So are the Nuggets now our closest rivals?

[The_Game]

In terms of getting that title?

If the gel are they better than the Mavs and Suns?

[MosesGuthrie]

no I would still put the Mavs ahead of them and probably the Suns too.

Denver will be a force though.

[WalterBenitez]

DEN will become a funny team to watch, not as much as PHX, and not as much effective as MAVs.

[The_Game]

For me this makes denver a huge threat

two superstars + a good frontcourt= trouble

[dknights411]

This is getting insane! I mean you have the Mavs and the Suns, of course (and Houston if they are healthy), but add to the fact that the Lakers and Jazz are tearing it up, you can consider those rivalries as revived. And now the Nuggets are up there too? :dizzy

One thing's for sure, the Western Confernce bracket is gonna be super tough come May (or even April!).

[PM5K]

I forsee the Finals as a sweep with an average margin of vicrtory of 35 points per game...

[mavsfan1000]

Nuggets are a 50 win team with Iverson and Melo. Not as good as a healthy Houston team.

[Sweet Pea]

This is getting insane! I mean you have the Mavs and the Suns, of course (and Houston if they are healthy), but add to the fact that the Lakers and Jazz are tearing it up, you can consider those rivalries as revived. And now the Nuggets are up there too? :dizzy

One thing's for sure, the Western Confernce bracket is gonna be super tough come May (or even April!).

Agree the West is just too loaded...sux to be the ninth team in the West. NBA needs to expand the western playoff bracket..maybe send a few Atlantic Div teams to the NBDL.

[ShoogarBear]

Sixers are a 50 win team with Iverson and Melo.*Billy King slaps head*

[The_Game]

Nuggets are a 50 win team with Iverson and Melo. Not as good as a healthy Houston team.


Houston? Houston are garbage. T-mac is never healthly and all they have is Yao.

They don't have enough around them to compete.

[ShoogarBear]

You have to think, barring some unforeseen catastrophe, the top six teams in the West are known (SA, Dallas, Phoenix, Utah, Denver, Lakers) with only the order to be determined. And if Houston survives however long T-Mac is out, that makes seven. So only one spot is left for grabs between everyone else, with probably Memphis and Seattle effectively out of it (although still with a shot).

Crap.

[Solid D]

The Nuggets will probably need some "gel" time, however, I think the Nuggets will improve by 5 wins and more importantly, be a beast in the playoffs. Two supreme iso options, now.

[ponky]

In terms of getting that title?

If the gel are they better than the Mavs and Suns?

you ought to just worry about your own team and stop sounding like a douche

[ChumpDumper]

If they can stay healthy, maybe.

[mavsfan1000]

My list goes in this order.
Dallas, Phoenix, Houston, Utah Denver, LA.

[dirk4mvp]

no, they aren't. Dallas still exist.

[GrandeDavid]

The Mavs eliminated the Spurs last playoffs and have gotten a little better. No way the Spurs could even think about any other team but the Mavs being their main rival. Having said that, this is the NBA and these are professional athletes, so when the playoffs start, you take it one series at a time and respect your opponent. Dallas, Phoenix, Denver, they're all damn good. But Dallas will be the toughest of all come playoff time.

[mabber]

Will be interesting to see how it plays out in Denver at the very least.

[Bruno]

It's too soon to say but they are really good on the paper with :
- Two of the best offensive players in the league (melo and AI)
- A good shooter who will be often wide open (JR Smith)
- A strong and solid big men rotation (Nene, najera, Evans) around one of the best defensive big man in the league (Camby)
- A player who cna scored points from the bench (Boykins)
- Two young players who can help a little (Diawara and Kleiza)
- A good coach

It's scary.

