mavs offer to josh extention....

[TDMVPDPOY]

first offer was less than prince contract 20mill less hahaha

i laugh if howard walks, and comes sign with the spurs for MLE for 3 years, then we offer him something........

[JamStone]

He won't sign for the MLE.

[Mr.Bottomtooth]

Yes he will.

[mavsfan1000]

Fuck man. Howard is worth more than that. You better not fuck this up Cuban.

[Ignorant Spurs fan]

come to the Spurs baby! :hungry:

[dirk4mvp]

He ain't going nowhere.

[Mr.Bottomtooth]

Next year:
C Elson/Butler(Oberto FA)
PF Duncan(Boner FA, Horry may retire)
SF Bowen(Williams FA)
SG Manu/Fin/Brent
PG Tony(Beno and JV FA)

Resign Oberto. Get rid of Elson for a 1st rounder. Sign Howard, Boykins, and either Scola, Anderson Varejao, Javtokas, and Mahinmi, and we got ourselves a deal! I know I live in fantasy world.

C Oberto/Butler/Mahinmi or Javtokas
PF Duncan/Varejao or Scola
SF Howard/Bowen
SG Manu/Fin/Brent
PG Tony/Boykins
GOD DAMN! Spurs heaven. If only it became true...

[Bruno]

http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/spt/basketball/mavs/stories/101406dnspomavslede.2dc8d02

Howard upset by value Mavs attach to him
Fourth-year G/F wants team to make fair offer so he can just go play
10:11 PM CDT on Friday, October 13, 2006
By EDDIE SEFKO / The Dallas Morning News

MILWAUKEE – Through two preseason games, Josh Howard has heaved 22 shots in 40 minutes. Only one player's arm has had a bigger workout, rookie Moe Ager, who has 25 shots but has played 59 minutes.

The coaches can forgive Ager for his exuberance. He's young, and it's the staff's job to rein him in, which they will.

But Howard's situation is different. The knee-jerk reaction is to think that Howard is already taking a me-first attitude because he's playing for next season's contract. Never too early to start building a case for megabucks, right?

Wrong. Howard said Friday that he has to tell himself every day to chill out about his contract situation and that "depressed" is not the word he'd use to describe his mood.

"Disappointed would be a better word," he said. "The other one I'd use would be a cuss word."

Howard is in the final year of his rookie contract. He is one of the lowest-paid Mavericks at slightly less than $1.6 million this season. Yet he is either the team's second- or third-most important player, along with Jason Terry, behind Dirk Nowitzki.

Howard and his agent already have talked to the Mavericks about a contract in the same neighborhood as Detroit's Tayshaun Prince, who signed last October for five years, $47.5 million.

The two players are similar, although it can be argued that Howard is more valuable to the Mavericks.

"The first number that came out [from the Mavs] wasn't anywhere near what Tayshaun makes," Howard said. "It was for five years, but it was $20 million less."

President of basketball operations Donnie Nelson said the Mavericks have not given up on extending Howard before the Oct. 31 deadline. After that, the team must wait until next summer and run the restricted free-agent gantlet.

"It's a negotiation," Nelson said. "Sometimes they move quickly and sometimes they move slowly. Everyone's worst-case scenario is not such a terrible thing – to wait until next summer. Nobody should sign a deal they're not comfortable with."

Howard will be a restricted free agent after this season, which means he can do one of four things:

• sign an extension with the Mavericks;

• sign an offer sheet with another team, which the Mavericks can match and retain Howard;

• end up with the team that offers him the contract if the Mavericks don't match it;

• or, play one more season with the Mavericks, then become an unrestricted free agent and go wherever he wants.

Considering that a team like Charlotte, which has boatloads of money next summer, could be waiting to pounce on a player like Howard, it's a dangerous game the Mavericks are playing.

At the very least, the price tag could go up markedly.

"I'm not even trying to break the bank," Howard said. "I've never been a guy who lets stuff get to me. I understand I'm a restricted free agent and they can wait until next year to sign me. But I was the other guy in that '03 class who made it to the Finals [joining Miami's Dwyane Wade]."

Howard understands that management wants a hungry player who is going to have a big season. However, he disagrees with the theory that the team's success this year should be the basis of his future.

"I want to get back to that spot where we were last year," he said. "We all do. But to be honest, I don't think that should have anything to do with me making money."

As for Howard's frame of mind, he said the team and fans shouldn't worry.

"I don't have to prove nothing," he said. "I'm still playing whether I'm getting $40 million or I'm getting my $1.6 million like this year. I'm going to have a ball out there because that's what I do."

Injury update: The Mavericks left Greg Buckner (sprained left knee), Jerry Stackhouse (knee), Dirk Nowitzki and Jason Terry in Dallas and also will play the Milwaukee Bucks tonight without Devin Harris (left hamstring).

Harris, who is from Milwaukee, took the trip home to visit family and friends and work out with the team.

"Just some free per diem for him," coach Avery Johnson joked.

[TDMVPDPOY]

Next year:
C Elson/Butler(Oberto FA)
PF Duncan(Boner FA, Horry may retire)
SF Bowen(Williams FA)
SG Manu/Fin/Brent
PG Tony(Beno and JV FA)

Resign Oberto. Get rid of Elson for a 1st rounder. Sign Howard, Boykins, and either Scola, Anderson Varejao, Javtokas, and Mahinmi, and we got ourselves a deal! I know I live in fantasy world.

C Oberto/Butler/Mahinmi or Javtokas
PF Duncan/Varejao or Scola
SF Howard/Bowen
SG Manu/Fin/Brent
PG Tony/Boykins
GOD DAMN! Spurs heaven. If only it became true...

pass the fuckn joint around bro!!!

i love this shit, now all we need is cp3 and change the SAS = WF spurs :D

[Mr.Bottomtooth]

Go for the Spurs offer!!!

[Mr.Bottomtooth]

pass the fuckn joint around bro!!!

i love this shit, now all we need is cp3 and change the SAS = WF spurs :D
I know it's stupid. I just wanted to post my dream.

[Bruno]

"The first number that came out [from the Mavs] wasn't anywhere near what Tayshaun makes," Howard said. "It was for five years, but it was $20 million less."

So they first offer him $27.5M/5 years ?
I can understand that Howard is upset, doing an offer like that is a lack of respect for him and for what he has done for Dallas.

Howard to Spurs is a pipe dream, the only way we cna get him is :
Howard doesn't sign an extension this summer. Howard play for the qualifyin offer in 07-08 (same scenario than Radmanovic). Spurs will be under the cap during the 08 summer, so they can offer him a big contract during this summer.

[TDMVPDPOY]

look if the current offer was MLE, then why not accept the spurs MLE offer for 3 years, than resign him to the new CBA whatever it is, better to sign with the mavs enemy and shove it down cubans throat :D.

now i wonder what diaw/hinrich are thinkin right now....

[Bruno]

C Oberto/Butler/Mahinmi or Javtokas
PF Duncan/Varejao or Scola
SF Howard/Bowen
SG Manu/Fin/Brent
PG Tony/Boykins
GOD DAMN! Spurs heaven. If only it became true...

It works too with Diaw at SF and it's less unlikely.

BTW, Mahinmi is more a PF not a C and Spurs' staff see him as a PF too.

[Bruno]

look if the current offer was MLE, then why not accept the spurs MLE offer for 3 years, than resign him to the new CBA whatever it is, better to sign with the mavs enemy and shove it down cubans throat :D.

now i wonder what diaw/hinrich are thinkin right now....

He will be restricted in 07, mavs will match a MLE offer.

[Mr.Bottomtooth]

It works too with Diaw at SF and it's less unlikely.

