Ludden: Spurs' Popovich says league exec crossed line with Bowen

[Solid D]

http://www.mysanantonio.com/sports/basketball/nba/spurs/stories/MYSA111806.05C.BKNspurs.notebook.38e2352.html

Web Posted: 11/18/2006 01:05 AM CST

Johnny Ludden
Express-News Staff Writer

Spurs coach Gregg Popovich criticized the NBA on Friday for warning Bruce Bowen about his defensive "tactics" and complained league officials are "trying to change the way my best defender plays."
NBA executive vice president of basketball operations Stu Jackson, who handles disciplinary matters for the league, called Bowen at home on Sunday night and told him he needed to watch his feet and give shooters room to land. If not, Jackson said, Bowen faced a possible fine or suspension.

Popovich said the league never informed Spurs officials of the conversation and he learned of it only after reading Wednesday's Express-News.

"They didn't bother to call the owner, the (general manager) or the coach," Popovich said. "No one. They're trying to change the way Bruce plays and we don't even know about it?

"Secondly, what they're telling him is highly inaccurate. It's unfounded and fueled by media pressure and player complaints."

New York guard Steve Francis sprained his left ankle after landing on Bowen's foot in a Nov. 6 game. When the teams met again four days later, Knicks coach Isiah Thomas threatened to break Bowen's foot after Jamal Crawford almost came down on him on a drive to the basket.

That incident led to a heated exchange between Popovich and Thomas, who was not reprimanded by the league for his actions.

League officials have been instructed to call a foul whenever a defender doesn't give a shooter enough room to land. Vince Carter sprained his ankle in the 2003-04 season after coming down on Bowen. Carter also accused him of purposefully stepping under him in another incident the next season.

Popovich said Bowen is being singled out, citing incidents where New Jersey's Richard Jefferson and Dallas' Josh Howard sprained ankles after landing on Miami's Shaquille O'Neal and Golden State's Mickael Pietrus.

"Did (the league) call them?" Popovich said. "Did they call all those guys (Dirk) Nowitzki landed on when he sprained his ankles the past three, four years? The answer is no.

"So why did they call Bruce? Because it's happened to him twice? Bruce guards an All-Star every night. If he was doing what they're accusing him of doing, wouldn't it have happened a higher percentage of times?

"The people who cry about it are just frustrated about having to go against Bruce."

Popovich is concerned Jackson's warning has taken away some of Bowen's aggressiveness. Houston's Tracy McGrady scored 21 first-half points — most of which came against Bowen — on Tuesday. After looking at film of Wednesday's loss to Charlotte, Popovich said Bowen sometimes wasn't within "5 feet" of rookie Adam Morrison.

"The league is just trying to cover its ass," Popovich said. "I told Bruce, 'You be Bruce Bowen. You're the best (expletive) defender in this league. You will NOT change the way you play defense.'

"Stu Jackson is not going to change my team just because he thinks he's doing the right thing."

Jackson declined comment except to say he discussed the issue with Spurs general manager R.C. Buford on Friday.

"We registered our disappointment and disagreement with the way it was handled," Popovich said.

Bowen said he took issue with Jackson saying he needed to change his "tactics."

"Tactics means I have a certain way I'm going about doing things and it's purpose-driven," Bowen said.

Bowen also plans to heed his coach's advice — even it puts him at risk of being fined.

"I've been given a command," he said, smiling. "So I'm going to keep playing hard."
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[THE SIXTH MAN]

"So why did they call Bruce? Because it's happened to him twice? Bruce guards an All-Star every night. If he was doing what they're accusing him of doing, wouldn't it have happened a higher percentage of times?

"The people who cry about it are just frustrated about having to go against Bruce." As much as this is being made out to be, most people lose site that it has only happened two times.



"I've been given a command," he said, smiling. "So I'm going to keep playing hard."
:fro

[Kori Ellis]

Holy cow!

I don't think I've ever heard Pop go off on something about the league like this.


"So why did they call Bruce? Because it's happened to him twice? Bruce guards an All-Star every night. If he was doing what they're accusing him of doing, wouldn't it have happened a higher percentage of times?



That was my take on the situation too.

[TDMVPDPOY]

i expect pop to get a fine in the next few days

fuck stern, disco stu, the refs, the sore losers in teh league....

[carina_gino20]

about time pop said something about this... whether or not Bruce or the other players are doing it intentionally will always be debatable. so why single out bruce? :dramaquee

[GINNNNNNNNNNNNOBILI]

Has it only happened twice?

