Ludden: Spurs unable to land Mourning

[Solid D]

Web Posted: 07/09/2006 12:00 AM CDT
Johnny Ludden
Express-News Staff Writer

The Spurs hope to finish their search for a new center within the next few days after making a hard, yet unsuccessful, push to lure Alonzo Mourning from Miami.

Aware that Mourning planned to re-sign with the Heat or retire, the Spurs knew they would have a difficult time convincing him to leave Florida, where his family has been settled for much of his 13-year career. But Spurs officials were initially encouraged this past week when Mourning showed interest in joining them.

The Spurs' optimism, however, had diminished by Saturday afternoon. Mourning is now expected to return to the Heat and help them defend their NBA title.

Spurs officials also have looked at the available big men in Europe, as well as trade options, but will probably sign someone from the small pool of NBA free-agent centers this week.

Utah's Jarron Collins and Memphis' Lorenzen Wright are the top remaining unrestricted free-agent centers. New York's Jackie Butler and Charlotte's Melvin Ely are young with potential, but each is a restricted free agent, which would force the Spurs to wait up to a week to see if their offer would be matched.

Indiana's Scot Pollard, Boston's Michael Olowokandi, Charlotte's Jake Voskuhl, Denver's Francisco Elson (restricted), Toronto's Loren Woods and Chicago's Luke Schenscher (restricted) are other options.

The Spurs tried unsuccessfully to sign Mourning a few seasons ago. He turns 37 in February and is three years removed from a kidney transplant, but that didn't deter the Spurs from again seeking his services.

Mourning averaged 7.8 points, 5.5 rebounds and 2.66 blocks — the third-most in the NBA — in 65 games for the Heat last season. He remains one of the league's best interior defenders and would have been a good fit next to Tim Duncan.

Because Duncan also will play some center and Lithuanian big man Robertas Javtokas will help back up the position, the Spurs could have used Mourning at the start of each half and kept his minutes in check. Signing Mourning to a two-year contract with a healthy raise from the $1.1 million he made last season also would have fit well with the Spurs' financial plans: Duncan, Tony Parker and Manu Ginobili are the team's only players currently under contract after the 2007-08 season.

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[angel_luv]

The Spurs were going after Mourning? Where have I been?

[Solid D]

C.I.A. Pop and RC

[loveforthegame]

Spurs officials also have looked at the available big men in Europe, as well as trade options, but will probably sign someone from the small pool of NBA free-agent centers this week.

I like the attempt on Mourning but why go after someone you know isn't leaving their team?

And why are they confident they can sign one of the leftovers this week?

[SequNets]

The Spurs have no clue. Mourning is old and ready to retire.

[ducks]

Spurs officials also have looked at the available big men in Europe, as well as trade options, but will probably sign someone from the small pool of NBA free-agent centers this week.

that is not good
I was hoping for the euro
but since it was in the paper it could be cia that is who they will sign the euro and hope to drive the other fa's prices up

[Mr.Bottomtooth]

Looks like Collins is more close to being a Spur.

[Doc Jerome]

I don't think anyone available at the moment can help the Spurs at the center position. Oh well, stay tuned. :fro

[MannyIsGod]

Well, there was no one pressing, so why not take a shot at Zo? I don't mind that at all actually. So they'll sign someone within the next week. Hopefully it is Butler.

[MaNu4Tres]

how many games did you actually see butler play?

[MannyIsGod]

I saw several Knick games last year, but even if I hadn't seen any he's the one with the biggest upside out of the group.

[Solid D]

I saw several Knick games last year, but even if I hadn't seen any he's the one with the biggest upside out of the group.

And the biggest backside. :lol

Sorry you lobbed us a softball.

[timvp]

CIA Pop at work.

Nobody got wind of Zo to SA. I wouldn't have minded it but it sure would have been weird. Zo's badmouthing of DRob back in the day was pretty harsh. Plus it's tough to imagine Zo has much if anything left in the tank.

Well at least they were trying to do something in the last week instead of just sitting around like it seemed like they were doing.

There is hope.

:smokin

[loveforthegame]

If I had to pick the top 3 choices it would be Pollard, Wright, Collins.

It doesn't sound like they'll go after a RFA because of the waiting period. And I don't see the Spurs offering enough money to where the other team doesn't match in the end anyway.

[MaNu4Tres]

The way I look at it. With the free agent centers or bigs available. We won't be gettin any better regardless of who it is. The only way I see us improving is if we make a trade for a center.

[Kori Ellis]

The fact that they went after Zo should get Spurs fans to sit back, shutup and wait. :lol

No one here thought they would go after Mourning, so obviously they have some ideas that some of us don't as to what to do with the team.

Patience.

For all we know, they'll pull off a blockbuster trade by Monday :drunk

[El_Mago]

What a horrible offseason.

[timvp]

I offer my apologies to the front office. Although I wouldn't have loved Zo in a Spurs uniform, I can understand where the Spurs were coming from. He's the best shotblocker in the league and if they could have milked a couple more seasons out of his kidneys, he'd be a good 15-20 minute guy.

[ChumpDumper]

There's no need to publicize going after an RFA until the deal is made and the clock starts, and the Spurs really won't know what to offer until the amount of the MLE is known since these guys probably won't require all of it.

We need to go after Butler hard. Zeke just picked up the option on Ime Udoka, so they will be carrying 15 players under contract when he signs both his picks. It's going to be hard for him to match Butler in favor of one of his projects/picks and even harder to convince Dolan that matching and waiving another guaranteed deal (likely a smaller one) is a good idea.

[MaNu4Tres]

I would have loved Zo for a year. The man plays like he has a pair down low. Unlike our last two centers.

[clubalien]

looks like the spurs front office is tilling ludden to put out articles about players we aren't getting. I guess to keep fans from exploding from the wait tell the KG trade is pulled off?

[MaNu4Tres]

I would like to see what cavs do with drew gooden.
Kori do you have any inside information about what ferry is going to do with drew?

[timvp]

It's obvious to me the Spurs want a shotblocking center. Going after Przybilla and Mourning, two of the best shotblockers in the league, wasn't an accident.

Of the remaining centers, Butler is the best shotblocker. Hopefully that is who they are after.

[clubalien]

spurs refused to get ZO when KiDD wanted him
and that is why kidd is a net today

[El_Mago]

Ferry is letting Drew test the waters....no-one is biting.

Ferry's intention is to resign Drew according to reports once the LeBron deal was done, now that it is, Drew becomes priority.

If anything, Ferry would like to move Zydrunas.

[trueD]

Betcha Zo was just being polite (acting interested in joining a team after 13 years with the current World Champs). Polite is nice. :angel

Mourning: "I'm on such a high right now," he said. "I'm really enjoying the moment. I'm not thinking about basketball right now."

[ChumpDumper]

Gooden is frustrating because he can be as great a player as he wants to be. Problem is he's already as good as he ever wants to be. Zero upside.

[Russ]

I hope this is just the Spurs' front office idea of a good joke. They couldn't even get a second look from Mourning when Jason Kidd was trying to close the deal. Jeez . . .

Come on guys . . .

[trueD]

I would like to see what cavs do with drew gooden.
Kori do you have any inside information about what ferry is going to do with drew?Gooden would be a great take, if Spurs can afford him (I think he's making 10 mil). Scot Pollard plays his heart out on D under the basket, keeps the other bigs very honest...but doesn't have much gas left.

[MaNu4Tres]

Gooden is better than any big left in free agency

[Solid D]

The Spurs could offer Mourning more than the vet minimum, so I'm sure Mourning had to at least think about it.

[trueD]

Excuse me, Gooden only makes 4 mil, but now that LeBron has signed his extension, you know...

[MaNu4Tres]

Although, I do like Butler's age and upside.

[MannyIsGod]

It's obvious to me the Spurs want a shotblocking center. Going after Przybilla and Mourning, two of the best shotblockers in the league, wasn't an accident.

Of the remaining centers, Butler is the best shotblocker. Hopefully that is who they are after.I know we all keep amending this, but I think everyone has to agree that an offseason of adding Javaktovas/Butler plus trading Rasho and getting rid of Nazr has to be considered very successful.

[MannyIsGod]

Gooden is probably the leauge's worst defensive big man. I'm going to go ahead and say no thanks.