BTW, Mahinmi is more a PF not a C and Spurs' staff see him as a PF too.
There's not a big selection for the center position next summer so we're probably gonna have to adjust. The only centers that are available that are sorta good are Chris Mihm, Jamaal Magloire, and Raef LaFrentz.

[Bruno]

There's not a big selection for the center position next summer so we're probably gonna have to adjust. The only centers that are available that are sorta good are Chris Mihm, Jamaal Magloire, and Raef LaFrentz.

Duncan, Elson, Butler, Javtokas are closer to a C than Mahinmi.

And spurs won't retool during the 07 summer but during the 08 summer.

BTW a quote from Pop about Mahinmi :
" We think that he will be more a PF than a C because he is athletic, run the floor very well and is mobile. I don't know if he will be able to play C in nba."

[ducks]

20 million less then prince is alot

[Zunni]

When did Cake Boy Cuban get so fucking cheap? I can understand Fin and Nash, because they had passed their peak, but Howard is on the upswing, a talented young player.

Both Josh Howard and Boris Diaw are not liking the extensions they are being offered, and one or both could be UFAs in 2008 if they accept the QO next summer.

[FromWayDowntown]

trading Elson for a first rounder

:lmao

[dirk4mvp]

20 million less then prince is alot


No shit

[atxrocker]

josh howard is a piece of horse shit. fuck em. i hope he gets screwed.

[Dirk41MVP]

look if the current offer was MLE, then why not accept the spurs MLE offer for 3 years, than resign him to the new CBA whatever it is, better to sign with the mavs enemy and shove it down cubans throat

problem is, YOU are the enemies. besides if he signs and MLA offer, do you think Cubes will let him go to the spurs for that ? HAAAAAA, you'd have to offer him close to a max deal (not happening) for cuban to let him go to our direct enemies.

Don't dream, you stand 0 chance at him even if he is a restricted FA next year.

[Amarelooms]

josh howard is a piece of horse shit. fuck em. i hope he gets screwed.

WGAS what you think RIGHT!!! Now fuck off please :elephant

[mavs>spurs2]

josh howard is a piece of horse shit. fuck em. i hope he gets screwed.

Care to explain?

[TheSanityAnnex]

Why does Josh Howard always wear his headband like a fruitcake?

[atxrocker]

WGAS what you think RIGHT!!! Now fuck off please :elephant


:lol :lol you gotta be fuckin jokin me. who gives a shit what i think? right... maybe i should produce such winning threads as

mavs vs the world
why are the mavs so good and cool
and want some of this

maybe i could be relevant in this forum then. go suck a horse dick you fuckin prick and spare us from having to read your weak ass threads. looking back at the titles of those threads seriously makes me wonder if you're over the age of 11. come back after you bring something to the fucking table, you fucking douche.

[ABDENOUR POWER]

Howard is an arrogant prick.

I still haven't forgiven him for his comments about Tayshaun.

[ducks]

howard deserves something close to prince with the money
cuban is being an idiot
howard is young he got an out with nash because of age but howard is young and NOT INJURY PRONE

[mavsfan1000]

Howard plays a wreckless game so I always worry about him getting injured.

[Amarelooms]

:lol :lol you gotta be fuckin jokin me. who gives a shit what i think? right... maybe i should produce such winning threads as

mavs vs the world
why are the mavs so good and cool
and want some of this

maybe i could be relevant in this forum then. go suck a horse dick you fuckin prick and spare us from having to read your weak ass threads. looking back at the titles of those threads seriously makes me wonder if you're over the age of 11. come back after you bring something to the fucking table, you fucking douche.

You're the one claiming "josh howard is a piece of horse shit. fuck em. i hope he gets screwed". Do you know Josh Howard personnally? Have you hung out with him? Now fuck off cunt face. BTW the Kings suck donkey balls!! :elephant

[mavs>spurs2]

josh howard is a piece of horse shit. fuck em. i hope he gets screwed.


Care to explain?

Guess not....

Don't give Amarelooms a hard time when you can't even backup your own shit.

[dirk4mvp]

Howard plays a wreckless game so I always worry about him getting injured.


that shit gets on my nerves. HE just runs into the lane not giving a fuck what might happen. He's got some tender ankles too.

[Mr.Bottomtooth]

You're the one claiming "josh howard is a piece of horse shit. fuck em. i hope he gets screwed". Do you know Josh Howard personnally? Have you hung out with him? Now fuck off cunt face. BTW the Kings suck donkey balls!! :elephant
:lmao

I can't believe I'm saying this, but I agree with you.

[atxrocker]

Guess not....

Don't give Amarelooms a hard time when you can't even backup your own shit.


can't back up my own shit? i said he was a piece of shit and i hope he get's fucked, that's my personal opinion and i don't have to explain shit to anybody, especially j.ho jockers. he's a fucking overrated ghetto classless thug just like jason terry and they can both go to hell. you think he's god and i think he's a fucking punk, that doesn't make either of our opinions right.

[atxrocker]

You're the one claiming "josh howard is a piece of horse shit. fuck em. i hope he gets screwed". Do you know Josh Howard personnally? Have you hung out with him? Now fuck off cunt face. BTW the Kings suck donkey balls!! :elephant


yeah i said it, and i don't take a fucking word back. i'll say it again if need be. do i know him or hung out with him... uh fuck no and i have no desire to. people on this board judge nba players all the fucking time and i highly doubt any have actually hung out with the player that they criticize. oh and fuck off cunt face and the kings suck donkey balls are great insults. my fucking dog coulda came up with something more original. try again.

[dirk4mvp]

can't back up my own shit? i said he was a piece of shit and i hope he get's fucked, that's my personal opinion and i don't have to explain shit to anybody, especially j.ho jockers. he's a fucking overrated ghetto classless thug just like jason terry and they can both go to hell. you think he's god and i think he's a fucking punk, that doesn't make either of our opinions right.


I really want to hear how Josh Howard is overrated. Come on, exercise your brain a little and come up with something.

[Mr.Bottomtooth]

A non-Mavs fan making nonsenseless arguments?! Something is up. This is gonna take me awhile to sink in.

[dirk4mvp]

A non-Mavs fan making nonsenseless arguments?! Something is up. This is gonna take me awhile to sink in.


Teh world is coming to an end. :dizzy :downspin:



He's just mad the Kings won't amount to shit.

[Mr.Bottomtooth]

Teh world is coming to an end. :dizzy :downspin:



He's just mad the Kings won't amount to shit.
:lol

Well honestly, I think they declined too. They lost Bonzi, but maybe Taylor can contribute well.

[Amarelooms]

can't back up my own shit? i said he was a piece of shit and i hope he get's fucked, that's my personal opinion and i don't have to explain shit to anybody, especially j.ho jockers. he's a fucking overrated ghetto classless thug just like jason terry and they can both go to hell. you think he's god and i think he's a fucking punk, that doesn't make either of our opinions right.

Hahha QUEENS fan talking smack. Let's look the QUEENS roster shall we.

Mike Bibby - true flamer - get any more tatoos this offseason?
Ron Artest - talk about ghetto lol he's biggest POS individual EVER
Brad Miller - wigger in every sense of the word
Shareef "I'm just glad I got to the playoffs for once in my career" Rahim

Why even go on. I'm done arguring with this loser. Josh Howard is greater than the whole QUEENS organization.

[Mr.Bottomtooth]

C Miller/Taylor/Potapenko/Woods
PF Abdur-Rahim/Thomas
SF Artest/Williamson/Williams/Amundson
SG Martin or Salmons/Martin or Salmons/Garcia
PG Bibby/Hart/Douby/Price
I don't know whether Douby is a PG or SG, but I don't think that matters. :lol

[dirk4mvp]

Hahha QUEENS fan talking smack. Let's look the QUEENS roster shall we.

