French Fried Prohibition?

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

http://www.cnn.com/2006/HEALTH/09/26/trans.fat.ban.ap/index.html

I can see it now... McDonald's speakeasies.

[boutons_]

"It is a dangerous and unnecessary ingredient," Frieden said. "No one will miss it when it's gone."

Go ahead, Agggie, trust companies to look after your health AHEAD of looking after their profits. Eliminating you dumbfucks from the human gene pool would advance humanity.

Unfortunately, you will probably breed before transfats and other corporate "nutrition" kills you.

[2centsworth]

"It is a dangerous and unnecessary ingredient," Frieden said. "No one will miss it when it's gone."

Go ahead, Agggie, trust companies to look after your health AHEAD of looking after their profits. Eliminating you dumbfucks from the human gene pool would advance humanity.

Unfortunately, you will probably breed before transfats and other corporate "nutrition" kills you.
so we should ask the government to take care of us? Is this Cuba?

btw, life expectancies keep going up. 85 for a 2yr female.

[Zunni]

Trust me: if NY outlaws it, McD's isn't going to pull out. They'll just use the same oil that Wendy's does now...completely trans fat free.

[boutons_]

"so we should ask the government to take care of us?"

Can you be so fucking stupid? yes, you can.

A key role of the fed govt is to protect citizens and the environment from corporations and from any provider of services, so we can obtains these services and products in confidence that the won't hurt or kill or steal from us.

Why do you think corps finance/buy/elect Repugs to kill regulations, and to enforce regulations with laxity or not at all?

Do you think corps have your best interests as their priority, or your money?

[01Snake]

GW makes me eat McDonalds!

[Yonivore]

GW makes me eat McDonalds!
I question the timing and I think Karl Rove is responsible.

[01Snake]

According to Croutons...is there ANYTHING that Bush/Repubs ARE NOT responsible for? Hmmmmmm

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Go ahead, Agggie, trust companies to look after your health AHEAD of looking after their profits. Eliminating you dumbfucks from the human gene pool would advance humanity.

I'll tell you who needs eliminated from the gene pool. It's dumbfucks like you who think it's a corporation's responsibility to make sure people eat right.

No one puts a gun to anyone's head and makes them buy fries and a big mac. Damn, you are a stupid fuck and typical of the liberal left.


Unfortunately, you will probably breed before transfats and other corporate "nutrition" kills you.

Wow, it's a good thing you're sitting behind a keyboard right now, I'd love to beat the shit out of you with a comment like that. Thanks for verifying what a pathetic human being you are.

Transfats and corporate nutrition are going to kill me? How fucking stupid does a person have to be to figure out that eating a big mac and fries every fucking day is bad for you? All you gotta do is watch Supersize me.

Your reaction is classic and surprisingly the norm for your sorry ass these days. San Antonio called and wants its village idiot back - looks like it's time for you to go boutons.

[Yonivore]

What I don't understand is why people who object to the ingredients found in fast food and convenience foods don't just cook their own damn trans-fat-free meals.

Of course, I felt the same way about people who whined about smoke-free restuarants.

I'm constantly amazed by people who think they are entitled to access to businesses and products that fit their specific requirements.

[Guru of Nothing]

What I don't understand is why people who object to the ingredients found in fast food and convenience foods don't just cook their own damn trans-fat-free meals.

I agree with you.

Now, why don't you don't form your own white, celibate, republican nation?

.... political forum is fun!

[Yonivore]

I agree with you.

Now, why don't you don't form your own white, celibate, republican nation?
Because I'm not in the market for one? But, hey, if that's your cup of tea...I say go for it.

Just make sure you acquire the land legally or, if by right of conquest, that you make sure you're big and bad enough to hold on to it.


.... political forum is fun!
Yeah, it's a regular Cirque du soleil.

[Yonivore]

i agree with yonivore
Me too!

[Zunni]

Yeah, it's a regular Cirque du soleil.
They're French. Shouldn't you be boycotting them or renaming them Freedom Circus?

[johnsmith]

What I don't understand is why people who object to the ingredients found in fast food and convenience foods don't just cook their own damn trans-fat-free meals.

Of course, I felt the same way about people who whined about smoke-free restuarants.

I'm constantly amazed by people who think they are entitled to access to businesses and products that fit their specific requirements.


Oh my dear lord I disagree with something Yoni is saying........I'm not a fan of this happening. Yoni, how could you feel the same way about smoke-free restuarants as you do fast food meals? They are two different things. One only hurts the person stuffing Big Mac's into their pie-holes and the other hurts every person in the room.

