Oklahoma State @ Texas A&M

[johngateswhiteley]

venue: Reed Arena
time: 6pm MT
line: ?

thoughts: i actually said, when others didn't/wouldn't that OSU was a good team earlier this year. i think they are playing good ball right now and i expect a tough scrappy game. it definitely helps that its a home game for the Aggs.

prediction: A&M 71 OSU 65

...i know its early, but i can't wait for this game. i wanna send Capt. Mike's team packing....only 11 days away anyway. :)

[Jimcs50]

I'll be there in section 123 as usual.

[johngateswhiteley]

I'll be there in section 123 as usual.

nice! well, root hard! my sister still lives in College Station (graduated in 2006), but i think she only goes to a couple games a year (since she has been there). maybe i can convince her to go....her friends go.

[SrA Husker]

Just as a note, this game isn't until January 20th...

Really looking ahead considering you have two road games ahead of you still...

Impatient, young grasshopper???

[johngateswhiteley]

Just as a note, this game isn't until January 20th...

Really looking ahead considering you have two road games ahead of you still...

Impatient, young grasshopper???



...i know its early, but i can't wait for this game. i wanna send Capt. Mike's team packing....only 11 days away anyway. :)

[1369]

OSU has a tough schedule for the next three games before they get to A&M with games against KU and UT. With basically a seven man rotation (Bowman (OSU WR) is set to join the team, so hopefully he can get some minutes and give others a rest), the next three are going to be tough on OSU.

[SrA Husker]

Yes, I saw that in your original post, but still!!!!!!!!!!!!


Next week, I'll put up the thread for #1 USC at #13 Nebraska (using Rivals preseason rankings) football on 9/15/07 :)

[johngateswhiteley]

Yes, I saw that in your original post, but still!!!!!!!!!!!!


Next week, I'll put up the thread for #1 USC at #13 Nebraska (using Rivals preseason rankings) football on 9/15/07 :)

ha ha, maybe you should. that should be an interesting game....whats your prediction?

[SrA Husker]

Too early to tell, let me wait until after spring practice atleast. However, with Nebraska's D-Line quickly going from a worry to a solid thing with Callahan's recent recruiting, I'm getting more and more anxious for the season to start!

[MajorMike]

Big 12 Insider: OSU-Texas A&M already a sellout

Big 12 Insider: OSU-Texas A&M already a sellout
By BILL HAISTEN World Sports Writer
1/16/2007

During the weekend, Texas A&M officials announced that 12,500-seat Reed Arena is sold out for the Oklahoma State-Texas A&M game in College Station. For A&M, it is the earliest basketball sellout in school history.

The 12th-ranked Cowboys and eighth-ranked Aggies meet at 7 p.m. Saturday. Aggie officials are promoting the game as a "white-out" event, with all A&M fans wearing white T-shirts.

A&M has a 17-game home win streak. Since Billy Gillispie became the head coach, the Aggies are 45-5 at Reed Arena.

The OSU-A&M game may draw a record crowd. The largest crowd for an A&M home date was the 13,176 who witnessed a 46-43 Aggie win over Texas last March.

OSU coach Sean Sutton said he expects Saturday's contest to be a "lockdown, grind-it-out game."

[SrA Husker]

Hopefully, OSU can actually get out of town for this game, they've already had to reschedule their meeting with us up in Lincoln!!!

[MajorMike]

Maybe a good thing. Neb always has a history of whooping us up there when we are having a nice season. If you remember, they were our 1st loss in the 20-0 season up there. Neb is one of those teams that just plays us very well for some odd reason, and we always seem to play ya'll early.

[SrA Husker]

Maybe a good thing. Neb always has a history of whooping us up there when we are having a nice season. If you remember, they were our 1st loss in the 20-0 season up there. Neb is one of those teams that just plays us very well for some odd reason, and we always seem to play ya'll early.

I was just hoping to catch OSU when they were still ranked top 10, knowing you would drop a few after your ass-rape in Lawrence. But whenever we meet, it should be a good game - I just hope it can come at a time when we can still get a full 2-3 days in between the last and next game.

[johngateswhiteley]

...i am hoping osu wins tonight against t.u.. i don't want a lower cowboys team coming to town when we play them

as for the sellout, yep, thats what happens when you play a highly ranked foe and expectations are through the roof. when we play t.u. later in the year, all records will be broken.

