," Jackson wrote.

Jackson told him he was going to retire.

"Really?" Bryant asked, his eyebrows rising.

Then Jackson asked whether Shaquille O'Neal's presence on the team would affect Bryant's decision.

"Yes, it does," Bryant said, according to Jackson.

Jackson told them they could play together, to which Bryant responded, according to Jackson: "There's no doubt about that. I've done that for eight years with him, but I'm tired of being a sidekick."

(Buss said over the summer that his decision to trade O'Neal — he eventually was dealt to Miami for Lamar Odom, Brian Grant and Caron Butler — was made independently of Bryant. Bryant said he had no role in either Jackson's or O'Neal's departures.)

Bryant's relationship with O'Neal — which slid from chilly to frozen — was an unavoidable topic for Jackson as well.

In Jackson's first meeting with Bryant before the season, Bryant said he would hold his ground in the public war of words with O'Neal.

"If he starts saying things in the press, I'll fire back," Bryant said. "I'm not afraid to go up against him. I've had it."

Jackson wrote that after O'Neal and Bryant exchanged shots in the media two days before the start of the season, O'Neal was frustrated at what he perceived as an organizational favoritism toward Bryant and said: "I'd like to pound the chump."

When O'Neal missed practice the day after the All-Star game, Bryant told Jackson: "That just shows you what kind of leader he is."

"He was angry about the allowances the Lakers afford Shaq, failing to note the hypocrisy in his accusation," Jackson wrote. "Nobody this year, or in any year I've coached, has received more 'allowances' than Kobe Bryant. At times the pettiness between the two of them can be unbelievably juvenile."

Jackson and O'Neal had their own squabbles, but Jackson called coaching O'Neal "an experience I will cherish forever."

He didn't use those words for Bryant.

Among the "allowances" the organization made for Bryant was to pay part of the expense of Bryant's taking private jets to and from Colorado for hearings in his sexual assault case. Jackson wrote, "Kobe was unhappy with the type of plane that was selected; he wanted one with higher status. He should feel fortunate that he's not footing the bill himself."

Jackson thought Bryant was disrespectful during the season, whether mocking him or flat-out defying orders. An incident when Bryant told Jackson he would do some running, then didn't follow through, set off Jackson's January trade demand.

But another incident showed Jackson how much of the battle was his own doing. In March, Bryant was late for a bus to the airport, by Jackson's reckoning. Bryant insisted he was on time and Jackson should "get with the rest of the world" and synchronize his watch. Jackson later checked with a trainer and discovered that Bryant was right; Jackson's watch was three minutes fast.

"The incident illustrated to me how conditioned I am to find fault with this kid, after everything I've gone through with him," Jackson wrote. "I suppose the anger is deeper than I imagined."

Jackson had reached the conclusion before the season that "a major confrontation between the two of us seems unavoidable."

It prompted Jackson to hire a therapist "who has dealt with narcissistic behavior in the Los Angeles public school system" to consult during the season.

Jackson wrote that he knew he would be out of a job after he took the me-or-him stance with Bryant, and deep down inside it was what he wanted after the usual rigors of the NBA season and the unusual drama on "this dysfunctional team." That decision was confirmed in his final meeting with Buss, when he was told the team wanted to scale back and would go in a direction that didn't involve Jackson as coach.

[Boomhauer]

BoyThatBlackBastardBetterNotDoTimeITellYouWhatILik etHatMotherFockerYesSir...

[timvp]

No surprises. Bryant is a punk b!tch.

[Boomhauer]

yousaythatnowthathedidntsignwiththespursyouknowheg otzskillsyouknowwhatimean?

[baseline bum]

Bryant and Jackson deserved each other. Who would have thought the 2 biggest assholes in the league couldn't play nice together?

[AlamoSpursFan]

O'Neal was frustrated at what he perceived as an organizational favoritism toward Bryant and said: "I'd like to pound the chump."


Damn...I never thought I'd actually like Shaq...

:lol

[missmyzte]

Good riddance to Shaq and PJ. I'm so sick of the blatant media-bias against Kobe, talk about a guy who can do nothing right. He takes a lot of shots and he's a ball hog, he doesn't shoot and he's throwing the game. He responds to Shaq's insults and he's a child, he doesn't respond and he's anti-social. He doesn't have any tattoos and he has no street cred, he gets a tattoo (with butterflies??) and he's trying too hard. He works hard to improve his game and he's trying to show up Shaq, he doesn't work as hard and Shaq is the better player.

We're talking about a guy who is socially stunted, he was raised in a black-hole of Kobe worship and basketball. That's all he knows. He's never been on the police blotter before, never been interrogated before, he freaked out. That's human nature, give the guy a freaking break. I don't know what I'd do if the police came knocking on my door hours after I'd had surgery.

He wants to do well, he wants to lead the team and show what kind of player he can be but all the media can write is negative. For once I'd like to see a writer admit that Shaq is a spoiled baby and that LA is better for his absense.

[Useruser666]

AHF, I'm sure he meant that in a non-Colorado way.

[picnroll]

We're talking about a guy who is socially stunted

And this is your leader. Good luck.

[Useruser666]

missmyzte,

I agree Shaq is a giant man-child. I however, 100% believe Kobe Bryant is a super sized tool. He has an enormous ego and that more than anything is what drives him. You are worshipping a golden goat. If he were a Spur I would be him at every game I went to. That is if I would go to a game if he were a Spur. I don't wish the Lakers fans ill will, but I hope any team that Kobe Bryant is a part of fails. Then and only then will he learn humility and to respect everyone not named Bean. Some greatly talented athletes waste away their lives with drugs, others in the judicial system, Kobe squanders his in his self-absorption.

[timvp]

Who was the Laker fan who was saying that Phil was going to say in his book that Shaq was the real problem and not Kobe?

Don't make me hit the search button. :hat

[HollywoodKobe]

Everyone is at fault here. Kobe was sick of Shaq for being fat, ragging on him in the media and not being a good leader. He was sick of the ZenMaser for allowing the team to conduct itself in such a lackadasical manner every season. Kobe is a perfectionist. Shaq tries to do just enough. Kobe is a hard worker. Shaq is a lazy-ass.

Yes, Kobe can be a spoiled, punk-ass, selfish kid, but there's plenty of blame to go around. I think Kobe will be a better team leader than Shaq ever was. We will never again say the Lakers are underchieving. We'll never again say the Lakers just didn't show up. Kobe will demand perfecton and hard work. He will install a competitive spirit in the entire team - something he could never do while Shaq was around.