Mike Bibby - true flamer - get any more tatoos this offseason?
Ron Artest - talk about ghetto lol he's biggest POS individual EVER
Brad Miller - wigger in every sense of the word
Shareef "I'm just glad I got to the playoffs for once in my career" Rahim

Why even go on. I'm done arguring with this loser. Josh Howard is greater than the whole QUEENS organization.


Haha, I did find that ironic atxrocker said JET and Howard were ghetto whatevers. Especially when his team has the biggest wigger in the NBA and that piece of shit named Artest.

[trueD]

Hahha QUEENS fan talking smack. Let's look the QUEENS roster shall we.

Mike Bibby - true flamer - get any more tatoos this offseason?
Ron Artest - talk about ghetto lol he's biggest POS individual EVER
Brad Miller - wigger in every sense of the word
Shareef "I'm just glad I got to the playoffs for once in my career" Rahim

Why even go on. I'm done arguring with this loser. Josh Howard is greater than the whole QUEENS organization.I already know you don't like to talk about pre-season games, but didn't the Kings look sweet the other night? You can't lie now, no fair lying!

Too bad that puss "oh, I can't mess up my hair and maybe risk getting hurt for the sake of a meaningless, competitive warmup game before regular season" Nowitzki didn't play, he outta be proud that coach finds his worth great enough that he gets a pass. Those lovely lace panties he certainly wears under his shorts have likely stunted his manly growth by climbing up his scrotum and squishing any chance he has of having real balls. Big fat whiner, momma's boy. He lost against the stationary bike and the Heat, but he won't lose the race in the west for most valuable choker with femme hands and dainty ass swagger. You go honey Dirk, make momma proud!

[ATX Spur]

Josh Howard will not amount to much more than he is now. Cuban didn't shell out extra for Nash, he's sure as shit not going to do it for someone who doesn't have the presence of mind not to call timeouts when you don't have any remaining.

On him being pursued by the Spurs: pass.

Diaw has twice the potential.

[Obstructed_View]

Josh Howard is going to have to figure out a way to not lead the league in technicals. He's one of those guys that whines to the officials because he can't control his temper. He might have problems in that area. If the league is serious, it could set his game back.

[TDMVPDPOY]

seriously josh should be gettin what tay is getting, fuck even dunleavy got a contract that much.....seriously though.

[ATX Spur]

seriously josh should be gettin what tay is getting, fuck even dunleavy got a contract that much.....seriously though.

Just because other people are getting overpaid doesn't mean the other 28 owners should perpetuate their mistakes.

[ponky]

I already know you don't like to talk about pre-season games, but didn't the Kings look sweet the other night? You can't lie now, no fair lying!

Too bad that puss "oh, I can't mess up my hair and maybe risk getting hurt for the sake of a meaningless, competitive warmup game before regular season" Nowitzki didn't play, he outta be proud that coach finds his worth great enough that he gets a pass. Those lovely lace panties he certainly wears under his shorts have likely stunted his manly growth by climbing up his scrotum and squishing any chance he has of having real balls. Big fat whiner, momma's boy. He lost against the stationary bike and the Heat, but he won't lose the race in the west for most valuable choker with femme hands and dainty ass swagger. You go honey Dirk, make momma proud!

Yeah, Kings played so great against a Mavs team with no Dirk, Terry, Stack, Harris and who else? You guys played all your starters like there was no tomorrow...cause there ain't, at least not for your team, it's over in April.

I know Spurs fans don't take a liking to Mavs fans but c'mon now, look at these dumb azz Kings fans in this thread. What is the world coming to when Texas teams unite to bash stupid Cali teams?

[Bruno]

On him being pursued by the Spurs: pass.

Diaw has twice the potential.

I take Diaw over Howard too but I wouldn't pass on Howard.

[Amarelooms]

I already know you don't like to talk about pre-season games, but didn't the Kings look sweet the other night? You can't lie now, no fair lying!

Too bad that puss "oh, I can't mess up my hair and maybe risk getting hurt for the sake of a meaningless, competitive warmup game before regular season" Nowitzki didn't play, he outta be proud that coach finds his worth great enough that he gets a pass. Those lovely lace panties he certainly wears under his shorts have likely stunted his manly growth by climbing up his scrotum and squishing any chance he has of having real balls. Big fat whiner, momma's boy. He lost against the stationary bike and the Heat, but he won't lose the race in the west for most valuable choker with femme hands and dainty ass swagger. You go honey Dirk, make momma proud!

Ummm WTF did you just say lol. Dirk lead the Mavs to the Finals....way more than the QUEENS have been to. Enjoy another year fighting for that 8th spot only to be bounced in the 1st round :elephant

[Amarelooms]

Josh Howard is going to have to figure out a way to not lead the league in technicals. He's one of those guys that whines to the officials because he can't control his temper. He might have problems in that area. If the league is serious, it could set his game back.

HAHHAHA....ummm hello genius your teams has Duncan and Ginobli. Come on homer NO ONE IN THE LEAGUE whines more than the Spurs...seriously check yourself man.

[BUMP]

C Miller/Taylor/Potapenko/Woods
PF Abdur-Rahim/Thomas
SF Artest/Williamson/Williams/Amundson
SG Martin or Salmons/Martin or Salmons/Garcia
PG Bibby/Hart/Douby/Price
I don't know whether Douby is a PG or SG, but I don't think that matters. :lol

:lol

only thing Kings need to be focusing on is next year's draft pick

[dirk4mvp]

He shouldn't even wear a mouthpiece, cause he throws it all the time. :bang

[Mr.Bottomtooth]

Yeah, Kings played so great against a Mavs team with no Dirk, Terry, Stack, Harris and who else? You guys played all your starters like there was no tomorrow...cause there ain't, at least not for your team, it's over in April.

I know Spurs fans don't take a liking to Mavs fans but c'mon now, look at these dumb azz Kings fans in this thread. What is the world coming to when Texas teams unite to bash stupid Cali teams?
I definitely see them. Looks like theres a new era of arguments here at SpursTalk.

[Trainwreck2100]

HAHHAHA....ummm hello genius your teams has Duncan and Ginobli. Come on homer NO ONE IN THE LEAGUE whines more than the Spurs...seriously check yourself man.


Yes but they have tenure and this new rule is objective.

[leemajors]

i think the mavs are actually being smart and somewhat cautious here. howard is injury prone, and i don't know if he really deserves what tayshaun got at this point - tayshaun is a much better defender and has added some nice things to his game even since his extension last year. it seems like they may have lowballed him a bit, but he is definitely overreacting. i think donnie said the right thing here - this is going to be an ongoing negotiation. it's just weird to see the mavs acting like this after so recently overpaying terry.

[TDMVPDPOY]

i think josh shouldnt be comparing him and tay what he got, if he wants it, compare himself to dunleavy whose done jackshit all and still got 50mill/5years, its just like cuban wasting money on 6 fouls from eric dampier for 50mill, or watever he signed him for

[trueD]

Yeah, Kings played so great against a Mavs team with no Dirk, Terry, Stack, Harris and who else? You guys played all your starters like there was no tomorrow...cause there ain't, at least not for your team, it's over in April.

Kings played against mostly non-starters, that's true. We came to compete, but only played our starters avg of 22 minutes each (Ron played 30). I couldn't get a good read on how many minutes your starters played because...well, they didn't. Bunch of pansyasses.

[TheSanityAnnex]

I don't hate the Mavs, I just hate their fans.

[Mr.Bottomtooth]

Kings played against mostly non-starters, that's true. We came to compete, but only played our starters avg of 22 minutes each (Ron played 30). I couldn't get a good read on how many minutes your starters played because...well, they didn't. Bunch of pansyasses.
I'm gonna have to ask you to leave this thread and not come back. You're just too fuckin stupid.

