The Massacre Has Begun...

[Nbadan]

What would Jesus do? Level a city of innocent civilians?


The Psychopaths and Fallujah Resistance

By Ghali Hassan

11/06/04 "ICH" -- As the hubris of the American election is passed, the people of Fallujah are under new massive US assault. The world “only” superpower is posed to flatten the city of 300,000 people in order to pacify (kill) its citizens because of their opposition to US Occupation. This new massacre is sold by the Bush Administration and mainstream Western media as a “necessary step to hold election” in Iraq.

The US took over the main hospital and converted to a military hospital. In other words, the people of Fallujah no longer have a hospital to treat injured men, women and children. The US Occupation forces are currently preventing men of age 14-60 years from leaving the city. It is a crime against humanity to massacre unarmed civilians. US forces are also preventing journalists from entering the city to report on the ongoing massacre of innocent civilians.

As I write, the BBC reports that the US strikes on the centre of Fallujah have completely destroyed the Nazzal Emergency Hospital in the centre of the city. There are no reports on casualties of a criminal attack on a hospital in the centre of the city. Can you imagine this happening in Manchester or Boston?

In April 2004, the first US massive attacks on Fallujah killed more than 1300 Iraqis, mostly innocent women and children, reported by AFP. The heroic Iraqi Resistance forced the Marines to capitulate, and Fallujah became the symbol of Iraqi Resistance to US Occupation.
(more)

Information Clearing House (http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article7233.htm)

With the main forces having melted away days ago, before the U.S. bother to seal off the city, what's left are defenders who voluntarily stayed to defend the city of Fallujah, does this remind anyone else of a famous historical occurrence in SA?

[whottt]

Don't be upset Dan, the terrorists might win this war yet...

[Useruser666]

What would Jesus do? Level a city of innocent civilians?



Information Clearing House (http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article7233.htm)

With the main forces having melted away days ago, before the U.S. bother to seal off the city, what's left are defenders who voluntarily stayed to defend the city of Fallujah, does this remind anyone else of a famous historical occurrence in SA?

I'm sorry but, HOLY FUCK!!!!!!!!!!! You are comparing the battle of the Alamo to the terrorists holding out behind women and children?!!!!!!!!!! Dan this post totally proves to me what type of person you are. You may at one point in your life been born of noble ideals, but something very powerful has warped your sense of right and wrong. With statements like this, I know it is futile to have any further discussion with you about anything. Change your name to PoliticalDan.

[CrazyOne]

Another relevant fact - this city of 300,000 is down to about 50,000 because most of the actual residents already left some time ago.

[2pac]

We also have been dropping notes on the city for some time telling the people to leave in order to save their lives.



What would Jesus do? Level a city of innocent civilians?

Genesis 19:1-29
Genesis 19


Sodom and Gomorrah Destroyed

1 The two angels arrived at Sodom in the evening, and Lot was sitting in the gateway of the city. When he saw them, he got up to meet them and bowed down with his face to the ground. 2 "My lords," he said, "please turn aside to your servant's house. You can wash your feet and spend the night and then go on your way early in the morning."
"No," they answered, "we will spend the night in the square."
3 But he insisted so strongly that they did go with him and entered his house. He prepared a meal for them, baking bread without yeast, and they ate. 4 Before they had gone to bed, all the men from every part of the city of Sodom-both young and old-surrounded the house. 5 They called to Lot, "Where are the men who came to you tonight? Bring them out to us so that we can have sex with them."
6 Lot went outside to meet them and shut the door behind him 7 and said, "No, my friends. Don't do this wicked thing. 8 Look, I have two daughters who have never slept with a man. Let me bring them out to you, and you can do what you like with them. But don't do anything to these men, for they have come under the protection of my roof."
9 "Get out of our way," they replied. And they said, "This fellow came here as an alien, and now he wants to play the judge! We'll treat you worse than them." They kept bringing pressure on Lot and moved forward to break down the door.
10 But the men inside reached out and pulled Lot back into the house and shut the door. 11 Then they struck the men who were at the door of the house, young and old, with blindness so that they could not find the door.
12 The two men said to Lot, "Do you have anyone else here-sons-in-law, sons or daughters, or anyone else in the city who belongs to you? Get them out of here, 13 because we are going to destroy this place. The outcry to the LORD against its people is so great that he has sent us to destroy it."
14 So Lot went out and spoke to his sons-in-law, who were pledged to marry [1] his daughters. He said, "Hurry and get out of this place, because the LORD is about to destroy the city!" But his sons-in-law thought he was joking.
15 With the coming of dawn, the angels urged Lot, saying, "Hurry! Take your wife and your two daughters who are here, or you will be swept away when the city is punished."
16 When he hesitated, the men grasped his hand and the hands of his wife and of his two daughters and led them safely out of the city, for the LORD was merciful to them. 17 As soon as they had brought them out, one of them said, "Flee for your lives! Don't look back, and don't stop anywhere in the plain! Flee to the mountains or you will be swept away!"
18 But Lot said to them, "No, my lords, [2] please! 19 Your [3] servant has found favor in your [4] eyes, and you [5] have shown great kindness to me in sparing my life. But I can't flee to the mountains; this disaster will overtake me, and I'll die. 20 Look, here is a town near enough to run to, and it is small. Let me flee to it-it is very small, isn't it? Then my life will be spared."
21 He said to him, "Very well, I will grant this request too; I will not overthrow the town you speak of. 22 But flee there quickly, because I cannot do anything until you reach it." (That is why the town was called Zoar. [6] )
23 By the time Lot reached Zoar, the sun had risen over the land. 24 Then the LORD rained down burning sulfur on Sodom and Gomorrah-from the LORD out of the heavens. 25 Thus he overthrew those cities and the entire plain, including all those living in the cities-and also the vegetation in the land. 26 But Lot's wife looked back, and she became a pillar of salt.
27 Early the next morning Abraham got up and returned to the place where he had stood before the LORD . 28 He looked down toward Sodom and Gomorrah, toward all the land of the plain, and he saw dense smoke rising from the land, like smoke from a furnace.
29 So when God destroyed the cities of the plain, he remembered Abraham, and he brought Lot out of the catastrophe that overthrew the cities where Lot had lived.




