Rosen: Spurs (& others) have one more shot @ title.

[DieMrBond]

These teams need to win ... or reboot
Charley Rosen / Special to FOXSports.com
http://msn.foxsports.com/nba/story/6077332

In the real world, a generation lasts for 20 years. That's the period in which a newborn is deemed to have reached full maturity.

But time is so compressed in the skewed world of pro sports that an NBA generation extends for only three to five years. That's the period given to the players on any given roster to reach their collective maturity.

Given this definition, there are several NBA teams that are at, or near, the end of their respective maturation processes. In other words, the upcoming season represents the last chance for these ball clubs to achieve their goals — which range from being serious contenders to winning the championship.

If these specific goals are not reached in 2006-07, then it will be necessary for each team to reboot its roster and to rethink its underlying basketball philosophy.

Philadelphia

In truth, the Sixers are so far past their competitive maturity as to be on the verge of extinction. But the front office believes that dreams never die, that the glorious playoff run in the spring of 2001 can be resurrected, and that Allen Iverson can still inspire visions of a championship.

The Sixers might still have faith in Allen Iverson. But the veteran guard has logged lots of minutes heading into this season. (Michael Sohn / Associated Press)

Back then, however, when the Sixers scratched their way into the Finals (where they were downed in five games by the Shaq-Kobe Lakers), their roster featured the likes of Theo Ratliff, Aaron McKie, Dikembe Mutombo, Eric Snow, George Lynch, and Tyrone Hill. That's six complementary players who could play earnest defense, covering up A.I.'s disinclination to do the same.

Nowadays, the only current Sixers who can adequately defend are Andre Iguodala, Kevin Ollie, and occasionally Sam Dalembert. Meanwhile, Chris Webber and Kyle Korver couldn't guard their own lunchboxes at a kindergarteners' recess.

To make matters worse, the Sixers' two top guns are rapidly approaching their dotage. Webber is a 33-year-old with the knees of a septuagenarian. If Iverson is "only" 31, he has far too many miles (and minutes) on his drive-o-meter.

Moreover, the thrill of watching Iverson take on opponents one-on-five is long gone, and home attendance is way down. And if Webber is virtually untradeable, Iverson is likewise on the verge of becoming an immovable object. Billy King blew it big-time when he chickened out and failed to deal Iverson over the summer.

Now it's too late to do anything more than play out the string and watch the Sixers fade into irrelevance.

Minnesota

Contrary to popular opinion, the Big Ticket is actually a complementary player. On his own, he offers nothing more than an aggravating ride to oblivion. Yes, Kevin Garnett is forever complaining about the Wolves roster and begging for help. And the other faces have changed — but Ricky Davis and Mike James are the wrong guys on the wrong team.

Simply put, K.G. needs to play in the shadow of a top-flight big man. Granted that such middle-men are a rare species, the biggest hindrance to enlisting one is Garnett himself. Indeed, it's K.G.'s disproportionately large salary that prohibits the Wolves from having the wherewithal to sign a quality center without vaulting over the salary cap.

Kevin Garnett's best chance to win a championship would be to play a complimentary role to a supremely talented big man. (Dave Weaver / Associated Press)

In the long run, the Wolves are (and have been) headed nowhere fast as long as Garnett is reputed to be a franchise player. Also to be considered is that the guy's on the wrong side of 30, and leansome players like him tend to age quickly. So why not resolve the will-he-or-won't-he want-to-stay dilemma by finally cutting the cord?

Despite the contractual road-block, the only remedy is to somehow trade Garnett ASAP for a batch of young flyers. While they're at it, Ricky Davis, Mark Blount, Mark Madsen, Troy Hudson, and Marko Jaric should also be discounted and sent elsewhere. Otherwise, Garnett will continue to lead the Wolves in never-ending circles.

San Antonio

While Tony Parker (24), Manu Ginobili (29), and Tim Duncan (30) are still at the top of their games, the Spurs roster is clogged with too many aging veterans — like Robert Horry (36), Michael Finley (closer to 34 than to 33), Brent Barry (almost 36), and Bruce Bowen (35). Too bad these vets are required to play such prominent roles as the Spurs chase another championship.

At the same time, the Spurs bench shows nary a young stud with enough skills to keep their mini-dynasty extant. Matt Bonner, Jackie Butler, Francisco Elson, and Fabricio Oberto are all role players.

At best, the Spurs have two more seasons to seriously challenge for another championship. At worst, Bowen's game goes quickly downhill, and this season will be do or die.

The Spurs failure to obtain and develop young star-quality players (besides Parker), proves that in the NBA the future is now.