[Dirk41MVP]

Kings played against mostly non-starters, that's true. We came to compete, but only played our starters avg of 22 minutes each (Ron played 30). I couldn't get a good read on how many minutes your starters played because...well, they didn't. Bunch of pansyasses.

you're feeling too proud cause you beat the WC champs in a preseason game without 4 of their top 5 players ?, niice... Stupid 4th grader you got as a coach, get a real coach and a real team (see the mavs and the spurs) and then feel proud about your worthless victory against Jose Juan Barea, DJ Mbenga, Ndu Ebi (w/e his name is) , washington and co.

...lmao 1st time i feel bad for spurs fans in this forum... now you got the kings fans talking shit in here, since they've won a preseason game with their new 4th grader coach. HAAAAAAAA :lol


(Ron played 30)

Isn't ron your "superstar" ?, had dirk played full-time-like minutes (30+) as ron did, you guys walk out with a L. plain and simple

[trueD]

No, I'm not feeling proud of beating a depleted Mav's team, but proud of how we played as compared to last year. Anyone who pays attention to Kings ballclub (which I don't expect Mav's fans to be abreast of Kings' condition beyond the W/L column :lol ) knows what a marked improvement just one little pre-season game showed.

4th Grader for a coach, damn...why am I even responding. My bad.

Well, while I'm here: The disparity was 21 points. If Dirk could have prevented say, 10 of those and shot 11 better than his counterpart(s) who filled in, then yeah. You MAY have had a chance. You really need players around Dirk, don't discount their contributions, K bruh?

[trueD]

I'm gonna have to ask you to leave this thread and not come back. You're just too fuckin stupid.:lol

Ask away, little sister. Fucking ask away.

[Amarelooms]

No, I'm not feeling proud of beating a depleted Mav's team, but proud of how we played as compared to last year. Anyone who pays attention to Kings ballclub (which I don't expect Mav's fans to be abreast of Kings' condition beyond the W/L column :lol ) knows what a marked improvement just one little pre-season game showed.

4th Grader for a coach, damn...why am I even responding. My bad.

Well, while I'm here: The disparity was 21 points. If Dirk could have prevented say, 10 of those and shot 11 better than his counterpart(s) who filled in, then yeah. You MAY have had a chance. You really need players around Dirk, don't discount their contributions, K bruh?

Ummm please say you are joking. It's PRESEASON...it DOESN"T MEAN SHIT...calm the fuck down good lord. You gotta be like 15 or something I bet lol.

[Mr.Bottomtooth]

No, I'm not feeling proud of beating a depleted Mav's team, but proud of how we played as compared to last year. Anyone who pays attention to Kings ballclub (which I don't expect Mav's fans to be abreast of Kings' condition beyond the W/L column :lol ) knows what a marked improvement just one little pre-season game showed.

4th Grader for a coach, damn...why am I even responding. My bad.

Well, while I'm here: The disparity was 21 points. If Dirk could have prevented say, 10 of those and shot 11 better than his counterpart(s) who filled in, then yeah. You MAY have had a chance. You really need players around Dirk, don't discount their contributions, K bruh?
Are you trying to say you can tell that the Kings are improving because they beat a Mavs team who are missing their best players and mainly playing the ones just trying to make the team? And what more can Dirk have around him? They have Terry, Howard, Harris, Stackhouse and many others. You are honestly the stupidest person I've had an argument with here ever.

[Zunni]

FMUSA is the Kings version of TDMVPDPOY.

[ponky]

No, I'm not feeling proud of beating a depleted Mav's team, but proud of how we played as compared to last year. Anyone who pays attention to Kings ballclub (which I don't expect Mav's fans to be abreast of Kings' condition beyond the W/L column :lol ) knows what a marked improvement just one little pre-season game showed.

4th Grader for a coach, damn...why am I even responding. My bad.

Well, while I'm here: The disparity was 21 points. If Dirk could have prevented say, 10 of those and shot 11 better than his counterpart(s) who filled in, then yeah. You MAY have had a chance. You really need players around Dirk, don't discount their contributions, K bruh?


*Crickets chirping*

[Obstructed_View]

HAHHAHA....ummm hello genius your teams has Duncan and Ginobli. Come on homer NO ONE IN THE LEAGUE whines more than the Spurs...seriously check yourself man.
Once again I know more about the Mavs than someone claiming to be a fan.

When Howard complains to the officials he does it because he's angry. Duncan and Ginobili don't do that. Howard gets pissed and can't control himself, and that's not something you can necessarily just turn off when they change the rules. It's a known flaw in his game that he gets so easily taken out of it by losing his cool. It has nothing to do with whining, which I'm on record saying I hate about the Spurs. You'd be a fool to imply that Dirk, AJ and Cuban don't whine as much as anyone else, but of course, you are a fool.

Since you aren't actually a Mavericks fan I don't expect you to know any of this. You are, however, completely ignorant about the team you claim to root for, so you fit in just fine with most of them until the Suns show signs of life and you jump back on that bandwagon.

[Amarelooms]

Once again I know more about the Mavs than someone claiming to be a fan.

When Howard complains to the officials he does it because he's angry. Duncan and Ginobili don't do that. Howard gets pissed and can't control himself, and that's not something you can necessarily just turn off when they change the rules. It's a known flaw in his game that he gets so easily taken out of it by losing his cool. It has nothing to do with whining, which I'm on record saying I hate about the Spurs. You'd be a fool to imply that Dirk, AJ and Cuban don't whine as much as anyone else, but of course, you are a fool.

Since you aren't actually a Mavericks fan I don't expect you to know any of this. You are, however, completely ignorant about the team you claim to root for, so you fit in just fine with most of them until the Suns show signs of life and you jump back on that bandwagon.

Having this in your sig "Horry, Duncan, Finley: Defensive juggernaut front line 2007" makes you lose all credibility. No explanation needed. BTW I rather a player get emotional and OCCASIONALLY complain as opposed to the Spurs....er Duncan who throws his hands up in the air and whines after EVERY call against him.

[dirk4mvp]

Kings played against mostly non-starters, that's true. We came to compete, but only played our starters avg of 22 minutes each (Ron played 30). I couldn't get a good read on how many minutes your starters played because...well, they didn't. Bunch of pansyasses.


Are you seriously bitching about the preseason? I guess Kings fans have nothing better to do than bitch about the preseason as they will not accomplish much this season.

[TheSanityAnnex]

Are you seriously bitching about the preseason? I guess Kings fans have nothing better to do than bitch about the preseason as they will not accomplish much this season.


Looks to me like she simply stated what she saw in the preseason game. And it also looks to me like your Mavs friends are the ones bitching.

[Bob Lanier]

tayshaun is a much better defender and has added some nice things to his game even since his extension last year.
No on both counts.

Prince is not nearly the defender he was even in '05, much less '04; with the banning of perimeter hand-checking, a player with his slow feet and lack of strength will never again be more than an average defender (Rip Hamilton became the Pistons' go-to perimeter stopper) - and he can't rebound worth a damn. Offensively, he took a step back last year, although it's hard to tell if that was his fault or Flip's. His post-up game has actually gotten worse since his rookie season, and his jumpshot is still as erratic as it is ugly.

Given a choice between the two, I'd take Howard every time.

[dirk4mvp]

Looks to me like she simply stated what she saw in the preseason game. And it also looks to me like your Mavs friends are the ones bitching.


Looks to me like she called the Mavs a bunch of "pansyasses" for not playing their starters in a pre-season game.

[TheSanityAnnex]

And that is bitching?

[dirk4mvp]

And that is bitching?


Yeah

[mavsfan1000]

I'm sure the kings will do fine this year. We'll see if they reach the mavs level or not. I think changing coaches was a good idea though for them since I think they got bored with Rick Adelman. I like both teams though. I'm looking forward to hopefully another meeting in the playoffs with the kings. It could be another thrilling series.