I have no problem destroying Sodom and Fallujah.

[bigzak25]

who's side are you on Dan?

it's not Freedom's side. It's not America's side. Was Saddam in your pocket too?

[Hook Dem]

Thats what Jesus would do Dan!!!!!! You asked and you got the answer.

[samikeyp]

You should change your name to "IraqiDan" its clear which side you are on. I know you are pissed because W won but to turn against your own country. I long for the day when traitors like you were shot.

[bigzak25]

besides Dan, didn't you want Bush to stop being mr. diplomacy and finally take the gloves off? I know I did....and nobody ever said war was pretty. Reading on Fox News that even more loyalists with Al Qaida ties are coming in from Iran through the mountains....

if fox news knows this, i'm sure our Gov't does.....could be the makings of something beautiful...killing all the cockroaches in one fell swoop. And why are they sending all their people to fight the Americans? Why do they want to stop Freedom? Why do they want to keep the elections in a FREE Iraq from happening? Because there propaganda war will goto shit. Speaking of propaganda wars going to shit....carry on with your postings....

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

he BBC reports that the US strikes on the centre of Fallujah have completely destroyed the Nazzal Emergency Hospital in the centre of the city

Said hospital was being used by the militants as a base. Try again.

Dan, you forgot to mention the people who have left the city showing our troops on a map where their houses are, telling the troops the insurgents have taken abandoned houses for use in bases, and asking our troops to bomb their houses because they want the militants dead and their city back.

You know what's fucking pathetic? God help us all, but the day AQ deploys a WMD here in the US, Dan will be throwing a party celebrating.

I hope we do have a draft next year, just in the hope your candy ass gets drafted.

[JFK]

Pray for our troops, and lets go in there and hit these sons of bitches and stomp them out!!!! enough of this pussyfooting with them, we've been sitting around and letting them dictate everything over there, now lets go in there and kick them in the ass and destroy them

btw this thread is ridiculous

[Hook Dem]

Pray for our troops, and lets go in there and hit these sons of bitches and stomp them out!!!! enough of this pussyfooting with them, we've been sitting around and letting them dictate everything over there, now lets go in there and kick them in the ass and destroy them

btw this thread is ridiculous
JFK.....you're a good American! Thanks!

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Like my dad said this morning... "we've given them two chances, third time's the charm, and the US Marines are doing the charming."

Hoo-rah!

[Nbadan]

The xenophobia in this thread is very evident. Yes, our marines will win this battle because it is what they do best, but the battle of Fallujah could, for the insurgents and their supporters, be the eventual cry to battle that starts Bush's Jihad in the Middle East and disrupts the whole region. All of you are fools if you think that the Iraq war is just a Iraq problem, as we are finding out now, this war has grown well beyond that now. We are starting World War 3.

[Useruser666]

The xenophobia in this thread is very evident. Yes, our marines will win this battle because it is what they do best, but the battle of Fallujah could, for the insurgents and their supporters, be the eventual cry to battle that starts Bush's Jihad in the Middle East and disrupts the whole region. All of you are fools if you think that the Iraq war is just a Iraq problem, as we are finding out now, this war has grown well beyond that now. We are starting World War 3.

No one said this was just a war in Iraq. I don't think anyone ever thought that, so maybe you are the one who is finding that out. WW3 Dan?? Come on, give a rest already.

[Yonivore]

I just want to know what Jesus is gonna do to Nbadanallah...

[Nbadan]

Hey folks, this is the stuff great military defeats are made of. Your falling for the spin if you think the battle of Fallujah is gonna have a calming effect in the rest of Iraq and our troops are gonna be coming home anytime soon. It's not gonna happen, especially if there is great loss of innocent life in the battle to take the city.

[bigzak25]

dan, for all we know, insurgents are keeping women and children hostage so that ther can be a loss of innocent life.....they play the propaganda war just like you do. it's the only way they can win.

[Nbadan]

Your a fool. You honestly think that the insurgents want to see their families massacred? Are you really that warped? Where is your rationalization?

[2pac]

Your a fool. You honestly think that the insurgents want to see their families massacred? Are you really that warped? Where is your rationalization?

If they wanted them to not be killed, they would have moved them out of Fallujah. There have been messages to the residents of Fallujah for a while that we are about to attack. If civilians remain there and are killed, it is their own fault.

We are bending over backwards by telling them where we are going to strike. Not exactly the typical way of doing things. We are making more than enough concessions to keep civilians safe.

[Nbadan]

We have threatened all men under 40 with automatic arrest if they try to leave the City. We have attacked the only hospitals in the city (war crime?). All the real insurgents left the city days ago before the U.S. sealed it off.

[2pac]

We have threatened all men under 40 with automatic arrest if they try to leave the City. We have attacked the only hospitals in the city (war crime?). All the real insurgents left the city days ago before the U.S. sealed it off.

A hospital is fair game when it is a military base.

Please show links to the insurgents leaving.

[Clandestino]

dan, most of the insurgents aren't even iraqi... and the u.s. military is not trying to kill civilians. the terrorists are. seriously, you should go fight on the side of the terrorists if you feel so strongly about their cause. you will end up like john walker lindh.

[Nbadan]

Since when is a hospital a legitimate military target? Especially a civilian hospital? Where is your proof that this hospital was being used as a base against the teachings of Islam?

[bigzak25]

so would you suggest that we just let the insurgents pretending to be innocent men walk out of the city to set up in mosul or wherever the next insurgent stronghold is determined to be?

of couse they should be arrested. let the innocents point out the criminals and the rest can walk.

[Useruser666]

Dan = Enemy Combatant

[1369]

We have attacked the only hospitals in the city (war crime?).

The ROE state that if any facility(Hospital/Church/Mosque) is being used as a staging area by insurgents/terrorists, it no longer has a protected status.

By the way, after the hospital was secured, the Marines brought in doctors and supplies.


After the operation, the 1st Marine Expeditionary Forces' 4th Civil Affairs Group "brought in a medical assessment team and medical supplies provided by the World Health Organization and the Iraqi interim government."

The military said hospitals "are recognized as protected structures; however, when they are used for military purposes they lose that protected status."