New Jersey

For sure, the Nets lineup showcases plenty of current and potential young All-Stars — namely Richard Jefferson, Nenad Krstic, and Marcus Williams. Moreover, Vince Carter is still a spry 31. But Jason Kidd is 33, and his surgically repaired knee has perpetuated his career at the expense of what used to be his exceptional speed and quickness.

Jason Kidd is 33 years old, and has had his knee repaired by surgery. Obviously, he is not getting any faster. (Jason DeCrow / Associated Press)

The Nets' problem is two-fold: Kidd won't be getting any quicker, and Carter is making noises about opting out of his contract at season's end and signing with Orlando. Given these circumstances — plus the fact that Carter is a highly overrated performer, particularly in clutch situations — New Jersey is in an awful bind.

As it is, the Nets have enough juice to approach 50 wins and once again venture into the second round of the playoffs. To expect anything more is delusional.

So, are the above goals sufficient? Or does Rod Thorn aspire to his team's being an authentic championship contender? And what will happen in 2007-08 when Kidd will need a walker to navigate his way up and down the court, and when Carter will be a 33-year-old choker playing either here or there?

The accepted wisdom in other sports is to deal a player the year before his wheels fall off, and the Nets should take this methodology to heart. Carter should be traded to the highest bidder. And so should J-Kidd.

The trouble is that New York-area fans loathe the very prospect of rebuilding. Why should they pay top-of-the-line prices to witness a young team struggle with growing pains? Still, rebuilding can't be done on a gradual basis. The Nets need to take the risk and turnover their roster while Kidd and Carter can still fetch high-quality players in return.

Waiting for another dissatisfying season to pass is an exercise in futility.

Indiana

The Pacers are stuck with too many undesirable players. Jamaal Tinsley is a loser, Stephen Jackson is a loose cannon, and Sarunas Jasikevicus is fatally slow.

It's already past time to back up the truck and unload these guys. Trouble is that Jackson is a pariah, Tinsley is best suited to be a backup on a second-rate team, and Jasikevicus has little value.

The X-factor is that Jermaine O'Neal has done all he can do in Indiana, which makes him the Pacers' only attractive trade bait. Rather than agonize through another pointless season of disappointments and emotional explosions, Larry Bird should have cleaned house last summer.

Denver

It's now or never for the Nuggets. And the smart money is on the latter possibility.

Kenyon Martin is a fraud. Earl Boykins gives away more than he contributes. Will Marcus Camby's next physical breakdown be his last? Joe Smith is the oldest 31-year-old on the planet. George Karl's endless mind games, perpetual emphasis on full-speed-ahead offense and his profound disregard for defense may be successful for short stretches, but are counter-productive over the long haul.

One more season of could-haves should-haves, and might-haves will just leave the Nuggets mired in mediocrity.

Cleveland

The Cavs players, fans, and management continue to fanaticize about winning a championship. While this fantasy might someday come true, it certainly won't so long as the current roster is intact.

The problem, of course, is to surround LeBron James with guys who can complement his unique (and considerable) talents. What the Cavs need is the proper mix of shooters, defenders, and big men who are mobile.

Zydrunas Ilgauskas isn't a good match for LBJ, but Anderson Varejao is. Eric Snow is on his last legs. Larry Hughes is an erratic shooter and a risk-taker on defense, but has the potential of developing into a passable partner for LeBron. Drew Gooden is an adequate spare part. Donyell Marshall is too old (33) and too defenseless. Damon Jones talks the talk yet can barely crawl.

All in all, this is a mismatched team that can barely afford another unsatisfactory season before frustration becomes institutional.

Detroit

Even had Ben Wallace chosen to remain in Detroit, the Pistons' run was already over. If Ben was noticeably wearing down, what was left of Rasheed Wallace's tender psyche was also disintegrating. Joe Dumars should have noted that, as a Piston, Rasheed only played hard and conducted himself with integrity during the 22 regular season and 23 postseason games he played with the team in 2004. Waiting for Rasheed to reprise the maturity he exhibited back then is about as fruitless as waiting for Godot.

Yes, it's worth one more season to see how Chauncey Billups, Richard Hamilton, and Tayshaun Prince can function along-side a dysfunctional Wallace. Too bad the other big s are also problematic — the ancient Dale Davis and the flabby-fingers of Nazr Mohammed make for a brace of severely flawed big men. But with Billups already proclaiming his eagerness to investigate free agency at season's end, this will similarly be the Pistons' last chance for glory.

Charley Rosen is a frequent dumbass contributor to FOXSports.com.

[Johnny_Blaze_47]

He's obviously wrong.

I mean, when has Minnesota ever had a chance at a title?