[GrandeDavid]

Until proven otherwise, the Mavs are the team to beat in the West. But throwing Iverson into Denver's lineup will be interesting. If Iverson truly is happy in Denver and respects Carmelo's offensive game, then boy would I love to see a Dallas v Denver playoff series, which the Mavs would win. But it would still be fun! Thenn hopefully the victor would be tired and have to face San Antono. ha ha ha

[mabber]

It's too soon to say but they are really good on the paper with :
- Two of the best offensive players in the league (melo and AI)
- A good shooter who will be often wide open (JR Smith)
- A strong and solid big men rotation (Nene, najera, Evans) around one of the best defensive big man in the league (Camby)
- A player who cna scored points from the bench (Boykins)
- Two young players who can help a little (Diawara and Kleiza)
- A good coach

It's scary.

The key will be keeping Camby healthy. If he's healthy in the playoffs then the Nuggets will be tough.

[ALVAREZ6]

It's too soon to say but they are really good on the paper with :
- Two of the best offensive players in the league (melo and AI)
- A good shooter who will be often wide open (JR Smith)
- A strong and solid big men rotation (Nene, najera, Evans) around one of the best defensive big man in the league (Camby)
- A player who cna scored points from the bench (Boykins)
- Two young players who can help a little (Diawara and Kleiza)
- A good coach

It's scary.
Yet they can't control themselves and have been known to slap their opponents like little girls (last saturday, also 05 playoffs).

[Mr. Body]

If anything it means the playoffs will be a nasty dogfight for one conference and a sea of soft lillypads for the other.

[nkdlunch]

that's what some ppl said about the Rockets before the season started :rolleyes

[MrChug]

Nuggets are a 50 win team with Iverson and Melo. Not as good as a healthy Houston team.

Exactly. :toast

[dg7md]

Mavs and Suns are still better. I believe Utah will likely still be better as well.

[Memaid time]

Nuggets>>>>>>>>>>>Spurs

They will probably knock out the Spurs in a playoff series.

[Kori Ellis]

Nuggets>>>>>>>>>>>Spurs

They will probably knock out the Spurs in a playoff series.

Nice user name :lmao

[baseline bum]

Winning the division just got a lot more important.

[Bruno]

Yet they can't control themselves and have been known to slap their opponents like little girls (last saturday, also 05 playoffs).

I have really hated 05' Nuggets, KMart is one of my least favourite player.
Now, I like them more because they have Iverson, a french guy and even after the Brawl, I have some respect for Melo because he doesn't cry about Bruce.

[dg7md]

I have really hated 05' Nuggets, KMart is one of my least favourite player.
I have some respect for Melo because he doesn't cry about Bruce.

Because Bruce can never stop him.
:lol

[ducks]

Nuggets are a 50 win team with Iverson and Melo. Not as good as a healthy Houston team.
when is houston healthy

[mabber]

when is houston healthy

Excellent point! I can't recall the last time Houston has been healthy for more than maybe 2 weeks.

[The_Game]

Houston have become so overrated, Yao is great but t-mac is always hurt and they have no consistant threat outside of those two.

They consistant get owned by the spurs and suns.

[NuGGeTs-FaN]

wow, they havent even stepped on the court and this thread has started? lol

Nuggets have to prove themselves b4 they get talked about with the Spurs

[The_Game]

wow, they havent even stepped on the court and this thread has started? lol

Nuggets have to prove themselves b4 they get talked about with the Spurs

It's something to talk about. We don't have a game for a little while.

[NuGGeTs-FaN]

It's something to talk about. We don't have a game for a little while.


:lol thats right, i 4got u guys had 3 days off :hungry:

[phyzik]

wow, they havent even stepped on the court and this thread has started? lol

Nuggets have to prove themselves b4 they get talked about with the Spurs

Thats what I was thinking.....

I suppose everyone owns this guys Mat as well...

http://www.newgrounds.com/bbs/user_images/pics/1/245000/ngbbs3c48f1755fcfb.jpg

[The Truth #6]

It will be an interesting transition. AI steps in right as Melo steps out for 15 games, possibly less if Billy Hunter gets an appeal. However much AI gets used to things, it's all going to change when first JR gets back, and then when Melo gets back. I'm not sure if this way is easier for AI or more difficult, but its going to be a while before everything settles and we see what they're really like.

