Ludden: Oberto shoots 11 of 11; Spurs top Suns in OT

[Taco]

Oberto shoots 11 of 11; Spurs top Suns in OT
Johnny Ludden
Express-News Staff Writer

The Phoenix Suns' high-octane, let-it-fly offense has revolutionized the NBA, put fans in the seats and kept many an opposing coach up at night, most notably Gregg Popovich.

So when the Suns announced they were starting Amare Stoudemire on Wednesday night, surrounding him with four shooters and taking the floor, as always, ready to run, Popovich was asked the obvious: Would he also tweak his lineup and play small?

"No," Popovich said, shaking his head. "We'll go with what we have."

What the Spurs had was good enough. With Tony Parker scoring 29 points, Tim Duncan adding 26, and Fabricio Oberto, their 6-foot-and-change bull of a starting center making all 11 of his shots, the Spurs rallied for a 111-106 overtime victory over the Suns at the AT&T Center.

For the second time in three games, Oberto shared center stage with the Spurs' stars. His 22 points and 10 rebounds were both career highs, and his 11-for-11 performance ranked as the most accurate shooting performance in franchise history.

"Numbers are just numbers," Oberto said. "What's important is we won the game."

That seemed in doubt on a couple of occasions, the first of which came midway through the fourth quarter. Steve Nash dropped in a 3-pointer to put the Spurs in a 91-82 hole.

The Spurs had shot poorly for much of the night, but Brent Barry answered with his own three. Five minutes later, Parker gave the Spurs the lead, bolting three-quarters of the court for a layup that became a three-point play when Kurt Thomas fouled him from behind.

After Manu Ginobili endured a charge from Leandro Barbosa, Oberto made the play of the evening. With his defender sagging off him toward Duncan, Oberto cut to the left block, took a pass from Ginobili, then immediately skipped the ball to Duncan for an easy layup and foul. The three-point play pushed the Spurs' lead to 101-97 with 10.8 seconds left.

"That's just reaction," Duncan said. "Fabi's an incredible passer. He's great at making those quick reads.

"When he's 11 for 11, I guess you have to guard him."

Oberto, who broke the franchise's 10-for-10 record set by Mark Olberding in 1977 and tied by Gene Banks in '83, opened the game with a pair of 15-foot jumpers — a shot he rarely took with confidence during his career in Europe. The rest of his scoring came on layups and cuts to the basket.

But while Chip Engelland, the Spurs' shooting coach, deserves credit for helping Oberto with his form and giving Parker — who buried back-to-back 3-pointers in the third quarter — a jump shot, the Hall of Fame should reserve a spot for him if he ever gets Duncan to consistently make free throws.

After Raja Bell buried a 3-pointer to bring the Suns within a point, Duncan missed two foul shots with 6.3 seconds left.

"When Timmy missed those free throws," Parker said, "I was like, 'Aww, that was a great comeback.'"

Fortunately for the Spurs, Duncan wasn't the only one struck by a case of the yips. Bell looked headed for a game-winning layup until Oberto fouled him with 1.5 seconds left. He swished his first attempt but watched the second clang off the left side of the rim to send the game into overtime.

Bruce Bowen opened the extra period with a long jumper, and the Spurs never trailed again.

By then, Stoudemire was already on the bench, having fouled out with 4:17 left in the fourth quarter.

"I thought a couple of the calls were questionable," Stoudemire said. "But I guess that's what happens when you're a superstar (like Duncan) in this league."

Hoping to boost Stoudemire's confidence, as well as coax a little more aggressiveness from him, the Suns gave their young center his first start of the season.

The Spurs hadn't seen Stoudemire, who is recovering from microfracture surgery on his left knee last year, since he pounded them for 185 points over five games of the 2004-05 Western Conference finals. The 14 points he scored in 12 minutes in the first half brought back memories of that series.

"He was on his way to 39 again," Popovich said, "like he usually gets against us."

Regardless of whether Stoudemire was on the floor, the Spurs stayed big for much of the game. Of the 29 minutes after halftime, Oberto played all but three. Francisco Elson didn't leave the bench in the second half.

Oberto guarded Stoudemire but also switched on Nash on the Suns' pick-and-rolls.

"I think sometimes we try to adjust too much in going small," Parker said. "I think sometimes when we keep going big, we hurt them.

"Fabi is pretty clever on defense. He moves his feet pretty well, so I think we can get away with that."

Oberto proved his worth again in overtime. With the Spurs clinging to a 105-103 lead, he cut inside for another layup.