There's probably nothing in this book we already didn't know besides a few details of what we all suspected anyway. All three are responsible. All 3 are immature.

[Duff McCartney]

Kobe is a perfectionist. Shaq tries to do just enough. Kobe is a hard worker. Shaq is a lazy-ass.

It's amazing how Kobe can be a perfectionist and hard worker, yet he lets the team down in Sactown and decides not to shoot the ball.

[exstatic]

He gave his press conference at Staples with our blessing, and we have agreed -- once we attained permission from the league to make sure the funds wouldn't be applied to the salary cap -- to cover a percentage of his private plane expenses to and from Colorado for court hearings. This will cost thousands of dollars. Kobe was unhappy with the type of plane that was selected; he wanted one with higher status.

Punk. Ungrateful punk.

[Useruser666]

Kobe is a hard worker when it suits him or makes him look good. Yes all of the big three are egotistical asses, but you prove yourself the biggest one when you have the other two shipped out. It's like king of the ass hill. He could have found more glory by making that Lakers team more succesful, instead he has taken the route of seeking personal fame. When Kobe was called upon to be the bigger man, the little boy in him shown through.

[Shelly]

Popdamn! I can't wait for the Heat/Laker matchup!

[timvp]

Now that Shaq isn't in LA to put the fear of God in Kobe, what is going to stop him from totally giving up on the team after a couple losses? It's classic to me that Laker Fans think they have Kobe pegged and know how he is going to succeed. No one knows if Kobe is a raging rapist or a misunderstood saint.

[picnroll]

Seriously Lakers fans doesn't it make you just a little bit nervous that the future of the franchise you love is in the hands of this guy?

[jcrod]

Good riddance to Shaq and PJ. I'm so sick of the blatant media-bias against Kobe, talk about a guy who can do nothing right. He takes a lot of shots and he's a ball hog, he doesn't shoot and he's throwing the game. He responds to Shaq's insults and he's a child, he doesn't respond and he's anti-social. He doesn't have any tattoos and he has no street cred, he gets a tattoo (with butterflies??) and he's trying too hard. He works hard to improve his game and he's trying to show up Shaq, he doesn't work as hard and Shaq is the better player.

We're talking about a guy who is socially stunted, he was raised in a black-hole of Kobe worship and basketball. That's all he knows. He's never been on the police blotter before, never been interrogated before, he freaked out. That's human nature, give the guy a freaking break. I don't know what I'd do if the police came knocking on my door hours after I'd had surgery.

He wants to do well, he wants to lead the team and show what kind of player he can be but all the media can write is negative. For once I'd like to see a writer admit that Shaq is a spoiled baby and that LA is better for his absense.


I agree, people tend to fault Kobe more than PJ and Shaq. All three should be blamed. I for one have less hatered towards the Lakers now that PJ and Shaq aren't there.

Kobe is the one that made the Lakers dangerous and unstopable. Kobe is the one that prevented the Spurs from having more rings. If he wins more titles before he retires he is easily one of the top 3-5 players of all times.

[Man In Black]

We will never again say the Lakers are underchieving.

You can say that IF you are one of those LAL fans who feel that MEDIOCRITY is acceptable.
Most people are saying that with the team you have right now, you have literally no chance, barring injuries to other team's key players, to win the titles. The playoffs are no longer a certainty.

:fro

[Supergirl]

Among the "allowances" the organization made for Bryant was to pay part of the expense of Bryant's taking private jets to and from Colorado for hearings in his sexual assault case. Jackson wrote, "Kobe was unhappy with the type of plane that was selected; he wanted one with higher status. He should feel fortunate that he's not footing the bill himself."

This is unbelievable. I don't see how this is allowed in the NBA. THe team has to pay for Kobe to attend to the legal trouble he got himself into? Would the Blazers ever be expected, or condoned, if they paid for Zach Randolph or Damon Stoudamire to attend to a possession or drunk driving (or witnessing a murder) trial?

These guys make millions of dollars a year, there is no reason why they can't foot the bill for every and any expense outside of the 82 + games they are contracted to play.

Shaq has never struck me as being lazy or a chump. The man is a freak of nature, physically, and every day he is alive on this planet is hard on his body. Kobe is not a perfectionist, he is a spoiled brat who got dumped with all he ever wanted at the age of 18, and turned it into entitlement. He doesn't see any reason why he shouldn't get anything from anyone - whether it's attention, the final shot, sex, or whatever else.

I worry that Lebron will wind up in the same place, given where he's starting. Have all straight-from-high school players turned out like Kobe, to some degree? Who are the others? KG, Lebron, Jermaine O'Neal, Tony Parker...I guess it's not inevitable. It probably depends on what sort of character and family your come from before you get to the NBA.

[Medvedenko]

Easy there.....Kobe will be fine.
I like both Phil and Shaq, however the team was designed in Shaq's image and now it's formulated to enhance Kobe's skills. Only time will tell how this will all work out. Yes, Kobe's a bitch for "naming names"... now Phil is releasing his book right before the season to sell, clearly a marketing push..."naming names" all three are bitches in my book...(which will come out in 2006: "Slava, the man, the myth, the legend: Chronicles of Instant Offense"
Seriously, this is great for the NBA...It's too bad that Kobe hasn't got a fair shake, but I believe it's his on doing most of the time....Oh and if I have to hear Kobe tanked the game in Sac I'm going to puke. I watched that game and he was unselfish and tried to run the O and go through Shaq....balls to say he tanked the game. He shoots too much and he's a ball hog, and he plays withing the offence and he's tanking. Whatever.

[HollywoodKobe]

Hey Medvedenko, Did you see this? It's from SI.com. More excerpts from the book. Kobe likes you.

This afternoon I did something I almost never do. When Shaquille and Rick [Fox] stepped off the bus at our hotel in Coconut Grove, an upscale Miami suburb, I asked them to enter my suite for a brief chat. From the puzzled expressions on their faces, I could tell they were extremely curious, perhaps alarmed. I believe the time on the road between practice and the tip-off is almost sacred; the players should be allowed to prepare in their own ways for the challenge awaiting them. But this time I was facing my own challenge, and it had nothing to do with the Miami Heat. Recognizing that my relationship with Kobe was becoming more acrimonious by the day, I decided that a conversation with Shaq and Fox could not wait any longer. At practice the day before Kobe, who told [trainer Gary] Vitti that his finger hadn't healed sufficiently for him to play in the Miami game, was taking a few shots left-handed when I asked him not to be a distraction. I needed to work with the players who would be suiting up. "Distraction," he said, mockingly, unable to resist taking one more shot. A few hours later, during dinner in Key Biscayne with the staff, Vitti told us that Kobe has been threatening again to opt out of his contract, vowing "to take Slava [Medvedenko] with me." Slava? Was this an indication of Kobe's being totally out of touch with reality? If Kobe was interested in taking along a player who would defer to him, Slava Medvedenko was the worst choice imaginable. He hasn't passed up a shot since November.