[RC's Boss]

Karl can't coach regardless of what he may "think" ... I'll give them 5-8 extra wins off adrenalin alone, but it takes trg camp and 3/4 a season AT LEAST to build the chemistry it would take for a team to contend w/ SA

[exstatic]

For me this makes denver a huge threat

two superstars + a good frontcourt= trouble
OK, someone tell me what this "good frontcourt" consists of. Their best player, Camby, averages about 60 games played a year. Martin is done for the year with microfracture surgery. Nene is putting up Oberto type numbers. As a group, they either suck, or are hurt a lot. On top of that, you have two 30 point scorers who both need to dominate the ball to be effective. No one sees a problem here? Both of them will NOT continue to score 30 points.

[Bob Lanier]

Let me get the whining started: The Nuggets are dirty! Evans grabbed Kaman's scrotum! Evans sets dirty picks! Martin gives dirty looks! Najera, Evans, and Camby are floppers! JR Smith probably complained about Bruce Bowen at some point in his life! Boykins is a loser! Iverson and Anthony are so totally thuggish!

[BeerIsGood!]

Something tells me that there just won't be enough basketballs on the court during the game for this team to do well. Teams that are built around a shoot first and shoot very often point guard who shoots a horrible percentage and wastes possessions just do not do very well. Iverson will either take anthony's shots and piss him off, or anthony will take shots from iverson and piss him off.

[dbreiden83080]

This won't work out at all for Denver. You got Melo leading the league in scoring, coming into his own who by the way is also a friggin headcase. You now add Iverson to the mix a guy starting to hit the tail end of his prime, who needs a million shots to get his points and is an even bigger headcase than Melo.

[Viva Las Espuelas]

i cant wait 'til AI and Melo get pulled over with a hydro blunt. So much for Melo's ad campaign.

[Dirk Nowitzki]

Nuggets in the Karl era have yet to beat the spurs in a series. Not a series by any means. Only team Spurs can call their rivals is the Mavs and the Mavs can call the Suns and Spurs legit rivals as well.

[phxspurfan]

Re: So are the Nuggets now our closest rivals?


no

[RC's Boss]

i cant wait 'til AI and Melo get pulled over with a hydro blunt. So much for Melo's ad campaign.
I hope I'm w/ them... They have access to that good shit :smokin

[leemajors]

Let me get the whining started: The Nuggets are dirty! Evans grabbed Kaman's scrotum! Evans sets dirty picks! Martin gives dirty looks! Najera, Evans, and Camby are floppers! JR Smith probably complained about Bruce Bowen at some point in his life! Boykins is a loser! Iverson and Anthony are so totally thuggish!

evans better watch out then, elson will call him out for being "gay" like garnett!

[phyzik]

I would like a Vbookie.....

AI and Melo together will score alot of points and thus demand alot of shots from the rest of the players....

Im not saying it wont work but the question is there.... can they share between them??? and the bigger question.... can they share between the rest of their teammates...

Im not yet ready to believe they are a title contender, You have 2 players that are perinial ball-hogs on one team. theres a reason AI is the NBA top scorer.. The guy is averaging this season 10.1 FGM vs 24.4 FGA. Put him in a team with shooters and his stats go down, garunteed. 3pt's even worse at 23%... he was barely shooting 41% and thats as the main scorer at 42-43mpg. I would search for previous year stats but why? Everyone knows AI isn't a disher, his stats would probably be almost similar.

I admit the guy is a great shooter but how is he going to react on a team that has another allstar caliber person, nevermind roleplayers....

Stat line:

PLAYER NAME, TEAM NAME GP MPG PTS FGM-FGA FG% 3PM-3PA 3P% FTM-FTA FT%
1 Allen Iverson , PHI 15 42.7 31.2 10.1-24.4 .413 .8-3.5 .226 10.3-11.6 .885


I would put money down that he will either hurt Denver or keep them even with what they have done in previous years. Teams need to learn putting 2 ballhogs on 1 team RARELY works... It will be interesting to see how Melo and AI react to eachother.

