Word out of Detroit is the Pistons re-signing free agent Ben Wallace not a lock

[ducks]

# Word out of Detroit is the Pistons re-signing free agent Ben Wallace to a maximum contract isn't the lock it seemed just a few weeks ago. It seems Wallace's act during the playoffs -- essentially blaming coach Flip Saunders for not focusing on defense enough in practice -- rubbed some in the organization the wrong way. Wallace, 32, could be available for any team looking to make a big-time offer.
http://www.suntimes.com/output/jackson/cst-spt-jax18.html

[MadDog73]

He is just looking for money, or does he just want another Ring with a classy organization and the best PF in the NBA?

(and, no, I'm not talking about the Mavs...)

[Darrin]

I think in this case, unlike with Isiah Thomas and Grant Hill, my loyalty will leave with Wallace.

[jman3000]

I think in this case, unlike with Isiah Thomas and Grant Hill, my loyalty will leave with Wallace.

is your loyalty going to follow wallace or are you just gonna become a fan of another team?

[DirkAB]

He's too old to give a max deal, I wouldn't be willing to give him what he wants. His contract is going to spell doom for some stupid team.

[Bob Lanier]

I think in this case, unlike with Isiah Thomas and Grant Hill, my loyalty will leave with Wallace.
:tu

[Darrin]

is your loyalty going to follow wallace or are you just gonna become a fan of another team?

I'll probably start out a huge fan of Ben Wallace's new team, but he'll eventually retire. Will my loyalty stay with his team? I'll play it by ear. I didn't have a game-plan when it came to following the Pistons. I just liked them from an early age.

But I may pick another league.

[Obstructed_View]

I knew some of you Pistons fans were bandwagon pussies. Don't abandon your team or you are no better than a Mavs fan.

[ABDENOUR POWER]

He is just looking for money, or does he just want another Ring with a classy organization and the best PF in the NBA?

If that was the case he'd stay in Detroit and line up along side Rasheed Wallace. :blah

About the article, though, I don't think it says anything new. Its been known for a while that Wallace re-signing is not a lock.

[spurschick]

According to Hoopsworld, the Spurs are packaging Rasho and Manu for Wallace. If Hoopsworld says it, it must be true. :heavy sarcasm

[Pistons < Spurs]

I knew some of you Pistons fans were bandwagon pussies. Don't abandon your team or you are no better than a Mavs fan.


Hate to say it, but I agree.

Fuck this whole 'my loyalty will elave with Wallace' junk.

Are you Detroit Wallace fans? or Detroit Piston fans?

If he leaves us, he leaves. Thats the buisness side of it.

IMO Ben is not worth a Max deal. His age, and performance is on the downside. Attitude has been more of a problem aswell.

How many proffesional players do you know that need their wife to tell them that their not bringing it during the NBA Finals?

I hope he stays with us and is super productive for many years to come.......but if it doesn't happen, I'm still down with my team.

[SpurForLife]

Hate to say it, but I agree.

Fuck this whole 'my loyalty will elave with Wallace' junk.

Are you Detroit Wallace fans? or Detroit Piston fans?

If he leaves us, he leaves. Thats the buisness side of it.

IMO Ben is not worth a Max deal. His age, and performance is on the downside. Attitude has been more of a problem aswell.

How many proffesional players do you know that need their wife to tell them that their not bringing it during the NBA Finals?

I hope he stays with us and is super productive for many years to come.......but if it doesn't happen, I'm still down with my team.


Well Said :elephant

[Bob Lanier]

I am not a fan of what this organization is becoming. Maybe, I am not a fan of what the NBA is becoming. Either way I don't think I could stomach cheering for the Flip Saunders/Chauncey Billups Pistons without someone standing for The Right Way in the locker room.

Obviously Ben isn't worth a max deal and he's rapidly declining, and maybe the Pistons would be a better team if Dumars pulls off a spectacular sign-and-trade. But if the Pistons abandon their roots and Hammond sets his lackeys in the press to viciously slander Ben and what he stands for, then the Pistons can fuck themselves.

I can count on one hand the number of organizations in the NBA committed to playing good basketball, and I'm a fan of all of them. If the Pistons drop off that list, that's unfortunate, but as a sports fan the choice between supporting my aesthetic and philosophical principles or supporting Bill Davidson's logo is an easy one. I'm a bandwagon pussy - when my team sells out, I move on. At the end of the day, it's just a sport; nobody owes any organization their loyalty.

[Darrin]

Hate to say it, but I agree.

Fuck this whole 'my loyalty will elave with Wallace' junk.

Are you Detroit Wallace fans? or Detroit Piston fans?

If he leaves us, he leaves. Thats the buisness side of it.

IMO Ben is not worth a Max deal. His age, and performance is on the downside. Attitude has been more of a problem aswell.

How many proffesional players do you know that need their wife to tell them that their not bringing it during the NBA Finals?

I hope he stays with us and is super productive for many years to come.......but if it doesn't happen, I'm still down with my team.


Yes. I've been a bandwagon fan for 17 years. I waited until the Pistons lost 18 games, when things got really bad, to think about leaving them.

[Darrin]

I am not a fan of what this organization is becoming. Maybe, I am not a fan of what the NBA is becoming. Either way I don't think I could stomach cheering for the Flip Saunders/Chauncey Billups Pistons without someone standing for The Right Way in the locker room.