"You can say what you want about him," Duncan said, "but he understands how to play the game."

http://www.mysanantonio.com/sports/basketball/nba/spurs/stories/MYSA110906.01C.BKNspurs.suns.gamer.2ff50fe.html

[boutons_]

"I think sometimes we try to adjust too much in going small," Parker said. "I think sometimes when we keep going big, we hurt them"

Tony must read SpursTalk, too.

[ALVAREZ6]

Props to Oberto, what a fuckin game!

[ducks]

when will manu do it?

[Borosai]

I swear, the Spurs players are lurkers around these here parts...they probably discuss the threads during team meetings.

[Dartherus]

FWIW, Scola has the same size than Oberto, but is faster and more athletic, and has better footwork and about the same (if not slightly more) fundamentals and Basketball IQ, and clearly better mid-range shooting....just for the ones saying Scola would struggle in NBA.

Spurs have such a great player in Europe, when he could contribute from the start, or Spurs could get a good player in a trade.

[whottt]

FWIW, Scola has the same size than Oberto, but is faster and more athletic, and has better footwork and about the same (if not slightly more) fundamentals and Basketball IQ, and clearly better mid-range shooting....just for the ones saying Scola would struggle in NBA.

Spurs have such a great player in Europe, when he could contribute from the start, or Spurs could get a good player in a trade.


As a charter memeber of the Oberto fan club and a guy who was jocking him over Scola a year before the Spurs even signed Oberto...I gotta disagree.

They are not the same type of player at all.

Oberto has much more toughness and is much more willing to do the dirty work and play off of his teamates.

Scola is an offensive player who is primarily a scorer and little else.

This much was appratent on Team Argentina.



Furthermore...

Scola is a hot head who likes to run his mouth and has a habit of making inflammatory statements.

Oberto knows when to keep it shut.

Scola is a Delfino in the making.

No way Scola would have rode the pine like Oberto did to wait for his chance and still remained quiet after a year when he didn't think it was coming or getting yanked out of games.

Kinda like Manu has put up with being yanked out of the starting rotation and coming off the bench behind choking bitches, and still kept his mouth shut for the good of the team...even when it was done after he was an All Star.








Manu is unique among the 4 of them in that he is a SuperStar caliber player who also can double as role player. While Oberto is a pure role player.

Delfino and Scola are guys that can only be SuperStars but lack the talent to actually pull it off in the NBA.


FWIW though...I do think Oberto was kind of a test flight for Scola...seeing how well the talent transfers to the NBA to see if they should risk the large contract the unproven Scola demands.


And Scola might even be a decent NBA PF....he and his game would just never fit in on the Spurs. While Oberto has Spur written all over him.

Hopefully Detroit will be interested in Scola so we can trade him there and he Delfino can be whining, miserable and disgruntled bitches together...with little or no NBA game.


In closing:

Scola = Bad Argie
Oberto = Good Argie

Scola = Delfino
Oberto = Manu

Manu y Oberto = Team players
Scola y Delfino = Cancerous Primadonnas.


I don't want Scola on the Spurs...ever.


Apologies to all the board Argies for stepping on the toes of two of their national heroes...but they aren't my national heroes, and that's just the way it is IMO. Scola and Delfino have made their own NBA beds.

[ShoogarBear]

In closing:

Libya is a land of contrast. Thank you.

[Mr. Body]

I could see Scola do well on a team like Chicago that vitally needs a post presence. I agree with the differences marked between him and Oberto, but think Scola will be a very good NBA player perhaps in a Corliss Williamson mold, when Corliss was devastating off the bench. He doesn't rebound or defend nearly enough to be a Spur.

Scola+something = Nocioni

That's my wet dream next summer.

[whottt]

I'd do Scola for Crapa right now....and that's probably all we could get. Actually I'd be pretty happy if we could get that.

We won't get Noccioni out of the Bulls...they'll give up Deng before Noccioni IMO.

Noccioni is a playoff stud and his nickname is Red Bull....that won't be a guy they'll be trading.

In fact I think the reason Deng is starting right now is to showcase him so they can trade him for a post scorer.

[Mr. Body]

They keep Deng and trade Nocioni. Deng's cheaper, does many of the same things, and is a lot younger. This is likely Nocioni's last year as a Bull, IMO.

But yeah, one of the two has to go. They have too many swingmen behind them - too many guards and wings in general - and have other needs. I doubt Nocioni wants to continue playing off the bench. He deserves more.