[Jimcs50]

...i am hoping osu wins tonight against t.u.. i don't want a lower cowboys team coming to town when we play them

as for the sellout, yep, thats what happens when you play a highly ranked foe and expectations are through the roof. when we play t.u. later in the year, all records will be broken.


all conference games will be a sell out...the K St game would have been, had school be going on.


I too hope Ok St beats UT, as that will get teh Aggie's attention even moreso.


I can not wait til Sat night.

:elephant

[BeerIsGood!]

Can't wait for this one tonight. Durant, Augustine, Abrahms have been tearing it up and getting support from James and Co. Need to keep the buzzsaw rolling...

[MajorMike]

I was just hoping to catch OSU when they were still ranked top 10, knowing you would drop a few after your ass-rape in Lawrence. But whenever we meet, it should be a good game - I just hope it can come at a time when we can still get a full 2-3 days in between the last and next game.

Ya, the only thing I can liken that game to is 2003-2004. We were a pretty decent team early that year. We go to ttek and get the poop knocked out of us by over 20 in our B12 opener.

We did, however, win the B12 reg season and B12 tourney and end up going to the Final Four that year.

[johngateswhiteley]

capt. mike-
...do you feel confident this weekend? who do you think will win?

edit: when you get around to it, i would appreciate an answer.

[RonMexico]

I've wanted to go to so many more conference games this year, but they just don't work into my schedule when driving from Houston all the time.

Now that so many are on Nat'l/Regional TV, and I don't have many friends who can pull tickets for me there (since they've mostly graduated), it's even more difficult to justify going and trying to charm my way into crashing on someone's couch. But I will make it for a few late in the season, I guarantee it - besides the last two OSU and OU home games I've been to have been disasters, so maybe I'm the bad luck charm...

[MajorMike]

Nah... whereas I believe atm is overrated (not a Top 10 team), people don't know that OSU really isn't that good of a team. A good D, which atm has, will force us into turnovers. We don't handle the ball well. That being said, if you can't win home games, don't expect to compete for the B12.

atm really needs a win, as they are 0-2 against Top 10/25 teams and their best win is against #61 RPI KState at home by only 4. atm hasn't played anyone worth looking at twice since last December, whereas OSU played KU, UT and atm back-to-back, with uo 2 days after atm on Big Monday. Couple that with the fact we have only 7 scholy players and 3 of them played 50 minutes plus against UT. atm should win by around 15.

If you want a score, atm has that 65 point thing going, so I'll say 76-61.

[johngateswhiteley]

Nah... whereas I believe atm is overrated (not a Top 10 team), people don't know that OSU really isn't that good of a team. A good D, which atm has, will force us into turnovers. We don't handle the ball well. That being said, if you can't win home games, don't expect to compete for the B12.

atm really needs a win, as they are 0-2 against Top 10/25 teams and their best win is against #61 RPI KState at home by only 4. atm hasn't played anyone worth looking at twice since last December, whereas OSU played KU, UT and atm back-to-back, with uo 2 days after atm on Big Monday. Couple that with the fact we have only 7 scholy players and 3 of them played 50 minutes plus against UT. atm should win by around 15.

If you want a score, atm has that 65 point thing going, so I'll say 76-61.

finally, one doesn't have to assume what you mean. thank you.

i don't think A&M wins by 15, though i'd love to see it. if A&M plays like they are capable then i could see a double digit win, but something tells me it will be closer.

A&M a top 10 team?...i am not so sure they are either. i am not saying either way, i just don't know yet. i think they are definitely a top 20 team, no doubt. after that i just don't know...i'd probably put them at 14 or 15. too early to tell...

i disagree about the whole A&M really needs a win thing. they need to play well, thats for sure...and i hope they do win. another loss to a top 15 team would not look good, but it wouldn't kill us either.

[Jimcs50]

finally, one doesn't have to assume what you mean. thank you.

i don't think A&M wins by 15, though i'd love to see it. if A&M plays like they are capable then i could see a double digit win, but something tells me it will be closer.

A&M a top 10 team?...i am not so sure they are either. i am not saying either way, i just don't know yet. i think they are definitely a top 20 team, no doubt. after that i just don't know...i'd probably put them at 14 or 15. too early to tell...

i disagree about the whole A&M really needs a win thing. they need to play well, thats for sure...and i hope they do win. another loss to a top 15 team would not look good, but it wouldn't kill us either.