[mavs>spurs2]

can't back up my own shit? i said he was a piece of shit and i hope he get's fucked, that's my personal opinion and i don't have to explain shit to anybody, especially j.ho jockers. he's a fucking overrated ghetto classless thug just like jason terry and they can both go to hell. you think he's god and i think he's a fucking punk, that doesn't make either of our opinions right.

You can't back up your shit, or else you would have elaborated a little more than childish comments. "Josh howard is a piece of shit" What the hell is that? I think he's god? Where have I ever said that? Find one instance where I ever even overrated Josh Howard. Hell, I don't think i've even talked much about howard since i've been on this forum. Calling him a ghetto classless thug? Like amarelooms said, have you ever met or talked to the guy personally? That's a bold statement for a coward like you who can't even back up his own opinions.

[mavs>spurs2]

Oh, I almost forgot. Atxrocker, you are a hypocrite. You call someone a "ghetto thug," when Ron Artest is the best player on your team. What Artest did was just about the worst thing a player could do, how the hell do you think Josh Howard is a thug after watching that guy beat up fans.

[trueD]

Are you trying to say you can tell that the Kings are improving because they beat a Mavs team who are missing their best players and mainly playing the ones just trying to make the team? And what more can Dirk have around him? They have Terry, Howard, Harris, Stackhouse and many others. You are honestly the stupidest person I've had an argument with here ever.No, Silly. I said
No, I'm not feeling proud of beating a depleted Mav's team

and this:


You really need players around Dirk, don't discount their contributions ...

Now go back and read what I wrote in the context in which it was said. Get some reading comprehension and don't make me use my big wooden spoon on your schoolboy little ass.

:dizzy :reading :clap

[AFBlue]

Josh Howard will not amount to much more than he is now. Cuban didn't shell out extra for Nash, he's sure as shit not going to do it for someone who doesn't have the presence of mind not to call timeouts when you don't have any remaining.

On him being pursued by the Spurs: pass.

Diaw has twice the potential.

So what if Howard screwed up in the finals. Ginobili didn't exactly save game 7 vs. the Mavs. Everyone makes mistakes. Howard is a tough-nosed and professional kid who has a solid all-around game and plays GREAT defense. Even if he has plateaud (which I seriously doubt), he's easily the second best player on the Western Conference Champion Dallas Mavericks and was a huge piece of that series. The man just wants his due. If Joe Johnson can get $15+ mil a year, I gotta think Howard deserves at least $10 mil, and he'll get it whether that's this year, next as an RFA, or hopefully in '08 to the Spurs.

As far as the Diaw comparison, he's got howard beat in in the assist and maybe rebounding categories. But, Howard has a more consistent 3pt shot, is a better on-the-ball defender, and can take his man off the dribble on offense. I think Diaw is good, but the Suns' system has been known to inflate performance statistics. I'd still take Howard and am pissed off that we passed on him in 2003.

[Obstructed_View]

Having this in your sig "Horry, Duncan, Finley: Defensive juggernaut front line 2007" makes you lose all credibility. No explanation needed. BTW I rather a player get emotional and OCCASIONALLY complain as opposed to the Spurs....er Duncan who throws his hands up in the air and whines after EVERY call against him.
I'm really sorry that you are too stupid to understand my sig, but it's appropriate that as a claimed Mavericks fan that you wouldn't. It's also understandable that you don't understand the difference between complaining and losing your temper. Howard gets technicals because he's a hothead. Duncan complains because he's a crybaby. One behavior is more difficult to change than the other, and Howard has demonstrated zero ability to adapt over his short career.

[TDMVPDPOY]

i rather have a player complain, then some idiot flexin his muscles or pumpin his chest, or doing pushups and missin 2fts hahahaha

[Amarelooms]

i rather have a player complain, then some idiot flexin his muscles or pumpin his chest, or doing pushups and missin 2fts hahahaha

Amare LOOMS my friend...be afraid...be very afraid. :elephant

[Amarelooms]

I'm really sorry that you are too stupid to understand my sig, but it's appropriate that as a claimed Mavericks fan that you wouldn't. It's also understandable that you don't understand the difference between complaining and losing your temper. Howard gets technicals because he's a hothead. Duncan complains because he's a crybaby. One behavior is more difficult to change than the other, and Howard has demonstrated zero ability to adapt over his short career.

That's where we disagree. First of all Howard is far from a hothead...if you think this you know nothing about him or the Mavs. How many technicals did Howard get last season? Secondly, I rather someone get emotional and lose their temper once in a while instead of being a big pussy and cry baby like Duncan often portrays himself as. Lastly, you thinking that Finley and old ass Robert Horry are going to D up and shut down anyone is just silly....please take off those homer glasses lol :elephant

[TheSanityAnnex]

I'm sure the kings will do fine this year. We'll see if they reach the mavs level or not. I think changing coaches was a good idea though for them since I think they got bored with Rick Adelman. I like both teams though. I'm looking forward to hopefully another meeting in the playoffs with the kings. It could be another thrilling series.

I'm with you on this one. I'd love to see them match up in the playoffs. Dirk/Artest would be a fun battle.


No one answered my question though..........why does Josh Howard wear his headband like a fruitcake?

[ponky]

I'm with you on this one. I'd love to see them match up in the playoffs. Dirk/Artest would be a fun battle.


No one answered my question though..........why does Josh Howard wear his headband like a fruitcake?


I'll answer it. Guys will of course think it looks like a fruitcake but girls think it's cute...I'm sure he cares more about what us girls think that what guys think about his headband and I've talked to other girl fans about it, most of them think it's cool. I've always thought this, plus I think it fits his youthful, not-so-serious joking and laughing image. Then again, maybe it just bothers his line of vision to have something right above his eyebrow so he pulls it up.

[dirk4mvp]

Amare LOOMS my friend...be afraid...be very afraid. :elephant


:wtf

Okay.

[dirk4mvp]

I'm with you on this one. I'd love to see them match up in the playoffs. Dirk/Artest would be a fun battle.


No one answered my question though..........why does Josh Howard wear his headband like a fruitcake?


It's not fruitcake-ish, it's stylish :fro


Nice sig :tu

[Mr.Bottomtooth]

No, Silly. I said

and this:



Now go back and read what I wrote in the context in which it was said. Get some reading comprehension and don't make me use my big wooden spoon on your schoolboy little ass.

:dizzy :reading :clap
Well then what point are you trying to make?

[Obstructed_View]

That's where we disagree. First of all Howard is far from a hothead...if you think this you know nothing about him or the Mavs. How many technicals did Howard get last season?

Again, you are missing the point. There's a change in the way they interpret the rule this year. And Howard got three technicals last year. As much as the team bitches he's a minor offender, but he barks and has gotten away with it in the past. With the change, he has a chance to be the new Nick Van Exel.


Secondly, I rather someone get emotional and lose their temper once in a while instead of being a big pussy and cry baby like Duncan often portrays himself as.
But you just got done saying that Howard isn't a hothead, but back to your statement: If a player loses his temper in a big game and, oh I don't know, punches someone in the balls or flagrant fouls Shaq and gets himself suspended for a game how is that better than whining about calls, which your team does as well as anyone not from Miami. The Mavs are a team full of hotheads which doesn't set much of an example for Howard. See Stephen Jackson for history on that.


Lastly, you thinking that Finley and old ass Robert Horry are going to D up and shut down anyone is just silly....please take off those homer glasses lol :elephant
Further proof of your blithering idiocy. If you had any idea what FSB stood for you'd realize the meaning of the rest of my sig. That's the front line that your team barely beat in the playoffs, junior, and it's not coming back for meaningful minutes against anyone. Time for Mavs fans to realize what they will never be fortunate enough to face from the Spurs ever again. Hope you celebrated your fluke last year.

