Props to Oberto

[smeagol]

Before Solid starts his own thread about Fabri :lol

He had another good game. 14 pts, 11 boards (3 offensive), great passes . . . and a dunk!

[E20]

That baseline reverse dunk was unexpected, but a nice suprise. He also played solid D on Dirk to boot.

[Mavs<Spurs]

Oberto played outstanding.

Whoever this loss is on, (Parker, Manu, Bruce), it certainly was not because of any deficiency in Oberto.

[MannyIsGod]

Oberto has been the biggest surprise for me this year. I'm a believer in him. He played awesome tonight. He was so in Dirk's head. I loved it when he drew that offensive foul on Dirk.

[Mr.Bottomtooth]

One of the very few upsides.

[samikeyp]

Oberto has been solid all year. Good to see.

[Bruno]

He has been really good but he can't defend Dirk well. I've been ipset to see that Pop has used Elson when Dirk was on the bench. Elson should be used to defend Dirk.

[MannyIsGod]

He has been really good but he can't defend Dirk well. I've been ipset to see that Pop has used Elson when Dirk was on the bench. Elson should be used to defend Dirk.He's not long enough to defend him, but he does a good job of keeping Dirk off the glass. Its a tough comprimise.

[smeagol]

He has been really good but he can't defend Dirk well.

Not many players in this league can.

[ShoogarBear]

Oberto does a suprisingly good job on Dirk, but can't be expected to do it for the whole game.

I would have like to see more minutes with Elson and Bowen on him, so he's kept off-balance.

[Sam]

Oberto had a hell of a game. Not sure that we can afford to sit Oberto when he's having that kind of game for Elson. I know Pop isn't going to go with 3 bigs in the game with Elson, Oberto and Duncan.

[SequSpur]

Oberto got used by Nowitski nutsack all night long. What game were you watching?

Oh, its all about the fancy passes.... fuck that.

[Bruno]

Not many players in this league can.

Elson can do a slighty better job on Dirk than Oberto.
I haven't say that Pop shouldn't used Oberto on Dirk (he was better than Rasho/Nazr to defend him) but that Elson should play only when Dirk is on the floor as long as he hasn't mastered Spurs defense.

[dknights411]

Oberto gets my vote for Most Improved Player!

[T Park]

Oberto is proving to be a perfect starter.

Doesn't get too up or down.

Plays well in the offense. He stayed in front of Irk pretty well, Irk just made some tough ass jumpers.

I think rotating Elson and Bowen on him would've helped.

More Elson tonight than Horry would've been prudent, but what the hell.

[timvp]

Oberto does a suprisingly good job on Dirk, but can't be expected to do it for the whole game.

I would have like to see more minutes with Elson and Bowen on him, so he's kept off-balance.

:tu to Elson on him.
:td to Bowen on him.

Spurs as it is got dominated on the boards again. You put Bowen, who had all of zero rebounds in 38 minutes, on him and you open up the flood gates.

[timvp]

But yeah Oberto battled and played a good game. He tried hard on defense but you have to give Elson at least one minute on him to see what he could do.

[T Park]

I thought Pop was extremely unfair to Elson tonight.

He played what, a minute and a half and yanked him and was never seen again.

Horry missed more rotations and got more PT.

WTF, are we still trying to outscore em? We don't HAVE TO DO THAT THIS YEAR!!!

[loveforthegame]

I really like how Oberto keeps Dirk in front of him. Sure he falls for a couple of those fakes but I'd rather see Dirk live and die by those jumpers than fly by the defender for an easy layup or draw the foul.

I'd like to see Elson get some minutes on Dirk because he does a decent job of keeping Dirk in front him as well but he has the height where as Oberto doesn't.

[milkyway21]

Before Solid starts his own thread about Fabri :lol

He had another good game. 14 pts, 11 boards (3 offensive), great passes . . . and a dunk!

:worthy: :worthy: :worthy:

[Ariel]

For the season, Fabricio is averaging 7 pts on 68.3% shooting, and 5.77 rbds. Vamos Fabri!!!

[pjjrfan]

Oberto made Dirk work on the defensive end, and kept making him look weak on D. Dirk got away with some fouls on Oberto, but overall Oberto kept him in front, and kept him from driving to the basket. Bad thing was that Dirk was hot especially in the 1st and 4th. He hit some tough shots and then he hit some wide open shots, that pick and roll killed the Spurs late in the game, but still the team had it's chances.
I felt with the way Elson played Dirk in the first game he would be used more. Not the case. I'm happy for Oberto, I think he is staying in the starting lineup, he sure hasn't done anything to get him yanked.