[MaNu4Tres]

javtokas isn't a guarantee he hasn't proven anything yet. Butler has proven playin 13 minutes a game. Gooden is better than the both of them.

[MaNu4Tres]

gooden could guard dirk effectively just like haslem . What am i bitching about anyway spurs won't get gooden. Cavs will match anything between 5-8 million.

[Kori Ellis]

Gooden is a horrible defender. That's pretty insulting to Haslem.

[MaNu4Tres]

I'm just saying gooden has all the assets to guard dirk more effectively than any spur.

And if there were stats to prove how much of a horrible defender you all say he is. I'd like to see them.

[MaNu4Tres]

I can't believe im defending drew gooden.

[MannyIsGod]

Well, you've already done more defending than Gooden will ever do. Gooden will not be a Spur this year or hopefully any year. He's a horribly overrated player.

[MaNu4Tres]

Take it for what its worth... Gooden is 5th in Offensive rebounds per 48 minutes and 8th in rebounds per 48 minutes and 16th in field goal percentage...

Rebounding was an achilles' heel for the spurs last year

[trueD]

Gooden played about 3 good games in the playoffs. He started in Game 2 against Wizards and was 11-12, 24/16 in 39 minutes. Though an abberation, his career stats of 10.7/8.4 aren't too shabby, considering what's out there.

[timvp]

If the Spurs want shotblocking, I can imagine them pulling off a Brent Barry for Brendan Haywood deal. Haywood is probably the best shotblocker that the Spurs can get at this point. Plus he's fallen out of favor in Washington.

Makes sense to me.

:smokin

[T Park]

Typical CIA...

[boutons_]

What do you get when you milk kidneys?

[T Park]

If the Spurs want shotblocking, I can imagine them pulling off a Brent Barry for Brendan Haywood deal. Haywood is probably the best shotblocker that the Spurs can get at this point. Plus he's fallen out of favor in Washington.

Makes sense to me.


Brendan Haywood also is DECENT offensively.


Might be another Nazr Mohammed though.

[timvp]

What do you get when you milk kidneys?

Championships, I guess.

[timvp]

Would any Spurs fan be against a Barry for Haywood swap? That trade makes a lot of sense, especially considering the Wizards have been looking for a SG and it would save the Spurs some money.

[rayray2k8]

Would any Spurs fan be against a Barry for Haywood swap? That trade makes a lot of sense, especially considering the Wizards have been looking for a SG and it would save the Spurs some money.
At this point I dont see how anybody would argue about trading for a starting Center.

[ChumpDumper]

I think the Bullets might go for that if Blatche or Ramos were anywhere close to consistent contribution.

[Beer is Good]

As long as Haywood comes to play. He has had a habit of laziness in the past, can't afford that on this team.

[timvp]

I think the Bullets might go for that if Blatche or Ramos were anywhere close to consistent contribution.

Etan Thomas was starting at center by the end of the year.

They also have Ruffin.

[rayray2k8]

Fuck it, lets just get David Robinson to come back.
I think thats the only way to keep spurs fans happy.
Wonder how his back is feeling....

:shootme

[polandprzem]

I think the Bullets might go for that if Blatche or Ramos were anywhere close to consistent contribution.

Bullets?


:D

[ChumpDumper]

Etan Thomas was starting at center by the end of the year.

They also have Ruffin.Who started in the playoffs?

Again, if the Wiz thought they could replace his blocking with one of their younger guys or another FA, they'd probably do it.

[ChumpDumper]

Bullets?


:DYeah.

[polandprzem]

Nobody is thinking about Brezec?

I am surprised. He showed last season that he can be effective, but I don't think the Bobcats agree to a trade.

[timvp]

Brezec isn't a good enough defender.

[shaggy17]

Us trying to go after fucking ZO??? Ughhhhh God this team is fucking stupid now no offense to zo but we dont need him because he isnt a fucking starter. Well its time to realize and accept our title runs are over and done with! This just put the icing on the cake with that sign of desperation. I feel so bad for Duncan as his fucking prime is getting pissed away by these fucking pricks!!! :cuss :flipoff :pctoss to our coach and front office since May 2006 and they deserve every single bit of it!!

[polandprzem]

Brezec isn't a good enough defender.

Do we only have one option?

Thomases, Harringtons, Haywoodses.

Anybody big with some D?

[Kibic]

:blah :king

It is obvious now. Spurs did not trade Rasho. It was more like he ask for trade.

[polandprzem]

Pachulia isn't good enough also?

4M/year

[shaggy17]

Pachulia isn't good enough also?

4M/year

That is way way too much for the cheap bastards running this organization! Remember we are saving up for future cap room in 2010-2011 while wasting Duncans prime away :depressed

[polandprzem]

Duncan have no prime !

[polandprzem]

Do you guys speak English in Poland?

do you have brains in america?


He had no prime, he has no prime, he won't have prime

^^^^^^^^^^^^
whcich one you choose?

[shaggy17]

Whatever you want to call it Polish dude, the fact remains these pricks are wasting the remaining years of this trio so they can have fucking cap space in 2011 which to me is so stupid! This team is built to win NOW not LATER but they have their heads up their asses so no point in trying to explain this shit to them!!

[shaggy17]

Fuck it, lets just get David Robinson to come back.
I think thats the only way to keep spurs fans happy.
Wonder how his back is feeling....

:shootme

:lol BTW I LOVE DX!! They have helped me cope with our managements stupidity

[Mr. Body]

A Barry for Haywood trade would be hard to take. His runs to $6M in 2010. I'd have to think we'd be looking to dump that salary within two years, but at least it's not as horrible as Nesterovic's contract.

If we have to do it, we have to do it. I'll pinch my nose.

[polandprzem]

Whatever you want to call it Polish dude, the fact remains these pricks are wasting the remaining years of this trio so they can have fucking cap space in 2011 which to me is so stupid! This team is built to win NOW not LATER but they have their heads up their asses so no point in trying to explain this shit to them!!

We all know that. But they will have more possibilieties during the season.
I think there is still plenty of time in the season for a trade.

[timvp]

A Barry for Haywood trade would be hard to take. His runs to $6M in 2010. I'd have to think we'd be looking to dump that salary within two years, but at least it's not as horrible as Nesterovic's contract.

If we have to do it, we have to do it. I'll pinch my nose.

Haywood's remaining contract is 4-year, $21M.

That's a pretty good value for a starting center.

[Mr. Body]

Haywood's remaining contract is 4-year, $21M.

That's a pretty good value for a starting center.

No, it's not bad. I'm going more on the presumption that Javtokas and then Mahinmi will be the starting centers soon enough, as the FO expects, and they're not looking for long contracts there.

[timvp]

No, it's not bad. I'm going more on the presumption that Javtokas and then Mahinmi will be the starting centers soon enough, as the FO expects, and they're not looking for long contracts there.

I've never heard the front office suggest that Javtokas is a NBA starting center. Mahinmi's prime is long after Tony and Tim hang it up.

[polandprzem]

:lol


:tu

[Mr. Body]

I've never heard the front office suggest that Javtokas is a NBA starting center. Mahinmi's prime is long after Tony and Tim hang it up.

Javtokas should be starting at least by next year. At least we're not sure, but he definitely has the tools to start. Mahinmi could be sliding in behind him in the rotation by the time Oberto's contract is up.

Ergo, overpaying for a guy who merely can start in the NBA (Brendan Haywood) is not the best idea. At least not this summer. If Javtokas shows himself incapable of holding it down, then next summer go shopping again.

This summer I see them going for an expiring or someone cheap. Mourning obviously fit the second bill. The European guys fit the first.

Maybe they do trade for a Brendan Haywood, but they'd do it expecting to dump him in two years.

[shaggy17]

As long as Ian is a bust with a cheap short term contract then its a steal for the spurs front office :blah :tu :tu

[picnroll]

Butler and Woods and a project backup PG and call it an off season.

[mabber]

Betcha Zo was just being polite (acting interested in joining a team after 13 years with the current World Champs). Polite is nice. :angel

Mourning: "I'm on such a high right now," he said. "I'm really enjoying the moment. I'm not thinking about basketball right now."

I'd heard there was strong interest from several teams in Zo. I think he was just playing it out to get the biggest offer he could from the Heat. He's not going anywhere if he decides not to retire (sounds like he's gonna play again).

