Dirk VS Duncan

[romsey31]

If Dirk wins a ring this year could he be considered a better PF than Duncan? If not what needs to be done to his game to put him above or in the same category as Duncan?

Duncan has been better in rebounding,steals,assist, and blocked shots over his career, but Dirk has raised the level of his game tremendously this post season, maturing to the point where he is posting and driving to the basket, while limiting his 3 point attempts.

Duncan has been mister consistent and the ultimate team player. He could go off for 30 on any given night but differs to his team mates and in turn makes them better, turning 2nd round picks and late first round picks into allstars.

Right now I would rank Dirk as the second best PF in the league after Duncan. I know he plays C but both does at times. I think if Dirk works on his post game more to the extent that other teams wouldnt send their pg's to guard him :lol then he would be the best pf in the league...but we could also argue if it was Duncan on the line with the game on the line as much as Dirk was he wouldnt have hit all those ft's...btw this guy reminds me of Bird in every way.

[exstatic]

Dirk couldn't hold Duncan's jock in any OVERALL comparison of their entire careers. Both his defense and post-up game are extremely suspect for a 7 footer. If you look at his game, he really plays much more like a SF, so it may not really relevant to compare them.

[admiral50]

It is not that hard to compare them. Afterall they both play the game of basketball. They are both unique.

Duncan is a legend. No doubt about that. Dirk will be there soon. Even less doubt. Just look at his height, talent and his will to play. INCREDIBLE.


GO TIM, GO DIRK!

[SpursStillTippin]

If your comparing by careers, Duncan is head and shoulders above Dirk no question. I mean Duncan's individual awards and Titles speak for that. Dirk has nothing in his trophy case and I would be suprised if the guy can even spell "defense". But yes Dirk has stepped his game up tremendously this year. Now if you wanna compare them by just 2006 then yes Dirk has had the better year, while Duncan has been injured.

[ALVAREZ6]

TD>>>>>>>>>Dirk

[MadDog73]

Dirk has 3 more Rings and 3 more MVPs to go...

[Texas_Ranger]

tim is 100% better player then Dirk :king

[JamStone]

There are a few ways of looking at the question.

If you compare careers, it isn't even close. Duncan is by far the better player.

If you go by the position "Power Forward," likewise Duncan's skill set make him the better power forward.

But, if you are talking about which is the better basketball player currently, this season, one could easily make an argument that Dirk is the better player ... THIS YEAR.

[SpurYank]

Dirk can have 5 or 6 more years like this one, and he still wouldn't be recognized as Tim's equal. Up here in the Atlantic Coast, Tim is recognized more for his college playing days than we recognize him for his NBA statistics.

Let's face it, Tim is already a legend. We're living in the present with Dirk and the accomplishments of the Mavericks THIS YEAR. Dirk has minumally 9 to 10 years to catch up with Tim. When it's all said and done, people will reflect on the past.

There will be no comparison.

[polandprzem]

In the Forward position Dirkm is top 20 but Timmy is top 2. So that's the comparison

[boutons_]

It's taken Dirk longer to arrive at the top, but right now, he's as every bit as MVP to the Mavs as Tim is to the the Spurs. No Dirk, no Mavs, just like we say about Tim.

I hadn't thought about it, but right now, Dirk is much better than Tim.
He can and does score more ways, inside and out,
he rebounds better (28 and 12 in the playoffs),
and he hits his FTs, all the time.

Dirk's defense is his weakest area, as FTs are Tim's weakest area, but given his limited lateral mobility, you still see him flailing away and hustling on defense.

Dirk's willingness to take it hard to the hole and dunk with both hands has given him a new level of toughness and unstoppability, like his drive that tied up Game7. If you could get in his way, would you want to?

Dirk's playoff rebounding has been huge, +4 RPG vs his season RPG, while his points are +6 PPG. Not playing near the basket like Tim, Dirk has +2 RPG more than Tim these playoffs.

Tim's greatest years are probably past (Tim's incredible performance in the playoffs is not as good as Dirk's), while it looks like, based on veritable "new level" this season, Dirk's best years are just beginning.

And amazingly, thanks to Avery this year, Dirk is an offensive monster without 3Gs being a huge porportion of his shots and points.

[zocool16]

Duncan is God... Nowitzky is a mere mortal. :-)... jk but Duncan's greatness isn't as appreciated by fans as it is by some NBA-veterans and knowers of the game of basketball. Dirk Nowitsky has gotten so much better though... his style is sick.... but he is yet to do what Tim Duncan does...which is basically be that quarterback of the champion Spurs (3 times)

[themvp]

Tim >>> Dirk

Not to disrespect Dirk, but he has to show us something more to be at the Tims level.

