What will China and japan do.....

[Ozzman]

When North Korea decides to test their nuke? A mass scale invasion? or just bomb the living shit out of them?

[Ozzman]

I think that if attacks are carried out by Iran-Funded terrorists here in america, which may actually happen, then I think China and Russia, India, Japan, etc, will decimate them. And If North Korea attacks us, same there. The reason why? NOT because "everyone loves us" but because in those countries they may say "oh shit! that could be us here eventually!!!"



Just a thought.

[Zunni]

NK doesn't do anything China doesn't want them to. Think: USSR/Cuba in the old days. China is the prop that keeps NK solvent, since they spend 110% of their budget on the military.

[PixelPusher]

China doesn't want to lose it's best customer (us).

[Bob Lanier]

A mass scale invasion?
No.

bomb the living shit out of them?
No.

Iran-Funded terrorists here in america, which may actually happen
No.

China and Russia, India, Japan, etc, will decimate them.
No.

North Korea attacks us
No.

Hope that helps.

[ChumpDumper]

No shit. It's a test, not a first strike.

[AFE7FATMAN]

China is doing nothing - as far as we know.

Japan is stocking up on Anti- Missile defense and leting NK know of its displeasure.

[Ozzman]

No.

No.

No.

No.

No.

Hope that helps.

I said IF, not WHEN, genius!

Hope that helps.

[Ozzman]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15152981/

“Fight at the cost of our lives!” the North’s official Korean Central News Agency reported on Friday

OH I really doubt will fire nukes after the test within a few years. (sarcasm)

He's like another Hitler.....IMO. Just one crazy ass bastard.

[velik_m]

They're crazy, but at least they're not bent on world domination, just paranoid as hell.

[Yonivore]

No shit. It's a test, not a first strike.
Yeah, I'm sure they'll announce when it's not a test, right?

It's a NOTICE, not a test.

[xrayzebra]

Well kiddies, I will tell you one thing. They really don't
want to get Japan too stirred up and they may have just about
done that. For people with short memories, Japan kicked
butt in Asia before and I suspect China really doesn't
want them to really re-arm and Japan become too
aggressive in defending themselves. There is talk that
Japan may go nuclear themselves or even us providing
them with atomic weapons. Nice thought isn't it? Nope
NK may not have visions of being a world beater, but
the idiot is a known drunk and despot and does have
visions of sometime more than a tin horn dictator, that
he is.

Iran does have visions of become the leading nation
of the world and world conqueror. Of that I have no
doubt. And because of Europe and their spineless
behavior and money grabbing/corruption within
their governments I am afraid we may be the only
ones who will step up and attempt to stop them. I
say attempt because when that little war starts, it
is really going to hit the fan. And it is not going to
be a pretty thing.

[ChumpDumper]

Yeah, I'm sure they'll announce when it's not a test, right?

It's a NOTICE, not a test.Reading is fundamental, idiot. Look at the first question.

[Ozzman]

Reading is fundamental, idiot. Look at the first question.


well, lets see...IF not WHEN.....Reading IS fundamental, isn't it?

[Ozzman]

Well kiddies, I will tell you one thing. They really don't
want to get Japan too stirred up and they may have just about
done that. For people with short memories, Japan kicked
butt in Asia before and I suspect China really doesn't
want them to really re-arm and Japan become too
aggressive in defending themselves. There is talk that
Japan may go nuclear themselves or even us providing
them with atomic weapons. Nice thought isn't it? Nope
NK may not have visions of being a world beater, but
the idiot is a known drunk and despot and does have
visions of sometime more than a tin horn dictator, that
he is.

Iran does have visions of become the leading nation
of the world and world conqueror. Of that I have no
doubt. And because of Europe and their spineless
behavior and money grabbing/corruption within
their governments I am afraid we may be the only
ones who will step up and attempt to stop them. I
say attempt because when that little war starts, it
is really going to hit the fan. And it is not going to
be a pretty thing.



Europe is pretty fucked up. Not like we aren't either.

The U.N. is pretty worthless as well. You can't negotiate with un-negotiable "sicheeshuns". you just can't. That bastard is fucked up, and needs a bullet in his head.

[RandomGuy]

This just in. They did it.