[George Gervin's Afro]

Viable inexpensive option. I have no problem with the thinking.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

spurs refused to get ZO when KiDD wanted him
and that is why kidd is a net today

It wasn't that they didn't want Zo, it was that they didn't want him for 5 million a year.

And in retrospect, thank God that didn't happen, Kidd has done nothing but gone down hill since.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

gooden could guard dirk effectively just like haslem . What am i bitching about anyway spurs won't get gooden. Cavs will match anything between 5-8 million.

Manu4Tres, you don't get it. Gooden sucks defensively. He couldn't guard my grandma on the low block, let alone any decent offensive player in the league.


Would any Spurs fan be against a Barry for Haywood swap? That trade makes a lot of sense, especially considering the Wizards have been looking for a SG and it would save the Spurs some money.

Actually it makes a lot of sense, especially given how Pecherov has been doing on their summer league team so far.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Us trying to go after fucking ZO??? Ughhhhh God this team is fucking stupid now no offense to zo but we dont need him because he isnt a fucking starter. Well its time to realize and accept our title runs are over and done with! This just put the icing on the cake with that sign of desperation. I feel so bad for Duncan as his fucking prime is getting pissed away by these fucking pricks!!! :cuss :flipoff :pctoss to our coach and front office since May 2006 and they deserve every single bit of it!!

What the fuck is your problem? We're not looking for a center to go out and average 20, 10, and 5. We're looking for someone to rebound and block shots, and Zo would have been perfect in that role.

Damn, put down the fucking keyboard, go find a cliff, and get it over with.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Javtokas should be starting at least by next year. At least we're not sure, but he definitely has the tools to start. Mahinmi could be sliding in behind him in the rotation by the time Oberto's contract is up.


Man, a lot of people sure are overvaluing Javtokas. How many games have you seen him play? I guarantee the Spurs front office has seen him play more than you, and they don't think he's starter quality.

Typical Spurstalk, overhyping one of our foreign draftees into the next Spur Hall of Famer...

[mabber]

What the fuck is your problem? We're not looking for a center to go out and average 20, 10, and 5. We're looking for someone to rebound and block shots, and Zo would have been perfect in that role.

Damn, put down the fucking keyboard, go find a cliff, and get it over with.

Yeah, Zo would have been a perfect fit for the Spurs. I'm damn glad y'all didn't get him. I don't know if the Heat beat the Mavs w/o him. I know they don't win game 6 w/o Zo.

[my2sons]

The Spurs have no clue. Mourning is old and ready to retire.
we got three trophies that say you got no clue

[Mr. Body]

Man, a lot of people sure are overvaluing Javtokas. How many games have you seen him play? I guarantee the Spurs front office has seen him play more than you, and they don't think he's starter quality.

Typical Spurstalk, overhyping one of our foreign draftees into the next Spur Hall of Famer...

Did I say he was a Hall of Famer, you idiot? I said he has the tools to be a good starter.

The Spurs FO damn well think he is starter quality or else they wouldn't have traded Rasho, let Nazr walk, and low-balled Przybilla. They just don't think he's starter material yet. He has the tools at least to be a Stephen Hunter in this league. That's objectively obvious and, really, not that hard to do.

[FromWayDowntown]

What the fuck is your problem? We're not looking for a center to go out and average 20, 10, and 5. We're looking for someone to rebound and block shots, and Zo would have been perfect in that role.

Damn, put down the fucking keyboard, go find a cliff, and get it over with.

That's the part of all of the complaining that I don't get.

Other than maybe Ben Wallace, there isn't an available center who can be a difference-maker. The Spurs weren't going to get Ben Wallace. So what's left is a group of guys who bring a variety of skills and tools to the table, but none of whom is ever likely to be an All-Star or much more than a servicable role-player for the duration of his next contract (even Pryzbilla). Why spend money and get tied down long term to a guy who will never be anything more than marginal or slightly above-average at best?

The Spurs decided last year that centers that move at glacial pace -- guys who aren't particularly athletic and don't tend to do a lot of things really, really well -- don't fit well with the core of the current team in the context of the rest of the NBA. Pop didn't try it against Dallas, because Sacramento proved it in the First Round. So, in the offseason, it makes sense that the goal, other than making a run for Ben Wallace, is to find players who have more athleticism than Rasho or Nazr and who can at least provide that to this team at the center spot. If its Jarron Collins or Brendan Haywood or Lorenzen Wright or whomever else, the point is that the Spurs are seeking center-types who can move around and do some things that allow them to be productive enough on the glass to stay on the floor against more athletic teams, while providing some resistance against the handful of traditional centers who are in the league.

It's not about being cheap, it's about being smart.

[mabber]

That's the part of all of the complaining that I don't get.

Other than maybe Ben Wallace, there isn't an available center who can be a difference-maker. The Spurs weren't going to get Ben Wallace. So what's left is a group of guys who bring a variety of skills and tools to the table, but none of whom is ever likely to be an All-Star or much more than a servicable role-player for the duration of his next contract (even Pryzbilla). Why spend money and get tied down long term to a guy who will never be anything more than marginal or slightly above-average at best?

The Spurs decided last year that centers that move at glacial pace -- guys who aren't particularly athletic and don't tend to do a lot of things really, really well -- don't fit well with the core of the current team in the context of the rest of the NBA. Pop didn't try it against Dallas, because Sacramento proved it in the First Round. So, in the offseason, it makes sense that the goal, other than making a run for Ben Wallace, is to find players who have more athleticism than Rasho or Nazr and who can at least provide that to this team at the center spot. If its Jarron Collins or Brendan Haywood or Lorenzen Wright or whomever else, the point is that the Spurs are seeking center-types who can move around and do some things that allow them to be productive enough on the glass to stay on the floor against more athletic teams, while providing some resistance against the handful of traditional centers who are in the league.

It's not about being cheap, it's about being smart.

Yeah, that's what they need. Diop in Dallas is a good example of the type of center the Spurs need. Diop made all the difference in the Dallas/Phoenix series cuz he was athletic enough to be able to stay on the court, yet he's somewhat capable of guarding bigger, slower centers (other than Shaq).

[T Park]

Hey Shaggy,

heres the fuckin rope.

Go swing from the shower rod already. Fuck........

[Mr.Bottomtooth]

Hey Shaggy,

heres the fuckin rope.

Go swing from the shower rod already. Fuck........
Just took the words right outta my mouth. Dude, Shaggy, you need to shut up already. It says you are a Spurs fan but you talk nothing but shit about them. I'm getting tired of you. If you're really a Spurs fan act like it. Right now you're acting like you're a Mavs fan. So get your act together or everybody's gonna be hating on you. Is your job being a professional pessimist or what?

[T Park]

we didnt blow money on Pryzbilla

AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH HHHHHHHHHHH

[exstatic]

Ignore list works for me. I just wish that feature didn't show their posts at all, instead of just hiding them within the thread. I also wish people would stop FUCKING QUOTING HIS POSTS, Dammit!!! :lol

[FromWayDowntown]

we didnt blow money on Pryzbilla

AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH HHHHHHHHHHH


Well, wait a second -- the Spurs were willing to "blow money" on Przybilla, just not another year's worth of money.

I don't understand the hand-wringing about cheapness when those who complain are mostly talking about throwing money at anyone, regardless of that player's quality. But the Spurs must have believed that Przybilla was enough above the average to warrant making a market price offer (MLE) for a period of several years. Wanting to hedge their bet by limiting the length of that contract seems like a smart move by a franchise that just got burned on a long and expensive contract for an underperforming center.

I'm not sure why some question the decision-making in being reluctant to overspend for players who are most likely not going to be able to justify big contracts. I guess it just sets those people up to complain in a couple of years about how a contract was unwise and has handcuffed the franchise.

[T Park]

BUT FWD

if you don't blow money stupidly.

Your cheap.

Plain and simple.

[leemajors]

As long as Ian is a bust with a cheap short term contract then its a steal for the spurs front office :blah :tu :tu

why don't you save yourself the time of typing the same thing over and over, and us the time of having to scroll past your posts. your front office blathering can be summed up with this: :blah

[shaggy17]

Just took the words right outta my mouth. Dude, Shaggy, you need to shut up already. It says you are a Spurs fan but you talk nothing but shit about them. I'm getting tired of you. If you're really a Spurs fan act like it. Right now you're acting like you're a Mavs fan. So get your act together or everybody's gonna be hating on you. Is your job being a professional pessimist or what?