They DO need to win, that is s given. Why? because they play AT Texas Tech the next game and if they lose that one, like I think they have a great chance of doing, they will be in a deep hole in conference standings, because they will lose at UT and at Kansas and probably at Ok St. they have to win every home game in order to finish higher than last year's Big 12 record 10-6.

I think the Ags need to finish the Big 12 no worse than 12-4 to keep Billy's momentum going.


Sat is a must win.

[Jimcs50]

I've wanted to go to so many more conference games this year, but they just don't work into my schedule when driving from Houston all the time.

Now that so many are on Nat'l/Regional TV, and I don't have many friends who can pull tickets for me there (since they've mostly graduated), it's even more difficult to justify going and trying to charm my way into crashing on someone's couch. But I will make it for a few late in the season, I guarantee it - besides the last two OSU and OU home games I've been to have been disasters, so maybe I'm the bad luck charm...


Ron, I have 3 season tickets, if my wife and son can not make a game, and if you want to go to one, I can hook you up one game. PM me if you are interested and I will keep you in mind.

[johngateswhiteley]

They DO need to win, that is s given. Why? because they play AT Texas Tech the next game and if they lose that one, like I think they have a great chance of doing, they will be in a deep hole in conference standings, because they will lose at UT and at Kansas and probably at Ok St. they have to win every home game in order to finish higher than last year's Big 12 record 10-6.

I think the Ags need to finish the Big 12 no worse than 12-4 to keep Billy's momentum going.


Sat is a must win.

i understand that argument, and i am sure a lot of people feel the same way. me?...i don't think they lose @ tech, @ t.u., @ ku, and @ ok state. i think they definitely beat tech, and probably ok state and t.u., the ku game will be tough but they aren't as good as ucla; we can beat anyone on the road.
i'm not worried at all. that being said, i do think they beat ok state saturday.

[Jimcs50]

i understand that argument, and i am sure a lot of people feel the same way. me?...i don't think they lose @ tech, @ t.u., @ ku, and @ ok state. i think they definitely beat tech, and probably ok state and t.u., the ku game will be tough but they aren't as good as ucla; we can beat anyone on the road.
i'm not worried at all. that being said, i do think they beat ok state saturday.

Tech will be a very tough win, and the UT game at Reed Arena will be very tough because it is just 2 days after having to travel to Kansas......


ight now, I will love to have that 12-4 conference record. That should get them a 3 seed in the tourney, and that will be a great spot to be in.

[johngateswhiteley]

Tech will be a very tough win, and the UT game at Reed Arena will be very tough because it is just 2 days after having to travel to Kansas......


ight now, I will love to have that 12-4 conference record. That should get them a 3 seed in the tourney, and that will be a great spot to be in.

...here is where i think A&M will finish in conference, trying not to be biased.

4. ok state - win
5. @ tekk - win
6. ou - win
7. iowa state - win
8. @ ku - loss
9. t.u. - win
10. @ neb - win
11. tekk - win
12. @ ou - win
13. @ ok state - loss
14. baylor - win
15. @ t.u. - loss
16. missouri - win

...that puts us @ 13-3, about the same record i expect for Kansas. i could see us going 14-2, not losing one of the games @ t.u. or ok state, but we'll see. i'll stick with 13-3.

[MajorMike]

I understand looking at it and saying a game they are "forecasted to lose." If you apply that same logic to KU, I can't see them losing any game. Whereas I'm sure they will, you just don't know where it will be. @ Mizzou? @ KSU? Who knows. Another factor to be aware of is the 'we are playing one of the big dogs' factor. This applies for the game @ neb, for example. They bat the ball around with ISU/CU/KSU/Mizzou yearly for 3-6 in the North. They've got not much else to play for at that point. But all of a sudden, a good team we don't see often comes to town and we have something new to play for. Plus any way game is no gimme in the B12. With UT and ttek going to atm, don't assume you will win all your home games, either.

I don't expect atm to fall on their face by any means, but they need to show that they can win and finish as a fave. To be honest... they snuck up on alot of teams last year. This year, everyone knows who they are when they come to town.