Obviously Ben isn't worth a max deal and he's rapidly declining, and maybe the Pistons would be a better team if Dumars pulls off a spectacular sign-and-trade. But if the Pistons abandon their roots and Hammond sets his lackeys in the press to viciously slander Ben and what he stands for, then the Pistons can fuck themselves.

I can count on one hand the number of organizations in the NBA committed to playing good basketball, and I'm a fan of all of them. If the Pistons drop off that list, that's unfortunate, but as a sports fan the choice between supporting my aesthetic and philosophical principles or supporting Bill Davidson's logo is an easy one. I'm a bandwagon pussy - when my team sells out, I move on. At the end of the day, it's just a sport; nobody owes any organization their loyalty.

Well said. The Pistons taught me what to value from a basketball team, and they appear to be abandoning it because the NBA has changed its product. The mud has already started to sling at Ben Wallace. I've seen this happen with Isiah, Rodman, Rick Carlisle, Larry Brown, etc. The Pistons are never wrong - it's never a mutal breakup - and I'm getting a little sick of it.

[DirkAB]

I think in this case, unlike with Isiah Thomas and Grant Hill, my loyalty will leave with Wallace.

Even if keeping your loyalty means signing Wallace to a huge and terrible contract? A contract that he will surely command because other poorly ran teams will be willing to pay him big, which will surely kill the Pistons' chances at being competitive over the last 3-4 years of the contract.

[Darrin]

Even if keeping your loyalty means signing Wallace to a huge and terrible contract? A contract that he will surely command because other poorly ran teams will be willing to pay him big, which will surely kill the Pistons' chances at being competitive over the last 3-4 years of the contract.

First, recognize what Ben Wallace has done for this franchise.

On-the-court: (July 2000 thru present).
- 5-time All-NBA Center.
- 4-time Defensive Player of the Year.
- 4-time All-Star
- NBA Champion
- 295-175 (.628) record with him in the lineup.
- 9-13 (.409) record with hom out of the lineup.
- 4 Division titles (none between 1990 and 2002).
- 4 Conference Finals Appearances (none between 1991 and 2003).
- 2 NBA Finals Appearances (none between 1990 and 2004).

Salary Cap:
- Could've opted out of contract before 2003-04. This allowed the Pistons to easily re-sign Rip Hamilton to a large deal, allow for the stress free MLE use on Elden Campbell, and trading for Bob Sura, although his contract was larger than Cliff Robinson's. Let's also not forget that all this financial flexibility allowed Dumars to trade for Rasheed Wallace. Without Ben Wallace staying for 6.0 million for 2003-04, the Pistons would've paid more than 300,000 dollars in luxury tax after trading for Rasheed - it would've been in the 7-million range.

- By not extending Wallace after the 2002-03 season, it cost Ben Wallace in the pocketbook since the Collective Bargaining Agreement lowered the amount of years, and the percentage increase from season to season.

Revenue:
- In Ben Wallace's time in Detroit, he has been the face of the franchise. The Pistons have made countless dollars off of merchandise and exposure because of Big Ben.
- In the previous six seasons before Wallace, the Pistons totalled 4,187,870 patrons at the Palace or 18,208 patrons a night for 230 games. That's, on average, about 83% of the capacity of the Palace of Auburn Hills.
- In the six seasons with Ben Wallace, the Pistons totalled 4,890,542 patrons at the Palace or 19,880 patrons for 246 games, about 90% of the capacity of the Palace of Auburn Hills.

That's right - in the Ben Wallace era, there has been a 7 percent increase in ticket sales. And this is after his rookie season, when the Pistons drew 14,000 patrons a night, or the lowest attendance since 1982-83.


6-years, 34-million dollars. He played every single cent of that contract when he could've gotten much more. He's played at the bargain rate of 72,000 dollars a game. Grant Hill, by comparison, made 116,254 dollars a game.

Tayshaun's been taken care of (5-year, 45 million), so has Rip Hamilton (7-years, 63 million), Cliff Robinson (2-years, 10 million), and Rasheed Wallace (5-years, 65 million).

He won't get 140 million over six years anywhere, and he should know that. But if the Pistons take the attitude that he's going to be a little over-priced later on, when he's done so under-priced for six years, that's just bull.

How is it going to doom this franchise to sign him to a lucrative 4-year, 60-million dollar deal?

[leemajors]

free agency can be rough on fans. but with salaries the way they are, teams face tough decisions.

[Mr.Bottomtooth]

Ben to the Spurs for Nazr Mohammed and Fabricio Oberto and 2-3 future draft picks.

[Darrin]

Ben to the Spurs for Nazr Mohammed and Fabricio Oberto and 2-3 future draft picks.


Tim Duncan for Dale Davis, Jason Maxiell and 2-3 future draft picks.

[DirkAB]

He won't get 140 million over six years anywhere, and he should know that. But if the Pistons take the attitude that he's going to be a little over-priced later on, when he's done so under-priced for six years, that's just bull.

How is it going to doom this franchise to sign him to a lucrative 4-year, 60-million dollar deal?

You think that teams are obligated to pay a player for past performance even though they won't be worth it in the future?????? That really isn't how it works. That isn't how your team climbed to the top of the league, and doing that will screw them to the wall. So what if he exercised the option on his contract, that was his decision and Pistons didn't hold a gun to his head. Maybe he should have opted out and tried to get paid then, because he isn't worth what he was a few years back, his value is sharply declining each year. Bottom line is, you can't hold that against the Pistons because it wasn't their decision to make. Plus, I don't see him taking a 4-year deal.