[johnsmith]

I'll tell you who needs eliminated from the gene pool. It's dumbfucks like you who think it's a corporation's responsibility to make sure people eat right.

No one puts a gun to anyone's head and makes them buy fries and a big mac. Damn, you are a stupid fuck and typical of the liberal left.



Wow, it's a good thing you're sitting behind a keyboard right now, I'd love to beat the shit out of you with a comment like that. Thanks for verifying what a pathetic human being you are.

Transfats and corporate nutrition are going to kill me? How fucking stupid does a person have to be to figure out that eating a big mac and fries every fucking day is bad for you? All you gotta do is watch Supersize me.

Your reaction is classic and surprisingly the norm for your sorry ass these days. San Antonio called and wants its village idiot back - looks like it's time for you to go boutons.


I do find it interesting that Boutons never replied to this one...........also, I fucking hate Boutons and wish very bad things to happen to his mother, of whom he coincedentally lives with.

[leemajors]

"so we should ask the government to take care of us?"

Can you be so fucking stupid? yes, you can.

A key role of the fed govt is to protect citizens and the environment from corporations and from any provider of services, so we can obtains these services and products in confidence that the won't hurt or kill or steal from us.

Why do you think corps finance/buy/elect Repugs to kill regulations, and to enforce regulations with laxity or not at all?

Do you think corps have your best interests as their priority, or your money?

what i think is amazing is big business lobbies appear to target republicans only.

[Ozzman]

you know, you're supposed to be responsible for your own healthy eating habits. Like all these frivolous lawsuits, it's ruining our country and helping us lose our freedom. we say we are a free country, but we are so heavily regulated on EVERYTHING that it is starting to leave. this whole "blame someone else for your own god damn stupidity" thing is really gay, and these dumbasses are abusing our legal system to "get rich quick"


the only two legged snakes are a Lawyer and thier stupid client.

[johnsmith]

what i think is amazing is big business lobbies appear to target republicans only.


Explain........

[boutons_]

http://www.fda.gov/fdac/features/2003/503_fats.html

Aggie, and you other conservaties, feed your kids LOTS of trans fat, gotta keep working on improving the gene pool. And as soon as they are old enough, sign them up for dubya's military. And eat LOTS of spinach, and lots of chicken, but don't wash it or cook it too much, please. We appreciate your efforts in this area.

Trans fats, and who knows what other shit, are in commerciall foods because they are good for the food industry, NOT because they are good for the consumer. Even when that shit is BAD for the consumer, food industry is chasing your $$$ first, and your health is secondary concern, if it's a concern at all.

It's a perverse ideology, espoused by perverts, that says food suppliers should be free to put any shit in food because nobody's forced to that buy shit from them.

Anybody know why acid-resistant E.coli from cowshit spread on vegetable fields is unnecessarily acid-resistant? Because acid-resistant E. coli is good for agri-business.

http://www.sciencemag.org/cgi/content/abstract/281/5383/1666

[101A]

http://www.fda.gov/fdac/features/2003/503_fats.html

Aggie, and you other conservaties, feed your kids LOTS of trans fat, gotta keep working on improving the gene pool. And as soon as they are old enough, sign them up for dubya's military. And eat LOTS of spinach, and lots of chicken, but don't wash it or cook it too much, please. We appreciate your efforts in this area.

Trans fats, and who knows what other shit, are in commerciall foods because they are good for the food industry, NOT because they are good for the consumer. Even when that shit is BAD for the consumer, food industry is chasing your $$$ first, and your health is secondary concern, if it's a concern at all.

It's a perverse ideology, espoused by perverts, that says food suppliers should be free to put any shit in food because nobody's forced to that buy shit from them.

Anybody know why acid-resistant E.coli from cowshit spread on vegetable fields is unnecessarily acid-resistant? Because acid-resistant E. coli is good for agri-business.

http://www.sciencemag.org/cgi/content/abstract/281/5383/1666

The food industry is responsible for the food industry, the consumer is responsible for the consumer.

Individual liberty, personal responsibility, FREEDOM.

It's not like any of us thought double quarterpounder w/cheese was healthfood!

It is truly frightening how much personal liberty you are willing to give away to the state, and how much control over your life you are willing to grant it, in order for you to pretend like it is protecting you, Boutons.

Then you're against wiretapping suspected terrorists? You are bewilderingly inconsistent; unless, of course, we all compare your views to the Democratic Party Line (of which you vehemently deny you follow).

[101A]

what i think is amazing is big business lobbies appear to target republicans only.

I would assume this is sarcasm, if not; get a clue.