[Nbadan]

dan, most of the insurgents aren't even iraqi... and the u.s. military is not trying to kill civilians. the terrorists are. seriously, you should go fight on the side of the terrorists if you feel so strongly about their cause. you will end up like john walker lindh.

The U.S. military is the single great threat to Iraqi civilians. Yes, the insurgents have killed some innocent civilians, but we've killed much more and for what? To liberate them? What if the French resistance had turned on its American liberators during WW2? Would it still have been a liberation or occupation?

[2pac]

Since when is a hospital a legitimate military target? Especially a civilian hospital? Where is your proof that this hospital was being used as a base against the teachings of Islam?

Since the insurgants took up in it to hide, thinking that we wouldnt destroy it. They made it a HQ, and we destroyed it. Good idea on thier part (just like Saddam put women and children in his palaces so we wouldnt destroy them in the first gulf war.

[Nbadan]

Dan = Enemy Combatant

:flipoff

If being a enemy combatant equates to speaking out against this immoral war then I am guilty and so are 56 million other Americans.

If you believe in this war so much why aren't you putting your ass on the line for your beliefs? All talk?

[Clandestino]

The U.S. military is the single great threat to Iraqi civilians. Yes, the insurgents have killed some innocent civilians, but we've killed much more and for what? To liberate them? What if the French resistance had turned on its American liberators during WW2? Would it still have been a liberation or occupation?

now, i truly believe you are not american. where are you from for real. if you believe the u.s. military is the greatest threat to iraqi civilians...

what if, schmat ifs... they didn't, they knew we helped them..

but now, the iraqi people aren't turning against us..it is the terrorists from other countries...

as a former military member i take great offense to you saying the u.s. military is the greatest threat to this... so FUCK YOU and if you have any children I feel terribly sorry they have a father as fucked up as you.

[2pac]

:flipoff

If being a enemy combatant equates to speaking out against this immoral war then I am guilty and so are 56 million other Americans.

If you believe in this war so much why aren't you putting your ass on the line for your beliefs? All talk?

Not everyone can be front line. For every soldier on the front lines, there is something like 12 that arent.

And while these men and women are fighting for America, people need to be back at home running America.

If a time came when my country needed my services (draft came up) I would gladly pick up my weapon and fight for the values I believe in.

[Nbadan]

We have killed 100,000+ Iraqis. 10x more than all the mass graves we have found from Saddams 30 years of sadistic rule. We are worse than Saddam.

[2pac]

Link to the numbers we have killed?

http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2004/10/13/1097607255864.html?oneclick=true

Saddam killed over 300,000 in his 24 years.

[CrazyOne]

That is out and out BS... what nether region did you pick that number from?

[Nbadan]

If a time came when my country needed my services (draft came up) I would gladly pick up my weapon and fight for the values I believe in.

Why wait? The country needs you now. We have a back door draft that is unfairly keeping troops in Iraq that clearly don't want to be there. If this is a war you really believe in then put your actions where your words are and go fight for your President.

[Useruser666]

:flipoff

If being a enemy combatant equates to speaking out against this immoral war then I am guilty and so are 56 million other Americans.

If you believe in this war so much why aren't you putting your ass on the line for your beliefs? All talk?

Oh sure, question me if I am not in the military. Funny thing is how the people who post here who are in military called your bullshit already and yet you still don't get a clue. No one can reason with you, because when you can no longer make up a retort with a straight face you jump to some other new found thread of lunacy. Be my guest, believe what you want. Shout it at the top of your lungs, but do yourself a favor and maybe listen to some one else for a while.

[bigzak25]

We are worse than Saddam.



what's this "we" shit? are you french? (oui)

you are not one of us. you are against us. your backbone is limper than clinton after a lewinsky....

[Nbadan]

The desertion of the Iraqi army have begun..


From AP story: Thousands of U.S. Troops Storm Fallujah

Another issue is the role of Iraqi forces fighting alongside the Americans. A National Public Radio correspondent embedded with the Marines outside Fallujah reported desertions among the Iraqis. One Iraqi battalion shrunk from over 500 men down to 170 over the past two week _ with 255 members quitting over the weekend, the correspondent said.

DC (http://www.dunnconnect.com/articles/2004/11/03/ap/headlines/d867rk1g1.txt)

[Clandestino]

Why wait? The country needs you now. We have a back door draft that is unfairly keeping troops in Iraq that clearly don't want to be there. If this is a war you really believe in then put your actions where your words are and go fight for your President.

NO SUCH THING AS A BACKDOOR DRAFT...

you know going in you are VOLUNTEERING for 8 years of service.

[2pac]

Why wait? The country needs you now. We have a back door draft that is unfairly keeping troops in Iraq that clearly don't want to be there. If this is a war you really believe in then put your actions where your words are and go fight for your President.

How many soldiers WANT to be there. When you sign up for the military, you know that you could be signing up for extended periods of time at war. That is part of the job. This isnt the cub scouts, this is the best military in the world.

My country needs me to be where I am best suited, and right now, that is at my current position. The men and women over there are trained specifically for that. If there was a mass exodus of people from their jobs into the military, there would be a huge problem with the economy because adept workers would be pulled out of their positions.

Right now, we are not in a stage of war where this is needed. If we get to the place where I would be more valuable with a gun than with a pen, then I would be happy to go.

[Nbadan]

Funny thing is how the people who post here who are in military called your bullshit already and yet you still don't get a clue. No one can reason with you, because when you can no longer make up a retort with a straight face you jump to some other new found thread of lunacy. Be my guest, believe what you want. Shout it at the top of your lungs, but do yourself a favor and maybe listen to some one else for a while.

Who here has served in the military recently? Certainly not you. So that qualifies you to tell me what is right and what is wrong in US. foreign policy? What are your credentials? I know more about the Middle East than you can hope to learn before this war is over. You know nothing. You are nothing but an American elitest propped by blind nationalism and ego.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Hey folks, this is the stuff great military defeats are made of.

Actually, Admiral Halsey (WWII in the Pacific) said the key to military victory is to kill so many of them they no longer want to fight.



We have attacked the only hospitals in the city (war crime?).