I guess we get to find out who will do what.

FYI, the Chinese are PISSED.

[ChumpDumper]

well, lets see...IF not WHEN.....Reading IS fundamental, isn't it?And?

They did it.

Any of your listed options coming to pass right now?

[101A]

And?

They did it.

Any of your listed options coming to pass right now?

Countries with nuclear weapons don't get attacked.

[JoeChalupa]

So then if every country gets nukes the world will be safe!!!!!

[jman3000]

make... fried rice?

[ChumpDumper]

Countries with nuclear weapons don't get attacked.Exactly.

[whottt]

Countries with nuclear weapons don't get attacked.


Sincerely,

US

[johnsmith]

Countries with nuclear weapons don't get attacked.


I like it. Let's try that.

[mavs>spurs2]

Countries with nuclear weapons don't get attacked.

Maybe not attacked by a nuclear weapon, but I would call 9/11 a form of attack.

[johnsmith]

So then if every country gets nukes the world will be safe!!!!!


I meant to quote this one.

Again, I like it, let's go this route.

[Ozzman]

And?

They did it.

Any of your listed options coming to pass right now?


Not right now, but eventually.

[JoeChalupa]

I feel it is really up to China to end this. They have the most leverage against NK. They cannot cut off the food supply since so many have already died due to starvation but they can cut off their energy supply and put some real pressure against NK.

We must talk to NK.

[clambake]

We need to stay as far away from this as possible. Bush is not qualified to talk to anybody. Do you really want to add this to his string of errors?

[boutons_]

"We must talk to NK."

nah, Democrats try diplomacy and multi-national co-operation. The Repugs spurn diplomacy, go it alone, and bomb the shit out of everybody, but above all do only that which provides Repug partisan advantage and some kind of gotcha/litmus test to attack the Dems, NatSec be damned.

[JoeChalupa]

Even former Sec. of State Baker says the US must talk to NK and other US adversaries if we want to reach any type of agreement. We didn't go to war with Chinese under Nixon and it has worked out okay. We didn't go to war with Russia/Breshnev and it has turned out okay.

Diplomacy CAN and DOES work when done properly.

[clambake]

Of course we need to talk, but theres the horror of what Bush will say. He is not qualified to talk to anybody. He is the least trusted leader on the planet. Hell, I wouldn't buy an apple from that lying son of a bitch.

[NASCARdad]

Screw the talk! You yellow bellied libs want to talk while NK keeps building nuclear weapons!?!? Just like you all fucked up 9/11 you want to do it again? Not on our watch you won't. :flipoff

[clambake]

Right on Nascar! We need to use the successful example of Iraq and spread that shit throughout the world!

[NASCARdad]

Hey, has there been an attack on US soil since 9/11? NO!

Cut and run is NOT an option except for you libs.

[clambake]

Right on Nascar!!!! Why attack here when we gratefully send our kids to die over there? It saves the bad guys alot of trouble.

[boutons_]

I love you faux macho NASCAR knee-jerk dumbfucks.
You're as easy as shooting fish in a barrel, great sport! http://spurstalk.com/forums/images/smilies/smilol.gif

"an attack on US soil since 9/11"

Has an attack been attepted? NO! OBL knew attacks directly in USA would be extremely difficutl, esp after the sleeping Repugs were awakened by WTC. So OBL succeeded, with WTC attack, in drawing the US military into much easier, closer killing grounds in foreign countries surrounded by other Muslim countries. As direct result, the US military will waste more lives in Afghanistan and Iraq than OLB murdered in the WTC. Wasting US lives with no benefit to the USA.

"you all fucked up 9/11"

The Repugs are 100% responsible for derelection of NatSec duty between Jan-Sep 2001 that permitted the WTC. The Repugs did nothing, were asleep at the wheel, abandoned their NatSec guard duty. The Dems were NOT involved, but keep the slime and lies coming.

"Cut and run is NOT an option"

Failing in Aghanistan and Iraq is NOT an option, so why are the Repugs NOT doing the things necessary to try recover in those countries what the Repugs' incompetence has perhaps irretrievably lost? Cut-and-run is a sane upgrade compared to the what the incompetent Repugs are doing now.

[clambake]

Nascar fans are as close as they'll get to turning left.