[ChumpDumper]

You do know a mare is a female horsey, right?

[BUMP]

ChumpDumper is a beast

[Amarelooms]

Obstructed is clueless and obviously doesn't know the Mavs players. Howard will be just fine and he's no worse than Parker, Ginobili or other nba players. You have NO POINT at all yet you keep yapping away and continue to appear like a retard....keep on keeping on playa lol

[Obstructed_View]

Obstructed is clueless and obviously doesn't know the Mavs players. Howard will be just fine and he's no worse than Parker, Ginobili or other nba players. You have NO POINT at all yet you keep yapping away and continue to appear like a retard....keep on keeping on playa lol
You are my science class frog. I know more about the Mavs than you do, more about the city, and I've probably been to more games. I've been kicking your ass for a dozen posts in a row and now that you've finally figured out that my sig is sarcastic you have nothing to say.

I own you, "playa". Go back to rooting for the Suns, female horsey.

[BUMP]

You are my science class frog. I know more about the Mavs than you do, more about the city, and I've probably been to more games. I've been kicking your ass for a dozen posts in a row and now that you've finally figured out that my sig is sarcastic you have nothing to say.

I own you, "playa". Go back to rooting for the Suns, female horsey.

actually Horry and Duncan or solid on D. just not on Dirk

[Amarelooms]

You are my science class frog. I know more about the Mavs than you do, more about the city, and I've probably been to more games. I've been kicking your ass for a dozen posts in a row and now that you've finally figured out that my sig is sarcastic you have nothing to say.

I own you, "playa". Go back to rooting for the Suns, female horsey.

HAHAHAHA good one you are truely clueless. "Kicking my ass for a dozen posts" lol. You must be blind if you claim to know the Mavs. BTW I'm not even a Suns fan but you're too dumb to figure that out I guess. Maybe I'll pull for the Suns as Amare and Nash run circles aroung the Spurs this season :elephant

[Obstructed_View]

HAHAHAHA good one you are truely clueless. "Kicking my ass for a dozen posts" lol. You must be blind if you claim to know the Mavs. BTW I'm not even a Suns fan but you're too dumb to figure that out I guess. Maybe I'll pull for the Suns as Amare and Nash run circles aroung the Spurs this season :elephant
Way to follow up with nothing.

By the way, locked threads don't lie:

As a Suns fan I am going to cheer for the Mavs.....they are a great team and as a WCF gotta pull for em. Also how can anyone cheer for Shaq, that idiot Payton, Jason Williams, thug Zo, and that jackass Walker. GO MAVS!!!
I own you.

[Mr.Bottomtooth]

lol

[BUMP]

im loving this argument :hungry:

[THE SIXTH MAN]

Way to follow up with nothing.

By the way, locked threads don't lie:

I own you.
OHHHHHHHHH SHIT!!!!!!!!!!


Amarecocksucker just got :owned x 1,000,000,000!!!!!!!

:corn: Classic bandwagon fan.

[ATX Spur]

So what if Howard screwed up in the finals. Ginobili didn't exactly save game 7 vs. the Mavs. Everyone makes mistakes. Howard is a tough-nosed and professional kid who has a solid all-around game and plays GREAT defense. Even if he has plateaud (which I seriously doubt), he's easily the second best player on the Western Conference Champion Dallas Mavericks and was a huge piece of that series. The man just wants his due. If Joe Johnson can get $15+ mil a year, I gotta think Howard deserves at least $10 mil, and he'll get it whether that's this year, next as an RFA, or hopefully in '08 to the Spurs.

As far as the Diaw comparison, he's got howard beat in in the assist and maybe rebounding categories. But, Howard has a more consistent 3pt shot, is a better on-the-ball defender, and can take his man off the dribble on offense. I think Diaw is good, but the Suns' system has been known to inflate performance statistics. I'd still take Howard and am pissed off that we passed on him in 2003.

The Finals wasn't the only time Howard called a timeout when his team didn't have anymore. See: Wake Forest critical ACC games. If he hasn't reached his plateau, he's not far off. He hasn't exhibited the intelligence that it takes to add another dimension to his game. He'll continue to be gritty and athletic for a few years if he avoids injury, and that's about it.

And Diaw doesn't just have Howard beat in the assist and rebound categories. He averaged over three times the number of assists Howard did last season. Over twice as many blocks. Howard can take his man off the dribble better, as you say correctly, but Diaw mostly plays a position where he doesn't have to take his man off the dribble. Playing in the Suns' offense only inflates your stats inasmuch as the tempo gives you more offensive possesions per game. In that department, they're not that much more ahead of Dallas.

Diaw is longer and taller and much more versatile. He's got international experience. Diaw over Howard all week, and twice on Sundays.

[mavsfan1000]

The best way of improving how the suns inflate stats by seeing how Joe Johnson is doing this year with the Hawks. He's not close to the player he was in Phoenix. The running system really benefits his game rather than the halfcourt Hawks team. I would take Howard over Diaw as well. Diaw only beats Howard in the rebounding category because he is playing CENTER while Howard is playing SF. It's a lot easier to get high rebounding numbers when you play center. Howard has better range, better slashing ability, and a better rebounder.

[George Gervin's Afro]

I hope Cuban lowballs Josh Howard.. and then has to overpay him..nothing like a cap strapped team to trying get better..

[Obstructed_View]

The best way of improving how the suns inflate stats by seeing how Joe Johnson is doing this year with the Hawks.
Yeah. 17 points and 3.5 assists with the Suns dropped to a measley 20 points and 6.5 assists in Atlanta. :rolleyes

Maybe Joe averaged three points and 3 assists in that extra MINUTE he played per game in Atlanta.

[mavsfan1000]

Joe Johnson was the go to guy in Atlanta. It shows your intelligence by only listing his point average and assist average. His outside shooting went from like 47% to like 33%. That is all that needs to be said on the difference between Phoenix and Atlanta.

[ATX Spur]

Joe Johnson was the go to guy in Atlanta. It shows your intelligence by only listing his point average and assist average. His outside shooting went from like 47% to like 33%. That is all that needs to be said on the difference between Phoenix and Atlanta.

Phoenix is a much better team than Atlanta. His point and assist totals would be even higher if he had better teammates and a clear game plan.

[mavs>spurs2]

Joe Johnson is good....I just don't think he's comfortable being the number one option. He needs teammates before his talent will really show.

[mavsfan1000]

Phoenix is a much better team than Atlanta. His point and assist totals would be even higher if he had better teammates and a clear game plan.
Exactly. That's what I was saying about Diaw getting better because he was on a better team. Phoenix also maximizes his rebounding numbers by putting him at center. His rebound stats get better at the price of the teams rebounding numbers. Dallas is one of the best rebounding teams and Phoenix one of the worst. Josh Howard>Diaw.

[ATX Spur]

Joe Johnson was the go to guy in Atlanta. It shows your intelligence by only listing his point average and assist average. His outside shooting went from like 47% to like 33%. That is all that needs to be said on the difference between Phoenix and Atlanta.

By the way, Johnson's field goal percentage was 45 percent in Atlanta this last season. But his 3pt% did go down, which makes it more poignant that he averaged more points last season.

[ATX Spur]

Exactly. That's what I was saying about Diaw getting better because he was on a better team. Phoenix also maximizes his rebounding numbers by putting him at center. His rebound stats get better at the price of the teams rebounding numbers. Dallas is one of the best rebounding teams and Phoenix one of the worst. Josh Howard>Diaw.

I agree with you on all these points. I just don't make the leap from that to Howard being better than Diaw.