[lrrr]

the championship team of 99 was pretty old too. Didn't stop em from winning more. As long as the big 3 are in theri prime, the FO will put together the pieces to keep the team contending.

[himat]

Charlie Rosen is a dumbass. You don't break a championship team fully you make changes, but you don't make it so you have to start at the bottom again.

[Russ]

This is the same line that was propagated when Robinson was about to retire. The Spurs are so old -- why would Duncan want to stick around instead of going to a franchise with a platinum-plated future. Like Orlando.

What writers (as opposed to GMs) don't understand is that the age of a team's nucleus is the only age consideration that really matters.

Get some young role players (not all that difficult) and you go from too old to dynasty in no time.

The Spurs have made it happen before and they have at least a chance to do it again. If all goes well, in two years, they'll talk about how the Spurs have lost their ability to find young role players like they used to. Then they'll probably use Melzer and Butler as examples of how the Spurs used to be able to do it. :)

[Mr.Bottomtooth]

Isn't he the same guy that said he thought the Spurs were gonna fire Pop?

[Obstructed_View]

the championship team of 99 was pretty old too.

The '03 team had some graybeards on it too. Those guys played big roles.

[1Parker1]

If Shaq can still win championships at 33 with a different cast of players, why can't Duncan?

[Obstructed_View]

If Shaq can still win championships at 33 with a different cast of players, why can't Duncan?
If Shaq can win a championship at 33 with THAT cast of players, anything is possible, and age is the least of anyone's problems.

[NuGGeTs-FaN]

Charley Rosen is a douche bag, he is a Nuggets hater through and through. Never has anything positive to say

Seriously, how does this guy get a job?

[ATX Spur]

One more crap article from Charley Rosen. How is that guy still getting published?

[phxspurfan]

he basically said any team with more than 3 players over 30 is done after this year. He discounts anyone with an inconsistent past. He is also basically saying they all need "the proper mix of shooters, defenders, and big men who are mobile." That's like a John Madden football comment i.e. after a sack, "you can't take too many of those!" This article makes me wonder what kind of bs he wrote before last season.

[leemajors]

Charley Rosen is a douche bag, he is a Nuggets hater through and through. Never has anything positive to say

Seriously, how does this guy keep a job?

[SenorSpur]

The guy might indeed be a "douchebag" and a "dumb ass", with a reputation for writing "crap articles, but I don't see anything "untrue" or non-factual about what he wrote.

The Spurs do have their "big three" and a core group of aging veterans without a young, developing stud talent or two to balance it out. The goal is clear. The time IS now for the Spurs - and has been that way for the last couple of years.

Like everyone else, I believe the Spurs can and will win it all this year. However if they don't, many (including some on this board - myself included) will point back to the age factor, high injury quotient that usually comes with older players and the "perceived" matchup limitations against younger, more athletic teams as reasons.

Hell, we spent most of the summer discussing these very things following the Mavs series.

Dude has make a good point. There will come a time the Spurs will have to "pay the piper" for their failure to acquire and develop, a potential stud or two along the way - especially that of the domestic variety. I just hope it's not this year.

[Joepa]

Douchebags sure do have a poor reputation in our society.

[Lebowski Brickowski]

These teams need to win ... or reboot
Charley Rosen / Special to FOXSports.com
http://msn.foxsports.com/nba/story/6077332

San Antonio

The Spurs failure to obtain and develop young star-quality players (besides Parker), proves that in the NBA the future is now.



How do you obtain "young star-quality players?"

Trade your core and spend $170M or suck bad enough to get a top 3-5 pick.

The Spurs have proven that they are able to "obtain and develop" players that no one else would have heard of.

Has he never heard of Javtokas? Not that Javtokas will be star-quality but I think he can be some one who will play very well for several years.

[JGrice02]

The guy might indeed be a "douchebag" and a "dumb ass", with a reputation for writing "crap articles, but I don't see anything "untrue" or non-factual about what he wrote.

The Spurs do have their "big three" and a core group of aging veterans without a young, developing stud talent or two to balance it out. The goal is clear. The time IS now for the Spurs - and has been that way for the last couple of years.

Like everyone else, I believe the Spurs can and will win it all this year. However if they don't, many (including some on this board - myself included) will point back to the age factor, high injury quotient that usually comes with older players and the "perceived" matchup limitations against younger, more athletic teams as reasons.

Hell, we spent most of the summer discussing these very things following the Mavs series.

Dude has make a good point. There will come a time the Spurs will have to "pay the piper" for their failure to acquire and develop, a potential stud or two along the way - especially that of the domestic variety. I just hope it's not this year.


Agreed. The guys comments are right on and if you think otherwise you are in for a rude awakening in the next couple of years. The Spurs have maintained a level of consistency with their current roster but they have not drafted well and they have not developed anyone. The last player to fit in that category is Parker and he made mention of that in his comments.

