Muhammad Ali

[johngateswhiteley]

...anyone else tired of this guy? it has exhausted me for years....every time i see him on tv or people talk about him in a 'falling all over themselves jacking off' sense...makes me sick.

1. his trash talk was annoying
2. his whole 'conscientious objector' trip seemed like a cop out to me, of course i don't know for sure
3. the media is always sucking his dick and making him out to be this great amazing person...whatever
4. he wasn't the best boxer ever

no offense Ali, but i am sick of you and the media building you up to be something you're not. to all: shut the fuck up already.

[johngateswhiteley]

There must be something wrong with you to have such a obnoxious opinion.

.. :lol you're cracking me up bro. but its simple:

1. i am being consistent
2. i am not judging him for anything but his craft and the media always sucking his cock...perfectly reasonable
3. furthermore, i am not saying that he isn't one of the best ever, or that he wasn't a good person...he was

[LEONARD]

If Ali was doing his thing today, he would be hated by MANY...and probably most...

[johngateswhiteley]

Nope you said you hate people with parkinsons.

well, thats true.

[johngateswhiteley]

If Ali was doing his thing today, he would be hated by MANY...and probably most...

thank you! shit, it appears the media has been pulling the wool over everyone's eyes.

[cornbread]

...anyone else tired of this guy? it has exhausted me for years....every time i see him on tv or people talk about him in a 'falling all over themselves jacking off' sense...makes me sick.

1. his trash talk was annoying
2. his whole 'conscientious objector' trip seemed like a cop out to me, of course i don't know for sure
3. the media is always sucking his dick and making him out to be this great amazing person...whatever
4. he wasn't the best boxer ever

no offense Ali, but i am sick of you and the media building you up to be something you're not. to all: shut the fuck up already.

1. trash talk is mental warfare. Ali was the greatest at this.
2. Ali stood up for his beliefs over money. This move cost him his title and boxing license.
3. Enlighten us on why he wasn't a great amazing person. You seem to be in the minority on this opinion.
4. Who was?

Correct me if I'm wrong but I'm guessing that you weren't alive to watch career as it happened.

[cornbread]

4. Who was?


I love Ali and the history of his career but I'm in the Sugar Ray Robinson boat for the greatest ever. IMO, Ali is a VERY close second to SRR.

[BeerIsGood!]

Jack Dempsey, Baby!!! ok, j/k


JGW - don't worry. In 40 years when TO has impairments from constantly failing in his attempts to kill himself he will be the best receiver ever to play the game of football. It's the "good old days" syndrome. Newsflash - the good old days sucked too

[johngateswhiteley]

1. trash talk is mental warfare. Ali was the greatest at this.
2. Ali stood up for his beliefs over money. This move cost him his title and boxing license.
3. Enlighten us on why he wasn't a great amazing person. You seem to be in the minority on this opinion.
4. Who was?

Correct me if I'm wrong but I'm guessing that you weren't alive to watch career as it happened.

1. trash talk amongst competitors is weak and meaningless. if it gets into your head and affects your play...you have no business competing. oh yeah, and Ali was annoying not scary...i don't know why people didn't just laugh at him

2. i'm not sold that he stood up for his beliefs over money, obviously nobody but Ali really knows, but it seems very plausible he just didn't want to go to war or he was being used by the Islam community

3. nothing i have seen makes Ali special, imo. is he a nice guy?...he might be, probably is. has he always been a nice guy?...i don't know. is an amazing person, in the sense that he is kind, gracious, loving? now?...maybe. earlier in his career?...i doubt it. i've read nothing to support that. in fact, he seemed like a fucking asshole...at least thats how he acted in the spotlight, in the ring, and outside of the ring. was in private life?...well, nobody knows. but i am judging him on what i have seen and heard on his craft.

is knocking someone out in a boxing ring, and then talking trash while they lay limp a classy thing? is running your mouth insulting people before and after fights a classy thing? is that something an athlete should do?...i don't think so.

what the hell did Ali ever do besides box, sit out a war, and run his mouth? nothing, imo. Lance Armstrong makes Ali look like a little bitch as far as i am concerned.

4. Rocky Marciano and, yes, Sugar Ray Robinson

5. was i alive?...no. but i have seen about 15-20 of his fights and a plethora of interviews and public scenes, plus many articles

BeerIsGood-
...exactly, my friend....exactly.

[Saddam's Ghost]

I'm pro-war, too, JGW!

[johngateswhiteley]

I'm pro-war, too, JGW!

good for you saddam...but me, i am not pro-war. far from it.

[BeerIsGood!]

saddam's ghost?? :lol :lol :lol

[johngateswhiteley]

so you have conscientious objections? how convenient. I'm not sure i believe that.

1. not being pro-war means i have a conscientious objection?...can you even spell your name without help?