[Tek_XX]

I doubt Pop gets fined, this is a disagreement over the way a situation off the court was handled. No doubt the league has gotten calls from angry coaches, players, agents that they felt that had to say something. It's good to see Pop has Bowens back and i hope he gave Stu "token" jackson a call himself.

[Louie Vega]

Pop has every right to be pissed! I knew that this was going to be an issue. Pop seems to agree!

[greens]

Props to Pop for saying the truth out loud...He had a good point in singling out how all the other players who have caused such accidents do not receive the same type of attention that Bruce has been getting...

Plus it's very true that if Bruce did do this intentionally, then why aren't the percentages higher? I mean there are ONLY TWO incidents for Bruce, who has been a starter for San Antonio for the past 5-6 years...Plus doesn't he hold the record for not missing any games in the past couple of years? He's the only Spur to play a huge number of consecutive games...Plus look at his minutes. He has had the most minutes during all the games he has started. And what about the playoffs...the Spurs have gone into the Finals twice with Bruce on their team...so that's 82 regular games plus the playoffs, the finals...That's a LOT of playing time for Bruce. I mean he guards high percentage shooters every night. So then why are TWO incidents so damn important? It does not add up...

It's just unfair...and I'm glad that Pop told Bruce to just be Bruce Bowen...and continue his defense the way it is...I'm so happy that Bruce listened to this and will continue to play the way that he does...I was worried that he'd listen to Stu...And I love that Pop acknowledged that Bruce is the best defender in the league, and it's ridiculous for him to change his winning days...So what if he is fined? So be it...But we need our best defender in order to go to the Finals and win the trophy. We cannot do it with Bruce doing half of his defense and watching his every step. He needs to be the typical Bruce: tough and relentless...So I'm glad that Pop stood up for Bruce.

Players are frustrated because of how good Bruce is...not because he's dirty or etc...It's all about his defense...

[Kori Ellis]

I doubt Pop gets fined, this is a disagreement over the way a situation off the court was handled. No doubt the league has gotten calls from angry coaches, players, agents that they felt that had to say something. It's good to see Pop has Bowens back and i hope he gave Stu "token" jackson a call himself.


Saying this quote to the media would be what may get him a fine, not because he disagreed with the situation.

"The league is just trying to cover its ass," Popovich said.

[Tek_XX]

Saying this quote to the media would be what may get him a fine, not because he disagreed with the situation.

"The league is just trying to cover its ass," Popovich said.

Ha yeah forgot about that line, but dammit if it ain't the truth.

[polandprzem]

:wow

Pop is the man!

can anybody remember the last time when Pop was making such statments towards the leauge officials?
No?
Me either

I only remember when he was pissed about the Artest "stats" which was realeases by the Indiana staff (Carlisle that is mostly)



Stu Jackson is not going to change my team just because he thinks he's doing the right thing.

[lrrr]

Has it only happened twice?

Vince, cry baby Allen and Francis.

That's twice, cause Vince doesn't count. He was due for his "season ending injury" anyway. Stepping on Bowen's foot was just his excuse.

[Kori Ellis]

Vince, cry baby Allen and Francis.

That's twice, cause Vince doesn't count. He was due for his "season ending injury" anyway. Stepping on Bowen's foot was just his excuse.

Vince's season didn't even end when he sprained his ankle by stepping on Bruce. He came back in a couple weeks. But the next year when he talked about it, he said that it did.

[jmard5]

This time, it is not some ***hole coach or team owner that is criticizing the league. Being Pop, it is about time the league do some reality-checking.

[dimsah]

Greenleo brings up a point I never thought of. Besides guarding the best player every night, he has also played almost 400 consecutive games at about 35 minutes per.

[spursparker9]

"The league is just trying to cover its ass," Popovich said. "I told Bruce, 'You be Bruce Bowen. You're the best (expletive) defender in this league. You will NOT change the way you play defense.'


well said! pop :clap

[TDMVPDPOY]

im waitin for a response from phil jackson who criticize pop about browns situation with NYK.....

[wildbill2u]

Holy cow!

I don't think I've ever heard Pop go off on something about the league like this.



That was my take on the situation too.
This was an egregious intrusion by Stu Jackson, in effect going behind a team's management into a "discipline" matter directly with a player.

