so seriously...

[atxrocker]

what the fuck happened to all the amare nay-sayers? countless threads during the off-season with everyone swearing up and down this kid would never dunk again but surprise, surprise. i know the season is young and the long term results are unclear, but the haters sure are quiet these days.

[Kori Ellis]

I don't think anyone said he'd never dunk again.

But I still don't think he'll ever be the same.

He needs a second surgery on that same knee and has bad arthritis in his other knee. I think he's awesome, but I don't think he'll have a long, explosive career.

[JamStone]

"I told you so" threads in the fourth week of the NBA regular season are funny.

[Obstructed_View]

I've only seen a couple of Suns games, but I've yet to see him show the explosiveness that he had pre-injury. Probably a little premature to pronounce him 100 percent.

[cornbread]

what the fuck happened to all the amare nay-sayers? countless threads during the off-season with everyone swearing up and down this kid would never dunk again but surprise, surprise. i know the season is young and the long term results are unclear, but the haters sure are quiet these days.

Go read the threads again. Nobody was swearing up and down that he would never dunk again. Most, including myself, were saying that chances are he'll never be the same Amare that averaged 37 pts against the Spurs in the WCF. I wish the guy the best but IMO the frightening potential that he showed in 2005 has been comprimised.

It's not hating, it's logic based off the history of other players who had the same operation.

[Xylus]

It wasn't so much this board that was bad about the Amare talk. There were certain Mavericks boards that were ready to proclaim that he'd never get 20 points in a game again.

Amare's showing great strides already, though. His play in the last few weeks (apart from the goose egg he laid against New Orleans because of sickness) has been stellar, and he's showing a growing increase in skill. Even his defense is looking better these days.

I didn't expect him to be playing this well so early in the season.

[bdictjames]

It's just that the Suns offense has radically changed when Amare was injured. He'll have a hard time getting along this Suns offense

[atxrocker]

"I told you so" threads in the fourth week of the NBA regular season are funny.


It's funnier when people make doomsday threads on players before seeing them get a chance to play. And apparently you fall in the "oh shit" category on this one, good call.

[RonMexico]

Kori, could you expand on these surgeries Amare needs? I guess these reports never show up in the Phoenix papers... this information you just presented is the only thing to scare me at all. Amare doesn't have to be explosive to be effective. I think he's still quick enough to get around the big men who have to guard him and draw fouls - but he'll be even more effective if he can take a Tim Duncan mini-camp on how to nail the 19-ft jumper from anywhere on the floor. However, before he went down with a different injury, K-Mart was looking pretty explosive this year (his 2nd after the surgery)... so I still have faith for Amare (he isn't jumping as high as he was before, but he also probably hasn't worked out his calves like he did before).

[JamStone]

It's funnier when people make doomsday threads on players before seeing them get a chance to play. And apparently you fall in the "oh shit" category on this one, good call.


LMAO!! I never had an opinion on whether Amare was going to come back and play well or "never dunk again."

But, nice on the assuming.

Grant Hill, when he does play, puts up pretty impressive numbers. Then he takes weeks off, if not seasons.

How about you wait longer than about 10-15 games before trying to stick it to people. And, how about not talking shit to someone who wasn't even one of the people you were initially directing your soapbox soliloquy to.

How about that?

"Oh shit!"

[atxrocker]

^^never had an opinion, but you're ready to write him off as another grant hill? how old was hill when he had his injury as opposed to amare? logically, wouldn't one have to be of the opinion that amares future ability is the equivelant of an injured hill to make such comparisons?

[Xylus]

Amare: 22 points and 15 rebounds against Yao and the Rockets tonight.

[atxrocker]

Amare: 22 points and 15 rebounds against Yao and the Rockets tonight.


my eyes must deceive me, another double double for amare? wow, he really does suck now.

[RonMexico]

He played really well - getting 6 offensive boards to keep some possessions alive to hold off the Rockets' surge.

[JamStone]

^^never had an opinion, but you're ready to write him off as another grant hill? how old was hill when he had his injury as opposed to amare? logically, wouldn't one have to be of the opinion that amares future ability is the equivelant of an injured hill to make such comparisons?