2. let me help out the handicapped...i think war should be a last resort, but yes, sometimes it is necessary. seems some are too happy to go to war nowadays, though

3. but don't get confused, if Ali really was a conscientious objector, great....good for him. i just don't give a shit...it shouldn't be celebrated to the extent it has

[cornbread]

1. trash talk amongst competitors is weak and meaningless. if it gets into your head and affects your play...you have no business competing. oh yeah, and Ali was annoying not scary...i don't know why people didn't just laugh at him

3. nothing i have seen makes Ali special, imo. is he a nice guy?...he might be, probably is. has he always been a nice guy?...i don't know. is an amazing person, in the sense that he is kind, gracious, loving? now?...maybe. earlier in his career?...i doubt it. i've read nothing to support that. in fact, he seemed like a fucking asshole...at least thats how he acted in the spotlight, in the ring, and outside of the ring. was in private life?...well, nobody knows. but i am judging him on what i have seen and heard on his craft.

is knocking someone out in a boxing ring, and then talking trash while they lay limp a classy thing? is running your mouth insulting people before and after fights a classy thing? is that something an athlete should do?...i don't think so.

what the hell did Ali ever do besides box, sit out a war, and run his mouth?

5. was i alive?...no. but i have seen about 15-20 of his fights and a plethora of interviews and public scenes, plus many articles


It's easy to say he wasn't scary from the comfort of your keyboard in the year 2007. Luckily, Ali's concern wasn't getting on your nerves when he talked trash. Keep shit in context.
Ali was a fighter. Trash talking totally has a place in the sport. We're not talking about racing bicycles here. This is FIGHTING. If Ali talked trash over a downed opponent then so be it. Send a message out to the rest of the guys who are waiting in line to fight him. You think he's the only boxer who ever talked trash? No, he was just the best at it. And Boxing is a brutal sport with brutal consequences. If you're looking for a gentleman's sport, then watch golf.

In terms of how "nice" he was during his career, I've always understood that he was the most approachable superstar out there. Everybody I know who had the privelege of meeting him while he was still a fighter shared a positive experience. This isn't by means a large number of people, but I've always heard that he was incredibly friendly. But earlier in his career, I have no idea.

Here's a few things that Ali has done besides box, sit out a war, and run his mouth.

http://www.alicenter.org/
In the FAQ section it states that Ali has helped provide over 22,000,000 meals to the hungry.
http://www.maprc.com/home/default.aspx

[E20]

http://img149.imageshack.us/img149/42/untitledsb8.jpg

Muhammad Ali has done a lot in the ring and outside, if you fail to understand that then you obviously have something against him.

[johngateswhiteley]

so your objection to war is not based on rational thought?

...of course it is, but you're getting off-topic. i don't have a problem with Ali being a conscientious objector....i could care less. he shouldn't be celebrated for it.

[johngateswhiteley]

you brought it up. you called it a cop out.

no i didn't.

[cornbread]

i don't have a problem with Ali being a conscientious objector....i could care less. he shouldn't be celebrated for it.
I agree it shouldn't be celebrated, but if his motives were true then I can respect that.

[johngateswhiteley]

It's easy to say he wasn't scary from the comfort of your keyboard in the year 2007. Luckily, Ali's concern wasn't getting on your nerves when he talked trash. Keep shit in context.
Ali was a fighter. Trash talking totally has a place in the sport. We're not talking about racing bicycles here. This is FIGHTING. If Ali talked trash over a downed opponent then so be it. Send a message out to the rest of the guys who are waiting in line to fight him. You think he's the only boxer who ever talked trash? No, he was just the best at it. And Boxing is a brutal sport with brutal consequences. If you're looking for a gentleman's sport, then watch golf.

In terms of how "nice" he was during his career, I've always understood that he was the most approachable superstar out there. Everybody I know who had the privelege of meeting him while he was still a fighter shared a positive experience. This isn't by means a large number of people, but I've always heard that he was incredibly friendly. But earlier in his career, I have no idea.

Here's a few things that Ali has done besides box, sit out a war, and run his mouth.

http://www.alicenter.org/
In the FAQ section it states that Ali has helped provide over 22,000,000 meals to the hungry.
http://www.maprc.com/home/default.aspx

1. i wouldn't be scared of Ali b/c he talked, in fact, i wouldn't be scared of Ali at all. would i box him?...no, but i am not a boxer and even if i was he wouldn't scare me, thats preposterous

2. imo, boxing is not fighting. boxing is a sport...i've never seen a fight where two men just stood and swung at each other

3. Ali already talked trash, theres nothing i can do to change that, but it doesn't mean he is not an arrogant bitch

4. i don't care if other boxers talked trash, they are not celebrated in ridiculous amounts, imo

5. fwiw, boxing is a gentleman's sport

6. just an example: if a guy rapes a girl on his way to a fund raiser, does that mean he is a good person?