Pop was right on and I bet all the coaches and FO people in the league agree with him. Stern may even agree with him privately while supporting Jackson by publicly fining Pop.

And don't you think ALL the players in the league didn't notice how Pop treats and defends his players? One more piece of evidence that Pop is, in his own way, a players' coach. Might help us down the line when a Free Agent is making up his mind where to go.

[texbound]

Vince, cry baby Allen and Francis.

That's twice, cause Vince doesn't count. He was due for his "season ending injury" anyway. Stepping on Bowen's foot was just his excuse.


It only happened to Carter and Vincent.

I thought the stuff with Ray "wussy" Allen was because Bruce uses his hands too much. Allen complains that bruce grabs, punches, and claws him while he runs around the court. Plus the whole Bruce kicking Ray in the back incident (nevermind the fact that Ray was sitting on one of Bruces legs and wouldn't get up because he was complaining to the ref). Ray is just cry baby who can't take defense.

[joeyjfive]

Nothing brings a team together even more than a coach standing up for his player in a controversial situation. I'm very proud of Pop for doing this, but in so many ways hes completely right.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Dude, take the politics to the political board, ass.

Back to the situation with Bowen and Pop. I think it's awesome Pop spoke up. I agree with everything he said 100%. The league needs to be told to fuck off in this case and it looks like Pop said as much.

I think it's fucking lame that a has been wannabe hack like Isiah can get his panties in a bunch, go to the league, and get them to do anything about it. I guess that's what being in New Yawk will do for you, no matter how much you have sucked since you retired as a player. Fuck him.

I actually think this will have a galvanizing effect for the Spurs squad. Every year we all wait for the 'soft' card to be played. I think this will have a much quicker 'gelling' effect for this squad and form a bunker us against them mentality on the team.

And if it hasn't been clear enough already, fuck Stu Jackson, and fuck David Stern. If they want to outlaw defense, outlaw it. If not, shut the fuck up and let Bowen play it how he wants to play it.

[Cherry]

Please Pop, say this to Manu:

" 'You be Manu. You're the best (expletive) crunch player in this league. You will NOT change the way you go to the (expletive) basket!.'"

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

AD-VER-TIS-ING....................look it up.
$$$$$$$$$$$$ makes the world go round............look it up

spurs+championships=low ratings..........look that shit up. asswipe.

If that's all the league cared about, the Spurs wouldn't have any rings.


Political Forum.... look that up *asswipe*.

[EVAY]

I was glad that Pop said what he did, but I thought it was far too little and way too late. I get irritated with Pop when he is so busy being "cool" that he underreacts when any player other than Tim has an issue with refs, injuries, or other players. He gets upset during a game, but then acts all cool afterword. I thought he should have stood up for Bruce last year when he was getting all the badmouthing from Ray Allen et.al.,, because Jackson said something about it last year in public, regarding Bruce.

I think that the problem here is Jackson. Isaiah Thomas is a really easy guy to have no respect for, ( because he deserves none), but he has clout in the league (more than he should). Pop, or Holt (or both) need to realize that the league has to be managed just like the team has t be managed. Jackson has to be dealt with in owner's meetings and league coach meetings, because he is inconsistent, arbitrary and capricious in his disciplinary moves. The refs pay attention to Jackson, and that will hurt Bowen and the Spurs.

[NO LIMIT ARMY COMMANDER]

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TO: SNLA
FR: SNLAC

SUBJ: KNOW THY ENEMY

SOLDIERS, THESE ARE YOUR ENEMIES. THEY MUST BE STOPPED.


http://www.jewishsports.net/BioImages/Stern99NBAB874.jpg
STERN, DAVID JOEL
COMMISSIONER
HEAD GLOBALIST CONSPIRATOR
NATIONAL BASKETBALL ASSOCIATION


http://images.ibox.bg/2006/08/03/stu-jackson/220x190.jpg
JACKSON, STUART WAYNE
EXECUTIVE VICE PRESIDENT OF BASKETBALL OPERATIONS
SUCK UP TO OVERRATED SHOOTING GUARDS
NATIONAL BASKETBALL ASSOCIATION


http://www.spudart.org/blog/images/2006/2legit2quit-isaiah-thomas.jpg
THOMAS, ISIAH LORD III
PRESIDENT OF BASKETBALL OPERATIONS
HEAD COACH
MOST LIKELY PUBLIC FIGURE TO BE ON THE "DOWN LOW"
NEW YORK KNICKERBOCKERS
NATIONAL BASKETBALL ASSOCIATION


http://thedraftreview.com/history/drafted1999/images/steve-francis.jpg
FRANCIS, STEVE D'SHAWN
"PROFESSIONAL" BASKETBALL PLAYER
NEW YORK KNICKERBOCKERS
NATIONAL BASKETBALL ASSOCIATION

XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

[T Park]

AD-VER-TIS-ING....................look it up.
$$$$$$$$$$$$ makes the world go round............look it up

spurs+championships=low ratings..........look that shit up. asswipe.