SMH. You don't understand, do you? All I'm saying is that you should wait longer than 4 weeks of regular season games to make your "I told you so" thread. Let's see him last an entire season. No, he's not the same age as Grant Hill was 28 in 2000. Amare is 23 or 24. My intent wasn't to write him off as another Grant Hill. My intent was to say that it takes longer than 4 weeks and 14 or so games to know if a player can fully recover from what Amare went through. You want an example of a younger player? How about Jonathan Bender? I'm sure you can make up some excuse why that's not a good analogy.

But, that's not my point. My point is wait longer than 4 weeks. Wait longer than 14 or so games. He's playing very well right now. If he breaks down 20 games from now, are you still going to toot your horn?

[Xylus]

According to bobster from phxsuns.net, these are Amare's stats in the 10 games he started. He did not start the first 4 games of the season, keep in mind.

Min - 29.2
FG% - .651
FT% - .721
Pts - 18.2
Reb - 9.6
Ast - 0.7
Stl - 1.20
Blk - 1.00

So he's averaging 18 points and 9.6 rebounds since he first started against the San Antonio Spurs a few weeks ago. If you disregard the egg he dropped against New Orleans (0 points, 5 rebounds, only 1 FG attempted in 21 minutes) because of sickness...he'd be averaging more than 20 points and 10 rebounds per game.

But he's still not regained all of his explosiveness. He's still getting the job done and he's improved defensively, but he's not as intimidating as he was before surgery. Hopefully that will come with time.

[Sense]

According to bobster from phxsuns.net, these are Amare's stats in the 10 games he started. He did not start the first 4 games of the season, keep in mind.

Min - 29.2
FG% - .651
FT% - .721
Pts - 18.2
Reb - 9.6
Ast - 0.7
Stl - 1.20
Blk - 1.00

So he's averaging 18 points and 9.6 rebounds since he first started against the San Antonio Spurs a few weeks ago. If you disregard the egg he dropped against New Orleans (0 points, 5 rebounds, only 1 FG attempted in 21 minutes) because of sickness...he'd be averaging more than 20 points and 10 rebounds per game.

But he's still not regained all of his explosiveness. He's still getting the job done and he's improved defensively, but he's not as intimidating as he was before surgery. Hopefully that will come with time.

Those are not Amare numbers... sure he might only be playing 30 mpg.. but look at our starters...

The truth is Amare is never going to intimidate like he used to... he's just not going to. Even if most of his explosiveness is back, people are still going to remember this.

As of now, he's not the go to guy for the PHX Suns, it's Nash... Didn't used to be like this, but I don't think they're ever switching that role again.

[Doug Collins]

Those are not Amare numbers... sure he might only be playing 30 mpg.. but look at our starters...

The truth is Amare is never going to intimidate like he used to... he's just not going to. Even if most of his explosiveness is back, people are still going to remember this.

As of now, he's not the go to guy for the PHX Suns, it's Nash... Didn't used to be like this, but I don't think they're ever switching that role again.

Uh wait. Nash has always been the go to guy for the Suns, even before Amare's surgery. Amare doesn't have to intimidate for the Suns to be effective he just has to play the pick n' roll with Nash and they'll be fine.

[Sense]

Uh wait. Nash has always been the go to guy for the Suns, even before Amare's surgery. Amare doesn't have to intimidate for the Suns to be effective he just has to play the pick n' roll with Nash and they'll be fine.

Nash wasn't the go-to-guy before the injury... It took Nash to make Amare explode in 2005, Nash was the MVP that year, on what appeared to be an unbeatable team thanks to D'Antoni's offense, but if it wasn't for Amare that particular season, they wouldn't be somewhat feared right now.

Amare has to intimidate for the Suns to be effective in the playoffs atleast. They aren't getting far if he continues to do what he's doing now. The Suns have equal shots at the title with or without Amare. Which are slim shots.

[RonMexico]

So who was your go-to guy against the Jazz? How soon you forget that Amare had 15 points in 18 minutes at AT&T Center before fouling out (at least one borderline call in that mess that could have kept him in a few more mins), and then the Suns were a Raja Bell FT away from winning it... you don't have to fear him to lose.... unless you fear him banking in 3 pointers which I'm sure he could still do.

[The_Game]

Those are not Amare numbers... sure he might only be playing 30 mpg.. but look at our starters...