7. good for Ali, but he is celebrated, mainly, for what he did during his earlier years. btw, i have done some charity work...can i be celebrated too?

finally, and listen closely, did i ever say Ali was not a good boxer? did i ever say he was not a good person? did i ever say he did not deserve 'some' praise? this whole thread is about him getting enormous amounts of attention he does not deserve. its a fucking joke. he was a boxer....great, big deal. answer me this...what do you have if you take all the trash talk out of Ali's game? i'll tell you, just another boxer who had a great run.

[johngateswhiteley]

cornbread-
...love your sig btw. i love me some cornbread.

[johngateswhiteley]

yeah, it seemed. i am not saying it was or wasn't, in other words, i don't know.

[cornbread]

1. i wouldn't be scared of Ali b/c he talked, in fact, i wouldn't be scared of Ali at all. would i box him?...no, but i am not a boxer and even if i was he wouldn't scare me, thats preposterous
As a fan 35-45 years later, why would you be scared? What matters is the affect that it had on his opponents. Scared isn't the best word anyways. It's more about the mental warfare.

2. imo, boxing is not fighting. boxing is a sport...i've never seen a fight where two men just stood and swung at each other
I've never seen two professional fighters throw down in the street. I imagine it would look nothing like the drunken barbrawls that I've seen. IMO, boxing is both sport and fighting.

3. Ali already talked trash, theres nothing i can do to change that, but it doesn't mean he is not an arrogant bitch
"Arrogant", yes. "Bitch", all I can say is wow. You must be an amazing human who's accomplished incredible things if you're in the position to refer to Muhammad Ali as a bitch.

5. fwiw, boxing is a gentleman's sport
:lol

6. just an example: if a guy rapes a girl on his way to a fund raiser, does that mean he is a good person?
Come on man. You're really reaching with this one. A rapist? It did make me laugh though.

7. good for Ali, but he is celebrated, mainly, for what he did during his earlier years. btw, i have done some charity work...can i be celebrated too?
It's a good point about his early career. But let me know the next time you feed 22 million hungry people and I'll start a thread about it. Get you some press on Spurstalk. :toast

finally, and listen closely, did i ever say Ali was not a good boxer? did i ever say he was not a good person? did i ever say he did not deserve 'some' praise? this whole thread is about him getting enormous amounts of attention he does not deserve. its a fucking joke. he was a boxer....great, big deal. answer me this...what do you have if you take all the trash talk out of Ali's game? i'll tell you, just another boxer who had a great run.
To answer those last few questions about him being a good boxer, person, etc, the anwer is no. But you brought into question his person and dissed the trashtalk. I responded. Did I ever say he was the greatest? I noted earlier that I think SRR is the greatest.
^^^It's an interesting question about the trashtalk. If he didn't trashtalk then you completely remove his self-promotion so it could change his place in history, drastically. But like I posted earlier, I feel trashtalk is part of the fight game so it's not necessarily fair to hypothetically remove that element from his game when looking at his success in the ring. At least IMO.

[cornbread]

cornbread-
...love your sig btw. i love me some cornbread.
Gotta love that southern cooking!

[BIG IRISH]

Yep he ended up being more than the Louisville lip, however, watch his fights against Sonny Liston, Sonny took a dive, maybe two.

[Greg Oden]

he was the greatest fighter of his era (and I'm a much bigger foreman fan than ali fan) there's no doubt about that. but tyson in his prime would put a whoopin on Ali's ass.

[BIG IRISH]

he was the greatest fighter of his era (and I'm a much bigger foreman fan than ali fan) there's no doubt about that. but tyson in his prime would put a whoopin on Ali's ass.

Get Real
Ali, would win on Points, Tyson was not a boxer, and no way could he knock-out, ali

[Greg Oden]

haha

crazy fuck case or not, Tyson was a beast in the ring and I don't think anyone could beat him in his prime.

[E20]

haha

crazy fuck case or not, Tyson was a beast in the ring and I don't think anyone could beat him in his prime.
Tyson would have a hard time catching Ali in his prime, if you've seen Ali in his prime his reflexes were superhuman, he'd see the move coming before his opponent even thought of it. At best Tyson was a brawler, he needed to be 12 inches away from you to get you, if not he'd slowly get closer to land hits.

[degenerate_gambler]

haha

crazy fuck case or not, Tyson was a beast in the ring and I don't think anyone could beat him in his prime.


Please. He was a beast against the Marvis Frazier's, Trevor Berbick's and Pinklon Thomas's of the world. It's called intimidation. Michael Spinks was actually shaking during pre-fight instructions when they fought.

That was his edge...and he lost that the night Buster Douglas knocked his ass out.