:rolleyes So I cant criticize them?? I am not a spurs fan if I dog them like they deserve at the moment? I love the spurs but right now I am going to be like this till they fucking do something! When/If they do something then maybe MAYBE I will start to be confident in them again. I just think it is really stupid to defend them right now when they havent dont a damn thing!

[shaggy17]

What the fuck is your problem? We're not looking for a center to go out and average 20, 10, and 5. We're looking for someone to rebound and block shots, and Zo would have been perfect in that role.

Damn, put down the fucking keyboard, go find a cliff, and get it over with.

I dont want a superstar type of center but Zo cant play heavy minutes anymore! That is the type of center I want as well a person who does the dirty work and is an enforcer/agressive player in the paint

[shaggy17]

Hey Shaggy,

heres the fuckin rope.

Go swing from the shower rod already. Fuck........

Ummmm whatever the hell that means :rolleyes . "If the Spurs stop being cheap I will not post for a year" comon Tpark say it I know you want to :angel

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

:rolleyes So I cant criticize them?? I am not a spurs fan if I dog them like they deserve at the moment? I love the spurs but right now I am going to be like this till they fucking do something! When/If they do something then maybe MAYBE I will start to be confident in them again. I just think it is really stupid to defend them right now when they havent dont a damn thing!

Well, judging by the article about Zo, they are doing something, so why don't you shut up and see what happens?



I dont want a superstar type of center but Zo cant play heavy minutes anymore! That is the type of center I want as well a person who does the dirty work and is an enforcer/agressive player in the paint

David Robinson couldn't play heavy minutes his last year either, why don't you go bitch about that?

[shaggy17]

why don't you save yourself the time of typing the same thing over and over, and us the time of having to scroll past your posts. your front office blathering can be summed up with this: :blah
:lol

[shaggy17]

Well, judging by the article about Zo, they are doing something, so why don't you shut up and see what happens?




David Robinson couldn't play heavy minutes his last year either, why don't you go bitch about that?

Stop acting like you havent been hard on the front office either! You have been pissed off with them as well so stop contradicting yourself :rolleyes

[FromWayDowntown]

:rolleyes So I cant criticize them?? I am not a spurs fan if I dog them like they deserve at the moment? I love the spurs but right now I am going to be like this till they fucking do something! When/If they do something then maybe MAYBE I will start to be confident in them again. I just think it is really stupid to defend them right now when they havent dont a damn thing!

So is doing anything preferrable to doing something smart?

I'd say at this point, the Spurs have already done something positive this offseason by ridding themselves of Rasho's contract and acquiring a couple of expiring contracts that, at the very least, can be used to make later trades. That's at least something productive.

Don't say they haven't done anything; say that they haven't made a rash move to overpay anyone.

[Enygmatic]

Can we at least agree that this has been a "less than productive" off season. I mean other than dumping off Rasho's contract we still have a Back up PG problem and the obvious starting center problem. Its gonna be about what we are willing to give up in order to fix these problems. We can either give up personel or we can give up next season. Grant it we were one foul away from moving on to the next round, everyone else seems to be getting better...but if I know the spurs they are gonna be ok no matter what they do. I mean shit we didnt really do much after 200.4 and we won the title back next year...

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Stop acting like you havent been hard on the front office either! You have been pissed off with them as well so stop contradicting yourself :rolleyes

I was pissed when it appeared as though they weren't doing anything. Like I said, Ludden's article about Zo proves they are still working on the center situation.

That gives them a reprieve from me.

Why don't you go log in under one of your other user names and give yourself some backup?

[shaggy17]

I was pissed when it appeared as though they weren't doing anything. Like I said, Ludden's article about Zo proves they are still working on the center situation.

That gives them a reprieve from me.

Why don't you go log in under one of your other user names and give yourself some backup?

I dont have "another user name" so I will argue all my points with this one only if that is okay with you :lol

[ChumpDumper]

Can we at least agree that this has been a "less than productive" off season.No.

It's July 9.

[FromWayDowntown]

Can we at least agree that this has been a "less than productive" off season.

Jettisoning Rasho's deal is FAR more than I expected from the Spurs this off-season. All else is just icing, IMO.

[Enygmatic]

No.

It's July 9.


I meant So Far....

[ChumpDumper]

I meant I won't make ANY overall judgments on July 9.

[Bruno]

For the moment Spurs have had a good offseason :
- Spurs have traded Rasho + $1M for Bonner + Williams + 2009 2nd round pick.
Dumping Rasho for expiring players that can be usefull is a great deal.
- Spurs have traded their second round pick for a 2007 second round pick (the best between Bucks and Houston). Trading a 59th pick for a future pick in a deeper draft who will likely be between 40th and 50th is a great trade.
- Spurs will sign Javtokas : good move, he seems to be a quite good player.
- The only mistake you can think they have done is with Scola : not signing him and not trading his rights isn't maybe the best solution.

So good start.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

- The only mistake you can think they have done is with Scola : not signing him and not trading his rights isn't maybe the best solution.

It's way too early to say that how they've handled the situation is a mistake.

[Bruno]

It's way too early to say that how they've handled the situation is a mistake.

Agree, that's why I say maybe.

[Slinkyman]

I have to think as long as we add a back up SF and another big (other then Jak) it's a good offseason, whether we trade for them or sign them those are two positions that need to be filled before next season. I don't care at this point if they're NBA players or from overseas, just find someone that can come in and contribute.

[Obstructed_View]

Ummmm whatever the hell that means :rolleyes
What it means is that you have declared defeat before the fucking free agent period even starts. That wouldn't be a big deal, except you've done it A THOUSAND TIMES in the last five days. You think the front office is cheap. We. Fucking. Get. It. What T Park is saying is that if you have nothing better to keep posting than useless sarcastic shit over and over and over and over you should hang yourself from the shower curtain and do us all a favor.

[picnroll]

Signing Mourning to a two-year contract with a healthy raise from the $1.1 million he made last season also would have fit well with the Spurs' financial plans: Duncan, Tony Parker and Manu Ginobili are the team's only players currently under contract after the 2007-08 season.

Holting Pattern V1.1. If they hold tight to a strategy of freeing up cap space for the 2008 off season the Spurs will be severely limited in the moves they can make.

[ShoogarBear]

Would any Spurs fan be against a Barry for Haywood swap? That trade makes a lot of sense, especially considering the Wizards have been looking for a SG and it would save the Spurs some money.
Yes.

Brendan Haywood is Mr. Half-Assed himself. At least Rasho/Nazr were trying out there.

[ShoogarBear]

Not only that, the Wiz are highly sensitized to trading a (relatively) young big guy for an old little guy. See Webber/Richmond. The Spurs would probably have to give something else up.

[shaggy17]

What it means is that you have declared defeat before the fucking free agent period even starts. That wouldn't be a big deal, except you've done it A THOUSAND TIMES in the last five days. You think the front office is cheap. We. Fucking. Get. It. What T Park is saying is that if you have nothing better to keep posting than useless sarcastic shit over and over and over and over you should hang yourself from the shower curtain and do us all a favor.

You wanna keep acting like I am the only one upset with them at the moment???? :rolleyes Unless we fucking do something, I wont stop on this shit. From reading all these express articles as well, it seems like we are in a real tough spot and trying to not spend much more but it doesnt deserve any criticizing??? I love this team and I wont stop being a true die hard fan of them but I will diss them when it is needed. How cant I think negative thoughts on the direction of this team with the days passing by and the smoke clearing up?? If we do something (Which believe it or not I actually am still holding out a tad of hope for despite my posts) I will gladly eat crow.