If that was true special ed, then why did the league "allow" them to win twice more after 99.

Go away.


Please Pop, say this to Manu:

" 'You be Manu. You're the best (expletive) crunch player in this league. You will NOT change the way you go to the (expletive) basket!.'"


Im sure pop has said that.

At one time last night during a time out he looked at Manu and others and told them to drive to the "Fucking basket"

[The Truth #6]

I don't think its a big deal. They're not changing the rules just to hurt Bowen's game, they're telling to stay within the rules.

Bowen is a master of pushing the limits and looking for every angle he can to stop his man. That's all a part of playing lock down defense. Playing defense is not about being nice. It's about being rough at times, crafty, playing head games, holding when the ref isn't looking, flopping, moving your feet, blocking someone's shot from the weakside, never taking a break on any play. I think people need to look at the total picture and accept that Bruce finds the line often and occasionally goes beyond it, even if it is rarely.

Besides, he's getting notoriety for his defense. He'll probaby finally win DPOY this year.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Jackson has to be dealt with in owner's meetings and league coach meetings, because he is inconsistent, arbitrary and capricious in his disciplinary moves.

Fuck that, Stu didn't feel compelled to use the appropriate channels, instead going behind their backs and to try to intimidate Bowen.

[SequSpur]

Telling Ludden is bullcrap.

I want to see him on the frontlines of ESPN going Denny Green on their asses.

Then I will give him a chest bump.

[polandprzem]

I was glad that Pop said what he did, but I thought it was far too little and way too late. I get irritated with Pop when he is so busy being "cool" that he underreacts when any player other than Tim has an issue with refs, injuries, or other players. He gets upset during a game, but then acts all cool afterword. I thought he should have stood up for Bruce last year when he was getting all the badmouthing from Ray Allen et.al.,, because Jackson said something about it last year in public, regarding Bruce.

I think that the problem here is Jackson. Isaiah Thomas is a really easy guy to have no respect for, ( because he deserves none), but he has clout in the league (more than he should). Pop, or Holt (or both) need to realize that the league has to be managed just like the team has t be managed. Jackson has to be dealt with in owner's meetings and league coach meetings, because he is inconsistent, arbitrary and capricious in his disciplinary moves. The refs pay attention to Jackson, and that will hurt Bowen and the Spurs.


I think nobody gave a damn what Ray had to say.

And Pop doesn't need to talk about that kind of stuff on press conferences.

[SequSpur]

I think nobody gave a damn what Ray had to say.

And Pop doesn't need to talk about that kind of stuff on press conferences.

yes he does.

[polandprzem]

yes he does.

why?

[greens]

Greenleo brings up a point I never thought of. Besides guarding the best player every night, he has also played almost 400 consecutive games at about 35 minutes per.

Exactly! The precentages do not add up. I mean only TWO incidents have occured in the span of 400 consecutive games...Pop was right in mentioning the statistics...although he should have also mentioned that Bruce holds the record for being the Spur with most consecutive games. I think that would have helped the article a lot better. I don't know how anyone can call Bruce dirty after looking at all the statistics. It makes no sense. If Bruce was truly as dirty as he supposedly is, he'd have a HUGE number of incidents by now...But TWO add up to nothing at all...

I'm just glad that BOTH Pop and Timmy stood up for Bruce. I think it shows that this team has each other's backs no matter what...That's one of the things I love about the Spurs...

[LilMissSPURfect]

Please Pop, say this to Manu:

" 'You be Manu. You're the best (expletive) crunch player in this league. You will NOT change the way you go to the (expletive) basket!.'"
:tu :tu

[LilMissSPURfect]

exactly what i had expressed....why should bruce change his defensive schemes.....why isn't the offensive player asked to change their games? and why didn't bruce do his magic on dirk last spring? :D :D

[TDMVPDPOY]

CIA POP is sendin these guyz in if he gets a fine

http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/9623/spursfictionje3.jpg

[spurtime]

Ignoring the issue as to whether Bruce is purposefully injuring other players, Stu Jackson should never break established protocol and personally contact a player, ignoring team officials, especially when no action is being taken against him. Either suspend him/fine him and allow him to take the issue up on appeal, where you will have an opportunity to question him, or don't suspend him/fine him and leave him alone.