For those that want to cite Parker as an example of the Spurs drafting and developing young talent, know that he is entering his 6th NBA season. That means for the past 5 season, the only player the Spurs have really developed is Parker. Everyone else is a flop. And when you look at some of the players the Spurs passed on in the draft, namely Josh Howard, it makes the sting even worse.

The Spurs best chance of sustaining this success in the future is to draft and develop bargian-priced players. That, or signing some underachieving free agents (Stephen Jackson) and developing them. As it stands today, the big three will take up a huge chunk of their salary and they will not be able to afford major free-agent signings in the future.

If you are looking 2-3 years down the road, which is what the article is all about, the Spurs are not in great position. The only young player with promise is Butler and we have no idea how he will develop. The Spurs also tried to go after Josh Smith, another young, athletic player with some potential. So at least the front office knows they need to get younger ASAP. Things just haven't worked out.

One positive is that the Spurs do have some young talent developing overseas and NBA analysts have no idea what is happening on that front (neither do we). The real problem is that the Spurs need young talent on their team NOW so in two years it can contribute when these aging role players retire.

The front office knows it is an issue. They are trying to upgrade the roster. But much to the chagrin of Spurs fans the front office does not always get what they want. And if they Mavs have continued success it will be evenn harder for the Spurs to compete for top free agents.

Maybe the fans don't want to admit that but the front office knows what needs to happen. The article is right on. With the current roster the Spurs are looking at a 1-2 year window. Of course, no one on the roster is under contract beyond two years except four players: Duncan, Parker, Ginobili, and Butler. Financially, they could be in very good position. But to do what? Sign a top free agent? Like I said, they need bargain-priced talent that won't take up all their salary. And I think the Spurs are well aware of their situation...

[Mr. Body]

Rosen is absolutely right. Of course the Spurs have a chance this year, but it doesn't look that great. Their team is largely geriatric, and the only two young players they have other than the big three are injury-prone, doghouse ridden Beno Udrih and longterm prospect and third-string center Jackie Butler, neither of whom lights hearts on fire.

This is a pretty dire situation. Any other team, they'd already be toast. At least we have Manu, Parker, and Duncan - two of whom had big injury problems last year. The Spurs will be at least in the second round this year - that much is certain - but beyond that, we'll have to see.

The F.O. has not done a good job of getting young talent on this team in the last several years.

[AFBlue]

AT THIS POINT the Spurs' future doesn't look great. The team is built to compete for the next two years right now. But who is to say that the Spurs FO won't make moves to pick up young talent during this season, next off-season, or the season after that?

They almost swung a deal for J.R. Smith by offering Barry. Maybe Mickeal Pietrus goes in the coaches doghouse and they offer Barry in exchange...only this time they BEAT the deadline.

They also have the expiring contract of Eric Williams.

Beno Udrih can develop as a solid backup PG or off-guard in a small-ball lineup...or he could be packaged in a trade as an "change-of-scenery" type prospect.

They'll have the mid-level next year and should have little bit of dough to make some moves the following year.

The point is that RIGHT NOW, the Spurs are built for "now", but as long as the major pieces (tim, tony, manu) are functioning like major pieces, it's not time to panic. Next season he could be writing about how the Spurs re-loaded with young talent and ensured their future as a long-term dynasty for the next ten years....at least I hope that's what they're writing.

[KinksterforGov]

If Charlie Rosen knew so much about the game, he'd be a GM/coach, instead of writing half-assed analyses for the Web.

[Chris Bell]

If Charlie Rosen knew so much about the game, he'd be a GM/coach, instead of writing half-assed analyses for the Web.

Hey, when are you going to have your guy quit the race so I can be the next Governor of the Great State of Texas?

But Chuckly Rosen is an idiot, that's one thing all Texans can agree on!

[AFBlue]

Hey, when are you going to have your guy quit the race so I can be the next Governor of the Great State of Texas?

But Chuckly Rosen is an idiot, that's one thing all Texans can agree on!

Man, just like a politician....make a bid for governor and tie it back to the topic so you can say your post was legit...

You, you're good.... :clap

[SenorSpur]

Agreed. The guys comments are right on and if you think otherwise you are in for a rude awakening in the next couple of years. The Spurs have maintained a level of consistency with their current roster but they have not drafted well and they have not developed anyone. The last player to fit in that category is Parker and he made mention of that in his comments.

For those that want to cite Parker as an example of the Spurs drafting and developing young talent, know that he is entering his 6th NBA season. That means for the past 5 season, the only player the Spurs have really developed is Parker. Everyone else is a flop. And when you look at some of the players the Spurs passed on in the draft, namely Josh Howard, it makes the sting even worse.