[strangeweather]

I hadn't thought about it, but right now, Dirk is much better than Tim.
He can and does score more ways, inside and out,
he rebounds better (28 and 12 in the playoffs),
and he hits his FTs, all the time.


It's also worth remembering that it's not merely that Dirk isn't a great defender. In addition to his substantial offensive responsibilities, Duncan is the anchor of one of the best two defenses in the league.

[dknights411]

I give Dirk the nod for being one of the top 10 players today, but he still has not accomplished a fraction of what Tim has done over his career. And since we base greatness on winning, then Tim gets the nod easily.

But if Dirk wins a title this year, he WILL be better than KG! (He's already better than him already in my rankings) :lol

[anon101]

In the Forward position Dirkm is top 20 but Timmy is top 2. So that's the comparison

If Duncan is not the #1 forward in the game, the only possible competition is Dirk.

I agree with others that for the career its unquestionably Duncan--even if you spot Dirk 3 years because he came into the league as basically a European high-schooler while Duncan came in a year earlier as a polished college product.

During this season, with Duncan's productivity down due to the plantar fasciatis, Dirk was clearly the better player, but in our series I thought it pretty much a push with Dirk and Duncan both playing at an MVP-level that basically cancelled the other out and Dirk's supporting cast was slightly better.

It will be interesting to revisit this next year when Duncan will presumably return to last year's, pre-PF form. Duncan is still better than Dirk at the 'classic' power forward aspects of the game, down on the blocks both offensively and defensively. But Dirk is more versatile with better ball-handling skills and a better shooting touch from pretty much anywhere on the court.

[Extra Stout]

There isn't really a direct comparison. Dirk is like a 7-foot Larry Bird. Duncan is a classic big man.

[johngateswhiteley]

...i'm sorry, but this has to be said. i have seen some of the stupidest threads since i joined this site. wtf is going on here? spursreport.com is nazis, fine, but spurstalk.com seems like it is full of 5 year olds...spurs fans or not.

...let's see, shall i post....if the spurs were a piece of grass what type of grass would they be? or if duncan was going to have a party at his house, would sinatra be invited?

i know this board is not regulated, and most like that, but why are so many threads completely insane? and before people respond with the original "just ignore it if you don't like it", well i do that already. this is the first and last time i will post about this topic, just curious what in the world is going on here?

[Spurologist]

posting

:lmao Dirk is a guard

[Extra Stout]

...i'm sorry, but this has to be said. i have seen some of the stupidest threads since i joined this site. wtf is going on here? spursreport.com is nazis, fine, but spurstalk.com seems like it is full of 5 year olds...spurs fans or not.

...let's see, shall i post....if the spurs were a piece of grass what type of grass would they be? or if duncan was going to have a party at his house, would sinatra be invited?

i know this board is not regulated, and most like that, but why are so many threads completely insane? and before people respond with the original "just ignore it if you don't like it", well i do that already. this is the first and last time i will post about this topic, just curious what in the world is going on here?
Welcome to summer.

[ca®lo]

if given a choice.. how many teams would choose dirk over duncan?

END OF DISCUSSION.

[Spurologist]

if given a choice.. how many teams would choose dirk over duncan?

END OF DISCUSSION.

GAME. SET. MATCH.

[picnroll]

if given a choice.. how many teams would choose dirk over duncan?

END OF DISCUSSION.
Utah?

[romsey31]

if given a choice.. how many teams would choose dirk over duncan?

END OF DISCUSSION.

Many teams would chose Dirk over Duncan. This might sound dumb to you but its actually not. Dirk is a crazy mismatch. He can play any position on the court. His post game is getting better, and thats his only flaw on the offensive end at the moment. His defensive skills are suspect, but that could be taken care of with good team defense.

Some teams could say Duncan has already peaked...while Dirk hasnt, You dont find 7 footers like Dirk lying around. I'm in no way knockign Duncan, he is probably the best player in the league, I'm just explaining why some teams would take Dirk over Duncan.

[JamStone]

if given a choice.. how many teams would choose dirk over duncan?



It all depends on the team, the system, and the personnel on that team. Right now, what teams with their current rosters would take Dirk over Duncan?