[boutons_]

"double quarterpounder"

So you assume the sit-down chain restaurants don't use trans fats?

What liberty do I give up if govt regulations prevent food businesses from putting shit in and on the food I buy from them?

[johnsmith]

http://www.fda.gov/fdac/features/2003/503_fats.html

Aggie, and you other conservaties, feed your kids LOTS of trans fat, gotta keep working on improving the gene pool. And as soon as they are old enough, sign them up for dubya's military. And eat LOTS of spinach, and lots of chicken, but don't wash it or cook it too much, please. We appreciate your efforts in this area.

Trans fats, and who knows what other shit, are in commerciall foods because they are good for the food industry, NOT because they are good for the consumer. Even when that shit is BAD for the consumer, food industry is chasing your $$$ first, and your health is secondary concern, if it's a concern at all.

It's a perverse ideology, espoused by perverts, that says food suppliers should be free to put any shit in food because nobody's forced to that buy shit from them.

Anybody know why acid-resistant E.coli from cowshit spread on vegetable fields is unnecessarily acid-resistant? Because acid-resistant E. coli is good for agri-business.

http://www.sciencemag.org/cgi/content/abstract/281/5383/1666

This is absolutely ridiculous and not even worth the argument. If it's bad for you, don't fucking eat it. Christ, do you really need to the government to regulate everything in your life?
I'm going to go out on a limb and first assume that Boutons is a fat bastard (although this is pretty much a guarantee) and that Boutons then blames Jack in the Box for his obesity rather then himself. Hey Boutons, there are gyms all over the town you live in, join one, use it, quit eating fast food, and quit complaining about it.

[101A]

"double quarterpounder"

So you assume the sit-down chain restaurants don't use trans fats?

What liberty do I give up if govt regulations prevent food businesses from putting shit in and on the food I buy from them?

We're not talking about feces, Boutons. We're talking about something that makes McDonalds Frech Fries TASTE BETTER (to some people). People ought to have the right to buy what they like - whether it kills them or not.

I don't have a problem with health inspectors, truth in labeling laws, etc. that compel comapanies and individual to sell what they purport to be selling (meat and not crap, in you example). I think if some company wants to mix some excrement up in there ground round, proudly display the fact that they are doing so on their menu - and somebody wants to eat that shit; let 'em.

[101A]

This is absolutely ridiculous and not even worth the argument. If it's bad for you, don't fucking eat it. Christ, do you really need to the government to regulate everything in your life?
I'm going to go out on a limb and first assume that Boutons is a fat bastard (although this is pretty much a guarantee) and that Boutons then blames Jack in the Box for his obesity rather then himself. Hey Boutons, there are gyms all over the town you live in, join one, use it, quit eating fast food, and quit complaining about it.


I know Boutons can get on your nerves, but in this thread you have claimed he is fat and lives with his mother. You don't need to stoop to his level.

[Boutons__]

I know Boutons can get on your nerves, but in this thread you have claimed he is fat and lives with his mother. You don't need to stoop to his level.


Why, I am fat and live with my mother.

[boutons_]

"TASTE BETTER"

the main advantage of hydrogenated fats for food suppliers is NOT "better" taste.

From the FDA link:

"Hydrogenation increases the shelf life and flavor stability of foods containing these fats."

You right-wingers never cease to amaze me. You are arguing against food safety as if it were in opposition to personal and business freedom.

[101A]

Why, I am fat and live with my mother.

:lol

Fair enough.

[101A]

"TASTE BETTER"

the main advantage of hydrogenated fats for food suppliers is NOT "better" taste.

From the FDA link:

"Hydrogenation increases the shelf life and flavor stability of foods containing these fats."

You right-wingers never cease to amaze me. You are arguing against food safety as if it were in opposition to personal and business freedom.


All I know is McDonalds fries taste better than Wendy's. I would assume increasing their shelf life also keeps prices lower; another thing I ought to have a right to.

[Phenomanul]

Political views aside....

Trans fats have to be weeded out of foods period... whether the consumer chooses to eat them or not.... Many of them are not adequately informed on the dangers of transfats....

Again (think of the children :lol ) they don't know that their parents are 'poisoning' them out of ignorance or bliss.

For an extreme example that paints the underlying need for regulation: Why doesn't McDonalds deliberately cook with arsenic, on lead pans, and with formaldehyde laden meats? Or why doesn't Coca Cola add cocaine to their product formula anymore? Right! Because these substances are all toxic to the human body... Some more than the others, but all toxic nonetheless...

Trans fats may not be as toxic in and of themselves, but they inherently cause damage to humans. The difference is that it takes longer for the effects of transfat foods to kill. But don't be mistaken, trans-fats will kill.