[TDMVPDPOY]

when is japan sendin out their gundams, mechas....

[RandomGuy]

Screw the talk! You yellow bellied libs want to talk while NK keeps building nuclear weapons!?!? Just like you all fucked up 9/11 you want to do it again? Not on our watch you won't. :flipoff

Right, because things have gone so well on *your* watch. :rolleyes

The bad idea poorly executed that is Iraq has made nukes the only viable self-defense option in the eyes of both Iran and NK.

[01Snake]

Note to pacifist/isolationists - This is PRECISELY why you do anything necessary to stop third world countries from gaining nuclear capability. Because once that genie is out of the bottle there's almost never a way to put it back. Once a rogue state gets its hands on a bomb, your military option goes out the window. Take NK for example - It's very satisfying to talk about the utter destruction we could put down on them but it would be so irresponsible of us to pre-emptively strike them that it's just out of the question. They might not be able to reach us with a weapon (yet) but they could certainly evaporate Seoul or maybe even Tokyo. Once an unstable state is armed the stakes are just too high to do anything but talk, sanction, coax, wait and try to destabilize. All very unsatisfying and defensive measures. They're now driving and we're left reacting.

This is why a realistic threat of a nuclear program in Iraq and now Iran merit(ed) a pre-emptive military response. Time is on their side. Dither and talk and sanction and you only give them time to develop that trump card. Once they've got it, we're screwed. The political debate over the fairness of us, a nuclear power, trying to dictate against that to others is just so fucking irrelevant ... It's like arguing that if you the honest homeowner can have a gun then why shouldn't the criminal down the street? We're not bitching about Britain or France or some other respectable civilized country that can be counted on to behave rationally ... We're talking about third-world dipshits who are barely out of the trees now being armed with hydrogen bombs. It's expedient common sense, people. Stomp them out hard before they're armed otherwise you're left with the options of A.) Being blackmailed by them or B.) Trading cities.

[clambake]

Where the hell is my mongoose?

[velik_m]

Note to pacifist/isolationists - This is PRECISELY why you do anything necessary to stop third world countries from gaining nuclear capability. Because once that genie is out of the bottle there's almost never a way to put it back. Once a rogue state gets its hands on a bomb, your military option goes out the window. Take NK for example - It's very satisfying to talk about the utter destruction we could put down on them but it would be so irresponsible of us to pre-emptively strike them that it's just out of the question. They might not be able to reach us with a weapon (yet) but they could certainly evaporate Seoul or maybe even Tokyo. Once an unstable state is armed the stakes are just too high to do anything but talk, sanction, coax, wait and try to destabilize. All very unsatisfying and defensive measures. They're now driving and we're left reacting.

This is why a realistic threat of a nuclear program in Iraq and now Iran merit(ed) a pre-emptive military response. Time is on their side. Dither and talk and sanction and you only give them time to develop that trump card. Once they've got it, we're screwed. The political debate over the fairness of us, a nuclear power, trying to dictate against that to others is just so fucking irrelevant ... It's like arguing that if you the honest homeowner can have a gun then why shouldn't the criminal down the street? We're not bitching about Britain or France or some other respectable civilized country that can be counted on to behave rationally ... We're talking about third-world dipshits who are barely out of the trees now being armed with hydrogen bombs. It's expedient common sense, people. Stomp them out hard before they're armed otherwise you're left with the options of A.) Being blackmailed by them or B.) Trading cities.

almost never? how many time this happened? How many nuke wars did we have? Up to this point there is only one country in the world that used nukes in combat. (hopefully it stays that way)

[01Snake]

How many nuke wars did we have? Up to this point there is only one country in the world that used nukes in combat. (hopefully it stays that way)

Keeping said weapons out of the hands of rogue states is a great way to assure it stays that way don't you agree?

[velik_m]

define rogue. Is Pakistan rogue (muslim+dictator)?

[01Snake]

define rogue. Is Pakistan rogue (muslim+dictator)?

While Pakistan does have some issues (mainly with India), I do not see them in the same light as Iran/NK.

[velik_m]

by issues you mean wars.

funny - the relationship between the countries improved after they both got nukes.

i'm not happy about the spreading of the nuclear weapons, but preemptive bombing is not the anwser. And with US having such a big stockpile of nukes, it's a bit hypocritical to bash other countries to want them.