Miami - Dirk complements Shaq better
Houston - with T-Mac and Yao, Dirk is a better fit
Cleveland - high-low action with Zydrunas
Phoenix - style and tempo is better fit with Dirk
Indiana - Dirk and Jermaine would probably be a better inside-out duo
Denver - Camby already downlow, Nuggets need outside shooting and have an uptempo style
Seattle - uptempo, 3-point shooting team
Memphis - Gasol an inside force, Dirk fits better
Orlando - Dwight Howard is the low post threat
Charlotte - Okafor and May already inside presences
New York - Eddy Curry needs space down low

maybe New Jersey - uptempo style, toss-up between the two
maybe Sacramento - toss-up between the two
maybe Milwaukee - toss-up, Bogut as the center, Dirk the high post PF
maybe New Orleans - I think that team would like either, but Chris Paul might like playing with Dirk more

[DampierAmGod]

It's not fair to compare Duncan and Dirks careers.

Duncan started on a great team. The Spurs were coming off of a 20 win season but that was because David Robinson only played 6 games. Before that they made the playoffs 7 straight times and won 60+ games a couple times if I remember correctly.

Dirk started on the Dallas Mavericks, the New Orleans Saints of the NBA at the time. Not only was his team poor but he learned the NBA from Don Nelson. So naturally he is one of the best offensive players in the league but not so great at defense. Look how far his defense and overall game has improved in just 1 1/2 seasons under Avery, he still has his best years ahead of him.

It's not a situation where you're comparing two people and one is clearly better than the other, one just landed in a better situation than the other.

[windboy226]

You take their overall careers and its a no-brainer...Duncan all the way. Based on the play of this year and future years I'd take Dirk now. Duncan will go down as the greatest power forward in the history of the game and when it's all said and done Dirk won't be too far behind him.

[SsKSpurs21]

careerwise duncan will end up being probably the best powerforward of all time. Dirk has one great year and people are already pushing him to the best? Dirk is capitalizing on the small ball lineups. avery johnson has found a system that works in his favor. he is constantly being guarded by smaller defenders due to his mobile ability as a 7 footer. that is a great asset for any big man. i can almost guarentee you that eventually teams will exploit his flaws and figure out a way to shut him down. bowen has done it a few times and he is giving up 3 inches or so.

i remember when KG won his MVP people were saying how he is the greatest when he only had one great year. where are the KG talks now?

not taking anything away from dirk. he is a great player, but give him some time to establish himself and prove himself before we get carried away here.

[ponky]

Dirk's still evolving, Duncan has pretty much done it all. Wait until the end of their careers to judge, but even then, they have different styles of ball. Regardless, they are both great players.

[spurs=bling]

TD>>>>>>>>>Dirk

actually its

TD>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> dirk

[johngateswhiteley]

this is a good topic.its not about parties, or grass. its about one of the greatest players of all time and another (dirk)who is turning the corner to maybe being a hall of famer himself, and instead of wasting b ball fans time by making them read 3 paragraphs of self promotion, id rather keep it on a b ball topic.

you can maybe find a forum dissing forum with a google, or better yet, start one yourself.

1) it's a horrible question
2) it's a ridiculous thread
3) and i am not here to diss anybody
4) i am here to bring direction upon an otherwise, sometimes lost, forum. lol
5) you cannot even put the two players in the same sentence

[jaysmooth004]

If Duncan is not the #1 forward in the game, the only possible competition is Dirk.

I agree with others that for the career its unquestionably Duncan--even if you spot Dirk 3 years because he came into the league as basically a European high-schooler while Duncan came in a year earlier as a polished college product.

During this season, with Duncan's productivity down due to the plantar fasciatis, Dirk was clearly the better player, but in our series I thought it pretty much a push with Dirk and Duncan both playing at an MVP-level that basically cancelled the other out and Dirk's supporting cast was slightly better.

It will be interesting to revisit this next year when Duncan will presumably return to last year's, pre-PF form. Duncan is still better than Dirk at the 'classic' power forward aspects of the game, down on the blocks both offensively and defensively. But Dirk is more versatile with better ball-handling skills and a better shooting touch from pretty much anywhere on the court.


better than kg??? are you serious? come on now i mean kg is by far a much more agressive player on both ends of the court than dirk, and i dare you to compare dirk on a rebounding scale with kg! dirk has been fortunate enough to play with some good coaches and he's had tremondous help on the court to get him where he's at right now on the other hand kg well its just been all kg.

[DampierAmGod]

better than kg??? are you serious? come on now i mean kg is by far a much more agressive player on both ends of the court than dirk, and i dare you to compare dirk on a rebounding scale with kg! dirk has been fortunate enough to play with some good coaches and he's had tremondous help on the court to get him where he's at right now on the other hand kg well its just been all kg.

Well then I guess that means Duncan is overrated too I mean look at the players and coaching staff Duncan has had on his team. Put KG on a team with Ginobli and Parker and he'd have a ring or two as well.