[Obstructed_View]

You wanna keep acting like I am the only one upset with them at the moment???? :rolleyes Unless we fucking do something, I wont stop on this shit. From reading all these express articles as well, it seems like we are in a real tough spot and trying to not spend much more but it doesnt deserve any criticizing??? I love this team and I wont stop being a true die hard fan of them but I will diss them when it is needed. How cant I think negative thoughts on the direction of this team with the days passing by and the smoke clearing up?? If we do something (Which believe it or not I actually am still holding out a tad of hope for despite my posts) I will gladly eat crow.
Don't act like you are being reasonable in questioning the direction of the team or the long term plan of the front office when you fucking post this shit thirty times a day. If you posted up every week or even every two or three days to say "I'm worried about their plans" that would be one thing, but every single post is some smart ass sarcastic shit about how the Spurs are gonig to stick their dicks in their asses because the owner's a cheap shit and the Spurs don't want to ever win a basketball game again. Like I said. We get it. I'm not acting like you are the only one upset, but you are the only one that won't fucking let it go long enough to stop ruining every thread with your idiotic ranting. Nobody is looking forward to having to read 50 of your posts a day from now until the trade deadline, and they don't want to have to wish the Spurs would just make a trade or sign someone terrible just so you'll get your head out of the fucking oven.

[Despot]

You wanna keep acting like I am the only one upset with them at the moment???? :rolleyes Unless we fucking do something, I wont stop on this shit. From reading all these express articles as well, it seems like we are in a real tough spot and trying to not spend much more but it doesnt deserve any criticizing??? I love this team and I wont stop being a true die hard fan of them but I will diss them when it is needed. How cant I think negative thoughts on the direction of this team with the days passing by and the smoke clearing up?? If we do something (Which believe it or not I actually am still holding out a tad of hope for despite my posts) I will gladly eat crow.

Don't you get it? The problem is that in your posts you rarely contribute to the basketball discussion, and when you do, you are mostly off base and uninformed. Not to mention that you complain about the FO in just about every post, it has gotten pretty annoying that you are the cause for alot of threads going off-topic. Wanna talk about trades? I would trade you for a few Mavs Trolls about now, your bantering is making threads painful to come in and read.

[shaggy17]

Don't act like you are being reasonable in questioning the direction of the team or the long term plan of the front office when you fucking post this shit thirty times a day. If you posted up every week or even every two or three days to say "I'm worried about their plans" that would be one thing, but every single post is some smart ass sarcastic shit about how the Spurs are gonig to stick their dicks in their asses because the owner's a cheap shit and the Spurs don't want to ever win a basketball game again. Like I said. We get it. I'm not acting like you are the only one upset, but you are the only one that won't fucking let it go long enough to stop ruining every thread with your idiotic ranting. Nobody is looking forward to having to read 50 of your posts a day from now until the trade deadline, and they don't want to have to wish the Spurs would just make a trade or sign someone terrible just so you'll get your head out of the fucking oven.

:lmao :angel You made your point trying to use insulting cussing towards me. Nice title by the way because you obviously live up to the f-bomb king label . Believe it or not some people here actually do agree with my posts so you can stop the BS about that as well! Nice post though I got some good laughs reading your graphic description on my views of them are...ah good stuff :lol

[shaggy17]

Don't you get it? The problem is that in your posts you rarely contribute to the basketball discussion, and when you do, you are mostly off base and uninformed. Not to mention that you complain about the FO in just about every post, it has gotten pretty annoying that you are the cause for alot of threads going off-topic. Wanna talk about trades? I would trade you for a few Mavs Trolls about now, your bantering is making threads painful to come in and read.

Well thanks I do appreciate the honesty :lol. However saying my arguments are stupid and defending the front office is pretty lame but to each their own

[ChumpDumper]

You're a one-take pony.

You've got nothing else.

[Obstructed_View]

:lmao :angel You made your point trying to use insulting cussing towards me. Nice title by the way because you obviously live up to the f-bomb king label . Believe it or not some people here actually do agree with my posts so you can stop the BS about that as well! Nice post though I got some good laughs reading your graphic description on my views of them are...ah good stuff :lol
Um, when I use "insulting cussing" towards you, you will know. I'm just frustrated with how stupid you appear to be. There may be people that agree with you, but about 90 percent of your posts state the same idea over and over and over. There are more people that agree with me that you should get over it and actually try to bring something constructive to the conversation. I suspect that you actually have nothing else to bring, which is why you repeat the same thing over and over. Trust me, it's not insightful enough to require repetition.

[shaggy17]

You're a one-take pony.

You've got nothing else.

:huh I said to each their own. I have my views on them and you can agree to disagree to them.

[ChumpDumper]

You have one view.

[Obstructed_View]

You have one view.
Damn, you beat me to it. :lol

[shaggy17]

You have one view.

1.)I have been critical of our front office because I have a serious fear that they are going to waste the final years of Duncan and it would kill me to see that

2.)I hated small ball and thought it was a retarded strategy

3.)I am excited about the intangables that Javtokas brings to the team

4.)I really want to see us land a heir for Bowen

5.)As much as I have pissed on management, I would take it over Isiah Thomas and many others in this league


I have views on many other things. I wont lie I am worried shitless on Duncan along with the other 2 guys from the trio best years being wasted and my fear of team implosion could be a reality. It pained me to watch the Mavs beat us last year with how that series went. I dont want superstar players, just want us to find some solid guys who will help this team get payback on the Mavs next season and bring the title back here. I vent and am frusterated because I am eager to have a good vibe for next season like it was for us in the summer of 2004 when we got all the right pieces in a hurry!

[ChumpDumper]

I have views on many other things.Prove it.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

:lmao :angel You made your point trying to use insulting cussing towards me. Nice title by the way because you obviously live up to the f-bomb king label . Believe it or not some people here actually do agree with my posts so you can stop the BS about that as well! Nice post though I got some good laughs reading your graphic description on my views of them are...ah good stuff :lol

Yeah, there's some people that agree with you. The difference is that they don't post the same thing 100 times in the same fucking thread.

We get it, you hate the front office, you hate that we haven't done anything in a week of free agency.

You've made your point, so quit posting the same shit over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over.

[shaggy17]

Hate is too strong of a word. I am frusterated and impatient with them. Your sig is something we actually agree on :lol

[SenorSpur]

1.)I have been critical of our front office because I have a serious fear that they are going to waste the final years of Duncan and it would kill me to see that

2.)I hated small ball and thought it was a retarded strategy

3.)I am excited about the intangables that Javtokas brings to the team

4.)I really want to see us land a heir for Bowen

5.)As much as I have pissed on management, I would take it over Isiah Thomas and many others in this league


I have views on many other things. I wont lie I am worried shitless on Duncan along with the other 2 guys from the trio best years being wasted and my fear of team implosion could be a reality. It pained me to watch the Mavs beat us last year with how that series went. I dont want superstar players, just want us to find some solid guys who will help this team get payback on the Mavs next season and bring the title back here. I vent and am frusterated because I am eager to have a good vibe for next season like it was for us in the summer of 2004 when we got all the right pieces in a hurry!

Well said. I can't add anything further.

[Bruno]

Yeah, there's some people that agree with you. The difference is that they don't post the same thing 100 times in the same fucking thread.


... and some people post 100 times a day that Pop is bad coach. ;)

[FromWayDowntown]

1.)I have been critical of our front office because I have a serious fear that they are going to waste the final years of Duncan and it would kill me to see that

I'm sure the FO is just being spiteful and, deep down inside, is completely unwilling to do anything that might allow Tim Duncan to win another championship before he retires.

In fact, they've done just the opposite -- they've created flexibility that didn't exist before while bringing in at least one player who has a fighting chance to be productive in a playoff series against Dallas or Phoenix. Why isn't that progress?


2.)I hated small ball and thought it was a retarded strategy

Because the Rasho and Nazr who couldn't do a damned thing against Sacramento were suddenly going to find some secret recipe to get things done against a much, much better Mavericks team? If you really think that, I'll just stop paying attention to anything you write from here on out.


3.)I am excited about the intangables that Javtokas brings to the team

What intangibles are those. If Javtokas can be productive for 10-12 minutes per night and stay on the floor at playoff time, he's a plus. Anyone who expects more than that from him has unrealistic expectations, IMO. The FO has said he's a rotation guy at best. In some cases, rotation guys make a difference, but mostly that difference is not a big difference.


4.)I really want to see us land a heir for Bowen

Should the FO just make one appear out of thin air? Should they overspend for players who don't have anything resembling the ability Bowen has on the off chance that such players might suddenly find whatever it is that Bowen has that makes him so great. I'd much rather that the FO take its time and make a reasonable decision in pursuing that need than flying off at the handle for the sake of getting something done and making a mistake.