[ShoogarBear]

Excerpt from PhilJax book on SI.com (http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2004/basketball/nba/10/12/jackson/index.html)

Can't wait to see the Kobe-lovers put a spin on this . . .



Balancing act
Excerpt: Bryant's trial, attitude took toll on Jackson, Lakers
Posted: Tuesday October 12, 2004 11:46AM; Updated: Tuesday October 12, 2004 1:06PM

In the following excerpt from Phil Jackson's upcoming book, The Last Season (published this fall by Penguin Press), the former Lakers coach describes the difficulties in trying to manage an increasingly petulant Kobe Bryant while trying to keep the Lakers focused on the season at hand, and not themselves.

AUGUST 26

Los Angeles

In the first six weeks after the Colorado story broke, I did not speak to Kobe [Bryant]. I called for a third and final time from Montana, but again the machine answered. He never returned my calls. Imagining the anxieties in his new life, I was not offended. Kobe will confide only with the people he trusts, and I certainly have never been a card-carrying member of that group. Mitch [Kupchak] and I wondered whether Kobe, as some people have suggested, might elect to sit out the entire season. We also talked about perhaps offering him a leave of absence. No professional athlete, I believe, has ever tried to perform at the top level of his sport for any extended length of time while fighting to keep his freedom. We didn't wonder for too long: we recently received word from Kobe's people that he intended to treat the upcoming season like any other. He must be in denial. This season, if nothing else, cannot possibly be like any other.

Finally, earlier this week, Kobe came into my office at our training facility in El Segundo. He looked weak and gaunt, down to maybe a little more than two hundred pounds, ten or fifteen less than his standard playing weight. Most NBA players participate in pick-up games during the off-season and work out daily to maintain the conditioning they'll need to compete in top form. Many use the time to develop another move or facet of their game, something, anything, to provide them with an edge over their opponents. Kobe has been playing basketball since he was three years old. He loves the game more than anything else. To realize that he hadn't been doing much physically was quite a shock.

"We really want you to survive this thing," I told him.

He smiled.

"Are you getting any help?" I asked. "Do you have anybody to talk to?"

"No."

"Kobe, you've got to have someone to talk to."

"We have a minister."

"That's a start."

We didn't rehash our old conflicts. We were here to talk about this year, this team, and the necessary adjustments to make this coming season successful. We didn't go over his case. We discussed how he was recuperating from the injuries to his knee and shoulder. The conversation was fairly harmless. Until out of nowhere it became anything but harmless.

"I'm not going to take any s--- from Shaq[uille O'Neal] this year," Kobe blurted out. "If he starts saying things in the press, I'll fire back. I'm not afraid to go up against him. I've had it."

I tried to calm him down as quickly as possible. "Kobe, we'll watch what's being said," I assured him. "We'll make allowances this year so you'll be able to do what you have to do and then come back to the team. Don't worry. We're hoping for the best."

I looked him right in the eye and gave him a hug. No matter what had gone on between us in the past, he is a member of the Laker family, and families stick together in difficult times. I was sure that at least for the moment, the anger he flashed toward Shaquille was neutralized. After we wrapped up, Kobe headed straight to see Mitch, who later informed me that nothing had been neutralized.

"Shaq didn't call me this summer," Kobe told Mitch.

"Kobe, I gave you a message from him," Mitch responded. "He invited you to Orlando to get away from everything."

"Shaq didn't have to leave a message through you," he said. "He knew how to reach me."

The exchange with Mitch revealed the underlying contradiction in Kobe's attitude toward Shaquille, a symbol, in fact, of a much broader dichotomy in his psyche. On the one hand, he insists that he doesn't "give a shit what the big guy does," but on the other, he shows he cares a great deal about what the big guy does. The meeting with Kobe reinforced an idea I had been contemplating since July, since Colorado, since everything changed. I decided to enlist a therapist to help me cope with what will surely be the most turbulent season of my coaching career. After receiving a few recommendations, I selected a therapist who has dealt with narcissistic behavior in the Los Angeles public school system. He'll be right at home here.

OCTOBER 21

Los Angeles

I wonder what Kobe is thinking. Yesterday he reiterated his intention to opt out of his contract and become an unrestricted free agent at the end of the season. I would never oppose a player's desire to explore his true market value -- if only the players in my era had been granted a similar freedom -- but I do question his sense of timing. Since the charges were made, Kobe has been treated remarkably well by the Lakers organization and the fans. He gave his press conference at Staples with our blessing, and we have agreed -- once we attained permission from the league to make sure the funds wouldn't be applied to the salary cap -- to cover a percentage of his private plane expenses to and from Colorado for court hearings. This will cost thousands of dollars. Kobe was unhappy with the type of plane that was selected; he wanted one with higher status.

OCTOBER 28

Los Angeles

After going 3-5 during the exhibition season we started serious preparations a few days ago for, at long last, tonight's opener at Staples against the Dallas Mavericks. While we put together probably only one decent half in eight games, this is a veteran group that will know how to perform when everything matters. This being the Lakers, the longest-running soap opera in professional sports, there has been plenty of intrigue off the court over the last seventy-two hours. The stars of the newest episode? Why, Kobe Bryant and Shaquille O'Neal, of course. Their most recent feud had taken place in early 2001. After a two-year hiatus, the duo have reunited -- wrong word, I suppose -- for a sequel. I heard the news while checking out video of the Mavericks, trying to devise a game plan to disrupt their highly explosive attack. There was a knock at the door. Kobe walked in, anxious to talk about another highly explosive attack.

"He popped off," Kobe said. I did not have to ask who "he" was.

"You're kidding me," I said. "What did he say?"

"Did you read the paper? It's in the paper," he said.

It was in the paper, all right, Shaq suggesting that for the Lakers to be successful this season, Kobe, who played in only two exhibition contests, needed to rely more on his teammates until he regained his full strength.

"Is this what you're talking about?" I asked Kobe.

"Yeah," he said.

"Kobe, what's wrong with this?" I said. "Shaq is right. This is exactly what we want you to do." ....