The Spurs best chance of sustaining this success in the future is to draft and develop bargian-priced players. That, or signing some underachieving free agents (Stephen Jackson) and developing them. As it stands today, the big three will take up a huge chunk of their salary and they will not be able to afford major free-agent signings in the future.

If you are looking 2-3 years down the road, which is what the article is all about, the Spurs are not in great position. The only young player with promise is Butler and we have no idea how he will develop. The Spurs also tried to go after Josh Smith, another young, athletic player with some potential. So at least the front office knows they need to get younger ASAP. Things just haven't worked out.

One positive is that the Spurs do have some young talent developing overseas and NBA analysts have no idea what is happening on that front (neither do we). The real problem is that the Spurs need young talent on their team NOW so in two years it can contribute when these aging role players retire.

The front office knows it is an issue. They are trying to upgrade the roster. But much to the chagrin of Spurs fans the front office does not always get what they want. And if they Mavs have continued success it will be evenn harder for the Spurs to compete for top free agents.

Maybe the fans don't want to admit that but the front office knows what needs to happen. The article is right on. With the current roster the Spurs are looking at a 1-2 year window. Of course, no one on the roster is under contract beyond two years except four players: Duncan, Parker, Ginobili, and Butler. Financially, they could be in very good position. But to do what? Sign a top free agent? Like I said, they need bargain-priced talent that won't take up all their salary. And I think the Spurs are well aware of their situation...

That's a TOUCHDOWN! Very well said!

Let's not forget that always-important element in talent development - that is the process of integration. Infusing young players into the culture of both the team and the league. Learning the nuances of their teammates; learning the plays; learning how to conduct themselves as pro players. This process can often take upwards of a couple of years before they become productive.

No matter what players the Spurs have in their overseas incubator, the fact remains that these players are far removed from the system, the daily regimen and culture of the team. It will take time for them to fit in before they can begin producing - no matter how mature they are.

With that said, I believe the FO has failed in their attempts to replenish this roster with young. developing talent. Nothing says they have to sacrifice championship contention in the process. I cannot emphasize enough the importance of having at least 1 or 2 young, talented, domestic players that are on the roster and in the system learning and developing and getting precious practice time and "garbage time" minutes would be a good thing. The Spurs FO may see this as a "waste of money" but it's no secret that the core of this team is still OLD.

Let's hope they bring the championship home. If so, my points are moot - at least for now.

[ducks]

spurs drafted manu
idiot

[Obstructed_View]

...in 1999.

[JamStone]

Rosen knows some things about basketball, but he continues to think he's an expert simply because he's friends with Phil Jackson. His basketball analyses of games are always filled with terminology that makes him feel smarter than the average fan even though he knows little more than real avid fans of basketball. And, his subjective articles like this one are always filled with misinformation and wrong facts.

Take for example how he describes Vince Carter as a "spry 31." Vince Carter is 29 years old, dumbass.

In his last article ranking coaches, he called Minnesota head coach Duane Casey Mike Casey.

I wouldn't go so far as saying he doesn't know anything. He obviously knows some things about basketball. But, it's far less than he makes it out to be.

[Zunni]

LMAO that he even gave us one chance. Rosen is a notorious Spur hatah. Yeah, Duncan at 30 is almost done...:lol Didn't Kareem win one at like 40?

[Mr. Body]

That's a TOUCHDOWN! Very well said!

Let's not forget that always-important element in talent development - that is the process of integration. Infusing young players into the culture of both the team and the league. Learning the nuances of their teammates; learning the plays; learning how to conduct themselves as pro players. This process can often take upwards of a couple of years before they become productive.

No matter what players the Spurs have in their overseas incubator, the fact remains that these players are far removed from the system, the daily regimen and culture of the team. It will take time for them to fit in before they can begin producing - no matter how mature they are.

With that said, I believe the FO has failed in their attempts to replenish this roster with young. developing talent. Nothing says they have to sacrifice championship contention in the process. I can emphasize enough the importance of having at least 1 or 2 young, talented, domestic players that are on the roster and in the system learning and developing and getting precious practice time and "garbage time" minutes would be a good thing.

Some people talking sense. Wow, unbelievable. What's striking about this squad is that there are none of these players being developed on the team who can move into important roles. The above posters are exactly right: it has been since Parker came aboard that they acquired and developed a young player that worked out and wasn't a flop.