5.)As much as I have pissed on management, I would take it over Isiah Thomas and many others in this league

That's marginally reasonable. A begrudging acceptance?


I wont lie I am worried shitless on Duncan along with the other 2 guys from the trio best years being wasted and my fear of team implosion could be a reality.

I don't think the FO has any intention to wasting the next few years. But I also don't think the FO has any desire to make rash moves that will end up being net negatives. There's no rule that says the Spurs will enter the 2007 playoffs with the team that starts the 2006-07 season. Even if they don't make a boatload of splashy moves this summer, they have the ability to make deals that might actually put them in better shape to win a title than the moves you'd like to see them make this summer. Patience is useful.


It pained me to watch the Mavs beat us last year with how that series went. I dont want superstar players, just want us to find some solid guys who will help this team get payback on the Mavs next season and bring the title back here.

The Spurs had about 7 guys on the roster last season who could truly play at the level that Mavericks series demanded, in terms of athleticism. Right now, they might actually have 8 or 9, which is already an improvement. I don't understand the viewpoint that says that the Spurs needed a ridiculous amount of tinkering to be competitive with Dallas -- they were ill-suited to beat Dallas in 2006 and still almost did it. They almost did it with a hobbled Duncan, an ailing Parker, and a Ginobili who never seemed to be himself all year long. They also had a glut of 2 guards and little help up front. The FO is remaking the roster slightly to change those things and, given the choices available, they've done fairly well. There's more to come and, I'm sure, it will prove to be helpful too. The Mavericks will be there and the Spurs will get their chance -- with a roster better suited to getting the job done.


I vent and am frusterated because I am eager to have a good vibe for next season like it was for us in the summer of 2004 when we got all the right pieces in a hurry!

If the Spurs had a major FA who is key to the team's success (like Ginobili or Bowen in 2004) they would have resigned him. They didn't have that this summer. If there was a FA who seemed fit exactly what the Spurs needed for the MLE (ala Barry in 2004), they would have done whatever it took to get him. Neither of those things was true this summer, though, so comparing it to 2004 is comparing apples and oranges.

[timvp]

I was on the front office's azz because I thought they were being slow to act. Turns out they were going after Zo. Now knowing that, it's obvious that we were just under a CIA spell there for about a week.

So when a lot of us were saying the Spurs need to start trying to make the team better, they actually were. Those saying the Spurs were fine status quo were actually the ones who had it wrong. :)

This article makes it look like the Spurs will fix the hole in the middle soon. I'm not sure who but it looks like we are going to see a two-year contract for a veteran or try to get a young big for cheap.

Either way, I'm thinking something happens soon.

[furry_spurry]

I call that lowered standards. Now we are supposed to be overjoyed that they went after some guy who was never coming. Yippee! And that the Spurs will sign some cheap short-term deal-- which I said they were going to do two weeks ago.

[timvp]

I call that lowered standards. Now we are supposed to be overjoyed that they went after some guy who was never coming. Yippee! And that the Spurs will sign some cheap short-term deal-- which I said they were going to do two weeks ago.

I don't think it's really lowered standards. The Spurs are active and looking to spend money, which is better than what I believed to be happening. For a while it looked like they were just going to sit on the Rasho and Nazr savings.

Plan A, B and C were Ben Wallace, Joel Przybilla and Zo. Now we get to see what Plan D is. I'm sure going into the summer, the Spurs knew that all three of those signings were unlikely. Knowing how the Spurs work, they probably have a trade or a signing ready to go.

[shaggy17]

Because the Rasho and Nazr who couldn't do a damned thing against Sacramento were suddenly going to find some secret recipe to get things done against a much, much better Mavericks team? If you really think that, I'll just stop paying attention to anything you write from here on out.



What intangibles are those. If Javtokas can be productive for 10-12 minutes per night and stay on the floor at playoff time, he's a plus. Anyone who expects more than that from him has unrealistic expectations, IMO. The FO has said he's a rotation guy at best. In some cases, rotation guys make a difference, but mostly that difference is not a big difference.


As far saying saying Rasho and Nazr would of been the ultimate balance of powers in that series, not even close. But I truly felt it would of done something positive and prevented layups etc but none of them are spurs anymore and that series is well over and done so its time to just go with it and move on. The intangibles I am thinking of is toughness and an enforcer on this team that even with Nazr and Rasho we truly lacked. Jav seems like a guy who will put you on your ass if you try to drive and his efforts are things I really like about the guy. If someone like Stackhouse or Terry gives a cheap shot to one of our guys I see Jav getting right in his face having that guys back. I dont expect Jav to be a blanace shifting impact but I expect him to give this team some fire and energy at times. He is in no way a star but I think he can be a solid role player with this team. That is my 2 cents on him. I also am shocked that we even went after ZO. That does show me the Spurs have something they are determined to fix and I wont lie it gives me some comfort knowing that.

[FromWayDowntown]

I call that lowered standards. Now we are supposed to be overjoyed that they went after some guy who was never coming. Yippee! And that the Spurs will sign some cheap short-term deal-- which I said they were going to do two weeks ago.

So you would have preferred that they spend a lot of money over a long term contract for one of the schlubs that was available in this market?

Just curious.

[furry_spurry]

So you would have preferred that they spend a lot of money over a long term contract for one of the schlubs that was available in this market?

Just curious.
No- I just want honesty. The Spurs are not going to spend the money they are saving- they need to quit pretending they are- by announcing low ball offers and attempts to go after players that were never coming. Trades are not to improve basketball-wise, but to lessen payroll,and players are not re-signed to decrease expenses. How does talking to Zo mean the Spurs were going to spend $$? As for some signing- it will be cheap- we know that.

[timvp]

No- I just want honesty. The Spurs are not going to spend the money they are saving- they need to quit pretending they are- by announcing low ball offers and attempts to go after players that were never coming. Trades are not to improve basketball-wise, but to lessen payroll,and players are not re-signed to decrease expenses. How does talking to Zo mean the Spurs were going to spend $$? As for some signing- it will be cheap- we know that.

You could be right but we'll see in the coming week. If the Spurs are going to make a splash, it'll be sometime before Friday.

If the Spurs pocket the money after lowballing Przybilla and going after an untouchable (Zo), that'd be a new low for the franchise.

For the time being, I have hope that they will start filling some needs.

[FromWayDowntown]

No- I just want honesty. The Spurs are not going to spend the money they are saving- they need to quit pretending they are- by announcing low ball offers and attempts to go after players that were never coming. Trades are not to improve basketball-wise, but to lessen payroll,and players are not re-signed to decrease expenses. How does talking to Zo mean the Spurs were going to spend $$? As for some signing- it will be cheap- we know that.

I ask again -- what could they have reasonably spent money on to this point? Are you seriously bent that they didn't go in the tank for 5 years on Przybilla? Would you be happier if they dropped 5 years at the MLE on Jared Jeffries or some other player who won't get an offer anywhere near that amount?

I'm honestly curious -- who is on the market that warrants a 5 year offer at the full MLE to show that the Spurs aren't cheap?

[my2sons]

Ok shag, who would you open up the wallet for, keeping min mind all we have is lle and mle and if trading is your answer who would you trade for and how. Calling a team cheap is a very simplistic i'm taking my ball and going home argument to make, but what is your solution and how do you get that player. Who was out there besides wallace that you would want. keeping in mind that you would have had to come up w/12-15 million dollars in cap space to acquire him and if it was a sign and trade who do you trade. This is your opportunity to prove just how cheap the spurs front office really is and one other small tidbit if they did manage to trade for wallce he's 32 and signed a five year cap busting deal. I am only using him as an example since he was the big prize this off season. I'll still keep the faith with pop and crew over the spurs are too cheap argument. They have the jewlry to back up their arguments.

[furry_spurry]

I ask again -- what could they have reasonably spent money on to this point? Are you seriously bent that they didn't go in the tank for 5 years on Przybilla? Would you be happier if they dropped 5 years at the MLE on Jared Jeffries or some other player who won't get an offer anywhere near that amount?