[mavsfan1000]

Howard is Dallas's second best player and a key to the defense for them. He needs Dirk like Diaw needs Nash and Marion but Diaw is not as effective at the SF position. He is exploiting defenses by being playing at center but he hurts with his lack of size on defense and rebounding. Exchange Howard with Diaw and the Suns are better off. They would improve in defense and outside shooting with Howard while staying the same in rebounding. Howard won't be able to play center like Diaw could and that is the only difference. Diaw can't play shooting guard effectively though because of his lack of shooting skills. A lineup of Amare, Marion, Josh Howard, Bell, and Nash would be scary.

[mavs>spurs2]

How is it that Howard is the 2nd best player on a team that reaches the finals....while Diaw is top 5 on a team that doesnt, and some people still say Diaw is better than Howard?

[Bruno]

Before doing some Diaw/Howard comparaison, people shouldn't forget that Diaw is 2 years younger than Howard and has had a less linear past.
Even if Howard is maybe the better player for the moment, I take Diaw over him because he has more upside and is way more talented.

[ATX Spur]

Before doing some Diaw/Howard comparaison, people shouldn't forget that Diaw is 2 years younger than Howard and has had a less linear past.
Even if Howard is maybe the better player for the moment, I take Diaw over him because he has more upside and is way more talented.

Exactly. Can't be said any simpler.

[mavsfan1000]

Anyone watch Howard's game tonight? Man he was a beast. He averaged like a point a minutes. I expect him to have a huge year. Diaw won't get any better until he can take his game outside.

[z0sa]

Howard is an outside shooter now? I think not

[mavsfan1000]

Howard is an outside shooter now? I think not
He's not a pure shooter but if you leave him open he will burn you. You should know from experience. He uses his outside shot to give him space to attack the inside.

[AFBlue]

Howard is an outside shooter now? I think not

I wouldn't say he's an outside shooter, but when he does shoot three-pointers he's pretty accurate (43% last season).

Unlike Diaw who shot about 25% on the season when he took his three pointers.

[Obstructed_View]

Joe Johnson was the go to guy in Atlanta. It shows your intelligence by only listing his point average and assist average. His outside shooting went from like 47% to like 33%. That is all that needs to be said on the difference between Phoenix and Atlanta.

So his three point average went down without Steve Nash, Shawn Marion, Quentin Richardson and Amare Stoudamire? Wow, yeah. Good point. :rolleyes As you said, he's the go to guy. He's not getting wide open looks because he doesn't have three all-stars on his team anymore.

But that isn't the point. You specifically said to look at Joe Johnson to see how being on the Suns inflates your stats. Looking at his point and assist average goes right to the heart of what you said and proves it completely wrong. Were you talking about his height and weight?

Is there a Mavs fan anywhere that isn't completely stupid?

[mavsfan1000]

Yeah when you're the 3rd option on offense compared to being to the go to guy you are going to average more points. Being on a better team makes you a BETTER PLAYER based on percentages and efficiency while being on a worse team and being the go to player helps your point totals. You seem to really focus on point totals rather than the efficiency of that player. The only way to measure inflation is if you are the go to guy on both teams. The one on the sorry team and the one on the new team. Amare Stoudemire is the perfect example of that. The suns were a sorry team without Nash and Amare's stats were good but once he got Nash his stats got inflated with him being the go to guy on that team also.

I wasn't specific enough before to show the inflation but Diaw was the third option last year on the high flying suns team and his stats got inflated.

[shaggy17]

Anyone watch Howard's game tonight? Man he was a beast. He averaged like a point a minutes. I expect him to have a huge year. Diaw won't get any better until he can take his game outside.

As long as he doesnt mentor Chris Webber and his timeouts anymore he should have an amazing season.

[baseline bum]

Let me get this straight: Cuban tried to get Howard to sign a deal starting at $4.58 million for the first season, and people wonder how Howard can be pissed? That's a ridiculous lowball. Offering $6 million starting would be a ridiculous lowball. Anything less than $7.5 million starting for Howard is below his market value. We're talking about one of the most versitale players in the league. I'd kill to have him on the Spurs, and you can bet Popovich will be ready to throw him a huge deal in 2008 if Dallas manages to screw things up with him.

[mavs>spurs2]

Don't worry it will all get straightened out....Cuban will give him the deal he deserves and Josh will have an awesome season.

[ATX Spur]

Let me get this straight: Cuban tried to get Howard to sign a deal starting at $4.58 million for the first season, and people wonder how Howard can be pissed? That's a ridiculous lowball. Offering $6 million starting would be a ridiculous lowball. Anything less than $7.5 million starting for Howard is below his market value. We're talking about one of the most versitale players in the league. I'd kill to have him on the Spurs, and you can bet Popovich will be ready to throw him a huge deal in 2008 if Dallas manages to screw things up with him.

Howard on the Spurs would turn Pop's hair white if it wasn't like that already.

[Ignorant Spurs fan]

He's not a pure shooter but if you leave him open he will burn you. You should know from experience. He uses his outside shot to give him space to attack the inside.

:lol :blah

Howard cant make a three if his life depended on it

[Obstructed_View]

Yeah when you're the 3rd option on offense compared to being to the go to guy you are going to average more points. Being on a better team makes you a BETTER PLAYER based on percentages and efficiency while being on a worse team and being the go to player helps your point totals.
And none of the above changes the fact that you referred to "inflated stats". What stats are more important for a point guard than points and assists? His minutes and FG % were nearly the same for the two seasons. Efficiency means nothing when you are talking about differing roles from one team to another. Go to guy = Defenses key on you. Not that you would understand defense, being a Mavericks fan.


You seem to really focus on point totals rather than the efficiency of that player. The only way to measure inflation is if you are the go to guy on both teams. The one on the sorry team and the one on the new team. Amare Stoudemire is the perfect example of that. The suns were a sorry team without Nash and Amare's stats were good but once he got Nash his stats got inflated with him being the go to guy on that team also.
Wrong. Frank Johnson was the coach at the beginning of the season before Nash arrived and Amare was in his second year and injured for 30 games. Stephon Marbury was traded halfway through the year. Fifteen guys played more than 21 games for the Suns, and fourteen different guys started. So basically once Amare got a year older, a training camp with his coaching staff, Steve Nash, Quentin Richardson, and a healthy roster, his stats inflated. Imagine that!


I wasn't specific enough before to show the inflation but Diaw was the third option last year on the high flying suns team and his stats got inflated.
Diaw was an underused player on a bad team. His minutes doubled and he started three times as many games for the Suns. He was also a young talent that everybody was waiting for to break out. His stats aren't inflated, he improved. But his stats did go up, so you are at least in the ballpark for a change.

[mavsfan1000]

Diaw was an underused player on a bad team. His minutes doubled and he started three times as many games for the Suns. He was also a young talent that everybody was waiting for to break out. His stats aren't inflated, he improved. But his stats did go up, so you are at least in the ballpark for a change.
Diaw was underused because he sucked. He had no shooting ability when he was with the Hawks. His stats got inflated because he wasn't thought of that much in Atlanta because of his poor shooting and the Suns offense is much quicker than the Hawks. Also he changed positions and centers in general tend to have high rebounding numbers no matter if they are playing at their positions or out of position. As you can see many things have helped Diaw out when he went to Phoenix. Diaw I think will not have his stats inflated as much if Amare is playing center a lot.

[Obstructed_View]

Also he changed positions and centers in general tend to have high rebounding numbers no matter if they are playing at their positions or out of position.
Go back and read this sentence over and over until you realize that you don't know what the fuck you are talking about. There really is no point in having an intelligent discussion with you as you appear to be completely unequipped for it.