They were being used as bases for the insurgency, and their assault was lead by Iraqis.



All the real insurgents left the city days ago before the U.S. sealed it off.


Who is fighting us then dumbfuck?



Since when is a hospital a legitimate military target? Especially a civilian hospital? Where is your proof that this hospital was being used as a base against the teachings of Islam?


http://apnews.myway.com/article/20041108/D867RMM81.html


Casey said that U.S. troops had secured a hospital used as a staging area by Sunni insurgents and two bridges across the Euphrates River. One of the bridges was where Iraqis hung the charred bodies of at least two of four American contractors last March.

Wanna try again dumbass?

BTW, explain this whole "base against the teachings of Islam thing" for me please. I wanna hear this one.

[Nbadan]

NO SUCH THING AS A BACKDOOR DRAFT...

Tell that to the thousands of troops who have had their combat tours extended and watch how fast he stuffs a gernade up your ass.

[bigzak25]

what would Kerry do dan?

[2pac]

Tell that to the thousands of troops who have had their combat tours extended and watch how fast he stuffs a gernade up your ass.

You do realize that these men AGREED TO BE IN THE MILITARY FOR THIS TIME PERIOD?

[Nbadan]

Casey said that U.S. troops had secured a hospital used as a staging area by Sunni insurgents and two bridges across the Euphrates River. One of the bridges was where Iraqis hung the charred bodies of at least two of four American contractors last March.

Yeah, I blindly believe our adminstration. God knows how those WMD and Mobile labs worked out.

:lol

[2pac]

Yeah, I blindly believe our adminstration. God knows how those WMD and Mobile labs worked out.

:lol

Casey isnt in the administration, dumbass.

[Nbadan]

You do realize that these men AGREED TO BE IN THE MILITARY FOR THIS TIME PERIOD?

And you do realize that we are bound to not use our troops in combat unless the freedom and liberties of our nation is in danger? Where is the danger to you or me by fighting Iraqi's defending their own country?

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

If you believe in this war so much why aren't you putting your ass on the line for your beliefs? All talk?

Why don't you put your ass on the line for what you believe? I will pony up airfare for you to Baghdad, you can go find some of those insurgents and help speak out against America. Fair?


Who here has served in the military recently? Certainly not you. So that qualifies you to tell me what is right and what is wrong in US. foreign policy? What are your credentials?

Have you? So how does that qualify you to say what's right and wrong? Why don't we ask gophergeorge what's going on, what his take is? He's over there in the middle of it, certainly a lot closer than your pansy Osama loving ass.


I know more about the Middle East than you can hope to learn before this war is over.

Spare me. You don't know a fucking thing salon doesn't tell you. I could dance circles around your ass on the Mideast. You know about as much as John Kerry, which isn't saying much.



You know nothing. You are nothing but an American elitest propped by blind nationalism and ego.

:lmao I read this from you, and all I can think of is...

http://www.welovetheiraqiinformationminister.com/images/07-minister.jpg

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Tell that to the thousands of troops who have had their combat tours extended and watch how fast he stuffs a gernade up your ass.

78% of the military voted for GWB. Next.

[Clandestino]

Tell that to the thousands of troops who have had their combat tours extended and watch how fast he stuffs a gernade up your ass.

There is nothing to tell them... THEY ALREADY KNOW... I was in the military. I knew my active duty contract was on 4 1/2 years, but that when I got out I could still be called back within the next 3 1/2 years if my country needed me. They didn't, so I am now no longer obligated to them.

The only person who would be getting anything shoved up their ass would be you since you would have to tell him he is in the job of killing innocent civilians.

[2pac]

And you do realize that we are bound to not use our troops in combat unless the freedom and liberties of our nation is in danger? Where is the danger to you or me by fighting Iraqi's defending their own country?

Link to first statement.

How was America in danger when we invaded Somilia (Clinton)

How was America in danger when we invaded Vietnam (LBJ/JFK)

How was America in danger from the Germans when we declared war on them (Japanese attacked us, not Germany, no matter what Bluto says.) (FDR)

How was America in danger when we invaded the Yugoslovian region (Clinton)


Note: All had Dem presidents.

[Clandestino]

Why don't you put your ass on the line for what you believe? I will pony up airfare for you to Baghdad, you can go find some of those insurgents and help speak out against America. Fair?

I'd pitch in! The terrorists would love you. Right before they cut your head off they fuck you in the ass a few thousand times you little pansy.

[samikeyp]

What do you care about the military anyway Dan? You have shown your disdain for the troops already in this forum. You don't like the war in Iraq so I am sure you cheer everytime a soldier gets killed.

[Yonivore]

Dear Kori:

Please do us (and Nbadanallah) a favor and change his subtitle to "Insurgent Minister of Information."

Thank you.
http://www.welovetheiraqiinformationminister.com/images/07-minister.jpg

[samikeyp]

^^^ :lmao

[Drachen]

Dear Kori:

Please do us (and Nbadanallah) a favor and change his subtitle to "Insurgent Minister of Information."

Thank you.
http://www.welovetheiraqiinformationminister.com/images/07-minister.jpg


Interesting that you are referring to him as a deity.

[Yonivore]

Interesting that you are referring to him as a deity.
Isn't he?

[Hook Dem]

Dan ....please post a pic of yourself. Anyone having your views has got to be a raghead posing as an American.

[RobinsontoDuncan]

Ok so i guess now americans are ok with the mass murder of a people who oppose our presensce in their country, do you people realize how fucked up that sounds, "yeah, well if they dont want to die they should just like our occupation of their country damn it, we're americans and we have a fucking mandate to do whatever the hell we want whenever then hell we want to" americans are so fucking stupid, god the people who responded to this ought to be taken out to a shed and shot for stupidity, you stupid superiority complex toting morons. I am embarrased to consider myself an american right now, and you should too.