Who else besides McDonald's would need to be regulated...
Whataburger?
Burger King?
KFC?
Jack in the Box?
Carl's Jr?
Pizza Hut?

[101A]

Political views aside....

Trans fats have to be weeded out of foods period... whether the consumer chooses to eat them or not.... Many of them are not adequately informed on the dangers of transfats....

Again (think of the children :lol ) they don't know that their parents are 'poisoning' them out of ignorance or bliss.

For an extreme example that paints the underlying need for regulation: Why doesn't McDonalds deliberately cook with arsenic, on lead pans, and with formaldehyde laden meats? Or why doesn't Coca Cola add cocaine to their product formula anymore? Right! Because these substances are all toxic to the human body... Some more than the others, but all toxic nonetheless...

Trans fats may not be as toxic in and of themselves, but they inherently cause damage to humans. The difference is that it takes longer for the effects of transfat foods to kill. But don't be mistaken, trans-fats will kill.

Who else besides McDonald's would need to be regulated...
Whataburger?
Burger King?
KFC?
Jack in the Box?
Carl's Jr?
Pizza Hut?

Arsenic, Cocaine, Transfats...okay, I get the pattern, but I also see a slippery slope.

Ultimately there are LOTS of foods that damage the human body, and we all OUGHT to eat broccolli and fish at every meal (small portions, mind you), so your argument, however eloquently you made it, can be made about food at Taco Bell, Pizza Hut, KFC, etc...whether or not they have Trans Fats or not. Their food does, in fact, cause damage to humans.

[boutons_]

Trans fats are not only in fast-food.

They are in packaged junk foods, and basically in all kinds of "dead" food.

As always, the straw man is that food regulations to protect consumers will infringe personal freedom (to eat unhealthy food for a few pennies cheaper), will destroy industry, willl cost jobs, and will render food unpalatable.

Because commercial food is so untrustworthy, we now have this insanity of labels. Of course, the food industry fought and still fights truth in labelling. The food industry doesn't want you to know the shit they put in food to increase their profits.

[101A]

Also, I DO NOT take MY children to McDonalds.

I might agree with parents being held responsible for what their children eat; but that is not McDonalds fault; that fault lies directly with the parents. NONE of my children's friends who come to dinner at our house EVER eat the vegetables offered to them, "I don't eat vegetables" is the reply, and their parents allow that; bewilders me, frankly.

[101A]

The food industry doesn't want you to know the shit they put in food to increase their profits.

Of course they don't, humans, and groups of humans are self-interested - that's where the government must step in, and make sure the rest of us individuals, who are also self-interested, know what those others are doing.


Boutons, you always make corporations out to be greedy;

THIS JUST IN: ALL PEOPLE ARE GREEDY! That's why capitilism works, and ALL forms of socialism don't.

That greed must be harnessed, and controlled to work for the good of all; if you take away the greed, however, and make it so indivuduals and groups of individuals (corporations) can't reep the benefits of their work, there will be no work- and regardless of the altruism of your society, and the greatest of intentions, it WILL fail.

Corporations must look out for corporations, people must look out for themselves, the government must try to keep the field as open and level as possible while allowiing the most possible freedom.

[Phenomanul]

Arsenic, Cocaine, Transfats...okay, I get the pattern, but I also see a slippery slope.

Ultimately there are LOTS of foods that damage the human body, and we all OUGHT to eat broccolli and fish at every meal (small portions, mind you), so your argument, however eloquently you made it, can be made about food at Taco Bell, Pizza Hut, KFC, etc...whether or not they have Trans Fats or not. Their food does, in fact, cause damage to humans.


Subway and for that matter Quiznos cook without transfats.... their food is still very tasty....

All I'm saying is that someone has to curb the practice of cooking with known poisons. If the restaurant owners themselves don't do it out of loss of profitability... would you buy that as a valid excuse?

You do realize that there are social-economic implications to this problem as well, right? Most healthy diets are expensive... the non-healthy ones are cheap. I certainly can't afford to eat healthy all the time, and my income is not what I would consider meager.

So should we allow the poorest people in society to poison themselves with transfats without regard to the fact that they will eventually become a medical burden on our government? I say 'big Businesses' like McDonalds should foot the bill themselves... that or stop cooking with transfats altogether. Clean their hands of the problem...

And yes the eating habits of people also need to change... just don't assume that they are all given an option to 'eat healthy'.... as this is out of the reach of many.

[101A]

Subway and for that matter Quiznos cook without transfats.... their food is still very tasty....