I'm honestly curious -- who is on the market that warrants a 5 year offer at the full MLE to show that the Spurs aren't cheap?
Again- you are missing my point. I did not say the Spurs should run out and spend money. What I am saying is that they have no intention of spending the $ and are content with what they have. They traded Rasho- knowing Nazr wasn't staying- and knowing that they would not make a strong offer toward anyone. People kept wanting to believe that they had some big plan in place to replace the center but they really are OK with Oberto and Javtokas.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Again- you are missing my point. I did not say the Spurs should run out and spend money. What I am saying is that they have no intention of spending the $ and are content with what they have.

And again, you're missing his. The fact the Spurs spent the last couple of days courting Zo proves they ARE intent on spending the money.

[furry_spurry]

And again, you're missing his. The fact the Spurs spent the last couple of days courting Zo proves they ARE intent on spending the money.
And I contend two things-
1. They knew he would not come and just want it to appear they have tried
2. How much were they offering him anyway?

A well-timed report that the Spurs tried to land Zo seems more PR than anything and made people quit talking about Scola.

[leemajors]

And I contend two things-
1. They knew he would not come and just want it to appear they have tried
2. How much were they offering him anyway?

A well-timed report that the Spurs tried to land Zo seems more PR than anything and made people quit talking about Scola.

it has to be a fiscal conspiracy. i can't believe the spurs front office doesn't tell everyone what they are trying to do when they are doing it.

[timvp]

Even though I've backed off of bashing the front office, when it's all said and done furry spurry could be right.

The next week should give the answer.

[FromWayDowntown]

Again- you are missing my point. I did not say the Spurs should run out and spend money. What I am saying is that they have no intention of spending the $ and are content with what they have. They traded Rasho- knowing Nazr wasn't staying- and knowing that they would not make a strong offer toward anyone. People kept wanting to believe that they had some big plan in place to replace the center but they really are OK with Oberto and Javtokas.

You say that, but we're dealing with a market that is much better suited to frugality than to wild spending. If the Spurs decision to not spend money like crazy this summer can be tied to the fact that there are no available players who are worth spending crazy money on, doesn't that justify their decision? Would you have preferred that they keep Rasho -- a player who demonstrated throughout the playoffs that he was not reasonably capable of playing at any useful level against athletic teams -- for the sole purpose of demonstrating that the front office isn't cheap?

I don't see how you deduce some evidence of frugality from reasonable behavior in a very weak player market. So you're right -- I don't understand your argument because it seems to make no sense in light of the existing facts. I'm quite sure that if there was a true difference-maker on the market who could be had for what the Spurs have to offer -- there isn't and hasn't been this summer -- the Spurs would make the move.

[Mr. Body]

Who was talking about Scola except for Spurs junkies on early summer offseason binges? What percentage of fans know anything about him, much less his deal?

We'd forgive the org whatever they do - we don't need a P.R. campaign. Do we really think they orchestrate major communications to the city of San Antonio in order to placate the denizens of Spurstalk.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

And I contend two things-
1. They knew he would not come and just want it to appear they have tried
2. How much were they offering him anyway?

A well-timed report that the Spurs tried to land Zo seems more PR than anything and made people quit talking about Scola.

Unless we sign no one else to our team in the following two months, you're wrong on #1.

On #2, what does it really matter? Obviously not enough to convince him to leave.

[T Park]

Who gives a shit about Scola.

I swear to god, the people here saying its a mistake not signing him are such tools.

Furry Spurry = Shaggy


wayyyy too similar to not be.

[shaggy17]

Who gives a shit about Scola.

I swear to god, the people here saying its a mistake not signing him are such tools.

Furry Spurry = Shaggy


wayyyy too similar to not be.

I am sorry you are starting to get you to obsessed with me :lol. Do yourself a favor and read my previous post and that should explain to you why I said what I said kinda like what you did a year ago with that not posting for a whole year thing (not throwing an insult at you but making a point on how overreacting is human nature in being a fan and can bring out the worst in us being fans) I do have faith in the front office and I am with this team win or lose. Believe it or not I can bring other things than my overreacting bitching to this board. I like this board and I will bring in my 2 cents on various disscussions (excluding negative repetitive front office talk) as the year goes on.

[CaptainLate]

we just suck.

For next year. The FO is probably giving up on FA signings for '06-'07 and hoping we do okay. :angel

In the meantime, they are preparing for an '07-'08 splash where the draft is better and Scola will be able to come over (not that the Spurs will sign him but attempt to move up in the '07 draft.

[ChumpDumper]

Odd little blurb from Miami today:

San Antonio is believed to be offering a two-year deal worth between $3 million to $5 million for the free agent center to join the 2005 NBA champions.

http://www.local10.com/news/9492755/detail.html

[timvp]

Odd little blurb from Miami today:

San Antonio is believed to be offering a two-year deal worth between $3 million to $5 million for the free agent center to join the 2005 NBA champions.

http://www.local10.com/news/9492755/detail.html

Oh hell no. I thought the Spurs would be offering more. Like $8-10M over two-years. Are they crazy to think that they can steal Zo for $3M?

:pctoss

Perhaps I let up on the front office too soon.

[Mr. Body]

Old news, right Chump? Thought Mourning already said No.

[timvp]

Old news, right Chump? Thought Mourning already said No.

The news is that the Spurs only offered $3-5M. Way to really make a push.

:jack

[ChumpDumper]

I never heard any numbers. According to the article Miami is only offerring the vet minimum. I've never known Zo to turn down a paycheck.

[Mr. Body]

Gotcha. New news.

Shoulda thrown the MLE at him. Why not? He can get it done.

[timvp]

Gotcha. New news.

Shoulda thrown the MLE at him. Why not? He can get it done.

Let's see. Miami is offering 2-year, $2.5M. Spurs try to steal him with 2-year, $3M. :rollin

Zo would have been a pretty good two year plugin, especially if the Spurs think Mahinmi or Javtokas will be good enough to take over by then.

I think this is even weaker than when the Spurs "went after" Przybilla with a four-year deal when the rest of the NBA was offering five.

[ducks]

The Heat has already agreed to pay Mourning the veteran's minimum of $1.1 million next season.

Mourning joined the Heat after three seasons with Charlotte in 1995. He left for the New Jersey Nets prior to the 2003-04 season before being dealt to Toronto in December 2004. After being cut by the Raptors in February 2005, he returned to the Heat that March.

So is the former Georgetown standout really considering leaving for another team?

"I really haven't thought about it too much in detail," Mourning told Local 10's Todd Tongen at the ribbon-cutting ceremony. "…To tell you the truth, it's only fitting that I retire in a Heat jersey, but I really haven't made that decision yet whether or not I will come back." same article chump posted

[furry_spurry]

And that's the total for 2 years!! Isn't a vet min contract for a guy like Zo pay over $1M/season?

Hate to be right on this one, but does that really look like a real effort to sign the guy? Where are all those people claiming the Spurs were ready to spend some of that money?

[timvp]

And that's the total for 2 years!! Isn't a vet min contract for a guy like Zo pay over $1M/season?

Hate to be right on this one, but does that really look like a real effort to sign the guy? Where are all those people claiming the Spurs were ready to spend some of that money?

Yep, looks like you were right. I had hope but the Spurs are going to be damn cheap this summer.

:pctoss

[furry_spurry]

There's still hope. :) I'm usually wrong about things. Never get in line behind me anywhere.

[timvp]

We'll know soon. Last summer everything dragged on because of the Allan Houston Rule. This summer, things will be wrapping up in a week or two.

[Solid D]

Forthcoming Official Salary Cap news should open up things like Vicks VapoRub.

http://vicks.com/images/vaporub_prod.gif

[timvp]

Hopefully the Spurs don't eat the Rasho and Nazr savings like Vicks Vapor Rub.

[ShoogarBear]

A Vicks Vapor Rub reference? Sweet. Now I have to give my obligatory remark about my mom would make us swallow it.

The semi-unspoken question here is, which should the Spurs try to maximize: the talent level for the team this year, their position to accumulate talent for the 2008 and 2009 seasons, or somewhere in the middle?

[Solid D]

:lol I never had to swallow Vicks but I think the last time I used any for a cold was when I was a kid.

[Solid D]

I guess I could have said...open things up like Atomic Balm inside a jock strap. That ought to bring back memories to anyone who ever spent any time in a locker room. :smokin

http://www.cramersportsmed.com/servlet/CatalogImageViewer?id=160&type=nata_picture&table=product

[Notorious H.O.P.]