So much weight has been put on the overseas talent in the past, but this summer has basically torpedoed most of it. They said no to Javtokas - Elson is better. They determined that Scola will never be a Spur. Mahinmi looks miles away from being a productive NBA player, much less being a starter, and Sanikidze is similarly leagues away. We even find out Karaulov was someone they took a flier on because *ahem* Presti heard about him fifth-hand, when they could have drafted at that spot, uh, Jackie Butler.

We expected a lot to happen this offseason. Dump Rasho and Nazr, get some back-up PG help (hopefully), get back-up big men for Duncan, fix the rebounding problem, find a Bowen replacement, get some youth on the bench.

What happened? They did dump Rasho and Nazr, but got as replacement a dubious fleet-of-foot third stringer from Denver, and an untested project from New York. They got Jacques Vaughn (I was very happy with this). Did nothing to fix the rebounding problem, did not find a Bowen replacement, got no youth on the bench. This off-season was an utter strike-out. Grade? D.

The Chicago preseason game was eye-opening not because the Spurs lost - who cares? But because Chicago is teeming with young talent, exactly the pieces the Spurs need. Would I trade the 3 championships we've won post-Jordan for what they've not accomplished? No, of course not. But would I trade our future in the next five years for their future? I'd think about it, long and hard.

Obviously we have Parker, Ginobili and Duncan, and yes, we're going to compete for a championship banner this year, but after this season is over, things go downhill fast. Horry - gone. Bowen - one year closer to it. Finley - slower and slower. Barry - ineffective. No centers. We're not developing talent on the bench. Our overseas troops aren't much.

That's why people are concerned. You look across the way vs. Chicago and they were bringing in players - Thabo Sefolosha, Victor Khryapa - that we VITALLY NEED, that are deep in their bench. Those are players that take the load off Duncan's shoulders, that give him rest, don't strain him and risk injury for him.

So what happened? Why did the Front Office fail to keep this team going? Suddenly we look like the Los Angeles Lakers team we plucked in 2003. Sure, they had Kobe and Shaq, but the rest of the team was a shambles. Their guys were just old. Rick Fox, too old. Shaw, too old. Devean George, hurt. Horry, played too much. They had to fill in blanks with Medvedenko, Samaki Walker, Kareem Rush. Their point guard was Jannero Pargo.

That's us right now, or close to it. These are the last years of a dynasty team: the savvy veterans have long grey beards. It gets harder and harder to get young talent. The luck subsides.

It's not over, not by a longshot. But how long is it? Enjoy this year - we all will - but anyone with long term perspective can see this is the third act in a three act play.

[Samr]

While what Rosen has said is true, I believe he missed the point:

We, the fans, do not care about the future.

We do not care about long-term projections, where players are in relation to their "prime," or any number of factors that one would take into account when worried about a project's longevity. The NBA is entertainment. The NBA is a service provided to the population for the purposes of giving us something interesting to talk about, and socialize around. And we, in return, give the NBA money. It is a simple supply and demand.

If the end-goal of an NBA team is to win (because winning is what the fans want), why would a head office intentionally lose now to achieve the same thing later? If a core group of 30+ aged players produces wins during the season and puts fans in the stands, why change the formula? Isn’t that what they wanted?

For example, when a team rebuilds, they have understandably lost X percentage of the total fan support. Of the money spent on tickets and concessions and items with their logo. But if they win, which the process of rebuilding tends to insinuate (unless you are the Warriors), they only gain that X percentage back?

Teams only rebuild if the current formula does not work. It is like declaring bankruptcy. So why is Rosen even caring that the 76ers should have traded away AI a season ago? Did they really reach their lowest point? Did their monetary return on investment really slow to the point where it would make immediate financial sense to trade him?

I argue that teams should ride the wave as long as possible. So what if Finley is aging, Horry is on his last knee brace, and Bowen is one more 100+ game season away from blowing his cooling system? The fact of the matter is, the players the Spurs have right now have them winning. And as a fan, that makes me happy. That makes me want to continue to buy Spurs paraphernalia, and tickets to games, because I enjoy watching the Spurs win.

Of course everyone is going to burnout, just like every car will eventually be unable to start. But hell, if the thing moves, keep it moving. These teams don’t need to win or reboot. They need to win, even at a decreasing rate, in a pattern that could still span many seasons, until they have stalled in the middle of the street. It is then, and only then, that they can reboot.

If Horry retires, or Finley fades, or Ginobili gets hurt, or Bowen simply can’t take it anymore, the Spurs are still going to win. They will win less often than they are winning now, but they will still, by all accounts, be a successful franchise. And successful franchises make money.

Which is point Rosen missed making.

[SenorSpur]

If I may speak for those of us (JGrice02, Phat Tony and Mr. Body) who have expressed concern with both the immediate and long-term future of this team, this aint about pessimism - this is about cold, hard, competitive reality.