The truth is Amare is never going to intimidate like he used to... he's just not going to. Even if most of his explosiveness is back, people are still going to remember this.

As of now, he's not the go to guy for the PHX Suns, it's Nash... Didn't used to be like this, but I don't think they're ever switching that role again.

It takes 12 months to fully recover from this type of surgery the fact he is averaging close to 20 and 10 after only 11 months is quite amazing...i thinkby playoff time Amare will be completely back to his best.

a heathly Amare the suns have as good a shot as anyone to win it all

[RonMexico]

Another 20-10 night for Amare and he fouled out tonight - he's playing well enough to complement players like Diaw, Marion, Bell and Nash - which is the nucleus for a Suns run at the championship... just wish they wouldn't take defensive possessions off to rely on their offense to win games... same story for 3 years, but at some point you gotta realize that your offense is great and spend some reps in the second half of the year shoring up the defensive prowess.

[Sense]

It takes 12 months to fully recover from this type of surgery the fact he is averaging close to 20 and 10 after only 11 months is quite amazing...i thinkby playoff time Amare will be completely back to his best.

a heathly Amare the suns have as good a shot as anyone to win it all

Yeah but Amare is Amare... he's younger and more athletic than the others who got the surgery.. you expect him to atleast have some of it in him.

I don't think Amare will be the same Amare again... They might make a push in the playoffs but no real threat.

[Irony_]

Yeah but Amare is Amare

I don't think Amare will be the same Amare again


:spin :spin

[Sense]

:spin :spin

Ok you know what I ment don't act like you didn't...


Nice quote either way :bang

[The_Game]

Yeah but Amare is Amare... he's younger and more athletic than the others who got the surgery.. you expect him to atleast have some of it in him.

I don't think Amare will be the same Amare again... They might make a push in the playoffs but no real threat.

No real threat? are you serious?

had the suns had amare last year they would of likely won the title.

[leemajors]

It takes 12 months to fully recover from this type of surgery the fact he is averaging close to 20 and 10 after only 11 months is quite amazing...i thinkby playoff time Amare will be completely back to his best.

a heathly Amare the suns have as good a shot as anyone to win it all

it takes 2 years, not 2 months. ask kidd and randolph.

[JamStone]

No real threat? are you serious?

had the suns had amare last year they would of likely won the title.


I don't usually buy hypothetical "what-if" situational stretches like this, but I actually agree with that.

Last year for the Suns had the look of a "perfect storm." Steve Nash playing the best basketball of his career. Leandro Barbosa becoming a surprise stud off the bench. Boris Diaw becoming a legitimate triple double guy on any given night. And, Shawn Marion having an MVP type season as a second fiddle. If you think about it, the Suns lost in the Western Conference without BOTH Amare Stoudemire and Kurt Thomas.

If Amare played last year, they could have very well won it all. That does make them very much a "threat."

[KB24]

it takes 2 years, not 2 months. ask kidd and randolph.


Kobe is not looking bad after his surgery. I think it varies from Player to Player. Amare is looking real good.

[RonMexico]

Kobe is not looking bad after his surgery. I think it varies from Player to Player. Amare is looking real good.

Kobe didn't have microfracture surgery! That's the whole point of this thread - that microfracture surgery is usually devastating to a player's career (especially in football, where precise cuts can be the difference between an incompletion or a touchdown). Kobe had arthroscopic knee surgery which is not the same type - and while he has a recovery period, you can come back much more quickly than from the type of surgery Amare had. The microfracture surgery is what everyone has been talking about on every TV station and sports website since last summer... but I'll cut you some slack since you're in LA and too wrapped up in USC, Lakers, and Dodgers to look at other teams.

[RonMexico]

Yeah but Amare is Amare... he's younger and more athletic than the others who got the surgery.. you expect him to atleast have some of it in him.

I don't think Amare will be the same Amare again... They might make a push in the playoffs but no real threat.

Please change your name - it makes me want to :bang over and over again at how little sense you make....

[ShoogarBear]

Mavericks boards Therein lies the problem.

[SirChaz]

Amare will never be the same player he was.

So far it looks like he will be better.



He may only be 90% the athletic freak he once was but he is already a better passer and rebounder than he ever was.

Will he be a great player? For that he has to be consistent and only time will tell.