All I'm saying is that someone has to curb the practice of cooking with known poisons. If the restaurant owners themselves don't do it out of loss of profitability... would you buy that as a valid excuse?

You do realize that there are social-economic implications to this problem as well, right? Most healthy diets are expensive... the non-healthy ones are cheap. I certainly can't afford to eat healthy all the time, and my income is not what I would consider meager.

So should we allow the poorest people in society to poison themselves with transfats without regard to the fact that they will eventually become a medical burden on our government? I say 'big Businesses' like McDonalds should foot the bill themselves... that or stop cooking with transfats altogether. Clean their hands of the problem...

And yes the eating habits of people also need to change... just don't assume that they are all given an option to 'eat healthy'.... as this is out of the reach of many.


The cheapest meals I cook are the healthy ones. Beans, rice, fresh vegetables, chicken and fish are all cheaper than beef, breaded crap, etc....

Eating out at all is several factors more expensive than eating at home, also, so your rich vs. poor argument doesn't make alot of sense.


Also, this isn't about profit, necessarily. Often a business owner sets his profit margin; he's gonna make his regardless. Raising his costs often simply means it costs more for the consumer, doesn't change the corps. bottom line.

Claiming that making people fat and unhealthy costs money is not true.

Fat people die younger than skinny people, but skinny people, do, in fact, get sick and die. They die of the same things (cancer, heart disease, stroke, etc..) they just do it later in life and put up a better fight when it happens. That means that, yes, healthy people cost MORE than unhealthy people ultimately. They collect Social Security longer, they are on Medicare longer, and they can withstand more heroic treatments, and survive more medical treatments (read that as EXPESIVE).

A smoker that kicks of lung cancer at 59 is a hell of a lot less expensive than a cyclist who dies of colon cancer at 92.

Heart attacks are one of the cheapest ways to go (especially if the 1st one get you).

[Yonivore]

They're French. Shouldn't you be boycotting them or renaming them Freedom Circus?
No, you idiot, they're not Cirque du Francais.

[Yonivore]

Oh my dear lord I disagree with something Yoni is saying........I'm not a fan of this happening. Yoni, how could you feel the same way about smoke-free restuarants as you do fast food meals? They are two different things. One only hurts the person stuffing Big Mac's into their pie-holes and the other hurts every person in the room.
Because both occur on private property where no one is compelled to enter.

[johnsmith]

Because both occur on private property where no one is compelled to enter.


Nice, I'm back in agreement with Yoni.

[Yonivore]

Political views aside....

Trans fats have to be weeded out of foods period... whether the consumer chooses to eat them or not.... Many of them are not adequately informed on the dangers of transfats....
Okay, this could be done through a free market where the Phenomanuls and Yonivores refuse to buy products until they meet our demanding standards.


Again (think of the children :lol ) they don't know that their parents are 'poisoning' them out of ignorance or bliss.
Then hold the parents responsible. I have no problem with yanking parental rights over food abuse just as you would physical abuse or sexual abuse. If you find a parent that is raising their child on Happy Meals and soft drinks, and that child is morbidly obese because of it, call in Child Protective Services.

I don't care if it is because of ignorance. There's no excuse, with today's media, for any parent not to know that McDonalds is serving unhealthy food.

Of course, there is that old addage, "everything in moderation." I don't think anyone is harmed by eating the occassional Big Mac and fries if they maintain a healthy lifestyle, generally eat healthy food, exercise regularly, and keep the portions reasonable.

I see a lot of skinny, healthy-looking people picking up fast food to go. I suspect they don't make it their principal source of nutrition.


For an extreme example that paints the underlying need for regulation: Why doesn't McDonalds deliberately cook with arsenic, on lead pans, and with formaldehyde laden meats? Or why doesn't Coca Cola add cocaine to their product formula anymore? Right! Because these substances are all toxic to the human body... Some more than the others, but all toxic nonetheless...
Apples and oranges...well, to an extent. To be just as extreme in showing how this could be done, so long as McDonald's advertised they were engaged in such a practice, It'd be stupid for people to consume their product. So, maybe they'd be getting what they deserve.

However, I will say that some regulation is in order so as to prevent the induction, into our foods, of harmful ingredients that are not advertised or that are so microscopic as to be undetectable. E. Coli., Salmonella, and other food-borne pathogens as an example. I think restaurants should be held to a standard of hygeine that precludes the unintentional introduction of harmful ingredients.

But, on the obverse, if they want to include legal ingredients -- even if unhealthy -- to their product, I don't have a problem with it so long as they disclose those ingredients.