[RobinsontoDuncan]

What do you care about the military anyway Dan? You have shown your disdain for the troops already in this forum. You don't like the war in Iraq so I am sure you cheer everytime a soldier gets killed.


oh see there is that bush brainwashing, if you dont like blood-for-oil you must be against our troops, you moron he wants to pull them out to save their damn lives

[RobinsontoDuncan]

Reading on Fox News that even more loyalists with Al Qaida ties are coming in from Iran through the mountains....

if fox news knows this, i'm sure our Gov't does.......


wow what are realibale, non-biased source, you really are smart :lol

[Hook Dem]

oh see there is that bush brainwashing, if you dont like blood-for-oil you must be against our troops, you moron he wants to pull them out to save their damn lives
Come on Dan....quit posting under someone elses title.

[Drachen]

Ok so i guess now americans are ok with the mass murder of a people who oppose our presensce in their country, do you people realize how fucked up that sounds, "yeah, well if they dont want to die they should just like our occupation of their counrty damn it, we're americans and we have a fucking mandate to do whatever the hell we want whenever then hell we want to" americans are so fucking stupid, god the people who responded to this ought to be taken out to a shed and shot for stupidity, you stupid superiority complex toting morons. I am embarrased to consider myself an american right now, and you should too.

You spelled embarassed wrong . . . stupid. :p

[nadabN]

I am embarrased to consider myself an american right now

Then don't. That wasn't hard.


and you should too.

Never ever you little sell out bitch.

[RobinsontoDuncan]

real argumentation is a skill so few on the right actually posses, but if name calling and ignoring the substance of my arguments is all you are capable of, then at least you are using your cranium for something.

[CrazyOne]

The title of Moron truly belongs to anyone spouting the "blood for oil" bullcaca...

[nadabN]

real argumentation is a skill so few

Your skill is awe inspiring. I get goosebumps when I read your posts.

[Jimcs50]

Dan, a wise man once said, "When one finds oneself in a hole, stop digging."

[RobinsontoDuncan]

I am not dan My Name is Chris and i have had this account for some time, i simply side on the side of reason, the same side you choose Jim because you yourself said you want american troops out of iraq.

[Jimcs50]

I am not dan My Name is Chris and i have had this account for some time, i simply side on the side of reason, the same side you choose Jim because you yourself said you want american troops out of iraq.


I am a realist, the only way we get out is to anihilate the insurgents once and for all. The sooner they die, the faster we get our troops home.

[Hook Dem]

I am not dan My Name is Chris and i have had this account for some time, i simply side on the side of reason, the same side you choose Jim because you yourself said you want american troops out of iraq.
It is not a bad thing to side on the side of reason but to side with someone like Dan is a move toward lunacy.

[Drachen]

It is not a bad thing to side on the side of reason but to side with someone like Dan is a move toward lunacy.


But reality kinda sucks, so maybe lunacy would be a nice vacation.

[RobinsontoDuncan]

im not siding with dan because of anything about him, im siding with him because on this particular issue i feel he is absolutley right, im tipping my hat to you Nbadan, nice call

[Shelly]

God help us.

[RobinsontoDuncan]

you know what crazy one, i would like you to give me one good reason why we're there and then tell me if that reason would be enough for you to send your son or daughter out to war.

[Hook Dem]

I realize you're not talking to me RtoD, but for you to come in here and say"give me one good reason" when we have been here arguing this since the beginning and you just now decide to join us. Where have you been if you're so interested in all of this? Maybe we don't wish to rehash all of this. Your side lost and we are going to do it our way now. Just sit back and watch. Then you can come in and criticize the end result. I say all of this with due respect.

[JFK]

For whatever reason wrong or right, the boys are over there, and its all academic.
What happened in Vietnam ripped this country apart and i pray that it does not start again with this unpopular war. I have friends over there fighting in the 1st Cavalry out of Fort Hood. I hate to think any american villainizes them and has disdain for them like the insurgents do, because thats what it ammounts to.
for whatever reasons they're there and lets hope they come back its going to be bloody and its going to be hard but I will support the troops and now the president to help win that war. I hope it does not become another vietnam, maybe you can welcome the troops back from the ships and spit on them and go berate them.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

i guess now americans are ok with the mass murder of a people who oppose our presensce in their country,

Whoa whoa whoa. The people getting their asses handed to them in Fallujah are not Iraqis.

About 90% of those opposing us, particularly in Fallujah, come from the likes of Syria, Lebanon, Egypt, Saudi Arabia, etc.

I don't doubt there are some Iraqis in Fallujah, but they're the same fuckers who are killing the new Iraqi security forces. You know, the ones who are opposed to a free Iraq and were probably Republican Guard/Feyadeen Saddam under the rule of Hussein.

Sorry, I could give a damn if any of those guys get killed, hell I wouldn't piss on one of 'em if they were on fire.

Gotta disagree here RobinsontoDuncan. We aren't killing innocent Iraqis here, it's all the murderers who used to call Saddam boss, and all the transient mujaheideen who have heeded the calls of Osama and Zarqawi.

IMO, we can't ever kill enough of them.

[JFK]

^^^thats true, the real residents if they were smart evacuated and got the hell out of there
those staying behind are mostly...MOSTLY.. insurgents, fuck them they need to fucking kill those bastards and hang their heads on the tanks and grease the treads with their guts.

[samikeyp]

RtoD....first off, by saying that if someone disagrees with you is brain-washing then you are doing the name calling that you are accusing others of.

What I was referring to when I made that statement about Dan is when he told GopherGeorge, who just came back from Afghanistan serving our country..."shouldn't you be out playing GI Joe right now?" so yeah, when you insult someone who serves his country and puts his life on the line, I tend to get upset about that. Call that brainwashing if you will but you are wayyy off base. Here is the post...

11-05-2004, 02:44 PM #10
Nbadan
Down With NeoCons




Position: Dominant Center
Team: San Antonio Spurs
vBookie Cash: $25
Post Count: 5,442
Re: When W Won, We ALL Lost

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Fuck you Gopher, aren't you supposed to be off playing GI Joe somewhere?

"Don't you got some raghead to kill"

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Fuck you Gopher, aren't you supposed to be off playing GI Joe somewhere?

"Don't you got some raghead to kill"

You know, between this post above, Dan throwing around the term "fag" last week, and calling Marcus and I white crackers, I think Dan has proven to be the most (and only from what I've seen) racist mofo on this board.