[T Park]

Oberto was slow to roll back to Nowitzki on the pick and pops tonight, but, Oberto did his best.

Horry did pretty decent on him tonight too.

[Ariel]

16 points on 7/8 FG shooting! + 5 boards. :spin

[T Park]

Would've liked a better effort on the rebounding side, but damn another 16 point game.

Oberto has cemented his spot as the starting center no question.

[Kori Ellis]

Elson looks like he's pretty much out of the rotation. The only reason he got any minutes in the first half tonight was because Oberto picked up his 3rd foul. Then he got token garbage minutes in the end.

That's two games in a row. I am not saying I disagree with him not playing, but I wonder what he did to fall out of the rotation.

[Buddy Holly]

but I wonder what he did to fall out of the rotation.

Doesn't have Horry as his last name.

[Solid D]

What I like seeing is the other Spurs getting to know where Oberto is going to be, also. Not just Oberto adjusting to them. Oberto has made it exceedingly more difficult to double the post.

[dimsah]

He's showing a lot more offensive game than I thought he had, and he hustles his ass off.

[timvp]

Nice job by Oberto :tu

Eight points to start the second half was big. I could have lived with a couple more rebounds but he pulled down a couple tough ones.

Anyone else notice Elson wasn't in the rotation? If Oberto didn't get in foul trouble, it didn't look like Elson was going to play. Interesting development. . .

[ducks]

oberto has been shooting good
did not look like elson was going to play but pop most likely was just sticking with oberto because he was on fire again from the field
if you shot that well you have to stay with him

[whottt]

Maybe Pop doesn't like the way he's been practicing or something.

He definitely hasn't done anything on the court to deserve it......

I think Pop benches guys to get their attention....I don't think it always works to the benefit of the team.

Hopefully Pop will decide it's better to beat the Mavs than teach lessons.

[dimsah]

Anyone else notice Elson wasn't in the rotation? If Oberto didn't get in foul trouble, it didn't look like Elson was going to play. Interesting development. . .
Elson still had 7 boards in 12 minutes.

[whottt]

Maybe Pop doesn't want AJ to get a real good look at Elson....so he's making it look like he's out of the rotation.

I just hope Elson knows it if that's the case.

[Kori Ellis]

Elson still had 7 boards in 12 minutes.

He only got in the game because Oberto got his 3rd foul in the first half. Otherwise he wouldn't have gotten into the game until the closing 2 minutes.

[ducks]

oberto was doing a good job tonight
oberto shot well against mavs
lets see what happens when oberto is cold from the field
elson is still learning the system to
I would not read to much into it yet

[THE SIXTH MAN]

CIA pop

[ducks]

He only got in the game because Oberto got his 3rd foul in the first half. Otherwise he wouldn't have gotten into the game until the closing 2 minutes.

true but elson is producing still given the chance

I like it when oberto,horry and elson are actually battling it out for playing time

nazr and rasho both sucked at the same time quite a bit

[Ariel]

elson is still learning the system to
I would not read to much into it yet

true but elson is producing still given the chance

I like it when oberto,horry and elson are actually battling it out for playing time
Dear God... I agree with you!!

:wow :dizzy :wtf :huh :spless: :smchode:

[2centsworth]

Nice job by Oberto :tu

Eight points to start the second half was big. I could have lived with a couple more rebounds but he pulled down a couple tough ones.

Anyone else notice Elson wasn't in the rotation? If Oberto didn't get in foul trouble, it didn't look like Elson was going to play. Interesting development. . .
i watched very little of the game but noticed Elson dissed Tim on the hi5 after the game. Looked like Elson was pissed off.

[Solid D]

I will make an educated guess regarding the lack of Elson's play lately and say that Oberto is just playing better at both ends than Elson is right now. There were so many little things both Oberto and Horry were doing tonight.

Example: Sonics have a side out-of-bounds at their end with 5 secs. remaining on the shot clock. Ball is inbounded with an immediate screen at the wing. Oberto not only shows hard but completely blows up the play, playing as though the clock was an extra defender.

Just as Malik was outplayed by Horry 3 years ago, and only got decent minutes when matchups, fouls or injury dictated it... the same thing may be happening in Pop's mind with Fab and Cisco.

[T Park]

If Cisco has a problem he needs to get over it.

I don't think he was promised anything.

Just go out there, bust your ass rebounding and defending like he did tonight and he'll be alright.


These minutes on Horry though are gonna add up in the playoffs, I just don't like him playing 20+ like he did tonight...

[mikeanthony21]

Elson looks like he's pretty much out of the rotation. The only reason he got any minutes in the first half tonight was because Oberto picked up his 3rd foul. Then he got token garbage minutes in the end.

