PDA

View Full Version : You Still A Liberal?



xrayzebra
06-05-2006, 09:15 AM
Dr. Thomas Sowell talks about why some have learned the lessons of
the Liberal thought and abandoned it.


Preserving a vision: Part IV

By Thomas Sowell

Jun 5, 2006

Despite the warm glow of self-satisfaction that the liberal vision confers on liberals, ugly facts keep intruding to undermine that vision. Some liberals eventually jump ship and defect to conservatism when the facts keep piling up too high to ignore.

This takes time, of course, and in the meantime there is a never-ending supply of new young people to become charmed with the liberal vision and replace those who have become disenchanted with it.

Other liberals hang on to liberal ideas to the bitter end -- especially when the end is not that bitter for them personally, when they live insulated lives in academia, the courts, foundations and other places where there is no price for liberals to pay for being wrong, no matter how disastrous the consequences for others.

Still, facts are a danger to the vision. In recent times, those on the left have increasingly sought to suppress facts that go counter to the vision.

Research dealing with innate biological differences are of course anathema to those with the liberal-left vision. Even research that turns up cultural or other behavioral differences between groups is almost as great a danger.

Both kinds of research undermine the notion that there are "solutions" that government can impose to eliminate differences, gaps, disparities or "inequities" that liberalism claims to be able to eliminate.

Scientific research into differences in the way male and female brains function is denounced by radical feminists, who are calling for a ban on such research. No matter what the MRIs say, the radical feminists say all differences are due to "society."

Liberals have worked long and hard to get the very word "sex" replaced by "gender," since sex is an innate biological fact while gender is an arbitrary social designation, much as the French language assigns the female gender to the noun "plume" for pen.

It is a sign of how easy it is to stampede large sections of society that so many people now find it necessary to refer to gender instead of sex, even if they have not bothered to consider what the difference is or why they have changed what they say.

When it comes to racial and ethnic minorities, liberal politicians and judges can make it literally a federal case to give IQ tests to black children. Among the facts that we would never have known if some people did not find ways around this taboo is that black IQs have risen in recent times.

The greatest danger to the liberal vision are facts about the consequences of liberalism itself and the laws, policies, and ways of life that the left has spawned.

That the black family, which survived centuries of slavery and generations of discrimination, has disintegrated in the wake of the liberal welfare state is only one example.

Liberals have been driven to the desperate expedient of attributing this and other social pathology in today's ghettos to "a legacy of slavery" -- even though black children grew up with two parents more often under slavery than today.

Blacks only a generation or two out of slavery also had higher rates of employment and lower rates of crime than today.

The illogic of the "legacy of slavery" argument only illustrates the desperate attempt to salvage the liberal vision.

The very people who argue this way would never be guilty of such illogic in discussing something that was not such a threat to their vision.

One of the most telling examples of the social destructiveness of the left's welfare-state vision can be found among the white slum dwellers in Britain described in the brilliant and insightful book "Life at the Bottom" by Theodore Dalrymple.

There it is not possible to blame social degeneracy on slavery, racism or any of the other things cited as causes of the behavior and consequences found among blacks in American slums. Yet the results are virtually identical, right down to children beating up classmates for trying to get an education.

The vision of the left, full of envy and resentment, takes its worst toll on those at the bottom -- whether black or white -- who find in that paranoid vision an excuse for counterproductive and ultimately self-destructive attitudes and behavior.

Thomas Sowell is the prolific author of books such as Black Rednecks and White Liberals and Applied Economics.

Read more about Black Rednecks and White Liberals by Sowell, Thomas Read more about Applied Economics: Thinking Beyond Stage One by Sowell, Thomas

Copyright © 2006 Townhall.com

Find this story at: http://www.townhall.com/opinion/columns/thomassowell/2006/06/05/199853.html

JoeChalupa
06-05-2006, 11:18 AM
I'm a progressive thinking American. Damn right.

And while I respect Mr. Sowell, I disagree with his opinion and view on liberals.

xrayzebra
06-05-2006, 02:36 PM
Shame on you for being progressive. Progressive in most cases means being
regressive in most traditional American values.