[diego]

or, AI and melo score 22-24pppg, more efficiently.

we wont know for a while which it will be but its not at all improbable that given more options the nuggets will improve the quality of their offense.

in any case i agree with the other guy who said that camby is the one that makes them special. Sure, he isnt going to lead the to the 1st seed with his injury problems, but if he makes it to the playoffs in good shape these guys will be extremely difficult to beat and a very tough matchup for us specifically- AI can keep up with parker and trade baskets with him; JR smith can keep manu busy and off AI; Melo gives bruce problems; and they have enough depth and strength at the frontcourt to foul tim, crowd out our penetration, and outrebound oberto, horry and elson. If we beat them it will take a huge effort esp. from the big 3 and pop out-coaching karl.

[NBA Junkie]

In terms of getting that title?

If the gel are they better than the Mavs and Suns?

:lmao

[Texas_Ranger]

Hell no!

[SAGambler]

It's too soon to say but they are really good on the paper

Yeah....Enron looked good on paper also...See how that worked out.

I just don't see it....Two players who think they are "the man" on one team. Usually spells disaster.

[mountainballer]

It's too soon to say but they are really good on the paper with :
- Two of the best offensive players in the league (melo and AI)
- A good shooter who will be often wide open (JR Smith)
- A strong and solid big men rotation (Nene, najera, Evans) around one of the best defensive big man in the league (Camby)
- A player who cna scored points from the bench (Boykins)
- Two young players who can help a little (Diawara and Kleiza)
- A good coach

It's scary.

no doubt, this team looks good.

this would mean that Spurs should think of some moves to improve their perimeter defense.
Vaughn as an additional option won't do it, especially since he doesn't play at all.
Beno, Barry and Finley can pretty much be ignored when talking about perimeter defense.
and Spurs can't afford that Manu and Tony spend all energy on defending AI and Smith.
a big PG, who can also guard the SG will be needed more than ever.
(I'm sure Pop was thinking of such a player when he for example tried to trade Beno for Jarret Jack in 2005)
Spurs should explore what it would take to get for example Charly Bell from the Bucks. or maybe Keyon Dooling from the Magic.
or Luther Head from the Rockets. (who isn't exactly a look down defender, but getting better in this area)
other players like Jannero Pargo, Daniel Ewing, Jason Hart come to my mind.
(I would also mention this player....agrr, Antonio Daniels in this regard, if he didn't cost way to much anyhow)

[Bruno]

Spurs can't afford that Manu and Tony spend all energy on defending AI and Smith.
a big PG, who can also guard the SG will be needed more than ever.


I don't get at all your point.
Against who do you want that Manu/Tony defend ? Melo ? Denver's bigs ?
Do you realize that in playoff, Iverson will play something like 45 mpg. And you want that Spurs backup PG defend the opposite SG. Who will defend Iverson (or Boykins) then ?
If Beno can't defend at all on Boykins/Iverson, Spurs need a small and quick PG like Vaughn.

[mabber]

no doubt, this team looks good.

this would mean that Spurs should think of some moves to improve their perimeter defense.
Vaughn as an additional option won't do it, especially since he doesn't play at all.
Beno, Barry and Finley can pretty much be ignored when talking about perimeter defense.
and Spurs can't afford that Manu and Tony spend all energy on defending AI and Smith.
a big PG, who can also guard the SG will be needed more than ever.
(I'm sure Pop was thinking of such a player when he for example tried to trade Beno for Jarret Jack in 2005)
Spurs should explore what it would take to get for example Charly Bell from the Bucks. or maybe Keyon Dooling from the Magic.
or Luther Head from the Rockets. (who isn't exactly a look down defender, but getting better in this area)
other players like Jannero Pargo, Daniel Ewing, Jason Hart come to my mind.
(I would also mention this player....agrr, Antonio Daniels in this regard, if he didn't cost way to much anyhow)

The Spurs don't need to react to this trade. Nor do the Mavs or Suns.