[Yonivore]

"Ok so i guess now americans are ok with the mass murder of a people who oppose our presensce in their country,..."
All indications are that the Iraqi people are glad we're there and, they're looking forward to free and fair elections come January.

"...do you people realize how fucked up that sounds, "yeah, well if they dont want to die they should just like our occupation of their country damn it, we're americans and we have a fucking mandate to do whatever the hell we want whenever then hell we want to" americans are so fucking stupid, god the people who responded to this ought to be taken out to a shed and shot for stupidity, you stupid superiority complex toting morons. I am embarrased to consider myself an american right now, and you should too.
Boy, you got incoherent in a hurry.

[Nbadan]

Fuck you Gopher, aren't you supposed to be off playing GI Joe somewhere?

"Don't you got some raghead to kill"

What the hell does that have to do with you Mikey? If I wanna call GopherGeorge out isn't that between me and him? Let Gopher prove who he says he is and you STFU.

[Nbadan]

You know, between this post above, Dan throwing around the term "fag" last week, and calling Marcus and I white crackers, I think Dan has proven to be the most (and only from what I've seen) racist mofo on this board.

Marcus is an asshole, but what does that have to do with you? You sucking his dick now. See, that's the way Marcus is - he always leaves just when the party's getting started. Where is he now? Certainly not standing beside his man Bush just like he disappears when the Spurs start losing at the end of the season.

Many of you would learn a lot from Ghostwriter's enlightenment of Marcus Bryant over the years.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

I'm not sucking anyone's dick.

Sorry Danno, the day you called me a racist because of what school attended two months ago, you lost any hope of ever getting any respect from me. You damn near got banned by Kori for it, and I really wish you would have.

People who pull that bullshit don't get my respect, especially when they are talking out of their ass (like you were).

I could GAF about your dispute with Marcus, in all honesty.

So now gophergeorge has to prove who he is to? I'd love to see him show up in uniform at your doorstep one day, just to see you piss your pants when you opened the door.

Unfortunately, but thankfully, he's out defending this country so assholes like you can come be "cute" on message boards like this.

[samikeyp]

no dan because RtoD was saying I was brainwashed by what I said and I merely explained what I was saying.....and I have the same right to post as you do. You want me to shut the fuck up? shut me up.

[Nbadan]

Sorry Danno, the day you called me a racist because of what school attended two months ago, you lost any hope of ever getting any respect from me. You damn near got banned by Kori for it, and I really wish you would have

See, your fucked up. I never called you or anyone else a racists (well, until I called out Marcus today, but that's between him and I). I merely said that the points or legacy system system at A&M promoted racism since most of the allumi was caucasion. Obviously, the A&M regents agreed with me cause they promptly dropped the legacy system soon after.

[Nbadan]

no dan because RtoD was saying I was brainwashed by what I said and I merely explained what I was saying.....and I have the same right to post as you do. You want me to shut the fuck up? shut me up.

The day I hear about someone getting unfairly banned from this forum is the day I leave. You know me from The Spurs Dominion Mikey, I never banned anyone for speaking their mind.

[samikeyp]

actually I don't post at Spurs Dominion...and where did I say anything about banning?

[Nbadan]

You are brainwashed Mikey, I can read it in your posts and evidently so can R2D. Obviously, whoever this guy Chris is is wise beyond his years.

[samikeyp]

I was quoting what you said....how is that brainwashing? You were making shit up about me saying something about banning. Its ok if people disagree. It doesn't mean anyone is brainwashed. I still think its uncool to attack someone who volunteered to defend his country and risk his life.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

the A&M regents agreed with me cause they promptly dropped the legacy system soon after.

lol!

You were bitching about the legacy admissions in September. Our President, former CIA chief Bob Gates, did away with the legacy system last December.

Try again clown.

[Useruser666]

Sorry this is late but....

R2D, why do you believe everyone must send their sons or daughters off to war to understand what it's like to make a sacrafice? The military is voluntary. The fine men and women who serve in it are not stupid. They know the risks involved. They took those risks when they joined. My father served in the military, yet I have chosen a different path. If I was called upon to serve then I would. Sure you can question that, but since you know nothing about me you have no basis to do so.

Taking to a member of the military the way Dan has is pretty alarming. It's like telling a firefighter, "Don't you have any fires to put out?!"

[Hook Dem]

"R2D, why do you believe everyone must send their sons or daughters off to war to understand what it's like to make a sacrafice? The military is voluntary." ...............................I don't really know if RtoD served or not, or even if he has "sent" his son or daughter off to war, but I do know that I served in a time when the draft was still in effect. I was not drafted. I joined voluntarily and I realize that is where i became a self dependant individual. I did not serve during a time we were at war but I would have laid my life on the line for my country had it become necessary. Todays service people are there because they volunteered and should understand what risks are involved. Therefore, I hail them in their efforts and no one should feel "sorry" for them. They are brave people who are willing to do the job at hand. For all of those who want to exploit them for their political purposes, I say "go to hell".

[Nbadan]

More news from the massacre...


snip>

"Body parts everywhere!" cries a US soldier as a shell crashes onto a group of suspected rebels in the Iraqi city of Fallujah, where a punishing torrent of firepower thundered down on Tuesday.

More than 500 rounds of 155-millimetre Howitzer cannon shells have been fired on the besieged Sunni stronghold west of Baghdad since a US-Iraqi offensive to take control of the city started on Monday evening, said Sergeant Michael Hamby.

<snip>

Unconfirmed estimates suggest that as many as 100 000 residents of Fallujah could still be inside the city.

In the northwestern Jolan neighbourhood alone - branded the hotbed of insurgent activity in Fallujah - US forces unleashed more than 20 air strikes and some 60 artillery rounds on Monday, said Major Todd Desgrosseilliers.