[01Snake]

And with US having such a big stockpile of nukes, it's a bit hypocritical to bash other countries to want them.

Some simply cannot be TRUSTED if (when) they acquire them don't you think? Are you comfortable with nutjobs like Kim Jong or Ahmadinejad behind the trigger of a nuke? I'm not and I'm pretty sure the rest of the world isn't either.

[RandomGuy]

Note to pacifist/isolationists - This is PRECISELY why you do anything necessary to stop third world countries from gaining nuclear capability

Anything?

So lobbing a pre-emptive nuke or two would be included in that?

[RandomGuy]

This is why a realistic threat of a nuclear program in Iraq and now Iran merit(ed) a pre-emptive military response. Time is on their side. Dither and talk and sanction and you only give them time to develop that trump card. Once they've got it, we're screwed. The political debate over the fairness of us, a nuclear power, trying to dictate against that to others is just so fucking irrelevant ... It's like arguing that if you the honest homeowner can have a gun then why shouldn't the criminal down the street? We're not bitching about Britain or France or some other respectable civilized country that can be counted on to behave rationally ... We're talking about third-world dipshits who are barely out of the trees now being armed with hydrogen bombs. It's expedient common sense, people. Stomp them out hard before they're armed otherwise you're left with the options of A.) Being blackmailed by them or B.) Trading cities.

I am far from a "pacifist". I am a pragmatist. Military action in either Iran or North Korea is just stupid and short sighted. You seem to be making the case that we MUST respond militarily to everything.

I just don't see how this is any different than what happened with the Soviet Union for 50 years, other than the difference is that the newer nuclear powers are much smaller.

MAD would mean far more for such a small country, even barring other considerations. Add those in and you get some interesting results.

Let's step this up and see where your logic leads.

Let's assume we do nothing and North Korea really does get a nuke.

Let's further assume, as you do, that they are unstable enough to use it, on Japan, SK, or the US.

What do you think will happen?

[01Snake]

Anything?

So lobbing a pre-emptive nuke or two would be included in that?

Technically, yes. Would a situation ever warrant a pre-emptive nuke strike? HELL NO!

[Drachen]

Technically, yes. Would a situation ever warrant a pre-emptive nuke strike? HELL NO!

Why not? An Iraq that was doing nothing to us warrented a conventional attack. It would seem to follow that a country that IS doing something to us (making threats, proving before the world that they have the ability to carry them out) would warrent a nuke attack.

[clambake]

Time to add us into that group of countries that can't be trusted.

[xrayzebra]

"We must talk to NK."

nah, Democrats try diplomacy and multi-national co-operation. The Repugs spurn diplomacy, go it alone, and bomb the shit out of everybody, but above all do only that which provides Repug partisan advantage and some kind of gotcha/litmus test to attack the Dems, NatSec be damned.

Did you watch the Condi interview today on
FOX. She explained why the U.S. wont talk to
them directly. Really simple.

The would not abide by any agreement with the
U.S. and feel justified in doing so. BUT

If they do not abide by any agreement made to
all the nations in the talks, China and Russia and
Japan especially then they would have problems
with those countries since they must live with
them on a daily basis and get most of their
aid from them.

Now do you understand why we wont and cant
have one on one talks? I doubt it.

[Ozzman]

I feel it is really up to China to end this. They have the most leverage against NK. They cannot cut off the food supply since so many have already died due to starvation but they can cut off their energy supply and put some real pressure against NK.

We must talk to NK.


Agreed. THis is dealing with Nukes, and china is the one to handle this.

Think about this....IIFF China were to invade, they could assemble a million man army in a flash! Their population is what, 1.7 Billion? and roughly .25 to .375 of that is Males able to fight. that equals out to roughly 636,000,000 people, minus the unable to fight, etc. And since they are communists, they can have any of them in their army, and remember this is ROUGH calculations!! I doubt that they would do that, but think about the fact that is over twice OUR population.

But I do agree that this situation require special handling, Bush not qualified to do so. I also think it would do some good for Bush to add a negotiating assistant, etc, that might be able to coordinate him better on this subject.