This was just incredibly unprofessional.

[lefty]

Please Pop, say this to Manu:

" 'You be Manu. You're the best (expletive) crunch player in this league. You will NOT change the way you go to the (expletive) basket!.'"

True ; Manu is at his best when he doesn't think too much ; lately, he has been thinking too much

[td4mvp21]

Tell them, Pop. Although I think Bowen could defend otherwise, there is nothing wrong with what he's doing. The league office is trying to eliminate defense. They want players to be able to score at will.

[Obstructed_View]

Ignoring the issue as to whether Bruce is purposefully injuring other players, Stu Jackson should never break established protocol and personally contact a player, ignoring team officials, especially when no action is being taken against him. Either suspend him/fine him and allow him to take the issue up on appeal, where you will have an opportunity to question him, or don't suspend him/fine him and leave him alone.

This was just incredibly unprofessional.
Exactly. There's no way to make an actual case with actual evidence against Bowen, so they will just try to intimidate him into changing his game because, oh by the way, nobody wants to see defense, especially from a small market team.

[Bruno]

:clap Pop, let's see now how big will be the fine.

[TDMVPDPOY]

how is this fine goin to be? is it 25k per interview or fine on each criticism?

[rwb]

Somehow I can't imagine Bruce actively thinking to himself every time the player he's defending jumps into the air, "Ooo...I gotta get my foot under him so he sprains his ankle." Bruce is the best defender out there and a sincerely good guy. Basketball is a physical game and unless someone goes out on the floor with the agenda of hurting other players by clubbing or punching them, injuries will happen because they just happen. It's like blaming the wall that you ran into for hurting you. But calling a player at home like that...if there isn't some kind of rule against it, there should be. Completely wrong.

[Bruno]

how is this fine goin to be? is it 25k per interview or fine on each criticism?

We will see.
JVG has had a $25k fine but it wasn't the first time he criticizes refs/league...
It's the first time for Pop but what he has said is more serious than what JVG has said.

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

Good on Pop for defending his player, but I'm gonna disagree with all of you here and say that I think Bowen does step under shooters after they are up in the air and he should stop doing it. He shouldn't change his D, but he should NOT step under shooters and he does it all the time. It's very dangerous and has already led to two serious sprains (one incident is isolated, two forms a trend and three or more a pattern).

I think the reason why he does it is much like the pretend punch to the balls that some guys will give you when you go up for a jump shot - instinctively, you are put off.

Go back and re-watch some games over the last 3 years... Bruce can do whatever he likes, but stepping under shooters, which I have seen him do (in the Carter incident he did it quite clearly), is bad karma.

[Spursfury]

The league should have suspended Isaah Thomas, and fined him up the ass. If they suspended maybe then his team would when some damm games.There worthless I can see why he was crying not because of Bruce it's because his team sucks and he has to coach them the rest of the season...

[NO LIMIT ARMY COMMANDER]

Good on Pop for defending his player, but I'm gonna disagree with all of you here and say that I think Bowen does step under shooters after they are up in the air and he should stop doing it. He shouldn't change his D, but he should NOT step under shooters and he does it all the time. It's very dangerous and has already led to two serious sprains (one incident is isolated, two forms a trend and three or more a pattern).

I think the reason why he does it is much like the pretend punch to the balls that some guys will give you when you go up for a jump shot - instinctively, you are put off.

Go back and re-watch some games over the last 3 years... Bruce can do whatever he likes, but stepping under shooters, which I have seen him do (in the Carter incident he did it quite clearly), is bad karma.


TIME TO COURT MARTIAL THE COMMIE.

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

TIME TO COURT MARTIAL THE COMMIE.

Read my sig, mofo. I call em as I see em.

I love Bruce Bowen's game, and his character, and without him we'd have two fewer rings. I think most of what he does is above board. I'm not saying that Bruce steps under players with the intention of spraining their ankles, but he does step up under players, especially shooters.