Iafrica (http://iafrica.com/news/worldnews/389225.htm)

[Nbadan]

Onward Christian soldier....

http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/2004-11/08/xinsrc_4721101081650031126811.jpg

A rosary hangs off the barrel of a machinegun mounted on a Bradley belonging to the 1st Cavalry Regiment 5th Battalion positioned on the outskirts of Fallujah, 50 kms west of Baghdad 07 November 2004.(Xinhua/AFP Photo By Patrick Baz)

[Nbadan]

http://news.globalfreepress.com/images/bush/Trifectafinal.JPG

[Nbadan]

Study Puts Iraqi Deaths of Civilians at 100,000

By ELISABETH ROSENTHAL,
International Herald Tribune

Published: October 29, 2004

PARIS, Oct. 28 - An estimated 100,000 civilians have died in Iraq as a direct or indirect consequence of the March 2003 United States-led invasion, according to a new study by a research team at the Bloomberg School of Public Health at Johns Hopkins University in Baltimore.

source...

New York Times (http://www.nytimes.com/2004/10/29/international/europe/29casualties.html?ex=1100149200&en=02b17696137aaad3&ei=5070)

[1369]

A better picture...

http://www.news.com.au/common/imagedata/0,3600,394822,00.jpg

God Bless and watch over all the Marines, Soldiers, Sailors, Airmen and Coasties that are liberating Iraq.

[Nbadan]

RAMADI, Iraq (AFP) - Rebel fighters massed in the centre of the restive Iraqi city of Ramadi after US military snipers withdrew from their positions following 24 hours of clashes, an AFP correspondent said.

The US military could not immediately be contacted for comment. US snipers left a hotel from where they were able to control most of Ramadi's main roads, but the military remained in its headquarters in the governor's office nearby, the correspondent said.

Other US soldiers left the city for their bases in the east and west of the city.

As the snipers departed, large crowds of armed rebels, their faces hidden by scarves, began dancing in the street and shooting in to the air, yelling "Allah Akbar" (God is great).

Banners proclaiming solidarity with insurgents in Fallujah, where US-led forces launched a massive offensive to retake the city on Monday, were hung in the streets.


"The residents of Ramadi condemn the attack against Fallujah and we appeal to the inhabitants of Ramadi to wage jihad against the American occupants who want to eradicate Islam," said one man who did not want to be named.

Seven Iraqis were killed and 24 were injured during the previous day's fighting, said Dr Saad Dulaimi at Ramadi's main hospital, although he said it was unclear how many of the casualties were rebels.

Yahoo News (http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/afp/20041109/wl_mideast_afp/iraq_ramadi_seize&cid=1514&ncid=1480)

Bloody 24 hours if this report and others are accurate.

U.S Soldiers Killed..........261
U.S Soldiers Captured.... 39
CIA/Intelligence............ 21
British Soldiers Killed...... 2
British Soldiers Captured. 10
ING Surrendered............101

Abrams Main Battle Tank 15
Humvees..................... 17
Bradley Fighting Vehicles 7
APCs........................... 4
Trucks/Tankers............ 18
Unknown Helicopters...... 3
Apachee Helicopters..... 1
BlackHawk Helicopters.. 1

believe it or not..

[Nbadan]

http://www.news.com.au/common/imagedata/0,3600,394822,00.jpg

:devil

[gophergeorge]

I see it as this....

To use the "Alamo" reference, but not with the comparision Dan used... This could be the "line in the sand"... Remember, this battle was directed BY the Iraqi government.

This is where we could end it. For good.

As to the civilian deaths: As a student of the Rules of Engagement, we go WAY OUT OF OUR WAY to prevent civilian deaths. With the complexity of our weapons systems, you would be amazed at what we can do. However, shit happens.

We love killing bad guys. We don't enjoy killing innocents. Trust me.

Dan... You will never cease to amaze me....

[Nbadan]

~snip~
An American soldier wounded in Falluja said he had seen two of his colleagues killed.


"A buddy of mine and another soldier were killed and I have seen about 50 other wounded (U.S.) soldiers since the fighting began," he told Reuters while awaiting medical evacuation. He declined to give his name.


A Reuters reporter saw about five wounded soldiers being flown out by helicopter and a U.S. military ambulance driver also said he had witnessed many casualties.


Among the Iraqis killed was a nine-year-old boy, severely injured by shrapnel in the abdomen when his home was bombarded by U.S. jets overnight. His parents were unable to get him to hospital and he died hours later of blood loss, they said.

~snip~

Yahoo News (http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=574&ncid=721&e=4&u=/nm/20041109/wl_nm/iraq_dc)

[1369]

Dan, do you have a link to your supposed statistics?

[Nbadan]

total of 14 Americans have been killed in the past two days across Iraq (news - web sites) — including three killed in Fallujah combat on Tuesday and 11 others who died Monday, most of them as guerrillas launched a wave of attacks in Baghdad and southwest of Fallujah, a senior Pentagon (news - web sites) official said.


The 11 deaths were the highest one-day U.S. toll in more than six months.


As fighting raged in Fallujah, Prime Minister Ayad Allawi declared a nighttime curfew in Baghdad and its surroundings — the first curfew in the capital for a year — a day after a string of insurgent attacks in the city killed nine Iraqis and wounded more than 80.

Yahoo News (http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=535&ncid=535&e=2&u=/ap/20041109/ap_on_re_mi_ea/iraq)

[nadabN]

I will never gloat at the prospect of American war dead. I am not someone who is in need of immediate mental health assistance.

[1369]

Fighting is reported to have eased in Fallujah where US forces say they have reached the city centre and are in control of the northern third of the city.

There have been fierce street battles with militants loyal to Abu Musab al Zarqawi.

The rebels say they have hit back elsewhere with attacks in Baquba and Baghdad.

The US and Iraqi troops have set up bases on the northern and southeastern edges of the town.

They had previously seized the two main bridges across the Euphrates river, as well as the railway station and the main hospital.

According to reports, three US soldiers have been killed and 14 wounded in the latest phase of the operation.

At least two US tanks are said to have been destroyed - claims that a helicopter was shot down as it flew over the Jolan district have been denied.

Lieutenant-Colonel John Morris said US troops were acting as a "fist", while Iraqi forces seized weapons and fought the rebels along streets and alleyways.

He revealed buildings had been booby-trapped so they would fall on troops searching for gunmen.

"There was resistance at the beginning but there is almost no resistance now," another high-ranking officer announced.

More than 10,000 US and Iraqi troops stormed into several areas of the city as part of Operation Phantom Fury.