The Spurs have utterly failed in building the type of balanced roster that will allow them to remain chamiponship contenders in an ever-changing league beyond this year and next. Outside of the "big three", no one knows what this team will look like in two years.

Don't anyone give me that shit about the Euro talent overseas. I see highlights of Maceo Baston (formerly of Maccabi) in a Pacers uniform and I wonder, what happened?

I see Boris Diaw getting an extension with the Suns and I wonder, what happened? After all, if the Spurs scouted Tony Parker extensively, shouldn't they have known about Diaw too? Hell, they played on the same team.

I see Luol Deng in a Bulls uniform and I wonder what happened?

I see Michael Pietrus in a Warriors uniform and I wonder what happened?

I see Josh Howard in a Mavs unifrom, and I KNOW what happened. You get the point.

How does an organization that is THE front runner in league scouting miss on all these guys. Of course, we know they cannot pay everyone, but when is the last time the Spurs have successfully drafted and developed a player in house? Beno Udrih?

It seems every team is drafting and developing young talent to replenish its roster - except the Spurs. And please SPARE ME the names of the EURO players who cannot garner enough consideration to warrant the necessary contractual "buyout" needed to get them over here. At this point, I don't give a FUCK about EURO talent. The fact is Spurs are overlooking "home-grown", domestic talent in this country at the expense of courting foreign talent that is in no position to help them win.

We all love our Spurs and want to see them succeed - not just this year but for many years to come. However, the FO is not abouve harsh criticism. The age of the current roster and the overall lack of long-term talent needed to replenish it is a MAJOR CONCERN.

[ChumpDumper]

some fresh takes, pal, that's all any of us ask. Bring a fresh take or two.

[K-State Spur]

I see Luol Deng in a Bulls uniform and I wonder what happened?


The Bulls had a lottery pick and we didn't?

[Bruno]

The Spurs have utterly failed in building the type of balanced roster that will allow them to remain chamiponship contenders in an ever-changing league beyond this year and next.

That's your POV.
Check vegas odds to see that your POV isn't widely shared.



Outside of the "big three", no one knows what this team will look like in two years.

Spurs will be under the cap in 2 years.
Spurs fans are lucky, most nba teams fans are worried about this season, not the 08-09 one.



Don't anyone give me that shit about the Euro talent overseas. I see highlights of Maceo Baston (formerly of Maccabi) in a Pacers uniform and I wonder, what happened?

Baston is 30 years old average player. You can find player like that every year. Javtokas is too abeast on highlights.



I see Boris Diaw getting an extension with the Suns and I wonder, what happened? After all, if the Spurs scouted Tony Parker extensively, shouldn't they have known about Diaw too? Hell, they played on the same team.

Diaw wasn't available at the Spurs pick.



I see Luol Deng in a Bulls uniform and I wonder what happened?

Deng wasn't available at the Spurs pick



I see Michael Pietrus in a Warriors uniform and I wonder what happened?

Pietrus wasn't available at the Spurs pick and he isn't that good.



I see Josh Howard in a Mavs unifrom, and I KNOW what happened. You get the point.

Hindsight...
Every franchise makes draft mistakes, Spurs is one of the franchise that make the less mistakes. Since you pointed that Howard is in a Mavs uni, don't forget too that they draft Pavel Podkolzin with the 21st pick



How does an organization that is THE front runner in league scouting miss on all these guys. Of course, we know they cannot pay everyone, but when is the last time the Spurs have successfully drafted and developed a player in house? Beno Udrih?

Just look at what psurs have done with their draft picks since Parker.
2001 : Parker
2002 : Traded for Claxton. Claxton has helped Spurs to get the 03 title.
2003 : Traded. Spurs get Nazr for this pick, he has helped Spurs to win the 05 title and they have too dump malik contract that will allow Spurs to reload them in 08.
2004 : Udrih. Not that bad when you look at the players available for this pick.
2005 : Mahinmi. Too soon to judge but this guy has upside.
2006 : Traded (see 2003).



It seems every team is drafting and developing young talent to replenish its roster - except the Spurs.

If you want to that, Spurs should tank for Oden. With late first round pick, no capspce and a "cheap" owner rebuilding isn't that easy.



And please SPARE ME the names of the EURO players who cannot garner enough consideration to warrant the necessary contractual "buyout" needed to get them over here. At this point, I don't give a FUCK about EURO talent.

cough .... Parker and Ginobili ... cough



The fact is Spurs are overlooking "home-grown", domestic talent in this country at the expense of courting foreign talent that is in no position to help them win.

Spurs mainly use second round pick to draft euros. With this kind of pick, you don't get a quality player 90% of the time (even if he is american).