If it comes down to Nocioni leaving for nothing this summer, Chicago may want something in return. A package of Scola+ could pry him loose.

[whottt]

That's a great theory but...Deng isn't as good as Noccioni and if anyone knows this it's Scott Skiles.

IF the rest of the team played like Noccioni in the post season, the Bulls would be NBA champions right now.


Keep in mind...the Bulls aren't the Spurs....getting a cheaper player instead of a better player isn't the mindset of the big market teams...Spurs Fans often overlook this when analyzing teams like the Knicks, Mavs and Bulls.

The Bulls have a buttload of SF's on their roster...I think Deng is the one they'll move.

If it's Noccioni they are trying to move, they are doing a shitty job of showcasing his talent to raise his value.

[Mr. Body]

We'll see. Deng is still 21 and still has potential. He's putting up very nice numbers so far this season and may be turning the corner.

[coopdogg3]

Scola and Delfino have made their own NBA beds.

I think it's a bit harsh and unfair to say Scola has made his own NBA bed, before he's ever even played in the NBA.

[diego]

everything i see out of the bulls is that they prefer deng. i dont know why but...

and of course its unfair to tag scola when he hasnt played a nba game, even delfino for that matter. American players that need touches/minutes or are simply immature dont get called "incapable superstars" or "cancerous primmadonnas" the way whottt is doing.

but dont worry about my argie pride, as our star to bust ratio is still better than that for american players

[whottt]

Scola's self inflicted buyout and he and his agents hostile and unaccountable stance has made him a tough trade and left teams gunshy about aquiring him. He has indeed made his own bed.

[whottt]

everything i see out of the bulls is that they prefer deng. i dont know why but...

and of course its unfair to tag scola when he hasnt played a nba game, even delfino for that matter. American players that need touches/minutes or are simply immature dont get called "incapable superstars" or "cancerous primmadonnas" the way whottt is doing.

but dont worry about my argie pride, as our star to bust ratio is still better than that for american players



You are kidding right? You don't think American players get called cancerous primadonnas?

False...we have enough good players here to where we don't turn a blind eye towards their obvious faults. The NBA is full of American cancerous primadonnas...and they will get called as such by me and other Americans(although admittedly there are some who won't).

OTOH, Scola could kill a baby and to a man, you guys would still have his back...undeservedly, merely because of the flag that he waives(although I notice he wasn't exactly waiving it at Oberto when Oberto signed with the Spurs).

You are willing to trade objectivity out of some sense of national loyalty...I am not quite sure I get that mindset outside of international competition but it's a corrupted mindset....then again, my country has hundreds of players in the NBA. Cancerous primadonnas, and otherwise.

[picnroll]

Seems like calling Scola a cancer is a ridiculous stretch. He seems extremely well liked by his Argentine teammates. Unlike Delfino he seems to be one of core musketeers Manu, Obertto, Nocioni and Scola. That doesn't mean I think his game will translate well to the Spurs or NBA but not from intensity effort but more from possible athleticism issues.

[Mr. Body]

People hate Scola for being upset with the Spurs for not getting him over soon enough, possibly being cheap about it (in his view). Not keeping his contract situation separate from his game, they think he's a cancerous presence in the locker room and uncontrollable on the floor, when he's neither. He's a passionate player, plain and simple, and will be a kick in the pants for whatever team finally gets him from the Spurs. He'll be in the league within two years.

[whottt]

He bitched about being drafted.
He blamed the Spurs for his 13 million dollar buyout.
Copped an attitude when the Spurs asked him to work on his rebounding. Like he was above it or something.
He bitched and whined and asked to be traded because the Spurs wouldn't pay him 5 million per year, unproven in the NBA.
Then when the Spurs couldn't find another team stupid enough to do that...he again bitched about the Spurs and acts like they are the reason he has a huge buyout and can't get 5 mil per season. Like they weren't trying to trade him and attempting to sabotage his career or something by not trading him.
When in fact, the Spurs would like nothing better than to trade his azz for anything.


Dumbass. F Scola. One dimensional PF that if he's lucky might have a career best season 15 ppg and 4 rbg in the NBA on 45% shooting. We could get that from Mo Taylor.


Pain in the ass....

He's a weak rebounder, he has a habit of falling short in championship games in Euroleague, and he's obviously not very media savvy, since not only has his mouth made him unappealing to the Spurs, but other NBA teams as well.

He's his own worse enemy...If he'd just keep his fucking mouth shut for an offseason, we probably could eventually trade him.