But the anger did not disappear. After practice, Kobe fired back at Shaquille, through the press, exactly as he promised he would in August. "I definitely don't need advice on how to play my game," he said. "I know how to play my guard spot. He can worry about the low post." The war was on.

"He doesn't need advice on how to play his position," Shaquille said, "but he needs advice on how to play team ball. If it's going to be my team, I'll voice my opinion. If he don't like it, he can opt out."

On and on it went, the two protagonists in top form. Why don't the two get along? I have my theories, one of which is that Shaquille is making the type of money -- about $25 million a year -- that Kobe will never earn due to the changes in the league's collective bargaining agreement. No matter how many MVP trophies Kobe might collect in the decade ahead, there is nothing he can do about this discrepancy. In fact, the word I got was that Kobe was the only player in the entire league who voted against the agreement because of the cap it put on salaries.

The newspapers, needless to say, have treated the Kobe-Shaq feud as if it were the second coming of Cain versus Abel. IT'S THE RETURN OF STAR WARS was the headline in the [Los Angeles] Times. The story was destined to last for days and days, every basketball reporter in the city, maybe the nation, on a scavenger hunt for the next insult or innuendo to filter through the grapevine. There was only so much the Lakers could do to try to tame the beast, and whatever we were going to do, we had to act fast. I placed a call to the therapist. "Get them apart," he recommended. "Tell them that what they're saying about each other is not doing anybody any good." He mentioned a psychological term for this damage-control strategy: suppression. I took Shaq aside, and Mitch found Kobe.

"We can't have this," I told Shaq. "This isn't right. We're on a mission, and we want nothing more in the press." Shaq was not in the mood to suppress anything. "Phil, I have a stepbrother," he explained, "and when I was young, I was the outcast. Everything I did was wrong and everything he did was okay even though he did stuff that I could never get away with. If I tried to do it, they would have beaten the heck out of me. It's the same situation with Kobe. He ends up getting an operation from some doctor, who knows where, and I end up getting an operation and I'm the one criticized for it. I end up looking like crap in this thing, and he can do whatever he wants. I'd like to pound the chump." I empathized with Shaq but I told him the team needed to put the feud behind it as soon as possible. He agreed to keep quiet. This was another example of the basic difference between him and Kobe. Ask Shaq to do something and he'll say: "No, I don't want to do that." But after a little pouting, he will do it. Ask Kobe, and he'll say, "okay," and then he will do whatever he wants. Against our instructions, Kobe did an interview with ESPN, vowing that if he were to leave the Lakers at the end of the season, it would be due to Shaq's "childlike selfishness and jealousy." So much for suppression.

JANUARY 31

On the subject of losing Kobe, I wonder once again whether our relationship has deteriorated beyond repair. Earlier this week at El Segundo there was an incident at practice. On the way to the court, I asked Kobe, still nursing a sore shoulder, if he was up to doing a little running. Sure, he responded, as soon as he finished his treatment. Almost an hour went by, and there was no Kobe sighting. Finally, with an ice pack on his shoulder, he took a seat on the sideline. It began to dawn on me that contrary to what he had told me, Kobe had no intention of running. After practice I followed Kobe to the training room, asking him why he lied to me. He was being sarcastic, he said. Wrong answer. I wasn't in the mood. Believe me, I can't begin to imagine how difficult this whole ordeal has been for Kobe, but that doesn't mean I will allow myself to be the recipient of his displaced anger, especially when I've been firmly on his side since the Colorado story broke.

Now I was the one who was angry. I went upstairs to see Mitch in his office. Wasting no time, I went off on a tirade about the need to deal Kobe before the trading deadline in mid-February. "I won't coach this team next year if he is still here," I said emphatically. "He won't listen to anyone. I've had it with this kid."

FEBRUARY 10

Miami

This afternoon I did something I almost never do. When Shaquille and Rick [Fox] stepped off the bus at our hotel in Coconut Grove, an upscale Miami suburb, I asked them to enter my suite for a brief chat. From the puzzled expressions on their faces, I could tell they were extremely curious, perhaps alarmed. I believe the time on the road between practice and the tip-off is almost sacred; the players should be allowed to prepare in their own ways for the challenge awaiting them. But this time I was facing my own challenge, and it had nothing to do with the Miami Heat. Recognizing that my relationship with Kobe was becoming more acrimonious by the day, I decided that a conversation with Shaq and Fox could not wait any longer. At practice the day before Kobe, who told [trainer Gary] Vitti that his finger hadn't healed sufficiently for him to play in the Miami game, was taking a few shots left-handed when I asked him not to be a distraction. I needed to work with the players who would be suiting up. "Distraction," he said, mockingly, unable to resist taking one more shot. A few hours later, during dinner in Key Biscayne with the staff, Vitti told us that Kobe has been threatening again to opt out of his contract, vowing "to take Slava [Medvedenko] with me." Slava? Was this an indication of Kobe's being totally out of touch with reality? If Kobe was interested in taking along a player who would defer to him, Slava Medvedenko was the worst choice imaginable. He hasn't passed up a shot since November.

Shaq and Rick took a seat in my room. Inviting Rick, I felt, would keep the discussion at a high level. I got right to the point. "What would you guys think if I were to offer Kobe a leave of absence?" They wasted no time, either. Kobe, they promised, would contribute to the team in a positive manner once he recovered from his finger injury. I was gratified to note the genuine sense of compassion, especially coming from Kobe's supposed enemy, Shaquille. The press, I have long believed, with its sensationalistic, insult-to-insult coverage, has captured only one component in a rather complicated relationship between two proud, if emotionally fragile, superstars. Shaq and Kobe will never be buddies, but they remain linked together by a common goal, perhaps destiny, each aware that they can't win championships here without the other. With Rick and Shaquille opposed, along with Mitch, I filed the leave of absence idea away for good. "What happens if he won't accept it?" Mitch asked. In that case, I replied, I would tell Kobe that we would suspend him with pay regardless, but for PR purposes call it a "leave of absence." The choice would belong to him. I knew precisely what I would say: "Kobe, you're not a positive element with the team anymore. You can't have these kind of anger situations in front of your teammates because it's destructive to the balance that has to be maintained."