Trans fats may not be as toxic in and of themselves, but they inherently cause damage to humans. The difference is that it takes longer for the effects of transfat foods to kill. But don't be mistaken, trans-fats will kill.
Using this reasoning, just about every life activity should be outlawed. I suspect more people's health is ruined by the act of driving an automobile, every year, than that of consuming trans-fats. I think you'd have to outlaw most carbonated soft drinks altogether. I know of no nutritional value to them whatsoever. In fact, many are detrimental to your health.

Do you see where this is going? It's not about the ingredients. It's about the consumers personal responsibility to know what to consume and to do so in moderation.


Who else besides McDonald's would need to be regulated...
Whataburger?
Burger King?
KFC?
Jack in the Box?
Carl's Jr?
Pizza Hut?
Every one that sells food.

[Yonivore]

All I'm saying is that someone has to curb the practice of cooking with known poisons.
That someone is the consumer.

[PixelPusher]

"Public Health" is just one of many civic concepts alien to believers in the absolute power of free markets to magically solve all of our problems, if only it had complete autonomy from government. An unhealthy population is a cost to all of us collectively, and I'm not talking about the hospital bill.

[101A]

"Public Health" is just one of many civic concepts alien to believers in the absolute power of free markets to magically solve all of our problems, if only it had complete autonomy from government. An unhealthy population is a cost to all of us collectively, and I'm not talking about the hospital bill.


I don't know anybody that thinks a free market solves all of our problems. If you think that's what conservatives think, I believe that is the cruxt of the problem.

"Free" is the operative word, and the fact that many problems simply cannot be solved, and I am willing to admit that, and make the most of what is left IS the point.

Trying to create a better life for all of us "collectively" doesn't work. People are too myopic to be motivated by such goals. The collective, in turn, is not trustworthy enough for me to freely grant it the power to control what IT deems is in my best interest. You people need to be more cynical about your government.

[Yonivore]

"Public Health" is just one of many civic concepts alien to believers in the absolute power of free markets to magically solve all of our problems, if only it had complete autonomy from government. An unhealthy population is a cost to all of us collectively, and I'm not talking about the hospital bill.
Well, free markets combined with an informed and responsible public can solve most of our problems -- without magic.

And, I don't believe anyone is advocating complete autonomy from government. As I expressed earlier, restaurants should be required to reveal all the ingredients of their consumable products and further should be held to sanitary standards that prevent the introduction and formation of toxic pathogens in the food.

I don't believe governments have the responsibility to police my engaging in a purely voluntary and legal practice like sitting down at McDonald's and consuming two Super-sized #4's.

I do think you could make an argument that trans-fats are toxic and should be outlawed. Period. But, that wouldn't involve controlling the issue at the restaurant level -- it would mean banning the production and introduction of trans-fats in all products.

I'd be okay with that so long as you can demonstrate trans-fats are actually the culprit and not the proclivity of the average American to stuff their lard asses until they can't bend over to tie their shoes.

Just sayin'

[Phenomanul]

Whatever... this is not an issue for me...

Keeping the 'bottom line' profitable at the expense of the public... well, I guess people here feel that restaurants can do whatever the hell they want to do.


:tu, have at it then...

[Phenomanul]

The cheapest meals I cook are the healthy ones. Beans, rice, fresh vegetables, chicken and fish are all cheaper than beef, breaded crap, etc....

Eating out at all is several factors more expensive than eating at home, also, so your rich vs. poor argument doesn't make alot of sense.


It does when you consider the fact that the healthiest diets should include food from all of the food groups.

Keeping a steady supply of fresh vegetables and fruit is not cheap....
Buying sufficient quantities of fish, pastas and grains is not cheap either...
And what about those meats.... well, for one the ones with less fat and more quality are more expensive, not cheaper. The healthy cheeses are more expensive too. Higher quality products cost more --- what doesn't make sense about that?

The healthiest diet my father ever practiced had seven meals per day... he ended up losing about 30 pounds on that diet in a span of about 3 months. Guess what though, he was constantly in the kitchen, the grocery store, and it eventually wore him out. IT WAS EXPENSIVE and time consuming.

Yeah your examples of rice and beans is practical... but I wasn't trying to make peoples' diets heathly at the expense of tastebud bordom.



Also, this isn't about profit, necessarily. Often a business owner sets his profit margin; he's gonna make his regardless. Raising his costs often simply means it costs more for the consumer, doesn't change the corps. bottom line.

Claiming that making people fat and unhealthy costs money is not true.

Government money is not private money...

The charge is the same, the funding source is different.