This guy thinks he's Jordan, and we already have a PF, true, he's no Luis Scola, but we'll keep him just the same. Kick Scola's ass to the curb.

And BTW, I am not a blind Pop homer or Spurs FO jocker...but at the minimum, disregard the fact that he's a cancerous primadonna, Scola is a dumbass of rare caliber..period.


Oberto>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Scola

[MI21]

Shoog, that might be the funniest thing I have ever read on SpursTalk :lol

[coopdogg3]

I haven't seen Scola play. Don't defend him. Don't really care if he's a Spur. But I find it a tad repugnant that you're saying he's made his own NBA bed, before he's played in the freaking NBA. If he comes over and proves cancerous, one-dimensional, etc, than so be it. But innocent until PROVEN guilty is my take on the matter. I don't care how he acts in Europe, watching Pop yell at Duncan (and Duncan taking it), watching Manu come off the bench (and not complaining) may change Scola.

It may not, sure. I doubt he plays for SA at all. But I'm more than willing to wait to pass judgement on Scola's NBA career, until he's at least played 1 NBA game.

[whottt]

I haven't seen Scola play.

I have.


Don't defend him.

Me either.


Don't really care if he's a Spur.

I do.


But I find it a tad repugnant that you're saying he's made his own NBA bed, before he's played in the freaking NBA.

Find it repugnant all you like...does not change the facts that he is pretty much unsignable and untradeable. Because of his own doing...



If he comes over and proves cancerous, one-dimensional, etc, than so be it.

No not so be it when he wants 5 million per year...this is the Spurs, not the Knicks.



But innocent until PROVEN guilty is my take on the matter.
He has been proven guilty...

He entered the draft, then bitched when the Spurs drafted him.

He signed a contract with an insane buyout and then bitched when no one could afford it.

He wanted more money than any unproven Euroleaguer has ever gotten and then bitched when he didn't get it.

He then wanted to be traded, but due the same reasons the Spurs couldn't sign him, no other team is willing to risk it right now, and his complaining on top of it only exacerbated the situation.

He's asked to be traded...why do you think he hasn't been?

Period.



I don't care how he acts in Europe, watching Pop yell at Duncan (and Duncan taking it), watching Manu come off the bench (and not complaining) may change Scola.

And it might not...once you are paying him the MLE, otherwise known as the amount we are paying Elson and Butler combined....that would be a bad thing. Especially if he sucks.



It may not, sure. I doubt he plays for SA at all. But I'm more than willing to wait to pass judgement on Scola's NBA career, until he's at least played 1 NBA game.

I can pass judgement on his mouth and his complaining, something he has done since day one when he entered the draft and, heaven forbid, was drafted.

[Mr. Body]

Whottt just hates the guy. There's no real argument to be made.

[Bruno]

I'm fine with whottt hating Scola but at least he can base his hate on facts.

http://www.mysanantonio.com/sports/basketball/nba/spurs/stories/MYSA070706.1D.BKNspurs.scola.1300a8f.html


Scola is seeking a three-year contract worth between $9 million and $10 million, about a third of which would go to paying the $3.5 million buyout he has with Tau.

"he wants 5 million per year." and "He wanted more money than any unproven Euroleaguer has ever gotten" is BS (Garbajosa get $12M/3 years)


Several executives from other NBA teams said the Spurs tried to use Scola's rights to move into the first round of last week's draft. They also have sought to secure a future first-round pick for him.

Cleveland and Memphis expressed some interest, but the talks never yielded an offer.

"no other team is willing to risk it right now" is BS. No other team was willing to give up a first for him.

BTW, Scola's european agent has bitched a lot last summer caling Scola a slave. As far as I know, Scola hasn't bitched last summer and has just said that he understands that Spurs have other priorities than him. http://spurstalk.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1086161&postcount=92

[whottt]

Whottt just hates the guy. There's no real argument to be made.


And you just love the guy...there's no real argument to be made.

[whottt]

I'm fine with whottt hating Scola but at least he can base his hate on facts.

http://www.mysanantonio.com/sports/basketball/nba/spurs/stories/MYSA070706.1D.BKNspurs.scola.1300a8f.html



"he wants 5 million per year." and "He wanted more money than any unproven Euroleaguer has ever gotten" is BS (Garbajosa get $12M/3 years)


My bad...still too much for a small market team to pay an unproven player.

And thanks for mentioning Garbajosa...he sucks too.