FEBRUARY 16

A conversation with Kobe often reveals one of his many narcissistic tendencies. After I told him I believed he and Shaquille have proven they can play effectively together, he brought up Sunday's All-Star game, captured by the Western Conference squad 136--132. Shaq led the way with twenty-four points and eleven rebounds. "I got Shaq the most valuable player award last night," Kobe said. "I know how to make Shaq the best player on the floor." No doubt he was right. Nobody, when he is committed, can deliver the ball to Shaq more consistently, in a better spot, than Kobe. Yet if I were to acknowledge this point, I would betray Shaquille and arm Kobe with ammunition he might later exploit for their one-on-one battle that although camouflaged, always simmers under the surface. Kobe then expressed his disapproval of Shaquille's failure to show up for practice today. "That just shows you what kind of a leader he is," he said. "The conversation is about you and me, not Shaq," I said. He was angry about the allowances the Lakers afford Shaq, failing to note the hypocrisy in his accusation. Nobody this year, or in any year I've coached, has received more "allowances" than Kobe Bryant. At times the pettiness between the two of them can be unbelievably juvenile. Shaquille won't allow himself to be taped before a game by Gary Vitti because he's too aligned with Kobe. Kobe won't let Chip Schaefer, Shaq's guy, tape him. Reporters aren't immune from these territorial disputes. If a writer lingers too often around one superstar's locker, he is likely to be shut out by the other.

APRIL 13

Los Angeles

With the playoffs less than a week away, we need to be coming together. Instead, we're coming apart. At the center of the latest turmoil is -- who else? --Kobe. This time, in a strange twist, he's being crucified for taking too few shots: only one, unbelievably enough, in the first half of Sunday's game in Sacramento, which we lost by seventeen points, ruining, in all likelihood, any chance to win our division. He finished with eight points, his lowest total ever in a game in which he played at least forty minutes. The theory being tossed around is that Kobe, stung by criticism for his shot selection in recent games, decided to show the Lakers how stagnant the offense can become when he doesn't assert himself. "I don't know how we can forgive him," one anonymous teammate was quoted as saying in today's Times.

Today at practice, Kobe went from player to player, shoving the article with the anonymous quote in their faces. I have rarely seen him that incensed. "Did you say this?" he demanded of each player. Later, during a team gathering, he pursued the interrogation. "Right here and right now," he said, raising his voice, "I want to know who said this shit."

Nobody said a word, until Karl finally broke the silence. "Obviously, Kobe, no one said it or no one wants to admit they said it," Karl said. "You've just got to let it go now." Karl and Kobe, who have become buddies, launched into a shouting match that I had to stop.

"We have to get over these types of things," I told the guys. "You can't be playing as a team if you're going to be harboring sentiments that aren't good toward each other." Desperate measures, I'm beginning to think, might be in order. Maybe we'll return to meditation, something, anything, to improve our karma.

"Are you feeling like you're going to come back next year?" Jeanie [Buss] asked me.

"Well, not if Kobe Bryant is on this team next year," I told her. "He's too complex a person. I don't need this."

JUNE 18

Los Angeles

This was one day I will certainly never forget. In the morning I met with Kobe. In the afternoon I saw [Lakers owner] Dr. [Jerry] Buss. By the evening I no longer had a job. I was not surprised in the least, yet the end of any journey is always jarring. Once again I will need time to reflect. Kobe arrived in El Segundo with his agent, Rob Pelinka. Before the formal exit interview with Mitch, who was still meeting with [Derek Fish[er], I invited them into my office. I couldn't help but think of my meeting with Kobe back in February on the day after the All-Star game, when I was trying to salvage a relationship and a season. There was great tension, yet in a sense Jeanie right. Kobe and I did work well together -- for four months, that is. This time the same tension between us wasn't there. We both knew I would never coach him again.

While waiting for Mitch, we discussed Kobe's upcoming court appearance in Eagle County.

"Is the trial going to interfere with your free agency?" I asked.

"I don't know," he said. "The date hasn't been set yet."

"If it's set in July, will you be able to work around this?"

"Yeah, I'd have meetings on the weekends."

"How long will the trial last?"

"Anywhere from one to three weeks."

"Is there still a chance that there won't be a trial?"

"Yeah, there's a chance but either way, it doesn't matter. The outcome will be the same."

Just then Mitch came in. The chat was over. It was time for the official meeting. Mitch, Kobe, and I moved to the conference room.

I started by casually asking Kobe who called him on his cell moments before we left the locker room for Game 5. It was Brian Shaw, he said, a former teammate and part of our organization. "He told me to get after Gary [Payton], to make sure he was fired up." The advice, it turned out, was sound, but answering the call wasn't appropriate.

I then told Kobe how pleased I was with his ability to put aside our conflicts after the meeting in February, and make a strong commitment to the rest of the season. Mitch didn't waste the opportunity to praise Kobe's remarkable performances. The next subject was his decision to become a free agent, which killed a minute or two. I then got down to the questions I really wanted to ask.

"Will my presence or absence have anything to do with your desire to play for the Lakers?" I asked.

He looked puzzled. I rephrased the question. "Would my being with the Lakers or retiring have any influence on your desire to remain with the Lakers?"

He said I should make up my mind about my future independently of his decision.

"I'm going to retire," I said.

He raised his eyebrows. For the first time in the entire conversation, I thought I detected a little emotion.

"Really?" he asked.

I nodded. The next subject was Shaquille. "Will Shaq's presence on this team color your decision to come back or not?" I asked him.

"Yes, it does," he said.

"There's no doubt about that," he said. "I've done that for eight years with him, but I'm tired of being a sidekick." His sentiment came as no surprise, obviously. In the last few years the entire city of Los Angeles has heard many times from many "sources" that Kobe was no longer willing to play a subservient role to Shaquille. But to hear it in the words of the only source that matters, to hear Kobe say "sidekick," really struck me. I told Kobe I hoped he would find happiness in basketball and in his life, and that his family would remain intact after everything that had transpired in the last year. The meeting was over.

I understand why the Lakers treat Kobe as their most valuable asset. The kid will be twenty-six in August. His ability to take over a game, to make an impossible play, is unmatched. Yet it needs to be remembered that Kobe is still an employee, and that he needs direction and guidance in a way that helps him mature into the kind of adult we hope he can be. Kobe is missing out by not finding a way to become part of a system that involves giving to something larger than himself. He could have been the heir apparent to [Michael Jordan] and maybe won as many championships. He may still win a championship or two, but the boyish hero image has been replaced by that of a callous gun for hire.

[Kori Ellis]

We're talking about a guy who is socially stunted, he was raised in a black-hole of Kobe worship and basketball. That's all he knows. He's never been on the police blotter before, never been interrogated before, he freaked out. That's human nature, give the guy a freaking break. I don't know what I'd do if the police came knocking on my door hours after I'd had surgery.

Well maybe poor innocent, socially-stunted Kobe should just try not fucking other women other than his wife. That might cut down on the "false" rape charges.