Most poor people can't pay for their own medical attention without subsidies; middle class people and rich people can -- but they are usually the ones who will have a much more diverse slate of diets to begin with.



Fat people die younger than skinny people, but skinny people, do, in fact, get sick and die. They die of the same things (cancer, heart disease, stroke, etc..) they just do it later in life and put up a better fight when it happens. That means that, yes, healthy people cost MORE than unhealthy people ultimately. They collect Social Security longer, they are on Medicare longer, and they can withstand more heroic treatments, and survive more medical treatments (read that as EXPESIVE).

A smoker that kicks of lung cancer at 59 is a hell of a lot less expensive than a cyclist who dies of colon cancer at 92.

Heart attacks are one of the cheapest ways to go (especially if the 1st one get you).

That's a rather inhumane view of quality/span of life vs. medical costs. Whatever...

[Yonivore]

Whatever... this is not an issue for me...
Until they try to regulate a legal practice in which you engage in moderation and to no self-detriment, unlike the idiots lacking self-control for whom they're trying to protect through that regulation.


Keeping the 'bottom line' profitable at the expense of the public...
You act as though the consumer has no ability to make a decision on what they will consume.


well, I guess people here feel that restaurants can do whatever the hell they want to do.
I know you didn't go to the ChumpDumper school of semantic absolutes so, I'm going to pretend you really don't believe this is what you heard in here.


:tu, have at it then...
Well, thanks for at least playing.

[Yonivore]

It does when you consider the fact that the healthiest diets should include food from all of the food groups.

Keeping a steady supply of fresh vegetables and fruit is not cheap....
Buying sufficient quantities of fish, pastas and grains is not cheap either...
And what about those meats.... well, for one the ones with less fat and more quality are more expensive, not cheaper. The healthy cheeses are more expensive too. Higher quality products cost more --- what doesn't make sense about that?
And, yet, all those options are less expensive than eating out every day.


The healthiest diet my father ever practiced had seven meals per day... he ended up losing about 30 pounds on that diet in a span of about 3 months. Guess what though, he was constantly in the kitchen, the grocery store, and it eventually wore him out. IT WAS EXPENSIVE and time consuming.
It doesn't have to be. And, sounds like he may have lost weight from all the moving around as well.

[johnsmith]

Phenomanul, I like where your head's at in this one but I have to disagree. Yoni is correct, while healthy foods do cost more, preparing your own food is still less expensive, be it healthy or not. I suppose you could make the argument that one could go to McDonalds and order 1 item off the dollar menu and that would be cheaper, but how many McDonalds eaters only get 1 item?
Ultimately, it's up to the consumer. And guess what else, jogging, walking, sit-ups, pull-ups, push-ups........yep, all free.

[101A]

It does when you consider the fact that the healthiest diets should include food from all of the food groups.

Keeping a steady supply of fresh vegetables and fruit is not cheap....
Buying sufficient quantities of fish, pastas and grains is not cheap either...
And what about those meats.... well, for one the ones with less fat and more quality are more expensive, not cheaper. The healthy cheeses are more expensive too. Higher quality products cost more --- what doesn't make sense about that?

The healthiest diet my father ever practiced had seven meals per day... he ended up losing about 30 pounds on that diet in a span of about 3 months. Guess what though, he was constantly in the kitchen, the grocery store, and it eventually wore him out. IT WAS EXPENSIVE and time consuming.

Yeah your examples of rice and beans is practical... but I wasn't trying to make peoples' diets heathly at the expense of tastebud bordom.



Government money is not private money...

The charge is the same, the funding source is different.

Most poor people can't pay for their own medical attention without subsidies; middle class people and rich people can -- but they are usually the ones who will have a much more diverse slate of diets to begin with.



That's a rather inhumane view of quality/span of life vs. medical costs. Whatever...


Let me help you with your shopping cart:

Whole, not cut up chicken.
Flash Frozen Bulk "White" fish
Bulk Beans
Bulk Rice
Carrots (not the pretty, short, peeled ones - the long ugly ones)
Apples
Oranges
Potatoes (the ugly, off-sized ones you have to clean yourself)
Big ole bag of frozen peas, green beans and lima beans
Fresh Lettuce

There, now add it all up, you got several healthy meals there, and didn't spend nothing. Who the hell said anything about cheese? Health food nuts, and certainly poor people, don't run around pining for Boars Head! And pasta? I never said that was healthy - but a big bag of elbow macaroni don't set ME back all that much. Also diverse doesn't = healthy, either. Check out the Chinese and Japanese diets if you don't believe me. Again, two examples of not expensive, healthy diets.