[Jimcs50]

I understand looking at it and saying a game they are "forecasted to lose." If you apply that same logic to KU, I can't see them losing any game. Whereas I'm sure they will, you just don't know where it will be. @ Mizzou? @ KSU? Who knows. Another factor to be aware of is the 'we are playing one of the big dogs' factor. This applies for the game @ neb, for example. They bat the ball around with ISU/CU/KSU/Mizzou yearly for 3-6 in the North. They've got not much else to play for at that point. But all of a sudden, a good team we don't see often comes to town and we have something new to play for. Plus any way game is no gimme in the B12. With UT and ttek going to atm, don't assume you will win all your home games, either.

I don't expect atm to fall on their face by any means, but they need to show that they can win and finish as a fave. To be honest... they snuck up on alot of teams last year. This year, everyone knows who they are when they come to town.


I agree 100%

I think it is overly optimistic to think that the Aggies will win all those road games, like at TT, and even at Nebraska(we lost there last year) Even Baylor is not a given.

I will take 12-4 in a heartbeat.

[johngateswhiteley]

I understand looking at it and saying a game they are "forecasted to lose." If you apply that same logic to KU, I can't see them losing any game. Whereas I'm sure they will, you just don't know where it will be. @ Mizzou? @ KSU? Who knows. Another factor to be aware of is the 'we are playing one of the big dogs' factor. This applies for the game @ neb, for example. They bat the ball around with ISU/CU/KSU/Mizzou yearly for 3-6 in the North. They've got not much else to play for at that point. But all of a sudden, a good team we don't see often comes to town and we have something new to play for. Plus any way game is no gimme in the B12. With UT and ttek going to atm, don't assume you will win all your home games, either.

I don't expect atm to fall on their face by any means, but they need to show that they can win and finish as a fave. To be honest... they snuck up on alot of teams last year. This year, everyone knows who they are when they come to town.

good thoughts, but i don't see A&M losing to any inferior teams...defense is just too good. Auburn and Winthrop are as good as kstate, baylor, nebraska, etc. and we murdered those teams. but i understand your thought process.

i do, however, agree completely with your last paragraph. A&M does need to show that...and i think they will.

[MajorMike]

Hahaha Winthrop again. Well, I actually agree to an extent with you. Whereas I think that any B12 team could win a home game with Winthrop this year (the worst teams - ISU and CU, are historically 2 of the hardest road games), lets for arguement's sake say you are right and both those teams are as good as KSU, BU and Neb. None of those teams will be a tourney team, therefore, the only reason Winthrop will be in the tourney is because the rest of their conf is rated 250+. In other words, you have agreed with my earlier statements that neither Winthrop nor Auburn are good teams.

**note that OSU beat Auburn by 1, and I still don't think they are a good team.

[Jimcs50]

Hahaha Winthrop again. Well, I actually agree to an extent with you. Whereas I think that any B12 team could win a home game with Winthrop this year (the worst teams - ISU and CU, are historically 2 of the hardest road games), lets for arguement's sake say you are right and both those teams are as good as KSU, BU and Neb. None of those teams will be a tourney team, therefore, the only reason Winthrop will be in the tourney is because the rest of their conf is rated 250+. In other words, you have agreed with my earlier statements that neither Winthrop nor Auburn are good teams.

**note that OSU beat Auburn by 1, and I still don't think they are a good team.


They played the #2 and #4 team in the country (Wisconsin and NC) on the road and lost by a total of 9 pts...incld OT game at Wisconsin.

I think they are a good team.

[johngateswhiteley]

Hahaha Winthrop again. Well, I actually agree to an extent with you. Whereas I think that any B12 team could win a home game with Winthrop this year (the worst teams - ISU and CU, are historically 2 of the hardest road games), lets for arguement's sake say you are right and both those teams are as good as KSU, BU and Neb. None of those teams will be a tourney team, therefore, the only reason Winthrop will be in the tourney is because the rest of their conf is rated 250+. In other words, you have agreed with my earlier statements that neither Winthrop nor Auburn are good teams.

**note that OSU beat Auburn by 1, and I still don't think they are a good team.

my point is that while you are suggesting A&M might/should lose some games you cannot predict...i don't see it. obviously, we don't know how good k-state, nebraska, and baylor are....though it looks to be average in the big 12. i should have said 'at least' as good as though teams. Auburn has played some very good teams closely and A&M beat them by 30. what say you about that?

i will agree that winthrop is a tourney team b/c their conference is weak, but that doesn't make them undeserving. they are what i thought they were, a top 100 RPI team. lol.