[Medvedenko]

Well maybe poor innocent, socially-stunted Kobe should just try not fucking other women other than his wife. That might cut down on the "false" rape charges.

I agree with Kori...and I'm going to get Phil's book..."Kobe's a little whiney bitch" wawaawa...
I'm sick of it....At this point I'm sticking with my boys Kobe and Slava.

[Useruser666]

Uhhhhhh......WOW!

My Comments on that:

#1
"Is there still a chance that there won't be a trial?"
"Yeah, there's a chance but either way, it doesn't matter. The outcome will be the same."

How would Kobe know the outcome will be the same? Of course he could be innocent, but that's an odd statement to make even before it was determined to be there would be a trial or not. Maybe his legal team has been planning out the entire thing from the get go. Let it go to trial, have the victim drop out, and then just settle with her in a civil case to make everything go away. Maybe that's why he knew the outcome.

#2 Kobe is an ass.

#3 I think everyone who hates Karl Malone will have to love the shouting match between him and Kobe.

[Useruser666]

LOL Kori such anger! :wtf :bang :flipoff :pctoss

Slava, you are the third hoodlum from the right, in a gang, in one of those "Death Wish" movies!

[Useruser666]

He's never been on the police blotter before, never been interrogated before, he freaked out. That's human nature, give the guy a freaking break. I don't know what I'd do if the police came knocking on my door hours after I'd had surgery.

He wouldn't know what to do hours after surgery? He would go have sex with the first woman he saw that wasn't his wife. I wonder if he called her between the time he had the surgery and the time he had sex with the girl?

[Kori Ellis]

LOL Kori such anger!

My viewpoint on the Kobe situation is this ... I actually used to like Kobe a lot more than Shaq. I always thought Kobe was more mature and handled things better than Shaq did. And then this whole rape thing hit the press. I'm not saying I think Kobe raped her (though he might have) but let's just say he didn't.

Here you are, a guy who just banged a girl for fun (and didn't even finish mind you) and OMG, someone is accusing you of rape!

When Kobe was being interrogated, he should have been concerned about the false accusations, he should have been concerned about his wife finding out, he should have been concerned about his NBA career, his endorsements, etc. But he should NOT have been concerned about Shaquille O'Neal. To bring up Shaq to the police is nuts. And it makes you realize how much Shaq is in Kobe's head. In this time of crisis, he took time out to make sure they knew that Shaq did it too? :wtf

And another thing, if you are an NBA player and you choose to fuck women other your wife (and yes I understand that a majority of them might do it) -- you need to understand the risk and the consequences. You need to understand that some girls who you bang are going to tell all their friends, most will want money from you, some will harrass you, some will tell your wife .. and yes, some might even accuse you of rape. But you know what -- that's on you. You choose to put your dick inside another woman, so those are the consequences. If you don't like it, then don't do it.

[HollywoodKobe]

Yes, Phil is a scumbag. Way to sell out your former players for more money ZenMaster. I'm sure you'll have no problem getting players to level with you on your next team when they know you're writing every word down for you next best seller.

[bigzak25]

i'm having more and more respect for shaq....weird.

kobe was crying that shaq didn't give him a call? even after kobes himself sold shaq out to the cops with his statements....poor baby....

oh well....the christmas game is definitely MUST SEE TV....

Jackson comes off as a bitch in all this as well.....all about the money....selling out his former player for the cash.....maybe it's his way of getting the last laugh....

[Kori Ellis]

That's the next thing that I was going to say Hollywood. It's shocking and kind of sickening that Phil is revealing such conversations and details. If someone keeps a journal, I always think of that as just something personal. For this kind of stuff to be exposed in the press sucks.




















But I don't mind reading it. :)

[Useruser666]

Disregard any posts in this thread from any poster with "Kobe", "Medvedenko", "Laker", or any other Laker player's name in his username.

[samikeyp]

Here is to all three of them rotting in hell. :drunk

[ShoogarBear]

I just noticed . . . Phil's book is being published by Penguin Press.

The same people who, like, publish the foo-foo Thomas Hardy and Herman Hesse stuff.

No doubt Phil considers himself in the same league . . .

[Useruser666]

I thought they only published kids books? Shaq?

[jalbre6]

God, I still don't understand all this. Kobe and Shaq were paid beaucoup dollars to play basketball. With each other, in Los Angeles. And when they played together, they won three fucking rings.

I work with people I can't stand every fucking day. Some, if not most, are very good at what they do. Virtually all of them, if they weren't there, would make my job more difficult. So I put up with them, knowing that if I want more recognition, or money, or authority, they need to excel at what they do best as well.

And Kobe, you dumbass, you're about to find out how much more difficult your job is going to be with Brian Grant or Vlade Divac playing the 5, and not employee #34.

[HollywoodKobe]

But I don't mind reading it

Yes, it was riveting. I might have to buy the book. There wasn't anything shocking like I said, but there's something about actually reading what you always suspected.

Kobe should write a book.

[ShoogarBear]

How Shaq, Phil, and Vanessa Got Three Rings, by Kobe Bryant. New York: Cheathum Press, 2005.

(Acknowledgment to whoever first came up with the "Vanessa + 3 rings line" in another thread.)

[1Parker1]

All 3 are at fault. That's all there is to it. I guess Kobe just makes for the easiest target out of the three

1) Kobe: For commiting adultry and bringing Shaq into the mess and for being such high maintainance

2) Shaq: For being an overgrown baby. I think Shaq secretly likes this whole, twisted soap opera he has going with kobe. He should just be the bigger man and realize he doesn't always have to go to the media to retailiate to Kobe's remarks. Kobe's actions speak for themselves.

3) Phil Jackson: What kind of coach goes out and writes a tell all book on a team he has coached for 8 years (or however many he was in LA)? Phil is just being a drama queen and in typical LA fashion trying to make a little extra cash.

I, for one, and sick and tired of all this Kobe/Shaq/PJ drama. I thought that once the trial ended, that would be the end. But now that there's not trial, there's all this drama about Kobe's lifestyle and the verbal bashing between Shaq and Kobe. All I can say to them is GROW UP !! They make a million dollars a season to play basketball, not star in a soap opera. The drama was interesting in the begining, but now it is just getting played out !!

To Kobe, Shaq, and Phil...... :flipoff

[samikeyp]

personally, I was hoping the Shaq to South Beach deal would end the whole soap opera...guess I was wrong.