That's two games in a row. I am not saying I disagree with him not playing, but I wonder what he did to fall out of the rotation.

Probably nothing... but we'll never know.

[xamila rey]

vamos Oberto caraj*!!
great job Fab!

[timvp]

Fabricio Oberto continued his torrid shooting, going 7-for-8 from the field to score 16 points in the Spurs' 98-78 win at Seattle. San Antonio improved its record to 7-0 on the road, and Oberto has been a factor. He has made 26 of 33 field-goal attempts in the Spurs' seven road games (79 percent).

Scary thing is he's been mixing in a jumper.

[ShoogarBear]

Oberto was much better last year when he wasn't shooting so well.

[whottt]

I figured out why Pop didn't play Elson tonight....


Take a look at who we play tomorrow...and it is a back to back.

I can see 3 reasons why Pop wouldn't give Elson much PT tonight...

#1. It's the first night of a back to back.
#2. We are playing a fast and big team tomorrow.
#3. Nelly. Why tip your hand?



Apologies to Pop.


Elson is going to have to be the Biedrins stopper.

[whottt]

Oberto was much better last year when he wasn't shooting so well.


You used to be funny Shoogar...Used to be.

[Kori Ellis]

I figured out why Pop didn't play Elson tonight....


...

Apologies to Pop.


Elson is going to have to be the Biedrins stopper.

So why didn't he play him against Dallas?

[MannyIsGod]

You used to be funny Shoogar...Used to be.Doesn't it crack you up to watch the new posters freak out at posts like Shoogs?

[whottt]

I'm thinking because Oberto was playing well and he wanted to use Horry to stretch the Mavs D...and I think he legitimately might not want to give Avery too good a look at Elson.

I guess we'll find out. I can't see Elson doing anything wrong...his D hasn't been that bad for someone new to the system IMO...

[whottt]

Doesn't it crack you up to watch the new posters freak out at posts like Shoogs?


Yes lol. Newbies are so much fun ;)

[Bruno]

Props to Chip Engelland, too.
He has done an awesome job with Parker but with Oberto too.
One year ago, Oberto was a 50% FT shooter with an horrible mechanic and wasn't unable to hit a midrange jumper. This year, he is a 73% FT shooter (even if hasn't shot a lot of FTs for the moment) and can hit the 12-18ft jumpshot with consistency. His mechanic isn't perfect but it's better than last year.


About Elson, I just think it's because Oberto is playing well and Pop likes to play with a 3 bigs rotation.

[whottt]

I wouldn't count on Oberto's FT shooting staying up that high...he's a horrible FT shooter and I think he's just on a hot streak. He was horrible in Euroleague too. I remember when he was matched up against Javtokas in the ULEB Cup playoffs and he pretty much whipped Javtokas butt....except his FT shooting cost his team the game. He's a worse FT shooter than Duncan.

[boutons_]

"awesome job with Parker"

Last season, when Tony got to the basket, it was money in the bank, he seemed never to miss. This season, Tony's jumper started hot, has now deserted him, and he misses lots of layups, too. Can you get in a shooting slump on layups, too? WTF?

[Bruno]

"awesome job with Parker"

Last season, when Tony got to the basket, it was money in the bank, he seemed never to miss. This season, Tony's jumper started hot, has now deserted him, and he misses lots of layups, too. Can you get in a shooting slump on layups, too? WTF?

WTF ???? :downspin:

Do you realize that :
- Spurs have only played 14 games this year.
- Parker FG% is 51% this year.

A 5 games bad shooting streak isn't enough to day that a player is a bad shooter. Bottomline is that Parker's jumpshot/FT has been quite good since the ASG.

Every player has bad shooting streak and trashing their overall shooting ability because of that is rediculous. It applies too to Udrih, Finley and Horry.

[smeagol]

Oberto was much better last year when he wasn't shooting so well.

Mucho funny Shoog :lol

The issue with Oberto is, the same as with Manu in 2003/04, the same as with Barry in 2004/05, to be able to see through (i) his mistakes, (ii) his bad plays, and (iii) his adjusting to the NBA from last season, and stick with the guy.

Some people who knew Oberto from with Euro era, or who watched him closely last year and could see through (i),(ii), and (iii), gave the rest of the forum a correct assesment of what he was capable of. Obviously Pop and the coaching staff saw this because they kept praising Fabri all last year and stuck with him as the satrting center this year (which is paying of).

The other poster who has been right all along is Solid.

He should've started this thread.