I agree completely with Mr. Sowell. Many liberals have moved to the conservative
side because the have seen what liberalism has done to the human race.

pussyface
06-05-2006, 02:47 PM
that was an interesting attack on liberalism. one huge problem i had with it though was the way it set up a false dichotomy of liberal and conservative as the only two options, as if you had to be one or the other. this is laughable.

although it did much to refute liberalism, it did very little to explain why conservatism is attractive.

this is not an either/or question; see libertarianism, for instance.

pussyface
06-05-2006, 02:50 PM
Still, facts are a danger to the vision. In recent times, those on the left have increasingly sought to suppress facts that go counter to the vision." sowell

you need to consider the bias of sowell as well. although i have no doubt this is true of liberals, it is undeniable that conservatives have been guilty of the same (for instance, on environmental issues like global warming and social issues like their abstinance only sex ed program and its proven ineffectiveness.

austinfan
06-05-2006, 02:53 PM
This is such a ludicrous characterization of "liberal" that I don't even know where to begin to refute it. But if by liberal you mean someone who's for alternative energy sources, a decent minimum wage, smaller class sizes in public schools, healthcare for *all* American children regardless of their parents' income, and an end to being the world's policeman, then you're damn straight I'm a liberal.

And I hope you don't bust a vein reading this, but I happen to support gay marriage too. It's been legalized now in Europe for quite some time and more recently in Massachusetts, and as far as I can tell those places haven't turned into fiery hellpits nor have their economies gone down the tubes.

xrayzebra
06-05-2006, 02:59 PM
^^Gee abstinence has proven ineffective. I didn't know that.

Global warming may be a fact. But nothing has proven mankind caused it. I have
read some articles where they say that although thinning has occurred at the edges
of ice flows it has actually thinkened on the interior. But they never mention that.
Do they?

Libertarians have some good points, but without the absence of all law, as they
propose, you have archany.

austinfan
06-05-2006, 03:33 PM
Global warming may be a fact. But nothing has proven mankind caused it. I have
read some articles where they say that although thinning has occurred at the edges
of ice flows it has actually thinkened on the interior. But they never mention that.

I'm glad that you admit that global warming is a fact. And can it really hurt our economy and the global political situation to wean ourselves off Middle Eastern oil and implement alternative technologies that will create more jobs for people here in the U.S.? To me, it just seems like a win-win for everybody except the oil companies, who want to keep us stuck on the teat of Saudi Arabia, Iran and the rest of OPEC, so that they can continue to reap their outrageous profits.

fyatuk
06-05-2006, 03:38 PM
^^Gee abstinence has proven ineffective. I didn't know that.


They didn't say abstinenece was proven ineffective. They said abstinence-only education has proven ineffective.

JoeChalupa
06-05-2006, 03:51 PM
Shame on you for being progressive. Progressive in most cases means being
regressive in most traditional American values.

I agree completely with Mr. Sowell. Many liberals have moved to the conservative
side because the have seen what liberalism has done to the human race.

Actually many liberals have always been conservative on many issues but many have been duped by the Karl Roves and Sean insHannity's of the world into thinking that liberals are the root of all evil and just it isn't so.
I'm just as patriotic and church going as the next guy and yeah, I'm progressive on some issues and conservative on others.

I do support the war on terrorism, just don't agree on how the Iraq war was sold to me. I do support the protection of our borders on the NORTH and SOUTH by enforcing the laws that are already on the books. I have no trouble fining employers who hire illegals.

Lumping liberals as Mr. Sowell does just adds fuel to a fire that is already out of control. I know for a fact that most conservatives don't really think like Rove, Coulter, Limbaugh and Hannity...at least I hope not.

DarkReign
06-05-2006, 04:16 PM
Still, facts are a danger to the vision. In recent times, those on the left have increasingly sought to suppress facts that go counter to the vision." sowell

you need to consider the bias of sowell as well. although i have no doubt this is true of liberals, it is undeniable that conservatives have been guilty of the same (for instance, on environmental issues like global warming and social issues like their abstinance only sex ed program and its proven ineffectiveness.

I am not trying to be a prick in the least, so please dont take it that way.

You should use the quote feature. Especially when you miss the opening quote and fail to capitalize Sowell.

In case you dont know the syntax, here is Sowell's quote using this feature.

[quote=Sowell.]Still, facts are a danger to the vision. In recent times, those on the left have increasingly sought to suppress facts that go counter to the vision.[/quote.]

Minus the periods in the brackets. Im thinking you already know this, but I figured "What the hell, it inflates my post count" :lol

Mr. Peabody
06-05-2006, 04:23 PM
Other liberals hang on to liberal ideas to the bitter end -- especially when the end is not that bitter for them personally, when they live insulated lives in academia, the courts, foundations and other places where there is no price for liberals to pay for being wrong, no matter how disastrous the consequences for others.



Isn't Dr. Sowell a Senior Fellow at Stanford?

pussyface
06-05-2006, 04:25 PM
writing libertarians off as anarchists doesnt mean they arent right on principal.
also, that wasnt my point. my point is that the article suffers because it is built around the supposition that there are only 2 choices, liberal or conservative.