[Iron Giant]

No doubt Phil's a bit resentful--afterall, Kobe likely cost him his job. That being said, I don't doubt that Phil anticipates that Kobe and Shaq will be telling their own tales eventually (so he determined to put his out first). A violation of team trust? Maybe....but we're talking about the coach of two players who continuously went to the press despite admonition--much to the detriment of the team. The difference seems to me that Phil chose to show his knife in public, where Kobe did him behind closed doors (and mostly for the purposes of serving his own wounded "sidekick" ego). Whatever the truth is, I can't say that I feel much pity for any of them.

Speaking of sidekicks...who the hell cares about such tripe when you've got three rings? I can appreciate Kobe for his skill, but there are a host of players I'd rather see play for my team.

[SequSpur]

Kobe is a rapist. Lakers suck. Laker fans are stupid. Missmyty is blind and the Spurs will win the Championship this year.

Blow me.

[missmyzte]

Well maybe poor innocent, socially-stunted Kobe should just try not fucking other women other than his wife. That might cut down on the "false" rape charges.

You think he's the only one? He was just too social-dumb to know to stay away from this girl. Just because he's got something on the side doesn't mean that in the final seconds I wouldn't want the ball in his hands with the game on the line. Everything the Phil wrote is nothing new, just adding in details of what Lakers fans have known for a long time. I feel sorry for Kobe that he was raised the way he was, so isolated. Maybe I understand a little because I was very isolated growing up but I had a mentor to teach me, he's never had that.

[Kori Ellis]

You think he's the only one?

No, I don't. And I said that in my other post after the one you quoted.

But I'm not buying the "isolated" upbringing as an excuse for bad behavior. My mom is a drug addict and was in prison from the time I was 12 until I was 32. So do I have an excuse to break laws and act immoral? :rolleyes

[ShoogarBear]

Isolated? We're supposed to feel sorry for him? Kobe grew up with two parents, in material wealth, went to great schools, never wanted for anything. AND was blessed with incredible physical talent to boot. Instead of recognizing that, he stands around and wonders why somebody doesn't give him a better plane to fly in.

The truth is he's a self-centered asshole who's brought everything that's happened to him on himself, the good and the bad.

[missmyzte]

Isolated? We're supposed to feel sorry for him? Kobe grew up with two parents, in material wealth, went to great schools, never wanted for anything. AND was blessed with incredible physical talent to boot. Instead of recognizing that, he stands around and wonders why somebody doesn't give him a better plane to fly in.

The truth is he's a self-centered asshole who's brought everything that's happened to him on himself, the good and the bad.

Money doesn't buy happiness.

In other news, Kobe is 5-for-5 in the game against the Sonics right now. :)

[slayermin]

What a book. I can't wait to read the whole thing.

I guess the media does not what it's talking about. :lol

[Useruser666]

Money doesn't buy happiness.

Uh can some one give me a bunch and let me experiment with that hypothesis?

[Medvedenko]

hmmm...maybe I'll be thrown off this board for being a Laker fan...Funny stuff indeed. Hey this sitcom BS will soon subside and basketball will be played soon enough. That's all I really care about, nothing more nothing less. Yes in the interim the Phil book, Shaq's diatribes and Kobe's apathy will make headlines....for now. Let's all concentrate on the ball and the L.

[Shelly]

A letter of apology from the Accuser (http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/1012041kobe1.html)

[Useruser666]

She is stupid and he as an absolute asshole.

[Medvedenko]

Yeah thanks for that letter....tool...who cares.

[Sportcamper]

T.J. Simers:
Jackson's Book Is Basic Whine-of-the-Month Stuff
Let's begin with the name of the book: "The Last Season, a Team in Search of Its Soul."

Last season might have gone a lot better had it been "a team in search of the Larry O'Brien championship trophy."

The Lakers, however, were coached by an LSD-using, toenail-painting, tom-tom-playing, Zen Buddhism-Lakota Sioux incense-burning wacko who liked to play mind games with his minions and usually prevailed, but obviously took it hard when he discovered he was no match for a 25-year-old immature basketball player.

[Sportcamper]

TIM MVP-Who was the Laker fan who was saying that Phil was going to say in his book that Shaq was the real problem and not Kobe?

Don't make me hit the search button.

Sport camper- It will be interesting to read Phil Jackson’s remarks in his upcoming book...I have a feeling that Kobe won’t be portrayed as such a bad guy after all...

Well...Who Knew...Everyone thought they were such good friends...Bar be qued together...Double dated & all... :lol

If Phil Jackson does not have a chapter dedicated to Tex Winters then he is a real Chump...Tex’s main job was to put together footage for Shaquille proving to him that Kobe passed the ball around...The coaching staff constantly tried to reassure Shaq that he was the focal point & getting enough touches...

Bottom line...this makes for great gossip and it shows how bitter Shaq & Phil really are...Kobe and the Lakers have moved on....Those two never will.....

[samikeyp]

all three are bitches in my book...(which will come out in 2006: "Slava, the man, the myth, the legend: Chronicles of Instant Offense"


:lol

Dude...I better get an autographed copy.

[jcrod]

Some of you Spurs Fan never stop amazing me with your views.

1. It seems to me there's a lot of closet PJ and Shaq fans here.
2. What has Kobe done that 90% of NBA players haven't done. Nobody should put themselves in this position, but nobodys perfect and we are seeing some of his.
3. IMO Shaq & PJ are two times the whiny, braty and childish person Kobe is.
4. Although its no excuse, he's been given millions and treated like a star since he was 17. So you can see why he's spoiled and expects more.
5. L.A. doesnt' win jack without Kobe, and Shaq will soon find out how hard it will be without Kobe, bailing him out in the 4th.
6. The book just shows you what type of person PJ really is, not a great coach in my book.
7. Kobe was wrong for mentioning Shaq, but you can see why he did. I for one believe he didn't rape her. He knew all she wanted was money and was just trying to point it out to detectives that it happens all time. I bet if he knew this would get out or that it would put Shaq in any trouble he wouldn't have said it. You can tell with the interview he was scared shitless and was freaking out that she was saying he raped her.
8. After every loss he always gives the other team credit, unlike the other two who just makes excuses.

[Useruser666]

Some of you Spurs Fan never stop amazing me with your views.