We all love our Spurs and want to see them succeed - not just this year but for many years to come. However, the FO is not abouve harsh criticism. The age of the current roster and the overall lack of long-term talent needed to replenish it is a MAJOR CONCERN.

Let's trade Duncan, Ginobili and Parker for draft picks....

[Zunni]

I see Boris Diaw getting an extension with the Suns and I wonder, what happened? After all, if the Spurs scouted Tony Parker extensively, shouldn't they have known about Diaw too? Hell, they played on the same team.
As stated above, unavailable when they picked, AND they did NOT play on the same team. Tony played for Paris Basket Racing, and Boris with Pau Orthez. I believe that Boris also pulled out of the draft at least once when it looked as though he might not make the first round. If you're going to rant, at least have your fucking facts correct.

[Bruno]

^ Parker and Diaw played in the same team in 98-99.

[Zunni]

^ Parker and Diaw played in the same team in 98-99.
Long before the Spurs were scouting Parker, which was his misguided point.

[ambchang]

I don't get his logic, Rosen said the Spurs roster is filled with old players that play prominent roles, while complaining that the young players are all just role players. So who is that really really old player on the Spurs who's not a role player?

[ambchang]

I absolutely do not get what is going on. Could someone just tell me what would you rather have, 3 champions or young good players? If you want 3 championships, then please go ahead a name a team that went through 2 sets of championship contending core without any rebuilding. If you want young players, please list who the players the Spurs could have drafted and developed in the last 5 years.

[Mr. Body]

I absolutely do not get what is going on. Could someone just tell me what would you rather have, 3 champions or young good players? If you want 3 championships, then please go ahead a name a team that went through 2 sets of championship contending core without any rebuilding. If you want young players, please list who the players the Spurs could have drafted and developed in the last 5 years.

That's not what anyone's saying. We're talking about today and the future, not the past. Of course no one is about to trade away the 3 rings. The question is: are you happy with it?

[Tobias]

"The spurs will have the same players 3 years from now" -- essentially the logic you need to have to make this mae sense.

I think calling the Nuggets and Cavs contenders just now is generous -- and then doubly lame to list them here. Calling the Sixers "past their prime" is about as on a limb as saying "swimming might make your clothes damp"

[Zunni]

That's not what anyone's saying. We're talking about today and the future, not the past. Of course no one is about to trade away the 3 rings. The question is: are you happy with it?
Yes, I am. The difference is you think it's over, and I don't. The Spurs always do a good job of playing "Moneyball" and putting good solid players around their core. They're never going to be the big money free spenders in FA, but then again, what exactly has that gotten the Knicks or Portland? They will be title contenders each and every year as long as Duncan is playing. If that's not good enough for you, you need to either lower your expectations or find that elusive dominant team that wins every year. Hint: you won't find such a team.

[Ocotillo]

Philadelphia

They had their last shot a loooonnnnnggg time ago.


K.G.

The next Charles Barkley, Karl Malone, etc..... will retire with no rings and be remembered as one of the better players never to have tasted the champagne.


San Antonio

At best, the Spurs have two more seasons to seriously challenge for another championship. At worst, Bowen's game goes quickly downhill, and this season will be do or die.



Hmmmmm, what happens in the 2008 off-season? Oh yeah, everbody but the core doesn't have a contract. As alluded to earlier by others, the previous championship teams have had some gray beards on them and managed to reload and stay competitive.


New Jersey

Carter is making noises about opting out of his contract at season's end and signing with Orlando.

Carter would do well to stay with Kidd who has resurrected Carter's reputation after New Jersey salvaged his career from Toronto. But go ahead Vinsanity, go to Orlando and fall off the radar the remainder of your career.

Jamaal Tinsley is a loser

Anybody else remember how this guy was considered to have as bright a future as Tony Parker during their rookie seasons? Some Indiana fans regularly came in here and ran smack about how Tinsley was the better find in the draft. Yeah, sure.



Denver

It's now or never for the Nuggets. And the smart money is on the latter possibility.

Kenyon Martin is a fraud. Earl Boykins gives away more than he contributes. Will Marcus Camby's next physical breakdown be his last? Joe Smith is the oldest 31-year-old on the planet. George Karl's endless mind games, perpetual emphasis on full-speed-ahead offense and his profound disregard for defense may be successful for short stretches, but are counter-productive over the long haul.

One more season of could-haves should-haves, and might-haves will just leave the Nuggets mired in mediocrity.

Sounds about right to me.


Larry Hughes is an erratic shooter and a risk-taker on defense, but has the potential of developing into a passable partner for LeBron.

There's that word again in the same sentence with Larry Hughes.


Detroit

Probably is their last shot for a while.