Look at the Carter incident - he definitely steps up under him. And I've seen him do that many times. He should D-up as usual but not step up under shooters after they've taken off. That goes for all ballas who don't want to put their opponents out of the game with an ankle sprain.

Oh, and I agree that the way the NBA has handled this has been terrible. I just think Bruce should be a little more careful.

[spurtime]

No one knows for sure, but I think some of the undercutting incidents are intentional and some are just a function of Bruce being within the space of his defensive assignment. I think the Vince Carter and Ray Allen incidents were intentional and meant as statements to those guys. In fact, I would go so far as to say that Pop approved of the tactic against VC since he seemed to throw him out there as a ringer after VC had torched us for 3 quarters...and it worked.

Bottom line...Whether or not it's intentional I think the league has a difficult case to prove up, and I will defend Bruce whether or not he's dirty because he is a member of my clan.

[polandprzem]

yes he does.

This is where sequs bball knowlege ends

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

but he does step up under players, especially shooters.

Look at the Carter incident - he definitely steps up under him. And I've seen him do that many times.

So, Bowen does it 'many times', yet over the course of five seasons, with Bowen playing 35 minutes a night (on avg.), guarding other the other team's best player who is probably shooting 15 times (on avg.) a game, all of three guys have gotten hurt.

If he was doing it a lot, the casualty list would have a lot more than 3 people on it.

[ChumpDumper]

Stupid Aggie -- since he's been a starter, Bruce has stepped under shooters 7200 times.

It's a fact! Check your own numbers!

[picnroll]

If the jumpshooter jumps toward the basket/defender and the defender jumps toward the shooter to contest the shot, jumpshooter landing in a space occupied by the defender, is the defender at fault?

If the jumpshooter jumps toward the basket/defender and the defender jumps straight up to contest the shot, jumpshooter landing in a space occupied by the defender, is the defender at fault?

If the jumpshooter jumps toward the basket/defender and the defender jumps backward but not far enough backward, jumpshooter landing in a space occupied by the defender, is the defender at fault?

The first foul that Bowen committed on Francis looked like Bowen took a pretty long, unneccassry step toward France. the one that Thomas bitched about on Crawford was just too guys jumping toward each othr, Bowen to contest the shot. Maybe they need to make contesting shots a foul.

[LilMissSPURfect]

Good on Pop for defending his player, but I'm gonna disagree with all of you here and say that I think Bowen does step under shooters after they are up in the air and he should stop doing it. He shouldn't change his D, but he should NOT step under shooters and he does it all the time. It's very dangerous and has already led to two serious sprains (one incident is isolated, two forms a trend and three or more a pattern).

I think the reason why he does it is much like the pretend punch to the balls that some guys will give you when you go up for a jump shot - instinctively, you are put off.

Go back and re-watch some games over the last 3 years... Bruce can do whatever he likes, but stepping under shooters, which I have seen him do (in the Carter incident he did it quite clearly), is bad karma.


:dizzy :dizzy :dizzy

Do the teach that somewhere...???


Bruce, DO not step under shooters STEP ON THEM!!!!!! or how bout Dang it FRANCIS, why did u land on Bruce's foot...why couldn't he just land UNDER Bruce's shoe ???????? :downspin: :dizzy

[clubalien]

I think bowen plays dirty but so did danny ferry at times.
What I don;t get his how they can say the spurs are "soft" and then complan they are playing defense to hard and dirty...

maybe it is just the other teams are soft

[Spurminator]

Does anyone still say the Spurs are soft?

That's so 2002. Of course, I haven't seen the ESPN boards in a while so maybe I'm missing the common modern smack.

[LilMissSPURfect]

Does anyone still say the Spurs are soft?

That's so 2002. Of course, I haven't seen the ESPN boards in a while so maybe I'm missing the common modern smack.

if bruce watches out for chauncey's feet....chauncy prolly drops that one on us......(your avatar....)


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JUST play SPURS DEFENSE and f*ck ALL them wimps!

[Dre_7]

I think the reason why he does it is much like the pretend punch to the balls that some guys will give you when you go up for a jump shot - instinctively, you are put off.

:lmao I do the fake punch to the balls when I play 21. I am tellin ya, it works EVERYTIME!!! HAHA!

[ajh18]

The rules are ALREADY suppossed to be in place to control for "stepping under the shooter". Bruce shouldn't be singled out in any way. If the league has a problem with it, they either need to enforce the rules better, or change them. It's like calling Shaq at home to tell him that he can't make a move to the lane with his elbow up... it's redundant, because its suppossed to be a foul already. If they don't call it, or don't enforce the rule frequently enough to dissuade a player from duing it, than that's the league's problem, not the player's.