[jamezyjamez]

Will be a better discussion in a few years, but I think the post about TD anchoring one of the best defenses in the league is flawed. Seems like without a true center, he didn't anchor much of anything against the Mavs.

[raspsa]

Different players, different styles so its comparing apples and oranges. However, one thing is beyond dispute.. TD can dominate a game on Offense AND Defense.. Dirk isn/t even close to being the Defensive presence that TD is.

[ponky]

the mavs will not beat the heat. shaq will dominate.

shaq can dominate all he wants, the rest will get shut down...duncan dominated all he wanted and he had a great series, can't say the same for some of the other spurs...and like the poster below noted, it is a stupid thread

[Trainwreck2100]

This is a stupid thread, they don't even play head to head when they play against each other

[shwnhart]

To all those Dirk haters.. How can you hate a guy that is 7ft. tall and does all the things Dirk does? Has Duncan EVER rebounded the ball and drove it up court and made a play? I am not saying he is better by any means but my GOD>>>give him some credit. IT takes .00001 basketball IQ to see that we are seeing a great player do some amazing things. Timmy had his day can we now give credit to someone else? I read here where someone said that Dirk can't even hold Duncans jock. Are you F'n kidding me? This guy is amazing. I am so glad he is so bad that you are even starting a thread on him. I wish some of you would just appreciate his game rather than disect it with your B.S. Afterall, there is a reason he is leading his team to a western conference championship. It sure as hell isn't luck.

[bobbyjoe]

Dirk is certainly more clutch than TD. TD has missed a ton of HUGE easy shots late in games of the playoffs the last couple years.

TD's defense has also declined. Remember Amare dropping 40 a game on him last yr and Tim's inability to contest the Mavs who penetrated this series. Tim also couldn't guard Dirk very well. As great as Duncan was offensively against the Mavs, he was terrible defensively. When the Mavs guards drove to the hoop he didnt step up and alter shots. In the switches he made, his man was able to lose him far too easily.

Basically a wash at this point in their respective careers. Also in the reg season Dirk was way better than Tim.

[TDMVPDPOY]

i take duncans first 3 years in the league over dirks career

[Parker 09]

if Dirk works on his post game more to the extent that other teams wouldnt send their pg's to guard him
The fact that teams can do that means he is no where near the caliber of duncan

[TDMVPDPOY]

so base on one years accomplishments is goin to put him over td? hahahahhahhaha this is lame.

[samikeyp]

IMO, Dirk had the better season, Duncan is the better player.

[Texas_Ranger]

IMO, Dirk had the better season, Duncan is the better player.
:tu

[TDMVPDPOY]

It's not fair to compare Duncan and Dirks careers.

Duncan started on a great team. The Spurs were coming off of a 20 win season but that was because David Robinson only played 6 games. Before that they made the playoffs 7 straight times and won 60+ games a couple times if I remember correctly.

Dirk started on the Dallas Mavericks, the New Orleans Saints of the NBA at the time. Not only was his team poor but he learned the NBA from Don Nelson. So naturally he is one of the best offensive players in the league but not so great at defense. Look how far his defense and overall game has improved in just 1 1/2 seasons under Avery, he still has his best years ahead of him.

It's not a situation where you're comparing two people and one is clearly better than the other, one just landed in a better situation than the other.
i still take duncans years without drob is still better overall then dirks career

[Mavschick]

Even as a Mavs fan I recognize Duncan is clearly the better all-around player than Dirk. Dirk's D has gotten a lot better over the years, but he'll never be the defender Duncan is. He'll also never be the shot-blocker Duncan is. Dirk is one of the best offensive players in the game at his position. Duncan is one of the most complete players in the game at his position.

[DarrinS]

This is an apples and oranges comparison.

Dirk is truly unique to the game. He doesn't play PF in the traditional sense that Tim does.

He's like a giant SF with perfect shooting mechanics, which is why he's such a nightmarish matchup.


If Dirk could slightly improve his defensive game, I'd say he's one of the top 2 or 3 players in the league.


Milwaukee must feel like idiots for passing on him.

[strangeweather]

If Dirk could slightly improve his defensive game, I'd say he's one of the top 2 or 3 players in the league.

Even as is, I think he's clearly top 5 at this point. Which I honestly wouldn't have believed was possible before this year.

[zocool16]

Dirk is certainly more clutch than TD. TD has missed a ton of HUGE easy shots late in games of the playoffs the last couple years.