From the Miami Herald

Several NBA teams have made overtures to the 36-year-old, according to several reports. That includes a dogged pursuit by San Antonio, which made multiple offers, Mourning said. The Spurs need a replacement for backup center Nazr Mohammed, who reached a five-year agreement with the Detroit Pistons. "I'm not going to have somebody force me into making a decision when I'm not ready," Mourning said. "They wanted an answer doon, and I'm not in the position to do that.

What Mourning said is legit but I'll be damned if even his quotes don't piss me off. Why even bother mentioning that?

I'm just still pissed over all of his flexing and warrior bullshit and they way he teabagged the Nets and Raptors. It people are paying you millions of dollars, you play. If you don't want to play, you don't get paid.

The multiple offers part is interesting. I wonder how high they went.

[FromWayDowntown]

"I'm not going to have somebody force me into making a decision when I'm not ready," Mourning said. "They wanted an answer doon, and I'm not in the position to do that.

If that's true, then the question with Mourning wasn't money -- if I read the reports correctly, the Spurs reportedly offered him more than the Heat have -- but application of a sense of urgency. With limited resources available to make deals, would it have been better for the Spurs to leave an offer lingering to Mourning, facing the possibility that he might ultimately decide to stay in Miami anyway and leaving the Spurs with even fewer options, or to pull back when Zo wasn't willing to make a decision quickly and pursue what is still available?

[SenorSpur]

From the Miami Herald

Several NBA teams have made overtures to the 36-year-old, according to several reports. That includes a dogged pursuit by San Antonio, which made multiple offers, Mourning said. The Spurs need a replacement for backup center Nazr Mohammed, who reached a five-year agreement with the Detroit Pistons. "I'm not going to have somebody force me into making a decision when I'm not ready," Mourning said. "They wanted an answer doon, and I'm not in the position to do that.

What Mourning said is legit but I'll be damned if even his quotes don't piss me off. Why even bother mentioning that?

I'm just still pissed over all of his flexing and warrior bullshit and they way he teabagged the Nets and Raptors. It people are paying you millions of dollars, you play. If you don't want to play, you don't get paid.

The multiple offers part is interesting. I wonder how high they went.

Spurs are starting to appear desparate. Mourning just won a title and in all likelihood will resign with his team. They are doing their due diligence by making an offer and he would be an upgrade to what we've had so far. But I don't think they should stoop to "begging" this guy to come here. They obviously underestimate his allegiance to the Miami area and coach Riley.

[ducks]

it also said they tried several offers

[FromWayDowntown]

Spurs are starting to appear desparate.

I'm not sure that's true. But to read the opinions of some in this forum, one would think they should be desperate.

After all, the talking period is almost over and the Spurs haven't spent any of their MLE!!!!

[SPARKY]

Odd little blurb from Miami today:

San Antonio is believed to be offering a two-year deal worth between $3 million to $5 million for the free agent center to join the 2005 NBA champions.

http://www.local10.com/news/9492755/detail.html


And the hits keep on coming.

[SPARKY]

Anyways, things are so bad from the Spurs' perspective that they were willing to take a flier at Mourning, who is 1) old, 2) playing with a new kidney, 3) firmly established in South Florida, and 4) coming off a championship.

[FromWayDowntown]

It's a remarkably weak free agent market (and even trade market) for centers, even with Ben Wallace and Przybilla available.

In light of that, you could argue, one supposes that the old bird in hand is worth two in the bush theory and second-guess the decisions to jettison last season's flotsom. Still, I think it was pretty clear that Radoslav and Nazr, while nice fellows who could occasionally add a bit to the Spurs' successes, were not well suited to offering much assistance against the sorts of teams the Spurs will have to beat at playoff time -- certainly not at the salaries they were commanding. I think the stronger argument, therefore, is one supporting the idea of trying to find centers who might actually be able to stay on the floor at playoff time while taking down far less salary.

You can't just make quality centers grow on trees.

[rascal]

You wanna keep acting like I am the only one upset with them at the moment???? :rolleyes Unless we fucking do something, I wont stop on this shit. From reading all these express articles as well, it seems like we are in a real tough spot and trying to not spend much more but it doesnt deserve any criticizing??? I love this team and I wont stop being a true die hard fan of them but I will diss them when it is needed. How cant I think negative thoughts on the direction of this team with the days passing by and the smoke clearing up?? If we do something (Which believe it or not I actually am still holding out a tad of hope for despite my posts) I will gladly eat crow.
I generally agree with you. The spurs will do something but don't expect any type of difference maker. They will just plug some weak role player type in and lose again.

Whoever they get, this place will be excited about it but it will not make any difference in the end. The spurs don't want to make any impact moves to really land a difference maker.

[FromWayDowntown]

I generally agree with you. The spurs will do something but don't expect any type of difference maker. They will just plug some weak role player type in and lose again.

What difference maker could they have gotten? Seriously.

[rascal]

Explore trade options Trade Manu.

[ducks]

several teams contacted pistons about doing a sign and trade

spurs if you believe ice are after kg


I do not think those were strong odds of happening though

[ducks]

Explore trade options Trade Manu.

their is a rumor he is being offered for kg....


who else would you trade manu for that you think they have a shot at landing?
manu for martin? NOT
manu for ?

[rascal]

I do not like the core of Duncan Parker with manu. Try keeping duncan and Parker but trade Manu. He would be the most tradeable asset on the spurs I would consider.

[rascal]

Manu and cap adjustment for garnett. Do it now. Garnett will be a difference maker and impact player. A core of Duncan, Garnett and parker is better than Duncan Manu and parker. There will be huge matchup problems for opponents with duncan and Garnett on the same team.

[ducks]

I have heard tp is more tradable because he is younger and has a longer career ahead of him

I would think spurs would pull the trigger if wolves would do it with manu only and crap

[ducks]

if you are offered the most from the wolves standpoint do you trade him to a west team that you play 4 times a year and in the playoffs though.......

[rascal]

Of course TP is more tradeable, he is younger and better.

I would also consider parker in a deal for Garnett but the spurs would have to somehow have something in the works to get a reliable pg, of course it would be better to keep Parker.

[rascal]

I would think Parker and manu and additional cap adjustments including other players could be enough to get Garnett.

I don't like trading away Parker but it may have to come to that. Getting a solid pg for the future is easier then trying to get a franchise player with Garnett's ability.

[MajorMike]

FYI, players cannot simply 'restructure' and take less. The NBA Player's Union would not allow it. If it is time for them to resign, then yes, they can opt for less. However mid-contract, a player cannot simply say, "I'll take less." Contracts are just that, contracts. Same logic applies to teams. A team cannot simply say, "I'm going to pay you less." Works both ways.

[Please_dont_ban_me]

It's obvious to me the Spurs want a shotblocking center. Going after Przybilla and Mourning, two of the best shotblockers in the league, wasn't an accident.

Of the remaining centers, Butler is the best shotblocker. Hopefully that is who they are after.

I don't know the stats, but of the two I'd go with Francisco Nelson if you want a long center who is very phyical and will alter shots. He's also a bit less of a question mark then Jackie Butler.

[rascal]

FYI, players cannot simply 'restructure' and take less. The NBA Player's Union would not allow it. If it is time for them to resign, then yes, they can opt for less. However mid-contract, a player cannot simply say, "I'll take less." Contracts are just that, contracts. Same logic applies to teams. A team cannot simply say, "I'm going to pay you less." Works both ways.
I didn't mean adjust contracts. I meant make the necesary throw ins (adjustments) to make the trade work out.

[Nikos]

I do not like the core of Duncan Parker with manu. Try keeping duncan and Parker but trade Manu. He would be the most tradeable asset on the spurs I would consider.

What kind of logic is this? Manu is 29 and can't carry an offense for an 82 game season. Why would he have additional value to other teams (over Parker) that aren't championship calibur and are just trying to add another big piece?

If anything Manu is undervalued. He is an excellent supporting player who doesn't have many excellent years left. This means he has little trading value relative to the excellent supporting play he can contribute to the Spurs for the next 2 years or so.

[shaggy17]

I would think Parker and manu and additional cap adjustments including other players could be enough to get Garnett.

I don't like trading away Parker but it may have to come to that. Getting a solid pg for the future is easier then trying to get a franchise player with Garnett's ability.
:blah :rolleyes Lame