Matter of fact the only Euros worth their pay are Manu, Parker and Nocioni.




"no other team is willing to risk it right now" is BS. No other team was willing to give up a first for him.


Why not? He wants more money than a first rounder. Other teams don't want to screw with the buyout when they can just wait until this summer to do it.


All your little link says is that the Spurs tried to trade him and no one would do the trade.




BTW, Scola's european agent has bitched a lot last summer caling Scola a slave.

And that's a pretty stupid comment as well...don't you think?





As far as I know, Scola hasn't bitched last summer and has just said that he understands that Spurs have other priorities than him. http://spurstalk.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1086161&postcount=92


Ahh Scola's been whining and bitching since the Spurs drafted him. He's kind of resigned to his fate for now...the problem is, he did this to himself. And he's bitched a lot in previous offseasons.

He's the one that signed the contract with the huge buyout.
He's the one that overpriced himself.
He's the one that put himself in the draft.


Guy is not a Spur...and he's not that good either. He's definitely not worth the money that he wants, on this team.

He's not a good defender interior and Pop won't play him. And if you think he will...you need to watch more Spurs games.

[smeagol]

Matter of fact the only Euros worth their pay are Manu, Parker and Nocioni. .

Gasol?

[whottt]

Not really...

I could get my team swept every year. How much should that cost?

[Mad Martigan]

oberto for the all star game he's got my vote from the west

[Bruno]

My bad...still too much for a small market team to pay an unproven player.

Maybe, it's true that recently a lot of "star players" in europe have sucked in nba : Macijauskas, Jasikevicius and Garbajosa. The only european star player who seems to be quite good is Anthony Parker. Other european players that have some sucess in nba were young players.



And thanks for mentioning Garbajosa...he sucks too.

I called it as soon as Raps signed him :
http://spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=46855




Why not? He wants more money than a first rounder. Other teams don't want to screw with the buyout when they can just wait until this summer to do it.
All your little link says is that the Spurs tried to trade him and no one would do the trade.

The link says that Spurs wanted a first rounder for him. Toronto has given $12M/3 years to Garbajosa, it's obvious that some teams were ready to give Scola $10M/3 years (Scola is a younger and better than Garbajosa).
NBA teams weren't just ready to give $10M + a first for Scola.





And that's a pretty stupid comment as well...don't you think?

Agree.



Ahh Scola's been whining and bitching since the Spurs drafted him. He's kind of resigned to his fate for now...the problem is, he did this to himself. And he's bitched a lot in previous offseasons.

He's the one that signed the contract with the huge buyout.
He's the one that overpriced himself.
He's the one that put himself in the draft.

I've just said that he hasn't bitched last summer. Nothing more, nothing less.


BTW, my opinion on Scola is not well defined. Sometimes I think that he could really help Spurs as an energy guy from the bench. Sometimes I think that he will be a below average defender/rebounder in nba and that his post offense will suffer a lot to face athletic defenders.

[smeagol]

If Oberto can rebound in the NBA, Scola can too.

Not too difficult to see.

[diego]

whott, your best point about scola is that he signed that contract with the ridiculous buyout. the thing is though that he did that nearly 10 years ago when he was a kid no one thought had nba potential. if scola thought he'd be drafted 5 years later he probably wouldnt have agreed to that, but at the time he was an unproven kid cashing in on the best offer- what a bad guy. seeing as you are a professional athlete and all i thought you might empathize a little more, but what do i know, Im just an armchair quarterback.

when scola has expressed frustration with his situation, he has not put blame on SA, all he has said is that he is pining to go to the best league in the world and nothing more, obviously a sign of a primadonna.

and now that manu, oberto, sanchez and others have put in doubt wether they would continue with the NT, scola was the first to say I'll be there, plantar fasciitis or no.

clearly he's a me-first guy.

Look, I may be argentine, but that doesnt mean i dont have doubts about scola's nba transition. Its almost guaranteed any guy will suck in his first season due to adjustment. And as a spurs fans i can see how we have other needs that scola cannot fill. but you are trashing the guy badly, when he is a team first player in the best "competitive-argentine" mold. isnt it better to just say he doesnt fit on the spurs than to shit all over a guy with nothing more to base yourself on than mistranslated quotes (most of which arent even his, but his agent's) and highlights from biannual tournaments? how about you find yourself a tau ceramica forum and ask them what they think of scola?

and finally, if scola is so cancerous and useless, why did the spurs bother to draft him? why do pop and rc talk about him like a priority? i guess they're argentine too?