[MajorMike]

my point is that while you are suggesting A&M might/should lose some games you cannot predict...i don't see it. obviously, we don't know how good k-state, nebraska, and baylor are....though it looks to be average in the big 12. i should have said 'at least' as good as though teams. Auburn has played some very good teams closely and A&M beat them by 30. what say you about that?

i will agree that winthrop is a tourney team b/c their conference is weak, but that doesn't make them undeserving. they are what i thought they were, a top 100 RPI team. lol.


Any given day is what I say about that.

#10 Bama has beaten alot of good teams, and Vandy just beat them by 20. KU squeaks out wins against 2 bad teams (Mizzou by 3; ISU by 4) and mops the floor with us by 30.

Bottom line is you cannot script it. You have mediocre teams that win games they had no business of winning all the time (KU losing at home to DePaul and ORU??? UT getting beat last year by 21 to a .500 OSU team??).

Also, margin of victory is overrated, to a certain extent, as well as saying this team beat that team so they are better. You just can't use someone else's parallel to make a case. atm lost to LSU but UT beat LSU. Is UT better than atm? Not likely. atm beats Auburn by 20 and OSU beats them by 1, so is atm 19 points better than OSU? Possibly, but not likely. Auburn has also lost to 7-5 Southern Miss (by 2) who then lost to 4-14 Savannah State (by 2). Does that mean Savannah State is 3 points better than OSU? Mizzou St gave Wisc its only loss so far and OSU beats Mizzou St the very next day. Is OSU better than Wisc? Not likely.

Is it sane to think that atm will be 2nd or 3rd in the B12 this year? Of course. The only problem is college bball isn't always sane. Nothing is a given. That's all I'm trying to say.

That, and Winthrop is a bad team.

[johngateswhiteley]

Any given day is what I say about that.

#10 Bama has beaten alot of good teams, and Vandy just beat them by 20. KU squeaks out wins against 2 bad teams (Mizzou by 3; ISU by 4) and mops the floor with us by 30.

Bottom line is you cannot script it. You have mediocre teams that win games they had no business of winning all the time (KU losing at home to DePaul and ORU??? UT getting beat last year by 21 to a .500 OSU team??).

Also, margin of victory is overrated, to a certain extent, as well as saying this team beat that team so they are better. You just can't use someone else's parallel to make a case. atm lost to LSU but UT beat LSU. Is UT better than atm? Not likely. atm beats Auburn by 20 and OSU beats them by 1, so is atm 19 points better than OSU? Possibly, but not likely. Auburn has also lost to 7-5 Southern Miss (by 2) who then lost to 4-14 Savannah State (by 2). Does that mean Savannah State is 3 points better than OSU? Mizzou St gave Wisc its only loss so far and OSU beats Mizzou St the very next day. Is OSU better than Wisc? Not likely.

Is it sane to think that atm will be 2nd or 3rd in the B12 this year? Of course. The only problem is college bball isn't always sane. Nothing is a given. That's all I'm trying to say.

That, and Winthrop is a bad team.

(and we come full circle) shit Capt. Mike (i even did it capitals this time)! thats the best damn post you have ever made, imo. couldn't have said it better myself.

only thing we disagree on is Winthrop being a bad team. there are 336 D1 bball teams, if you're in the top 3rd...you're a good team. at least, thats my opinion.

[MajorMike]

Soooo...football has 120 D1 teams. That means anyone in the top third, down to 40, is a good team.

Zona was 6-6, didn't get a Bowl, and was 33rd in the final BCS ratings. By your logic, they are a good team?

I have to call bs on that 1st hand. OSU was ranked 89 last year RPI. We were a bad team. 15-14 Virginia was 77, 15-14 ISU was 93. 19-13 Nebraska was 96. All those teams were awful. So a Winthrop team that finishes 80-ish is as good as OSU or ISU last year. In other words... not a good team.

[johngateswhiteley]

Soooo...football has 120 D1 teams. That means anyone in the top third, down to 40, is a good team.

Zona was 6-6, didn't get a Bowl, and was 33rd in the final BCS ratings. By your logic, they are a good team?