[dirk4mvp]

Good game by Howard last night. Let's hope it keeps up in the reg. season. :tu

[mavsfan1000]

Go back and read this sentence over and over until you realize that you don't know what the fuck you are talking about. There really is no point in having an intelligent discussion with you as you appear to be completely unequipped for it.
Yeah ok Mr. Mavs hater. I don't know the fuck I'm talking about? I watched many suns games last year. How do you know Diaw didn't benefit from the high pace/open area in the paint because of the court being spread out by 4 other 3 point shooters. It's hard to guard Diaw 1 on 1 and if you double Diaw someone will be wide open for a 3. Instead of the insults come up with something intelligent back.

[Obstructed_View]

Yeah ok Mr. Mavs hater. I don't know the fuck I'm talking about? I watched many suns games last year. How do you know Diaw didn't benefit from the high pace/open area in the paint because of the court being spread out by 4 other 3 point shooters. It's hard to guard Diaw 1 on 1 and if you double Diaw someone will be wide open for a 3. Instead of the insults come up with something intelligent back.
Diaw improved and was utilized by the Suns. Johnson left, was the primary focus of the defense, and still improved his scoring and his assists. At best you are shooting fifty percent from the line on your statement that the Suns team "inflates stats".

Except that Diaw changed positions, which kind of kills your argument and makes me go back to your quote from a few posts back and laugh at your moronic circular logic.

[mavsfan1000]

Suns team=faster temp=inflated stats. Is that too hard to understand? I guess I'm a mavs fan so no matter how good my argument is you will still think it is moronic. Joe Johnson was the exception since he was the go to guy which was a big switch for him. There are exceptions to every rule like for example the mavs being clutch against the spurs. :lol

[Obstructed_View]

Suns team=faster temp=inflated stats. Is that too hard to understand? I guess I'm a mavs fan so no matter how good my argument is you will still think it is moronic. Joe Johnson was the exception since he was the go to guy which was a big switch for him. There are exceptions to every rule like for example the mavs being clutch against the spurs. :lol
Dude, you cited Joe Johnson as your example, but now you are saying he's the exception while trying to stick to your original premise. Therefore that argument IS moronic. I'm sorry you won't let it go, even after you have apparently abandoned the statement I challenged in the first place. The Suns do have inflated stats due to the higher number of possessions by both teams. That's well established. You just gave two poor examples of it. Josh Howard is better than Boris Diaw. Happy now?

[mavsfan1000]

Yeah I'm happy now. lol. It was a bad example and I should've done a better example. Still the higher tempo helped Joe Johnson's outside shooting and that was what I was saying but if you go by point totals than it was a bad example.

[Obstructed_View]

Yeah I'm happy now. lol. It was a bad example and I should've done a better example. Still the higher tempo helped Joe Johnson's outside shooting and that was what I was saying but if you go by point totals than it was a bad example.
Having three all stars helped Johnson's shooting, too, just like having anybody that could shoot threes and being down inside would have helped Diaw in Atlanta. All things being equal, Joe's stats probably WOULD have gone down, but he was ready to break out. It's one of those trades where both teams made out because the players needed a new team.

If you had only put "Quentin Richardson" in that original statement... :)

[LEONARD]

Howard isn't going anywhere...

http://sturminator.blogspot.com/
(Bob is an on-air guy with The Ticket in Dallas)

"Howard Update
Not that I claim to be a guy who breaks stories, but in talking with someone with intimate knowledge of the Josh Howard v. Mavericks situation, I am now much more confident that something will get done before Halloween. It appears that the Mavericks realize how important it is to Josh (given all of his public comments) and they surely realize how important he is to them. Therefore, with only so much wiggle room to discuss anyway, I fully expect this extension in a 5 year/$40 million range will be going down before opening night. I feel much better now."

[LEONARD]

JHo just signed a 4 yr extension...no $$$ yet...

[Kori Ellis]

Over $40M.

[ducks]

Updated: Oct. 19, 2006, 4:12 PM ET
Sources: Mavs, Howard agree on four-year extensionBy Marc Stein
ESPN.com


The Dallas Mavericks and Josh Howard on Thursday reached agreement on a four-year contract extension believed to be worth in excess of $40 million, team sources told ESPN.com.


Howard

The Mavericks and Howard were facing an Oct. 31 deadline to agree on an extension and prevent Howard from becoming a restricted free agent in July.

The new contract won't kick in until next season, with Howard scheduled to earn $1.7 million in the final year of his rookie contract.

Howard, who was eligible for a five-year extension, admitted in recent days he was "disappointed" with the slow pace of negotiations but also told ESPN.com earlier this month that he hadn't abandoned hope of securing a new deal before the Halloween buzzer.

"You never know," Howard said with a smile on Oct. 7.

It's believed the Mavericks, sensing the issue might linger with Howard all season, increased their offer in recent days to make it clear to the swingman how much they value him.

Howard has been Dallas' best player in training camp, showing little outward sign of being distracted by his contractual situation, but the absence of an extension before the regular season could easily have been perceived as another slight for a player who slipped to No. 29 in the 2003 draft.

Reaching terms with Howard means Mavericks owner Mark Cuban will have awarded new contracts to four of the biggest names in the organization since the Mavericks made their first trip to the NBA Finals in June: Dirk Nowitzki, Jason Terry, coach Avery Johnson and Howard.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2632299

[JamStone]

Thank god! Now all the speculative madness about Josh Howard going to the Spurs can stop.

[Xylus]

Unfortunately for Suns fans, this only drives up the value of Boris Diaw. $9 million a year is looking less and less realistic now that Howard and Kaman are getting good money.

[dirk4mvp]

J-Ho 4 more years :tu

[PhxDog]

Unfortunately for Suns fans, this only drives up the value of Boris Diaw. $9 million a year is looking less and less realistic now that Howard and Kaman are getting good money.

http://www.azcentral.com/sports/suns/articles/1019suns.html


Suns forward Boris Diaw has agreed to a five-year contract extension worth approximately $45 million, a source close to the team confirmed.
You were saying?

[ATX Spur]

Thank god! Now all the speculative madness about Josh Howard going to the Spurs can stop.

Thank holy god.

[TDMVPDPOY]

Suns team=faster temp=inflated stats. Is that too hard to understand? I guess I'm a mavs fan so no matter how good my argument is you will still think it is moronic. Joe Johnson was the exception since he was the go to guy which was a big switch for him. There are exceptions to every rule like for example the mavs being clutch against the spurs. :lol

JJ is not an exception, so does that make steph jackson an exception also, since he use to play with the hawks and was the goto guy....scrub teams that are one man team can always inflate stats if your willin to be a ball hog.

[mavsfan1000]

Scrub teams=higher point total and lower percentages. There are some exceptions but this is usually the case. Also faster pace teams inflate stats as well.

[dirk4mvp]

Mavericks forward Josh Howard agreed to a four-year, $40 million contract extension Thursday through the 2010-11 season.

Howard will play for $1.6 million this season, the last on his existing contract. Howard said he did not want to test the free-agent market after the season.

"I'm glad it's done," Howard said before Dallas' preseason game Thursday night against Milwaukee. "I knew I wanted to stay here as long as I could. Now I want to continue to play hard and get better."

Last season, his third in the NBA, Howard averaged a career-high 15.6 points and 6.3 rebounds to help the Mavericks to the most successful season in their history before losing to the Miami Heat in six games in the NBA Finals.

Talks between Howard's representatives and owner Mark Cuban had bogged down over the summer, but Cuban said it was important to get a new deal finalized with a key player like Howard before the regular season got underway.

"Josh has worked hard and he's an important part of the team," Cuban said. "We're glad to get it done."

Howard was no sure thing when he was drafted by the Mavericks with the 29th overall selection in 2003, but the Wake Forest product has developed into one of the league's best young players.

"It's a blessing for me and my family," Howard said. "I love the city, love the fans, and enjoy playing here. I'm going to be the same guy no matter how much money I make."


:tu