[smeagol]

This season, Tony's jumper started hot, has now deserted him, and he misses lots of layups, too.

Did you watch last night's game? His shot was very decent.

He hit many 15 footers and crucial layups in the 4th.

[boutons_]

One fantastic quarter from Tony or Manu doesn't mean they are out of their shooting slumps.

[AFBlue]

Doesn't have Horry as his last name.

Or Finley...

[2centsworth]

regardless of why Cisco is out, he didn't seem to take it very well. story might be developing.

[ChumpDumper]

he didn't seem to take it very well.How did he show that?

[wildbill2u]

You ever notice that Oberto is shooting a high percentage by picking up all those garbage putbacks under the basket and little short layups on passes from his teammates. Looks so easy and like cheap stat padding?

Bullshit.

That guy is great at moving without the ball and geting his man out of postion on defense so he can box him out. No great physical ability, but a smart basketball player who understands angles and how the game shoud be played.

His teamates, estpecially Tim, are starting to look for him under the basket when the double team comes and you can bet by May they'll be really making it work even better.

I was dubious about Oberto, but since I came to SA for Thanksgiving I've been able to watch the games instead of hearing them on radio. He's gonna remain the starter all year with this kind of play. Elson's only gonna get in when Fab is in fould trouble.

[AFBlue]

Oberto is making the most of his opportunity. He is not a great one-on-one player, but I give him respect because he has learned how to thrive in an offense dominated by a double-teamed big man and a penetrating guard.

Bottom Line: His unselfishness and intelligence make him a perfect compliment to the Spurs' system and personnel.

[2centsworth]

How did he show that?my own observation when after the game he stiffed Timmy on a hi5 and looked upset. I watched very little of the game (2mins or so)but it stuck out to me that Cisco was upset. I didn't have a clue as to why until I read this thread.

I'm probably wrong, but maybe Kori can find something out?

[ChumpDumper]

Sounds like a reach.

[2centsworth]

Sounds like a reach.
it does, but I have good eyes. Hopefully it's nothing and or I have bad vision.

[ShoogarBear]

The thing you have to remember is that the NBA, just like every major league sport, is all about adjustments. Once the opponents figure out your weaknesses, they will try to kill you with them. Just ask Beno, whose first two months in the NBA may have been his best.

Once other teams figure out they are actually losing games because of Oberto, they will make adjustments. Then we will see what his real impact will be.

[AFBlue]

The thing you have to remember is that the NBA, just like every major league sport, is all about adjustments. Once the opponents figure out your weaknesses, they will try to kill you with them. Just ask Beno, whose first two months in the NBA may have been his best.

Once other teams figure out they are actually losing games because of Oberto, they will make adjustments. Then we will see what his real impact will be.


That's understandable, but the fact that he moves great without the ball, makes excellent passes, and can hit a 12 footer makes him just one more asset for the opposing defense to be accountable for. If they shut down Oberto's opportunity to score(by doubling, etc.), it will open up opportunities for others no doubt.

Most said that the Spurs would be lucky to get anything from the 5 spot....looks like they're lucky! Now the spurs have 4 1/2 legitimate weapons on offense (Bowen is the half)

[ShoogarBear]

Oberto will never need to be doubled. A lot of his opportunities come from the fact that nobody is even bothering to guard him at all.

He will still be valuable because he knows how to get to open spots when TP, Manu, or Tim are in the lane with the ball. If Rasho or Nazr knew how to move to open spots like Oberto does, they'd still be here.

[ShoogarBear]

The other thing I like about him is he knows how to take a dribble step around the basket to free up the angle.

He'll take one dribble and go up with a bank or underneath the basket for a dunk where Rasho would have clanged off a fadeaway hook or Nazr would have pump faked himself into oblivion.

[AFBlue]

Oberto will never need to be doubled. A lot of his opportunities come from the fact that nobody is even bothering to guard him at all.




Good point. Guess I mean that he won't be guarded because the weakside post comes to double Tim and Oberto just sits and waits for the pass. The opponent has to pick their poison...double tim in the post and get a layup from Fab or leave tim one on one and take your chances. Either way, I like the Spurs' chances.

[whottt]

I figured out why Pop didn't play Elson tonight....


Take a look at who we play tomorrow...and it is a back to back.

I can see 3 reasons why Pop wouldn't give Elson much PT tonight...

#1. It's the first night of a back to back.
#2. We are playing a fast and big team tomorrow.
#3. Nelly. Why tip your hand?



Apologies to Pop.


Elson is going to have to be the Biedrins stopper.


Apology rescinded...

Pop stop fucking around.

Maybe it's all a ploy so he can use the soft speech.