1. It seems to me there's a lot of closet PJ and Shaq fans here.
2. What has Kobe done that 90% of NBA players haven't done. Nobody should put themselves in this position, but nobodys perfect and we are seeing some of his.
3. IMO Shaq & PJ are two times the whiny, braty and childish person Kobe is.
4. Although its no excuse, he's been given millions and treated like a star since he was 17. So you can see why he's spoiled and expects more.
5. L.A. doesnt' win jack without Kobe, and Shaq will soon find out how hard it will be without Kobe, bailing him out in the 4th.
6. The book just shows you what type of person PJ really is, not a great coach in my book.
7. Kobe was wrong for mentioning Shaq, but you can see why he did. I for one believe he didn't rape her. He knew all she wanted was money and was just trying to point it out to detectives that it happens all time. I bet if he knew this would get out or that it would put Shaq in any trouble he wouldn't have said it. You can tell with the interview he was scared shitless and was freaking out that she was saying he raped her.
8. After every loss he always gives the other team credit, unlike the other two who just makes excuses.

Why do some of the Spurs fans' views amaze you? You just repeated almost everyone with YOUR list. I think the backlash from the Spurs fans in general has to do a lot with how high a pedestal some Laker fans put Shaq, Kobe, and Phil. Now that they couldn't work together to bring you more gold their outcasts, washed up, and have dropped from the heavens. Kobe, however, still being on your team can still do no wrong. It seems that at least a consensus of Laker fans who can write off everything he has done to undermine your own organization, just because he is their only hope. I don't blame people for taking that stance. I do wish they could just give me a "wink" so to speak, when they talk so highly of Kobe. To quote Butthead, "You can't polish a turd Beavis."

[jcrod]

I'm not a Laker Fan, BTW. I'm one of the biggest Spurs Fans you'll ever meet. I just think everybody is mostly putting the blame on Kobe, when it's all three of them. Everybody here seems to have a strong hatered towards Kobe for some reason. I'm for one love seeing him play. He just loves to play, unlike some other players.

Like I said above, there's a lot of closet PJ and Shaq fans here. And those two are on the top of my list that i can't stand. Along with Karl, stockten, KG, GP, Cassell, and some others I can't think of.

[smeagol]

5. L.A. doesnt' win jack without Kobe, and Shaq will soon find out how hard it will be without Kobe, bailing him out in the 4th.

I thinks it will be the other way around. LA, without Snaq, is out in the first round of the playoffs.

The Fatso, on the other hand, will be contesting with Miami in the east.

[Useruser666]

I didn't say you were a Laker fan.


Everybody here seems to have a strong hatered towards Kobe for some reason.

I know I gave what I thought to be that reason. Another one might be people see all that Kobe has and can't comprehend why he would squander or endanger all of that. They see everything most people will never achieve being wasted away.

Shaq has the maturity of a 6 year old.

Kobe has the maturity of a 12 year old and an ego of 26 year old.

[Hook Dem]

Shaq will have a "good" Christmas present for Kobe. Wish Christmas was in November. Kobe will cry like the spoiled baby he is when his team falls hard. He will probably lead the league in scoring but sorry......no cigar!

[Kori Ellis]

After every loss he always gives the other team credit, unlike the other two who just makes excuses.

That's not really true. For example, after the Game1 and 2 losses to the Spurs this past playoffs, it was only Shaq who gave the Spurs credit. Kobe and Phil were the ones with the excuses. I know this for sure because I was in the locker room and have it on tape.

[Hank Hill]

Kobe Bryant?
That boy aint right.

[jcrod]

I didn't say you were a Laker fan.



I know I gave what I thought to be that reason. Another one might be people see all that Kobe has and can't comprehend why he would squander or endanger all of that. They see everything most people will never achieve being wasted away.

Shaq has the maturity of a 6 year old.

Kobe has the maturity of a 12 year old and an ego of 26 year old.


Sorry in you last post you kept referring the Lakers as your team, thats why i thought that.

I agree with you, but most super stars take that chance, just Kobe did it with someone who wanted money.


That's not really true. For example, after the Game1 and 2 losses to the Spurs this past playoffs, it was only Shaq who gave the Spurs credit. Kobe and Phil were the ones with the excuses. I know this for sure because I was in the locker room and have it on tape

True, but how often has he done it, rarely.

[Man In Black]

5. L.A. doesnt' win jack without Kobe, and Shaq will soon find out how hard it will be without Kobe, bailing him out in the 4th.

This part cracks me up. Most of the LAL fans I talk to do not recognize the support scoring that Shaq provided. Without that foundation, all those CLUTCH shots he made to win games for the Lakers amount to JUST shots made to keep the new la"K"ers from getting blown out. He took 21 shots made 13 last night. No one else gave more than 12 and what offense did they even attempt to run? I know the Kobe ISO, saw that many a time :) It looked very familiar to the Iverson or TMac ISO. Anyways, when people start telling me that Chris Mihm can be a dominant force or that Lamar Odom matches up well with the West 4's, I tend to start laughing hysterically.

[missmyzte]

This part cracks me up. Most of the LAL fans I talk to do not recognize the support scoring that Shaq provided. Without that foundation, all those CLUTCH shots he made to win games for the Lakers amount to JUST shots made to keep the new la"K"ers from getting blown out. He took 21 shots made 13 last night. No one else gave more than 12 and what offense did they even attempt to run? I know the Kobe ISO, saw that many a time :) It looked very familiar to the Iverson or TMac ISO. Anyways, when people start telling me that Chris Mihm can be a dominant force or that Lamar Odom matches up well with the West 4's, I tend to start laughing hysterically.

If Shaq would have made a couple of his FT's then Kobe's clutch shots would have just been icing on the cake instead of game-winners. I won't say that Chris Mihm is going to be dominant but it was encouraging to see him with 5 blocks the other night.

[jcrod]

This part cracks me up. Most of the LAL fans I talk to do not recognize the support scoring that Shaq provided. Without that foundation, all those CLUTCH shots he made to win games for the Lakers amount to JUST shots made to keep the new la"K"ers from getting blown out. He took 21 shots made 13 last night. No one else gave more than 12 and what offense did they even attempt to run? I know the Kobe ISO, saw that many a time :) It looked very familiar to the Iverson or TMac ISO. Anyways, when people start telling me that Chris Mihm can be a dominant force or that Lamar Odom matches up well with the West 4's, I tend to start laughing hysterically.


:lol :blah
Like I said, a lot of closet Shaq fans. Without the Clutch shots, the "FOUNDATION" doesn't mount to much does it.

[xcoriate]

Without the Clutch shots, the "FOUNDATION" doesn't mount to much does it

Kobe can make all the clutch 4th qurater shots he wants, but it won't matter if there down by 20

[Man In Black]

Kobe can make all the clutch 4th qurater shots he wants, but it won't matter if there down by 20
Bingo!!!

Leading the L in scoring isn't as cool as being in a position to win rings. :king