Sky's reporter at the scene David Chater said the Marines attacked across a wide front. He saw a huge number of mortar rounds being fired on insurgent positions.

The assault follows interim prime minister Iyad Allawi's declaration that military action was the only way to ensure January's elections go ahead.

The UN refugee agency and the international Red Cross have expressed grave concern about the plight of tens of thousands of people fleeing the fighting.

The International Committee of the Red Cross said it wants to get relief supplies to the civilians as soon as possible.

Officials said they were alarmed by information that Fallujah's two water treatment plants have been shut down by frightened employees.

Link (http://www.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,30000-1158957,00.html)

[Nbadan]

To use the "Alamo" reference, but not with the comparision Dan used... This could be the "line in the sand"... Remember, this battle was directed BY the Iraqi government.

Allawi is a puppet for the U.S. government. You diluded if you think that the battle of Fallujah is gonna be the end of the resistance in Iraq. Me thinks, it's just the beginning. These guys don't think like we do, look at the death and mayhem they have unleashed in Palestine against the Israeli occupation, and that's been going on for years. Same here.

[nadabN]

I am not hoping for an unsuccessful outcome for the US and Iraqi forces today because of domestic US politics.

I am a decent American.

I support our troops.

[Nbadan]

<snip>KOCH: Now, Rumsfeld says that he does not know if militant leader Abu Musab al-Zarqawi is in Falluja. Of course, Zarqawi a man with a $25 million price on his head, who has claimed responsibility for so much of the violence thus far in Iraq. Military leaders saying basically if they catch Zarqawi in Falluja, it will simply be a bonus, because the expectation is that he and his lieutenants have had ample time to slip quietly out of this city.

Now, speaking to the slipping quietly away, there are a number, perhaps hundreds, of Iraqi soldiers who did not turn up for this very decisive battle. The defense secretary yesterday saying basically that this is an isolated problem, though something that should be expected from time to time, considering the circumstances. But still this is not welcome news for the Pentagon, Carol, because this is the force that is supposed to take over security in Iraq so that U.S. troops can eventually come home -- back to you.

COSTELLO: When you say, Kathleen, that many Iraqi soldiers didn't show up, what are we talking about? Is there a specific number that we know of?

KOCH: Well, those numbers are very fuzzy. Apparently there are reports that perhaps as many as 500 didn't show up for the battle, but then there is some talk that there may have simply been some confusion behind-the-scenes, that they were on leave, didn't realize they needed to come back.

But again, these are the kinds of things that need to be worked out so that these troops can be reliably counted upon under any sort of circumstance, and especially for a critical battle like this.


more

CNN (http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0411/09/lad.01.html)

[nadabN]

I am not all tingly with the prospect of reports of massive numbers of American servicemen killed today.

[nadabN]

The password for my username is not "benedictarnold."

[1369]

CNN Link (http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/meast/11/08/arraf.otsc/index.html)


CNN Baghdad bureau chief Jane Arraf is embedded with the U.S. Army there; she spoke with "Anderson Cooper 360°" guest host Heidi Collins on Monday night by telephone.

ARRAF: At this point, the offensive has been going on for hours. And -- I'm not sure if you hear those thuds in the background -- the sky just lit up over the city of Falluja. There are continued airstrikes and ground strikes.

Quite a heavy bombardment as forces here ... try to soften up the insurgents to move further into the city. We started out on the northeast corner, where they found what they had expected and feared, which was a string of improvised explosive devices -- booby-trapped -- waiting for the troops to come in.

In that sector, [there were] very few civilians. And we had been told that they had not been allowed in that sector by the insurgents who have been rigging these homemade bombs around the city. The battle continues, and is expected to continue for some time. All the soldiers going into this -- and this is a massive effort -- have been told that this is a historic battle; this is their chance to rid the country of the insurgency.

COLLINS: You talk about the resistance, you talk about the foreign fighters. Any more you can tell us about that, as far as characterizing the size of it and how intense it is?

ARRAF: Military officials are putting varying figures on how many men they believe they're fighting ... and they vary from 1,200 to 3,000.

On the lowest tier -- although a lot of these probably would have fled the city by now -- it's people who are doing it just for the money. They are unemployed, perhaps angry, young men, and they get a few dollars for shooting a rocket-propelled grenade.

There are extreme religious fundamentalists, who are doing it because they believe that it is their religious duty. ...

There are former Baath Party elements, which are a large part of this -- this is a Sunni stronghold and a very conservative city. And there are the foreign fighters, probably fewer than had first been believed, but this city, over the past few months -- since the end of the war, in fact -- has become a magnet for insurgents of all sorts, a breeding ground for different cells. And many military officials believe that it has become a command-and-control center for the entire insurgency in Iraq.

COLLINS: We know that earlier in the day the troops were able to take over one hospital and two key bridges. Again, in talking about this resistance, are they able to take over more positions of importance, or would you say they are at a standby or a standstill as of late?

ARRAF: They're not at a standstill so much. They are certainly going forward. ... We're not entirely clear as to what targets they may have taken in other sectors of the city. Certainly, they had a lot of objectives. And the Iraqi security forces are playing a large part in that.

Those are the people -- we are with, for instance, Iraqi commandos -- and the Iraqi security forces, the intervention forces, are the ones who are going into places like mosques and schools, where U.S. forces say they've been targeted from.

As for the major targets that they have, most of those [involve] access to the city, and the city has, indeed, been breached.

[JoeChalupa]

The Marines...when you care enough to send the very best!!

Semper Fi!!

[DE FULL MANTE]

MANTE

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Allawi is a puppet for the U.S. government.

Yeah, all those Shi'ites, Sunnis, and Kurds who voted for him are all our puppets.

Whatever Chirac.

[whottt]

What's funny is that Dan doesn't seem to realize that Allawi was the choice of the UN.

[CrazyOne]

C'mon, Whott, you're not playing fair... shooting down all those conspiracy theories with cold, hard facts... :lol

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Yeah, but Kerry didn't approve of Allawi, and therein lies the rub.

[SpursWoman]

There have been fierce street battles with militants loyal to Abu Musab al Zarqawi.


So, has Dan quit insisting that al Zaqawi is dead yet?