[JPB]

The Spurs don't need to react to this trade. Nor do the Mavs or Suns.

No they don't.

[VaSpursFan]

In terms of getting that title?

If the gel are they better than the Mavs and Suns?

no. i really don't think the addition of AI will cause us many problems. i like how we match up. Camby/Duncan. melo/bruce. ai/tony. smith/manu. nene/elberto. i think we'll win any 7 games series against this squad because our bench is stronger.

[mountainballer]

I don't get at all your point.
Against who do you want that Manu/Tony defend ? Melo ? Denver's bigs ?
Do you realize that in playoff, Iverson will play something like 45 mpg. And you want that Spurs backup PG defend the opposite SG. Who will defend Iverson (or Boykins) then ?
If Beno can't defend at all on Boykins/Iverson, Spurs need a small and quick PG like Vaughn.

common. please don't try to make me look like an idiot. of course I don't think that Manu and Tony defend Melo or whoever.
I was talking of a player in the backcourt rotation, who can provide defense at both guard spots. neither Manu nor Tony will play the mentioned 45 minutes.
(and if they have to, it is not a good sign at all). In the current back-court rotation we have two players in Brent and Beno, who couldn't even think of help defending AI and JR when they go hot. I know that Vaughn was aquired to help out on defense in the first place. but do you think he will really be able to play a significant role, if he doesn't play at all in the regular season?

[Bruno]

I was talking of a player in the backcourt rotation, who can provide defense at both guard spots.

Smith is 6'6", 220lbs.
Iverson is 6'0", 165lbs.
Boykins is 5'5", 133lbs.

I don't see the use of a big PG, Smith is a big SG and I rather use a legit SG to defend him. Iverson and Boykins are both small PGs.



I know that Vaughn was aquired to help out on defense in the first place. but do you think he will really be able to play a significant role, if he doesn't play at all in the regular season?

Yes. Vaughn will be able to play solid D on Iverson or Boykins even if he hasn't played for months : he is a vet with a great work ethic. Remember Mike Wilks against Boykins in 05.

[mountainballer]

I don't see the use of a big PG, Smith is a big SG and I rather use a legit SG to defend him.


as we learned lately, in the case of Smith even a very undersized PG is enough to ...ehhh...stop him ;)

next try. Bruce will be working to capacity defending Melo.
Manu will defend Smith. do we want Manu to be the only option to do this?
Brent and Finley will look even older when trying.
I'm a fan of having a quick and good defending combo guard on the roster. (not particular just when playing the Nuggets, such a player also would have been crucial in the Dallas series last year). I think all the mentioned players more or less meet this describtion.

[wildbill2u]

Man the West just keeps on getting tougher by the day. :bang They oughta let the division champions of the West battle for the NBA championship and forget about the East. Look at their pathetic records.

Meanwhile Forget Denver. Did anyone notice that the SUNS have now won 15 Straight? :wakeup

Amare scored 28 with 10 rebounds in 28 minutes last night and Nash is picking teams apart as usual. I posted earlier that I didn't think Amare would be so good so soon, but here he comes.

I don't care if all those Suns' wins were against the Little Sisters of Perpetual PMS, a string of victories like that shows consistency, daily effort, and concentration.

How many times have we seen the Spurs lose because of some failure in one of those attibutes, especially in B to Bs?

What a dogfight the Western Conference playoff are going to be. I guess it will be fun to watch as a basketball fan, but I hope I don't have a heart attack.:hungry:

[VaSpursFan]

as we learned lately, in the case of Smith even a very undersized PG is enough to ...ehhh...stop him ;)

next try. Bruce will be working to capacity defending Melo.
Manu will defend Smith. do we want Manu to be the only option to do this?
Brent and Finley will look even older when trying.
I'm a fan of having a quick and good defending combo guard on the roster. (not particular just when playing the Nuggets, such a player also would have been crucial in the Dallas series last year). I think all the mentioned players more or less meet this describtion.

our defensive scheme is based on staying in front of your man or funneling him baseline into the bigs. it's good enough to handle denver. you keep any opponent out of the paint and turn them into a jump shooting team, i like our chances.