[Summers]

I was glad that Pop said what he did, but I thought it was far too little and way too late. I get irritated with Pop when he is so busy being "cool" that he underreacts when any player other than Tim has an issue with refs, injuries, or other players. He gets upset during a game, but then acts all cool afterword. I thought he should have stood up for Bruce last year when he was getting all the badmouthing from Ray Allen et.al.,, because Jackson said something about it last year in public, regarding Bruce.



I think if Pop gave a crap about looking or being "cool" he'd buy more than one new blazer each season. What you mistake for "acting cool" is Pop being professional, restrained, and mature. He'd look like an ass if he complained to reporters after every game in which the officiating sucked.

[Summers]

Holy cow!



Forgot to say, that was my reaction. I'm really surprised he's turning it into a public... feud?... But I love that he's sticking up for Bruce.

[greens]

I don't know how anyone can possibly think it's intentional based on TWO incidents! Accidents happen all the time. NBA players know there are risks involved in playing this sport. I don't think for a second that Bruce is dirty or that he is doing this intentionally just cuz TWO incidents have occured. Bruce prides himeself on working hard and achieving goals the right way. Plus he is the best defender in the league right now, so he does not NEED to hurt people intentionally to win. I understand if he was a bad defender, then maybe he could intentionally hurt people in order to win. But he's a fantastic defender, so there is no need at all for him to play dirty!

Plus Pop and the Spurs organization would not tolerate having a dirty player...The organization is based on good character players...In San Antonio, good character is just as important as talent...

So for those who actually are debating over whether Bruce is doing this intentionally or not, just look at the statistics...A player is bound to have a couple of incidents over a period of a couple of years...Pop made a good point in mentioning all the other players that have caused such injuries, and yet they are not put on the spotlight...Why you ask? Because Bruce is the better defender out of all those other guys, and because he frustrates players the most with his tenacity...He's relentless and just won't give the superstar players their shots so easily. That's why Ray Allen and Vince Carter are whinning...They're not getting their way. They actually have to WORK to get a shot...Plus as I recall, in 2005 playoffs, Ray began whinning about Bruce and saying he is dirty BEFORE the game!!! I mean who whines before the game???

Just because some big names are complaining, Bruce is the subject of controversy. If Ray Allen/Vince Carter were complaining about some other player, then that player would also be in the spotlight...

But I think regardless of how you feel about Bowen, statistics do not lie. TWO accidents in no way mean Bowen is doing so intentionally...And secondly, he's good enough to win without hurting other players, and just look at his character, it's not in him to harm others...it's just not. Bowen prides himself on being a good role model for children...Even after the Ray kick, he had apologized and had admitted his mistake...Unlike Jason Terry last year, who claimed that he never touched Michael Finley to begin with!!!

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

Okay, who here has actually played ball at any sort of level? When contesting a shot, you arms are usually at an angle in front of your body because the last thing you want is body contact with the player whose shot you're trying to swat. In this situation, the only way a shooter can land on your foot is if they jump into you, then I think it's the shooter's problem.

What I've seen Bruce do is step towards a shooter who has gone straight up after the shooter is in the air, thus increasing the chance that the shooter will come down on his foot. Personally, I think he's done this with the intention of defense, not injury. However, he doesn't need to do it because by the time he does the shot is usually already away, and he increases his chances of being called for a foul.


If he was doing it a lot, the casualty list would have a lot more than 3 people on it.

Not necessarily. Look at the number of times rebounders in a pack go up and no-one comes down on anyone else's feet. They must go up well over 1000 times for each time someone sprains an ankle.


In fact, I would go so far as to say that Pop approved of the tactic against VC since he seemed to throw him out there as a ringer after VC had torched us for 3 quarters...and it worked.

I think you're wrong because I'd hope no coach would tell a player to go out and engage in tactics more likely to injure another player. A grade 3 sprain or break can put a guy out for a season.

PS Hang the traitor now! I'm not towing the line so kick me out of the fanclub! :rolleyes

[spurs_in_7]

http://www.82games.com/0607/0607SAS.HTM

http://www.82games.com/0607/0607SAS5.HTM

best defender?????????, these stats says the opposite.