You ever go to HEB and watch what the migrant workers buy to eat? Check it out; it's healthy (they can't afford not to be) and cheap (they can't afford); the argument that healthy food is more expensive is simply wrong.

I don't understand you point about govt. money and private money.

Regarding the expense of unhealthy diets: you were making an argument about the the public good; I could only assume you were also addressing the cost to the public of masses of fat-assess running around. I was responding to that; as inhumane as the facts of healthcare costs are, they are the facts.

[johnsmith]

I think what's really going on here is that this subject was posted on a Spurstalk forum. Well, the Spurs reside in San Antonio, and if anyone has ever walked the streets anywhere in San Antonio they would see a serious obesity problem. God forbid these people blame it on themselves........................

I'm just kidding, sort of.

[Phenomanul]

And, yet, all those options are less expensive than eating out every day.

Not at a fast food restaurant it isn't. Now if the envelope includes the whole family then the point is conceded. But for one person, it would be cheaper to go out than eat in.... remember my time costs money too... and cooking takes time.


It doesn't have to be. And, sounds like he may have lost weight from all the moving around as well.

He plays soccer three times per week and walks every morning. Exercise was never the issue for his overweight problems... It was his diet -- or lack thereof.

[johnsmith]

Not at a fast food restaurant it isn't. Now if the envelope includes the whole family then the point is conceded. But for one, I



He plays soccer three times per week and walks every morning. Exercise was never the issue for his overweight problems... It was his diet -- or lack thereof.


Again, how many people just go and get 1 item off the dollar menu. It's cheaper to eat at home, you know this.

[Yonivore]

Let me help you with your shopping cart:

Whole, not cut up chicken.
Flash Frozen Bulk "White" fish
Bulk Beans
Bulk Rice
Carrots (not the pretty, short, peeled ones - the long ugly ones)
Apples
Oranges
Potatoes (the ugly, off-sized ones you have to clean yourself)
Big ole bag of frozen peas, green beans and lima beans
Fresh Lettuce

There, now add it all up, you got several healthy meals there, and didn't spend nothing. Who the hell said anything about cheese? Health food nuts, and certainly poor people, don't run around pining for Boars Head! And pasta? I never said that was healthy - but a big bag of elbow macaroni don't set ME back all that much. Also diverse doesn't = healthy, either. Check out the Chinese and Japanese diets if you don't believe me. Again, two examples of not expensive, healthy diets.


You ever go to HEB and watch what the migrant workers buy to eat? Check it out; it's healthy (they can't afford not to be) and cheap (they can't afford); the argument that healthy food is more expensive is simply wrong.

I don't understand you point about govt. money and private money.

Regarding the expense of unhealthy diets: you were making an argument about the the public good; I could only assume you were also addressing the cost to the public of masses of fat-assess running around. I was responding to that; as inhumane as the facts of healthcare costs are, they are the facts.
Then, grow your own herbs in the kitchen window and buy spices bulk and voila! you can make a fiesta for your tongue.

[101A]

Then, grow your own herbs in the kitchen window and buy spices bulk and voila! you can make a fiesta for your tongue.

:sombrero:

[johnsmith]

Not at a fast food restaurant it isn't. Now if the envelope includes the whole family then the point is conceded. But for one, I



He plays soccer three times per week and walks every morning. Exercise was never the issue for his overweight problems... It was his diet -- or lack thereof.


That doesn't sound very expensive.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Aggie, and you other conservaties, feed your kids LOTS of trans fat, gotta keep working on improving the gene pool. And as soon as they are old enough, sign them up for dubya's military. And eat LOTS of spinach, and lots of chicken, but don't wash it or cook it too much, please. We appreciate your efforts in this area.

Trans fats, and who knows what other shit, are in commerciall foods because they are good for the food industry, NOT because they are good for the consumer. Even when that shit is BAD for the consumer, food industry is chasing your $$$ first, and your health is secondary concern, if it's a concern at all.

It's a perverse ideology, espoused by perverts, that says food suppliers should be free to put any shit in food because nobody's forced to that buy shit from them.

Damn, you're dumb. Literally. I think you might be the dumbest person I've ever encountered.

Perverts think it's the government's responsibility to tell people what to eat, drink, do, etc.

You're a liberal, I'm absolutely amazed that you are FOR the government telling people how to run their lives.

[Guru of Nothing]

How about we require that trans-fat pushers publish pithy warnings on their packaging, a la cigarettes?

Works for me.

[01Snake]

Again, how many people just go and get 1 item off the dollar menu. It's cheaper to eat at home, you know this.

Its cheaper to eat at home but its so much damn easier to hit the drive through.
:spin