[mabber]

our defensive scheme is based on staying in front of your man or funneling him baseline into the bigs. it's good enough to handle denver. you keep any opponent out of the paint and turn them into a jump shooting team, i like our chances.

Yeah, a big reason that Dallas got by the Spurs last year was that Parker was hurt and couldn't stay in front of his man (mostly Harris).

[Bruno]

next try. Bruce will be working to capacity defending Melo.
Manu will defend Smith. do we want Manu to be the only option to do this?
Brent and Finley will look even older when trying.

I find that you overrate Smith and you underrate Barry/Finley. Smith isn't Kobe and even if Barry/Finley aren't the greatest defenders in the league, they are good enough to do a decent job on players like Smith.
If you don't want to use Barry/Finley against Denver because Smith is a too good offensive player for them, they won't play at all in playoff because almost all playoffs teams have at least 2 SG/SF as good as Smith on the offensive end.
If there is something that you can fear against Nuggets, it's the lack of a long/strong SF able to handle Melo when Bruce is in foul trouble or on the bench. I'm not worried at all by Smith.



I'm a fan of having a quick and good defending combo guard on the roster. (not particular just when playing the Nuggets, such a player also would have been crucial in the Dallas series last year). I think all the mentioned players more or less meet this describtion.

I find that Spurs are fine at PG/SG on the defensive end.
At PG : Parker will play 38mpg and he isn't a bad defender. Vaughn is a good defender too and can be usefull if Beno stuggles.
At SG : Manu is a good defender and Bruce (who isn't more a SF than a SG) is a great defender.

[ambchang]

The biggest problem is that the West would be so beat up by the time their reach the finals, the East's representative will have an easier time dealing with them. That's my theory for the Heat's victory over the Mavs last year, at least.

[mabber]

The biggest problem is that the West would be so beat up by the time their reach the finals, the East's representative will have an easier time dealing with them. That's my theory for the Heat's victory over the Mavs last year, at least.

I don't buy that at all. The Mavs really didn't play in any physical series in the west last year. The Spurs series was a long, tightly contested series but it wasn't that physical. There really wasn't a lot of defense being played by either the Mavs or even the Spurs in that series. The Suns series was the normal run & gun type series that you'd expect to play against them.

The Mavs just didn't adjust very well to the adjustments that the Heat made. They weren't tired. They just blew it and ran into a very hot Wade.

[itzsoweezee]

nothing's changed for the spurs. the big four are still spurs, mavs, suns. denver, houston, and the jazz can battle it out for the four spot.

[JamStone]

I think Denver is a factor, when they were not before the trade. And, they could be a possible suprise team in the playoffs. They won't be an easy out, if anything.

Right now, to me, it's still Dallas, San Antonio, and Phoenix.

I personally think Dallas is the best team in the Western Conference right now. And, I think Phoenix is pretty strong as well. San Antonio's experience, coaching, and basketball IQ as a team will continue to make them sure contenders. But, I just think that Dallas and Phoenix are better teams.

That being said, I wouldn't be surprised if any of those three make it to the NBA Finals.

Denver and the Lakers are probably the dark horses. They could upset any of those teams, but they still will likely not make it to the NBA Finals.

[Cant_Be_Faded]

Iverson + Boykins = Nugget Greatness

[wildbill2u]

Heard Mario Ellie on a Houston sports radio interview today. He said Phoenix has the best six players in the league.

When the playoffs come and the coaches shorten the rotations, I wonder if their six-7 can beat our six-7 roster.

[mavsfan1000]

Yeah, a big reason that Dallas got by the Spurs last year was that Parker was hurt and couldn't stay in front of his man (mostly Harris).
I never noticed Parker being hurt. Maybe he was worn down a little by Sacramento but I didn't see him bothered except slightly in game 2. I would be hurt to if I had chase Devin Harris all over the place. The guy is fast. Game 3 he was 100% again.