[Mavs<Spurs]

Exactly! The precentages do not add up. I mean only TWO incidents have occured in the span of 400 consecutive games...Pop was right in mentioning the statistics...although he should have also mentioned that Bruce holds the record for being the Spur with most consecutive games. I think that would have helped the article a lot better. I don't know how anyone can call Bruce dirty after looking at all the statistics. It makes no sense. If Bruce was truly as dirty as he supposedly is, he'd have a HUGE number of incidents by now...But TWO add up to nothing at all...

I'm just glad that BOTH Pop and Timmy stood up for Bruce. I think it shows that this team has each other's backs no matter what...That's one of the things I love about the Spurs...


I completely agree. As many divisions as we have here, this is one thing that almost all of us agree on. Pop said and did the right thing and Bruce doesn't need to change the way he pleases. He needs to do what he do.

And I agree also that the math does not add up.

[Borosai]

An ankle heals quicker than a broken heart. Fuck those ankles and win another championship!

[conqueso]

Okay, who here has actually played ball at any sort of level? When contesting a shot, you arms are usually at an angle in front of your body because the last thing you want is body contact with the player whose shot you're trying to swat. In this situation, the only way a shooter can land on your foot is if they jump into you, then I think it's the shooter's problem.

What I've seen Bruce do is step towards a shooter who has gone straight up after the shooter is in the air, thus increasing the chance that the shooter will come down on his foot. Personally, I think he's done this with the intention of defense, not injury. However, he doesn't need to do it because by the time he does the shot is usually already away, and he increases his chances of being called for a foul. There are two types of situations where someone has come down on my foot and either twisted their ankle or not:

1) We're banging down low, both of us go up for a rebound, no one has any idea where anyone's lower limbs are and it just happens, or

2) I'm a few (or several) feet away from the guy I'm defending when they are shooting a long jumper and I necessarily step or jump towards them to contest the shot, sometimes ending up with my foot in the spot they are going to land.

Sometimes you have to jump or step towards them to have any chance to contest the shot. Sometimes you get there in time, sometimes the shooter gets the shot off before you get close enough to contest it. And sometimes that means they land on you. B.F.D. If you're a real defender, it is something you "must" do since if you have any chance to contest a shot, you do it, even if your momentum or trajectory might carry you into the shooter or his landing spot.

It's a part of the game. Intentionally sticking your feet underneath shooters for whatever reason, whether to psychologically affect their shot or to hurt them, is dirty as fuck. No one here is saying that Bruce does that. Accidentally putting your feet under a shooter while playing hard defense is part of the game, and the fact that the people who are raising a stink about the way Bruce plays are egomaniacal primadonnas is pretty clear evidence that their accusations are self-serving and inaccurate.

Fuck these whiny bitches, fuck Stu Jackson, and seriously fuck Isiah Thomas. There's some serious favoritism going on here, and some serious prejudice. It's the same mentality that's responsible for Bruce never getting the respect he deserves in DPOY voting.

[RandomGuy]

In-f***ing-credible that they wouldn't talk to the coaches first.

What kind of soup sandwich is the NBA running?

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

conqueso - all I'll say is that there's a big difference between stepping "toward" and stepping "under" someone. Mostly Bruce does the former, occasionally he does the latter (the Carter incident is a clear illustration of that - I wish it was on youtube so I could link it). He shouldn't, nor should any other balla. It may be an effective way to put someone off their shot, but it's also dirty as fvck, like the ball-punch thing. Someone does that to me on the court and they are looking for a fight.

As someone who has had 32 sprains and two ligament tears (over 16 years of ball), I'm particularly touchy about this subject I guess. All of mine have come from banging or rebounding though... oh, and one of the tears from bloody volleyball! :lol

[miss paxton]

Tonight's game article (http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/recap?gameId=261119023) refers to Pop's latest comments. The line from the article that bothers me is, "Bowen has said he is committed to sticking to his menacing defensive style." First, "menacing" is a pretty strong--and definitely negative--description. Second, the way this is written implies Bowen not only believes, but said, his style is "menacing." It's just flat inaccurate and I can't stand sloppy writing. If Bowen said that, put it in quotes; if not, don't imply that he did.

[NO LIMIT ARMY COMMANDER]

So the Spurs are more

http://www.ticketspot.com/images/seo/sports-nba-san-antonio-spurs-banner.jpg

and less

http://www.sportslogos.net/images/Basketball/NBA/SA_4720.gif

?


Oh no.