I have to call bs on that 1st hand. OSU was ranked 89 last year RPI. We were a bad team. 15-14 Virginia was 77, 15-14 ISU was 93. 19-13 Nebraska was 96. All those teams were awful. So a Winthrop team that finishes 80-ish is as good as OSU or ISU last year. In other words... not a good team.

well, after the 25 are ranked its personal opinion as to who is in the top 3rd in either sport....we may have different opinions on that. but, i've always held that if you are in that 3rd you are a good team, period.

[johngateswhiteley]

game time!

[johngateswhiteley]

18-11 A&m
21-13 Usc

[johngateswhiteley]

A&M up 10 at half....Acie Law basically sat out the entire first half, this game should be much worse. instead of 10 i'm thinking 17-18.

[johngateswhiteley]

38-33...a&m

[johngateswhiteley]

...well, that was fun stomping on oklahomo state. later.

[Doug Collins]

I wonder what this does to okie state's rpi...

[Doug Collins]

Any given day is what I say about that.

#10 Bama has beaten alot of good teams, and Vandy just beat them by 20. KU squeaks out wins against 2 bad teams (Mizzou by 3; ISU by 4) and mops the floor with us by 30.

Bottom line is you cannot script it. You have mediocre teams that win games they had no business of winning all the time (KU losing at home to DePaul and ORU??? UT getting beat last year by 21 to a .500 OSU team??).

Also, margin of victory is overrated, to a certain extent, as well as saying this team beat that team so they are better. You just can't use someone else's parallel to make a case. atm lost to LSU but UT beat LSU. Is UT better than atm? Not likely. atm beats Auburn by 20 and OSU beats them by 1, so is atm 19 points better than OSU? Possibly, but not likely. Auburn has also lost to 7-5 Southern Miss (by 2) who then lost to 4-14 Savannah State (by 2). Does that mean Savannah State is 3 points better than OSU? Mizzou St gave Wisc its only loss so far and OSU beats Mizzou St the very next day. Is OSU better than Wisc? Not likely.

Is it sane to think that atm will be 2nd or 3rd in the B12 this year? Of course. The only problem is college bball isn't always sane. Nothing is a given. That's all I'm trying to say.

That, and Winthrop is a bad team.


Actually they're 18 points better :elephant :elephant :elephant

[johngateswhiteley]

I wonder what this does to okie state's rpi...

...still, great questions. i'm sure their RPI will still be higher than ours, even though we just beat that ass.

[johngateswhiteley]

Actually they're 18 points better :elephant :elephant :elephant

:lol btw, Capt. Mike...A&M beat Auburn by 29, not 20.

[Doug Collins]

...still, great questions. i'm sure their RPI will still be higher than ours, even though we just beat that ass.


I forgot. Gotta factor in that whole scheduling winthrop thing divided by only beating osu by 18 points, which puts into effect the super double secret rpi boost for osu. Had we beaten them by 19 maybe then we would've had a chance...nuts.

Oh well I'll settle for #1 in the Big 12. :spin :clap :downspin: :hungry:

[RonMexico]

What are college rankings?

[johngateswhiteley]

I forgot. Gotta factor in that whole scheduling winthrop thing divided by only beating osu by 18 points, which puts into effect the super double secret rpi boost for osu. Had we beaten them by 19 maybe then we would've had a chance...nuts.

Oh well I'll settle for #1 in the Big 12. :spin :clap :downspin: :hungry:

settling for #1 in the big 12 (thanks tekk), is...nice. :elephant

i don't think it matters what A&M does this year, they can't possibly catch oklahomo state in the RPI... :depressed

[remingtonbo2001]

The only thing that matters is the TOURNEY.....Just get in at this point...A good seeding would be nice....But, really, if A&M's defense continues to improve, as it has, then I really don't care too much who we play. It's weird, cause we don't have any big name guys. That should speaks volumes about the kind of coach Gillispie is.

[Jimcs50]

The only thing that matters is the TOURNEY.....Just get in at this point...A good seeding would be nice....But, really, if A&M's defense continues to improve, as it has, then I really don't care too much who we play. It's weird, cause we don't have any big name guys. That should speaks volumes about the kind of coach Gillispie is.


Acie Law is now a "big name" guy. He will be drafted in top 25...no doubt about it.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Acie will be a first rounder. AK will be a second rounder. Joseph will be drafted next year. Not sure how that translates to no big time guys....