TD's defense has also declined. Remember Amare dropping 40 a game on him last yr and Tim's inability to contest the Mavs who penetrated this series. Tim also couldn't guard Dirk very well. As great as Duncan was offensively against the Mavs, he was terrible defensively. When the Mavs guards drove to the hoop he didnt step up and alter shots. In the switches he made, his man was able to lose him far too easily.

Basically a wash at this point in their respective careers. Also in the reg season Dirk was way better than Tim.

Dirk is more clutch than TD?.... yeah i mean if TD was a 90 percent free throw shooter and was sent to shoot free throws with 5 seconds left with the game on the line I'm pretty sure he can be as clutch as dirk....

Allowing Amare 40 points a game was the strategy for that series, the Spurs wanted the Suns to score 2 at a time only. I think it worked.. I mean the Spurs won that series 4-1... oh yeah and it's hard to be as brave to go and "alter" a shot when it is a very likely thing that you will get a foul, Duncan plays smart defense.

Tim is better than Dirk... everyone's just amazed cuz Dirk is finally starting to do some of the things Duncan's done his whole career. Gotta give him props, that jumper of his is unstoppable. Makes u wonder how come when he had steve nash he couldn't do crap. STEVE NASH!

[LEONARD]

Dirk > All others

[Mavs_man_41]

Dirk is a much bigger threat offensively, but with TD's defense he is a little better overall. But Dirk has better years to come and if he improves his defense he might end up better but for now TD is better overall.

[Rynospursfan]

It all depends on the team, the system, and the personnel on that team. Right now, what teams with their current rosters would take Dirk over Duncan?

Miami - Dirk complements Shaq better
Houston - with T-Mac and Yao, Dirk is a better fit
Cleveland - high-low action with Zydrunas
Phoenix - style and tempo is better fit with Dirk
Indiana - Dirk and Jermaine would probably be a better inside-out duo
Denver - Camby already downlow, Nuggets need outside shooting and have an uptempo style
Seattle - uptempo, 3-point shooting team
Memphis - Gasol an inside force, Dirk fits better
Orlando - Dwight Howard is the low post threat
Charlotte - Okafor and May already inside presences
New York - Eddy Curry needs space down low

maybe New Jersey - uptempo style, toss-up between the two
maybe Sacramento - toss-up between the two
maybe Milwaukee - toss-up, Bogut as the center, Dirk the high post PF
maybe New Orleans - I think that team would like either, but Chris Paul might like playing with Dirk more

I like this list. Just a few things I might disagree with.

Cleveland - I think they would take Duncan and toss Big Z aside. Lebron's game requires him to have the ball a lot. This would work against Dirk.

Denver - I think this could go either way, Dirk might get the nod because they need a shooter so bad, but the front line of Duncan and Camby would make it almost imposible to score in the lane.

Seattle - This team is in desperate need of an inside presence. Lewis to a lesser extent already plays Dirks role.

NY - I think this team has enough perimeter threats they need someone that could get them open and clear lanes to the hoop and play some D, Duncan would be a better fit.

[romsey31]

Dirk is more clutch than TD?.... yeah i mean if TD was a 90 percent free throw shooter and was sent to shoot free throws with 5 seconds left with the game on the line I'm pretty sure he can be as clutch as dirk....
Allowing Amare 40 points a game was the strategy for that series, the Spurs wanted the Suns to score 2 at a time only. I think it worked.. I mean the Spurs won that series 4-1... oh yeah and it's hard to be as brave to go and "alter" a shot when it is a very likely thing that you will get a foul, Duncan plays smart defense.

Tim is better than Dirk... everyone's just amazed cuz Dirk is finally starting to do some of the things Duncan's done his whole career. Gotta give him props, that jumper of his is unstoppable. Makes u wonder how come when he had steve nash he couldn't do crap. STEVE NASH!

Duncan has no one to blame but himself for that. Its no one but his fault that he shoots that low a percentage from the Line.

[blaze89]

I wouldn't even consider Nowitski a PF. Duncan and Nowitski, in my eyes, two different players but each very valuable to their team. I find them hard to compare cause I see their games as completely different.

[kimberly_spursfan]

Tim no doubt is better that dirk as an all around player, but one day dirk may be up there by him as the best PF

[gtownspur]

dirks duties;
1. Sag on defense
2.Get open
3. Score
and whith all that really cumbersome responsiblity, get rebounds.



Duncan's Duties;
Anchor Defense
Anchor offense
Guard the Best Post players
Stop guard penetration
Set screens'
Be the ball handler on 4 down
Be help defender in at any situation.

and then get rebounds.


Timmy>>>>>>>>>>>>dork Novitzki.

[TDMVPDPOY]

duncan is already the goat at his position, dirk cant touch thtat